Va. Pastor Leading Cult or Culture?

"" "What started out as a Christian organization has turned into a cult where people are controlled," Jonathan Ernst, a former Calvary pastor, told Boorstein.""

What else is new, this is a suprise???

The church business seems like a winner. No taxes, apparently beyond the reach of the RICO laws, and with 46 percent of the nation a ready market that is very controllable.

Great way to get control and power, churchs are the ultimate in cults.

OBVIOUSLY a CULT. Scott is obviously a self-serving con-man.

The problem with contemporary evangelical christianity is a REFUSAL of the church to criticize anyone who "claims Christ". In fact, evangelicals RALLY around criminals who expose their hypocrisy.

The mega churches are led by men making 7 figures,
...But the bible says you "cannot serve both God and mammon".

One day before the thirtieth year anniversary of the Jonestown massacre, where a cult leader caused a thousand people who killed themselves or others, makes this expose on a cult timely.

This wolf didn't even bother to put on his sheep's clothing. A racing ministry? An automotive outreach? ROTLMAO!!!! There should be a law against establishing church memberships completely with special ed kids. It's nothing short of abuse.

Power corrupts. There were obviously no checks or balances built into Cavalry Temple's governing structure. Even in the Book of Acts, ALL the disciples and church elders would convene if there was a difficult issue to solve. It wasn't just Peter issuing edicts all by himself. I'm sure this dude started out well, but any church that claims to have "apostles" today is already headed down the path towards Looneyville. Absolute power corrupts absolutely.

what exactly is the difference between a religion and a cult?

The unquestioning faith of the believers? same.
The casting out of apostates ... the suppression of dissent ... the punishment for blasphemy ... the fleecing of the flock for money ... all the same.

I suppose it really comes down to the numbers - the more believers you can count, the less likely it will be called a cult.

Nothing else is different.

Many churches are not cults; the organization described above is obviously a cult. I can understand how this is a tempting outlier to use as straw man evidence against a vast cornucopia of churches, pastors, and Christians. This is just as has been done with thousands of other sad stories.

It is truly heartbreaking when people have horrible and negative experiences interacting with so called 'churches', 'pastors', or 'Christians' and then incorrectly assume all churches, pastors, and Christians are the same.

Who is honest? Who is pure? What can never be muddied or stained? Is such a thing a mere fantasy? Is it just a thought experiment?

I would choose to walk forever trying to reach the unattainable,
the clean, the pure, the holy one.
Rather than accept the cold, hard facts of life
and sit-down in a patch of muck that seems a little cleaner than most,
to ridicule those continuing on in the quest.

I don’t expect I’ll ever find that clean, pure, holy one.
But, just maybe; He will find me.

Calling a congregation a cult vilifies the people being duped rather than the charlatan pulling the wool over their eyes. It serves no useful purpose. We seem to ascribe magical properties to the word cult when what we have here is plain, old fashioned greed.

To Catsndogs: I don't the word vilifies the people in the congregation. They need to know the truth. Obviously, what they believe to be the truth is whatever the good Rev. Scott tells them is the truth. When you have an abusive pastor, who claims to have ultimate authority over everything in the church, who claims to be docrinally infallible, who coerces members to fork over their hard-earned money for his own benefit, who threatens excommunication to apostate members or anyone who takes a position contrary to him, and does so without any checks and balances, you have a cult on your hand. Worse, the people by remaining in that awful church are showing their compliance with his teachings.

Jesus said, "Not everyone who says, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of God." I can't put myself in God's place, but I fear that Rev. Scott and his flock may be in for a rude awakening come Judgement Day.

Definitions of "cult" is arbitrary. Small religious groups tend to be labeled cults.
.
That being said, many religious groups, particularly those headed by a charismatic leader, can be dangerous (See www.rickross.com for a comprehensive list).
.
As with anything else, buyer beware.

The problem with most people who attend church, is that they do not study the Bible for themselves. These same people usually show up for church and every Sunday and listen to their pastor preach a sermon based on one or two verses from the Bible. They do so, because it is part of their weekly ritual.

These Bible verses can easily be preached and/or taught in a way that is mis-leading, or misconstrued in some way by the pastor/teacher because of few of the reasons below:

The pastor/teacher knows that most of the people in their congregation are not studying the Word for themselves.

If the people in the congregation are not studying the Word of God for themselves, then they cannot challenge what is being said, and will most likely be manipulated, deceived, and led astray like dumb sheep.

Who is in charge of mixing the grape drink? Why does this remind me of Jim Jones and the Peoples’ Temple? Why are Scott’s tactics so reminiscent of Karl Rove’s slash and burn victimizing of minorities for power? This reads like something out of Charles Dickens with a generous portion of Big Brother and a whole lot of maschochistic sexual overtones. It’s amazing to me that in this day and age people would give up their own Self and follow a pervert like this one. The congregation should rise up and *shun* this so-called pastor and heave him out the door.

David Waters wrote "That Scott is using Biblical prophets for personal profit doesn't surprise me. That 400 people are still following him does surprise me. "

True, but much MORE SURPRISING is the billions of people and millions more who follow false religions like Catholicism, liberal Protestantism (pro-abortion and gay marriage) and "scientists" with its billions of folowers which believe that a mosquito can fly and seek its own food for fuel WITHOUT ANY INTELLIGENT HELP.

THIS IS A DUMB WORLD AND BECAUSE OF ITS STUPIDITY, IT IS BURNING SOON.

Spidermean - Well, it's attitudes like yours that isn't helping Christianity either when you put down the Catholic church and "liberal Protestant" churches... Oh and you go to the perfect church? There is no perfect church. Where's the humility and compassion in Christianity these days? Many only whine about gays and abortion when Jesus never mentioned either. How about talking about poverty? That's something he did talk about. And I wonder how much this fake pastor has given to the poor (instead of keeping it all for himself).

You should really get to know a person before you cast judgments from something a few discontented & bitter people said. Not all of what you read and hear is true.

....... 'nuf said

It's sad enough that these poor people have such a terrible need to belong to something that they will let themselves by gulled, bilked, and brainwashed.

It's even sadder that this con-man who calls himself a minister (and should be roundly denounced from every pulpit in the land, if not arrested) can't find any better way to spend his stolen pelf than on fancy motorcycles and pimpmobiles.

It recalls Tammy Fay Bakker and the gold-plated faucets in the bathroom. And the myth of King Midas.

I find this so laughable for a number of reasons, here are a few:

Every religion is a cult to anyone that does not believe in that religion, pretty simple isn't? For those of us who have no religion, we view all of the various forms of faith as a cult. See definition at the bottom of this post.

In our society what a small group of people believe is a "cult" until you reach some critical mass of believers. At one time in history all Christians were considered to be part of a cult.

The author fails to tell you that the Calvary Temple is Pentecostal, and possibly Third Wave, this church is part of a network (many different churches, same teachings). Pentecostal/Third Wave teachings are surging and "mainstream" Christians don't like it. Neither should you! Google Third Wave and Joel's Army to understand why.

Interestingly, Pentecostal Churches are condemned by nearly all other Christian churches as a cult. On the flip side the Pentecostals consider all other forms of Christian faith to be cults.

Sarah Palin belongs to a Pentecostal/Third Wave church, not once have I seen the MSM really cover that. Oh wait, she changed churches before her run for governor, move along, nothing to see here... Pentecostal folks believe the "end times" are coming in their lifetimes and that they are given powers to do special things by God. They believe in the literal word of the bible. They believe in witchcraft. On the flip side, most Christians believe you can be possessed by the devil (but a priest can exorcise it), the saved will be bodily lifted to heaven at the "rapture", tithing can save your soul and bring you great wealth (Pat Robertson is famous for this one, he runs a cult too). I could go on but you can find this stuff out yourself.

Definition of cult (Websters):
1: formal religious veneration : worship
2: a system of religious beliefs and ritual ; also : its body of adherents
3: a religion regarded as unorthodox or spurious ; also : its body of adherents
4: a system for the cure of disease based on dogma set forth by its promulgator
5 a: great devotion to a person, idea, object, movement, or work (as a film or book) ; especially : such devotion regarded as a literary or intellectual fad b: the object of such devotion c: a usually small group of people characterized by such devotion

Now if you'll excuse me I need to dance under the moon with happiness that Sarah Palin will not have our nuclear codes!

Not sure that this church qualifies as a cult, but the congregants certainly need to reconsider Scott. His actions are appalling. Sounds more like a megalomaniac than a pastor...

One of the hallmarks of a cult is the effort to isolate the believers from outside influences, even if family members. This church definitely meets that criterion so should be considered for cult status.

Godsdaughter - Actually, it's not "nuff said", because for some reason I still care about Christianity which is why I find it such a shame that many are leaving churches in droves these days (I know quite a handful) because they aren't seeing much of Jesus in the church - the Jesus of humility and compassion. Many who claim to be "born again" lying to wear it loudly on their sleeves and not really living it. There are true Christians out there, but they are truly the humble, the meek and the kind... Not "I am God's child and you're not" types.

Everyone needs to learn how to interpret the bible for themselves.

Don't go to church! He gave you a brain, use it!

I think there is a huge difference between belonging to a religion and worshiping something vs. belonging to a cult.

First of all, we all worship something, whether we care to admit it or not. Some worship Jehovah, others Allah, and yet others worship the quick buck or the next one night stand. We all base our lives on something; we just don't always realize that something is the object of our worship.

The difference with a cult is the power that lies within it. I'm a Christian (Protestant, if you care to know), but I attend a church that is run by elders that the membership selects. I believe that a pastor-led church opens up way too many doors for power and control, and I've seen it happen in churches, although thankfully none I've attended.

In our church, no one person in the church is above the rest. Our pastors know that they are subject to the elders, who themselves are subject to the congregation. Our church membership makes the big decisions, especially financially, and more than once I've seen pastors leave or be asked to leave.

I know the quote is extremely overused, but you know as well as I do that "power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely". Onestring is right - you can't serve both God and man, and having the church under the leadership of one man means that the church most likely isn't serving God.

Regardless of whether every congregant-led church is truly following the will of God, at least with this type of church, there is a much better chance you are not serving man. Are there congregation-led churches that are cults? Probably, but you won't find nearly as much.

The way I understand it, Chritianity started as nothing more than a small cult within Judaism. So if you can tell me the definition of a cult, then I can address your question. Is it a matter of size? Scientology is fairly large and yet many consider it a cult. Ditto with Mormonism. So please what is a cult? In some sense, all religious groups are cults. Remember Jim Jones? He, too, cited the bible often.

godsdaughter_tried_n_true Author Profile Page:

You should really get to know a person before you cast judgments from something a few discontented & bitter people said. Not all of what you read and hear is true.

....... 'nuf said

################################################

Well, I don't really know Osama bin Laden, so I guess that I shouldn't believe what a few bitter and discontented people say about him either!

One of the hallmarks of a cult is the effort to isolate the believers from outside influences, even if family members. This church definitely meets that criterion so should be considered for cult status.

###############################################

One of the marks of a Christian cult is that it eventually renounces the Bible itself. That is what happened in Jonestown.

If you read the Apostle Paul, he tells people to shun people who are performing evil acts, not people who aren't Christian. He specifically instructs new Christians not to shun their non-Christian spouses.

Steviana, the difference is the amount of control exerted over parishoners. Early Christians did not shun those who choose to leave the church. Mormons (at least not mainstream) do not cut off contact between parents and their children. Most religions allow people to leave at will.

Citing the Bible does not make a cult and believing in the ministry does not make a cult. Jim Jones displayed many of the same actions that Star Scott does. That should be bothersome.

This crazy church is in Sterling,Virginia, right in the middle of one of the bedroom communities of thousands of military-industrialist employees, not to mention members of the armed forces.

How many of his 400 have access to top secret information?

McG

Something else, too. 400 people can't afford to maintain a church building that large unless they're giving more than 10 or even 35 percent. The Sterling building is the HQ of a worldwide mission. The franchises are listed on his website.

The Abrahamic religions are all cults, so this is not news. It's disgusting, enriching oneself by deluding followers, and it's not unusual especially in christianity, but it's not news.

steviana...

Christianity was not a cult, but was a Jewish sect. Sects break off from "parent" bodies due to new teachings, new revelations, or disagreements over teaching. Cults form as new religious movements without any explicit organizational predecessors. While some argue the Amish communities are cults, they are really just Christian sects as having broken off from previous Christian denominations.

With this said, at this point it would be hard to academically define the church in the article as a cult. It can certainly turn that way if it completely abandons its Christian roots (i.e., by replacing the Bible with some other text).

AlexaK wrote " Oh and you go to the perfect church? There is no perfect church. Where's the humility and compassion in Christianity these days? Many only whine about gays and abortion when Jesus never mentioned either."

There may not be a perfect church but churches have a guide like this verse:

"Likewise, their men have given up natural sexual relations with women and burn with lust for each other. Men commit indecent acts with men, so they experience among themselves the punishment they deserve for their perversion." (Romans 1:27).

That should be easy to understand but people like it better to PLAY BLIND and DEAF.

"First of all, we all worship something, whether we care to admit it or not. Some worship Jehovah, others Allah, and yet others worship the quick buck or the next one night stand. We all base our lives on something; we just don't always realize that something is the object of our worship."

You are mistaken. Many respectful and intelligent people choose not to"worship" anything. And it is insulting of you to suggest that those who do not worship your designated religions are assumed to "worship the quick buck or the next one night stand."

Most non-religious people are just as moral and ethical as the standard to which you assume religious people adhere, and in some cases more so.

PostFan2 wrote " Many respectful and intelligent people choose not to"worship" anything."

That is what they think when actually they worship a DIFFERENT god called STUPIDITY. Consider evolution. To say that there is no intelligent design involved when almost all creatures are so intelligently made like roses with its different impecable colors and smell, etc. Compare that "simple" creation to a child with a complete set of crayons and a paper and you would soon find out what is intelligent and what is DUMB.

Just two small comments.

1. We should remember Jim Jones and Jonestown. The charisma is the same and the demand for total subservience is as well.

2. The parishioners are not the only ones paying for all these excesses. You and I are. He uses all this money tax free and we have to pay for the deficit.

I certainly take offense not at what he does to his followers; they do have a choice and it is their privilege not to use it, but he is using my money without ever having even asked me for it.

Every fool to his own folly but not with my money.

He, Mr. Scott, ahould be made to pay all the taxes on his income which is the church's.

spidermean:
The only form of stupidity is the blind devotion you profess.

You blame a culture of "scientists" for stupidity? By the way 'scientists" is not a religion, neither is "science". Write a gramatically correct sentence you f%#king moron!!!What is wrong with you man?

If you get a serious illness that can be treated by "science", I hope u live up to your word and pray instead of seeing a doctor and see how long u last. That is stupidity.

No body knows if god exists or not. Those that claim they know, are academically dishonest frauds unless they offer proof otherwise. That's what differentiates "scientists" and fundamentalists.

chops2, Im an engineer and Im more of a scientist than these idiotic evolutionists. The reason I don't believe evolution is because it is ANTI-SCIENCE. It's all a fairy tale. I read all their claims and as a trained engineer and wishing to understand those claims, I found out that their doctrines can't stand any true scientific inquiry. Do you know what is the background of Charles Darwin, the so called "father of evolution"? He's just a holder of a 4 year course and haven't even heard of the thing called DNA. His mentor (who was much more intelligent than him) laughed at his idea coz they were SO FUNNY.

None of these big supporters of evolution in our time is an engineer and these people Im sure don't even know how things are created. I'd be surprised if they can even make a simple screw. If ever they can, you have to turn it COUNTER-CLOCKWISE opposite to the concept of the right thumb rule.

Try this idiot. How did mosquitoes evolved in order to fly? What part of their DNA made some computations that they have to "vibrate" their wings at a certain speed to fly? Designing an object to fly needs a lot of number crunching you know. Some high tech airplanes like the modern bombers need a computer to fly, to crunch those numbers. Even robots which walk clumsily uses high power computers to be able to walk.

Those numbers don't come easily without any super intelligent help. Check this out, idiot. Try to catch a ball with one eye only. Those two eyes are there for a purpose and a number crunching super computing brain to process the angles. Do those evolutionist know that? Their answer would be, "how would we know?, we are idiots".

Christian Reality 101:

Jesus was an illiterate Jewish peasant/carpenter/simple preacher man who suffered from hallucinations and who has been characterized anywhere from the Messiah from Nazareth to a mythical character from mythical Nazareth to a mamzer from Nazareth (Professor Bruce Chilton, in his book Rabbi Jesus). Analyses of Jesus’ life by many contemporary NT scholars (e.g. Professors Crossan, Borg and Fredriksen, On Faith panelists) via the NT and related documents have concluded that only about 30% of Jesus' sayings and ways noted in the NT were authentic. The rest being embellishments (e.g. miracles)/hallucinations made/had by the NT authors to impress various Christian, Jewish and Pagan sects.

The 30% of the NT that is "authentic Jesus" like everything in life was borrowed/plagiarized and/or improved from those who came before. In Jesus' case, it was the ways and sayings of the Babylonians, Greeks, Persians, Egyptians, Hittites, Canaanites, OT, John the Baptizer and possibly the ways and sayings of traveling Greek Cynics. http://wiki.faithfutures.org/index.php/Works_Cited
For added "pizzazz", Catholic/Christian theologians divided god the singularity into three persons and invented atonement as an added guilt trip for the "pew people" to go along with this trinity of overseers. By doing so, they made god the padre into god the "filicider".

Current crises:

Pedophiliac priests, atonement theology and original sin!!!!

3. Luther, Calvin, Smith, Henry VIII, Wesley et al, founders of Christian-based religions, also suffered from the belief in/hallucinations of "pretty wingie thingie" visits and "prophecies" for profits analogous to the myths of Catholicism (resurrections, apparitions, ascensions and immaculate conceptions).

Current crises:

Adulterous preachers, "propheteering/ profiteering" evangelicals (e.g. the Osteens, Grahams and Star R. Scott) and atonement theology.

CCNL wrote "Jesus was an illiterate ..."

It depends on who reads the Bible. Those who are the true illiterate don't understand the deep methaphors in the Bible. How do you expect a pig treasure a pearl? Or how do you expect an idiot understand the Bible?

Jesus said "Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit."

That's the secret of true Christianity why it won't fade away. How can you stop a thing that produces many when it dies? Do you expect idiots to understand that?

CCNL. you and your gang (Crossan) are fools and the biggest illiterate.

Okay, let's look at the term "cult." What makes a religion a "cult?" Is it the number of members? There are a lot of Scientologists and Christian Scientists, but surely those are cults by any common usage of the term. Is it illegal activities of the leaders? That makes the Catholic Church a cult, based on all the pedofile priests. Is it superstition? Hey, they ALL rely on that.

IMO, "Cult" is nothing more or less than a perjorative term that folks use to describe others' religions. IMO, all religions are cults; some are just more anti-social than others -- but then I'm a member of the "atheist cult," so what would I know about religion? :-)

spidermean 2:

Following your own reasoning all things must have a creator: man created the computer, god created man then who created god?

Be honest, we dont know. Neither science or religion has the answer yet but science doesn't claim to. If you are an academic as you claim then please directly answer that question with some semblence of academic honesty. And please no quotes from the bible, it proves nothing, display hard evidence.

I'm a lawyer and evidence and reasoning are part of life and should be so in determining what u loosely call "truth" in religion. Faith is truth in religion, there is no religious truth that we are aware of because we have no evidence of a god.

1) An Engineer is not more of a scientist than an evolutionary biologist. That is frankly a ridiculous claim.

2) Evolution is anti science? Please. Evolutionary theory has been supported by a considerable body of evidence, even by those that are religious such as Dr. Kenneth Miller. Please seek his work, he is a brilliant man.

3) "Their doctrines can't stand any true scientific inquiry". An religious doctrines can? Please, evolution is a theory based on a culmination of scientific work, not fantasy professed 2000 years ago by someone with a lack of basic knowledge about the world that we now know. The evidence is there, you just choose not to see it.

And by the way if u can prove god exists, I and the rest of humanity would like to know so we can end this debate, please show us.

Spiderman2 aka Canyon Shearer, Bible Thumper, Fortune Teller and Severely Brainwashed in that Old Time Religion,

What "voodooer of the hoodoo" blessed you with such stupidity in the field of fortune telling i.e. the bible and interpretations of said stupidity???

The reality of it all is that the "pew sitters" and "bowers" are coming to grips with the flaws in their religions and in ten years the religions of today will be unrecognizable or extinct as the "pretty and ugly wingie flying thingies" are finally buried in the piles of utter nonsense.

There's a sucker born again every minute.

I wonder when Gov. Palin is scheduled to visit and give a speech praising this guy.

If there fools to be fleeced, there will always be someone out there to fleece them. At least this guy is honest about his intentions. If the congregation is too dumb to see how they are being used and abused, thats their problem.

I nominate Spidermean as the next leader of these inbred Virginia wackos when God smites Scott for his thievery.

Poor Jesus.

ALL pastors are cult leaders.

As L. Ron Hubbard, the founder of Scientology, said, the best way to make a million is to start your own religion.

What scares me is the gullilbility of folks. Those so desirous of being told and following instead of thinking for themselves, using some criticle thinking and having the courage to say "no" when your selected leader goes off the deep end! People should mature out of childish desires for a parent-god or his representative in the form of a pastor. THINK for yourselves and Grow up! If you want to remain a Christian, consider reading Jefferson's Bible.

Spidermean wrote:

"He's just a holder of a 4 year course and haven't even heard of the thing called DNA." (sic)

If you are indeed an Engineer, I would love to see your "degree". You seem to have a great deal of difficulty forming even the most basic sentence. And this is not a one-time occurrence. Is English your natural language? I do not normally nitpick spelling and grammar in posts, and prefer to look at the content instead. But when you sit here and trumpet your Engineering degree as proof of your intelligence and logic, and then constantly demonstrate to the world you cannot even write at a third grade level, you lose all credibility.

I read a lot of Washington Post articles and blogs and Spidermean2 is always at the center of controversy and takes the opposite view of everyone else. In my opinion, he does so in order to get his jollies and get everyone riled up to write an excited counterpoint to him. I don't for a minute believe that he really believes the things he writes. He is just having fun at our expense. Ignore the fool and let's continue to discuss the issue at hand. Clearly the descriptions sound cult-like, especially the commandment that he apparently got from God to marry the virgin bride. It is sad that religion has been perverted in this way to enrich these leaders so lavishly to the detriment of their poor and ignorant flock.

This guy does the same thing that every religious leader has done since man invented religion. He uses it to manipulate, control and fleece his fellow man. As technologically advanced as we have become, religion is the one thing that shows how primitive and superstitious humans still are. Believing in an invisible man that lives in the sky, that is capable of anything, but does nothing. It is still a puzzle to me how people can get to a point where they realize that santa clause is make believe, but still believes in a book of jewish fairy tales, that not one word of can be proven. If someone made the claims that are made in the bible today, they would be fitted with a special jacket, given a fluffy room and given some real good meds, because today we realize that these people are schisophrenic. But if you take this same schiso, back 2000 years when they had no concept of this particular mantal illness, and you have a prophet. Spare me. I'm not saying that there is no god, I'm just saying that religion has nothing to do with god.

This truly gives new meaning to "tending to the flock".

Baa. Baa.

What a bunch of sheep.

"I’m shocked, shocked to find that gambling is going on in here!"

Additional cults: Hagee, Hinn, Robertson, Osteen, Bakker, Roberts, Dobson, White, Copeland...

These criminals would take a widow's last dollar and promise them God will reward them three-fold, and then turn around and invest that dollar in a diamond mine under a Liberian dictatorship, a sprawling estate, expensive motor cars, servants, and all the other trappings of a pig.

To think these criminals get a tax break yet is just infuriating.

That, ladies and gentlemen, is how bone-deep stupid we are as a people, thanks to a propensity to disbelieve reality and instead investing that belief in people who they think represent an invisible omnipotent patriarch who lives in the sky.

Congratulations.

I sit here and just have to shake my head. I've been in law enforcement for 21 years and I am still surprised at the things I read and hear.

I believe whole heartedly in treating others the way I wish to be treated, whether I am an officer or not. I can still perform my job in that manner and get my job done very well. I am also a Christian by choice, based off of what I've learned in my life and what God has done for me and what I've seen Him do in the lives of others.

It's called free will.

People will always live their lives as they see fit. I believe because of what I've experienced in my life. There is a huge difference between those who believe in Christ and those who live their beliefs in Christ.

In the same manner that a police officer abuses his power, makes my life more difficult as a police officer who does not; the same holds true for those "christians" who claim the name and do not live their beliefs in Christ.

This is a newpaper article about a man, not a church. This is a newspaper article about a man who has influence over a group of people who believe what they will. It is a shame and makes those who live their belief in Christ much more difficult.

Those who are believers in Christ and live their beliefs, know that our belief is not about a man, but Christ. It is about the promise of an enternity with the God who created us.

It is about loving others unconditionally, despite what they look like, what they do or don't do, or what they believe or do not believe. If you do not believe what I do not believe, that does not change my behavior towards you, nor does it change my belief.

OK, so what does this mean to everyone. If you do not believe and you are right and I am wrong, I have lost nothing and have treated people by living the golden rule, treating those in the manner that I wish to be treated.

But what if I am right?

Send'em the IRS. Ain't see no charitable work'n there, other than Sugar Daddy's.

[Scott said he has spent hundreds of thousands of dollars of church funds on Ferraris, dragsters, souped-up motorcycles and trucks as "an automotive outreach."]
That doesn't pass the laughing rule. How come the IRS declaration-filters haven't spotted it? Does Scott own IRS Auditors too?

Chops2, biologists and lawyers MEMORIZE body parts and laws respectively. Engineers are trained to ANALYZE and SOLVE problems. Engineers make "impossible" things happen like flying you to the moon or mars. We are always at the forefront of technology. Unlike biology which developed from "OBSERVING" living cell behaviors, engineers deal with EXACT SCIENCE. In biology, what works today may NOT work the following year because living cells are TOO COMPLICATED. They have a mind of its own and upto now biologists can't fathom them. HIV is one "brainless" virus which your so called "briliant"scientists can't beat. Also, how a bunch of cells (the brain) is able to think is a wonder and an enigma.

Intelligence is EVERYWHERE and you don't have to look somewhere else to prove that there is a God. He is everywhere and only IDIOTS can't see Him.

Not only that, the Bible is a book of secrets and I know what is the future and what countries particularly will burn and be annihilated in due time.

The Bible is very tough to crack-open its secrets. If my analysis is correct, Iran will be the next country to fall. People elected Obama because those people "hate" wars. They can only wish coz it's not gonna happen. This world will explode in the near future. And a big thanks to the stupid doctrine of evolution for making people IDIOTIC.

Asking who created God is an IGNORANT question. It is like asking where is the beginning of space? It doesn't mean that if you occupy a certain space, then the space becomes finite. It means you are finite but the space continue to be finite. If you were created, it does not mean that God has to be created also.

For crying out loud, cult or culture? Is what you wrote true or false? The fault lies not only with the poor, ignorant boobs gulled by this shyster, but with the pap served up in this country as discerning thought. Didn't St. Paul say something about being neither warm nor cold? Cult is not a strong word, it is the correct word. This article does not throw light on the subject, it simply stirs the pot.

Chops2, biologists and lawyers MEMORIZE body parts and laws respectively. Engineers are trained to ANALYZE and SOLVE problems. Engineers make "impossible" things happen like flying you to the moon or mars. We are always at the forefront of technology. Unlike biology which developed from "OBSERVING" living cell behaviors, engineers deal with EXACT SCIENCE. In biology, what works today may NOT work the following year because living cells are TOO COMPLICATED. They have a mind of its own and upto now biologists can't fathom them. HIV is one "brainless" virus which your so called "briliant"scientists can't beat. Also, how a bunch of cells (the brain) is able to think is a wonder and an enigma.

Intelligence is EVERYWHERE and you don't have to look somewhere else to prove that there is a God. He is everywhere and only IDIOTS can't see Him.

Not only that, the Bible is a book of secrets and I know what is the future and what countries particularly will burn and be annihilated in due time.

The Bible is very tough to crack-open its secrets. If my analysis is correct, Iran will be the next country to fall. People elected Obama because those people "hate" wars. They can only wish coz it's not gonna happen. This world will explode in the near future. And a big thanks to the stupid doctrine of evolution for making people IDIOTIC.

Asking who created God is an IGNORANT question. It is like asking where is the beginning of space? It doesn't mean that if you occupy a certain space, then the space becomes finite. It means you are finite but the space continue to be infinite. If you were created, it does not mean that God has to be created also.

I live near this church, am acquainted with people who go there, and have been approached by members trying to evangelize. I'm more liberal in my practice of Christianty, but still recognize that there is something spiritually beautiful in the deep sense of faith that some conservative Christians have. I agree that the pastor here sounds like an ego-maniac, but the members of the congregation I have encountered aren't fools or sheep as suggested in some of the comments here. Maybe their faith has blinded them to the flaws in their pastor, but their level of faith is still something to be respected and admired.

What does it take to set some people's alarm bells off?

BONG! BONG! BONG!
If my church were to tell me that I had to choose between it and my child, or it and my husband, the church would lose.
Any god that demanded that choice would lose as well.

ABONG! BONG! BONG!
Any organization (other than the IRS) that demands a certain percentage of my income is s.o.l. I budget for contributions to various non-profits, including my UU church, but it's not as a percentage of my income - it's as a percentage of what's left after my bills are paid.
According to the article, when one family fell behind on their tithes, Scott came looking for them. When they told him that they had had a finacial hardship, he demanded to see their bank records.

BONG! BONG! BONG!
Any church that would demand that I send my child to their school would be suspect as well. I am the one who decides what educational environment my child would best thrive in, not my pastor.

BONG! BONG! BONG!
The pastor chooses a bride from the congregation THREE WEEKS after his wife dies. Pastors should not become romantically involved with congregants. And I have to wonder how willing his bride was, or if she was manipulated into the marriage.

BONG! BONG! BONG!
The pastor has a fleet of expensive cars and begins a "racing ministry." Saran Wrap is less transparent than that.

BONG! BONG! BONG!
The pastor has huge credit card bills that are paid by the congregation and no one questions any of his purchases?

If my pastor were to do any ONE of these things, I would question his integrity. But that people follow and DEFEND someone like this just boggles the mind.

"What does it take to set some people's alarm bells off?"

Not a hundred years coz people continue to believe evolution despite the fact that is it ANTI-SCIENCE. If evolution does not believe in any intelligent design, it is because evolution is designed or concocted by idiots. Im convinced that the DUMBEST people on earth are called EVOLUTIONISTS.

There is no question that Star Scott is a fake. But you guys should look at yourselves also. Can't you see you are a bunch of idiots yourselves?

What Lepidopteryx said, double!!! This pastor and his church meet all the earmarks of a cult, and reading about it just creeped me OUT!!!! It's sad how his congregation hasn't realized this yet...although considering how well he's insulated them (some would say brainwashed), it's no real surprise. Fortunately, his numbers went down, indicating that a sizable number came to their senses and realized just what he's all about! Hopefully there will be an investigation into this....

Pastors like this give Christianity a bad name, to say nothing of the extremist tripe spewed by such people as Pat Robertson, Jerry Falwell, Joel Osteen, Hagee, Phelps, and others whose message seems to be "our god loves you as long as you lockstep to our rules!"

And Sperrico, you're right...on the anniversary of the Jim Jones massacre, the timing couldn't have been better!

The people who follow this guy and other pastors like him are not christians, they're suckers.

"Im convinced that the DUMBEST people on earth are called EVOLUTIONISTS."

BONG! BONG! BONG! BONG! BONG! BONG! BONG! BONG! BONG!

For SPIDERMEAN2:
"Try to catch a ball with one eye only."

I've actually done this, not as an exercise to prove a point or illustrate the principles of depth perception, but rather because I lost my right eye to a stroke about three years ago. Guess what, I can still catch the ball!

Now I readily admit that I couldn't have done that the day after the stroke, or even the month after. But the human brain has a marvelous way of "evolving" new strategies to cope with the loss of an eye, or a leg (as I can also testify from personal experience).

I likewise admit that if you were to throw me ten balls that I might mishandle one or two, but that was not your proposition. Even one catch proves that it is possible for a one-eyed man to catch a ball, despite the absolute absence of depth perception. Catching eight of ten proves that it's possible to do so with reasonable efficiency. And from any perspective, it's an "evolved" skill.

For your motoring peace of mind, let me also say that I have likewise (and without special education or training aids ... in fact with no conscious mental effort) "evolved" the ability to drive my car at high speed without running into your back bumper. I can also put my fifteen foot wide houseboat into its sixteen foot wide slip without scraping the bang rails. In fact I can do pretty much everything I could do before. Isn't evolution wonderful? (And provable.)

"Check this out, idiot"

Folks who call other folks idiots are presuming a lot, and ignoring the fact that human intelligence is sufficiently flexible to allow even folks with ordinary IQs to achieve excellence in even the most difficult fields. Since the raw odds are exactly fifty/fifty that any one individual is smarter (or dumber) than any other individual, there's a good chance, for example, that you are smarter than the surgeon who's going to open your arteries, or that you're dumber than the plumber who's going to open your drain.

"How did mosquitoes evolved in order to fly? What part of their DNA made some computations that they have to "vibrate" their wings at a certain speed to fly?"

I like your proposition above. Flying, for a mosquito, is an evolved ability, as opposed to flight in birds, or walking in humans, both of which are learned abilities often involving repeated failures before the ability is mastered. Not so with mosquitoes. Minutes after emerging from the pupal stages they take flight with perfect expertise.

Religion itself speaks to the evolution of ideas at least as much as it speaks to the notion of divine creation. I don't know what your religion is, but I'd bet a dollar to a doughnut that it's an "evolved" religion that's considerably different from the religion of your grandfather, even though it may be the same denomination.

Cult:
a particular system of religious worship, esp. with reference to its rites and ceremonies.

They're all cults, it's just that this one is a bit more obvious than the others, but the definition holds true for all religions. There is no argument to the contrary. The end.

We are talking sheer abuse of power, authority, and trust here. This has nothing to do with cults, or even churches. It has to do with tyranny, and should be eliminated in a civilized society.

He can call himself whatever he wants, but insisting on everyone turning over their financial data to him, without doing the same, sets off plenty of alarms. Not to mention the whole insistence upon a virgin bride from the congregation. He's a charismatic charlatan, and if he has no conscience (which is my bet) then he's a psychopath. He may well be merely a sociopath, but he's doing plenty of damage and seems to care not a whit. Maybe he's simply a clever jerk, but I think he's so much more.

Just for fun, regarding biology, DNA and viruses:

Now consider inheritance. Sometimes, by a stroke of fate, the infected host is a sperm or egg cell, which becomes a child. That child has those inert viral sequences in every single cell of his body. If those sequences happen to lie near an allele (one member of a pair of genes) that becomes ubiquitous in the population through natural selection, then all members of the species will carry the same genetic "signature" in every cell of their body. These ghosts of infections past are called endogenous retroviruses, or more affectionately, ERVs.

An ERV found in the same DNA location in two people provides powerful evidence, admissible in court, that they share a common ancestor. All humans share many ERVs in identical locations, which is no surprise. We all have common ancestors if one looks far enough back. But here's where it gets interesting: Chimps and humans also have ERVs in common. If identical ERVs serve as evidence of relatedness in court, then ERVs are equally convincing evidence that chimps and humans are related!

The human and chimp genomes have been sequenced over the last decade, and we've found a dozen separate ERVs (hundreds of repeats each) identical in both genomes, in exactly the same locations. When these sequences are checked for time of introduction, they indicate a common ancestor five to seven million years ago. That is consistent with other molecular divergence studies and the fossil record.

But wait, there's more!

Consider a repeat sequence of base pairs like an ERV-or any other nonfunctional DNA sequence for that matter-found in the same locations in the genome between two species. Geneticists have looked at shared sequences between humans and mice, and compared those to the shared sequences between humans and chimps. They found that in humans and chimps, the same mouse sequences have been overwritten, just like a new CD recorded over an old one. This is exactly what we'd expect if ancestors of chimps and humans diverged more recently than primates and rodents diverged.

chilledmac : "It is about loving others unconditionally"

I would think a police officer would feel a bit weird saying these words. Society sets rules of conditional behavior and police are required to enforce them. This is not to say that love cannot be unconditional, but one does not love a force in one's community that threatens to disrupt everyone's peace. Love is reserved for those forces that cooperate with your interests. This Scott person is a danger to my community of fair minded, democratic people who see the benefit of all as a higher purpose. Scott is not interested in me. It looks to me that he is not even interested in the people who depend on him. Why should I not find him abominable?

It is just a matter of time before this manipulator is standing at the pulpit with tears streaking down his face, proclaiming "Ah have SINNED against yew!"

Those that permit such criminals to lead them, and to steal from them, deserve what they get.

Wake up!

Strip his Church (and any Church doing this for profit) of its tax-exempt status.

Spidermean2 wrote:

"Engineers are trained to ANALYZE and SOLVE problems. Engineers make "impossible" things happen like flying you to the moon or mars. We are always at the forefront of technology. Unlike biology which developed from "OBSERVING" living cell behaviors, engineers deal with EXACT SCIENCE. In biology, what works today may NOT work the following year because living cells are TOO COMPLICATED. They have a mind of its own and upto now biologists can't fathom them."

If what you say is true, then you, being a trained engineer and all, should have no problem whatsoever coming up with a cure for the AIDS virus. Shoot, I bet you could even do it with one eye closed! C'mon petunia...put your money where your keyboard is!

Giotto wrote:
"I... still recognize that there is something spiritually beautiful in the deep sense of faith that some conservative Christians have."

May I respectfully submit that faith in a messiah is, and has always been, an open invitation to charlatans. I believe this tends to make Christianity more vulnerable to these problems than some other religions, although clearly none are immune.

Pulpit pimps such as this man want to be indespensible Old Covenant Christian Priests. The problem is that for Christians, who exist only in the New Covenant, you seek God through the Son - not through the Priests, as the Jews were required to do. You can't establish a personal covenant relationship with your Lord, when your Pastor insists that he comprises a self-appointed degree of separation from God, creating claas B Christians - or Christians once removed. This is why we need to teach that tithing never was part of the New Covenant and take out the Prophet Motive for church leaders.

"three weeks after the death of his wife, "Scott stood before the congregation and announced that the Bible instructed him as a high priest to take a virgin bride from the faithful." A week later, he married a 20-year-old church (Yummy, slim, Blonde) member. "

GIVE ME THAT OLD TIME RELIGION. Star R. Scott is my HERO! Big House, YOUNG wife, $$$$$, fast cars and ultimate untouchable POWER! You rock Scott!

Unlike some of the posters here, I don't condemn the people of Scott's "temple" as fools or dupes--and I certainly don't condemn Christianity or religion because of the awful example the this man gives of power gone mad.

He is of course a conman and a thief, however he might have convinced himself otherwise.

But recognize the basis of his power over the cult he has created. That source is FEAR. His followers are not gullible fools, but he has managed to dominate them by playing on their fears of the wrath of God. If they don't follow his threatening reading of Scripture, they will burn in hell forever.

I would say this to any members of his congregation, or to other Christians who find themselves in this situation: God is not a God of wrath, but a loving and forgiving father.

If there is any justice and truth in this world, then the true wrath of God is going to fall on this manipulating and unscrupulous thief and fraud, who is destroying the lives of those who have come to him in fear and trembling.

And by the way, I hope that the IRS and the social-welfare agencies of Virginia are looking into what this fraud has been doing with his con games.

Can't resist - gotta add more - She is 35 YEARS younger then he is! Cute, petite, blonde. Young and Fresh at 20 when he TOOK her as his bride! She's 26 now, he's 61. She's a good lil' christian girl so she has to SUBMIT to her husband, according to the bible!

Ol' Scott is Rockin' in more ways then one! Now if her could only give the same to ALL his male members, his congregation would soar!

And this is why people are turned away from Christianity

JM917 wrote "I would say this to any members of his congregation, or to other Christians who find themselves in this situation: God is not a God of wrath, but a loving and forgiving father. "

So are you denying the existence of a hell as defined by christians?

Remove all faith based organizations from tax exempt status, they must pay taxes like all business, corporations and all Americans.

kengelhart :
chilledmac : "It is about loving others unconditionally"

"I would think a police officer would feel a bit weird saying these words. Society sets rules of conditional behavior and police are required to enforce them. This is not to say that love cannot be unconditional, but one does not love a force in one's community that threatens to disrupt everyone's peace. Love is reserved for those forces that cooperate with your interests. This Scott person is a danger to my community of fair minded, democratic people who see the benefit of all as a higher purpose. Scott is not interested in me. It looks to me that he is not even interested in the people who depend on him. Why should I not find him abominable?"

I appreciate your comment! I have not always been a christian police officer. Being that my job is to enforce the law, I do that and do it well. I did not say it is easy however! Most police officers are pessimistic by nature, which I am.

Because I arrest someone for something they alledgedly have done and that I have the probable cause for, does not mean that I can not treat them with love.

Our society has taken the word LOVE and warped into so many different things. The heart felt caring for others is what I would consider love, despite whether or not I agree with them.

I do not like, nor do I agree with what Scott is doing and how he is treating those who look up to him as a "pastor." I believe that he needs to be held accountable in everyway shape and form possible for what ever he may be doing that is illegal, whether criminal or civil law.

He got one thing right in the actual new paper article I read, not the one here in the article above; he will be judged by God. I hope he is held accountable in this time as well.

I_GO_POGO wrote:
"May I respectfully submit that faith in a messiah is, and has always been, an open invitation to charlatans. I believe this tends to make Christianity more vulnerable to these problems than some other religions, although clearly none are immune."

All religions have leaders who claim to be authorities. I guess I don't understand what makes Christians more vulnerable to being abused by them. People put their trust in all kinds of people who betray them: spouses, stockbrokers, politicians (well, maybe no one trusts them anymore - ha!).

I think life is still better lived as someone who has trusting relationships especially with family members, spiritual leaders, and a higher power. When someone's trust is abused, they deserve prayers not ridicule, even if the situation seems absurd.

"When someone's trust is abused, they deserve prayers not ridicule,"

In this case, why not pursue legal action? Praying is very nice, but if people have been illegally shorn of their money, they have recourse.

I agree, these people were CONNED, and plenty of very smart people are conned. Don't we all know the old folk story about it? You know, "The Emperor's New Clothes"? That's just one example.

"In this case, why not pursue legal action? Praying is very nice, but if people have been illegally shorn of their money, they have recourse."

Sure, if you have legal standing to make a case - absolutely. I didn't figure anyone on this forum was that involved in this church.

JUMPINGJACK

You wrote, "It is truly heartbreaking when people have horrible and negative experiences interacting with so called 'churches', 'pastors', or 'Christians' and then incorrectly assume all churches, pastors, and Christians are the same."

I agree, not only is it sad but it does not reflect at all on Jesus, but on those that twist what Jesus is all about. Christianity is about Jesus and what He did and is doing but it is not necessarily anything about what some who call themself, "Christian", would lead some to believe.

Then you wrote, "I don’t expect I’ll ever find that clean, pure, holy one.
But, just maybe; He will find me.", God works in His Way and in His Time, the phrase, "Expect the Unexpected", can be quite an understatement at times.

Take care, be ready.

Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

I've been looking for an easy way to make money -- I think I've found it. I'll start my own cult! Apparently, all that is required is an outsized ego and willing sheep...with bank accounts.

lcarter0311

You wrote, "These Bible verses can easily be preached and/or taught in a way that is mis-leading, or misconstrued in some way by the pastor/teacher because of few of the reasons below: ...".

When I was told in a dream that I knew was from God, I dove into bible studies and one of the things that I found out was if anyone tries to tell anyone else to follow them and they will show you the way then they do not know what they are talking about.

It is good to listen to others but not to let others be your conscience.

Jesus is Who He Is, God-Incarnate, and the way that I am to follow Him is not the way that is for others to follow Him. If someone wants to be a follower of Jesus then they are to follow Him not to follow a follower of Jesus or one that may call themself a follower.

I am a Catholic and I cherish my Catholic Faith and as anyone who reads these posts can tell there are some who think somewhat less than highly of "Catholics" just because they are Catholic not necessarily because of who the person really is that is Catholic.

God is a searcher of hearts and minds, not of religious affiliations or lack thereof, He is not the egomaniac that some would have others believe.

It is important what one does and why one does it and what one knows, more important than whatever "label" someone applies to themself.

Jesus did say He would send the Holy Spirit to guide us, not only can God speak thru people and sometimes unbeknowst to them but so can satan.

One other thing, satan knows the bible better than any human being but as Jesus said, "satan is a liar and a thief". satan used the bible verbatim but out of context when Jesus was in the desert, so beware.

Take care, be ready.

Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

brannonmay

You wrote, "Everyone needs to learn how to interpret the bible for themselves.

Don't go to church! He gave you a brain, use it!".

I partly agree, yes we should use our brain but we should also use our heart and also the guidance of the Holy Spirit.

I do not tell anyone to go to church or not to go to church, that is their decision.

I go to church for the reasons I go. Some of which are:

One is to receive the Eucharist which I know is Jesus since the Holy Spirit revealed it to me.

Another is to listen to the readings and the homily.

And another, since the Mass is in the vernacular, to listen to the other prayers at Mass which say so much if one listens. Sometimes, something that one has heard numerous times, just comes alive in a whole different way as if your ears have been opened to a whole new meaning.

Same with the homiles whether it is something that you agree or disagree with, they can help you grow and be able to do whatever God has chosen you to do.

Take care, be ready.

Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

Great, we've got Baum and Spidermean. The nuts are falling out of the tree.

CCNL

You keep writing that Jesus was illiterate, as far as I know being literate means that one can read, does it not?

Even tho it is probably part of the bible that you ripped out and threw away, it says right in there that He got up and read from the scrolls, does it not?

By the way, what do you have against illiterate peasants anyway? The reason I ask is that you seem to write it as a put-down!

I would say that Jesus would be considered a peasant although not an illiterate one.

I would also say that some of the Vietnamese people that I met over there that worked for the US Government were probably peasants, some of which very well could have been illiterate and they were very fine people and treated me very good also.

Do you think that having a fancy job and having a store-bought education makes someone a better person than someone that does manual labor?

Isn't it something that when God became One of Us, He chose to be born in a lowly way rather than in a palace and chose to perform manual labor before setting off on His Mission to SAVE ALL OF HUMANITY.

Thank You God that Your Plan, which is for ALL, will come to Fruition on the seventh day.

Take care, be ready.

Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

Spidermean (and yes you are mean, you are so far from the idea of Jesus its not even funny),

Asking who created the creator is not a stupid question as your concept of intelligent design revolves around there being a designer for everything. So who designed the designer? The ease at which u say that all laws dont apply to him is a cop out and you know it.

My point was that WE DONT KNOW and it is disingenuous of ANYONE to claim they 100% know. Those that do should be shunned and ridiculed for the charletans they are. Yes you.

If you dont have the intellectual honesty to admit that then this all is a was a waste of time. You are incapable of reasoned analysis becuase you claim to know everything already.

You know the future? Are you listening to yourself? You sound like a loon!!

I love how u state Iran being the next to "burn", again a very America centric vision of the future.

2 questions u need to answer in simple terms:
1) Tell us "according to your analysis" when we will burn. Give me a date and then lets get in touch on that date and see if it happens. Simple.

Whats the date?

2) Take the aids challenge up if you are such a great engineer. the world awaits.

Get back to me.

AlexaK & Maggots:

AlexaK Author Profile Page:

Godsdaughter - Actually, it's not "nuff said", because for some reason I still care about Christianity which is why I find it such a shame that many are leaving churches in droves these days (I know quite a handful) because they aren't seeing much of Jesus in the church - the Jesus of humility and compassion. Many who claim to be "born again" lying to wear it loudly on their sleeves and not really living it. There are true Christians out there, but they are truly the humble, the meek and the kind... Not "I am God's child and you're not" types.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I never said I didn't care about Christianity. Jesus at with the sinners & publicians, the Pharases wrapped their robes around them and were disgusted at what Jesus was doing and walked away.

People are leaving churches in droves because they aren't hearing what they want to hear or not being "loved" like they think they should, think the touchy feely love that Joel Olsteen preaches, yes this is God. But He's also judging (read your old testament) God hasn't changed from the beginning of the Old Testament to the end of the New Testament or even changed now. We have changed who He is by saying that He is just made out of love, but He asks us to fear Him, make Him real in our lives to the point of being afraid of being sent to a devil's hell.

Fear - to have reverential awe of.

Yes, Christians are to be meek & humble, but they are also to proclaim the gospel and live it accordingly. Like Jesus did, He was jealous for the Word and for the temple of God, for example, when Jesus tossed over the tables of the money-changers in the temple! This is how Christians are supposed to be, jealous for the word of God, jealous for how they believe. Jealous for Jesus to shine through to all those around them. Jealous for those who claim to be Christians to be Christ-like!

maggots Author Profile Page:

godsdaughter_tried_n_true Author Profile Page:

You should really get to know a person before you cast judgments from something a few discontented & bitter people said. Not all of what you read and hear is true.

....... 'nuf said

################################################

Well, I don't really know Osama bin Laden, so I guess that I shouldn't believe what a few bitter and discontented people say about him either!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Thanks for twisting what I said Maggots! I wasn't talking about someone proven to kill people! What I was trying to say is that maybe you should come out and sit through a service and see what we as a congregation are & what Pastor Scott is really about before you actually place judgments and listen to what a few people are saying about him. That's all.

cornbread_r21 wrote "Flying, for a mosquito, is an evolved ability, "

I hope these evolutionist would start defining what an "evolved ability" means just like how engineers define what calculus is so we can start using the algorithm they use to fly our airplanes. Make it real guys so it can be usable and not just any FANTASTIC story.

Thomas, "god-meeter" and Moses of the NT, Baum,

See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Historical_Jesus for an analysis of Jesus' life to include his illiteracy.

Also, there is only one place in the NT that suggests Jesus could read i.e. Luke 4:16. This passage is not attested to in any other NT passage or in any other related document making it a later addition or poor translation as per most NT scholars' analyses.

See also Professor Crossan and Professor Reed's book, Excavating Jesus, p. 30.

See also Professor Bruce Chilton's commentary in his book, Rabbi Jesus, An Intimate Biography, pp 99-101- An excerpt:

"What Luke misses is that Jesus stood in the synagogue as an illiterate mamzer in his claim to be the Lord's anointed."

It is very unfortunate that Jesus was illiterate for it resulted in many gospels and epistles being written years after his death by non-witnesses. This resulted in significant differences in said gospels and epistles and with many embellishments to raise Jesus to the level of a deity to compete with the Roman gods and emperors. See Raymond Brown's 878 page book, An Introduction to the New Testament, (Luke 4:16 note on p. 237) for an exhaustive review of the true writers of the gospels and epistles.

" chops2 wrote "Take the aids challenge up if you are such a great engineer. the world awaits"

The quickest way to failure is to treat your intelligent enemy as dumb. Since evolutionist biologists don't believe there is INTELLIGENCE present in HIV viruses, they are destined to fail. Idiots can't solve problems. It is that simple.

Hire people who believe in intelligent design and you are one step ahead of the HIV battle. Don't waste your millions of dollars to stupid evolutionist biologist. It's a hopeless case.

CCNL, you are a crazy dude to say that Christ is illiterate. You lack the abilility to understand figures of speech which Christ is so well adept at using.

Just shut up coz you seem like an escaped inmate from a mental asylum who keep on bragging he's better than Einstein.

chops2 wrote "My point was that WE DONT KNOW and it is disingenuous of ANYONE to claim they 100% know. "

Jesus said "In a little while the WORLD will NO longer see me, but YOU WILL SEE ME." (John 14:19)

I guess that answers your question. You wouldn't know coz it isn't revealed to you. To others, He had SHOWED himself to them, just as He had promised.

100% true.

chops2 wrote "Tell us "according to your analysis" when we will burn. Give me a date and then lets get in touch on that date and see if it happens. Simple."

WW3 will be fought in a series of stages. Before the war is finally over, the burning will occur. For months, the U.S will be out of the picture in terms of military might. It's the sign that doomsday is near. Doomsday for both the unbelievers in U.S. shores and abroad.

No dates but REMEMBER the sequence of events and make ammends with God before doomsday will hit you by surprise.

Every Sunday millions of people go to church in this country and practice ritualized cannibalism (communion). The nuttiness of these groups is a matter of opinion. Once someone believes there is an invisible man in the clouds who can give them orders they are capable of anything.

"without religion you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But to get a good person to do an evil thing, that takes religion." - Steven Weinberg

Spiderman2 aka Canyon Shearer, Bible Thumper, Fortune Teller and Severely Brainwashed in that Old Time Religion,

A better view of God's/evolution's interactions with the human race:

From Father Edward Schillebeeckx, the famous contemporary theologian in his book, Church: The Human Story of God,
Crossroad, 1993, p.91 (softcover)

"Christians (humans) must give up a perverse, unhealthy and inhuman doctrine of predestination without in so doing making God the great scapegoat of history" .
"Nothing is determined in advance: in nature there is chance and determinism; in the world of human activity there is possibility of free choices.

Therefore the historical future is not known even to God; otherwise we and our history would be merely a puppet show in which God holds the strings. For God, too, history is an adventure, an open history for and of men and women."

Again, Spidermean what "voodooer of the hoodoo" blessed you with such stupidity in the field of fortune telling and interpretations of said stupidity???

The reality of it all is that the "pew sitters" and "bowers" are coming to grips with the flaws in their religions and in ten years the religions of today will be unrecognizable or extinct as the "pretty and ugly wingie flying thingies" are finally buried in the piles of utter stupidity.

"without religion you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But to get a good person to do an evil thing, that takes religion." - Steven Weinberg

WRONG. As there are good and evil people , there is also good and bad religion -- a true and a false religion. Steven Weinbart, I think belongs to a bad one and it's called the religion of STUPIDITY.

A comment and question to spiderman2:

I have read this commentary for sometime now. Your posts seem needlessly hostile and argumentative. Who are you trying to convince -- yourself?

"Make it real guys so it can be usable and not just any FANTASTIC story." -- spiderman2

I ask you the same about your faith in the central mystery of reincarnation.

Give these people a little more time and they'll be passing out the koolaid.

Posted on November 18, 2008 10:41

giotto wrote:
I live near this church, ...... Maybe their faith has blinded them to the flaws in their pastor, but their level of faith is still something to be respected and admired.

I do not agree that faith, especially THIS kind of faith is anything to be respected and especially admired! REALLY this is foolishness and to call it a good thing - faith- is why I think faith is not a good way to go about living a life. Faith ( religiuos faith) is NOT a virtue but a disease and should be untaught and corrected wherever progress will be had.

Giotto wrote: I think life is still better lived as someone who has trusting relationships especially with family members, spiritual leaders, and a higher power. When someone's trust is abused, they deserve prayers not ridicule, even if the situation seems absurd.

Better yet, this should be viewed as an opportunity for a " life lesson" ... to fine tune your trusting skills and to become more cautious and sophisticated about who or what you trust. Rather than waste time praying to an invisible friend, try consulting each other and figure out how to avoid this situation in the future. If you think of "praying" as talking to yourself or to your subconscience then OK - this can be helpful but to think that an imaginary power is going to step in and make things right or save you from the pain of learning a lesson, this seems childish to me. Most prayers I hear sound like a child talking to a parent. god is like a substitute parent for adults who still want or need one.

Hi David, you nailed the point perfectly by pointing out Scott's fruit.
On a side note, are you the same David Waters that preached once (or more) at CT way back in the early 80's? I worked at CT during that time and well remember a preacher of the same name.

Biblical predestination doesn't mean that God has made all the choices in your life and you're stuck with it, but that God can see your life from begining to it's end. He knows the choices you'll make and the outcome because of them.

Spidermean2,

How many years have you been a backslider now?

Our faith is not in Pastor Scott, our faith is in Jesus Christ! If what he taught wasn't in the scriptures, he wouldn't have so many attending the church. Before you believe everything the press publishes (because we know how great of a job they do), come sit in a service before you make any judgments of the people attending. Come sit and listen and you search the scriptures to see if it is in the Bible and don't just take the word of angry people.

Leviticus 21:13

Leviticus 27:32, Numbers 18:21-28, Deuteronomy 12:6, Hebrews 7:5.

Deuteronomy 10:12-13; 21:18-20,, Matthew 5:17-20

14truth1

You wrote, "Our faith is not in Pastor Scott, our faith is in Jesus Christ! If what he taught wasn't in the scriptures, he wouldn't have so many attending the church.".

First, the amount of people attending the church does not necessarily have anything to do with whether the Truth is being preached.

Second, just because something is in the scriptures does not mean that the true meaning of it hasn't been twisted.

Remember, satan quoted the scriptures verbatim when he tempted Jesus in the desert but satan was taking it out of context.

Jesus said that He would send the Holy Spirit to us to guide us into all Truth, no one should take what another speaks as truth just because they may be "charismatic" and convincing in their delivery but should discern for themself.

Christians should try to follow Jesus and be guided by the Holy Spirit, they should not follow a pasor, a priest, a minister, a church, a religion or for that matter the bible, all of the aforementioned can be a tool but Christians should follow Jesus, being guided by the Holy Spirit.

Take care, be ready.

Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

Being a leader and public figure in any discipline/field is not easy. Being the leader of a controversial Church is even more difficult, I assume. If I could say something positive here, I would say that Pastor Scott deserves an honorary Ph.D. in "Organizational Leadership" because he has been able to build up the ministry he has and continues to have many faithful followers, including much land, property, and money in the bank. I would say that he is definitely using his God-given talents for his benefit, but who wouldn't be smart to use innate and God-given talents in their personal career choice? Pastor Scott is a very persuasive smart man!

I attended Calvary Temple from July 1994 until June 1998 (almost 4 years). I had just graduated from College in PA and was looking for a job in the VA/DC area. I met some folks who attended Calvary Temple in the hair salon they owned and operated in Tyson's Corner. At this time in life, I was very vulnerable and open to trying out new things. Long story short, I decided to move from where I lived in PA to the northern VA area for work and to attend Calvary Temple. I moved in with some ladies from Calvary Temple and began attending the Church on a regular basis.

The Church consumed all of my time. When I was not at work, I was at the church. For a season, this church was good for me. I needed the structure the church provided; it was kind of like the Marine Corps boot camp of churches. After a while, though, I noticed that I wasn't doing any critical thinking for myself. I was only following expected behavioral norms to continue being accepted at the church. I was not allowed to grow spiritually at my own pace. I had to keep up with those who had been in church all of their lives and-or longer than me. I began to feel like a robot, smothered, and sort of like I was in house arrest or something. I began to not feel free in Jesus, but held captive by Pastor Scott's Calvary Temple prison.

When I decided to leave the church, I was already in trouble (can't even remember exactly what I had done, but I think it had to do with not following one of "their" specific rules and maybe questioning the leadership and teachings) and asked to not come to church for a season. I lived with a family from the church and was only allowed to go to work and back to their home again. For me, this was the final straw. I knew that if I decided to leave the church, I would have to find a new place to live and new friends (I had seen what had happened to others who left the church previously), but I knew that I had to make the break from the church at some point. The longer I was there, the more invested, the harder it would be to leave, I thought. Thankfully, Christians I worked with knew what I was going through and invited me to move in with them and I began a new and much happier life outside of Calvary Temple.

Following my break from Calvary Temple, I began attending another wonderful church in the northern VA area, got involved in their international ministry, went on a mission's trip, and was later invited to teach at a Christian elementary school in Nicaragua. While in Nicaragua, I helped with Hurricane Mitch relief efforts and was introduced to the U.S. military. After my time in Nicaragua, I decided to join the Army. After my Army training, I was stationed in Wiesbaden, Germany.

After a year here in Germany, I was married to my wonderful (and Christian) husband. Over the last 8.5 years, we've served our country (still here too), deployed to Iraq and Afghanistan, traveled all over Europe, received our MA degrees, and I'm half-way done with my Ph.D. If I had stayed at Calvary Temple, I would not have had any other friends outside of Calvary, would probably not have traveled or traveled internationally, would not have the education I have now, and would not have had the amazing life that I've had since leaving Calvary Temple.

If you're still at Calvary Temple and want to leave, please know that you can leave and be happy outside of Calvary Temple; you can have a life and still be a Christian. If you leave Calvary Temple, you will be completely rejected, but you can meet new people and make new friends and be happy! :) It's God's acceptance and approval you want anyway - not Calvary Temple or Pastor Scott's approval and acceptance.

Please use the brain God gave you (critical thinking skills) to make "your own decisions" for your life---not give every decision for your life over to others (i.e., Calvary Temple leadership) to make for you. There are other wonderful churches in the northern VA area. Calvary Temple is not thee only church. It's your personal relationship with Jesus--not Pastor Scott or Calvary Temple staff and congregation that is essential to right standing with God and salvation.

It's too bad that when you leave Calvary Temple, the people there will have nothing to do with you anymore. There were some wonderful people there that I would have loved to have kept in contact with - even if via e-mail, but....they are encouraged to NOT having "anything" to do with anyone "not" a member of Calvary Temple (unless to try and persuade them to go to the church) and especially those who used to go to the church (like me).

I don't hold anything against Pastor Scott, Calvary Temple leadership, or previous friends still members of Calvary Temple. They're choosing what is right in their eyes and right for them and their lives. I'm doing the same for my life. I have forgiven being rejected by them. The season there at Calvary taught me a lot (i.e., healthy/ open and unhealthy/closed boundaries and groups). Had the church been more "healthy", I may have stayed there and then....I wouldn't have had the GREAT life I have had to date and I wouldn't have the amazing husband I have too!

Angela12345_1998@yahoo.com

Angela12345_1998

Wonderful post Angela, thank you.

Take care, be ready.

Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

I attended Calvary Temple Christian School for nine years and I can't even begin to tell you the terrible things that went on at that school. I would get a spanking every time I talked no matter what I was saying. Wooden paddles were what they would use on us. I also remember a affair that took place between a male teacher and a female friend of mine who was not wanting it to take place!

Our classes were bible classes. When I finally went to public school I was so far behind other students my age. I had to study twice as hard to just catch up to where I should be for my grade. Of course my grades were never high due to the fact that I learned nothing at CTCS.

I was not surprised at all by the article written on Pastor Scott. He always had a new vehicle every six months. Lived in a fancy home. His children were always the favorite. They were picked to play on every sport team even though they were never as good as the ones who got cut. I actually went to the Pastors home on many occasions for parties and I can say that there family never wanted for nothing thanks to his generous pay check from his congregation.

My heart truly goes out to the family of his deceased wife. How Pastor Scott could replace her in a matter of weeks and to say the BIBLE told him to take a young virgin wife!!!!! Sounds like a perverted old man wanting a young virgin girl. DISGUSTING! However, it did not surprise me at all.

Long story short, I was finally kicked out of CTCS because I kissed the boyfriend of the Pastors daughter. Before I was kicked out, I was spanked with a wooden paddle eight times. Made to be on my knees and pray for forgiveness and ask God to please not send me to hell. I was thirteen at the time and truly thought I was destined for hell. The kiss happened in my own home but I was punished at my school and my parents were never told of this punishment.

My mother drove the bus and my father helped build their buildings. They did all this for free! When my parents fell on hard times the church NEVER offered to help them in any way. My parents were made to tithe a percentage of their income as well. It seemed to be all about the money.

My parents were eventually shuned from the church for reasons that they have never spoken of.
I know my parents thought they were doing what was right for me at the time and I love them for wanting to give me the best life and education possible. I only know that whatever happened at CTCS left both my parents very hurt.

CTCS has many, many issues. I am not here to judge them in any way. All memories and words that I speak are the total truth. I was there and lived it for nine years. The teasing, beatings, teachings have truly affected my life in many ways. Some made me stronger and some made me have to fight a little in life to overcome them.

I just want to thank the person who finally brought the truth out about Pastor Scott and the goings on at his School and Church. It has given me some sort of closure in my life so THANK YOU and God bless you.

Bunnyboobear, 4merCT, and crackatoe

Hate, unforgiveness and bitterness will send you to hell just as fast as any other sin will...

I came across this post on the original blog associated with the article and I thought it was worth posting.

john414 wrote:
To members of Calvary Temple:
I attended Calvary Temple for many years. Through those years the Holy Spirit raised many red flags but to my shame I ignored them and made excuses for Star Scott. I am thankful that God opened my eyes and allowed me see the truth. I do not believe that Star Scott was initially trying to fleece people or manipulate and control people, but over the years he has begun to have his own agenda. He is wrongly interpreting and emphasizing “obey those who have rule over you” and “WE know best”. In addition, his teaching has become increasingly focused on Old Testament law and legalism rather than the grace of God in Jesus Christ alone. Read Paul’s writing for yourself, He was passionate about warning us of false teaching.

If the remaining congregants would just take a look at the character of Star Scott in light of the scripture, especially in light of our Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ, they would see the lack in his own Christ-likeness. This is a man who uses the pulpit to ridicule and mock anyone who does not agree with or obey him. This is a man who encourages people to shun those who have left Calvary to attend another church. This is a man who uses the scripture “the poor you will always have with you” as a reason why the money is not used to feed the hungry or minister to the poor. This is a man who lives a wildly self-indulgent lifestyle and calls it the blessing of the Lord.

In addition, consider one of the associate pastor’s recent teachings – he states that all those who have left Calvary Temple are NOT serving God, and need to be “killed” (not physically but through shunning) though he admits he has not talked to any of them. He says he has heard things. Would that be gossip? Do you really believe that ALL the people you knew who left CT are not serving God?

Dear brothers and sisters, think about it, one of your own pastors recently left. A captain left. A deacon left. Many other men and women who love God have left. Be courageous and do not be afraid to find out why people would walk away from years of ministry, family members, and lifelong friends. Are you not free to ask why they left?

The Holy Spirit will guide you into all truth. No one leaves Calvary on a whim; there just might be a very good reason. Go talk to people and ask questions. You have an obligation to search out the truth of God’s word. Not Star Scott’s. And when you hear His voice, you will know that you must obey God, not man. Then respond no matter what the cost.

Reading these posts, a few perls of wisdom spring to mind that I feel moved to share...

Hey, godsdaughter_tried_n_true, why don't you try shutting up?

If you were sensitive at all to the experiences endured by Bunnyboobear, 4merCT, and crackatoe, you would not have condemned them. Go learn what this means, "I will have mercy and not sacrifice", says the Lord, ya santimonious cult zombie! I picture you as a devout CT church goer, flashing the biggest oversized, padded leather King James (or whatever version) Bible to the rest of the CT zombie failful, yet lambasting them with your tongue for perceiving in them the slightest infraction of Biblical morality (real or imagined). Or worse yet, ostracizing them for questioning Pastor moneybag's teachings or expense account (they would be awakening from the zombie state, you see).

godsdaughter_tried_n_true, are you not like the pharisee that went to temple with the sinful tax collector in Jesus' parable (Luke 18:9-14), praising yourself before God for the stinking rags of your own "good works" while pointing out to God everone else's faults? I do not read in the posts of these former CT members that they are trying to justify themselves - they are just bewildered and hurt, yet continuing to seek God.

I tell you, godsdaughter_tried_n_true, that Bunnyboobear, 4merCT, and crackatoe shall go to their houses justified, rather than you. For everyone who exalts himself (this means you, godsdaughter_tried_n_true) will be humbled, but the one who humbles himself will be exalted.

But don't lose heart, godsdaughter_tried_n_true, our God is the God not only of the living but also God of the zombie dead too! When will you arise from your slumber, O you simple zombie?

Excuse me now, I must return to prayer.

"No servant can serve two masters. Either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve both God and Money."
Jesus Christ
Luke 16:13 NIV

Any questions?

OK his " racecar outreach" reminds me of a Charlie's Angels episode where Bosley and Jill pretended to be a race car ministry and they called it "Race for the Lord" and it was a cover while Sabrina pretended to be a race car driver all the while to bust a Mexican smuggling ring.... I bet Pastor Scott saw that episode too.

Did anyone else see this episode?

2 Timothy 3:1-12
This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come.
For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,
Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good,
Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;
Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.
For of this sort are they which creep into houses, and lead captive silly women laden with sins, led away with divers lusts,
Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.
Now as Jannes and Jambres withstood Moses, so do these also resist the truth: men of corrupt minds, reprobate concerning the faith.
But they shall proceed no further: for their folly shall be manifest unto all men, as theirs also was.
But thou hast fully known my doctrine, manner of life, purpose, faith, longsuffering, charity, patience,
Persecutions, afflictions, which came unto me at Antioch, at Iconium, at Lystra; what persecutions I endured: but out of them all the Lord delivered me.
Yea, and all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution.

2 Peter 3:2-3
That ye may be mindful of the words which were spoken before by the holy prophets, and of the commandment of us the apostles of the Lord and Saviour:
Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,

Isaiah 5:20-21
Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!
Woe unto them that are wise in their own eyes, and prudent in their own sight!

After trynig to stomach reading the majority of these ignorant and unlearned base comments it is obvious Jesus Christ isn't welcome in any of your professed churches and homes. Our nation, controlled by the god of this world would probably have crucified Jesus faster than the jews did! The funny thing is God is hearing the prayers of Pastor Scott for you, for mercy on your souls and compassion on your wickedness.
1 Corinthians 13:4-5
Charity suffereth long, and is kind; charity envieth not; charity vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up,
Doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil
If you all are gonna read all of the trash comments written before today you might as well read this to sum it all up.