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Obama and Hu, a U.S.-China Luvfest

Niall Ferguson coined the term "Chimerica" to describe the close and often bizarre co-dependence of the United States on China and vice versa over the past decade. Americans were China's consumer of choice, gobbling up hundreds of billions in Chinese-made stuff. China was our ATM, lending us hundreds of billions of dollars. It was fun while it lasted.

But "Chimerica" is still alive. The US and China are positioning themselves as the twin saviors of the world's economy. Just witness today's luvfest between President Obama and China's Communist Party boss Hu Jintao. Obama announced he would travel to Beijing next year to, according to the White House, "intensify coordination and cooperation on global economic and financial issues." Doesn't seem like any troublesome issues were mentioned. No mention of their squabbles over the Chinese yuan, China's recent assault on the dollar as the world's dominant currency or even the ugly stand-off between US and Chinese naval vessels a few weeks back.


Also, it seems that there's going to be a significant upgrading to the "Strategic Economic Dialogue" that was started by the Bush administration and managed by then Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson. It's been renamed the "Strategic and Economic Dialogue." The White House says Secretary of State Hillary Clinton and Treasury Secretary Timothy Geithner would represent the United States during those talks.

Zachary Karabell, writing in Outlook last weekend, argued that if China and America don't hang together, they're going to hang separately. Well, at least Obama will have some hang time in Beijing.

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Comments (23)

generalyuefei Author Profile Page:

aiy!

People in Taiwan are wasting paper.

Don't they have time to read some novel or something?

Maybe John should do a audio book or podcast too in both language English and gibberish Chinese, we periodically download his passionately reading mp3 with background music. It is green this way. And people's mind will be more over-brainwashed than hard media(like lulu TV), and according to all John's post, he can even put out a slogan for every recording. that starts with:

"Here's a bad news from China again!
...blah blah blah in washing ton's of stuff."

John should charge from posting program too, like charging people for each post a quarter. I am sure there are much monthly payment for it, Mainland official would pay to post; Taiwan Independent group would pay to post; 2nd generation of Chinese Tibetan in US would pay to post, a few Chinese oversea college students(Nationalist)would pay to post...

and after some years, John can also collect some essay and poetry anthology from this website. Pretty rich in everything!

Dear John,

You should feel proud! Do you know your posters are all highly educated, talented bunch of bad crackers of all most everywhere in the world? Other website are dying for some posters like them, I mean they all masters of social, economical, historical, dramatical, religious, poetical... what a bunch of hard crackers? huh?

I post on John Pomfret's blog,
as a lonely boat to the open sea
where gales wave and breakers roar
but I shot aloud as my Chinese:)
Raise up the flag and exultant on!

Don't forget, if the poster writes a propaganda prose or a nationalist calling poem should be charged more.

polarcityboy Author Profile Page:

JOHN Pomfret, are you aware that your blog entries are now appearing in print in the print edition of the China Post newspaper in Taiwan, in print! with editors note saying :From JP's blog in the wash post.....? good idea, i love it...blogs break into print editions. NICE. did you know some papers are doing this? must be a service of the WASH POST SYNDICATE OR WIRE i guess. danny bloom in Taiwan danbloom at gmail

generalyuefei Author Profile Page:

Best Proposal to solve American debt and Chinese HR.

Chinese are willing to forgive all debt, to exchange for 1.4 B US passport:)

And two nations become one, and keeps power balanced in a democratic system, and president will be voted once four years.

Nation name: Chinamerica
People name: Chinamericanese

this method solves all international and domestic conflict, whether Taiwan, Iran...

American are off debt, Chinese can earn liberty and HR while live in China, and they all become one and to be called Chinamericanese of Chinamerica!:)

Communist party voted off, and everyone is happy.

And I guess Obama will still win for 2nd term, against republic or communist parties:-)

How is it? ha ha ha

Deal? or No?

Think about it! Really solve all problems!

generalyuefei Author Profile Page:

Best Proposal to solve American debt and Chinese HR.

Chinese are willing to forgive all debt, to exchange for 1.4 B US passport:)

And two nations become one, and keeps power balanced in a democratic system, and president will be voted once four years.

Nation name: Chinamerica
People name: Chinamericanese

this method solves all international and domestic conflict, whether Taiwan, Iran...

American are off debt, Chinese can earn liberty and HR while live in China, and they all become one and to be called Chinamericanese of Chinamerica!:)

Communist party voted off, and everyone is happy.

And I guess Obama will still win for 2nd term, against republic or communist parties:-)

How is it? ha ha ha

Deal? or No?

Donald2 Author Profile Page:

Looking at the picture from London, the body language between Obama, Hillary and Hu are much more natural than Bush days. Either thay are better actors than Bush, or they really enjoy the warmer relationship. Lucky for Chinese and Americans.

European people and leaders are lashing Americans for the American failure but not Chinese. Two reasons for this:

1. Chinese are not that close to US anyway so thay don't have the right to act like angry kids.

2. Chinese never completely trust American style Capitalism and are not surprised for this failure.

dummy4peace Author Profile Page:

In a democracy, there is no need to overthrow our government when we are not satisfied with our government. There are many ways to improve our government peacefully. Don't take our criticisms against our government in the same light as what you think or wish they are. No matter who is our president, there will be criticisms against the administration. That's called freedom of speech and balance of power. Hopefully, you will get there some day for your own sake.

"If you can dream it, you can do it" - Walt Disney.

thmak Author Profile Page:

To Generalyuefei: Throughout history people have been overthrowing their inefficient and unadaptable governmnets, the resulting governments in due time resemble the disposed ones. The cycle repeats. That fits in the Chinese philosophy of Yin-Yang. Much Appreciation for your Chinese poem.

voter Author Profile Page:

A U.S-China luvfest? It's more that China has learned to play the Western game and has become an inevitable strategic partner because both need each other. More importantly, both Americans and Chinese can understand their differences in culture and thinking, learn to respect each other and work for peace. This is a goal not a dream.

peacemaker74991 Author Profile Page:

I enjoy very much the exchanges between 'generalyuefei' and 'METOO5'. Though both posters disagree widely but very respectful to each other without name calling.

Regardless of whether the U.S. and China are in a 'LuvFest' or not, both nations must cooperate on common grounds instead of getting more confrontations.

dmm1 Author Profile Page:

To those advocating for "Chinamerica":
The word "Chimerica" is a play on the word "chimera." Look it up.

metoo5 Author Profile Page:

Generalyuefei -- the opening sentence "You sound like newly capitalized 'communist' leaders or another senator in Washington" is your assumption.
I'm an unemployed "downsized" 61 year old that has, twenty plus years ago, sued a city for civil rights violations and a company for civil rights violations. Today, I'm unemployed because of something called age discrimination - that's when potential employers change the job description as you sit interviewing, or send you on to the next person to continue the interview but when done with the other person, find the individual that sent you conveniently is absent so the interview cannot continue and calling back always found the same absence. That's when you've just completed a fresh B.A. graduating with honors, but find no one wants to hire such an old person. Far from being a "capitalized 'communist' leaders or another senator", I am a nobody. My only claim to power is the faith I hold in humanity.

You then state "Even John don't believe in dreams nowadays, only nightmares! And they are welcoming us". I would suggest that there are two worlds out there. One, is dark and holds views of defeat. The other sees the potential and holds to the sunlight sneaking over the ridge. Your gloom, your beliefs, are why we will always have differences and I feel sorry for that position you've taken.

Continuing; "When I was a kid, I dreamt; but now I woke, what a nightmare!" When I was a kid, I too dreamt. Now that I am awake, I choose to help others remember the dream.

Change will happen and that is scary. But look for the best and you will find it arrives - maybe slowly and maybe slightly, but it will come. Look from whence we have come to where we are today. Racism is being defeated socially and scientifically, sexism is being denied more and more, colonialism is being recognized for what it is, and communication is defeating the closed doors of old power brokers.

Look to what could be and hold on to it. Dream.

generalyuefei Author Profile Page:

Dreams are not reality, illusion that lures us to chase, after we throw all our valuable life and work for other's gain, what's left? Empty hands!

That is how poor American are experiencing right now, and the same that Chinese people learned, we people all once lured to a beautiful dream, that people shared with each other, everyone be sufficient, a house and car and family, but they were given guns to fight, to bleed and to howl, to chase and protect their dreams, dead were buried, and other running around whole circle, and still now be a slave of those greedy rich and powerful angels and parent-like leaders, what's left for them still a dream, nothing else, all the glories and wealth gathered by a few, but they are guaranteed to keep their dream, for they can't give it up, it was passed down from generations, as their living legacy and identity, so they are continue to be a slave of their dream that drew out by the senators and leaders.

We dreamers often think we sacrifice for good, but we and our later generations are not beneficiary.

Otherwise, tell me, why there are so many poor Americans? and Why Chinese officials are much richer than their poor people?

Are they once shared the same dream for each nation?
American Dream?
Communist Dream?

The only people are dreaming right now, us!
Wake up!

generalyuefei Author Profile Page:

Dear Metoo5,

You sound like newly capitalized 'communist' leaders or another senator in Washington.

Even John don't believe in dreams nowadays, only nightmares! And they are welcoming us:)

When I was a kid, I dreamt; but now I woke, what a nightmare!:)

metoo5 Author Profile Page:

Generalyuefei, As your belief rallies around the thought that "All the belief and labor and strife are just dreams," you and I will have a hard time coming to terms. Dreams are what carries forth an advancing civilization, dreams are what frees people from historical power brokers or oppressive governments, dreams are the reason science makes discoveries and why slavery to any institution is challenged. Strife is the grease dreams work through but it will never stop the dream.

Change in thought, change in levels of maturity, and change in recognizing the need to change is not betrayal rather it is how the world's peoples become one. (And I do believe that is the final direction humankind is bound to obtain.) There are, indeed, those who wish to maintain hold on power and they camouflage the truth with privatized "friendships". Those are people that do not hold formalized talks with others as that requires statesmanship and a formal recognition of others identities as valid. Formalized talks will shine the light of truth upon everything as it is done without a need for darkness.


Hypocrite1 Author Profile Page:

Pomfret: I am very much disappointed with your talk of Obama and Hu, a U.S.-China Luvfest. No human right issues? No Tibet crackdown?

Allow me to try for you here:
First, U.S.-China Luvfest talk could embolden the Chinese. China's security services do pay attention to what the United States says publicly. Saying you're not going to play human rights could be interpreted by China as a green light to break heads.

Second, announcing that a lot of other issues like US debt are more important than human rights (operative Pomfret quote: "The US and China are positioning themselves as the twin saviors of the world's economy") makes it harder to raise human rights as an issue when they do become important. You look silly. And your interlocutors won't take you seriously.


generalyuefei Author Profile Page:

I think I use correct word, 'betray'.

US Senators have been unfaithful to their people for long times, remember the 20s, 60s, and now? They painted others as devils and themselves angels of God and servants of their people. Now they and their wall street buddies are full pocket of dollars, have you heard any senators' house evicted? full of debts? They cut tax so they can earn more and use tax payers money to bail out the system, that same system they and their friends to benefit from, and now their president begs for returns. Do they care poor American? the majority? Yes! in front of TV, so they can hold their job to fill their pocket!

Chinese government, different rules, but the official' situation are better taken care than 1B peasants, at least before Qing Dynasty, the officials were picked by strictly governed exams, so talented people to serve.

And now they marry to each other, so they can still sit in the business class section and hope the economy section customers can work together to give them a smooth fly.

We, both nations' people been played by those greedy blood suckers for over 100 years. Nationalism, Capitalism, Socialism, Communism, are just name of their method they use, so they can continue sit on top of others. How many poor American and Chinese and Korean died in the Korean wars? How many families torn apart, so Chinese were laundry men, and Americans are evil imperialists? Are those dead laughing at themselves, or blessing us in heaven?

I only see a group Chinese sitting on the head of other Chinese, and a group of American fooling other childlike Americans.

the purpose is never changed, only method.
The emperors realized that they did not have any cloth, so they ordered another new cloth made, or they sometimes put on the old ones.

When people can figure out this? All the belief and labor and strife are just dreams.

That's the reason I use 'betray'. Chinese and American, and people in the world are all the same, we are just trying to get by each day.

Citizenofthepost-Americanworld Author Profile Page:

We do “live in interesting times”!

No matter what all those in denial keep on repeating, glaciers are melting faster than expected, and the West’s meltdown is accelerating faster than was foreseen. Who would have thought? Even pundits now tell us that, apparently in no time, we have moved from American unilateralism to bilateral Chimerism, all the while heading for no less, in fact, than multilateralism in what remains to be acknowledged as a truly multipolar world. One must admit: that is remarkable progress.

Meanwhile, as the crisis deepens all around us, China not only grows but keeps on sending shopping teams to Europe (Chinese enterprises have already signed deals worth more than $13 billion in four countries), to the US this month, to Africa and Japan later this year. On every continent, China’s presence and influence are now being felt in an unprecedented way. Amazingly, it would seem that Zachary Karabell’s wishful thinking notwithstanding, China (that “newly muscular adolescent”) already knows very well “how to wield its newly gained power and to what purpose…”

In the process, not only does China rise in the East, lead in BRIC (the Brazil, Russia, India, China unique “quartet”…) and influence Europe like never before, it has recently begun to side with, to support, and even to often speak on behalf of, poor and developing nations. That was most noticeable in the weeks leading to the G-20 summit, something that was widely reported around the world, more particularly by the Hispanic media.

What does all that mean? That either the US becomes unequivocally part of the solution to the current crisis (i.e. of a new financial, economic and political world order) as requested by all so-called “emerging” nations (and part of Europe), or we shall slowly come to the realization that we are more and more isolated in tomorrow’s world. That will become even clearer as the G-20 summit draws to a close: the world can slowly learn to live without US!

GaryEMasters Author Profile Page:

A match made in Heaven?

Why not.

Just lose the older rhetoric. It never was true or even helpful.

metoo5 Author Profile Page:

"Betrayal" is a word used to deny past relations upholding old beliefs. Generalyuefe, is that really what you mean? Are you believing that the belief systems of yesterday can really allow growth for tomorrow's world? I would believe what we see in today's strategic discussions is a long term strategy that will allow greater cooperation while keeping each individual country's integrity. This is something that has not been seen recently and is referred to as statesmanship rather than colonialism. As for either country being "pushovers" or "naive", I would suggest that such thought is based on the win / loose scenario that is fast loosing it's grip on world thought. As countries mature they grow to recognize the need to establish both responsibility of its being to the world while providing integrity to their own peoples. Yes, there is a history of corruption. Yes, there continues to be corruption. What we see developing, however, is a new direction of formalized respect carrying the weight of each countries desire to mature and to recognize the others same right. What we do not see is the "cover-up" informality carries. Betrayal is far from the events of developing statesmanship.

yeolds Author Profile Page:

THIS SCENIARO is only possible, if and only if, the US$ does not go into a major devaluation.

The amount of money funneled to Wall Street [in excess of 14 trillion $ and counting] surely undermine the preception that the dollar's value is of interest to Mr. Obama or to Mr. Bernanke.

China does not have great income in $ since the export market tanked, there is no-one who can cover the Federal Deficit, nor the coming trade deficit [even in its shrunken size]. The USA citizenry is tapped out [aftereffect of a credit binge], or they lost too great part of their wealth [courtesy of Wall Street and regulators]. Depending on the printing press [Federal Reserve buying gov bonds and other junk] eventutally leads to hyperinflation - the end of CHINAmerica

generalyuefei Author Profile Page:

昨日仇敌今日友,
世事渺茫难知晓.
江水悠悠奔流去,
回首日暮青山绕.

generalyuefei Author Profile Page:

Name should be

Chinamerica.

And I am afraid that officials of both nations would together betray their people one day, I mean they both have history of corruptions!

And Chinese are push overs, and Americans are idiotically naive.

I really worry about us! May Chinese and American should join together to over throw their governments together.

thmak Author Profile Page:

Since Obama and Hu is going to have a U.S.-China Luvfest, will Pomfret also change to a ChiLuv?

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