Yossi Melman is a senior commentator for the Israeli daily Haaretz. He specializes in intelligence, security, terrorism and strategic issues. An author of seven books on these topics, his most recent book, The Nuclear Sphinx of Tehran: Mahmoud Ahmadinejad and the State of Iran was published recently by Carroll & Graf.
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Yossi Melman
Tel Aviv, Israel
Yossi Melman is a senior commentator for the Israeli daily Haaretz. He specializes in intelligence, security, terrorism and strategic issues. An author of seven books on these topics, his most recent book, The Nuclear Sphinx of Tehran: Mahmoud Ahmadinejad and the State of Iran was published recently by Carroll & Graf.
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Let the politicians go home. Both the Israelis and the Palestinians. Let the Israelis,without their US patron, and the Palestinians, without their's ,sit down and work things out.
Cut the bs. Show me what you want and I will show you what I want. It seems that both people,the Israelis and the Palestinians , have been played for fools long enough.
Fire the Americans and let the Palestinians fire
their patrons. Sit down with kabob,arak,shawerma, hummus and flafel and let us talk about it and end the misery for both people.
“Arabs, are exposed daily to tons of toxic propaganda that passes for news, information and analysis in much of the Arab media, and which makes incessant use of the terminology of "arrogance", "hegemony", "imperialism" and other such meaningless claptrap to warp the minds of its listeners and readers until they cannot see reality. And if you think I'm wrong, you are invited to try and articulate what exactly do you mean by "America's arrogant ways" and "America's preference and support for dictators".
[OK, here is the trip report of a reporter who accompanied President Bush on his recent trip to the Middle East. The manner in which the corrupt leaders of Arab states are bowing to the wishes of King George is enough to make one ill, as exhibited during the ostentatious show of wealth.]
“Arab TV offered an uncomfortable juxtaposition: Al Arabiya running the wretched saga of Gaza children suffering from a lack of food and medicine during the Israeli blockade, blending into the wretched excess scenes of W. being festooned with riches from royal hosts flush with gazillions from gouging us on oil” ...
At a dinner last night in King Abdullah of Saudi Arabia’s tentlike retreat, where the 8-foot flat-screen TV in the middle of the room flashed Arab news, the president and his advisers Elliott Abrams and Josh Bolten went native, lounging in floor-length, fur-lined robes, as if they were Peter O'Toole and Omar Sharif. ...
In Abu Dhabi, Sheik Khalifa bin Zayed al-Nahyan gave the president a gigantic necklace made of gold, diamonds, rubies and emeralds, so gaudy and cumbersome that even the Secret Service agent carrying it seemed nonplussed. ...
Here in Saudi Arabia, the king draped W. with an emerald-and-ruby necklace that could have come from Ali Baba's cave. ...
Time's Massimo Calabresi described the Kuwaiti emir's residence where W. dined Friday as ''crass class'': ''Loud paintings of harems and the ruling Sabah clan hang near Louis XVI enameled clocks and candlesticks in the long hallways.''...
In Abu Dhabi, the president made a less-than-rousing speech about democracy while staying in the less-than-democratic Emirates Palace hotel's basketball-court-size Ruler's Suite -- an honor reserved for royalty and W...
The president's grandiose room included a ballroom. The $3 billion, seven-star, 84,114-square-foot pink marble hotel -- said to be the most expensive ever built -- would make Trump blush. It glistens with 64,000 square feet of 22-carat gold leaf, 1,000 chandeliers, 20,000 roses changed every day, 200 fountains, a dome higher than St. Peter's, an archway larger than the Arc de Triomphe, a beach with white sand shipped in from Algeria and a private heliport. The rooms, scattered with rose petals, range from $1,598 to $12,251.”
[The definition of “arrogance”, “hegemony”, “imperialism” and hypocrisy could be taken as the act of threatening to attack or impose sanctions on a sovereign country (Iran) for developing nuclear power which could lead to weapons grade material, when the US and Israel each have stockpiled a nuclear arsenal; or launching a preventive invasion and occupation of another sovereign country (Iraq) out of fear that it may have WMD, when in fact the US and Israel each have stockpiled tons of WMD including nuclear arsenals; or injecting hundreds of thousands of Zionist invaders into the Arab land of Palestine following WW I and WW II. Why, because we didn’t want them to immigrate to our land.
It is way past time for the Arab Street to revolt and take back their birthright. I know; the vast majority just wants to get along as well as possible and raise their children in peace. However, some people just cannot be lived with; e.g. the Zionist invader of Palestine, or the imperialist USA.]
As far as I can see,the Palestinians have no loyalty to Egypt or Jordan and Egypt and Jordan have no chance of establishing law and order there. Again, if Olmert were a reasl force for peace would he not have put some sort of proposal on the table and hoped to gain popularity and support by doing so?
It looks like Olmert will survive Winograd Wednesday and live for awhile longer.
The war battered Olmert's approval ratings. He has also been plagued by graft allegations, which he denies, and lost a rightist coalition ally this month over his peace moves.
But a poll in the Maariv daily showed Olmert's popularity appeared to have rallied, with 42 percent of respondents wanting him to stay on as prime minister, compared to only 17 percent after the interim report was issued in April. A television poll on Wednesday showed 27 percent wanted him to carry on.
But Amnesty International said the report itself was "deeply flawed" because it focused on strategic mistakes rather than Israel's "indiscriminate killing" of Lebanese civilians. About 1,200 Lebanese, mostly civilians, and 159 Israelis, mostly soldiers, died in the war.
Lebanon's Prime Minister Fouad Siniora also criticized the report, saying it set the scene for a possible future conflict and failed to address "Israel's crimes against Lebanon."
Kohen,
Don't u have an sense of shame? u keep repeating the same lies and cheap propaganda.
Philistines?what is this???
Why don't u see WWW.PLANDS.ORG and read your own israli revisionist historians' who confirmed that israel was established by violnce and ethnic cleanesing:remember the jewish terrorist gangs Haganah,Palmach,Irgun and Shtern? Do remember the over five hundred Palestinian villages in 1047/8 on the orders of ben gourion to prevent ethnically cleanesed PAlestinians as per UN 194 which the racist entity still refuse to implement it as all UN resoutions since 1947.
No Palestine is there as it always was since the Cannanite Arabs settled over five thousand years ago and built Yabous/Jerusalem,the city of peace;jews were only extremly marginal in the history of Arab Palestine-nothing like the Arabs in Spain for example who civilized Spain during eight hundred years there and wrere behind the European Renaissance and industrial revolution.
Europe wanted to get rid of the jews and solve the so called jewish question so they created this cancer in the heart of the Arab world;absloutely no need and viability for a racist jewish state on Arab land and in the heart of the Arab world-after all there is a propsperous jewish state:New York.
this Melman says the report will derail the "peace process"? What peace process-an endless futile game by successive israeli governments to buy more time while the racist apartheid jewish theocracy devours more Palestinian land.
There will never be any peace unless a Secular Democratic Palestine is established on all of historic Palestine for all people regardless of race or religion. To only have a racist jweish state is a recipe for a continued disaster-as is now there is no land or resources left for a viable Palestinian State.
Good grief...still not right ...original post should " If Abbas is so delusional and shortsighted to NOT deal with Hamas..."
anyway you det my drift...
Winodgrad is tough stuff but appears to be little new there...Olmert can survive unless there is significant public outcry for his head...this may be one of those times where it is more important what the public does than the plotting politcians...
I can't believe the breadth of ignorance on display here in the comments section. With every passing year, the facts and truths of history are slowly replaced by internet rumors, false accusations and slander. I don't even know where to begin.
*shakes head sadly*
Even in his final years, the super hawk Ariel Sharon reconsidered his previous policies regarding the conflicts between Israel and the Palestine. With the man in a deep coma, Mr Olmert took over. But Olmert is no Sharon and the last Lebanon war, 2006 has showed precisely that. With the current Bush administration on its way out, the shaking government of Israel will never be able to put together a plausible "peace process". To solve this conflict, we must not take side, for doing so, we will run the risks of intensifying the conflict and worsen the already devastating human tragedy.
Classic. You forgot to add that the Supreme Jew that lives on the Moon is working with the Aliens to conspire again the destruction of Earth. If you look closely at the full moon you can see him plotting..mwhaaaaaaaaa!
You've found the cure to Cancer, start on the moon.
Feel free to criticize the Israeli government's actions, that's the beauty of America's free speech.
Peace would be wonderful, I indulge this fantasy every now and then. But, peace is really about acceptance. If one entity refuses to "recognize" (accept) the other, fundamentally peace is impossible. So, is it really difficult to imagine an anxious, vulnerable, tired State lashing out to defend it's life? In swinging to save it's life did it chip the tooth of the friend of its enemy? Maybe. If so, regrettably understandable.
After reading 60+ posts, very few have to do with Mr. Melman's opinion, rather, they are thinly veiled attacks at "Israeli's", Jew's in general. It must be hard to conceal your burning, anonymous hatred that continues to feed from your disappointments in life (passed over for a promotion--boss or business owner is Jewish, didn't get accepted to the University of your choice-too many smart Jews, got laid off--because the economic downturn was caused by the secret band of wealthy Jews that control all!...etc) Hate does seem to help you maintain focus, keep things straight, explain the unexplainable. Stick with it.
Why?
Because, it only solidifies our identity which bleeds towards a complacent death everyday in America's openness and acceptance. Thank you :)
After reading the comments regarding Israel, I feel relieved to know that others are aware of the Pro-Israel position of the United States, which is bad news for all Americans!
Tell me this how is it that Jews, who account for less than 18 million people world wide, has such a strangle hold on the world? Why are Americans fighting in the Middle East dying for Israel? My research shows that through FY2000, $91.82 Billion taxpayer dollars have been given to Israel. What are American taxpayers subsidizing this wealthy country?
I begin to look at this arrangement after becoming involved in the Anti-Apartheid movement against the racist South African Government. I was amazed to learn that the racist South African government received training from the Israeli government. This changed the way I looked at Israel. Instead of becoming more human after the genocidal policies of Hitler- Jews became more hateful, and brutal. And, they say that “Jehovah God” gave them the land now known as Israel? The same God whose son Jesus Christ they killed?!?
With the ongoing elections looming, I shutter at the possibility of Senator Lieberman entering the presidential race. Something is terribly wrong with this equation!
After reading all of the comments I find it refreshing to know that so many are aware of the Pro-Israel position of the Bush administration and countless others before him.
Tell me this how is it that Jews, who account for less than 18 million people world wide, has such a strangle hold on the world? Why are Americans fighting in the Middle East dying for Israel? My research shows that through FY2000, $91.82 Billion taxpayer dollars have been given to Israel. What are American taxpayers subsidizing this wealthy country?
I begin to look at this arrangement after becoming involved in the Anti-Apartheid movement against the racist South African Government. I was amazed to learn that the racist South African government received training for the Israeli government. This changed the way I looked at Israel. Instead of becoming more human after the genocidal policies of Hitler- Jews became more hateful, and brutal. And, they say that “Jehovah God” gave them the land now known as Israel? The same God whose son Jesus Christ they killed?!?
With the ongoing elections looming, I shutter at the possibility of Senator Lieberman entering the presidential race. I can just imagine what type of legislation he would pass. He would be worst that Bush, if that is possible! Something is terribly wrong with this equation!
Wow! It is refreshing to read some of these responses. I was beginning to think that the Jews had pulled the wool over everyone eyes! Great comments. My question is this:
Tell me this how is it that Jews, who account for less than 18 million people world wide, has such a strangle hold on the world? Why are Americans fighting in the Middle East dying for Israel? My research shows that through FY2000, $91.82 Billion taxpayer dollars have been given to Israel. What are American taxpayers subsidizing this wealthy country?
I begin to look at this arrangement after becoming involved in the Anti-Apartheid movement against the racist South African Government. I was amazed to learn that the racist South African government received training for the Israeli government. This changed the way I looked at Israel. Instead of becoming more human after the genocidal policies of Hitler- Jews became more hateful, and brutal. And, they say that “Jehovah God” gave them the land now known as Israel? The same God whose son Jesus Christ they killed?!?
With the ongoing elections looming, I shutter at the possibility of Senator Lieberman entering the presidential race. Something is terribly wrong with this equation!
After reading all of the comments I find it refreshing to know that other people share my views.
Tell me this how is it that Jews, who account for less than 18 million people world wide, has such a strangle hold on the world? Why are Americans fighting in the Middle East dying for Israel? My research shows that through FY2000, $91.82 Billion taxpayer dollars have been given to Israel. What are American taxpayers subsidizing this wealthy country?
I begin to look at this arrangement after becoming involved in the Anti-Apartheid movement against the racist South African Government. I was amazed to learn that the racist South African government received training for the Israeli government. This changed the way I looked at Israel. Instead of becoming more human after the genocidal policies of Hitler- Jews became more hateful, and brutal. And, they say that “Jehovah God” gave them the land now known as Israel? The same God whose son Jesus Christ they killed?!?
With the ongoing elections looming, I shutter at the possibility of Senator Lieberman entering the presidential race. I can just imagine what type of legislation he would pass. He would be worst that Bush, if that is possible! Something is terribly wrong with this equation!
Typical WaPo comment thread - a bunch of hand-wringing zombies sputtering about Israel's 'ethnic cleansing/genocide/crimes against humanity' with the usual dearth of any solid facts to back up their claims.
1) If Israel is so virulently intent on ethnic cleansing, why is it that 20% of Israel is not Jewish? Why do Arab Muslims form a sizable portion of Israeli's government from whence they often call for Israel's destruction? How many mosques are in Israel? How many synagogues in the territories?
2) If Israel wants to 'grab all of Palestine', why did it remove itself from Gaza? Why has it consistently tried to negotiate - according to your idiotic narrative shouldn't the evil Israelis have long ago simply leveled Gaza and the West Bank? You often cry crocodile tears over your assertion that the Israeli military is supremely superior to the peace loving Palestinias - if this is the case why haven't the territories been reduced to rubble long ago?
3) As for the 'collective punishment' meme - if I stood behind a friend of mine and threw rocks at your mother's head every day what would you do? Would you try to stop me, knowing that you might hurt my friend (who while not participating in the attacks nevertheless stood between us at all times) or would you simply allow me to continue my attacks until your mother was dead?
4) Just how many people were killed in the Israel-Lebanon war? How many have been killed in the conflict between the Palestinians and Israelis? This is 'ethnic cleansing'? How many in (name any other conflict)? Sunni-Shia violence in Iraq? Janjaweed militias against non-Arab natives in Sudan?
I'm perpetually amazed that some idiots in this thread actually believe (in spite of every bit of evidence from around the world - Pakistan, Somalia, Nigeria, Indonesia, Malaysia, Iran, Saudi Arabia, Iraq, and even Europe recently) that it is the JEWS who are behind violent global conflict. Ah well, I too believe in karma. We'll see who gets theirs in the end.
After reading the comments regarding Israel, I feel relieved to know that others are aware of the Pro-Israel position of the United States, which is bad news for all Americans!
Tell me this how is it that Jews, who account for less than 18 million people world wide, has such a strangle hold on the world? Why are Americans fighting in the Middle East dying for Israel? My research shows that through FY2000, $91.82 Billion taxpayer dollars have been given to Israel. What are American taxpayers subsidizing this wealthy country?
I begin to look at this arrangement after becoming involved in the Anti-Apartheid movement against the racist South African Government. I was amazed to learn that the racist South African government received training from the Israeli government. This changed the way I looked at Israel. Instead of becoming more human after the genocidal policies of Hitler- Jews became more hateful, and brutal. And, they say that “Jehovah God” gave them the land now known as Israel? The same God whose son Jesus Christ they killed?!?
With the ongoing elections looming, I shutter at the possibility of Senator Lieberman entering the presidential race. Something is terribly wrong with this equation!
After reading the comments regarding Israel, I feel relieved to know that others are aware of the Pro-Israel position of the United States, which is bad news for all Americans!
Tell me this how is it that Jews, who account for less than 18 million people world wide, has such a strangle hold on the world? Why are Americans fighting in the Middle East dying for Israel? My research shows that through FY2000, $91.82 Billion taxpayer dollars have been given to Israel. What are American taxpayers subsidizing this wealthy country?
I begin to look at this arrangement after becoming involved in the Anti-Apartheid movement against the racist South African Government. I was amazed to learn that the racist South African government received training from the Israeli government. This changed the way I looked at Israel. Instead of becoming more human after the genocidal policies of Hitler- Jews became more hateful, and brutal. And, they say that “Jehovah God” gave them the land now known as Israel? The same God whose son Jesus Christ they killed?!?
With the ongoing elections looming, I shutter at the possibility of Senator Lieberman entering the presidential race. Something is terribly wrong with this equation!
I'm afraid the peace process was dead before the report came out. Bush shouldn't have waited until his last year in office to try to get the sides together. And he just sat on his hands while the Israeli-Lebanon war was raging.
No credibility for him or his administration in the Middle East was what doomed the peace initiative.
I'm afraid the peace process was dead before the report came out. Bush shouldn't have waited until his last year in office to try to get the sides together. And he just sat on his hands while the Israeli-Lebanon war was raging.
No credibility for him or his administration in the Middle East was what doomed the peace initiative.
The sad part about the Balfour declaration is not that it says nothing should change the rights and political status of the non-Jewish communities, who now (excluding those who are not Israeli citizens, i.e. Palestinians in the West Bank and Gaza, who have been subject to occupation by foreign entities since 1948) have more rights than they did at the time of the mandate, but that it laughably talks about rights and political status of Jews elsewhere. I guess the right to suffer pogroms were one of those things the British didn't want to disturb. When it came time to make sure that the rights and political status of Jews under the Nazis didn't change, the British did their best to ensure that Jews didn't sneak into the national homeland they were supposed to be given access to, and enjoyed the right to be gassed as a result of their political status. Of course, the current policies of the Israeli government, which, I agree, actually may humiliate people, are, no doubt in your mind, exactly what the Nazis did to the Jews, Gypsies, and all the other untermenschen, and may well be worse.
Nothing can possibly "mark the end of the Mideast peace process"; for nothing exists that could legitimately be called a Mideast peace process.
Throughout the world, everyone knows there is no Mideast peace process. Everyone has known that for years. To repeat there is one does not make one exist; on the contrary, like abortion in the case of foetuses, that is what prevents one from being born.
All one finds, in that part of the world, is fanatically, vociferously encouraged (primarily in the young -- a shameless crime in itself) permanent conflict and perpetual war, far beyond what those few images and anemic daily reports have been making quite clear, though, for years, and years, and years.
The tragedy is that after more than sixty years of such nonsense, primarily supported by the USA, with utter disrespect for innumerable United Nations resolutions, for human rights, international law and the Geneva conventions, people in that region have come to even ignore what the words "peace" and "process" both mean and denote. No wonder they therefore act as though they ignored, as well, that repeated war crimes and crimes against humanity do not lead to genuine, durable peace.
Unfortunately, those who, in our most prominent media, are officially endorsed to write about the Middle East are no exception.
It would seem that to advocate peace and to demand accountability for all war crimes and crimes against humanity committed in one's name is not for the fainthearted.
It's easy to say you want peace when you're in the middle of an aggresive land-grab. Israel is a failed state, a state which has decided it can and therefore will exist in a petertuetual state of war with its neighbours rather than justice. Nietzsche talked of the conflict of "morality" against "life". Israel has put a certain vision of its existence above all else, AT ANY COST to everyone else but what does it profit a man who lives like that? But its rationale is not even based on countering threats to its existence - it's about greed, domination, punishment, narcissism and self-delusion. The Children of Israel, sadly, have become just that; children.
Lisa represents the best in hopes and dreams of us all, that the Israelis and Palestinians will stop the violence and work together to establish two sovereign states which can live side by side in peace God willing.
It's easy to say you want peace when you're in the middle of an aggresive land-grab. Israel is a failed state, a state which has decided it can and therefore will exist in a petertuetual state of war with its neighbours rather than play fair. Nietzsche talked of the conflict of "morality" against "life". Israel has put its existence above all else, at ANY COST to everyone else but what does it profit a man who lives like that? But this is not even about existence - it's about greed.
We already went through this. There is no such place as “Israel”. It was a figment of the British imagination and the Balfour Declaration of 1917:
Foreign Office
November 2nd, 1917.
Dear Lord Rothschild,
I have much pleasure in conveying to you, on behalf of His Majesty's Government, the following declaration of sympathy with Jewish Zionist aspirations which has been submitted to, and approved by, the Cabinet:
"His Majesty's Government view with favour the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people, and will use their best endeavours to facilitate the achievement of this object, it being clearly understood that nothing shall be done which may prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine, or the rights and political status enjoyed by Jews in any other country".
I should be grateful if you would bring this declaration to the knowledge of the Zionist Federation.
Yours sincerely
Arthur James Balfour
Note the part that says: “it being clearly understood that nothing shall be done which may prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine”.
I have to leave. The bottom line is the bottom line:
The Philistines would have had a state in 1937 with the Peel Plan, but they violently rejected it.
They would have had a state in 1948 with UN 181, but they violently rejected it (and actually claimed that the UN had no such mandate!).
They could have had a state in Judea, Samaria, and Gaza from 1948-1967 without any Jews- because the Arabs had ethnically cleansed every last one; but they violently rejected it. In fact, that's exactly when they established Fatah (1959) and thre PLO (1964).
They could have had a state after 1967, but instead, the entire Arab world issued the Khartoum Resolutions:
A. No peace with Israel
B. No recognition of Israel
C. No negotiations with Israel
They would have had a state in 2000 with the Oslo Accords, but they violently rejected it- as always.
The Arabs will just have to learn to "make do" with their own 99.9% of the Middle East- including all of the oil, and stop trying to steal OUR tiny 1/10th of 1% without oil. The Philistines won't have a state here in Israel, and if they don't stop their violence, they won't even exist here anymore. They will have to go to their own land; Jordan.
Better get used to it, because we're not going anywhere.
Your 3rd option would be a disaster, as Israel does have serious security and socio-economic issues to deal with. The Peace process deserves to die. Unlike other efforts, this efforts was crafted from cynicism, callous calculation, and corruption. Olmert, Bush and Abbas are political eunuchs. It is better for Israel and Palestinains to look inward and work on their political and economic divides this year and wait for a new US President. The Palestinians should do the same, work on a dialogue toward unity, form a united government tweaking last year's Mecca Agreement..show the EU a united front so funding comes forth, and work with Blair on getting the Gaza Natural Gas field under Palestinian control ....Fatah needs to hold that congress in March. If Abbas insists on not dealing with Hamas then younger Fatah leadership have some decisions to make about who can really deliver a Palestinian state for them. I think Hamas is at crossroads...it could transform to a political entity BUT SOMEONE NEEDS TO GIVE THEM A REASON TO DO THAT. If Abbas is so delusional and shortsighted to deal with Abbas (actually it is a sign of weakness he does not so far not strength) then the Israelis should consider cutting their own deal with them and that includes and exchange of Marwan for Gilad. There is ONLY a short window for all of this, i.e., for Abbas to cut a deal and/or Israelis with Hamas. I also think a combination of your option 1 and 2 will happen...Livni will be put in driver seat and new elections called for 2008. It's a great pity Labour did not elect Ami Aylon .instead of Ehud Barak...in any event Barak should lose his job also due to the implementation Gaza Blockade, he may or maynot be another political eunuch but he is a total ass......Ami Aylon, Marwan and a new US President can go back to drawing table in 2009 in regard to finalizing peace...2008 should just be about both Isarel and Palestine putting their political and economic houses in order...in any event the emphsis now should be on cutting constructive deals that could potentially advance peace agreement with new players next year
You sure are confused. There are over a million non-Jews in Israel. Theonly ethnic cleansing was the ARAB ethnic cleansing of ALL Jews from Judea, Samaria, and Gaza in 1948.
This is what they did in 1929 in Hebron, as per a memorandum presented to the British High Commissioner by Hebron's community:
"…the rabbis, Meir Kastel, 68 years old, and Tzvi Drabkin, 70 years old, and five other young men… were robbed, castrated, tortured and murdered… The baker, Noah Immerman was roasted alive on an oven, Rabbi Ya'akov Orlanski HaCohen… was found… praying… they took his brain from his skull and his wife's intestines were crushed… the pharmacist, Ben-Tzion Gershon, lame, unable to move, who served in Hebron for 40 years, kindly assisting many Arabs, they cut off his nose and fingers, killed him, raped his daughter and murdered her with awful torture. The teacher Dubkinov and Yitzhak Abushdid were strangled with a rope… six synagogues… including 64 Torah scrolls, many of them ancient, from the Spanish exile, all were stolen and desecrated...."
The peace process dies regularly whenever it is re-initiated.
Israel has a knack, much practiced, of performing national security attacks against poorly armed or unarmed Palestinians. Criticize Israel , and castigation from Israeli supporters in America will quickly follow, charging anti-semitism.
The peace process dies regularly whenever it is re-initiated.
Israel has a knack, much practiced, of performing national security attacks against poorly armed or unarmed Palestinians. Criticize Israel , and castigation from Israeli supporters in America will quickly follow, charging anti-semitism.
I know: Yasser Arafat, who was born and raised in EGYPT, is your idea of a "Palestinian". Or would that be Edward Said, who also was?
Prior to 1948, a "Palestinian" was a Jew who lived in Mandate Palestine- NOT an Arab. Not until later did the term start referring to Arabs. Which should explain the sentiment expressed by Auni Bey Abdul-Hadi, recorded in 1937 by the Peel Commission:
"There is no such country! 'Palestine' is a term the Zionists invented! There is no Palestine in the Bible. Our country was for centuries part of SYRIA."
"It is only for tactical reasons that we carefully stress our Palestinian identity, for it is in the national interest of the Arabs to encourage a separate Palestinian identity to counter Zionism: The founding of a Palestinian state is a new tool in the ongoing battle against Israel…"
-Zohair Mohsin, then head of the PLO Military Operations Dept. and member of PLO Executive Council, in an interview for the Dutch newspaper Trouw, March 1977
"There is no language known as Palestinian. There is no distinct Palestinian culture. There has never been a land known as Palestine governed by Palestinians. Palestinians are Arabs, indistinguishable from Jordanians (another recent invention), Syrians, Lebanese, Iraqis, etc. Keep in mind that the Arabs control 99.9 percent of the Middle East lands. Israel represents one-tenth of 1 percent of the landmass.
But that's too much for the Arabs. They want it all. And that is ultimately what the fighting in Israel is about today. Greed. Pride. Envy. Covetousness. No matter how many land concessions the Israelis make, it will never be enough."
Joseph Farah, Arab-American journalist, editor and CEO of WorldNet Daily
Nope. The Philistines would have had a state in 1937 with the Peel Plan, but they violently rejected it.
They would have had a state in 1948 with UN 181, but they violently rejected it (and actually claimed that the UN had no such mandate!).
They could have had a state in Judea, Samaria, and Gaza from 1948-1967 without any Jews- because the Arabs had ethnically cleansed every last one; but they violently rejected it. In fact, that's exactly when they established Fatah (1959) and thre PLO (1964).
They could have had a state after 1967, but instead, the entire Arab world issued the Khartoum Resolutions:
A. No peace with Israel
B. No recognition of Israel
C. No negotiations with Israel
They would have had a state in 2000 with the Oslo Accords, but they violently rejected it- as always.
The Arabs will just have to learn to "make do" with their own 99.9% of the Middle East- including all of the oil, and stop trying to steal OUR tiny 1/10th of 1% without oil. The Philistines won't have a state here in Israel, and if they don't stop their violence, they won't even exist here anymore. They will have to go to their own land; Jordan.
Why talk about "before the 1940s"? Why not go back two thousand years when Rome conquered Judea and divided it into three regions, including Palestine. What need have we for a 2000-yr old force dictating the present world. Jews have had ties to the region since time immemorial, and Israel is now a sovereign country. You may not like it, but that's your tough luck, and your terrorist buddies' tough luck. Israel is here to stay, so get used to it.
Unfortunately, a number of neo-nazis appear to be posting comments here.
Let's dispel a few misconceptions: the US is not on its knees and Israel is not responsible for what few problems we have here.
Israel needs to let the arab world know that Jerusalem is an Israeli city by fortifying some land around it, but there is no interest in taking over all Palestinian territory.
The fact that we can even talk about a "peace process" while the palestinian government allows rockets to be fired from Gaza into Israel on a daily basis is simply astonishing. If any other sovereign country was being shelled by Palestinians, it would simply topple the government and wipe the floor with the lot of them. Israel has shown great restraint and held the moral highground, despite what the Jew-haters say.
We in this country were hit with terrorism on one day. We toppled two governments and went to war on the other side of the world. Israel is threatened with terrorism on a daily basis and people whine when it attempts self-defense along its borders. The hypocrisy is palpable.
Any time I see an article mentioning Israel or Jews I read the comments already knowing what will be there. I wish I could say I'm surprised by the amount of anti-semetic rhetoric on these pages, but I'm not. The fact that so many people in the US hate Jews and Israel simply reinforces the need for the State of Israel. I almost think the Washington Post continues to have these articles so that the idiots out there have a place to rant and spread their hate. To address the statements made by these people would be a pointless exercise in futility.
Rick Jones posts the lone comment somehow relating this to Iran and Ahmadinejad.
It is refreshing that it appears there is a conversation going on here about Israel and its definite right to exist, without bringing Iran into it.
Gaza is a mess, as is the West Bank, as is Lebanon. Syria is an opportunistic scavenger. And Jordan and Egypt's vast majority of populace despise the Israelis and their own government for among other things, making peace with Israel.
Israel has a lot to worry about and the Lebanon fiasco has made it feel vulnerable. But they and the Iranians know that the least of their problems are each other.
Kharma sometimes takes a while to come due. Sometimes it takes 90 years. This country went to sleep in 1917, when the zionists started their racist enterprise. But now that Israel's Holy Wars are starting to cost American lives, the slumbering masses are waking up. This is just the tip of the iceberg for the Hell that awaits the zionists, as the masses gradually realize they've been used abused for Israel's evil purposes.
It's about as basic as it gets: Congress has the power of the purse. And Section 1222 of the massive defense appropriation bill enacted this week asserts that power. It reads, in its entirety:
"No funds appropriated pursuant to an authorization of appropriations in this Act may be obligated or expended for a purpose as follows:
"(1) To establish any military installation or base for the purpose of providing for the permanent stationing of United States Armed Forces in Iraq.
"(2) To exercise United States control of the oil resources of Iraq."
But in another of his controversial " signing statements," President Bush on Tuesday asserted that Section 1222 -- along with three other sections of the bill -- "purport to impose requirements that could inhibit the President's ability to carry out his constitutional obligations to take care that the laws be faithfully executed, to protect national security, to supervise the executive branch, and to execute his authority as Commander in Chief."
Therefore, he wrote: "The executive branch shall construe such provisions in a manner consistent with the constitutional authority of the President."
The overall message to Congress was clear: I'm not bound by your laws.
[BTW, if you think that this is off topic you are wrong. Our invasion and occupation of Iraq is closely related to our support for the Zionist invasion and occupation of Palestine.]
If you kindly go over my previous comment, you will surely see that I have never said civilians did not perish in this war - from both sides.
I was referring to the anarchy that the people, whom you may call freedom fighters, created in Lebanon. Just imagine that a militia in the USA or in any of the European countries had private access to state and public installations and used them in its guerilla warfare.
The Israeli army was after Hizbollah and will continue his pursuit after this genocidal party of G-d. Just ask the so called freedom fighters not to hide anymore behind civilians and once and for all face the Israeli army face to face.
If Hizbollah decided to pound northern Israel will thousands of rockets do not expect us to spread flowers. And frankly, Franklin - your extensive usage of capital letters is more insulting.
The Prime Minister was murdered by Christofascists. That is the decision making process which led to the 33-day war with what Bush claimed were clients of the EFP providers.
Premier Olmert, as one of the three architects of the war, should follow his two colleagues out of office: General Haloutz, who resigned. and Defense Minister Peretz, who was forced by his labor party to be replaced by Ehud Barak.
In such an atmosphere, the possibility that the already crippled peace process is resurrected is very slim. If you make unilateral concessions or handovers, the Christian Zionists will kill you. It's easy to blame everything on Osama bin Laden. But the Christofascists also have their proxies. (In fact Osama bin Laden has long been one of their proxies)
There is no "peace process" There is only a process by which the world is trying to force the Jews to abandon Israel as a Jewish state and accept the fact that because the Muslims have billions of barrels of oil, the Jews should be once again, denied the right to life and put into extermination mode.
Bush and Clinton and Obama and the EU are all in the pockets of the Saudis and their UAE et al friends that is why the Islamist terrorist in Israel are getting hundreds of millions of dollars to buy weapons to kill Jews.
I posted my first post without looking at the other posts.
As often happens in Talkbacks on anything related to Israel there are a couple of vicious, ignorant anti- Semitic posts.
I believe nowadays all repectable Website talkbacks should have referees who do not allow the posting of hate-filled , abusive, inciteful comments.
All Comments (80)
Let the politicians go home. Both the Israelis and the Palestinians. Let the Israelis,without their US patron, and the Palestinians, without their's ,sit down and work things out.
Cut the bs. Show me what you want and I will show you what I want. It seems that both people,the Israelis and the Palestinians , have been played for fools long enough.
Fire the Americans and let the Palestinians fire
their patrons. Sit down with kabob,arak,shawerma, hummus and flafel and let us talk about it and end the misery for both people.
March 5, 2008 1:39 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on March 5, 2008 13:39
From another thread, someone says:
“Arabs, are exposed daily to tons of toxic propaganda that passes for news, information and analysis in much of the Arab media, and which makes incessant use of the terminology of "arrogance", "hegemony", "imperialism" and other such meaningless claptrap to warp the minds of its listeners and readers until they cannot see reality. And if you think I'm wrong, you are invited to try and articulate what exactly do you mean by "America's arrogant ways" and "America's preference and support for dictators".
[OK, here is the trip report of a reporter who accompanied President Bush on his recent trip to the Middle East. The manner in which the corrupt leaders of Arab states are bowing to the wishes of King George is enough to make one ill, as exhibited during the ostentatious show of wealth.]
“Arab TV offered an uncomfortable juxtaposition: Al Arabiya running the wretched saga of Gaza children suffering from a lack of food and medicine during the Israeli blockade, blending into the wretched excess scenes of W. being festooned with riches from royal hosts flush with gazillions from gouging us on oil” ...
At a dinner last night in King Abdullah of Saudi Arabia’s tentlike retreat, where the 8-foot flat-screen TV in the middle of the room flashed Arab news, the president and his advisers Elliott Abrams and Josh Bolten went native, lounging in floor-length, fur-lined robes, as if they were Peter O'Toole and Omar Sharif. ...
In Abu Dhabi, Sheik Khalifa bin Zayed al-Nahyan gave the president a gigantic necklace made of gold, diamonds, rubies and emeralds, so gaudy and cumbersome that even the Secret Service agent carrying it seemed nonplussed. ...
Here in Saudi Arabia, the king draped W. with an emerald-and-ruby necklace that could have come from Ali Baba's cave. ...
Time's Massimo Calabresi described the Kuwaiti emir's residence where W. dined Friday as ''crass class'': ''Loud paintings of harems and the ruling Sabah clan hang near Louis XVI enameled clocks and candlesticks in the long hallways.''...
In Abu Dhabi, the president made a less-than-rousing speech about democracy while staying in the less-than-democratic Emirates Palace hotel's basketball-court-size Ruler's Suite -- an honor reserved for royalty and W...
The president's grandiose room included a ballroom. The $3 billion, seven-star, 84,114-square-foot pink marble hotel -- said to be the most expensive ever built -- would make Trump blush. It glistens with 64,000 square feet of 22-carat gold leaf, 1,000 chandeliers, 20,000 roses changed every day, 200 fountains, a dome higher than St. Peter's, an archway larger than the Arc de Triomphe, a beach with white sand shipped in from Algeria and a private heliport. The rooms, scattered with rose petals, range from $1,598 to $12,251.”
[The definition of “arrogance”, “hegemony”, “imperialism” and hypocrisy could be taken as the act of threatening to attack or impose sanctions on a sovereign country (Iran) for developing nuclear power which could lead to weapons grade material, when the US and Israel each have stockpiled a nuclear arsenal; or launching a preventive invasion and occupation of another sovereign country (Iraq) out of fear that it may have WMD, when in fact the US and Israel each have stockpiled tons of WMD including nuclear arsenals; or injecting hundreds of thousands of Zionist invaders into the Arab land of Palestine following WW I and WW II. Why, because we didn’t want them to immigrate to our land.
It is way past time for the Arab Street to revolt and take back their birthright. I know; the vast majority just wants to get along as well as possible and raise their children in peace. However, some people just cannot be lived with; e.g. the Zionist invader of Palestine, or the imperialist USA.]
January 31, 2008 3:41 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 31, 2008 15:41
As far as I can see,the Palestinians have no loyalty to Egypt or Jordan and Egypt and Jordan have no chance of establishing law and order there. Again, if Olmert were a reasl force for peace would he not have put some sort of proposal on the table and hoped to gain popularity and support by doing so?
January 31, 2008 11:25 AM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 31, 2008 11:25
Sorry Lisa,
It looks like Olmert will survive Winograd Wednesday and live for awhile longer.
The war battered Olmert's approval ratings. He has also been plagued by graft allegations, which he denies, and lost a rightist coalition ally this month over his peace moves.
But a poll in the Maariv daily showed Olmert's popularity appeared to have rallied, with 42 percent of respondents wanting him to stay on as prime minister, compared to only 17 percent after the interim report was issued in April. A television poll on Wednesday showed 27 percent wanted him to carry on.
But Amnesty International said the report itself was "deeply flawed" because it focused on strategic mistakes rather than Israel's "indiscriminate killing" of Lebanese civilians. About 1,200 Lebanese, mostly civilians, and 159 Israelis, mostly soldiers, died in the war.
Lebanon's Prime Minister Fouad Siniora also criticized the report, saying it set the scene for a possible future conflict and failed to address "Israel's crimes against Lebanon."
January 31, 2008 10:13 AM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 31, 2008 10:13
Kohen,
Don't u have an sense of shame? u keep repeating the same lies and cheap propaganda.
Philistines?what is this???
Why don't u see WWW.PLANDS.ORG and read your own israli revisionist historians' who confirmed that israel was established by violnce and ethnic cleanesing:remember the jewish terrorist gangs Haganah,Palmach,Irgun and Shtern? Do remember the over five hundred Palestinian villages in 1047/8 on the orders of ben gourion to prevent ethnically cleanesed PAlestinians as per UN 194 which the racist entity still refuse to implement it as all UN resoutions since 1947.
No Palestine is there as it always was since the Cannanite Arabs settled over five thousand years ago and built Yabous/Jerusalem,the city of peace;jews were only extremly marginal in the history of Arab Palestine-nothing like the Arabs in Spain for example who civilized Spain during eight hundred years there and wrere behind the European Renaissance and industrial revolution.
Europe wanted to get rid of the jews and solve the so called jewish question so they created this cancer in the heart of the Arab world;absloutely no need and viability for a racist jewish state on Arab land and in the heart of the Arab world-after all there is a propsperous jewish state:New York.
January 31, 2008 6:27 AM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 31, 2008 06:27
this Melman says the report will derail the "peace process"? What peace process-an endless futile game by successive israeli governments to buy more time while the racist apartheid jewish theocracy devours more Palestinian land.
There will never be any peace unless a Secular Democratic Palestine is established on all of historic Palestine for all people regardless of race or religion. To only have a racist jweish state is a recipe for a continued disaster-as is now there is no land or resources left for a viable Palestinian State.
January 31, 2008 5:55 AM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 31, 2008 05:55
Good grief...still not right ...original post should " If Abbas is so delusional and shortsighted to NOT deal with Hamas..."
anyway you det my drift...
Winodgrad is tough stuff but appears to be little new there...Olmert can survive unless there is significant public outcry for his head...this may be one of those times where it is more important what the public does than the plotting politcians...
January 30, 2008 9:04 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 21:04
I can't believe the breadth of ignorance on display here in the comments section. With every passing year, the facts and truths of history are slowly replaced by internet rumors, false accusations and slander. I don't even know where to begin.
*shakes head sadly*
January 30, 2008 7:28 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 19:28
Even in his final years, the super hawk Ariel Sharon reconsidered his previous policies regarding the conflicts between Israel and the Palestine. With the man in a deep coma, Mr Olmert took over. But Olmert is no Sharon and the last Lebanon war, 2006 has showed precisely that. With the current Bush administration on its way out, the shaking government of Israel will never be able to put together a plausible "peace process". To solve this conflict, we must not take side, for doing so, we will run the risks of intensifying the conflict and worsen the already devastating human tragedy.
January 30, 2008 7:00 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 19:00
To Post American,
Classic. You forgot to add that the Supreme Jew that lives on the Moon is working with the Aliens to conspire again the destruction of Earth. If you look closely at the full moon you can see him plotting..mwhaaaaaaaaa!
You've found the cure to Cancer, start on the moon.
January 30, 2008 6:37 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 18:37
They alternately attack and bomb and kill in the most obscene, greedy, predictable ways...
And then whine about how they are so put upon.
And it has always been so. And with the same results. Do you suppose they are incapable of learning? Anything?
The current problems will end the same. Sadly. Who would care, except the American taxpayer is paying for it.
January 30, 2008 6:23 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 18:23
They alternately attack and bomb and kill in the most obscene, greedy, predictable ways...
And then whine about how they are so put upon.
And it has always been so. And with the same results. Do you suppose they are incapable of learning? Anything?
The current problems will end the same. Sadly. Who would care, except the American taxpayer is paying for it.
January 30, 2008 6:23 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 18:23
The greatest cancer on this living earth is the fascist Zionist Regime in Palestine. regards
January 30, 2008 6:19 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 18:19
Feel free to criticize the Israeli government's actions, that's the beauty of America's free speech.
Peace would be wonderful, I indulge this fantasy every now and then. But, peace is really about acceptance. If one entity refuses to "recognize" (accept) the other, fundamentally peace is impossible. So, is it really difficult to imagine an anxious, vulnerable, tired State lashing out to defend it's life? In swinging to save it's life did it chip the tooth of the friend of its enemy? Maybe. If so, regrettably understandable.
After reading 60+ posts, very few have to do with Mr. Melman's opinion, rather, they are thinly veiled attacks at "Israeli's", Jew's in general. It must be hard to conceal your burning, anonymous hatred that continues to feed from your disappointments in life (passed over for a promotion--boss or business owner is Jewish, didn't get accepted to the University of your choice-too many smart Jews, got laid off--because the economic downturn was caused by the secret band of wealthy Jews that control all!...etc) Hate does seem to help you maintain focus, keep things straight, explain the unexplainable. Stick with it.
Why?
Because, it only solidifies our identity which bleeds towards a complacent death everyday in America's openness and acceptance. Thank you :)
January 30, 2008 6:08 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 18:08
Why is it that Egypt and Jordan won't let the Palestinians live in their respective countries? Hmmmmm.....
January 30, 2008 5:31 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 17:31
After reading the comments regarding Israel, I feel relieved to know that others are aware of the Pro-Israel position of the United States, which is bad news for all Americans!
Tell me this how is it that Jews, who account for less than 18 million people world wide, has such a strangle hold on the world? Why are Americans fighting in the Middle East dying for Israel? My research shows that through FY2000, $91.82 Billion taxpayer dollars have been given to Israel. What are American taxpayers subsidizing this wealthy country?
I begin to look at this arrangement after becoming involved in the Anti-Apartheid movement against the racist South African Government. I was amazed to learn that the racist South African government received training from the Israeli government. This changed the way I looked at Israel. Instead of becoming more human after the genocidal policies of Hitler- Jews became more hateful, and brutal. And, they say that “Jehovah God” gave them the land now known as Israel? The same God whose son Jesus Christ they killed?!?
With the ongoing elections looming, I shutter at the possibility of Senator Lieberman entering the presidential race. Something is terribly wrong with this equation!
January 30, 2008 5:18 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 17:18
After reading all of the comments I find it refreshing to know that so many are aware of the Pro-Israel position of the Bush administration and countless others before him.
Tell me this how is it that Jews, who account for less than 18 million people world wide, has such a strangle hold on the world? Why are Americans fighting in the Middle East dying for Israel? My research shows that through FY2000, $91.82 Billion taxpayer dollars have been given to Israel. What are American taxpayers subsidizing this wealthy country?
I begin to look at this arrangement after becoming involved in the Anti-Apartheid movement against the racist South African Government. I was amazed to learn that the racist South African government received training for the Israeli government. This changed the way I looked at Israel. Instead of becoming more human after the genocidal policies of Hitler- Jews became more hateful, and brutal. And, they say that “Jehovah God” gave them the land now known as Israel? The same God whose son Jesus Christ they killed?!?
With the ongoing elections looming, I shutter at the possibility of Senator Lieberman entering the presidential race. I can just imagine what type of legislation he would pass. He would be worst that Bush, if that is possible! Something is terribly wrong with this equation!
January 30, 2008 5:10 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 17:10
Wow! It is refreshing to read some of these responses. I was beginning to think that the Jews had pulled the wool over everyone eyes! Great comments. My question is this:
Tell me this how is it that Jews, who account for less than 18 million people world wide, has such a strangle hold on the world? Why are Americans fighting in the Middle East dying for Israel? My research shows that through FY2000, $91.82 Billion taxpayer dollars have been given to Israel. What are American taxpayers subsidizing this wealthy country?
I begin to look at this arrangement after becoming involved in the Anti-Apartheid movement against the racist South African Government. I was amazed to learn that the racist South African government received training for the Israeli government. This changed the way I looked at Israel. Instead of becoming more human after the genocidal policies of Hitler- Jews became more hateful, and brutal. And, they say that “Jehovah God” gave them the land now known as Israel? The same God whose son Jesus Christ they killed?!?
With the ongoing elections looming, I shutter at the possibility of Senator Lieberman entering the presidential race. Something is terribly wrong with this equation!
January 30, 2008 5:07 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 17:07
After reading all of the comments I find it refreshing to know that other people share my views.
Tell me this how is it that Jews, who account for less than 18 million people world wide, has such a strangle hold on the world? Why are Americans fighting in the Middle East dying for Israel? My research shows that through FY2000, $91.82 Billion taxpayer dollars have been given to Israel. What are American taxpayers subsidizing this wealthy country?
I begin to look at this arrangement after becoming involved in the Anti-Apartheid movement against the racist South African Government. I was amazed to learn that the racist South African government received training for the Israeli government. This changed the way I looked at Israel. Instead of becoming more human after the genocidal policies of Hitler- Jews became more hateful, and brutal. And, they say that “Jehovah God” gave them the land now known as Israel? The same God whose son Jesus Christ they killed?!?
With the ongoing elections looming, I shutter at the possibility of Senator Lieberman entering the presidential race. I can just imagine what type of legislation he would pass. He would be worst that Bush, if that is possible! Something is terribly wrong with this equation!
January 30, 2008 5:01 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 17:01
Typical WaPo comment thread - a bunch of hand-wringing zombies sputtering about Israel's 'ethnic cleansing/genocide/crimes against humanity' with the usual dearth of any solid facts to back up their claims.
1) If Israel is so virulently intent on ethnic cleansing, why is it that 20% of Israel is not Jewish? Why do Arab Muslims form a sizable portion of Israeli's government from whence they often call for Israel's destruction? How many mosques are in Israel? How many synagogues in the territories?
2) If Israel wants to 'grab all of Palestine', why did it remove itself from Gaza? Why has it consistently tried to negotiate - according to your idiotic narrative shouldn't the evil Israelis have long ago simply leveled Gaza and the West Bank? You often cry crocodile tears over your assertion that the Israeli military is supremely superior to the peace loving Palestinias - if this is the case why haven't the territories been reduced to rubble long ago?
3) As for the 'collective punishment' meme - if I stood behind a friend of mine and threw rocks at your mother's head every day what would you do? Would you try to stop me, knowing that you might hurt my friend (who while not participating in the attacks nevertheless stood between us at all times) or would you simply allow me to continue my attacks until your mother was dead?
4) Just how many people were killed in the Israel-Lebanon war? How many have been killed in the conflict between the Palestinians and Israelis? This is 'ethnic cleansing'? How many in (name any other conflict)? Sunni-Shia violence in Iraq? Janjaweed militias against non-Arab natives in Sudan?
I'm perpetually amazed that some idiots in this thread actually believe (in spite of every bit of evidence from around the world - Pakistan, Somalia, Nigeria, Indonesia, Malaysia, Iran, Saudi Arabia, Iraq, and even Europe recently) that it is the JEWS who are behind violent global conflict. Ah well, I too believe in karma. We'll see who gets theirs in the end.
January 30, 2008 4:56 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 16:56
After reading the comments regarding Israel, I feel relieved to know that others are aware of the Pro-Israel position of the United States, which is bad news for all Americans!
Tell me this how is it that Jews, who account for less than 18 million people world wide, has such a strangle hold on the world? Why are Americans fighting in the Middle East dying for Israel? My research shows that through FY2000, $91.82 Billion taxpayer dollars have been given to Israel. What are American taxpayers subsidizing this wealthy country?
I begin to look at this arrangement after becoming involved in the Anti-Apartheid movement against the racist South African Government. I was amazed to learn that the racist South African government received training from the Israeli government. This changed the way I looked at Israel. Instead of becoming more human after the genocidal policies of Hitler- Jews became more hateful, and brutal. And, they say that “Jehovah God” gave them the land now known as Israel? The same God whose son Jesus Christ they killed?!?
With the ongoing elections looming, I shutter at the possibility of Senator Lieberman entering the presidential race. Something is terribly wrong with this equation!
January 30, 2008 4:56 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 16:56
After reading the comments regarding Israel, I feel relieved to know that others are aware of the Pro-Israel position of the United States, which is bad news for all Americans!
Tell me this how is it that Jews, who account for less than 18 million people world wide, has such a strangle hold on the world? Why are Americans fighting in the Middle East dying for Israel? My research shows that through FY2000, $91.82 Billion taxpayer dollars have been given to Israel. What are American taxpayers subsidizing this wealthy country?
I begin to look at this arrangement after becoming involved in the Anti-Apartheid movement against the racist South African Government. I was amazed to learn that the racist South African government received training from the Israeli government. This changed the way I looked at Israel. Instead of becoming more human after the genocidal policies of Hitler- Jews became more hateful, and brutal. And, they say that “Jehovah God” gave them the land now known as Israel? The same God whose son Jesus Christ they killed?!?
With the ongoing elections looming, I shutter at the possibility of Senator Lieberman entering the presidential race. Something is terribly wrong with this equation!
January 30, 2008 4:56 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 16:56
I'm afraid the peace process was dead before the report came out. Bush shouldn't have waited until his last year in office to try to get the sides together. And he just sat on his hands while the Israeli-Lebanon war was raging.
No credibility for him or his administration in the Middle East was what doomed the peace initiative.
January 30, 2008 4:29 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 16:29
I'm afraid the peace process was dead before the report came out. Bush shouldn't have waited until his last year in office to try to get the sides together. And he just sat on his hands while the Israeli-Lebanon war was raging.
No credibility for him or his administration in the Middle East was what doomed the peace initiative.
January 30, 2008 4:29 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 16:29
The sad part about the Balfour declaration is not that it says nothing should change the rights and political status of the non-Jewish communities, who now (excluding those who are not Israeli citizens, i.e. Palestinians in the West Bank and Gaza, who have been subject to occupation by foreign entities since 1948) have more rights than they did at the time of the mandate, but that it laughably talks about rights and political status of Jews elsewhere. I guess the right to suffer pogroms were one of those things the British didn't want to disturb. When it came time to make sure that the rights and political status of Jews under the Nazis didn't change, the British did their best to ensure that Jews didn't sneak into the national homeland they were supposed to be given access to, and enjoyed the right to be gassed as a result of their political status. Of course, the current policies of the Israeli government, which, I agree, actually may humiliate people, are, no doubt in your mind, exactly what the Nazis did to the Jews, Gypsies, and all the other untermenschen, and may well be worse.
January 30, 2008 4:27 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 16:27
Getting tired of the middle east.
Tired of the whining on both sides. Arabs and Jews have lots of blood on their hands.
Don't really care anymore because no one side is "right" as the lines were muddied beyond recognition eons ago.
They've been at each others throat for thousands of years and chances are they'll be at it thousands more.
Fundamentalism a road to nowhere and yes i include neo cons.
January 30, 2008 4:12 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 16:12
It staggers the mind, truly.
The Israelis/necons/Jews above bluster constantly how everyone hates Jews, how the Jews have to fight everyone. All the time.
Why, do you suppose?
How many people can you call anti-semite? Everyone? DO you suppose anyone cares?
"OUR LAND", including Palestine? You think so? You live in vaccuum.
January 30, 2008 4:00 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 16:00
Nothing can possibly "mark the end of the Mideast peace process"; for nothing exists that could legitimately be called a Mideast peace process.
Throughout the world, everyone knows there is no Mideast peace process. Everyone has known that for years. To repeat there is one does not make one exist; on the contrary, like abortion in the case of foetuses, that is what prevents one from being born.
All one finds, in that part of the world, is fanatically, vociferously encouraged (primarily in the young -- a shameless crime in itself) permanent conflict and perpetual war, far beyond what those few images and anemic daily reports have been making quite clear, though, for years, and years, and years.
The tragedy is that after more than sixty years of such nonsense, primarily supported by the USA, with utter disrespect for innumerable United Nations resolutions, for human rights, international law and the Geneva conventions, people in that region have come to even ignore what the words "peace" and "process" both mean and denote. No wonder they therefore act as though they ignored, as well, that repeated war crimes and crimes against humanity do not lead to genuine, durable peace.
Unfortunately, those who, in our most prominent media, are officially endorsed to write about the Middle East are no exception.
It would seem that to advocate peace and to demand accountability for all war crimes and crimes against humanity committed in one's name is not for the fainthearted.
January 30, 2008 3:48 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 15:48
It's easy to say you want peace when you're in the middle of an aggresive land-grab. Israel is a failed state, a state which has decided it can and therefore will exist in a petertuetual state of war with its neighbours rather than justice. Nietzsche talked of the conflict of "morality" against "life". Israel has put a certain vision of its existence above all else, AT ANY COST to everyone else but what does it profit a man who lives like that? But its rationale is not even based on countering threats to its existence - it's about greed, domination, punishment, narcissism and self-delusion. The Children of Israel, sadly, have become just that; children.
January 30, 2008 3:36 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 15:36
Lisa represents the best in hopes and dreams of us all, that the Israelis and Palestinians will stop the violence and work together to establish two sovereign states which can live side by side in peace God willing.
January 30, 2008 3:36 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 15:36
It's easy to say you want peace when you're in the middle of an aggresive land-grab. Israel is a failed state, a state which has decided it can and therefore will exist in a petertuetual state of war with its neighbours rather than play fair. Nietzsche talked of the conflict of "morality" against "life". Israel has put its existence above all else, at ANY COST to everyone else but what does it profit a man who lives like that? But this is not even about existence - it's about greed.
January 30, 2008 3:31 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 15:31
To Yishai
The Germans thought they were invincible, too.
Sleep tight in all that snow.
January 30, 2008 3:31 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 15:31
Hey Yishai,
We already went through this. There is no such place as “Israel”. It was a figment of the British imagination and the Balfour Declaration of 1917:
Foreign Office
November 2nd, 1917.
Dear Lord Rothschild,
I have much pleasure in conveying to you, on behalf of His Majesty's Government, the following declaration of sympathy with Jewish Zionist aspirations which has been submitted to, and approved by, the Cabinet:
"His Majesty's Government view with favour the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people, and will use their best endeavours to facilitate the achievement of this object, it being clearly understood that nothing shall be done which may prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine, or the rights and political status enjoyed by Jews in any other country".
I should be grateful if you would bring this declaration to the knowledge of the Zionist Federation.
Yours sincerely
Arthur James Balfour
Note the part that says: “it being clearly understood that nothing shall be done which may prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine”.
Right....
January 30, 2008 3:26 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 15:26
Re my previous post...The above should read " If Abbas is so delusional and shortsighted to deal with Hamas..."
January 30, 2008 3:18 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 15:18
I have to leave. The bottom line is the bottom line:
The Philistines would have had a state in 1937 with the Peel Plan, but they violently rejected it.
They would have had a state in 1948 with UN 181, but they violently rejected it (and actually claimed that the UN had no such mandate!).
They could have had a state in Judea, Samaria, and Gaza from 1948-1967 without any Jews- because the Arabs had ethnically cleansed every last one; but they violently rejected it. In fact, that's exactly when they established Fatah (1959) and thre PLO (1964).
They could have had a state after 1967, but instead, the entire Arab world issued the Khartoum Resolutions:
A. No peace with Israel
B. No recognition of Israel
C. No negotiations with Israel
They would have had a state in 2000 with the Oslo Accords, but they violently rejected it- as always.
The Arabs will just have to learn to "make do" with their own 99.9% of the Middle East- including all of the oil, and stop trying to steal OUR tiny 1/10th of 1% without oil. The Philistines won't have a state here in Israel, and if they don't stop their violence, they won't even exist here anymore. They will have to go to their own land; Jordan.
Better get used to it, because we're not going anywhere.
Nighty-night from snowy Israel.
January 30, 2008 3:14 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 15:14
Mr. Melman,
Your 3rd option would be a disaster, as Israel does have serious security and socio-economic issues to deal with. The Peace process deserves to die. Unlike other efforts, this efforts was crafted from cynicism, callous calculation, and corruption. Olmert, Bush and Abbas are political eunuchs. It is better for Israel and Palestinains to look inward and work on their political and economic divides this year and wait for a new US President. The Palestinians should do the same, work on a dialogue toward unity, form a united government tweaking last year's Mecca Agreement..show the EU a united front so funding comes forth, and work with Blair on getting the Gaza Natural Gas field under Palestinian control ....Fatah needs to hold that congress in March. If Abbas insists on not dealing with Hamas then younger Fatah leadership have some decisions to make about who can really deliver a Palestinian state for them. I think Hamas is at crossroads...it could transform to a political entity BUT SOMEONE NEEDS TO GIVE THEM A REASON TO DO THAT. If Abbas is so delusional and shortsighted to deal with Abbas (actually it is a sign of weakness he does not so far not strength) then the Israelis should consider cutting their own deal with them and that includes and exchange of Marwan for Gilad. There is ONLY a short window for all of this, i.e., for Abbas to cut a deal and/or Israelis with Hamas. I also think a combination of your option 1 and 2 will happen...Livni will be put in driver seat and new elections called for 2008. It's a great pity Labour did not elect Ami Aylon .instead of Ehud Barak...in any event Barak should lose his job also due to the implementation Gaza Blockade, he may or maynot be another political eunuch but he is a total ass......Ami Aylon, Marwan and a new US President can go back to drawing table in 2009 in regard to finalizing peace...2008 should just be about both Isarel and Palestine putting their political and economic houses in order...in any event the emphsis now should be on cutting constructive deals that could potentially advance peace agreement with new players next year
January 30, 2008 3:12 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 15:12
i.supreme,
You sure are confused. There are over a million non-Jews in Israel. Theonly ethnic cleansing was the ARAB ethnic cleansing of ALL Jews from Judea, Samaria, and Gaza in 1948.
This is what they did in 1929 in Hebron, as per a memorandum presented to the British High Commissioner by Hebron's community:
"…the rabbis, Meir Kastel, 68 years old, and Tzvi Drabkin, 70 years old, and five other young men… were robbed, castrated, tortured and murdered… The baker, Noah Immerman was roasted alive on an oven, Rabbi Ya'akov Orlanski HaCohen… was found… praying… they took his brain from his skull and his wife's intestines were crushed… the pharmacist, Ben-Tzion Gershon, lame, unable to move, who served in Hebron for 40 years, kindly assisting many Arabs, they cut off his nose and fingers, killed him, raped his daughter and murdered her with awful torture. The teacher Dubkinov and Yitzhak Abushdid were strangled with a rope… six synagogues… including 64 Torah scrolls, many of them ancient, from the Spanish exile, all were stolen and desecrated...."
http://www.israelnationalnews.com/article.php3?id=4310
We won't allow that any more here in OUR land.
January 30, 2008 3:09 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 15:09
The peace process dies regularly whenever it is re-initiated.
Israel has a knack, much practiced, of performing national security attacks against poorly armed or unarmed Palestinians. Criticize Israel , and castigation from Israeli supporters in America will quickly follow, charging anti-semitism.
No way to break through!! Jack G
January 30, 2008 3:08 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 15:08
The peace process dies regularly whenever it is re-initiated.
Israel has a knack, much practiced, of performing national security attacks against poorly armed or unarmed Palestinians. Criticize Israel , and castigation from Israeli supporters in America will quickly follow, charging anti-semitism.
No way to break through!! Jack G
January 30, 2008 3:08 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 15:08
That's the same 2000 year old force(OLD TESTAMENT and TORAH) that you use to justify the regions ethnic-cleansing of so-called non-Jews.
January 30, 2008 3:00 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 15:00
i.supreme,
I know: Yasser Arafat, who was born and raised in EGYPT, is your idea of a "Palestinian". Or would that be Edward Said, who also was?
Prior to 1948, a "Palestinian" was a Jew who lived in Mandate Palestine- NOT an Arab. Not until later did the term start referring to Arabs. Which should explain the sentiment expressed by Auni Bey Abdul-Hadi, recorded in 1937 by the Peel Commission:
"There is no such country! 'Palestine' is a term the Zionists invented! There is no Palestine in the Bible. Our country was for centuries part of SYRIA."
"It is only for tactical reasons that we carefully stress our Palestinian identity, for it is in the national interest of the Arabs to encourage a separate Palestinian identity to counter Zionism: The founding of a Palestinian state is a new tool in the ongoing battle against Israel…"
-Zohair Mohsin, then head of the PLO Military Operations Dept. and member of PLO Executive Council, in an interview for the Dutch newspaper Trouw, March 1977
"There is no language known as Palestinian. There is no distinct Palestinian culture. There has never been a land known as Palestine governed by Palestinians. Palestinians are Arabs, indistinguishable from Jordanians (another recent invention), Syrians, Lebanese, Iraqis, etc. Keep in mind that the Arabs control 99.9 percent of the Middle East lands. Israel represents one-tenth of 1 percent of the landmass.
But that's too much for the Arabs. They want it all. And that is ultimately what the fighting in Israel is about today. Greed. Pride. Envy. Covetousness. No matter how many land concessions the Israelis make, it will never be enough."
Joseph Farah, Arab-American journalist, editor and CEO of WorldNet Daily
Nope. The Philistines would have had a state in 1937 with the Peel Plan, but they violently rejected it.
They would have had a state in 1948 with UN 181, but they violently rejected it (and actually claimed that the UN had no such mandate!).
They could have had a state in Judea, Samaria, and Gaza from 1948-1967 without any Jews- because the Arabs had ethnically cleansed every last one; but they violently rejected it. In fact, that's exactly when they established Fatah (1959) and thre PLO (1964).
They could have had a state after 1967, but instead, the entire Arab world issued the Khartoum Resolutions:
A. No peace with Israel
B. No recognition of Israel
C. No negotiations with Israel
They would have had a state in 2000 with the Oslo Accords, but they violently rejected it- as always.
The Arabs will just have to learn to "make do" with their own 99.9% of the Middle East- including all of the oil, and stop trying to steal OUR tiny 1/10th of 1% without oil. The Philistines won't have a state here in Israel, and if they don't stop their violence, they won't even exist here anymore. They will have to go to their own land; Jordan.
January 30, 2008 2:52 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 14:52
To I.SUPREME:
Why talk about "before the 1940s"? Why not go back two thousand years when Rome conquered Judea and divided it into three regions, including Palestine. What need have we for a 2000-yr old force dictating the present world. Jews have had ties to the region since time immemorial, and Israel is now a sovereign country. You may not like it, but that's your tough luck, and your terrorist buddies' tough luck. Israel is here to stay, so get used to it.
January 30, 2008 2:50 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 14:50
Unfortunately, a number of neo-nazis appear to be posting comments here.
Let's dispel a few misconceptions: the US is not on its knees and Israel is not responsible for what few problems we have here.
Israel needs to let the arab world know that Jerusalem is an Israeli city by fortifying some land around it, but there is no interest in taking over all Palestinian territory.
The fact that we can even talk about a "peace process" while the palestinian government allows rockets to be fired from Gaza into Israel on a daily basis is simply astonishing. If any other sovereign country was being shelled by Palestinians, it would simply topple the government and wipe the floor with the lot of them. Israel has shown great restraint and held the moral highground, despite what the Jew-haters say.
We in this country were hit with terrorism on one day. We toppled two governments and went to war on the other side of the world. Israel is threatened with terrorism on a daily basis and people whine when it attempts self-defense along its borders. The hypocrisy is palpable.
January 30, 2008 2:45 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 14:45
Dear Yishai,
So please enlighten us... Before the 1940's, where EXACTLY was Israel ???
January 30, 2008 2:44 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 14:44
Any time I see an article mentioning Israel or Jews I read the comments already knowing what will be there. I wish I could say I'm surprised by the amount of anti-semetic rhetoric on these pages, but I'm not. The fact that so many people in the US hate Jews and Israel simply reinforces the need for the State of Israel. I almost think the Washington Post continues to have these articles so that the idiots out there have a place to rant and spread their hate. To address the statements made by these people would be a pointless exercise in futility.
January 30, 2008 2:32 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 14:32
Rick Jones posts the lone comment somehow relating this to Iran and Ahmadinejad.
It is refreshing that it appears there is a conversation going on here about Israel and its definite right to exist, without bringing Iran into it.
Gaza is a mess, as is the West Bank, as is Lebanon. Syria is an opportunistic scavenger. And Jordan and Egypt's vast majority of populace despise the Israelis and their own government for among other things, making peace with Israel.
Israel has a lot to worry about and the Lebanon fiasco has made it feel vulnerable. But they and the Iranians know that the least of their problems are each other.
January 30, 2008 2:20 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 14:20
Kharma sometimes takes a while to come due. Sometimes it takes 90 years. This country went to sleep in 1917, when the zionists started their racist enterprise. But now that Israel's Holy Wars are starting to cost American lives, the slumbering masses are waking up. This is just the tip of the iceberg for the Hell that awaits the zionists, as the masses gradually realize they've been used abused for Israel's evil purposes.
January 30, 2008 2:12 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 14:12
Hey Rick,
We already went through this. There's no such place as "Palestine". There would have been, but the would-have-been "Palestinians" chose war instead.
MANY times.
Oh well. That was their choice. Nothing for them now.
Not here in OUR land.
January 30, 2008 2:09 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 14:09
Bush Thumbs Nose at Congress
By Dan Froomkin
It's about as basic as it gets: Congress has the power of the purse. And Section 1222 of the massive defense appropriation bill enacted this week asserts that power. It reads, in its entirety:
"No funds appropriated pursuant to an authorization of appropriations in this Act may be obligated or expended for a purpose as follows:
"(1) To establish any military installation or base for the purpose of providing for the permanent stationing of United States Armed Forces in Iraq.
"(2) To exercise United States control of the oil resources of Iraq."
But in another of his controversial " signing statements," President Bush on Tuesday asserted that Section 1222 -- along with three other sections of the bill -- "purport to impose requirements that could inhibit the President's ability to carry out his constitutional obligations to take care that the laws be faithfully executed, to protect national security, to supervise the executive branch, and to execute his authority as Commander in Chief."
Therefore, he wrote: "The executive branch shall construe such provisions in a manner consistent with the constitutional authority of the President."
The overall message to Congress was clear: I'm not bound by your laws.
[BTW, if you think that this is off topic you are wrong. Our invasion and occupation of Iraq is closely related to our support for the Zionist invasion and occupation of Palestine.]
January 30, 2008 1:59 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 13:59
To Franklin -
If you kindly go over my previous comment, you will surely see that I have never said civilians did not perish in this war - from both sides.
I was referring to the anarchy that the people, whom you may call freedom fighters, created in Lebanon. Just imagine that a militia in the USA or in any of the European countries had private access to state and public installations and used them in its guerilla warfare.
The Israeli army was after Hizbollah and will continue his pursuit after this genocidal party of G-d. Just ask the so called freedom fighters not to hide anymore behind civilians and once and for all face the Israeli army face to face.
If Hizbollah decided to pound northern Israel will thousands of rockets do not expect us to spread flowers. And frankly, Franklin - your extensive usage of capital letters is more insulting.
January 30, 2008 1:59 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 13:59
Shalom, 99% of the world is anti-semetic. And growing.
Do you propose they should be silenced while the Jews plunder on?
January 30, 2008 1:57 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 13:57
The Prime Minister was murdered by Christofascists. That is the decision making process which led to the 33-day war with what Bush claimed were clients of the EFP providers.
Premier Olmert, as one of the three architects of the war, should follow his two colleagues out of office: General Haloutz, who resigned. and Defense Minister Peretz, who was forced by his labor party to be replaced by Ehud Barak.
In such an atmosphere, the possibility that the already crippled peace process is resurrected is very slim. If you make unilateral concessions or handovers, the Christian Zionists will kill you. It's easy to blame everything on Osama bin Laden. But the Christofascists also have their proxies. (In fact Osama bin Laden has long been one of their proxies)
January 30, 2008 1:49 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 13:49
There is no "peace process" There is only a process by which the world is trying to force the Jews to abandon Israel as a Jewish state and accept the fact that because the Muslims have billions of barrels of oil, the Jews should be once again, denied the right to life and put into extermination mode.
Bush and Clinton and Obama and the EU are all in the pockets of the Saudis and their UAE et al friends that is why the Islamist terrorist in Israel are getting hundreds of millions of dollars to buy weapons to kill Jews.
January 30, 2008 1:47 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 13:47
I posted my first post without looking at the other posts.
As often happens in Talkbacks on anything related to Israel there are a couple of vicious, ignorant anti- Semitic posts.
I believe nowadays all repectable Website talkbacks should have referees who do not allow the posting of hate-filled , abusive, inciteful comments.
January 30, 2008 1:44 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2008 13:44