Pomfret's China

« Previous Post | Next Post »

Australia to China: Let's Not Be Friends

Does the West have a new secret weapon in dealing with China in the person of Kevin Rudd, the new prime minister of Australia?

Rudd is the only Western leader who speaks Chinese, and his Chinese is pretty good at that. But deeper still is Rudd's understanding of China.

Australian China scholar Geremie Barme unpacks Rudd's marvelous speech, given at Beijing University last week, in which he bluntly called on China to recognize its human rights problems in Tibet.

Most Western leaders probably would have either punted or come on too strong. Rudd's tone, however, was pitch perfect.

Rudd's brilliance in the speech involves turning the Chinese term "friend" on its head. Friend (pengyou in Chinese) and frienship (youyi) are two of the most distorted concepts in modern China culture. In modern China, a friend is someone who will do you favors and who expects favors in return. A "foreign friend" is someone the Chinese party-state expects will carry water for them and NEVER criticize them.

Whenever a Chinese official called me "foreign friend" (waiguo pengyou), I knew some type of horrible deal would soon be asked or expected of me.

"To be a friend of China, the Chinese people, the party-state or, in the reform period, even a mainland business partner," Barme writes, "the foreigner is often expected to stomach unpalatable situations, and keep silent in the face of egregious behaviour. A friend of China might enjoy the privilege of offering the occasional word of caution in private; in the public arena he or she is expected to have the good sense and courtesy to be 'objective.' that is to toe the line, whatever that happens to be. The concept of 'friendship' thus degenerates into little more than an effective tool for emotional blackmail and enforced complicity."

So what did Rudd do? He went back -- way back -- into Chinese history, to the 7th century AD, and used another word for friendship (zhengyou).

"A true friend," Rudd said, "is one who can be a zhengyou, that is a partner who sees beyond immediate benefit to the broader and firm basis for continuing, profound and sincere friendship."

"Rudd's tactic," Barme wrote, "was to deftly sidestep the vice-like embrace of [the current] model of friendship by substituting another.

"A strong relationship, and a true friendship," he told the students, "are built on the ability to engage in a direct, frank and ongoing dialogue about our fundamental interests and future vision."

This type of engagement could be a model for how the West interacts with China. Enough with the back door, private stuff that Western powers have relied on to engage with China -- private conversations that Chinese officials can then ignore. But at the same time, stop the screaming, with its hint of "Yellow Peril," racism and fear. Rudd got it right. It remains to be seen whether others can follow his lead.

Email the Author | Email This Post | Del.icio.us | Digg | Facebook

Comments (176)

Patti Morey:

A dangerous precedent is being set because other countries stand by while China systematically destroys the entire country, religion and race of Tibet. Tibet has already been figuratively destroyed by those countries who blithely remove Tibet from world maps to call it "China." Thus, in the ultimate human race for water, food and resources, China learns that it may fearlessly take whatever it wants.

OTIS.LG:


Disaster tell the world what China is
the United States is the big countries, he said that China is a threat
Japan is the power, he said that China is a threat
India are neighbors, he said China is a threat
China is what » In an insult to the distortion of foreigners, dalai independence in the attack, no one can see a real China, no one really understands the Chinese people. Today, not this year, the world will have to understand China, China will have to see, not because of the Olympics, not because of the war, but from a series of disasters, so that the people of the world concerned about the disaster, the people of the world have experienced are not experienced the disaster.
Yes, China is a big country, is such a big country, in other countries to interfere in the internal affairs of the time just to condemn and legal resistance, in the face of humiliation and distortion when he was only demand an apology, the Chinese people to resist foreign enterprises unbearable when he was only Bite extraordinary calm, the looting of the torch, he will only let their efforts. However, the anger of the earth, he should not the people of the world the great Western powers of the Chinese nation when Bingmao he will not great nation was a great mind that the world is weak, he used the disaster to the Chinese test, to test the Chinese people, to tell the world What is China, what are the Chinese people, what is the Chinese People's Liberation Army!
Yes, China is such a, you have no right, in the face of disaster, the Chinese government will never yield, never weak and will never retreat, he would in the shortest possible time to make the fastest response! Flood Nanbu Dao, SARS Nanbu Dao, in the Olympic year snowstorm seismic upheaval it all Nanbu Dao! He is not human rights, he did not fail to pay attention to human rights, in the face of disaster you will see: In China, people are always the first one! Life will always be the first!
Yes, this is the Chinese people, you have no right, in the face of disaster, the Chinese people will not fallen and will never give up, they know love, they will do their all to work. It that the Chinese people in the corruption, you can believe that China's young people in the fall, but the catastrophe or disaster to the Chinese people see you in the face of the facts is the way young people because of the disaster to stand up, unite, not that they changed their heated moment in the heart of the unlimited dissemination to the warmth and light!
Yes, this is the Chinese People's Liberation Army, you have no right, in the face of disaster, the Chinese People's Liberation Army will appear in a world all the people can not understand the way, and they are not afraid of sacrifice, they do not include hard work, They all costs, they have only relief, now they will only relief, disaster told the world, was originally used to rescue soldiers, the military is used to protect its people from harm soldiers on the battlefield can not take weapons!
Yes, the world's people in the face of this series of disasters can not understand this country, has been in the understanding of this country. They do not know the world can have such a prime minister, they did not know the world has such a strong nation, they are not aware of such armed forces.
Yes, this is China, which is the embodiment of 5,000 years of civilization.
This disaster on the Chinese demonstrated in front of the world, the Olympic Games with the day the world will understand and look at the hearts of Chinese readers.
Pain in the Chinese dictionary is always equal to the force equivalent to unity.

YOu know nothing:

Please don't just copy others.
You know nothing.
You don't know why chinese students beat the korean. They were only fighting back.
If somebody hit you on your face, I bet you will not fight back according to your words here, because you are coward, and you call it civilization.

Ka C CHU Mr:

This is exactly the sort of comments that renders (White) Australians as racist, and rightly so; well, that I mean, in this days, White men and the White Man often dismisses allegations or charges of racism out of hand ESPECIALLY when there had been acts or matters being racist. As in the case of the comment by a Mr Reverend Jeremiah Wright, how could you possibly write off the entire 5% (FIVE PER-CENT) of your own natural-born and naturalised citizens as non-persons (with no political rights)? Unless when being racist, of course!

The culture of Commonwealth of the Australian States & of Australia does represent every thing bad and the worst things, abuses and excesses of that of the English & the British State & England & the United Kingdom of Great Britain; and does it not? You tell me!

AND BEFORE INSULT TO INJURY, REMEMBER & NEVER FORGET THE CHINESE EXCLUSION ACT OF THE UNION OF THE AMERICAN UNITED STATES & OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA!

WENWANG:

@ JUSTSOMELAOWAI

Canada burned down the White House, not that long ago, and the US is still friends with us.

Love,

another Laowai
(never a 'waiguo pengyou')

Zou xiaotian:

In Chinese, Friends (peng you) means the people has good relationship, know and understand each other. Being a friend, you can encourage, you can blame - you don't need to expect and ask for return. A good friend can prevent you from making mistake. While, providing help and expecting return, that is be partner (huoban).

justsomelaowai:

When the U.S. has to endure Chinese warships sailing up and down the Mississippi and Colorado Rivers, forcing the U.S. government to allow Chinese businessmen to sell heroin openly in America; to permit Chinese Marxist "missionaries" to preach their ideology and set up communist studies centers throughout all of our cities, and finally, have groups of Chinese citizens everywhere who are subject only to Chinese law and exempt from American law...

And then, when average Americans are outraged by this and rebel against the Chinese occupiers, the Chinese army burns the down the White House and loots the Smithsonian, and after 100 years the Chinese tell our descendants to "forget about it, that's old history", perhaps our descendants will understand how the Chinese feel today when they consider themselves bullied and under attack from the west...

Ziyun, Yuan:

Westeners didn't know and undertand China, they don't and they won't..never.

Learn Chinese language, and learn it well.It helps, at least you won't make stupid mistakes...

A Victim of Communist :

Great job, John! I will translate and post this one of your article in boxun.com, an objective oversea Chinese website, a rare Chinese oddity that is not controlled by the seemingly omnipresent Communist.

Keep up your good work.

We thank you.

A Victim of Communist Dictatorship:

Some Chinese here demonstrated how hopelessly poisoned and brainwashed by the communist dictatorship. Don't forget also, some Chinese here are paid by the communist government to manufacture so called Chinese people's opinions. The only opinion they actually represent here is that of the totalitarian communist dictatorship because ordinary Chinese cannot even see this website. Whoever here intentionally confuse Chinese people with China's Communist Dictatorship, your souls are either stolen or sold to the communist devil.

6531Lu:

The problem with journalists is that they have to write to make a living. They don't necessarily know all the facts or really understand the subjects they talk about. They grow up in a specific environment and are instilled whatever relegion they parents have. Once they get into this profession their mindset is basically fixed - a banana always smells like a banana. That's why you can play a game called "read the article and guess who wrote it". A person's article is like a signature of a person.

Well what I wanted to say is this columist has no understanding about China what-so-ever and try to tell world leaders how to deal with/bash China. But to most people in the world, ever since US and company(including Australia) went on a slaughtering spary in Iraq five years ago, the slogans "Human rights", Democracy, Liberty, Freedom have all lost traction. Iraq was an US ally and the only democratic country in mid-east. Of course it got human right problems - only AFTER US dumped it as a friend!

Whether China has good or bad human right records is not the issue now. The issue is US wanted to do the same thing as it been doing for 50 years - make some trouble for the Communists, or whoever it's not in control. You never hear US say anything about the Saudi's - the most dictatorial government on earth.

PTBC:

Mr. John,
Have you ever study modern Chinese History? About the Opium War I & II, about the WWII? Did you know anything about the Mass Killing of Nanjing? It is not a matter of how many year you live in that country, is a matter do you live in with a purpose to pick on people's weakness or to really want to understand them and feel how they feel. I have been live in the US for about 15 years. I went to school and work here. Do I really think I know all about your culture. NOT at all, first, I am not interested in your only 200 years culture. But do I like some of the people here. Yes, I met a lot of very humble and passionate American who make me feel that I am welcome in this country. In return I try to understand your culture without Biases about western culture. Indeed, I love them like my own family. I am very offend that on you article that Chinese "expects will carry water for them and NEVER criticize them" I CAN RECALL WHEN WE WERE THIRSTY IN THOSE DARKNESS TIME THAT YOU AMERICAN OR ANY FOREIGNER BRING US ANY WATER, INSTEAD, YOU DIVIDED OUR COUNTRY TO 8 PARTS FOR ALL OF YOU TO SHARE. I BET NOT A LOT OF REAL CHINESE FRIEND YOU HAVE CAUSE THEY KNOW YOU SUCH A BS.

Eww:

It's funny when someone's blaming China for the poisonous foods. Well, so many big firms has produced some products that accidentally contain poisonous ingredients. It happened in Japan, in the US.. everywhere in the world!

If you find a Chinese company exporting poisonous food to the US, then blame it, stop doing business with it. So what the heck did China do wrong?

Well, I do think there is toooo many differences between the east and the west. We have to work harder to understand each other, instead of pointing and blaming each other for their not understanding us.

Enemy of my enemy:

Charles de Gaulle said, 'Great nations do not have friends, only interests.'

Paul:

The following is my translation of the April 13 contribution by Zheng Min


I am a 41 year old Chinese engineer, living in Zhengzhou, Henan Province. This is the first time I am expressing my opinion about an article. I think the West should genuinely understand the true reality of China and make China a friend or partner and not an enemy. I feel China has made enormous progress in recent years in many areas so that the Chinese people do not appreciate others making indiscrete criticisms of their country. Is the West so perfect that it is qualified to lecture others? Sometimes I feel the West is quite hypocritical and mean, due to its prejudice and arrogance.

(Moniker can be translated as genuine guest)

BRAMBLES:

@ MrsDocChuck:

I m Chinese. I didnt poison you. Some scum bag exporters from my country shipped sub-standard products to your country. CHINA DIDNT. I did not do that.
Your country has criminals too. Blame your country's democratically elected import examination officials (FDA)/Congressman/Mayors for not delivering their campaign pledges. Blame your country's scum bag importers for delivering poison/sub-standard products to your family.
It's simple as that. Use your right to defend yourself as we are doing our share here. Just dont scream at "China" which includes people like me.

MrsDocChuck:

First, let me qualify my question and my subsequent comments by the admission that my husband is NOT in favor of “globalism.” He thinks that the concept is VERY dangerous to the health and welfare to the citizens of the United States of America.

That being said, he is infuriated by the daily reports of China’s shipping of poisonous food and food-related products into the U.S. China has inundated us with poisonous products including pet foods, fruits and juices, vegetables, meat products, seafood, toothpaste, and God knows what else.

Many of our elected officials, who could not care less about our health, permit this travesty in the name of “open-trade” and “globalism.”

• So, what can we do to protect ourselves from China’s poisonous products?
• What are YOU doing to protect yourself?
• What suggestions do you have for the rest of us?

a Chinese, Made in Taiwan:

'"A strong relationship, and a true friendship," he told the students, "are built on the ability to engage in a direct, frank and ongoing dialogue about our fundamental interests and future vision."'

Ruddy knows Chinese history better, but still not good enough. He should know a real friend or 'zhengyou' needs to be always thinking about the good (long term for a zhengyou)for his friend, but I really don't think any politican could have such good heart. On this cold cruel world, interests are the only rule. Don't trust anyone except yourself. You need to be strong enough to defend youself before the self-called zhengyou from the western world.

That's also very true for Taiwan. Some stupid people from my country think our allies from the 'free world' will defend us when the communists attack us. How can they get this idea? They only use us to deter the mainland, nothing more than that.

wangfromsd:

ha,,ha,,
everybody can skim this post inside china. and now i am typing these words in the city Jinan, which sits several hundred miles southeast of beijing.
oh...via the band line at home now, and i often get on line for surfing at office too.

It is 1996, I telnet BBS the first time inside china. Ha. Always those command in English. Lynx….mail binary…or ascii. ….

Lucy:

At least you seem to speak english... Thats a start.

Steve Farrow:

To the nut who says "The West wishes you the BEST of LUCK":

Stop this idiocy!

world-in-danger-with-yellow peril:

Yeah, i know. I'm such a mongoloid western supremacist!

piper:

Wow... Do you play with headless dolls too?

The West wishes you the BEST of LUCK:

qinshonghua@yahoo.com.cn:

I am glad a citizen’s voice has finally broken through your iron curtain. Though I see you post from a Chinese Yahoo domain, I hope that all your anti-regime words do not get you into trouble there.

If you are working on a pirated uncensored internet connection to access this site, please take our well wishes close to your heart and know that the free people of this world DO support you in your cause for Human Rights. The new Chinese labor law is a GREAT first step in the right direction, so progress is finally being made there.

I hope you now do the smart thing and pack up your satellite phone and computer and move to a different location before someone from your government comes knocking down your door to re-educate you.

I look forward to future posts from you as you are able to safely set up your communication systems in that country.

Ed:


Interesting article currently at "The Washington Post" website, "China's Emboldened Workers." Some foreign managers and owners of factories in China are trying to evade new laws or move their plants to other countries because they will be less able to exploit their employees as they have in the past. The new law, which has surprised reactionary business owners, gives major new protections to Chinese workers.

qinshonghua@yahoo.com.cn:

tebit isssure

Comments: am a chinese who wanna going to out side to tell what
feelings for the china government,though i still love china,but i hate this
government and have dispointed to her people especialy that
beruacracies,i have some thought that familiar with the tibetian,that is i have a
deepest disgusting to the this goverment because of :she didnot provide
the chance that fail to her people but totally a humanbeing eat
humanbeing enviroments,i want leave it if i can,i want challenge in a equality
society,please contact me if u see this words,best regard to you !i see the "tibet riots"
Your Comments: although am chinese,i really respected to tibetans,
espicially those people who have courage to stand out to strive their
right and freedom, what they had done seemed somehow released the
depressness that deeply hidded inside the mass chinese.

for reasons,maybe sorts of but one piece is the same.almost china
ordinary people are suffered and exploited by extremly unfair
supperstructure politic system and bureucracy based this system.

in china,the richest people can't avoid untached with this
bereucracies,almost prospective project can make money were grabbed by officers
who could take advantage of their power make themself rich first and
didn't take the coutry's interest into aacount at all.and this
upperstructure, which
organized the state,werenot made up by people that were elected by
equalitic completions but the majority of them
entring to work related by their old generation.

however, the ordinary population,who are called "people of the
people's repubic of china", are living on the substance of terrific
unequality and lakes the social security.....i see the "tibet riots"2
Your Comments: In search of whatever china news papers or internet, we
can easyly find out there are numorous civilians died or severe
injuried by government clerks every year.some of them just because of doing
business at street for living,some just because of their house site or
other proporty was conveted by government or profit relative realestate
companys whom was failed negotiate with, some just only have a little
offended with polices or governars.
there are another people were killed each year, or by business
conflicts,or cause power crave or political struggles,or even irritate resent
just by oppress subordinates......

Not mention the people who died related with government,more people
died in such an enviroments cotroled by government involved
robbing,rape,steal,gamble,prostitution,drug abuse,kidnap,illicit sexual
relations,trachery,bad triffic and facilities,mine accidents,being sick disable to
treat......we can heard or read in everywhere everyday,let alone those
people who suffered with lose
proporty,discrimilation,unemployment,unaffortable disk of disease,illicit child labour,nopayment work by
swindle or by force,lack of administred stock market traps,unreasonable
distributed tax and fees,undistinguished police bureau,inspect
institute,court......
such there cases are countless.......

in a word, this so called people's government is running for a few of
special classes but not for the masses cilvilian at all.

i hate this government and some of people lives in this substance.i
believe the people have this feelings like me in china absolutely arenot
a small number,that's part of reasons i prefer to support tibetans.i see the tibet riots (3)

In my youth year, almost enterprises in china wree state-owned, by now
almost of them had broke down except afew large company monopoly the
market by state force, forbidding or limiting other else oganizations
entering,but the situation of collaption and inefficiency of these
company's leadship and toilling masse's pitness is the same,the quility of th
masse's life wasn't get better because the continuous price rise always
offset the salary increaseness.

my father had worked at one state-oned backgroud enterprise for whole
life, after his retailment, his pensions werely could afford his
alive,he hardly get any money to look doctor during his strike period,he died
miserably at his 69 years old eventually because of lack treatment and
medicines.but during his alive,his only property-one old 60 square
metres house his previous leads distributed to his familly of 6 members.was
unresonable and by forced demolished by current leader ! colluded
with private business man,almost his collegues include us try to appeal
or bring a suit against them to government various deparments,but
eventually none of these departments give a practical responces like other
masses encounterd before......

Nevertheless,this various departments,when they charge the taxes or
other fees(which charged more and more alongwith year and year)from the
civilians,all did so cruel and greed like wolfes and tigers. i once was
telled pay high locative income tax when i runing a store, as an
accountant before, i knew this chage was far more aginst the county's law, but
when i asked the officer,he lost his temper and scold to me with foul
mouthed,at the end even threat to me said there was no reasons,or i
should pay it or they will seal my store.....

No need for reticence, the imagenations of almost governars are such
ugly,selfish and hertless, and hd deeply disdained by the masses in
china.....

BRAMBLES:

To You are nothing but a pawn in chinese culture:

Do you believe in Human Rights? Yes? Good.
What do you do for your belief? Are you gonna come down to the capital of this "oppressive regime" and save us? No? Good.
What elso do you do beside "dabbling" in "politics"? ?? Good.
Dude, stop pretending that you know what you are staying. Go to a law school and learn what's rule of law and what's Human Rights.
What did you do to deserve this position on the "Moral Everrest"? Think about it, man. Only dont tell me the answer.

I used to work in CA. Never seen this much ignorance and bloated complacence. It's worse than some Chinese BBS for teens.

You want the world's respect? Lol.

Alah:

To the NUT who says "You are nothing but a pawn in chinese culture":

You must be feeling a lot of pain. What did Chinese ever do to u??!!

Ed:


John Pomfret, may I suggest a future topic for discussion. How about asking persons from the United States or other countries who have visited China for their insights about China and the Chinese people? This could potentially be a meaningful exchange among those who have actually been to China.

You are nothing but a pawn in chinese culture:


Model citizens to other Chinese maybe. To everyone else, you are rude, obnoxious and conceited and have no idea of what courtesy is… That is if I were to stereotype the Chinese in general like you have done to us.

They hardly protest because they have been trained not to. They fear being beaten and re-educated to the ways of your illustrious leader which is why they keep problems to themselves, not because they couldn’t use the help.

As for not dabbling in politics? What’s the point when you cannot voice your opinions for the same reasons above? Your idea of what works for you and what works for the world are in no way compatible if you expect people to take you seriously.

Since you are the minority in terms of influence on world culture, perhaps you should stop demanding things and blaming the “West” for all your problems and start listening to what your own oppressed people have to say. Stop wasting your time trying to convince us on blogs and use that time to convince your own government to enact certain basic rights for its own citizens…! If you even believe in human rights…. Do you?

The world is not ready to lower their standards just because an oppressive regime like China says so. Sorry to disappoint you.

I'm as human as u:

To world-in-danger:

Are u nuts or racist? Chinese are model citizens anywhere in the world. They hardly protest and they keep their problems to themselves. Most Chinese just want to work for a good life, and don't dabble much in politics.

China, is still improving for the better, perhaps even towards democracy. But it must change slowly at its own pace, without anymore revolution and bloodshed.

Explains A Lot:

If he had to go back to 7th century AD to find a word that best describes "Friendship" in the same manner as the West describes it in every day language, I can see why they are so distrusting of anyone other than their great leader.

They lost all concept of true friendship back then. Perhaps all these Chinese posters should go and read all about what it means to us in their own history books. Then apologize for misunderstanding all of us Americans that post in ENGLISH on our ENGLISH boards.

Then go crawl back in your hole and avoid us until we are done getting ticked off.

Tariq Shah:

Australia despite its huge and empty landmass routinely send back refugees, and supported a cruel and unjust war in Iraq should not lecture China.

Australians are some of the most xenophobic people on the planet right behind the Russians and the Danes.

Living in US 15 years:

I don't think the issue of Tibet Independence should be off limit, even in China,as long as it is pursued in peaceful way. But I think people in the West should also know whom they are supporting, especially the Dalia Lama.
Dalia really is nothing but a very smart and charismatic politician. He occupies no higher moral ground than any other politicians in the world. If u need proof, just look at his stance on Iraq war. If u think John Kerry or Hillary are flip flop, Dalia is even worse.

DAVE MUSTAINE:

PEACE SELLS, BUT WHO'S BUYING?

Frends (Citizenz/Denizenz) of Holy Cosmic space Ship momma poppa Earth:

Courtesy translation, By: Comrades Of Space Ship earth et al, via Babel Fish.

For ZENGBIN @ 10:18AM Today.

"I am a Chinese engineer, 41 years old, in Henan Zhengzhou, this is my first time on an article expression view.

I thought the west should truly understand Chinese the realistic truth, should make China friend or partner, but is not the enemy.

I felt Chinese these years various aspects have all made the huge progress, including looks like I such ordinary Chinese is does not like the others gesticulating.

Western world very are really perfect, has the qualifications to teach the others?

My some times think the west very falsely, also very mean, the reason is the prejudice and is arrogant."

JRLR:

Aurelius: "Does anyone know where one can locate the original Chinese text version of the speech? A lot gets lost in translation."

I've been trying hard to... without success. Only bits and pieces, in Chinese, on YOUTUBE.

Anyone had more success? Would appreciate having links or the whole text reproduced here... assuming the owner of the blog does not keep it for his exclusive perusal.

Will advise were I to be more successful.

Regards and thank to all.

zhengbin:

I am a chinese engineer ,41,in ZHENGZHOU,HENAN . This is my first time feedback an article.I feel westworld should learn the truce of in CHINA, should be friend or partner of CHINA,not the enimy of china .

我是一名中国工程师,41岁,在河南郑州市,这是我第一次就一篇文章表达看法。我觉得西方应该真正了解中国的现实真相,应该做中国的朋友或伙伴,而不是敌人。我感觉中国这些年来各方面都取得了巨大的进步,包括象我这样普通的中国人是不喜欢别人指手画脚的。西方世界自己真的就很完美,有资格教训别人吗?我有时候觉得西方很虚伪,也很卑鄙,原因是偏见和傲慢。

TerryKing:

Why are my (inoffensive) posts being "Held by the (blog owner)" for two days now?? Who's in charge here?

world-in-danger:

QUESTION: "CAN THE WORLD MAKE FRIEND WITH CHINA?"

QUESTION: " CAN THE WORLD MAKE FRIEND WITH THE MONSTER? IT HARVESTS BODY-PARTS OF ITS OWN CHINESE TO MAKE MONEY?

QUESTION: "CAN THE WORLD COME TO PEKING TO SEE KILLERS WHO TORTURE, MURDER, IMPRISON, TERRORIZE THEIR OWN CHINESE LIKE A BORN-TO-BE SLAVES FOR COMMUNIST CHINESE VAMPIRES?"

QUESTION: "CAN THE WORLD COME AND DANCE WITH THE CHINA WHICH SMILES AND CARRYING A BAYONET IN ITS HAND READY TO DO HARM TO YOU AND EVEN ITS OWN CITIZENS WITHOUT HESISTATION?"

In summary, please stay away from the shadows of evil China and its murderous thugs!!! these animal-like cretures only born to exploit and create devastation to the world in general and their own chinese in particular!
these barbarous animal-like creatures prey on their own people the they will never pay attention on anyone else! it is true like: 1+1=2.

The world must stay away from the treacherous China and its terrible, lying chinese thugs for best protection on yourselves and on your next generations and your nation's future!!!!

John Wesley Rumchapel:

'...at the same time, stop the screaming, with its hint of "Yellow Peril," racism and fear...'

PENGYOU:


If you wanna know China by yourself, not by some biased midias! Welcome to China, welcome to Beijing Olympic Games!

Courtesy Translation by : "Comrades [ZHENGYOU/Friends] Of SpaceShip Earth." :


Courtesy Translation by : "Comrades [ZHENGYOU/Friends] Of SpaceShip Earth."

for: Chinese-People-True-Friends @ 7:37AM Today;

---- Translated from Simple-Chinese To-English vioa Babel Fish:

"Australian Premier Lu Kewen publishes at the abundant 鳌 Asian forum lectures on April 12, 2008 15:30:15"


"[ Australian Premier Lu Kewen ] extremely will thank the dragon forever to attempt gentleman, thanks respect president of PRC Mr. Hu Jintao, fellow state heads, the various countries' head, ladies, gentlemen, we all live today in the identical Earth village. This

is an extremely good forum, the East and the west can unify, because more and more globalization, any country other country has not had the influence to the world in, we adopt the behavior also is to our this world influential. This

not only is a national domestic challenge, also is the challenge which the whole world faces. The last week I visit American president, United Nations Secretary General, Europe commission chairman, English, French, Italian, South Africa's political head, then China, our good friend, is Premier Wen Jiabao, but also has President Hu Jintao. These

conferences all have a common subject, that is each country faced with they challenge, but they realize us to challenge must have to be supposed to, should to the global crisis. In

the middle of all questions, we thought the climatic change already became our core discussion the content, the climatic change was the biggest morals, the economic problem which the world faced. The

Australian government's starting point is, if to climatic change no matter what its development will not adopt moves we to pay the huge price, we will devote to establish a frame to come to be supposed to the climatic change. We

also must reduce our discharging, we must establish to discharge the highest limit. The Australian government hoped joins to the global endeavor, becomes the solution climatic change the country, but is not aggravates the climatic change the country, we all has the responsibility in this aspect, solves the climatic change through the global frame. We

have but have the difference together the responsibility, is the speech which said in the United Nations climate frame, said regarding the developing nation, possibly can have a better goal, has some other limits withdrawal the goal, this is possible to help to promote the sustainable development.

Further was reducing the felling also to have domain and so on forest degeneration, China already is at the leading position, China is increasing its forest 覆盖率. We

must build a platform, the technology solve this means most important part, we must think some means solution development technologies, no matter the whole world and the international goal are any, it must be can weigh, can investigate, moreover it must reduce discharges.

In Beijing, my isothermia family treasure premiers all agree with the acceleration in the climatic change aspect cooperation. The Australian environment organization already carried on the cooperation with China's friends, how can develop the new technology, this technology can reduce the withdrawal, I thought we have the very many technical question. But

we believed, also anticipates with China, US and other national positive cooperations. We must overcome the clean coal technology the challenge, we make the resolution and the pledge cause it through the more scientific research investment to become the reality, then becomes the commercial product.

China's state presidents once talked about science development view, already proposed a such scope, the economical development had to be extremely stable, if sustainable, was must reduce consumes energy and protects the environment. We must enter this science development view to us should to the climatic change scope. Finally

I must use Chinese to say several speeches. This year the abundant 鳌 Asian forum subject has contained two factors, first, we need the global cooperation; Second, the world will need a cleaner green the future.

I talk about in the Beijing University lecture, Australia devotes to becomes the Chinese genuine friends, a 铮 friend, carries on the constructive with China cooperation. We

also can also have the world with this area other partners together to face the challenge together, only has through pledged together and the unprecedented cooperation, we only then can realize in the climatic change question double win the result. Thanks everybody!

Made somewhere other than China:

Sure 'K-Rudd' bravely mentioned (very delicately) that China needs to address the human rights issues in Tibet - why wouldn't he, he's got nothing to fear from China. China desperately needs Australia's coal, they're in the process of trying to buy a huge stake one of their iron ore businesses (BHP) and they're also after their uranium, all of which drives the massive engine room of their economy, now and into the future - it's China that should be keeping the Aussies sweet!

As for those of you disgusted by China's blatant human rights violations, just stop buying goods 'Made in China', they'll soon get the message.

Last word on K-Rudd's words; Total Blairism.

Hu Clique:

I believe in true peace, true friendship and true love. Don't believe the words of the Hu Clique.

Mariano Patalinjug:

Yonkers, New York
13 April 2008

Australian prime minister Kevin Rudd obviously assumes that Chinese rulers now, the 21st century, must still think in terms of words the Chinese used in the 7th.

If he does, he is terribly mistaken!

Of course, China's present leaders should be assumed to know the distinction between the words "friend" and "partner" as those words are used by Westerners now.

Thus, any time and every time Chinese leaders engage in dialogue or negotiations with their Western counterparts, they must be assumed to understand the words "friend" and "partner," when used by Westerners, precisely as those same words are understood by Westerners--and not as those words were understood by 7th-century Chinese.

Yes, Mr. Kevin Rudd's Chinese must indeed be that good. But let me assure him that modern-day Chinese no longer need to be instructed on the 7th-century distinction between "friend" and "partner."

Mariano Patalinjug
MarPatalinjug@aol.com

john:

What do Gazprom (Putin) and Exxon/Mobil (Bush) have to do with China's Tibet crackdown? Oil and gas in Tibet. Lots of it. Why are they tacitly supporting China's crackdown? Well, does anyone really want to see a fully industrialized India in competition with China? For those familiar with India, the answer is obvious: no. So far, the TAP (Trans Afghan Pipeline) to supply India has been put on hold for years by fighting in Afghanistan and Pakistan--that's where the pipleline would have to run to supply India.) The rest is just silliness. The bottom line is that Western nations do not want to compete with a democratic capitalist Indian economy and there is no real fear of a Chinese economy because it is Communist--ideally suited for slave labor.)

just wanna be a good host of a party:

A last thought. Last year I saw a movie called "Babel" which was starred by Brad Pitt, it's really a cool film. It depicted a real sad story which is caused by communication-disfunction. The newsstory about China and Xizang (Tibet)in western press is so different from what i saw and experienced. We try to persude eachother but just in vain. What surprised me is that some Tibeten activist even cannot point out the location of XIZANG on the map. Do they really care about the people living on that land? Maybe they care more about morally superority than anything. The Bible says God confused the language, causing them to speak different languages so they would not understand each other. By doing this, God thwarted the plan to build "stairway to heaven". Maybe love is the only key to the tower of Bable.

foreigner:

to

your effort to underline any positive aspects of the Games is touching.

Don't worry Be Happy

just wanna be a good host of a party:

Thanks for all you guys’ kindness to concern about humanrights here in China. But to a average people in China, we dont care which party is in power or wheather it is a communist party or a democratic party, the name of the party means nothing to us, what we do care is that wheather we can get a good job to improve our lives, wheather our kids can get into a good school, wheather my parents can get good health care,or wheather we can have a larger house...You can call me shortsighted, but what we really want is a calm , happy and improving life, not your democratic Utopian. Everyone has his(her)own Republica , but if we have to realize it at the cost of taking away all we have now, we may have the right to say "no".

BRAMBLES:

TO Steamboater:
>>Many Chinese may be happy with so-called progress in China but it's something those people need to think about more. What dictatorships give, they can always take away. This is the rule of law that is China's tyrannical government. They give a little, piece by piece and then the people are happy with the crumbs they receive and think great progress has been made. (end of quote)

-- One obtacle between the parties in this much hyped "engagement/conversation" of the orient and the west is, like any newly in love/relationship, they dont know much about the lad/lass on the opposite end.
I hope you could trust me in saying that We (the Chinese people) are indeed "THINKING". Even the government you so despise are "THINKING". I also hope you would appreciate my sincerity in saying that a lot of the progress (of the benign kind) in China would not have materialized (so soon) without the pressure (criticism) from outside.
But I do want to point out a major factor that even apparently well educated people like you are, forgiving me for being blunt, ignoring: there are so many of us here in this vast country. If number itself is not convincing enough, I would also venture to say that the word "China" or "Chinese" (as some gentleman happily uses in their posts) enbodies a heterogeneous, diversified group. There are so many of us with different and sometimes diagonal immediate interest in this so called "economic boom". The balance of interests can be tricky and dangrous, considering that a great part of the population are well under poverty line and can not afford even the talk of 'rights' besides daily necessities. I m not an apologist of the government. It's just a sad truth. Changes can not be rushed. Time and patience is needed. I for myself learned this not through the easy way. To sum up, "China" means a lot more complicated than "human right problems" or "communist rulers" and "The Chinese" should be used carefully because as a collective noun it confuses important differences, just like "The Americans" or "The Muslims" does.
I have travelled my share of the world. I know people everywhere want good things to happen for their neighbours and themselves. I believe it's in our biological/social genes as mankind. I also know that things happen in their own ways. Just be patient.
Oh I m not saying you should "shut up" because you dont yet know China. On the contrary, I m replying because I m now joining the conversation/reasoning.

just want to a good host of a party:

for me and many ordinary Chinese people, olympics is just a great party to be held in our home. we are elected to be the host, and eager to do our best to be a best ever host of this game, we bulit lots of magnificent stadiums,we try to improve our environment, even elderly people like my mom and dad who are in their seventies warmheartedly try to learn more english to communicate with foreigners, and be supportive ^-^.and my nephew who is a average student in college applied severally times to be a volunteer to do some service job for the tourist.
we are openning our arms to the world in the past 30 years, though we are still poor and we have a lot of problems, like our english:), but we still are trying, so give us a encouraging smile, not a up-stick nose.

chinese people:

Australia to China: Let's Be true Friends

chinese people:

welcome to beijing

BRAMBLES:

TO ED:

Thanks for the information. However, the on again - off again of the dependency relationship between Tibet and China (or more accurately, dynasties that had ruled China, for example, the Yuan Dynasty which was alien but ruled from China) dates hundreds of years earlier than the Kangxi era of the Qing dynasty. There are many historical materials I can provide to you but they are all in Chinese/Tibetan and I have yet to locate a good English site.
The accuracy of either party's account of history is always open to arguements, as it should be. Just one interesting note: why is that there's such gaping discrepency between the version we (as Chinese) are taught, and the one used to inform you? Is it because the significance of Tibet to the west had dwindled following the Great Game? How to interpret the fact there are not much English literature documenting this line of history?

Aurelius:

Does anyone know where one can locate the original Chinese text version of the speech? A lot gets lost in translation.澳大利亞總理陸克文北大讲座中文原本在那儿?

Steamboater:

China may change at a snail's pace but that concept is difficult to say the least on those China has been and is responsible for harming to the point of torture and death e.g., Darfur, Tibet, Burma and North Korea. All these countries have come under China's boot in one way or the other, including China itself.
Most grievous too is China's scamming the Olympic commitee by promising to foster human rights in exchange for getting the Olympics. Human rights have worsensed, although maybe not. This is way it has always been by the thugs who devastate dignity and human rights. We think it's gotten worse because there has been little reporting over the years in the west of China's tyranny. Instead we get delightful reports on China's economic boom and benign travel highlights. Because of China's heist of the Olympics however, China should know that her abuses aren't going to be tolerated any more. The China Olympics should be boycotted by both heads of state and athletes.
Already, because of what's happpening in Tibet, the China Olympics is a disaster. People all over the world, whether they actively protest or not, are sickened by China's actions in Tibet. All this has brought to light China's aiding and abetting genocide in Darfur as well as the recent bloody crackdown in Burma.
Many Chinese may be happy with so-called progress in China but it's something those people need to think about more. What dictatorships give, they can always take away. This is the rule of law that is China's tyrannical government. They give a little, piece by piece and then the people are happy with the crumbs they receive and think great progress has been made.

Ed:


The issue of Tibet is not one I can speak to with much confidence, so what I say here may not be entirely historically accurate. Two of my sources for my very limited understanding of the history of China and Tibet are Jonathan Spence's "The Search for Modern China," widely acclaimed as the best single volume history of China since the fall of the Ming dynasty, and Frederick Mote's "Imperial China," a fairly detailed single volume history of China from about 900 to 1800 CE.

The famous Qing emperor Kangxi ordered Qing troops to invade Tibet during his reign, from what I can tell because of complicated geo-political relations between the Qing dynasty, Dalai Lama, and Western Mongol tribes that historically posed a threat to China. Certain Qing leaders, especially near the end of their dynasty, claimed control over Tibet. The British and Chinese tried, during varying periods, to control the foreign policy of Tibet. Great Britain wanted Tibet to be autonomous from China to create a buffer between China and their colony in India.

Frederick Mote contends Tibet was not administratively ruled by China until 1950. Spence observes how Yuan Shikai, who overthrew incipient democracy in China led by Sun Yat-sen and his allies, contended Tibet was a dependency of China. He agreed with British demands that Tibet be considered autonomous of China to win British recognition of his regime. However, as Spence points out, neither Yuan's Cabinet nor the Chinese Parliament concurred.

Mote writes that since the fall of the Qing dynasty in 1911 CE, nearly all Chinese historians, Nationalist, Communist, non-partisan, have claimed Tibet has long been part of China. This perhaps explains, at least in part, why most people in China today believe Tibet has historically been part of China.

The Nationalist government led by Chiang Kai-shek claimed Tibet and Mongolia were part of China, but lacked sufficient power to try to occupy either region, during the era of warlordism, civil war and Japanese invasion. This leads to the likelihood, had the Nationalist forces prevailed in the Chinese civil war over Communist forces, Nationalist forces probably would have eventually invaded and occupied Tibet.


Spence writes the CIA was involved in training Tibetan insurgents in 1959. This fact may help explain why some Chinese, even if circumstances have changed, believe outsiders are at least partly responsible for recent violent protests in Tibet.

Ambushed:

Chinese mentality is not much different from President Bush's mentality. "You are either with us, or against us". True friendship and democracy allows people to have different opinions. Let's agree to disagree. Of course, some fools will try to snatch the torch. Well, that's my opinion.

Exercising free speech:

Partners but not friends? So, now it is down to a play of words. What hypocrisy! How about more accurately "I want your money but nothing to do with you - because I'm afraid of those who pour hatred on you"

BRAMBLES:

To Living in Kunming:

To many Chinese I know, the recent events in Tibet might turn out to be a good thing for the sole reason that it transpired before Dalai's retirement (death).
Anything happens in this country it happens slow. Not that we want it to be slow because we consider patience to be consummate virtue. I wish a new and truly modern China might be born by travelling light but the fact is here in China Nearly Everything political is at the same historical. Isnt it the same with any other countries, for an instance, your country?
It takes time. And, please also consider that fact that this is a huge, heterogeneous country. Any sudden shift of policy at the national level could in effect trigger tremendous remifications across the state.
Please, if you are really concerned/interested in the issue, ask not "WHY NOT" THEY DO THIS or THAT? Things are easier if you do a little bit more research on the subject.
BTW, the correct Chinese Pinyin spelling of the name of the province you currently reside is "YUNNAN", not "YUNAN".

BRAMBLES:

TO Ed and CASTRO:

It's exactly because there are people like you that I and many of my peers respect YOUR Country and Civilization so much. Again I m Chinese and I live in Beijing.

Living in Kunming:

Regarding the Tibet issue, I'm curious why China can't have a dialogue with the Dalai Lama. I hear Chinese, when pressed to simply have a dialogue with the undisputed leader of the Tibetan people, resort to unrelated and unrealistic retorts calling for the United States to return American to the Native Americans. The former is a possible compromise that can improve the situation in Tibet, the latter might have been possible 300 years ago but is certainly wasted debate now.

It seems there is no middle ground for the Chinese to consider that maybe China's policy in Tibet is flawed. (The US's policy in Iraq is incredibly flawed, but there is at least a debate underway in the US on how to improve it.) Some comments from Chinese seem to think that any input from the outside world is biased imperialism. It's unfortunate, because China really limits itself as it grows if it thinks only "Chinese" are knowledgeable enough to make meaningful decisions regarding China's future.

I personally think that the the Chinese Napolean syndrome, xenophobism, and cponfused ideas regarding race/nation will continue to make China the short noisy guy in the room that everyone tolerates but no one really wants to be with. A government so obsessed with history and face can't lead its people, much less the world.

CASTRO:

A lot of hate on some of these posts. I would like to clearify things from a neutral point of view;

1)99%+ of Westerners do not have any issue with China, period. When you see 5,000 or so protesters from an area of over 250 million within an hours flight, it really is a small number. We are not talking about a million man protest, just a few 100 die hards followed by a few thousand "nothing" better to do people. This is the truth.
2)99%+ of Chinese do not have issues with the west. They just want to work their jobs, improve there lives and work gradually towards freedom and balanced sustainable prosperity.
3)Not all Western countries have an issue dealing with China. My country Portugal has been trading for over 500 years with China and to this day have a very good relationship. China gets involved with the Organization of Portuguese Speaking Nations quite well. They are working at getting observer status through the relationship with Macau. Good relations with Brazil, Portugal, Angola, etc... Must be a cultural thing, as we do not expect everyone we meet to agree with out culture and feel very much the same as China, you mess with my culture, expect my foot in your "ass" We should be making constructive discussion and action with China and give them time. Portugal was under a dictator for 50 years. That sucked, but we did not kill our own for freedom, we took our time and made what changes were possible and eventually without violence, we went back to democracy.
4)China is not going to rule the world, not through military or economics. Their army is much smaller than in the past, most of the people their do not have military experience or training and who are they going to invade. India will be a battle of atrition, Vietnam and Thailand will fight to the last, Japan has an impressive army, it just never leaves, Sout Korean army is huge when you add reservests as the country has manditory service and Russia, will just beat them senseless. China can not get anywhere else fast enough, unless they discouver teleportation. Do not forget that in WWII, almost 30 million soldiers died in Europe. NATO could field a huge army, with advanced tech if the need arised. Over three million Portugesse men have army training, out of a population of 10 million. Economically, not a chance. Everyone said the same about Japan. China is just catching up, that is why the 10 percent growth. South Korea, Tiwan, Japan, etc... all grew at 10 percent rates for over 30 years, eventually it becomes more difficult to grow. If China had more resources, like 5 times more, then maybe. China has 20% of the worlds population, but only 4% of the worlds gross resources. Canada, Russia, Brazil, US all have far more resources than China in their borders, and a hell of a lot less people. Plus China, like most other countries will be spending a lot of resources on the elderly, pensions, health, and pollution fighting in 15 years.
5)Remember, God loves us all equally.

Seala:

>> You are correct. After we take care of Iran we then will take care of China. Teach them a lesson in Currency markets and also in Human Rights 101.

With a 9.4 trillion dollar debt already, you think you can teach them a lesson? How?

blowback:

check this article out people. We are being played.

http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=8625

BleF:

I often find it somewhat amusing that Australians are till classified as 'The West'. Well, geographically they ain't, mate. Does that say something about how misplaced these 'Stop oppressing indigenous people' chants are? Where the hell are the 'REAL' Australasians?

Anyway, good on Kevin Rudd for telling China what he thinks. fair game, he did it in Chinese too.

What strikes me about all these mildly venomous comments from 'westerners' is that the reality is that the west and China live in completely different eras.

It is easy to bang on about fairtrade and organic food when you actually have a standard of living which can afford such luxuries. If finding sustenance to prevent you starving is a daily challenge, I really don't think your average Joe would have much time to consider the injustices of Tibet or Darfur. How many people can actually point to Darfur on a map? (I can't, so I don't feel I need to have formulate an opinion on it)

To those in the west who fear China, well you have good reason - China has only just started on the growth curve, and seriously, you ain't seen nothing yet. Bark and protest all you like, but no one is going to stop hungry people from getting their fair share of the world. No one.

Anonymous:

You are correct. After we take care of Iran we then will take care of China. Teach them a lesson in Currency markets and also in Human Rights 101.
------------------------------------------------
This is funny. You are borrowing money from China and Japan now to take care of the Iraqi business. Where do you think you can borrow money from to take care of Iran and China. China????

Objective:

To TTJ:

What do you mean by respecting Chinese people? You don't even admit Tibet is part of China! You are among the most arrogant westerners. You voted your governement to send armies to Iraq to smash their government. Now you think that you have done a great job that you freed the Iraq people when you enjoy the cheap oil from there. You don't care about what is really going on there. Only God will hear their cry and know their anger. Now you want to do the same thing to China.

Nirpinder Singh:

It is good to remember that whatever be the Chinese understanding of friendship they have historically been a difficult nation to deal with. This has been true for social interactions as well as for trade. One can only marvel at the fortitude of Buddhist missionaries of old who were able to take their message to China from India and have it be understood and adopted. Perhaps the way to get along with China and Chinese people is to live there for a long time to learn the language and to become intimate with Chinese people.
With this view all important nations will have to ensure that their representatives in China know the Chinese language well and have preferably lived there for an extended period of time. Perhaps this is the solution to the problem of developing good communication channels with China for the outside world.

Ed:

Many of the comments written here reflect ignorance, prejudice and xenophobia. There is far more freedom of movement and freedom to pursue a livelihood in China than during the Mao led era. There have already been radical social, economic, and cultural changes, for good, as well as bad, in China in just thirty years.

Some people in the West expect China to make further radical changes, especially in its political system, when the United States Congress and President have been unable to enact health care coverage for all persons or substantially reduce very high budget deficits. China will continue to change, but change will be primarily from within. The alien Qing dynasty lasted from 1644 to 1911 CE. The Communist led government has lasted only since 1949 CE. Fifty-nine years is a brief era within even a single major dynasty, let alone the entire written history of China.

Calls for China to become a "true democracy" are well-intentioned, but historically naive because many people mistakenly think the United States is and was created as a democracy. These people seem to know as little about United States' as China's history. The Founding Fathers in this country explicitly distrusted democracy and "mob rule." There was little democracy in the United States national government when the Constitution was adopted. For several decades there were property qualifications for the suffrage. Congressional caucuses chose presidential nominees. State legislatures in many states determined the allocation of electoral votes, not popular majority results. State legislatures, not popular elections, decided who would represent states in the Senate.

Democratic changes, which made this country, more democratic, but not a "true democracy" took nearly two hundred years. Yet some people expect China and other nations to become "democracies" as the United States or Great Britain, overnight. This is certainly a highly condescending attitude.

When one looks at Chinese history from a long-term perspective, there has often been expansion, but along land adjacent to its territory as a nation. Compare this to the history of Great Britain, France, Germany, Japan, Italy, the United States, Russia and certain other nations that conquered other nations, far from its territorial borders, to acquire an overseas empire. China and India are two nations that did not do this. Yet some in the West hypocritically demand China and India be peaceful rising powers.

I think both nations will, unlike most major European nations, Japan and the United States, be peaceful rising powers, because this is consistent with their history. In addition, they seek greater economic prosperity for their people, not regional political hegemony.

There is a lot of anti-China prejudice in the United States, just as there was similar anti-Japan prejudice during the 1980's, for basically the same reasons. High trade deficits and loss of American jobs led to widespread anti-Japanese opinions within the United States.
Most people do not realize Japan finances the budget deficits of this country more than China.

Fortunately most recent presidents, from Nixon to Bush, partly because of the influence of certain advisers, have pursued relatively moderate policies toward China, generally avoiding confrontation and seeking greater mutual cooperation.

TerryKing:

wangfromsd said:
---First come to china..and know Chinese people not only in the metropolis but also far distant little villages.---

wangfromsd, you are one of the few thoughtful voices here. Please continue to inform us...

Stop nagging me!:

Americans and their leader don't like to be told by another country that their foreign or domestic policy sucks. "Freedom fries", anyone?
Likewise, Chinese people thank the world for their concern. Chinese people appreciate if the foreigners restrict their protests to their own country's problems, which surely there must be many. Chinese people will lecture themselves and will wash their own dirty laundry. Thank you!

Anonymous:

Violent protests in Tibet and a subsequent crackdown by the Beijing government have created a worldwide outpouring of sympathy for the Tibetan cause.

In India, where the Dalai Lama lives in exile, politicians, celebrities, and common citizens have sided with the underdogs. But those who support the idea of an independent Tibet are misguided, and Indians who do so are hypocritical to boot.

Here's why. The land claimed by Tibet's government-in-exile is far larger than the territory ruled by the Dalai Lama before he fled to India in 1959. Greater Tibet covers an incredible 25 percent of the entire People's Republic of China (PRC).

There is no legal or historical basis whatsoever for this claim. Moreover, were such a nation to split from China, it would feel incomplete without Arunachal Pradesh, often referred to as Southern Tibet.

The case for an independent state composed of the smaller Tibet Autonomous Region is also questionable. For centuries, theocratic rulers of the Roof of the World accepted the land was part of the Chinese empire. This elite declared independence during a period of instability in the early twentieth century, but China never accepted it.
Excerpt from Times of India:

"It's true the fifties and sixties were dreadful for the region, but we must bear in mind that the Great Leap Forward and Cultural Revolution were disastrous for China as a whole.

Recent years have witnessed an increased tolerance of traditional culture by Chinese authorities, alongside a rise in Tibetans' standard of living. Thus far, the liberalisation has stopped short of negotiations with the Dalai Lama, which is unfortunate, for he is one of the great moral figures of our time and has signalled he would accept genuine autonomy instead of the complete independence he had previously sought..."

anti-cnn:

In FRENCE, the supporters of Tibet could not know where was the Tibet.could they see what the tibet look like really?
PLEASE GO to china and look by yourself eyes.if you want not to do like that ,don`t copy and repeat the lie.

westerner in fact is getting worried and jealous of the development of china, so they are happy to find something that happens in China that they can pick on.

ttj:

That's great. Australia is lucky to have a leader like Rudd. I admire Chinese history, Chinese traditional culture, and the Chinese people. The current Chinese political system, however, is abhorrent. The comments from that (presumably) Chinese citizen here regarding Westerners supposed ignorance about Tibet are entirely condescending...which is a typical attitude among the Chinese communists. They seem to really believe that they are purer or superior to Westerners, even though they have outright copied most of their recent advances from Western practices. Yes, INDEED China, FREE TIBET and adopt a true democracy in your own country! Maybe then the rest of the world will truly come to respect you and welcome you into international society (and who knows, will maybe allow for the re-integration of Taiwan). Until then, China will be considered a backward nation.

a-world-without-china-is-a-safer-world:

Whoever still has an illusion in mind as: "to do business with China is a good way" is only a betrayal individual to his/her nation!

Whoever has opened doors to let China and its chinese spies entering his/her nationis absolutely a betrayal individual to his/her nation and citizens and industries and economy and safety of his/her nation and citizens!!!!!

CHINA IS THE MOST TREACHEROUS AND HARMFUL SOURCE OF DEVASTATION AND DESTRUCTION IN ALL DOMAINS OF ANY NATION IN THIS PLANET EARTH!!!!!

The world has to wake up to avoid being harmed by china and to wisely stay away from the evil China!!!!!

CHINA EVEN DEVASTATES ITS OWN PEOPLE THAT IS THE SIMPLE LESSON TO THE WORLD AS THIS TERRIBLE CHINA NEVER EVER BECOMES A VALUABLE NATION TO ANY NATION TO DO BUSINESS WITH! AND THIS IS A SIMPLE COMMONSENSE TO REALIZE!!!!

anti-cnn:

In FRENCE, the supporters of Tibet could not know where was the Tibet.could they see what the tibet look like really?
PLEASE GO to china and look by yourself eyes.if you want not to do like that ,don`t copy and repeat the lie.

westerner in fact is getting worried and jealous of the development of china, so they are happy to find something that happens in China that they can pick on.

Evan:

I think the Rudd speech was brilliant.

His approach sure beats the hell out of the threats and blather on the one hand, and private representations on that other, that have formed the ineffective twin poles of Western dealings with China to date so far as it's Human Rights record is concened.

He told 'em like it is, publicly and without poking them-one in the eye.

It's called Statesmanship, a skill not much-used throughout the years of Bush The Younger's sorry reign.

Dylan:

Unlike some posters have mistakenly written, the correct characters for "zhengyou" are "诤友" (a friend who you can admonish) not "真友" (a true friend), Rudd is not speaking with an accent that makes him add "g" sounds to everything...

wangfromsd:

I often post against corruption, puppet, malicious manipulate and other deeds and incident inside china. And lots of changes should have taken place in China. And “Rome isn’t built in a day”. And those changes can’t happen within a little time. All we know, whether it fast or slow, the conditions are getting better and better inside china.
Here even the slogan is only to criticize the government not people. But there is so more prejudice, so more anti-Chinese sentiment, so many malicious intentions to split Chinese unity. Welcome the Olympic not only the government but also people. And we know the Olympic game will benefit most of Chinese people.

I appreciate the following post, though a little prejudice..
________-__________-___________
It is quite absurd that whenever a subject about China was brought up it always focus on communism, human rights, etc. People fail to recognize that every country can take its own route to modernity. The Europeans took the route of colonialism and slave trade. The American took the route of slaughtering of the native Indians. China took a different route which is much more peaceful and non-destructive to other nations.
The current generation of European and American has conveniently forgot that as beneficiaries of their ancestor's crimes and human rights abuses, they also rightfully inherit the guilt of their ancestor's crimes until they fully repaid the damages to the people and nations still suffering from lasting effects of those crimes

pingping:


The prime minister's Chinese has a strong accent. A real friend in Chinese should be pronounced "zhenyou." A real friend does not have to publicize his/her criticism; he did it to build his stature as a politician. Chinese should see him through.

Anonymous:

John Doe,

You are correct. After we take care of Iran we then will take care of China. Teach them a lesson in Currency markets and also in Human Rights 101.

Dalai Clique:

Too many Chinese spies trolling this post

VA22207:

What if Chinese tell Mr. Rudd this?
"Thank you very much for your great suggestions.
Australia is a great example of that we should learn a lot from. We want to learn from what you DID, not just what you say."

world-in-danger:

The world must realize that:

CHINA IS MUCH MORE DANGEROUS THAN AL-QAEDA AND BIN LADEN AND ALL WORLD TERRORISTS COMBINED!
WHY?

Due to China is a danger that can do harms in all aspects from military, politics, commercial, resources-swapping, harmful land-swapping deeds, spying and stealing all world technologies! and is a worst liar of all worst liars of the world!

The world has experienced the devastating effects done by China since the day one to do business with this evil nation! and cheated by the world worst strategies makers that created the beliefs that doing business and cooperating with China is the correct way! and this is the biggest mistake that USA and the rest of the world have done to the mankind!!!!!
Who open doors to invite China to thier nations are the betrayers to their citizens in all aspects!!!!!!

John Doe:

After the next US election a weakened country will find a leader again. When the US regains cohesion and a purpose China will see a real push from the US. This push will cause a change in speed of currency appreciation and potentially the political regimes in China's western areas.

Anonymous:

Rudd may not want to be China's waterboy, but doesn't seem to have a problem with being one for Bush and the USA. With Australian support, including allowing covert USA operations in Australia, Rudd provides valuable information and intelligence to Washington.
He also has pestered other countries frequently to contribute to NATO and Afghanistan. For Rudd, Australia's status is as a US territory, sort of like Puerto Rico. As for China, Bush will tell you what to do. Better give him another salute!

dena:

JRLR, i inform you that i have lived in china for over 30 years and have in fact helped to restore some of the fammed so called Chinese Culturals...that the Culture of the Communists destroyed during the called Culture Revolution! so i dont need the www.sites...i have seen it all and more than you can think.

When i refer to: where is the so called CHINESE CULTURE is precisally that. For if a people has a culture as old as china have yet havent learned a thing about 'people' and self-respect...and respect for others, i have all the rights to ask: where is this so called Chinese Culture?

Francesco Sinibaldi:

A witty child in the dreamland.

There's a witty
child where
a beautiful dreamland
presents the profile
of a delicate hedge,
over a feeling, in
the care of a
blackbird; and there's
also that sunset,
the timid contour
of a glittering flame.

Francesco Sinibaldi

Adriana from Florida:

I'm in the 9th grade, and it's my first year taking Chinese. We've learned the word "pengyou" and the first part--"peng"--is essentially "two moons in the sky together" as my teacher put it.

Personally, I believe there is nothing to gain from not being friends with China. I have a hard enough time taking criticism from my friends, but when I get it from enemies, it has the opposite effect. From some of the comments I've seen here, becoming friends with China will probably have to wait for my generation.

Anonymous:

Posted on April 11, 2008 22:23

Jiang Wang :
>>Lastly, RedChina! dont mess with USA. Democratic minds are always sharper than Communist egoes.

No. Most americans are far too busy worrying about their guns and what other people do in their bedrooms and Britney to even notice Red China

>>Dump the US dollar. Who cares? Try to find anyone who will and can buy all the junk you make.

You would care if they did!! New Zealand has just signed a free trade agreement with China There are lots of people who will buy their stuff. Just as they are a HUGE market for our produce. The US will never give us one because of our nuclear-free policy.
China will own the world in 20 years Most americans wont even notice it is happening.

Buy "LOAF" Locally grown, Organic, Animal friendly,Fairly Traded


African Bombata >>China wants to dominate the world and want to be more than US militarily and economically. I have seen that most of the Chinese Immigrants have this tendency to think Blacks and colored people in general are inferior. They even think Japan and Vietnam are somehow inferior.

So do lots of white americans! Read some of the right wing sites on the Net

All that China does is copy from west and replicate it over and over again. They think they have higher IQ than Africans,Japanese,Koreans,Vietnam,India,Arabs and so on.

So do lots white americans! Read some of the right wing sites on the Net

Shawn:

Fondly do we hope--fervently do we pray--that this mighty scourge of the second Opium War may speedily pass away. Yet, if God wills that it continue until all the humiliation imposed by the White European's four hundred years of unqualified domination shall be dispatched, and until every drop of blood drawn by the lash shall be paid by another drawn with the sword, as was said three thousand years ago, so still it must be said, "The judgments of the Lord are true and righteous altogether."


a-world-without-china-is-a-safer-world:


CHINA = A NIGHTMARE OF ALL WORLD CITIZENS!

CHINA = A NIGHTMARE OF 1.3 BILLION CHINESE SLAVES AS WELL!

CHINA = LAND OF CHINESE HUMAN BODY-PARTS HARVESTING FOR MAKING MONEY!

CHINA = A PLACE TO BRING DESTRUCTION AND DEVASTATIONS TO THE WORLD IN ALL ASPECTS!!!

TIBET, INNER MOGOLIA, SUDAN, CAMBODIA, VIETNAM, INDIA, JAPAN, BURMA, LAOS, THAILAND, PHILIPPINES,
UIGHURS NATIONS ARE VICTIMS OF CHINA IS A LESSON TO ALL AFRICAN NATIONS, CENTRAL AMERICA AND SOUTH AMERICA, AND ASIAN NATIONS!!!!

China is the worst place on earth to visit and to see barbarous activities on its own citizens in the daylight!!!!!

Henry:

To
African Bombata

We give ourselves an English name just because we want you to remember our name easier,not because we hate ourselves......I can't believe you would say that. How old are you????

wangfromsd:

Have anyone ever ponder over extremist? Find those words in good manners those telling us how to deal with other people in culture. And in my conclusion, Chinese is one peaceful nation. Aggressive wouldn't be one good manner in Chinese but good in English. So a little conservative image for good manners in Chinese culture. Personally, once are there any conflicts between people. First try to understand each other, throw away those cold words with angry, express our idea with more tolerance and encourage. Supposed, Chinese people living in the same condition just like Americans, and then human rights would the first and the most care. One family of millionaire’ care don’t exact as those poor who striving for food.
As to Tibet, Taiwan, HK, Macau and others those were the wound of Chinese unity. And there is no quarrel before opium war. So if we express our idea, we should learn why the quarrels happened. And there are communist, capitalist, matriarchy and others can’t be described in English in modern china society. And they exist inside china the same time. There is much difference inside china than those in America.
And we lived in the same village of the earth and under the same sky. One nuclear war would destroy the whole human life. We weren’t interacted as close as these days. And the world couldn’t survive after one nuclear war.

Henry:

To an Anonymous who lived in China for 30 years.

"Gladly inform you that i lived in china for 30 years...just abt the end of culture revolution"

QUESTION 1: The situation from culture revolution till now is getting better or worse?

"if China does not play fair in this modern world, China has no chance to join the world of great nations. No chance! "

QUESTION 2: who to define "fair"?? US UK or YOU;western country or eastern country?? developed country or undeveloped country???

my answer to my question 1 is : much much better
my answer to my question 2 is : money and power

what about yours ??

world-in-danger:


CHINA = WORLD'S DANGER

CHINA =LAND OF BARBAROUS CULTURE

CHINA= LAND OF VAMPIRES

The world should never come to China! it is a worst place on earth!

Henry:

To an Anonymous who lived in China for 30 years.

" if China does not play fair in this modern world, China has no chance to join the world of great nations"

Question 1: who to define "fair" ?? US UK or YOU.

"Gladly inform you that i lived in china for 30 years...just abt the end of culture revolution"

Question 2: The situation from culture revolution till now is getting better or worse??


BrownvBOE:

I am a Chinese. My professor is an African-American. And he is very talented. I do not think Chinese are more clever than anybody. We are just human. But I do I think US need to overhaul its education system so that more talented African-Americans can have more equal opportunities to compete within the society.

RE:
China wants to dominate the world and want to be more than US militarily and economically. I have seen that most of the Chinese Immigrants have this tendency to think Blacks and colored people in general are inferior. They even think Japan and Vietnam are somehow inferior.

All that China does is copy from west and replicate it over and over again. They think they have higher IQ than Africans,Japanese,Koreans,Vietnam,India,Arabs and so on. They want to be accepted so badly here in West that first thing they do is change their chinese name to something like David Yang,Kevin Zhou,Colin Wu and so on.

The underlying psychology is, they hate themselves and deep inside they think they have a littlemans syndrome which makes them aggressive.

China steals so much from supporting despots in africa and indirectly responsible for killing africans.

The golden days of Chinese economy is over in my view.

CheckMate:

China should immediately worry about what is the post olympic political and economical situation going to be.

1. How is it going to handle the dropping dollar situation?

2. How to handle Tibets new found voice among global community.

3. How to keep its GDP going eventhough I think its not sustainable.

4. With Japan and India on its throat economically and militarily and with a rude oppressive image among world, can they sustain their promise of growth and prosperity to their billions?

5. What happens if dollar devalues another 40%?
and West and corporate west looks to new manufacturing bases like latin america,south east asia and africa?

I think after olympics, chinese will become bitter and start sanctions against trade with french and others who boycotted olympics thus sealing their own fate.


African Bombata:

China wants to dominate the world and want to be more than US militarily and economically. I have seen that most of the Chinese Immigrants have this tendency to think Blacks and colored people in general are inferior. They even think Japan and Vietnam are somehow inferior.

All that China does is copy from west and replicate it over and over again. They think they have higher IQ than Africans,Japanese,Koreans,Vietnam,India,Arabs and so on. They want to be accepted so badly here in West that first thing they do is change their chinese name to something like David Yang,Kevin Zhou,Colin Wu and so on.

The underlying psychology is, they hate themselves and deep inside they think they have a littlemans syndrome which makes them aggressive.

China steals so much from supporting despots in africa and indirectly responsible for killing africans.

The golden days of Chinese economy is over in my view.

JRLR:

Dena writes: "where is this so much talked about CHINESE CULTURE...where is it?" --

Dena, it is first in China, then all over the world. Unbeknownst to you, we are constantly surrounded by Chinese culture.

China had a rich culture before this country even existed. For your information, since earliest times, China has played a central role in both the world's early development and throughout human history (just have a look at world-renowned American mythologist Joseph Campbell's "Historical Atlas of World Mythology", with accompanying maps, pictures, etc.)

Obviously, you have access to the Internet. You need not visit, or live in China. All you have to do is Google search "China", then "China culture". On the Internet, you can even have access to maps of China, pictures of many, many Chinese cities (just have a look at pictures of contemporary Shanghai!... then go see pictures of the old, very old terracota army of Xi'an -- see everything the Chinese had already invented, at the time!)... On the Internet, you can also read, for instance, in English, what eminent writers such as Lu Xun (Rudd refers to him, in his speech) have written, e.g. "Ah Q"... You can even learn Mandarin on the Internet: there are Chinese sites where Chinese speakers will teach you.

You can also go to your local library and ask for help from your friendly librarian.

In a nutshell, just get moving and come back tell us all about Chinese culture. Believe me, it's fun.

Need more help? Just ask on this blog.

Your friendly online librarian.

Anonymous:

To: China coming to the world, Friendly.:


To Dena.

You really now nothing about China. Suggestion to you is that you drop your self-centered and narrowminded mindset and learn to get used to live with China, no matter you like it or not. Cause if you your don't, you[ll continue to live in bitterness in the rest of your life. If that;s the case, I'll feel deeply sad and sorry fo you:)

Gladly inform you that i lived in china for 30 years...just abt the end of culture revolution,so i do know china somehow...and it is not self-centered nor narrowmind set, that makes me say what i say abt china. It is what it is and will always be that way. And there is no bitterness!certainly not from my side.Very much the contrary. In fact if anyo bitterness it is on the China's side, not the West side. For China have losted many generations...and if they dont play-fair in the world...but specially fair with it's own people...play with confidence not lack of it!
Assure you many more generations will be losted!and culture revolution will pale in comparison! Why? because a people - any people,any race as matter of fact- who plays Superior but which in truth feels Inferior can never accept Criticism! and accepting criticism is the only way to grow and to survive! It is no use you make a billion babies...if you can not deal with criticism! you have no chance!...one single Virus can erase an entire civilization/population! See what happened to Mayan,Inca cultures/civilizations... and many others thereon.
And look at China, even during breakthroughs of fatal deadly Virus, such as SARS, Bird Flu and so...they had to hide it!

So, I think in the end you:
China coming to the world, Friendly.:

You, should think twice before you say I should learn to live with China.
In fact, I have, indeed, long time ago, done that!

And i tell you, you should, as a chinese, speak out, criticize your chinese government if you want to see China bright and happy in the long run.
In this short term...everybody seem a bit friendly of China...but if China does not play fair in this modern world, China has no chance to join the world of great nations. No chance!

Money and Power was never Powerful and will never be. I mean, it is temporary power, yes, but surely not in the long term. And, if China or you think that it is, then China/you deserve to have the Olympic disrupted! even canceled.

As the saying goes: If they want to kill themselves let them do it! one less trouble for the world. But dont kill others, those who treasure, respect life and want to live.

awoman:

Wuheiyou

My best Chinese friends were two simple humble workers of the far province of Sichuan. We shared food and talks for long periods of my staying. They were so dear to me that I helped them to find a job. One was a speedy cook that made jokes of everything and everybody around him, he had become the mascotte of my Tibetan friends. The other was a wonderful chinese teacher who (after 12 years at school) had became a builder when the government denied him the pension.
We lived peacefully like a family, but one day we received the inaspected visit of a patrolling police squad and everything went upside down.

The story is too long and sad ...but the moral is, Chinese people (working class at least) are totally innocent of all is happening in the red rooms of power (that have long hands in the provinces)
Reading Mr. Ruud speech here, my hope is still big but I bet CCP will master the life of poor people for long long time, I will not be able to see the change.
I can calmly say that I hate CCP with all my heart.

wuheyu:

hello every one, i m a chinese who have been lived in china for 20 years. maybe most of you said I have been brainwashed.that's fine, who can believe you are not be brainwashed by your govt or media? anyway,i just want to say that we all chinese people knew "human right " is a good thing, we are not that stupid to believe all what the govt said. but can i ask you one question?what is the most basic human right??freedom of speech or media???nooooooo..it's the Right to subsistence!!!!!there are 900 million farmers struggle for their lives from morning to night every day. the average GDP is only 1000 USD per year,can you exist with only 1000 USD??? doubtful!!but it's the fact in china.and we all agree that currentlly our job number 1 is to solve the problem of starvation. if too many people suffer from starvation, we don't need you to overthrow the communist,we will do it for you. but now our lives is getting better and better,we can see holp in the future though still many people are very poor.we need time to improve our lives and then talk about "human right". we really don't care "freedom of speech" that much if we still struggle for our survival. on the other hand, such a huge country with 1.3 billion people is very very difficult to dominion, we have lots of problems ourselves,if Tibet want independence, taiwan want independence, and other provinves will follow,another civil war will begin, that will be a disaster of China, maybe that'a what some western countries want to see, but we don't....that's what i think about our situation, and i can tell you very very confidently,at least 1.2 billion people have the same thought with me. so before you censure China's human right record, can you hear carefully what our chinese people's voice???

A kind sugest to Dena:


After reading your post, I feel you really don;t know nothing about China, my suggestion is that if you don't have the resource to make a trip to China, you need at least read some book before making such comments. Your text exhibits morbid psychotic bias toward China, you need to drop your self-centered and narrowminded mindset and learn to get used to live with China, otherwise you[ll continue to live in bitterness as China is coming anyway. that case I'd feel deeply sad and sorry for you...

Li Ang:

Good post, thanks. Tolerance is, as ever, in short supply; Rudd's show of respect ought to earn him the same.

China coming to the world, Friendly.:

To Dena.

You really now nothing about China. Suggestion to you is that you drop your self-centered and narrowminded mindset and learn to get used to live with China, no matter you like it or not. Cause if you your don't, you[ll continue to live in bitterness in the rest of your life. If that;s the case, I'll feel deeply sad and sorry fo you:)

cctv3456..:

Dena

I agree with you about the compulsory way of copying everything, especially seen in the young generations styles and TV programs -have you ever seen a modern chinese soap- ?
The actors trying to imitate even the emotions, and what comes out are grimasses because it's just not their's.

Dena-stupid:

dena:

CHINA copy everything! ...griffes, brand names...political systems, religion-ways,,,Buddhism was born in India, not China. They copy everything! they do not have a mind of their own...and this make them feel vulnerable and inferior to others...specially in regard to the white race (chinese do not like or respect black-race, hindu-race and they lookdown on muslims and mideast/arabs...they call arabs: dirty-people!)

Anyway...where is this so much talked about CHINESE CULTURE...where is it?
----------------------------------------------

You are just the quintessential joke I have ever seen. Where is Chinese culture? In your dirty dark corner,how can undereducated yet self-righteous people like you know anything about China and its culture? Do not try in vain to slap Chinese as somebody "looking down upon" others,you are not up to pit Chinese against others and your crappy gimmick here speaks for itself.

dena:

CHINA copy everything! ...griffes, brand names...political systems, religion-ways,,,Buddhism was born in India, not China. They copy everything! they do not have a mind of their own...and this make them feel vulnerable and inferior to others...specially in regard to the white race (chinese do not like or respect black-race, hindu-race and they lookdown on muslims and mideast/arabs...they call arabs: dirty-people!)

Anyway...where is this so much talked about CHINESE CULTURE...where is it?

So, they feel inferior and precise because of that they must play both : SUPERIOR and SUBTLE,-hiding,secretly,and so on... bse if they truly let their true self come out they will need to go back 5000 years ago to find some solace of their-selves. So, this lack of confidence in themselves make them without cofidence in themselves...this why they COPY everything! and need EVERYTHING BIG...enourmous! because everything they have is SMALL! they want big Status and Statures!

This why...they had so much hope in this Olympic-games! to show off!...again with something that is not their own culture, but with something that is the essence of western culture and civilization.
And is there anything worng with that?
I dont think so. I think the WEST should feel proud and pride that there is 1.3 billion chinese people wanting to do something so western and so democracty in their biggest,last communist country in this world...one which,suddenly, panicked and let the FLASH LIGHT burn the OLYMPIC TORCHE!

I feel both for China. Sad and Sorry!

Maybe China should see Dalai Lama and save the World and Themselves at least this one time! I am sure people everywhere will applaude.

Bengt Larsson:

It's interesting that the self-interest version of Chinese "friendship" that is explained here is exactly the one the US government pursues with other states.

It's pathetic that it's now time to hate China; people in America should seek something else to join about than finding someone to hate. Let's remember that the US is the greater ill-doer recently with the Iraq war; also more of a dictatorship supporter with Egypt and Saudi Arabia.

Don't pursue happiness by bashing others but pursue truth, first. And that should be the whole truth. A selective truth is as good as a lie.

From a 糊涂的老外:

In the past few weeks I have seen blog commentaries, youtube videos, and e-mails filled with a seething sort of hatred from both "sides" that is beyond even the internet's standards of cruel and petty ad hominem sniping. Take a look at the comments on this posting for example: how many of the comments actually addressed the text or analysis of the Australian PM's speech? How many people paid attention to the actual content of his interaction with students at Beijing Daxue? The answer is disturbingly few, as it seems that a significant portion of the world's population has sunk to knee-jerk reactions that feed off of each others' fears. Some (assumedly) Chinese commenters simply shouted that this was just another example of Westerners infringing on their rights to do as they please, whatever that may mean, instead of considering that Rudd, a true diplomat in the finest sense, is calling for equal, responsible friendship. A group I will simply call "Westerners" (to which I belong) on the other hand, cry out in tones much resembling the "Yellow Peril" of the early 20th century, which I will just say brings out the worst in us and is absolutely unproductive.

I have spent a fair amount of time in China given my age, and the warmth, and desire to engage I have found there has always made me feel welcome, and my family has always met exchange students staying with us with open arms. There is more connecting us than divides us, what Zhou Enlai called qiutongcongyi in foreign relations, and that should always be the basis for the friendship between nations. However, as Rudd pointed out so well, it is vital that this friendship not merely be one of allowance and economic benefit, but one that encourages active engagement and *constructive* criticism when it is due, not only in private, but in the public sphere, in a friendly and cordial debate of ideas. China is a rising country that has extreme potential to effect great changes in the world, but it also has plenty of problems that could cripple its assent. Similarly, the western world has its fair share of shortcomings as well. The more we hide these issues from sight, the more they become our national "dirty laundry," the more electrically charged they become, leading to the outbursts of the past few weeks. Let us engage, not squabble meaninglessly. Let us work for the betterment of all the world's people, and not pretend that these issues don't exist.

taichilo:

No matter how open the Red China, Pangyou or Zhengyou, in essence, Red China still uses the Communist dogma to treat its own people and the foreign country for at least 50yr. You do not need to ask any scholar, Comminism is no hope for future Rea China. However, the communist elites, most of them are lacking of conscience, courage, and confidence to give up Comminism, they know they have to keep Karl Marx as their morphine!
Of-course, the C.Elites need to put Party interest over ahead its people. That is why human right issue more sensitive to them.

You do not expect can be a Zhengyou to a Communist China! Never! They do not need, because they do not know even this idea is coming form Confucius.

Jati Hoon:

World can use new young open minded leaders like, Kevin Rudd, the prime minister of Australia.Here is one leader who made efforts to learn other country language, politics and culture and went on to express it in China. You agree or not with his point of veiw, one thing is certain, he is not a war monger or China hater.He minces no words, rather make it simple for average person to understand, "LIKE IT OR NOT, WE ALL ARE INTERLINKED ON THIS PLANET, EITHER WE SWIM OR DIE TOGATHER."This is a "NUCLEAR WORLD," of the modern time, which he articulated very diplomatically to his host country in China, without offending them. President Regan, use to say,"Trust but verify." which apply to all countries, democratic or otherwise.

Paul in NY:

A few comments:
- chinese argue Tibet had backward and Feudalistic history. And what was China's? Was the HuangDi an enlightened democrat? there was precious little difference.
- Westerners did not cause China's weakness in the 19th Century. That was caused by the decaying Qing Dynasty itself.
- The world view of the Tsixi Huanghou, the Empress Dowager, was, at the time, similar to our present-day view of Sadam Hussien: backward, violent, corrupt, holding back the Chinese people, and ultimately heading for downfall.

I, for one, support the Olympics in China and believe Tibet is inseperable from China. On the other hand though, the Communist Gov't has inculcated one line of thought, and any deviation or criticism is absolutely not allowed or accepted. This and the extreme nationalism we see is also China's own problem.

JRLR:

No doubt, this sounds better than the usual “screaming, with its hint of "Yellow Peril," racism and fear”!

“When Wei (Zhen) died… emperor (Taizong) bitterly mourned his death. He offered this tribute: "One looks at a reflection in a mirror to see if one's dress is in order. One studies history to understand the changing fortunes of time. And one seeks wise counsel to avoid mistakes. Wei Zheng has died, and I have lost my mirror. To have a zhengyou is to be fortunate indeed."”

Rudd: "... a true friendship... It is the kind of friendship that I know is treasured in China’s political tradition. It is the kind of friendship that I also offer China today."

Neat!

Upon closer examination though, one can only assume that among friends, this works both ways: they being each other’s mirror….

Now what if the unthinkable were to happen?

What if, in a “principled dialogue”, the Chinese friendly mirror were to reflect (in both Mandarin and English, for good measure) that neither Zoellick nor Rudd “occupy the high moral ground (they) imagine” (Patrick), as “responsible global stakeholders”, in this “harmonious, global and regional rules-based order” of ours?

Are we to assume that after the hysterical freedom fries fit the whole world has been witnessing with amusement, following the reflections that came to us from mirrors such as Germany and France, prior to our very own Iraq military adventure, are we to assume we are in for a vociferous freedom noodles and raviolis episode, this time?

You get the patent on the in your face mirror game. I get the noodles and the raviolis. Deal?

Alan Browne:

Excellent piece! Wonderful to see a very brief and succinct article that gets to the core of the rest of the world's lack-of-relationship with China.

The Chinese government is on a very long course to an end and they have no intention of being fair or even handed about it. Their racist attitude towards "other" Chinese is nothing compared to their contempt for the rest of us.

More the reason to Boycott the Beijing 2008 Olympics. The Chinese understand one thing all too clearly: face.

Shovan Das:

THe Australian Prime Minister was roundly criticized by the press for giving a " salute " to President Bush - a reference to show he ( The PM ) is a subordinate. Is'nt his speech, his intimate knowledge of the Chinese language and his brilliant speech an indication the this media has got it all wrong ? When will this short-sighted, visionless, hollow, shallow and perhaps foolish media get it ? They should try to promote objectivity not deride it.

Hondo Hotel:

Hi John, Fascinating to read about Rudd's ability to speak Chinese. In any event, both Australia and China must be more tranquil after dark than Sarajevo. Best, Steve D

Tom :

i suggest you shut your mouth up. You stupid Aussie stole Australia from the aboriginals centuries ago. Now you aussies are lving a lazy life on mining.

Give back Australia to the aboriginals, you stupid aussie!

TEE S:

As I noted last week with Pomfret's blog. China cannot be trusted. I am amused by the response, that essentially the fact that the US has a double standard justifies China doing what it wants. So our double standard means there is no standard?

Let's not lose sight of the fact that China is a country that cannot look at itself in the mirror. THats why it has jailed journalists and lawyers it doesn't like. And has armies of blogsters whose job is to attack statements like this as somehow racist.

But it was the Han that forcible sterilized hundreds of Tibetan women. As I said last week, if you treat "foreigners" like animals (thats what you do to animals), you cannot be trusted.


COnsider the malignant corruption that ends up killing people because someone could make a few pennies more by cheating on what they manufacture in the drug pipeline. Same with lead paint on children's toys. The culture has promoted the notion that a few pennies more is worth destroying the life of a foreign child.

Cannot trust China. Let's pay triple for real products made in the USA that work better, last longer.

MAK Tsun John:

As a Hong Kong citizen and of Chinese origin with a Wsetern colonialist education, I appreciate that human being of the world are the same, Chinese always believe in tolerance, if you can tolerate others, you will find others able to appreciate your, China is advancing because she is opening up towards the world, she is getting more accepted by the world, what I found now is that westerner are less and less tolerant, and in fact is getting worried and jealous of the development of china, so they are happy to find something that happens in China that they can pick on, I believe thw west has to give some thoughts to why they have become so, is it because life is getting more difficult for them, does that mean that due to their complaciency that in recent years their moral and ethical standard has deteriorated, their education method has failed, or is it because there are now too many foreigners in each of their own country that has cultivated a sense of hatred in them for foreigners?

GENG:

Above all, Kevin Rudd came and showed his friendship. We are mot playing word puzzle. The fact is, the West has been particular about China. It just becomes much more fierce recently. I really wonder why western media don't call for truth or justice when things are concerned with China: all with one accord, so ridiculous.

ps. There is no "Beijing University" but "Peking University". Do your homework.

Karl:

As English spreads around the world as the dominant language, there will be less lost in translation.

tiwaridwijendra:

China can never be a good friend. All the nations are ignoring the plight of Tibetans. India was stabbed in back in 1962. There is no freedom of expression, movement or earn livelyhood. So, if Austrailian people rally want to live peacefully,they should not trust the chinese government.

Shawn, NJ, USA:

alostfriend:
David wrote:
"All the propgandas by CNN, BBC and ABC for last 50 years have been smashed by their lies. These lies have wakened up all Chinese, especilly overseas chinese. There is no illusion about the west anymore. Work hard and build a strong China so no body can bully you"

and BTW, go back to your homeland OVERSEAS CHINESE (if you can stand it) after years of freedom in our hosting western country, we don't like your company anymnore.
--------------------------------

Go back to Europe! You don't own this place. You and youe like-minded white people are no different from the "oversea Chinese". Let me suggest we all go back to where we or our ancestors came from and leave Native Americans to mind their own business on their own land! Free America! God is the grestest!

wangfromsd:

We are the world..

In the textbook of history, I know many missionaries from America saved Chinese lives in the Nanjing massacre, I know Claire Lee Chennault and those devoted their lives for Chinese, and I know many universities were founded help by Americans. The most famous specialist and technologist in China were educated in USA. And the government of America gives much help for Chinese unity in the histroy.
personally, Chinese people are eager to get help from Americans. If there is enough time, as a pioneer to help poor Chinese people, give kind-hearted suggestions to Chinese people, and so on..First come to china..and know Chinese people not only in the metropolis but also far distant little villages. Show our kindness and afford our help as what we can, and then I believe those stuff that touched us give us most of motive for living in this world..and based on them we would get a bright future..


Joe Bu:

"BTW, go back to your homeland OVERSEAS CHINESE (if you can stand it) after years of freedom in our hosting western country, we don't like your company anymnore."

No no, see we belong here because we have the skills needed to drive the economy. You were born here, kind of like a "legacy" which means you are dead weight that I have to pull.

I'd prefer to send you back to Europe. I know hundreds of millions of Indians and Chinese who could replace you in a flash (cheaper, faster, better).

So pipe down. I earned it. You should thank me for letting you collect the drippings of my skills and expertise, you ingrate!

wangfromsd:

Oh..as to Tibet or Taiwan..just like Cantonese and HK..all are one part of Chinese…
Since the opium war…and Tibet, canton and HK was invaded by Britain..Taiwan and Fujian was invaded by Japan..and Shandong was invaded by German..and northeast was invaded by Russia..and Guangxi was invaded by France….and so on…..and all that leave in the history..
but it still remains lots of quarrels till now.. and the whole Chinese survived as a unity based on most of heroes and Chinese people…and the most valued for Chinese people is independent for the past years..and now it would the progress of living standard…
although great changed have taken place these days..today many people even starve in modern China…as we all know only one can have enough food, and then he can talk about such as manners…so the topic those Americans care about don’t the exact to those for Chinese people…and these days..Chinese living standard getting better one day after one day..so we have the hope to get a bright future…

alostfriend:

David wrote:
"All the propgandas by CNN, BBC and ABC for last 50 years have been smashed by their lies. These lies have wakened up all Chinese, especilly overseas chinese. There is no illusion about the west anymore. Work hard and build a strong China so no body can bully you"

and BTW, go back to your homeland OVERSEAS CHINESE (if you can stand it) after years of freedom in our hosting western country, we don't like your company anymnore.

wangfromsd:

As one whole unity, china is one peaceful nation from my point of view. Many words..just like “zhongyong”…and be kind to unfamiliar from far away….and a little conservative…..
And those words..just like communist…and others just like capitalist..and the conflict between them.. all was derived from the west..and not rooted in the culture of the east..
And I notice lots of misunderstandings from these posts here…

pessimistic:

David wrote
"The only thing they (Chinese leaders) want to do is serve Chinese interests and never feel a bit for the western concerns because THEY KNOW TOO WELL that all the talks of HUMAN RIGHTS TIBET or TAIWAN from the west are hypocretics and NOT FOR CHINESE"

This is the true told by a chinese! I think that Mr Ruud speech was too sophisticated for this kind of people.

wangfromsd:

Australia to China: Let's Not Be Friends

the exact words...
personally,,,,it would be tranlated as...

let's not only be friends (benefit for temporary)..but true friends..

DocChuck:

KUDOS to Kevin Rudd, the new prime minister of Australia, for his intelligence and his insight into the chinese mind . . . the most insidious, convoluted "minds" on the planet.

It these people (the chinese) are NOT dealt with firmly and soon, the specter of a global conflagration between east and West is very real.

Personally, I have been boycotting chinese products for ten years, LONG before it became fashionable. I also boycott Wal-Mart because I feel they are partly responsible for the chinese poisonous, filthy, dangerous, imported crap.

I now do most of my grocery shopping at Trader Joe's . . . because Trader Joe's REFUSES to allow ANY chinese imports to be sold in their stores.

Again, Kudos to Kevin Rudd and Trader Joe's.

wangfromsd:

Australia to China: Let's Not Be Friends...

personally, it miscontrue those words..because of difference of culture...

there is great difference between the east and the west..and results lots of misunderstands..

"pengyou"...refer to one close relation without principle, and based on only benefit..and only for temporary.

"zhengyou"...refer to one close relation with well-heated, and based on sincerity. and for good..

in chinese culture...the ultimate objective between people..is get a few "zhengyou"..
and people would be only "pengyou", and the same time can't be considered as "zengyou"...

and if the two were "zengyou", and they must be friends...and the relaiton based on true friendship..

Notanexpert:

Castro, voltaire,

would you kindly give your expert's comments about a proposal that is going around the blogs in the last month: Boycott the "Made in China" products in every aspect, everywhere.
Enframed in the perspectives you both have described here, would it be a powerful mean of protesting or would it result in a minor act? Please avoid to explain how hard it will be (I know but I still can cope with it, leaving in EU) just suppose it works on a large scale, which results should we await?
BTW I've always got the suspect that my chinese "friends" misunderstood me in many ways, thanks Ruud to have deepened my understanding of chinese people feelings.

hubeiizz:

Chinese have been executing people for over two thousand years. It's the only way you know.
You executed Mao's retarded grandson's wife when he no longer wanted to be married.
You execute those who disagree with you.
You execute anyone who makes too much money.
Dump the US dollar. Who cares? Try to find anyone who will and can buy all the junk you make. We will be fine. Wake up China. Without the west, its technology, and scientific application you would not have the three gourges dam, the train, the airplane, ships to carry your products, and would still be in the dark ages. It's time you got your head out of the sand and stopped trying to take over the world.

Pengyou:

Since Mr Rudd pointed out China's human rights issues forthrightly, then Mr Hu should mention Australia's treatment of its aborigines.

dena:

David, this is a message to David who wrote above here.

My message to you is: Only inferior people has your point of views.

I dont know if you are chinese or not. It doesnt matter. The quest is: only inferior people have you point of views.

I have always said, chinese must stop this "hallucination" of playing SUPERIOR just because they feel inferior.

In human race there is no inferior or superior, there is only better quality genes. Just like a soil...better quality soil and no so good soil-quality.
But with all mankind advances...even bad soils can be improved...with proper technology...and behaviour!

lakang:

The fact that the Olympics are viewed as a major event in Chinese culture is ample evidence of Chinese cultural poverty. In effect, Chinese culture is dead. In China itself (where I live), "Chinese culture" really means "ancient culture" and holds negative connotations for the majority, especially the young.
The Olympics have nothing to do with this Chinese culture. The Chinese had nothing to do with its creation and yet they now see it as their own. Thus the attacks on the torch are to them attacks on China, not the Olympics, Greece, etc.
Almost everything about China's present "rise" is a result of Western culture, even Communism itself. Without Western markets, China would still be its miserable, poverty-stricken mass. All of that said, it must be added that the world should accept China's need and desire to enter the modern (read "Western") world. China should be welcomed with open arms. It has changed enormously for the better over the past few decades (no other country comes close), and there is reason to believe it will continue to improve in terms of "human rights." It could very well become, and in some respects already is, a better friend of such rights than the America of the monster Bush and the Neocons.

David:

Who said that Kevin is the first western leader to openly talk about human right in China? Clinton and Bush have done that long time ago. Chinese leaders know too well that all these human right puffs from these western leaders are for election stun or showcase for the audians in their own countries. Chinese leaders do not care what these western leaders say and never give them any compromise for the Chinese internal affairs. Chinese leaders know that there are no friends from the west but only bussiness. They are more sophisticated than most west leaders. The only thing they want to do is serve Chinese interests and never feel a bit for the western concerns because they know too well that all the talks of human right, tibet or taiwan from the west are hypocretics and not for Chinese. Some westerners think that recent Tibet riot and disruption of touch relay have sent massege to Chinese Govts. I agree. Yes. these thing did send message to China. That message is " the West is against China and Chinese in general". Such message has helped Chinese Givts to unite all Chinese in and out side of China. Chinese, especially overseas Chinese now will not believe western media or politician. What they see from the recent Tibet riot and disruption of the touch relay are the prejudice, rasim and lying of the west. All the propgandas by CNN, BBC and ABC for last 50 years have been smashed by their lies. These lies have wakened up all Chinese, especilly overseas Chinese. There is no illusion about the west anymore. Work hard and build a strong China so no body can bully you.

Anonymous:

Chinese gov is not sopported by all Chinese people

Anonymous:

人民是人民,政府是政府.
"People are people, governments are governments."

Let's keep them separate, shall we?

Aidsmonkey:

Thomas:

"your country has done bad things so ours can too"

But it's true. It shouldn't be, but it is.

To break the cycle, I want to see the West (especially the new world West) live by example and open their borders to all economic migrants. England relieved it's Malthusian pressures in Australia (among other places).

So you lift a finger (and your borders).... And there will be less Han Chinese streaming in Tibet. Otherwise, shut up.

Thomas:

The current situation in Tibet exists because within China, there is currently no sober discourse on why the Tibetans are unhappy. Tibet has become the "yellow-man's burden", and, as such, only the Han viewpoint is tolerated. Anything else would be barbaric. Chinese often say that Tibetan society before the 50s was barbaric. I hear it all the time. Several have said that here.

Oh, you say things were so bad there? Then Tibet should love you by now and should long ago have been part of your harmonious society. And monks should have had no reason to protest days before the violent rioting began... you know... the peaceful protests where monks were manhandled, then shut up into monesteries (not in Lhasa) that actually started this whole thing? The ones that the Chinese media just doesn't mention because it would be inconvenient to actually admit that peaceful protesting by monks had not been tolerated by the police?

Stop criticising foreigners for what you feel is their lack of understanding (many of us are quite familiar with China, have lived in many places in China, have lived in Taiwan, have known Tibetans, so many of us do know a thing or two). Stop relying on tired old tactics such as: your country has done bad things so ours can too. I have news from you. this does not make the bad things that China does any more forgivable. It also doesn't overlook the fact that even pompous Western hypocrites can sometimes speak the truth. A hypocrite is not the same thing as a liar.

Start rationally debating your own problems. Ask yourselves why Tibetans may dislike you. Then make a serious effort to try to solve your own problems. IN SHORT, LISTEN TO RUDD WHEN HE IS CALLING FOR YOU TO EXAMINE YOUR OWN PROBLEMS. Criticising others doesn't bring the problems any closer to being solved.

You say we don't understand? Well, some of us are still waiting for YOU to lift a finger and actually do something constructive that doesn't require forcing others to accept your viewpoint.

Not even the Dalai Lama advocates independence for Tibet. The ball should be in your court to improve things. I won't hold my breath though....

Ed:


I can not tell if my earlier comments did not go through or were censored, which would be quite ironic given how some persons have criticized the lack of freedom in China. I merely commented how President Bill Clinton's policies toward China seem similar to the comments of Mr. Rudd. President Clinton was widely regarded by the Chinese as a "friend of China."

I alluded to hypocrisy by many in the West about the lack of human rights in China, given the recent decline in human rights in this country. The current presidential campaign in this country, with its frequent slander of Senator Obama, is hardly a role model for China or other "undemocratic" countries.

Castro:

Voltaire

Are you series, $1 trillion is nothing compared to the $15 trillion in combined federal, state, and municiple debt in the states. None of the debt China owns is payable on demand, they all have fixed maturity dates, so China would have to find a buyer, which would mean losing tens of billions. The worst case is that the US dollar losses about 10 percent more value until the really large US pensions, rich people, US companies and EU/Japan jump in to buy the debt with a higher yield and to protect the EURO and Yen. The top 5 public pensions in the US has over $2 trillion in assets, only two. The US is very good at manipulating statistics. Negative savings rates, what a joke. The savings rate does not include investing and other forms of wealth building. My savings rate is only 3% based on US models, but I invest over 70% if what I make every year. The US federal budget is about $3 trillian a year, which is about the size of China's economy. The worst case for the US is that they default on the debt and it will be China, Japan, middle east and Europe who get screwed, because there is no way to collect. Russia, Argintina, China, Thailand, etc. have all done it. The truth is and I am not American, they can really mess up the world more, through war example Iraq, economically, financial crises anyone, politically, Cuba anyone. The only way the US can trully fall is if others start to consume more, Europe/Canada/Australia/Mexico/Columbia/Dubei/Japan/South Korea/India stops supporting their ability to consume and politics. US has many countries willing to support them, either out of fear of being steam rolled/marginalized or just because they do not want the spotlight. China has spent years quitely following Russia confronting the US, now they are starting to do it on thier own. It is probably to soon. The west does not fear China, we fear Russia. Russia has massive resources, millions of well trained and well equiped men, the ability to attack Europe and most places on Earth easily, and know how to fight and not much to lose. China really does not have that as most people in China just want to live peacefully and are not historically known for war.

Nelson From KC:

Zhengyou might also be a model for how the US and other western nations interact.
.
For example, the next time that the US decides to wage an unwise war-of-choice in Arabia and the French elect to exercise their right to international free speech in order to suggest to us that we are behaving unwisely, perhaps instead of renaming French fries as "liberty fries," we could recognize that France was merely being Zhengyou - a mature, friendly partner and --
.
I know that this may sound excessively idealistic...
.
-- and listen to them.

Nelson From KC

Castro:

Tibet is a distraction. 99 percent does not care in the least. The west is racist? Everyone is racist, if you did not know that before. Everyone. The Chinesse have no more love for Europeans then the Europeans have for Chinesse or US or India or anyone. We do not live in a fantasy world. Most world crises are fabricated. Tech bubble, terrorism, financial crises, etc. This givs the western powers the opportunity to change things in the way they want. The west is backing China into a corner on purpose, period. What happened when people protested Iraq, the US does not bother paying attention, when Russia crushed the Chechnians, nothing, French crushed rioters, nothing, why you ask. Not because thier was not critisism, but becuase in Western cultures, when someone pushes you, you either fight or you laugh at them. Russia does not get angry and make threats that "this is hurting the peoples feelings and you should be worried about that" or "this is our internal affairs, keep out" The west laughs it off and in some cases says "so what" China is being lulled into lashing out verbally, which means the west will keep provoking them. This article talks about the West not understanding China, it works both ways. The best thing China could have done is say nothing or say "what is your point" to the West. The west has no real point, except it is easy to piss China off and now the govenment in China will find it hard to control the people's anger. Look what happened last year regarding Japan, Chinesse to it to far and the government had a hard time controlling. If Chinesse get mad, they will do damage in their own country. The west is very happy letting China, India, Africa destroy their own environment getting resources and building crap. Think about it. The US is not drilling all the oil in Alaska, Texas, New Mexico, etc.... or Canada. Within twenty years the developing worlds resources will be close to depleted and the evironment will be so bad, people will die fast, food will be hard to grow and water will be undrinkable. The US has some of the best farm land on the earth. It can grow more food than China, many times more as a lot of land in the US is not being used and large farms with advanced techniques allows for more efficiency. There are more opportunities in chaos than in peace.

lz:

The West’s support of Tibetan monks is in the same vein as their support of Taliban, much worse because Tibet is recognized and has been part of China for centuries. The Western hypocrites just do NOT understand the Chinese people, their thousands of years struggle against foreign invasions and humiliation, often also against the rulers’ weakness and easy tendency for surrendering. The Chinese people in thousands of years have always been more patriotic and hawkish against foreign influence than the rulers. The Chinese patriotism has never been derived from communists, only that the communists used it well before they gained power. The West’s wishful thinking of communists’ manipulated patriotism is a fantasy. The best way for any Chinese ruler or leader to become notorious forever is to give up Taiwan or Tibetan. This history or tradition of Chinese thinking predates all the three major religions for over a thousand year. And these Western hypocrites want to educate the Chinese people that their thinking is so much more superior after merely 200 years of practice, notwithstanding the rise of terrorism due to Western manipulations. How arrogant is this?!

Debbie Chan:

People should read the entire text of Rudd's speech to the students [the elite students by the way, best of the best and probably the children of the powerful - the next leaders of China]. It was carefully crafted and designed to enable him to directly mention Tibet which he did and said there were significant human rights issues there.

People in their comments here are dishonestly not revealing that part of his speech. Rudd didn't just mention human rights issues in a vague sense he directly said they were there in Tibet and how he wished China to approach the solution - this on his first day, first event in China.

Rudd made reference not only to Zhengyou but also to some quite famous historical Chinese that went through Peking University and who were famous for standing up to authority and for harmonious solutions. The students and elite Chinese would have been well aware of what Rudd was inferring.

This is the second brilliant Rudd written speech, he also penned the Sorry that Australia said to their Aborigines.

Hopefully we are, with the coming generation of world leaders, seeing a more thoughtful intellectual approach to governing rather than the simplistic ways of the past. The world is changing rapidly - India, China and Asia are rising fast, might no longer equals right, climate change a preeminent issue - we will all need to be very sophisticated in our solutions and relationships. Rudd is the new breed.

lz2115:

The Western society’s hypocrisy is in perfect display in the Tibetan issue. Simply because the Han Chinese is dominant, the Western hypocrites turn a blind eye on the Tibetan monks’ murderous behaviors. Forget about the majority of the deaths are Han Chinese; forget about the criminal behavior that no western countries would tolerate. In the same vein, the Western hypocrites turn a blind eye on the murdering of Chinese in Indonesia in the 1960s and 1990s, and Japanese atrocity against Chinese, simply because China is a country that may threaten the West.

There is no moral clarity in the West’s hypocrites, particularly in these extreme liberals. They are racists! Just that they favor certain races over others. Kill as many Chinese as you like; we don’t like them! These Western hypocrites are the hidden racists. So long as the Western hypocrites continue on this behavior of hypocrisy, there will be more terrorism in the world. People of the world will continue to be enraged by these Western hypocrites that treat everyone else intellectually inferior, such that they cannot see their egregious hypocrisy. The truth is that most people in the non-Western world are not as stupid as the Western hypocrites think they are. So the struggle between cultures will continue on and get worse!

A. Jones (Sydney):

Rudd's remarks were anything but "blunt". Rudd merely said: "There are still many problems in China. Problems of poverty, problems of uneven development, problems of pollution. Problems of broader human rights.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2008/04/09/2212467.htm

"Problems"? We all have problems. So what. He equates gross human rights violations and deprivation of basic liberty with pollution. And as Opposition Foreign Affars Spokesman, the former junior diplomat didn't speak out much or at all on China's human rights abuses. See for example: https://213.192.30.36/owa/redir.aspx?URL=https%3a%2f%2fportal.newsltd.com.au%2fget%2furi%2fhttp%3a%2f%2fwww.alp.org.au%2fmedia%2f0406%2fdsifaistra020.php

Rudd has also badly miscalculated Australia's role in the region and ignored it important ally, Japan. He has been and remains intelectually captured by the communist state and there is a big question as to whether Australia's national interests are in safe hands. George Bush senior was also a former China diplomat but he never forgot for a moment that "friends" share common values.

Realist:

Mr. Pomfret:

Oh, I forgot to ask you returning to WaPo's main pages. We haven't seen any of your long reporting articles on the papers or the Main Web site. WaPo needs a neutral but a actually "reporting" reporter on the ground and knowing the history/culture like you to balance out those clueless clowns. (i.e. Maureen Fan).

Sincerely and Thank You!

Realist:

I have enjoyed Pomfret's articles because he has always approached the China problems basing on the realistic observations on the ground and an good understanding of the Chinese culture.

People, a.k.a a majority of Western media, can keep writing one-side and highly biased reports about China, but the end the Beijing regime will be the winner. The people will unite behind the government whenever the people realize what the foreign elements are trying to do to them as a country and a people, not just a government.

One biggest common mistake coutinuously being made by Western media is that almost all articles report that the Chinese are being brainwashed by their government's propaganda and nationalist teachings in schools. That's a totally flaw conclusion. If Chinese people have been brainwashed all along, the world would NOT ever see the student demonstrations in 1989; the world would NOT see/hear about the social unrests.

I do hope that the foreign policy planners/makers can be more far-sight than the media. The Chinese people does not equal to the Chinese government. Period. But if you push the Chinese, both government and the people, to the corner, it will result in making a strong shield and a sharp spear to wait for the unknowns.

H. Wang:

Jiang Wang.
You are Chinese, even though you want to get rid of this identity so badly.
You are so pathetic.

bdstauffer:

Hurrah for the Aussies! The Chinese people are very nice. Their gov't stinks.

Advance Australia Fair!
God Bless America!
God Save the Queen!

iewgnem:

Its unfortunate that the world's other leaders are too busy living up to their NGO expectations of bashing China to do anything constructive, for themselves as well as China.

Rudd is popular in China, and belive it or not his little remark on human rights was reported by Chinese media Phonex Television Mainland. His popularity stem mainly from his understanding of China and his ablity to engage with the people without resoting to age old propaganda slogans.

The problem with the NGO fearing politicians in Europe is they are not aware their catchphrase slogans used since the beginning of time has long been equated with hypocrisy in China, that whenever US or Britain brings up "human right", Chinese publics first reaction has always been "what make you think you are any better".

Will China change because of Rudd? Probably not, not many people can change Chinese policies particularly when the entire western world is attacking the Olympics which are viewed not as a communist party event but as an event for Chinese civilization. Having said that, Rudd's remark does strike at the heart of what many Chinese wish to see in their country, and by speaking in a way that does not resemble traditional slogan, his remarks will be a lot better accepted than one made by Gordon Brown or Bush.

bala srini:

it is an enigma-china is in a broad sense.there is a big populus of nearly 300 to 400 million chinese who are suppressed,oppressed and deprived by their own country's rulers.this is far worse than the racial and socio-economic problems we may have here.so the message i want to convey to all the rest of the world is there is no need to be afraid of china.it is a country like any other emerging power with wart and all.as long as there is a verifiable transparent level playing field then there will be progress in relationship between china and the rest of the world.the real question is will china be a willing and able partner-now that is the puzzle worth unravelling,but who can.

William Xia:

Jiang Wang:
Here are some 1940's way of living in US:
Apartheid is widespread in US, about 40 years before the Anti-Apartheid Act in 1986.
Tibet is a province of brutal Slavery.
The western powers assumes the occupation of many parts of China. India is a colony of the British.
Vietnam is a colony of the French.
The western powers are fighting the most bloody wars in the history. Is this the world of your dream?

Voltaire:

Kudos to Rudd for being such a brilliant and effective politician, not jumping on the bandwagon of China-bashing but still confronting the government on important issues.

Jiang Wang, you're funny. You sound Chinese, but you've got child's brain that's stuck in a Cold War mentality.

-No sponsors will show up? You seem to forget the ultimate goal of corporations is to MAKE MONEY, like it or not. They paid their billions, and they'll go to get their money's worth, and get their money's worth they will. Even if foreign attendance at the games is less than stellar, China's domestic market of 1.3 billion people, each with an average disposable income of 14000 yuan, are more than any company needs to thrive.

-The satellite test seemed provocative, but more of a kind warning to us in case we ever get in a war with them over Taiwan. Basically, they're saying, "We can blow your all-important satellites out of the sky, so stay the **** out of our business because we don't want to fight you, but we'll hurt you bad if we do have to fight". We responded in kind by knocking out our own satellite a few months back, using the excuse of 'destroying dangerous chemicals'. I don't buy that, China and Russia doesn't buy that either.

And finally, China will go back to the 1940s if the U.S. leave? What are you smoking? Bi-lateral trade between the U.S. and China totaled over 300 billion dollars in 2007, and China owns 1 trillion dollars of our debt. We are way more dependent on China than China is dependent on us. The world wants China's cheap goods (some of it is crap/toxic, a lot of it is actually good quality), but not too many countries want our debt. Seeing as our M1 money supply is only 1.4 trillion dollars, our dollar would crash and we'd literally go bankrupt if China decided to recall its 1 trillion dollars of worth our debt.

I don't condone the actions taken by the Chinese government, but when someone owns 1 trillion dollars worth of you, you don't have much leverage. The Chinese are a proud people, and they don't forget slights easily. A better way to engage China would be to just engage China instead of treating them like a yellow peril. If they are a yellow peril, treating them like one is only going to make the situation worse. Dubya isn't the smartest president around, but at least he'll go to the Olympics and check out the sports. Pelosi is a dumb b**** for lashing out against China that way. She can learn a thing or two from Rudd.

jacky:

I do not know what you are talking about. Shut up.

PizzaHut:

Jacky,
Yeah, some friend, US is giving all that cash to China buying crap so China can buy that uranium.

Arnold Yodice:

We have to understand that China finances our deficit, so we have to smile, smile, smile or else take the gold in Fort Knox and pay off our debt China will compete for world trade with us every step or the way. They are already making some progress in Southamerica because they will need their water in 20 years as we will too. Our great advantage is the agricultural resources together with Australia, Argentina and Brazil. In the meantime our kids should learn not only Spanish but also Chinese. My grandchildren have started already.

Patrick:

I've lived in Taiwan for ten years now at the grass roots level. I'm a permanent resident, speak Chinese and spend extensive periods of time on the mainland doing business and visiting family members by marriage.

It seems to me that what Kevin Rudd is describing is communism and not traditional Chinese culture as the best "pengyous" (pung-yohs) I've ever had are the Chinese version. My American friends and family members pale (in more ways than one) by comparison.

I can also tell you that from the Taiwan perspective, where we are next in line for mistreatment at the hands of the communist apparatchik for exercising our basic human rights, Kevin Rudd doesn't occupy the high moral ground he imagines after all the years of bloodshed and occupation Australia has contributed to in Iraq.

Jacky:

Yeah, some friend. Australia is selling uranium to China.

Pomfret fan:

Pomfret is the master China observer. His book "Chinese Lessons" strikes and seeks a similar balance. He is a China realist, and one of the few who understands the subtleties and intangibilities involved in living in or dealing with China. Rudd's finesse is rare, playing to a higher level of Chinese thinking. The rest of the world isn't so sophisticated, though, and whatever balance Rudd ably strikes will still be overshadowed by increased polarization. At the end of the day, how can even the most skilled world leader deal with a regime that labels the Dalai Lama "a jackal"? Good on Rudd, even if it's not going to do much good.

Labor View from Broome:

Australia's Minister for Climate Change and Water, Penny Wong, is of Malaysian Hakka Chinese background. She accompanied Kevin Rudd on the China leg of his trip. Her Mandarin skills are not supposed to be as good as Rudd's but I bet she's catching up fast. A duo who might come in handy at future Kyoto negotiations given the current tendency of US politicians to demonise China and India on the issue.

It is surprising how little international media coverage Rudd's remarks have received. Tibet is certainly topical. One can only hope that Al Gore is right in believing that global warming will become the high profile election issue that it was in Australia last year.

Kevin Rennie

Jiang Wang :

Great words by a future great leader. Australian leader along with THE Great French president Sarkozy are the 2 most fantastic upcoming leaders of today.

China does not have Friends anywhere in this world. Why? because China is not trustworthy. It comes across as a greedy selfish nation which oppresses its own people; Supresses religious freedom;Wants to colonize even in this day and age; Thinks neighbouring countries are inferior; Wants to be accepted so badly by west as a superpower that it has forgotten that West will not accept China in their fraternity if it still remains communist.

Mark my words. Olympics will be a great failure and a smear on Red communist Ego. They spent billions of dollars and wont recoup their money since no sponsorers will show up.

No decent American or European corporate want to be associated with olympics since they dont want to be seen as a symbol of oppression.

Secondly, China has antagonized the west by conducting a recent satellite test which was outrightly provoking and simply jabbing the west.

Thirdly, if you look at China, they are good in manufacturing but not in Finance or Creative technology. They like to steal designs and resell others technology but lack fundamental understanding in international finance and business.

Also much of this can be attributed to the red communist way of thinking that they can challenge a great democracy like USA with dollar manipulation and think they can get away.

If corporate America pulls out of China, they will go back to 1940's way of living. That they dont know yet.

Lastly, RedChina! dont mess with USA. Democratic minds are always sharper than Communist egoes.


Ehmetjan:

Oh man, as an expat in Western China being driven insane by the methods developed by administrators here to crush dissent or calls for change, be it disgruntled local minorities or me trying to get a new freaking computer in my classroom... "zhengyou" is now my new rallying cry. Thanks, Rudd!

Sumit, Grand Rapids, MI:

Heads I win, tails you lose! What is mine is mine, what is yours is negotiable, that is how the Chinese negotiate with others. Foreigners are barbarians and need to be exploited to the full, if they complain they are no longer "friends"'! With friends like this who will ever need enemies!

Thanks Fellas:

Yeah. I voted for him.

informed observer:

Rudd saw through the western leaderships kowtowing to the Zhongnanhai clique and Han chauvanists. To be truely familiar with the Chinese and their history means to view this as the perfect opportunity to confront them, but only if it is done in artful way. The relative lack of western media coverage of the speech at the university shows the western media is not biased against China, but ignorant of both China's strengths and weaknesses. Rudd threaded the needle, all of us with intimate knowledge of China should be very, very impressed and equally grateful.

Janus:

Intriguing, and if it pans out, wonderful. It was probably clear to everyone that the current relationship wasnt working, and this looks to be a winning bit of intellectual jujitsu, as it would be harder for PRC officials to decry "zhengyou" as another unfair Western imposition

Links & Resources

Visit Pomfret's Website
PostGlobal is an interactive conversation on global issues moderated by Newsweek International Editor Fareed Zakaria and David Ignatius of The Washington Post. It is produced jointly by Newsweek and washingtonpost.com, as is On Faith, a conversation on religion. Please send us your comments, questions and suggestions.