If the world was entirely about economic factors, and men had no other needs and no will or spirit, yours would be a flawless examination.

Very good points, but there is one missing piece to the puzzle. The primary impetus for self-determination that is often ignored is the fact that a group or region are often shut out of the process of governance. In Serbia, prejudice made sure that Kosovars had limited access to the governance of the nation. As you pointed out, we live in the age of trade agreements and open-border blocs, but this only makes the case for self-determination more pressing and more viable. With access to the EU, why would Kosovars continue to allow Serbians to speak for them when they know they don't have their best interests at heart?

In the case of Tibet, ethnic Tibetans are dominated politically and economically by Han Chinese and the Chinese government continues to break international promises about human rights and democratic reform. While there is no convenient trading bloc to walk into, it's easy to see independence as an escape route from this binding situation. In the end, threats of independence should only be used when internal reform fails. I think Tibet-related protests should focus on pressing China to live up to its human rights and democratic reform promises, not just vitriolic calls for independence.

Eventually, however, a divorce is better than being forced to live with an abusive marriage.

And to all those who don't think there is a human rights problem in China, then why are so many civil rights lawyers who defend abused civilians harassed or kidnapped by the government? Where is Gao Zhisheng? I want China to develop, but I also want it to take care of its people just as I expect the USA to answer for its mistakes and do the same. Posters are right, the West has a ways to go. The whole planet has a long way to go. And if we can't be honest about our collective failings during the times we come together, then when can we ever be honest?

I agree that daily practical issues in a globalised world is a lot more important than the notion of being "independent" when you cannot afford to be independent.

what a load of garbage....

obviuosly the diplomati relationship between tehran and beijing is very close!

"US provided us with good reasons to invade the world and mistreat all minorities."
First of all, China was always invaded by other countries in nearly 200 years, including so-called civil and democracy countries like America,British,French, Germany, Japan and so on, but China never invade any country, after the world war II, America invaded North Korea,Vietnam,Iraqi,Jugoslavia and Afghanistan,
Today America want to invade Iran and North Korea again?
"Mistreat all minorities"? First of all, do you know how many minorities are living in China? do you really know how their lifes are going? Do you know they are proud of being a chinese?Do you know most of tibets living in tibet don't even want the Dalai lama's autonomy?they are enjoying their lifes and don't want to be slaves again.
Are you really care about people living in tibet or you just want to sell your so-called democracy?

FOr those who did not understand why China want to hold unto Tibet, here is an except from an article by George Friedman:
"Note that running along the frontier directly south of this border is one of the largest population concentrations in the world. If China were to withdraw from Tibet, and there were no military hindrance to population movement, Beijing fears this population could migrate into Tibet. If there were such a migration, Tibet could turn into an extension of India and, over time, become a potential beachhead for Indian power. If that were to happen, India’s strategic frontier would directly abut Sichuan and Yunnan — the Chinese heartland.
The Chinese have a fundamental national interest in retaining Tibet, because Tibet is the Chinese anchor in the Himalayas. If that were open, or if Xinjiang became independent, the vast buffers between China and the rest of Eurasia would break down. The Chinese can’t predict the evolution of Indian, Islamic or Russian power in such a circumstance, and they certainly don’t intend to find out. They will hold both of these provinces, particularly Tibet. "
China's interests in Tibet is based on its security concerns, not econmic interests.

Article above is correct to say that economic realities are daily needs. People cannot eat their cultural traditions or heat their homes with their distant history or wear their unique cultural identity.

@Shalom Freedman
You attack the writer and raise the issue of the Islamic Republic of Iran as a theocracy, etc. but you forget that the Dalai Lama is a religious leader and their ideal Tibet (of the past, and of the hope for the future) is/will be a theocracy.
And, your raise Berlin and your name is a big giveaway...tell me, how come Israel does not have a written constitution and it relies on religious basic laws, not withstanding the fact that the idea of an apartheid democracy (ha ha ha) is a fraud that has never worked for the last 60 years....

I had intended on writing an in-depth analyses and critic of this article, It appears to have within it some hidden agendas. There are many factually incorrect statements, to many in fact to expound on. As a physicist, I thought I would take a different approach, a more fundamental view. The following quote is from an extrodinary human being. One of many, who've made extrodinary contribution to the whole of humanity. The kernel of this statement has within it a fundematal truth. I often think about it, whether it be about Government, Ideology, Religion, personal relationships, etc .. To strive to be an independent free thinker is perhaps the hardest road to embark on.

"If, in some cataclysm, all of scientific knowledge were to be destroyed, and only one sentence passed on to the next generations of creatures, what statement would contain the most information in the fewest words? I believe it is the Atomic Hypothesis (or the atomic fact, or whatever you wish to call it) that all things are made of atoms -- little particles, that move around in perpetual motion, attracting each other when they are a little distance apart, but repelling upon being squeezed into one another. In that on sentence, you will see, there is an enormous amount of information about the world, if just a little imagination and thinking are applied."

- Richard P. Feynman (The Feynman Lectures on Physics)

-Scott Humphrey

"How do you think US, the biggest ammunition export country in the world?"

This is great reason for China to invade India too!! China should have this enshrined in its constitution: "US provided us with good reasons to invade the world and mistreat all minorities."

Come to think of it, there are probably zillions of murderers in jail now, their crime gave me a lot of excuses to at least cheat in cards.

I am so glad that you only talked about ecomomic issues, and not cultural and religious. Economic is the only issue, only one that need discussion. All others are just rubbish. I am with you.

Money, food, and LV bags are all we need.

To Shalom Freedman:
Do you know the definition of Dalai lama's autonomy?Here is his autonomy:
The first one: He want the autonomy of the "big tibet", which includes tibet, sichuan, yunnan,gansu,qinghai, only in sichuan, there are 100 million people and most of the people are han chinese.
The second one:the chinese army have to evacuate from the "big tibet" and other nationalities including han have to evacuate from "big tibet" too. We all know garrison right is the symbol of Country's sovereignty.
"practicing their ancient religion and way of life", do you know the civil tibets were used to be slave, of cource the dalai lama and his fellows
want to their life back, because they would be slaveholder again.
"China also is a provider of military technology to Iran, perhaps even to its nuclear program." How do you think US, the biggest ammunition export country in the world? And why US are so angry with Iran and North Korea's civil nuclear programm, just because they don't soft-sawder US?And why Iran is a evil country, just because Iran is a oil-rich country and don't listen to US, like Iraqi?

I'm stunned by both this article, and the nature of the comments. Political independence is almost never driven by a desire for economic independence. America didn't declare it's independence from Britain because the taxes were considered onerous, but because they weren't reflected in commensurate political participation. Ireland didn't fight a war of independence because it felt it would benefit economically - it languished economically for years as a result - but because this was an acceptable price for freedom from perceived foreign domination. Political indpendence frequently doesn't even require economic independence. A free-trade agreement between China and Tibet need be no less effective in entwining the two economies than the free trade between the UK and Ireland or between the Czech Republic and Slovakia. It may not be considered rational by a member of the global economic elite, but it's an almost universal human desire to not be ruled by a foreign ethnicity/culture/religion. In fact you couldn't give better examples of what happens when you attempt to repress this desire than the states listed (inexplicably) as failed examples of independence. Iraq, Sudan, Israel, Pakistan, etc are all convulsing almost entirely due to crushed aspirations of ethnic or cultural independence.
There was a time when this desire for independence was subordinate to the power struggles between great states, but this is the 21st not the 19th century. For economic good or bad, Tibet wants independence. China has no moral grounds for denying them this.

The 'Washington Post' gives respectability to the author of this article who is a shill for the Islamic Revolutionary Regime in Tehran. That regime is major trading partner of China. China whose foreign policy ruthlessness and lack of ethics are second to none is at present giving support to the Sudanese government in its repressive actions in Darfur. China also is a provider of military technology to Iran, perhaps even to its nuclear program.
What the Tibetans are asking for is not an independent state, but rather a degree of cultural autonomy which will enable them to continue practicing their ancient religion and way of life. The Dalai Llama has made it clear that he eschews violent confrontation, that he demands only peaceful dialogue with China.
The question of whether or not to boycott the Games is a difficult one. But to pretend that Sport is somehow pure and beyond Politics is nonsense. The whole show in Peking will after all have a political dimension , just as the one in Berlin in 1936 did.

Where was the issue of Tibet independence at the
time of other International Sports held in China?
Suddenly the West wakes up to the plight of Tibet!
Could it be there own economic plight with those
soaring gas prices,with posterior stuck in Iraq and Afghanistan.The cost of keeping Vader's force
in Baghdad depends on the surging Bill that has to
be paid to Beijing!So why not create confusion in
the minds of gullible nation and cover your own failings with Tibet.

I think the comment below about Japan is a valid point. They were invaded and forced to have a surrender treaty with USA and remain under "official watch" of Americans with bases in Japan. but the people built their country and worked their country to be the No. 2 economy in the world (at least until China caught up with them). So, it is the character of people willing to work hard, instead of sitting around complaining about being "occupied" or invaded or whatever...

So, it is not about being an independent country, it is about being self-reliant and willing to help yourself. That kind of help will not come from a temple or from thinking about the past.

@Xin

There are certain people who are best left alone in their filthy nests. There are certain posters not worthy your reply. No need to waste your time and emotion on those.

Let each ethic group rain 50 bullets on each other before they learn anything.

To men with this kind of comments:
"I don't see anything valuable can be found in China! Only abuses, killing, cheating, lying, terrorizing, violence, and treachery and all bad and worst activities shown up on this nation!
Corruption, murdering, torturing, lying, bootlegging, copyrights violation, spying, and military blended with violence activities can be found in this nation!
What's the hell going on with this communist China?
All communist nations are so bad and dangerous, China is one of them! What is the benefit to think about this culture? this nation? this life-style? this threat?"

You are unhappy, but I feel shamed for your comments and you to be so naive. If a man could be so unjust about the truth and so naive, you must be from FBI or CIA or you are one of the candidates of president election.Have you ever been China? do yo really know something about what US is doing in this world?R you a human being by the way?You are nothing but an animal, which could not use your own brain to think, to do the reasoning and to get the truth. If you can have the slightest knowledge about the real world not just the stupid news from some so-called fair medias,you should know that in this world it is US which are starting the wars all around the war and killing millions of people in this peaceful time!!!!!!!!!If you knwo something about the truth, you will see some valuable things in China.Were it not for China, you may lose your job already because of another serious economic crisis. You even dont have to go to China;you could get this kind of information;it is just impossible for a man who could write but he can not see and hear and is so blind.

To Tenzin:
you said:"I am sure lots of Chinese people would also like to settle in Iran and Iranian culture would be enriched by Chinese culture."
I am sorry but I have to say you are wrong.That is what The US would like to do not us.Do you know that it is preparing to use military action agaist Iran.If you dont know, go to the main page or call Washington DC to make sure that.

To all who want Tibet to be independent:
You only checked Tibet's history in 1950;have you checked the history in the past 900 years;how much do you know about the thousands of years'territory of China? If you say people in China are bewildered by the government, how about us overseas? We live in the same country with you guys; we enjoy the "democratic media freedom" with you guys and that is why we can say something to support China, of course, without being blocked by Chinese Government. But I can tell you that we overseas could use our own brain to judge the right and wrong without having to follow the Chinese government. but could you?

You mention the gathering worldwide as nationalism.Yes, it is . But it is the step taken after reasonable and cool consideration. and how about you? When Chinese constantly told you to go to China and Tibet, to find out the truth, why do you just ignore it?You have to find out the truth yourselves just like what we are doing now.I had lived in China for 20 years and I am minority Chinese, and I could not find any trace to prove the discrimination. Tibetan Chinese,if you are happy to let me say so, are minority Chinese as well.I think we can feel the same thing. Will you feel shocked when you get the news from CIA that "it's archived at CIA that to their shock and dismay, the Tibetan people helped the PLA to rapidly defeat the separatist guerrilla."
Dont be naive!Dont follow your government any more just like what we do!Dont trust the western and eastern medias any more for they are after all created and communicated by human beings!Human beings make mistakes, controlled by the governments!

If you think that people living in China or cuba or vietnam are ugly because we have different cultures and different social systems, you are already as ugly as we are.If you think you are going to save the world people from Islamic or communist countries, I gotta say you are too naive and just like the communist part wanted to do 30years ago.Notice here, it is 30 years ago. Are you developing or just going back to 30 years ago?!!!
Dont be your governments' stupid bulldogs.Do see the conspiracy behind the ugly performance.Do go to China and talk to those Tibetans who help PLA to calm the Riot.Do be analyze using your own brain.

For our generation, Dalai lama is a remotely man, this year he is 72 years old, like my grandfather, for a chinese at his age, he should be home, i don't know whether you understand or not, we have a very complicated felling to Dalai Lama, sometimes we want to show our respect to him, as an old man just like my grandfather, he deserve our respect, even sometimes we made some harsh comments on him, but we tend to think that point to his standpoint on Tibet.
I am han-Nationality, i have to admit that i gave little attention about Tibet in my common life until i went to college, where i have met some tibets and became friends with them and learn somethings about tibet, most of the tibets are happy with their life, they are getting better, even the speed is not as fast as in other cities in China, but you have to understand china is a large developing country, many Han-cities are need development too, but China Govement still put Tibet's development as priority.
The majoriry of tibets are living in China, but what you have heard is from those who have not been tibet for many years or never been there , Dalai lama said he just want the "autonomy" of Tibet, but does he ever ask or care about whether the people living in tibet want his "autonomy" or not? China is a large country with a long history,i still cann't fiuge out why should tibet have the same automany as Hongkong has, their history are very different and complicated, the success of Hongkong's "democracy" couldn't be simply applied to other places, and "democracy" is not omnipotent, look at American "democracy" in Philippine, democracy in Liberia founded by Afro-American,and how about democracy in Iraqi today?The west always think Tibet should have their autonomy and democracy, but have you ever care whether the people living in tibet want that, don't even mention the 1.3 billion chinese?why?because tibet have been developing very well during these years and china is also making progresses. How many crimes had been made under the name of "democracy"? Should china have the "democracy"? if the answer is yes, then we want to say it must be chinese "democracy",not the democracy imposed by some "democracy" countries, and when will we have it? the answer is when the time is for it and we are ready for it.Afro-American didn't have their vote right until 1965, and Switzerland women din't have their vote right until 1971, don't forget these two are developed countries, and China is still a developing country with a large population of 1.3 billion.

Chinese govement have many problems, we have to admit that, especially what happened in the tiananmen square in 1989, which has been used by west as evidence against chinese human right or demorcacy, i was four when that was happen, so i don't comment anything on that, but things had been gone for 20 years, the gold developing time for china and i am growing during the time, why couldn't we look forward? China had been invaded by many countries, Japan,British,France US,Germany and so on, how should chinese people view those countries, they are devil or pirates or they were because they are making progress?
If you are really care about Tibet people, especially those who living in Tibet, i suggest you go to tibet and then figure out what can you do for them.

Tom Johnstone

China too was feudal society even far more evil than Tibet. Chinese were so poor that sometimes they ate corpse. They bound women in 3 in golden boot.

There are so many like Micheal Parenti and others who make easy living by just dishing out the China's propaganda stuff as if there were scholars on Central History particularly Tibet and China.

Mandarin is imposed on Tibetan in Tibet. All government discourses, business and education is done through Mandarin.

Dalai Lama has prohibited Shugden worshiper from attending his teachings for a simple reason that - follower of the Shugden are very sectarian group which devalues the Buddha and encourage spirit worship for personal gains. They actions remind me of the Spanish inquisition.

Chinese invasion resulted in death of 1.2 million Tibetans from execution, starvation, tortures and suicide since 1950.

To Ling Lang Long, or whoever your name is:

You must be from the Middle Ages. Nothing valuable coming out of China you say? When was the last time you checked the label on your shirt or trousers? Oh, I forgot. You're probably wearing nothing but a fig leaf. Then again, let's hope it's not made in China!

Well, that depends on what the nation values. Is freedom from human rights violations, cultural invasion, etc more important than the economics?

Another issue, is that most of the well paying jobs go to the Han Chinese not the uneducated Tibetans, so I suppose their is also the question of whether or not the economic improvements have even benefited the Tibetans.

Also, historically speaking, Tibet has been able to have a flourishing society,but today, for reasons you mentioned it may be incredibly difficult.

Oh,and as I understand that treat was signed after the nation was invaded...that isn't exactly the most fair circumstances for agreement.

So my thought, it should be up to the Tibetans themselves to decide. How about a referendum in the country by people of the Tibetan(or mixed) ethniticity. I don't think it would be fair to include immigrants...as they are foreigners.

Good points and clear thinking.

to PEMA -- In history, countries get invaded, or invade others. Persia was runover by Greek/Macedonian Alexander, Arabs, Turkic Mongolians..... but it has its history and has kept its culture. If Tibet was "invaded" by China, the fact that the Tibetans surrendered to and signed a treaty with PRC, then it is just another piece of history...for the record. Can't change the past.

Japan also formally surrendered to USA in WWII, and the Emperor Hiro Hito formally surrendered to an American soldier on an American ship, and lived for 40 years or so after that. Treaties, surrenders, acceptance of cold facts are all part of history, which is the reality of the past!

Ali Ettefagh, Tehran

Why there is so much sectarian blood shed in Iraq. Why Iran want to keep its Persian culture and hate Arabs.

For your kind information Tibet is not small country like Kosovo, small fragment from Baltic. Tibet is country with 2.5 millions square KM of land with 6 million Tibetan people with recorded history of over 2000 years as an independent country.

Tibet ceased to exist when China occupied in 1950. I know most Islamic world have more inclination to China because of their similar regimes governed by dictators. No wonder China had field day when torch ran through Pakistan.

SimpleSimon: are you seriously suggesting that anything other than economics motivated the Chinese takeover of Tibet in the first place? It seems so absurdly naive to assume that ONLY the West looks at economic considerations. :) Notice how Mr. Ettefagh emphasizes the great railroad built by the Chinese. Do you and he actually believe that China built the railroad for the good of Tibet or was this an economic decision for the good of China? Is the West supposed to be the only part of the world with unselfish values while the Mid-East and China can trample human rights and go about pursuing it's economic goals with impunity?

Jiaming: The U.S. government had zero to do with supporting any demonstrations against China regarding Tibet so it hasn't lost anything. We aren't China. People express themselves freely whenever they wish and the press reports the real news - not the party line. That's why you could make a post here without worrying about whether you are following the "official" line.

Georgia: if you found Mr. Ettefagh's article insightful, maybe you should travel and read more. I've noted over the years that people outside what you would describe as the "ignorant" West know virtually little about the real values of the West and often of themselves. They are no less selfishly motivated or informed than the West and many times much more so because in those countries you only have to be concerned about what the government thinks.

TT: ditto for the comments for Georgia. I believe it's the silliest and most ignorant prejudice on earth that says that English-speaking people understand the world less than others who live under a government-controlled press à la China, Northern Korea, Iran, etc.. I don't believe that spoon feeding news to the population makes them wise or unselfish - quite the contrary.

Mr Ali,
Tibet is asking for genuine autonomy, not independence.

Economic considerations always trump democracy and freedom for the pompous Western leaders regardless of how much they trumpet democracy and freedom. It was the case when UK negotiated a separate deal with Tibetan government while assuring China that UK always considered Tibet a part of China in 1913. It is the case when UK sends a delegation of big diplomats to Beijing today. Having said that, cause of independence can only be sustained by Tibetans. If Tibetans truly want to keep their culture alive and flourishing, they are the ones who have to earn it with their blood against a mighty Communist China. While Buddhism abhors violence, only way for Tibetans to gain independence is through violence against a ruthless ruler, especially when that ruler in its claim over Tibet is supported by the whole world including so-called champions of freedom. Will Tibetans rise to the challenge? If they don’t, their culture and independent identity is destined to the dust bin of history, just like many before theirs.

Thank you for such an insightful article. It really helps me understand the complex nature of Tibet situation. What is also unique about the article is that it puts the Tibet issue in the large global context. Very well written. That is WHY I like Washington Post much more than the NY Times.

This story pushed by exiled Tibetans reminds me of Cuban exiles in Miami (relatively few) that are still trying to get back to 1950s in Cuba......

This ugly Tibet episode is clearly a total loss for the United States. The Americans had badly underestimated the Chinese people this time. To try to break up a country or stir up internal chaos is an evil act, no matter if it is a small country like Serbia or a large country like China. Such agression is no different than the blatan invasion of Iraq with no justification. It is part of a troubling pattern of behaviors by the US since George W. Bush took office. Now, the US has finally succeeded in uniting virtuall every single Chinese in pursuit of theit national interests, this is probably a bigger failure than Iraq.

Reasonable and cool headed. Thanks.

It is amazing how people from the English speaking world have a strong opinion about China but know very little about the place. Thousand years of history cannot be summarized in a 90 second "news" item on CNN, which is the American equivalent of TASS from USSR.

Let's simplify the matter: What if Alaska decides to break away from USA. Is that possible? What if it decides to go and unite with Russia?

It is time for countries to mind their own business.

It seems to my simple mind that there are some serious problems in Chinese controlled Tibet and the free press has reported as much and nothing else. I believe that there are people in the West and the East who are seriously concerned about the plight of Tibetans as well as other peoples in the world who are regularly disregarded and trampled on for the sanctity of I guess what Mr. Ettefagh would call "legitimate states". These people have protested. So what? In turn, those who decry a free press or those press outlets either controlled by China or who have vested interests in China are outraged by the truth.

Add to the mix an immature nationalistic Chinese population that wouldn't know a free press if it hit them in the face and you have lots of noise but not much else.

I believe that people anywhere in the world have the right to question the oppressive behavior of the Chinese in all 3 of their conquerored provinces and doing that during the Olympics is perfectly fine. Have your demonstrations and make your point. That's permitted in free societies and in societies where people aspire to be free. However, I question attacking the Olympic flame because I believe that it represents a kind of hope for the world - not for China necessarily.

Contrary to much of the noise coming out of China I believe that most Western people are pleased to see the Olympics in China and wish them well with the games. There is a hope that exposure to peoples and events outside of China will help them get over their paranoia and help integrate them into the rest of the world.

But China doesn't need a blank check or to be absolved from all criticism (e.g. the recent arms shipment to Mugabe) in order to have the games. There has always been a political edge to the games and in reality the Chinese government understands that very well. If they can have the games, they should be able to take the heat.

As for Mr. Ettefagh's absurd statement about the legitimacy of the religious Tibetan agreement authorizing the Chinese takeover, just consider where he comes from. Note as well that most of those "failed states" are close to Iran. Is he suggesting that they all be assumed by Iran so they can participate in that great social experience. :) Yes, there is still humor in the world and not always intentionally.

CHINA ACCEPTED THE OLYMPICS ON THE CONDITION THAT IT WOULD CLEAN UP THE HUMAN RIGHTS ABUSES IN CHINA. THIS IS A BREAK OF CONTACT.

what's a break of contract,what's human rights abuse? Do you think those violences to civilans in Tibeta are human rights? Do you think chinese goverment should sit doing nothing when so many people were facing with the threaten of death?
I agree that china is still not perfect in human rights but what about western countries,are there any countries without human rights problems?If you know the Tibetan history,you will realize that there are no any human rights under govering of Dalai Lama.The happiness of 1% Dalai clique was built on the base of the 99% slaves' miserable.It is shame on western media to attack chinese using Olympics as a tool.

Great article and reasonable points.

The more lies from "Free Tibet", the more money they made.

Biased news reported by Western media (such as CNN and BBC), is just as state-run as the West accuses of China's media.

Tibet is an inalienable part of China. The West is just angry and jealous of China that they cannot own Tibet. Every Chinese knows that the West is out there to use Tibet against China. Too bad this western lame game isn't going to succeed and is set to fail.

I pity white folks, very badly, for their inability to compete with China. White folks are irresponsible and childish - always pointing fingers and blaming others for their own problems.

GROW UP!

Well, what can we expect? White people have been brainwashed by their government for centuries that governments have done the world good, when in fact, it's also their governments that colonized, destroyed, and pillaged ancient civilizations. How about let's get a lecture on Iraq independence? Restore the old Africa to the Africans after western colonialism? Free the Palestinians from Israel's control? End racism against minorities in America? How come I don't see any Westerners protesting any of these concerns?

Hypocrisy runs deep in the West. When I see West accuse China of these SAME violations, I see nothing but a way for the West to divert public's attention away from its sins.

Shame on the West. All white people need to be ashamed of their government. What a bunch of white thugs and goons.

Where are the so-called "Human Rights" demonstrators when U.S. police fired 50-shots to kill African-American Sean Bell in New York? Are African-Americans less human than Tibetans? Why there's no international protests for the human rights of African-Americans in the U.S.???

It's awfully quiet in the U.S. corporate media on domestic human rights violations against African-Americans. At the same time, the corporate media is jumping all over the Tibetan human rights.

Where are the French protests for African-American human rights? Where are the British protests for African-American human rights? Where are the international protests for African-American human rights? Where are human rights demonstrators that we see protesting for Tibet? Why won't these so-called human rights demonstrators do the same for African-Americans???

I know hypocrisy when I see it.

It's about time we see some unbiased comments.

I really agree of what you said.
If really Tibet independent, what could they do for people?
Most of our media are support Tibet,against China. Many people just believe everything that told on TV.
We never been Tibet Never been China? How should we talk about human right in China or Tibet.

Interesting. Right now, these small countries cannot afford many mondern things because they have a small market and investments needed are very high and complex. They also do not have the needed personnel.
The second issue is what will happen to "minority Chinese" (non-Tibetans) in an independent Tibet? Will they suffer like Serbs in Kosovo or Armenians in Azerbaijan (or Turkey)?

What an incredible and cynical claim from Mr. Ettefagh -- that Tibetans "signed a treaty" with China "agreeing to be a part of that country".

By that same token, my country, Estonia signed its own death warrant in 1940 when Stalin orchestrated a coup there.

Fortunately the Western world never recognized the annexation of Esonia into the USSR and today Estonia is a prosperous and free nation.

As for the railway, the whole point is that Tibetans would never have wanted such a piece of industrial and colonial infrastructure in their country.

The article is interesting and has exposed the lack of education by many readers that have highly polluted minds due to TV journalism in the English speaking world. Their attacks on the writer, rather than debating the subject show it.

Second, for those that talk about Iran, they seem to have no clue that Iran, formerly Persia, is one of the ancient civilisations in the world and a patchwork of ethnic groups living in the same country.

Thirdly, the writer is correct about first having a good look at these nation states. Which ones have been successful for the last two centuries....? In Europe, the people that were killing eachother only 65 years ago are now sittind down around a table, removing borders, unifying their currency and laws and taxes and information. That is a lesson for the rest of the world.

BOB-
You are taking shots here. Tell me, are you Chinese of Tibetan (or just another useless American that has no passport)? In fact, most atheletes in the Olympics, even Americans, come from small towns and modest backgrounds. But again, you probably think those Cuban exiles in Miami are right and the Castro regime is a temporary thing......did you re-elect Bush?

Why I am not allowed to talk about the 'blood for oil' war? Why my comment is not allowed?Should we care the 1 in 3 innocent people who died or wounded in Iraq?Where is the human rights there?Is that why you attack Iran?Next 'blood for oil' victom?Please learn to respect other countries.
Your media ,stop fooling your peace and let them know the truth of the rest (3/4)of world.
USA,EU have the worst human rights record in the world!So do not point at other countries's business.

I must say that this article is objective.China welcome friendly crititisms but not deliberate demonisation.Those who talk about 'free Tibet' don't even know Tibet's history.The most important 95% Tibetans are happy and enjoy to be Chinese.So why only listen to what 5% of slave masters or terrorats say?Don't those 95% tibetans have human rights too?I can't say Dalai is good or not but what he did proves that he is truely a dog of America.Honestely my tibetan friends don't really support Dalai .There are 6 major religion branches of Tibet Buddhism.Dalai and Ban Chan (who is in China)only represent one of them . Tibetan's living standard is now higher than average Chinese.Chinese government has invested heavily to improve the tibet's economy while all the tibet province's income pays no tax so tibet keeps all.Tibetan can have as many children as they like and they don't pay any education fee including universities.Tibetan students have reduced enrolling scores for the universities. More than 70,000 people ,most of them are Han Chinese helped Tibet to build the latest railway express
with 704 people died due to the tibet's harsh weather and high altitude. Tibetan and other 55 Chinese ethnic groups get on very well.For us we are all sisters and brothers.I also have Chinese muslim friends.When I am with my minority friends ,I don't feel there is any gap between each other.Although han chinese sometime do envy the minority have a lot of previliges that we don't have.But we support the government's minority policy .Recently when I read some western people's comments or articles ,I feel really amused that Chinese seem already to be in 21st century while the west still live in 1960s .They say we are brainwashed or we work for the government when we say we love our government.This is really funny because they will be shock to realise that above 99% Chinese support their government wholeheartedly including me who live in UK for more than 10 years.This government is the best ever we had in our history.We all know China is not perfect but this government has done a great deal to improve it .The priciple of ruling China now is 'base on human 'which means to protect the vulnerable and to respect human rights.China is correcting its mistake in an astornishing speed.I used to criticise China a lot now I am very happy that China is treating Chinese fairly .I used to be a democracy fan and was one of the 1989 protesters but after hearing those fake news and so-called 'crackdown' tibet'peaceful' protest from west media I realise how wrong I was.
Those liar media proved 'free tibet 'is an ugly plot against China.That is why they put the pictures of Nepal police beating lamas on the news to say it is Chinese police.That is why they say Chinese ambulance car is a military car to transport dead bodies.For those media ,peaceful protest=killing innocent civilians. Goodbye CNN!Goodbye BBC!Goodbye other 'fair' western media!Goodbye 'democracy'!Goodbye your so-called 'human rights'！

Nothing beats these articles and especially the comments for entertainment and just plain humor. In one respect, the Chinese certainly are world-class. They have a world-beating inferiority complex. And the notion of an Iranian commenting on the political probity of China smothering Tibet: Hilarious. I especially enjoyed the comment that the athletes are from "small towns with modest backgrounds, with little exposure to the rest of the world or opaque political agitations in foreign lands . . ." Which athletes was he referring to? The ones from Cuba perhaps? Or maybe China and Iran? Still, one can understand China's nervousness about the situation. A glance at the map reveals that Tibet and Xinjiang, another "ungrateful" province, make up about a third of the area of China. Modernity is likely to prove to be a double-edged sword for their unappreciated overlords.

I think Chinese should get over with the CNN and France chain store things. CNN has customers happy to see China bashing and CNN like many other media are run by bosses with anti-China agenda. So they are just happy following on. What China or Chinese can do is to kick CNN out of China forever. Also remember that free democracy media DOES NOT mean always truthfulness or unbiased. So, China should be prepared for that. What China should do is to concentrate on doing what they are doing well now, i.e. continuing development, continuing improvement of living standard, and continuing improvement on openness and transparency. Most importantly, China should stop IP and Artist Right piracies. That is where West is justifiably angry at China. These efforts are the best answer for unfair criticism. Why boycott the game when only peoples getting hurt are those athletes and why boycott the stores where most are made by Chinese themselves. As for the anti-China proxy DalaiLama/followers, China should out rightly rule out any negotiation and ask their supporters and financers to bring out the best they can. If Chinese government start to negotiate with DL and violence instigating and lying followers, Chinese government will have real issues of potential uproars from Chinese.

sadly,the 3.14 protest is not peaceful. It's understandable if you mistrust Chinese media, but video records/blogs by some of the western tourists stuck there as the riot broke out can clearly show you that a violent mob (I'd venture to say they are not true Tibetan monks.But God knows.)burned and looted shops, toppled over cars and attacked innocent civilians who are either ethnic Han or ethnic Muslim people.Just do a bit research and you'll see the full scale of the violence involved this time. If you see it this way,it's easier to understand why so many Chinese are not happy, especially given the fact western media ignored this very fact and keep ranting about the crackdown.even bad they MAKE news as Hollywood does.

Just imagine if a mob start looting and burning shops and attacking passers-by in Washington/Manhanton/London/anywhere with the rule of law,would the authority not act?And mind you the chinese government practiced a considerable degree of restraint this time, asking looters just to surrender themselves.

In addition, with all due respect to Dalai Lama,I do believe these violences have some sort of pre-meditation,not necessarily by the Lama himself,but most likely by OTHER groups.The timing is just too good and they certainly know how to garner attention.One week before Taiwan election and olympic year.
I would seriously appreciate if any western media would mind interviewing some of the tourists that were there,just to clarify matters,and preferably interview some Western Tibet experts(No chinese and no Tibetans)so more people can be enlightened on the historical and political side of the story.

What do you want from us?
When we were called "sick man of Asia”, we were called peril.!
When we billed to be the next superpower, we're called the threat
When we closed our doors, you smuggled drugs to open markets.
when we embrace free trade, you blame us for taking away your jobs

It is often assumed that different cultures, ethnic groups etc should not co-exist in one country, rather, they should split into many countries, one for each group. This is wrong. Different cultures should interact, different races should mix. Then something better will come out. This is how evolution goes. This is why the tremendous diversity in US is a strength. This is why freedom of speech, enabling different ideas to interact, make a country better. Therefore, suggestion that Tibetan should get a country of their own because Tibetan culture is different is from that of Han is wrong. We should get some Tibetans to US to increase the diversity of the gene pool in US.

Independent Tibet Would Mean More Suffering-
SINCE THE 1970'S THE TIBETAN GOVERNMENT IN EXILE HAS BEEN SEEKING AUTONOMY, NOT INDEPENDENCE.

Olympics and the World Cup, are about contact between people of different countries on commonly agreed rules-
CHINA ACCEPTED THE OLYMPICS ON THE CONDITION THAT IT WOULD CLEAN UP THE HUMAN RIGHTS ABUSES IN CHINA. THIS IS A BREAK OF CONTRACT.

The topic of Tibet and China is essentially a domestic issue in China. Many forget that the Tibetan (religious) leadership signed a treaty with the People’s Republic of China agreeing to be part of that country. -
THIS WAS SIGNED UNDER A HEAVY MILITARY PRESENCE IN THE COUNTRY, A CONTRACT SIGNED UNDER DURESS IS NOT A VALID AGREEMENT.

The latest railway development into Tibet, a unique piece of engineering at elevations of more than 4500 meters from sea level (about half the cruising altitude of airplanes), has connected Lhasa to the rest of the country. Could an independent Tibet afford such investment?-
THIS IS USED TO MOVE LARGE NUMBERS OF HAN CHINESE INTO THE TIBETAN REGION, THUS DILUTING THE NUMBER OF PEOPLE WHO CONSIDER THEMSELVES TIBETAN.

The Tibet region has taken no visible steps to build on its autonomy, for the fact is that autonomy and independence is first about daily economic realities-
PRIOR TO THE INVASION OF TIBET OTHER COUNTRIES (GREAT BRITAN ETC) RECOGNISED TIBET AS AN INDEPENDENT COUNTRY AND INTERACTED WITH IT ON THIS BASIS.

Sorry but this ‘article’ barely merits a response, for to dignify this superficial, incoherent and frankly an insult to anyone’s intelligence tripe would just boost the ego of the scribe. Who surely has not the least grasp on the issues and takes his cues from the most depraved, and most would say deranged, cabal ever to commit the most heinous crimes in human history, the Han Chinese Communists.
And continues to do so today in the 21st century – and the year this cabal is allowed to host the Olympics, symbol of ……. etc.
The Chinese were the first to politicize the event. and their attempt to milk it for all the political mileage they thought they could gain has backfired, and rightly so.

The 17 Point Agreement was signed under duress and has absolutely no legal basis.
The Han Chinese Communists had already occupied about half of Tibet when this piece of verbal insult was ‘signed’, at the point of a gun at the delegation’s head, and with the threat of further violence.
The delegation had no authority to sign, and the signing was immediately rescinded by the Tibetan Government once it was known what happened.
Every expert legal opinion has found that Tibet is an Illegally Occupied Country and that the 17PA is illegal.
And frankly to run this piece of gutter journalism is more a reflection on the web site here and its complete lack of any (moral) standards.

Too much hatred, too much boastful word, too much gabbage. Since the Dalai Lama and CIA are hell bent trying to damage the image of China, why should China give way. Why should China need to talk Dalai Lama. So why care. Let Dalai Lama and his cohorts die in vain in India.

No Way,

You are as informed as someone in China believing the mob still runs Chicago and you're as good as a corpse if you live in a city and go out after dark.

The Chinese are pouring billions into Tibet, not making $$$ out of it. Tibetan's trouble started when the West stepped in--the British invaded in the beginning of the last century, incited rebellion after failing to control it, and tried to claim it at the end of WWII (Churchill's attempt was turned on its head by none but Roosevelt).

Go visit China, talk to real people there, learn the history. Don't make the world hate us more with this ignorance and moral high horse.

Good one Tenzin!
Bear in mind that ethnic Iranians are only about 45% of the population of Iran. The current trend of minority groups establishing break-away nations is extremely worrisome to the dominant ethnic groups of multi-ethnic empires like the ethnic Iranians of Iran.
Dr. Ettefagh is only expressing the common feeling of ethnic Iranians when presented with the issue of break-away republics - fear. Fear of lost power. Fear of lost wealth. Fear of lost status. Fear of lost influence in the world. Fear of new, potentially hostile (duh), neighbors.
Nothing to see here, move along now, heh.

It's archived at CIA that to their shock and dismay, the Tibetan people helped the PLA to rapidly defeat the separatist guerrilla,.
The lamas in the monasteries are about the only people in Tibet who want to turn back the clock--they used to own the land and the serfs, now they are financially supported by the government since the locals are done with them.

Read Wikipedia, read scholarly works with references and quotes. As Google puts it, the Internet will make it really hard for the crooks.

It's not a domestic issue for China any more than the genocide in Darfur. Tibet was colonized by China in 1950; the West should have stepped in then. Now we see the mineral wealth, the clean water wealth, and the tourism wealth, not to mention the great wealth of wisdom and culture coming out of Tibet--all of it being $$$ in the pockets of the CCP. Except that is for the cultural and physical genocide of Tibetans, which is another kind of wealth--more still-pulsing fresh organs of political prisoners to be sold on the world black market. Indeed, now the prisoners are murdered on demand so the hospital client can have the freshest organ possible.

Then there's this:

http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/story/0,22049,23591375-5001021,00.html?from=public_rss

It was refreshing to read a sensible article that isn't demonising China as most of the Western world's media has been doing in recent days. Tibet was a theocracy when the Dalai Lama and Panchen Lama signed the treaty. Tibet at this time was a feudal theocracy in which 95% of the people were serfs or slaves who owned nothing and had a life expectancy of only 35. Lamas and noblemen owned all the land and the slaves and punishments were very cruel including the gouging out of eyes and amputation of hands. The Dalai Lama himself had 2000 slaves (Parenti 'Friendly Feudalism the Tibet Myth'). Several writers (eg Myth and Reality
by Foster Stockwell) state that five years after the treaty was signed there was a CIA backed armed revolt in Tibet supported by the Dalai Lama but not by the Panchen Lama. Now in Tibet the people no longer go hungry, they have possessions, education, freedom to worship and jobs. Tibetan is still the main language and their culture and traditions are still strong which are good selling point for tourists.

As for the Dalai Lama and his democratic government in exile they have been accused in a letter to the Indian Government(1996) of religious persecution after they banned another Buddhist sect from using Dorje Shugden as their oracle even though they had been doing so for hundreds of years. The Dorje Shugden monks have marched in protest against the dalai Lama complaining of beatings and death threats.

In the article 'Tibet a Reality Check' by N. Ram (2000) it states that the Dalai Lama and his government in exile run a huge worldwide propaganda machine making baseless claims of a Chinese invasion of Tibet and genocide of 1 million Tibetans. These claims fuel the 'free Tibet' campaign that is calling for the freedom of
a Tibet which according to their maps is twice the size of the Tibet ruled by the Dalai Lama (and the Tibet in an atlas)and includes provinces of China.
Additionally the US government changed its definition of Tibet so that when it refered to Tibet it meant this new larger Tibet. I think Ali Ettefah is right to express concern over any attempts to break China up. It would not be for the benefit of the Tibetans living in Tibet it would be for the benefit of the former Tibetan noblemen and Lamas who want to restore their theocracy and the Western governments that back them.

Tibetans will decide their future whether it is of a suffering claimed you are another scenorio, it had to be seen.

Regarding Olympics and politics, you need to study the past history of olympic relation with politics, more importantly, how Chinese government themselves is in the first place as a frontman to politicize Olympics with Politics and olympics committe submitted to that action.

Regarding the treat of Tibet being part of China, if I am not wrong, you are referring to the 1951 17 point agreement which was signed by Tibetan representatives under duress in Beijing. Morever,Chinese government themselves flushed the conditions into toilet when violent killing and massacre spread onto Tibetan people, so that agreement is became "NULL" and "VOID" and Tibetan Government stated to that fact.

Again, it is upto Tibetan people's wish as a nation and people to "FREE FROM CHINA".

Palden

To clarify--

The truly shameful here are those radical overseas Tibetans, often the offspring of the former slave owners driven out of Tibet by Mao's army, who have never been to Tibet, know few real Tibetans in Tibet, have zero concerns on the majority's wellbeing, and only care about their own political power.

-----------
In addition--

What's amazing is how the Westerners bought into this peaceful -paradise-overrun-by-evil-communists story and rallied behind those who lost their paradise of serfdom and theocracy, which was hell for the majority of Tibetans, even after the chairman of the Tibetan Youth Congress openly advocated suicide bombing as the most cost-effective way to bring attention.

One bin Laden is already too many!

The Dalai Lama makes it very clear that he doesn't believe the Tibetan people would have a better life separated from China. He views the EU as a the historic trend for peoples to join hands and work together for economic progress and wellbeing.

The truly shameful here are those radical overseas Tibetans, often the offspring of the former slave owners driven out of Tibet by Mao's army, who have never been to Tibet, know few real Tibetans in Tibet, have zero concerns on their wellbeing, and only care about their political power.

Tenzin, are you one of those?

When the author try to make sense with the Tibet issue, some peoples like Tenzin and Anita just couldn't think straight. They acted real childish with their ludicrous comments. The subject issue is Tibet and not Iran. Get real and be positive.

Out of the blue, there is at least some sensible people who is willing to use logical reasoning to tell us what needs to be done to help the common Tibetans. There is too much emotions and unnecessary rhetorics being thrown around with the exile Dalai Lama the main culprit for flaming up the tension. Whatever compassion pretended by Dalai Lama is not in line with Buddhist teaching when he keep pushing his luck without considering the position of the Chinese and the world community at large.

I agree with Tenzin, but Hey, why stop with Iran! Lets just all give up hope of sovereignty and personal freedoms and just give in to the PRC now as Dr Ali suggets.

One could argue with Dr Ali who says it is more difficult to run a country than is portrayed in the movies, but I think he is perhaps correct, atleast I think so! I am really too busy watching MTV however to really pay attention.

The last time I did I noticed that we gave the PRC entrance into the WTO and awarded them the Olympics. How did the PRC respond? By opening fire on Tibetans. But hey according to Dr Ali, atleast they were a part of something greater!

Dr Ali, from what university did you earn your "doctor ship"? In all due respect, even somebody with very little understanding, understand that you are not really well versed in your topic.

I totally agree, why don't Iran give up their independence and become a part of China?

After all, Iran would be much more prosperous, and they would enjoy lots of subsidies and infrastructure investments (railroad from Beijing to Teheran). I am sure lots of Chinese people would also like to settle in Iran and Iranian culture would be enriched by Chinese culture.

This would be a poke in the eye to those western imperialists!