ORDAK100:

It is not about the 72 million Iranians but about them.

Just look at Iraq. The suffering, death and destruction that the invasion has caused is not so much of a concern. It is mismanagement, mistakes and that's about it. All those lost lives? well it is unfortunate as the US government officials always say but the killings will continue, nevertheless.

It is all about how good they feel about what they are trying to do.

It is imperialism. You invade the "uncivilized" to feel good about yourself.

TOMMILLER1:

You didn't address my post. Did the US government harass Al-Jazeera and its reporters and then banned it while the US government was trying to "free" Iraq?

What free press. Fallujah's massacres by the use of modern napalm (White Phosphorus) was initially denied by the Pentagon until images of dead children with burned flesh surfaced on TV and on Al-Jazeera before they were kicked out of the city and prevented from covering the carnage.

What you write is speculation, most of it based on hostility and prejudice.

2 weeks ago, you would not know who Mousavi was.

A democracy doesn't act the way it did in Iraq or even in Iran but we must clear as who kills and destroys with so much impunity.

Close to 1 million dead Iraqi civilians within 5 years.

You tell me who the tyranny is.

The Iranian dictatorship is following a tried and true path for all totalitarian governments. As the free media are banned from Iran and communications are increasingly blocked, I suspect that the real crackdown and torture of the Iranian people will start. People will disappear and not be heard from again and in the pristine little world of Shah Khamenei all will be well but I bet in reality the future is no longer theirs. The free media had nothing to do with the internal disturbances in Iran but as sure as the Soviet Union fell this evil regime will fall one day and that same free media will tell those of us who care about the facts the truth.

This is not a matter for U.S. involvement and President Obama's measured approach is correct I believe. The Iranian people didn't need western media to voice their objections to the flaming human rights abuses of the Iranian government and I applaud them as I applaud all peoples who rise together for freedom. They will take care of the current Shah and his cronies in Iran themselves when the time is ripe.

This event has nothing to do with the media or other egregious historical events. Those claims are just more tired old excuses from apologists for tyrannical regimes. Clearly, it stands on its own as an example of people standing up for dignity and freedom. The brave protestors in Iran should give all of us who value the human spirit new hope for the future of all.

Foreign readers seem to be emotional and forget that Iran is a country of 72 million people and even if 1 million turn out and demonstrate for cameras, etc. (something that has yet to happen), they are still a tiny minority in their own country.
Do the other 71 million not have any rights or should they not have peace, because some dude has lost the election in a system that he accepted upfront?

And who are foreigners to have an opinion on an internal matter in Iran and their elections?

TOMMILLER:

Do you happen to remember which government threatened to bomb Al-Jazeera, killed two of its journalists, bombed its bureau in Afghanistan and destroyed its communication equipment, imprisoned one of its reporters in Gitmo for 6 years with no charge, has blamed Al-Jazeera for the bloodbath in Iraq and ended up banning the TV news channel from Iraq for years, routinely harassed its reporters while they were still allowed in Iraq?

I will give you a hint:

The democratic government of the United States.

What are we supposed to be? gullible people who swallow the propaganda and the lies.

I fully agree with Ali.

As an Arab, I can clearly see the double standards in covering Palestinian protests and these protests.

US mainstream media is clearly trying its best to over-dramatize the events and to use this opportunity to further de-legitimize, demonize the Iranian leadership among the readers and to stock hostility towards this country.

Newsweek has put together a photo presentation in its website and titled it: "Terror in the Streets of Tehran". This alone speaks for itself. This is the same Newsweek that was calling for the invasion of Iraq few years ago (Fareed Zakaria led that movement).

Luckly, we no longer have to rely on US dominated news like CNN, New York Times and their likes who pretty much stand by the official line of the US government when it comes to the Middle East.

It is a good thing we have Al-Jazeera which, for some strange reason, always bring in people who at least speak the native language to provide commentary and analysis.

Mr. Ettefagh,
Reading this report makes me come to the conclusion that you should stop writing articles for the western media and begin reporting on Press TV and other Iranian state-controlled propaganda sources. You have even perfected the art of underhanded insinuation with your statement "mobs are funded and supported by sources that are now very worried about corruption queries ever since the not-so-hidden taboos of their source of wealth have busted open." (A clear reference to Rafsanjani for anyone not versed enough in Iranian politics)

Your analysis, which in this case I use the term VERY loosely, is nothing more than repetition of the government line as spouted by Khamenei. How can you explain Karroubi receiving less than 1 percent of the vote after receiving 17% in 2005? Or Mousavi not winning in Tabriz? Or 50 districts having more votes than eligible voters?

Regardless of the actual results of the election, these videos of protesters getting beaten and shot in Iran are not created by the western media. The violence has been unjustified and illegal. The Iranian constitution clearly states the right to free assembly and protest as long as those assembling are not carrying weapons. As Ayatollah Montazeri stated regarding army and security forces "receiving orders will not excuse them before God." With this spreading of propaganda I place you in with the Basij beating women with batons.

As an Iranian American, I used to enjoy your posts in this forum, but this is the last one that I will ever read. Shame on you.

later, Mosavi may take this election to the court to be discussed. but now keep Mosavi calm and silent.

Ali Ittifak,

the groups shall be taken from Northern Iraq to Iran, at night in an hour.

Ali

Its over. Iran should know better … Iran does know better.

This regime that you adore began with a clean slate; it has had a legitimate chance to validate itself to the world and to God, It has not, it cannot.

Your fellow countrymen simply want more freedom than the “supreme leader” believes in. It truly is a dark heart that denies a people their elementary rights and freedoms.

For any form of government to actually believe it can rule its people as this one has reveals its absurd center.
Citizens who agree with it are provided for, those who question it … just look out your window Ali.

Apparently Ahmedinejad visited every province twice during his campaign. A WaPo exit poll in Iran predicted a 2/3s support for Ahmedinejad. In addition to 11 million victory margin, the case of a fraudulent election is far from substantiated, and rioting protesters appear far less supported by fact than by emotions.

It is all about the ballot box or the stick. Can't have it both ways and those that comment below, like SHIVEH and FARNAZ1MANSOURI1 want to have it both ways of creating havoc and violence if they are on the losing side.

As the article above clearly mentions, the riot police comes out when there is a need to put order back into society. Why was there no riots or random beating of the people in the past 4 years of Ahmadinejad? Secondly, for every 1 or 2 computer-literate Iranian, there is probably 10 that are not techie, to Twitter or send video files. They too need peace, quiet and pursuit of liberty.

Finally, this story that the "modern west" is the answer is just an advertisement taken without the due care and attention that it deserves:

a) In any society where the ballot is the way to go, there will always be a winner and several losers of the contest and the rule is for all to respect the result, not go out and raise hell if you lose;

b) The Iranian election results was a 2:1 result in favour of Ahmadinejad by 11 million votes (out of 40m cast). It is not possible to cheat by such a wide margin in a system that was observed by all candidates; and

c) Ahmadinejad won by 61% of the votes against Rafsanjani 4 years ago. So, his win of 65% is more or less on par with his previous votes, and

d) For 28 weeks prior to the election, there have been weekly polls taken by Iranian Broadcasting that always showed Ahmadinejad 50%+ to 60% ahead of others.

All of these facts show that the results are fair and expected. Time to set aside sensationalism. The article above was correct to point out that it was not and it is not Tiananmen Square (where they do not have elections). Speaking ill of Iran will not get any one to anywhere.

BARACK HUSSEIN OBAMA'S APPEASEMENT FOREIGN POLICIES WEAKEN THE U.S.; HE SIDED WITH IRANIAN BRUTAL REGIME!!!

Coward liar Barack HUSSEIN Obama "Apologist in chief", how can he keep his nonsense promise during his campaign, that is, negotiating with U.S. enemies such as North Korea and Iran, which have never respected any treaty with U.S., especially when North Korea just launched many missile and nuclear tests and planned to fire missile toward Hawaii, not mentioning illegally arrested and sentenced two American journalists Laura Ling and Eunu Lee to twelve years of labor, while Iranian president Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, an extremist who called for Israel to be wiped off the map and denied the holocaust, was just re-elected by fraud. Is Obama going to bow to Kim Jong Il and Ahmadinejas as he did to King Abdulla of Saudi Arabia to gain his peace deals? Is he willing to convert to Islam, his Kenyan father and Indonesian step father's religion, to meet Osama Bin Laden's requirement that in order to end the Iraq war, U.S. troop withdrawal is not enough, Americans must reject their democratic system and embrace Islam? Just recently, Obama said that he would support Iran's right to peaceful nuclear energy with rigorous inspections, giving a green light to Teheran's ambituous uranium enrichment program, which can be used for its discreet nuclear bomb development program as well, without suffering sanctions and economic isolation as it currently endures. Does Obama want Iran to become another North Korea using its nuclear power to terrorize the U.S and its allies? Worst still, Obama refused to show support for pro-democracy protesters and denounce the brutal regime for the deaths of seven demontrators, fearing to be seen as interfering in Iran's internal affairs so that he could not pursue a nuclear deal with Ayatollah Ali Khamenei, the country's supreme leader. In fact, Obama sided with the regime, citing that there was not a bit of difference between the two candidates, a moderate Mir Hossein Mousavi and hardcore extremist Ahmadinejad. A big mouth for change at home, he does not want to see any change in Iran. Is he going to turn a blind eye to another Tianamen Square massacre committed by the Iranian Revolutionary Guard? As for a Palestinian state demanded by Obama, it will undoubtedly soon become a TERRORIST state under control of terrorist militant group Hamas, which is the most powerful and popular force with its goal to destroy Israel and which won a majority seats in the current Palestinian National Authority in 2006 election and ousted Fatah militant group of Palestinian President Mahmud Abbas of Gaza in 2007. Last but not least, Obama ordered to stop waterboarding tactic used by CIA, even it worked well on terrorist suspects like Khalid Shaikh Mohammed, the self-describer planner of 9-11 attacks who provided CIA with valuable information, preventing more 9-11 attacks and saving thousands of American lives.

The article does not seem entirely honest to me. We've gotten emails, we have friends who are not only witnessing this in Iran, but, yes, in Turkey, in Pakistan, Tanzania, everywhere. Everywhere, people seem to be getting more inforamtion than we are in the US. I am Iranian. I know who and what Mousavi is. Unless there has been a radical change, he will not be the Abe Lincoln of Iran. Of course, he wants an Islamic state, with capitalist reform, and with very strong socialist safeguards. He wants a functioning economy. He doesn't want all those who were promised jobs beaten and jailed when they demonstrate for lack of them. He doesn't want the salve of throwing money at the poor intermittently to ease there anguish.

He knows that when a leader is elected on the promise of meeting the needs of the poor, there is only so long that Jew bashing and saber rattling at Israel can substitute for food. He wants an Islamic state. He does not want Iranian National Oil Co., the banks, the bizarres, everything, in the fists of the clerical oligarchy. In whose
fists it will be, should be must not be decided by one man, Supreme Leader, or other.

He needs to restore class mobility. He may be able to get rid of the embarrassment of the morality police, perhaps the basji, but women will not get equal rights any time soon. It would be good if he allowed the Jews and Christians to live in peace, attend the schools of their choice, etc. Very good if he stopped terrorizing the B'hai. These things he could do.

THIS is IRAN. A great nation. A wealthy nation that should be thriving. This it can do with a sensible economy, with some dialogue with the West. This it can do with an Islamic state, a moderate well-governed state with duly elected leaders. This is not 1953. Mousavi is not Shah. That cannot happen again. It will not.

Sudents are being shot on the streets of Iran. All over the world they are seeing more of this than we in the US are.

Here is something we have seen. Students being gunned down by basji, I presume:

http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2009/06/19/world/worldwatch/entry5096912.shtml

The death of young people is always a tragedy. But its also a blessing for them when they are free of the trials and temptations of this life at an early age.
See, in Islam the next life is the everlasting, superior life while this life is the temporary, inferior life.

That being said, youth can be vibrant and full of lofty ideas, but its also frought with niavete, ignorance, and gullibility in belief and ideas.

That's why it is so uncommon that mature people full the young when it comes to life's affairs.

The youth of Iran in Tehran may support Moussavi, but Moussavi apparently supports Neo Con capitalist reforms which would open Iranian resources to privatization thus capitalization by youth. Now youth are also known to be shortsighted and selfcentered, if not myopic. Iranian youth may like the cause of being free of Iranian morality police, but in exchange, oil and gas and mineral rights will be privatized and manipulated by Iranian capitalists who ultimately with engage and open up Iran to Western capitalists, the ultimate goal of the West.

So while Ali can wear make up, play music, and dance in the streets, his country's resources will eventually be bought up by Western oil and energy firms that will gain the profits once allocated to poor and needy in Iran. The tradeoff is notorious detrimental.

Russia went through a similiar transition which only the FSB/KGB Kremlin establishment could resist the efforts of Western capitalists as they exploited and pilfored Russia almost to the collapse of the state government.

And Moussavi with Rafsanjani over his shoulder appear more likely to advance Neo Con reforms in Iran. But Ahmedinejad ran a superior campaign, won 3 of their debates, and geared policies to win the support of rural and poor Iranians. Moreover, many Iranians are proud of the cause to nuclear development of Iran, ecspecially people of the Iranian diaspora and older generations.

This is an email I received that explains what is happening in Iran at this very moment. Lines have been drawn and regime apologists have lost all credibility. Dear Dr.! if not now, when?

"Hello,

It's painful to watch what's happening.

I don't want anything to do with what has been said this far, as I neither have the strength nor the resilience to face all these unfathomable events.

I only want to speak about what I have witnessed. I am a medical student. There was chaos last night at the trauma section in one of our main hospitals. Although by decree, all riot-related injuries were supposed to be sent to military hospitals, all other hospitals were filled to the rim. Last night, nine people died at our hospital and another 28 had gunshot wounds. All hospital employees were crying till dawn. They (government) removed the dead bodies on back of trucks, before we were even able to get their names or other information. What can you even say to the people who don't even respect the dead. No one was allowed to speak to the wounded or get any information from them. This morning the faculty and the students protested by gathering at the lobby of the hospital where they were confronted by plain cloths anti-riot militia, who in turn closed off the hospital and imprisoned the staff. The extent of injuries are so grave, that despite being one of the most staffed emergency rooms, they've asked everyone to stay and help--I'm sure it will even be worst tonight.

What can anyone say in face of all these atrocities? What can you say to the family of the 13 year old boy who died from gunshots and whose dead body then disappeared?

This issue is not about cheating (election) anymore. This is not about stealing votes anymore. The issue is about a vast injustice inflected on the people. They've put a baton in the hand of every 13-14 year old to smash the faces of "the bunches who are less than dirt" (government is calling the people who are uprising dried-up torn and weeds)

This is what sickens me from dealing with these issues. And from those who shut their eyes and close their ears and claim the riots are in opposition of the government and presidency!! No! The people's complaint is against the egregious injustices committed against the people"

I respect your different world perspective, but blaming the foreign media is so CCPish. Have the decency to accept your country for what it is, a theocratic oligarchy with flawed Democratic processes and institutions. Candidates are pre-vetted. Violence has occurred (see any number of videos and reports,) and the numerical results trumpeted by the government of the election are dubious. This is not Democracy.

You are quick to point out the flaws of the West, but if you can't realize and admit those of your own country and people, then you are no better than those you choose to castigate.

What the author didn't mention was that Ahmedinejad ran a superior political campaign which was more effective in almost every way, won all 3 debates in which all candidates participated, and had policies in place that favored large rural and poor populations.

If what he said is true that opposition candidates had observers at voting places and who counted ballots, this reenforces the election turnout.
So far, no one has shown evidence of a corrupt election. No one has shown how Ahmedinejad stoled the election after the voting.

In contrast, there is AMPLE evidence that America NeoCons have worked to overthrow the Iranian regime using any means possible, including using youth protests as pawns. This is evident in the Kyl Leiberman Amendement, HR 1585, which called for public funds to oust the current Iranian regime using all means, except "terrorism" http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/394317/crucial_kyllieberman_amendment_passes_pg2.html?cat=62

Whatever happened in this election, America IS behind an effort to overthrow the Iranian regime. Iranian youth may be too stupid to know they are pawns of the American Neo Con cabal, or think they can use the momentum in their favor. What is clear is Western media and political activists use this election as a way to rally support in their regional agendas in the Muslim world.

Wow..... how interesting to see foreigners sheing aligator tears for Iranian, and in case of TOMMILLER1, telling us that people in France speak French!

Yes, they do and if you read their newspapers, you will see that they are not trying to topple an elected government in another country. In fact the actual question posed by the moderator, the word "coup" (a pro-regime coup, which is an oxymoron), indicates that Americans are still stuck in the past and they think in terms of coups and overthrows and do not want to see real progress of democratic institutions in other countries.

The writer's guarded pointing towards the laws and budgets for regime change (i.e. USA laws) and the abject failure of Americans in Iraq and Pakistan and Afghanistan "democracies" ought to remind you all Yanks that elections do not necessarily mean that Iranians are compelled to elect a government to your liking. Full Stop! Learn to live with it.

Grand Ayatollah Montazeri would correctly say you've lost your marbles, Mr. Ettefagh. Just because the run-up was peaceful doesn't mean the Iranian people will not revolt on seeing their election stolen.

True, it may not be 1953 or 1979---Yet. But it sure looks like it's headed that way.

Dictatorships always blame the media that they don’t control. Most of this post is too ludicrous for comment (e.g. fair election monitoring?  ).
The simple facts are that Iran is in the middle of a major power struggle among the elite ruling class of mullahs, military and an entrenched bureaucracy while the Iranian people are simply requesting a little respect for their intelligence and personal rights. We’ve all seen this story before. When the Iranian people have enough of the tyranny, they will answer Mr. Ettefagh and the elite who have a stranglehold on power in Iran far better than anyone will do on this blog. If not today, then certainly tomorrow and they won’t need advice from western governments or media.
Also, for the record French is spoken in France, not English although their media are apparently also one of Mr. Ettefagh’s scapegoats. After the Sarkozy election, there was indeed a brief period of social unrest in France but it was not based on election fraud or abuses of power by the power elite (e.g. state media TV reporting ONLY on Mr. Ahmadinejad’s campaigns rallies or jamming of communications media to benefit the incumbent). The protests were based on a disappointment from a constituency who voted for the losing party. All unrest was reported by the world media and discussed openly in France and the world. No French official EVER accused external forces for the unrest because in a democracy we discuss and investigate our problems openly with the people in order to find honest solutions to them. We may not be as pious as the mullahs think they are or as holier-than-though as Mr. Ettefagh but our peoples have a say in their government. We also respect the right of people to eat at MacDonald’s if they wish or don’t have the money to finance a better meal.
I hope that Mr. Ettefagh will have the opportunity to travel more and learn something about cultures outside of Iran. For him and the privileged elite governing class in Iran they have much to learn apparently from their own people.

Dictatorships always blame the media that they can't control. The absurdity of most of this post is too ludicrous to discuss (e.g. monitoring of the election :) ).

Iran is in the middle of a serious power struggle among the elitists who run the country while the people just seek a better life, free from the hypocracy and injustice of the ruling class of mullahs, military, and intrenched bureaucratic interests.

True democratic elections provide a stable transition of power - not the kind of protests shaking Iran today. Apparently, Iran is far from capable of such elections. When the Iranian people have had enough, they will settle the matter and won't need any assistance from the West, the foreign press, or any other routine scapegoat.

P.S. The last I visited France they spoke French, not English but apparently their media ia also singled out by Mr. Ettefagh as the culprit in the election problems in Iran. Note that the riots after the Sarkozy election were by people unhappy with who was elected. They in no way believed that the election was rigged or falsified. Although the post-election riots were reported in every news service in the world, no French official blamed them on the media. We don't act that way in a democracy. We investigate and freely discuss our problems and work to elect officials who make improvements. I hope that Mr. Ettefagh will have the opportunity in the future to learn more about cultures outside of Iran and what is being said in what language in what country.

Very good! Superb observations, especially about the neighbors.