Palin, Dobson and GOP GOD

I wish people would quit referring to Dobson and his band as "Evangelicals" or even Christian's. I am an Evangelical and Dobson most certainly is noit. He is a member of a pseudo-christian cult we call "Fundimentalism". I genuinely question whether any member of that sect has any faith in, much less a relationship with, Jesus Christ. If you want to know what they are all about, just follow the money and the worldly pleasures they wallow in.

Dobson seems unable to distinguish the contempt we feel for Bush for the hatred he feels for everybody who isn't like Dobson.

And we didn't feel this contempt for Bush, not in the overwhelming numbers there are now, until we saw Bush in action.

And Dobson? I do hate you. As one of the most vile and evil perpetrators of the right wing hate machine you've done more to contribute to our decay than even Bush The Simple has done.

Better start praying louder Dobson, so you can't hear the destruction of the republican party you've so thoroughly poisoned.

Dear Unabashed David Waters:
9/5/08, talking to Georgie Porgie Stepalloverus, Hussein referred to his Muslim faith. But don't my word for it, listen to the words of Ghadafi. Oh, by the way, did you see what the unabashed Obsama did? See below.

Obama and Ghadafi give nearly two million $ to Kenyan Thug
EmailWritten by ojtnews on Oct-15-08 1:31pm
From: islamichorrors.blogspot.com
Senator Obama and Libya's Ghadafi donated to Raila Odinga, who protested his 2007 loss in Kenya's election with a brutal wave of machete-wielding violence that killed an estimated 1,000 members of the Kikuyu tribe in January and February. Some 800 Christian churches also were destroyed or burned to the ground, without a single mosque being damaged.

I agree-- each of the four candidates are Christians. I'm not sure when certain denominations morphed into the only ones worth an association with the Dobson Crew, when each Christian denom is assumed to hold to the main tenets of the faith, i.e. the Apostle's Creed. Those basic statements should be believed by each candidate, no? Oh, and that's why Romney was never considered to be a Christian by many-- LDS congregants do not believe that Trinity mentioned by such Creeds, if I'm not mistaken.

I assume, too, that the beef the Dobson Crew has with anyone other than Republicans is abortion. Why don't they just admit that they do not consider them Christians because they won't oppose abortion across the board? However, because many Christians these days consider the sanctity of human life to extend to people outside the womb --the poor/needy, orphans, prisoners up for execution, those trapped in underground slavery/human trafficking, etc.-- they may choose to go attack some members of the GOP for forgetting this much larger group of sufferers. Those who choose abortion as their single plank of a pro-life platform seem to really suck when they identify with Christianity. That is why so many people lamented/scoffed at Bush's claim that his favorite philosophical hero was Jesus. It seemed like such a canned answer then (made me cringe though I love Jesus dearly, and I was pulling for Bush that year), and he didn't do much to follow through with emulating his professed Lord. Warmongering and contorting the Constitution (and shelling out party money to outfit people!) while avoiding taking the stand on China, India, and Sudan's human rights tragedies is breathtakingly awful.

Just my two cents!

So what station is God on? Is it radio or TV- I don't have XM so maybe that is why I haven't heard what God wants me to do on election day. I guess I will just vote the way studying the issues, the candidates and history tell me- Obama/Biden. And even if I can't find the channel God is on- I figure God doesn't like racist hatemongerers or self-serving media preachers- so Palin and Dobson are out.

Wait a minute. Didn't Dobson tell us that Bush was the man anointed by God to lead our country in time of crisis? Either Dobson has no idea what he's talking about, or God has a very, very sick sense of humor. Some people never learn, and Dobson is clearly one of them.

Dobson said that he was staying home this year. He said he would never vote for McCain. I guess Palin changed his mind. She must be one powerful sister.

To believe that God only dwells in the mind of Mr. Dobson is blasphemy. I happen to believe that Jesus espouses many of the beliefs of Mr. Obama and Mr. Biden. To present God as picking sides shows no understanding of the teachings of Jesus Christ.

I wondered what anti-American and anti-Christian views would look like if put together. I give thanks to God for revealing them. Here they are as copied from a previous post.

Dear Unabashed David Waters:
9/5/08, talking to Georgie Porgie Stepalloverus, Hussein referred to his Muslim faith. But don't my word for it, listen to the words of Ghadafi. Oh, by the way, did you see what the unabashed Obsama did? See below.

Obama and Ghadafi give nearly two million $ to Kenyan Thug
EmailWritten by ojtnews on Oct-15-08 1:31pm
From: islamichorrors.blogspot.com
Senator Obama and Libya's Ghadafi donated to Raila Odinga, who protested his 2007 loss in Kenya's election with a brutal wave of machete-wielding violence that killed an estimated 1,000 members of the Kikuyu tribe in January and February. Some 800 Christian churches also were destroyed or burned to the ground, without a single mosque being damaged.

Keep in mind that Dr. Dobson is a fundamentalist. Fundamentalists use tactics such as guilting and shaming and other methods of demonizing the perceived enemies. It is a very black-and-white, either right or wrong mentality that draws a clear line between "us" and "them." They believe they are in a perpetual battle with Satan, hence their rigid, usually authoritarian type of thinking that shuns critical thinking (the intellect is the province of Satan). You can see the loosening of such archaic thinking among people who endeavor college-level learning; as people learn to think outside the box they come to terms with the problems of fundamentalism. Although many "stray" from the fundamentalist values, it does not necessarily mean a renouncement of religion. They just know better than to follow the dictates of the religious elites.

Did James Dobson ever serve in the US Armed Forces? He has spoken about life not being the most important thing to him before( "there are issues here that are more important to me than my life"). Just wondering if he is just blowing smoke or talking his usual stuff.

" ...There are millions of people praying for you and for Sen. McCain. ..."

And if they do not win, what does that say?

LOL, I can think of many reasons that I have grown to look at Bush with disdain, but never, not even for a moment, did it occur to me to dislike for invocation Christ as his favorite philosopher.

On the other hand, my reason for holding DODSON in disdain IS his attempt to invoke Christ as his guide. Dodson is to me the epitomy of everything counter to Christ's teachings. He is hatemongerer, He is a hate monger and Christ is not. He is a political partisan, and Christ is not. He is a homophobe, and Christ is not. He is in favor of ignoring the plight of the poor and marginalized in the name of unfettered capitalist greed, and Christ is not.

I cannot recall the good reverend Dobson doing ANYTHING to promote the message of Christ, but I recall him doing EVERYTHING to promote the far right fringe of the GOP “hate thy neighbor” movement. Reverend Dobson does not represent Christ. He doesn’t even represent the mainstream of the GOP. As another writer here correctly discerened, Mr. Dobson represents a cultist fringe movement – one that dangerous both to the objectives of Christianity and to a free democracy.

I will keep asking this question until I get an answer. What is the word conception mean since everyone of the right says it as the litmus test?

Bob Dylan - Knockin' On Heaven's Door
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m2feoIM9baI

Matthew 7:7 -
Ask, Seek, Knock

"Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you."

Change we need
Obama/Biden '08

If the same people that are praying for McCain to win the presidency prayed for a downpour during Obama's acceptance speech, then I guess we've seen the power of prayer.

I'd also pay $200 to see Dobson waterboarded.

There is a Biblical term for such folks as the Rev. Dobson...

"Pharisee".

http://www.keyway.ca/htm2002/pharisee.htm

GOV PALIN AND THE ANTI CHRISTIAN MEDIA JIHAD

Mr. Waters just doesn't get it.

Obama was indoctrinated as a Muslim in Muslim schools as a child. His Mother TWICE married Muslim men embracing their Muslim worldview.

Then Obama claims to be a Christian while-- he claims--NEVER listening to his Pastor's Hate America and racist Hate Whites rants. Year after year after year he went to the Church but NEVER listened....

Why don't you INDEPENDENTLY determine whether Obama has embraced radical Muslim theology by ANALYZING and COMPARING his Pastors sermons with radical Muslim Jihad theology?

Gov. Palin is the real deal a Genuine Christian who reads the Bible, prays etc. And other Christians recognize this.

And so do anti Christians. The only response to Christians is to claim they are stupid...the same attack on VP Quayle.

And you can soon use the same attack...

on Vice President Sarah Palin.

To the GOP party: You better wake up now and find a moderate fiscal mature conservative who can lead the Republican party back to it's traditional roots before Palin becomes the choice to lead the GOP in 2012 fueled by the hatred of the religious right. She will surely destroy your party if it hasn't already been destroyed by the pandering McCain.

It surprises me how many of Dodson's followers have this "us against them" attitude.

I would like to remind the readers that when given a forum in a church (Rick Warren's Saddleback Church), McCain did not mention the name "Jesus" once. I find this curious.

James Dobson has a big problem. He diminishes the Christian message by encouraging the notion that God is partisan. This is patently false.

I see Obama as the possible David in opposition to McCain as a self-professed military Goliath. It is time to resolve this issue and send the Republicans (Philistines) into retreat for many years. People like Dobson and Robertson need time in the wilderness to sort things out. I hope that they take their Bibles with them.

After reading my Bibles ( I say Bibles for there are more than one) from cover to cover I find it hard to understand the certainty that so many preachers seem to have. Two words are always on the tip of their tongues; evil and sin. For me Plato had the best definition for evil. He claimed that evil was too much or too little and that the Good or God was the mean between the two. In the New Testament the Greek word for sin is 'harmarta' and the literal meaning is 'To miss the mark.' Remember the Bible was not written in English but in Hebrew and Greek. Today we have to many preachers who miss the mark (sin) and don't speak out against the evil of too many having too little and too few having too much. God is in the center not out in the fringes or extremes and unless a preacher speaks out against the excess of greed that defines our modern age he has little to do with the God in my Bibles. Mr Dobson must have a version that I do not have.

Dobson and Hagey from San Antonio have never been about following Chrst. They have always been about using religious people to gain money and political power for themselves and their exteded families. "God gave me all these good things because I am good" justifies them.

Grandpa, who never missed church, always said to watch your wallet around the folks from the front pew singing the loudest.

When Dobson referred to the press not giving her a break or letting up on her, that is the job of the press to vet those who will publicly represent us, and more importantly, she's only getting her share after only being sought after in the last days of August 2008. Secondly, Dobson also has his brand of condesending remarks by stating as most of his shows prefer women to be at home taking care of the children or working charitable events, that Palin speaks so eloquently, what did he expect from a politician. Its funny how he can give his views in the name of a 501C4 at anytime, he wants to use the Focus on the Family name, but with him things are only according to his ways, which are not as high as God's way and he is so not an authoritarian in this election. He would have held more clout if he upheld his stance for not endorsing a candidate as he said he would not in the beginning or did he just do an Obama per the campaign financing, so maybe Dobson really is a psuedo democrat.

DAWNSTARUSA! Nicely done!

Dobson wouldn't know a Christian if one were sitting on his lap reading from he New Testament. He and his ilk have this religion that is vengeful and insane one day and forgiving and kind the next. In the Dobson faith, the end justifies the means every time aka lets attack Iraq before they get us--absurdity in the extreme.

It is not a new religion. Early adherents include the knights of the crusade who murdered every man, women and child they found in Jerusalem after they successfully laid siege to the place in the first place. The sermon on the mount in Dobson's faith is no where near as important as Revelations where good "Christians" eventually get to sit at the side of God and judge the rest of us poor homo sapiens who for whatever reasons just don't get it.

Dr. Dobson and his hate peddlers represent the greatest threat to the survival of humanity--oh there are indeed others like him in other "faiths" but most of them don't live in the country with the greatest nuclear arsenal nor do they have the communications reach to those of us who are the most ignorant and scared. They also don't have the support of those in power who think they can keep Dr. Dobson and his faithful on a leash--a belief they hold at their own peril

This sort of thing cheapens politics. But more importantly it tarnishes Christianity. It drives people away from Christianity.

A few thoughts:
- The best part about a democracy is that (almost) anyone can vote and run for office. The bad part is (almost) anyone can vote and run for office. Democracy assumes that the electorate is informed.

- President Bush believes in the sanctity of life - from conception to birth.

I would like to believe that God will do what is right (as in appropriate, not conservative) for the country. But we still all have to vote anyway.

I rember the part of the bible were christians were fed to lions. I wondered why? than I read about a time when christians were thrown from a mountian and slamed into rocks!Don't forget Stalin how could someone be so hateful? than hitler spent most my time as a boy in church I now at 53 yr old can see why and realize how hateful you christians are.. May god have MERCY on your shameless selfish souls! JOSEPH TIMOTHY

Someone should ask Dobson, such an aid supporter of George Bush, whether Jesus Christ would support torture, parading prisoners around naked and forcing them to have sexual acts in front of the American guards, the unecessary invasion of a country? What a disgusting and immoral group of hippocrits the Christian Right is.

You republicans always want to play: My God can beat up your God"

I was always taught that Christianity was about love of God and love of neighbor. Dobson has a very narrow view of his neighbor and an even narrower view of God. I do not think God takes sides in elections. This is a totally human event where we all exercise our God given human free will. Sometimes we make a good choice and sometimes we don't. That is our human nature again.

Where in Dobson's America do the rest of us fit in? To wit: Americans who are Jews, Muslims, atheists, Hindus, Roman Catholics, Eastern Orthodox, liberal Protestant, agnostics, Buddhists, humanists, Unitarians, Scientologists, and Bokononists? Dobson's 'America' could be squeezed into Guatemala, with space left over for the Guatemalans....

So, Dobson, only adherents to your religious cult are worthy of being President?

Palin just went one step further in dragging you into her argument for why she isn't fit to be in any public office.

Faith is very personal, not a public or political issue. We will all find out eventually, in a most personal way, if there is a God.

Organizations like yours do not invite tolerance, love, or understanding; they cultivate distrust and exclusion towards all who dare to have a mind of their own.

Of course I don't expect you to give it any thought: like McCain and Palin, you are content with what you believe (and what has also made you a fine income, I'm certain). Otherwise you'd be peddling snake-oil from door to door instead...

Dobson and his ilk have the right to freedom of expression and he has no qualms in using it to contiue his utter comtempt for citzens who do not share his narrow views of life. But what does he mean by up thier and who is he refering to? Me you who knows?

This man (Dobson) is a joke, supporting a farce (Palin,) and some folks still act like we should listen to anything he says. He's a pathetic shill - a soon to be very disappointed pathetic shill...

I couldn't help noticing that if you add a narrow tooth brush mustache to Dobson's photo he very closely resembles an elderly Adolf Hitler or Charlie Chaplin.

fr Mrbrooks27:

>I wish people would quit referring to Dobson and his band as "Evangelicals" or even Christian's...

Me too, as he sure isn't Christian. Watch the movie "For The Bible Tells Me So" and see his treatment of a family who simply wanted to deliver a letter to "dr" dobdork.

Jaxmax,

Palin is no more Christian than i am, and i only go to church for weddings. From her comments she has no idea about real Christianity, the type where you are to be kind to your fellow man. Some thing all Christians have forgotten. Your version and hers is selective Christianity, in other words she talks the talk but her actions are far from walking the walk when it comes to Christianity...

The Radinga posting from Payton is a smear from GOP smearmaster Jerome Corsi.

Obama is not related to Radinga and never gave money to Radinga. It is a total lie.

http://fightthesmears.com/articles/23/odingasmear

We all knew Dobson would not sit out this election; HIS political career is too important for that. He's now falling all over himself to kiss up to McCain/Palin, not because they're Christian, but because their ticket (Palin) is willing to kiss back. He's found his mealticket to weasel his away back into power in Washington. David Waters is right that all the other candidates are Christian, too, so that's not a true factor. Dobson is simply doing his usual "us" against "them" routine in his latest latest power grab. If only more people would look criticially at him and his motivations, they'd notice how transparent his truly is.

Hey jaxmax, looks your brain transplant failed.

The first time I heard of Mr. Dobson was in the documentary "For the Bible tells me so". If in the name of Christ you destroy lives, people need to be praying for your soul instead! And we better watch-out for politicians who seek such support to increase their vote-base during elections.

You know I just love their audacity that anyone that disagrees with them( Dobson, Palin etc) are wrong and they are right.

I cannot stand their holier than thou attitudes. If they mess up it is okay. They find some thing in the bible that supports their wrong.

But their behavior does not exhibit a single thing that Jesus does. Jesus loves everyone. Well Rush Limbaugh- hates all minorities. Sarah Palin- I don't think she cares much for minorities either. Jesus loves everyone even them.

That right wing really is a trip. They are so into anti-abortion, family values, and gay bashing. But yet they turn around and want to cut social programs for the poor and elderly. While the jury is out on whether or not God approves of homosexuality. It doesn't mean that even if it is a sin that God loves them any less. Thank God he has no respect of persons. But this right wing surely does.
And cutting programs to the people who need it is certainly not what Jesus would do claiming the reasoning as less government. The reason why they want less government is so they can do whatever the heck they want no matter how wrong it is without anyone calling them on it. They will find a way to make it right and even go as far as saying it is the will fo God.

You are supposed to be winning souls for God not driving them away with fear. These people have made people scared of God and think he is unapproachable. That is not who God is. God is love and he cares. There is nothing we can do that he won't forgive as long as we ask.

First of all we all fall short of God's glory
Second - Last time I checked God is neither a Democrat or a Republican. Whoever wins will be according to his plan and his purpose. We can pray for whoever we wish but God has already made up his mind. We have to to catch up with the time and place to see who the winner of the Presidency is.
3rd- They always seem to get behind the GOP candidate. Well when did the last time John McCain who is the head of their ticket and not Palin go to church?

Ye who is without sin throw the first stone.

The foundation of God is love. God has NO RESPECT FOR MAN OR CHARACTER. God is a lover of those who love Him like they love their neighbor, EVEN IF IT IS A NASTY NEIGHBOR. Love your enemies, or so your Bible says...

What I hear from many so-called Christian is that God loves those who are blond heaird, blue eyed, and of light skin. There is a reason why Obama rallies are a more realistic view of America. There is something terribly wrong when a republican ralley has 4 black, 3 Asians and 50 hispanics. This is not a true picture of American (even if it is the America you wish you had). Look inside yourselves and you so-called Christianity and ask yourselves why this is the case.

God is not a biggot. God is not racist. Sny God that you serve that would sanction such behavior is a god (little g) not GOD (big G).

Hate, racism and religious vulgarity are not traits of God, His son, or His spirit.

Stop standing on your self-righteous soapbox and admit your transgression.

God will love your for it!

You know, and I am probably going to get some very angry responses about this, but there is not much difference between Christian Fundamentalism and Islamic Fundamentalism. Change Christ for Allah, and both Mr. Dobson and Mr. bin Laden are about as close minded and intolerant of anything that remotely smacks of critical thinking as any two human beings can be. Better for Barack Hussein Obama's (and yes I use the Hussein for a reason) name to share Osama bin Laden's language of origin than having a Dr. James Dobson share Osama bin Laden's worldview.

If Jesus Christ returned to earth tomorrow, evangelical 'Christians' of the ilk of Mr. Dobson would have him back up on the cross within a week.
They would denounce him as an imposter, a liar, a deranged fraud and of course, a menace to their streams of income. Two thousand years come and go and nothing changes.

Jaxmax, several people have already responded to you, but since I don't think that comments about brain transplants are very helpful, let me explain my exception to your comment: by uncritically lumping together the very different worldviews of Wright and Muslim Jihadists, you have effectively dismissed and dehumanized a significant percentage of the world's population that simply happens to not share your worldview. I do not think that you should in any way condone the violent results of the Jihadist agenda around the world. But I do think you should use extreme language like "Jihad" more responsibly (e.g. don't apply it to the American media just because they don't report what you want to hear) and I hope that you might consider the following: that the extremity of your rejection and your willingness to view the world as composed of irreconcilably polarized groups puts you in the same boat as the people you are attacking. In the big picture, you are not that different from anyone else with an uncompromising, us-against-them agenda.

"I wondered what anti-American and anti-Christian views would look like if put together. I give thanks to God for revealing them. Here they are as copied from a previous post.

Dear Unabashed David Waters:
9/5/08, talking to Georgie Porgie Stepalloverus, Hussein referred to his Muslim faith. But don't my word for it, listen to the words of Ghadafi. Oh, by the way, did you see what the unabashed Obsama did? See below.

Obama and Ghadafi give nearly two million $ to Kenyan Thug
EmailWritten by ojtnews on Oct-15-08 1:31pm
From: islamichorrors.blogspot.com
Senator Obama and Libya's Ghadafi donated to Raila Odinga, who protested his 2007 loss in Kenya's election with a brutal wave of machete-wielding violence that killed an estimated 1,000 members of the Kikuyu tribe in January and February. Some 800 Christian churches also were destroyed or burned to the ground, without a single mosque being damaged."

The whole point about lying is NOT TO GET CAUGHT!

Read the truth for yourself: http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/kenya.asp

Hey Kruhn,
You were right in your predictions. Your foul skinhead comments comparing the Christian and Muslim fundamentalists stand right up there with the protocols of Zion! Sounds like you are totally off your meds!!!

GOV PALIN AND THE ANTI CHRISTIAN MEDIA JIHAD

Mr. Waters just doesn't get it.

Obama was indoctrinated as a Muslim in Muslim schools as a child. His Mother TWICE married Muslim men embracing their Muslim worldview.

Then Obama claims to be a Christian while-- he claims--NEVER listening to his Pastor's Hate America and racist Hate Whites rants. Year after year after year he went to the Church but NEVER listened....

Why don't you INDEPENDENTLY determine whether Obama has embraced radical Muslim theology by ANALYZING and COMPARING his Pastors sermons with radical Muslim Jihad theology?

Gov. Palin is the real deal a Genuine Christian who reads the Bible, prays etc. And other Christians recognize this.

And so do anti Christians. The only response to Christians is to claim they are stupid...the same attack on VP Quayle.

And you can soon use the same attack...

on Vice President Sarah Palin.

rharring wrote:

Jaxmax,

Palin is no more Christian than i am, and i only go to church for weddings. From her comments she has no idea about real Christianity, the type where you are to be kind to your fellow man. Some thing all Christians have forgotten. Your version and hers is selective Christianity, in other words she talks the talk but her actions are far from walking the walk when it comes to Christianity...

RESPONSE--Then why is Gov Palin such a threat?

Why doesn't the Wash Po report on all of Rev. Wrights hate filled rants on the days Obama the Comatose was present?

Jaxmax:

How in the world do YOU know whether Palin, Quayle, or anyone else is "right with God"??? The only clue we are allowed to have (since I would assume that you don't know them personally) is "by their works." Well, in the Christian church I was raised in, "Christian works" do not include intolerance, accusing people of being anti-American because they aren't voting for you, falsely accusing someone of "palling around with terrorists", abusing your power as governor to carry out a personal vendetta, or stuffing your pockets with taxpayer money for your commute home from work.

Also: how good of a Christian was GWB being when he told the Justice Deptartment lawyers to "stop waiving the Constitution in my face---it's just another G**D*mn piece of paper!"???? Just wondering, since he's another one of the GOP politicians that you on the "religious right" love to puff up as being such a man of God....

Well I suppose as Heinlein once said, if you pray hard enough, water will run up hill. How hard, well hard enough to run up hill, of course.

Meanwhile, Dobson,when he "condemned" Matthew Shepard to "hell" for being gay and desperately tried to interrupt his funeral, showed himself as a person without shame, or compassion for others.

If Palin and Dobson are the new voices of the Republican Party, it will need all the prayers it can get because, as the Whigs were destroyed by teh slavery question so the Republicans will continue to be destroyed by the "God in government" question.

Sorry to post so quickly again, but I wanted to respond to the poster who repeatedly points out Raila Odinga as a machete-wielding thug friend of Obama. Why don't we discuss Mr. Odinga? Raila Odinga is the Kenyan Prime Minister of a power-sharing government with President Mwai Kibaki brokered by then UN Secretary General Kofi Annan. However, Raila Odinga probably won the election but it was stolen by the government. In fact an exit poll by the International Republican Institute (an organization chaired by none other than Senator McCain) said that Odinga won the Kenyan elections of 2007 by 6 points. Even the Kenyan media gave Odinga a narrow lead during election night, but two days after the election the Kenyan Electoral Commission declared Mwai Kibaki the winner by 232,000 votes out of a total of over 9 million votes cast. However the Odinga camp disputed 300,000 of the votes adjudicated to Mwai Kibaki. (hanging chads anyone?)

That Obama may have supported Odinga was that his father is Luo, of the same ethnic background as Odinga. In fact, a bitter joke in Kenya was that a Luo (Obama) will probably be first President in the United States than in Kenya. Raila Odinga's supporters did commit barbarous acts against Kikuyu living outside their ancestral homelands in Kenya, but Mwai Kibaki, a Kikuyu, also incited his supporters and used the tools of the state to suppress Odinga and his supporters.

No one's hands were clean in Kenya during this tragedy, but to use Obama's support of Raila Odinga, the winner of the 2007 Kenyan elections as evidenced by an election-monitoring organization chaired by Senator McCain, as another example of "palling with terrorists" is spurious and irresponsible.

These people have substantial numbers of followers and each is as much a citizen of this country as the rest of us. They have the right to their opinion, to their religion and to their ability to petition the government. They have the right to support politicians who embrace their worldview. That is what makes our country simultaneously great and dangerous. We may not agree with extremists but we are very limited in what we can do to censor their views. Worse, their views are hard to ignore when they are embraced by a substantial proportion of the US population. It is important for the people of the US to keep a close watch on such extremists, to engage them (and particularly to engage their children, who are so easily indoctrinated) and to offer thoughtful alternatives to hate, religious elitism and lies in the name of god. It is becoming ever more important for each of us to engage politically and provide support for candidates who embrace and practice hope, love for all and faith in man and God. We will never be able to stop political and religious extremism. Our goal should be to gently teach extremists that alternatives are valid and to challenge them to open their hearts and minds to a broad and inclusive worldview. Love will conquer, hope will prevail and faith will guide us to a better nation, a better world and to the promised land.

That wasn't an interview. That was an infomercial.

Quoted:

"Posted on October 23, 2008 17:39

SMMajid_1 :
Hey Kruhn,
You were right in your predictions. Your foul skinhead comments comparing the Christian and Muslim fundamentalists stand right up there with the protocols of Zion!"

I been called many things but never anti-Semite. Well there's is always a first time! And the funny things is that, I never even mentioned Judaism.

At least I can claim to have listened to Mr. Dobson's radio show and have read bin Laden's rants and see certain similarites. Can you say the same, Mr. (or Ms.) SMMajid?

Now you SMMajid, sir, would do fine to perhaps present some arguments to support your positions regarding how does Commparing Christian and Islamic fundamentalism compares to anti-Semitism.

I hope Dobson and his followers don't pray for Obama to win the election. I would much rather read on November 5th his reasons why God didn't answer their prayers to elect McCain and Palin to office. I find it personally disgusing that a purported Christian "leader" would be asking God to determine our elections.

MRAYMOND10 wrote:

"It is important for the people of the US to keep a close watch on such extremists, to engage them (and particularly to engage their children, who are so easily indoctrinated) and to offer thoughtful alternatives to hate, religious elitism and lies in the name of god. "

RESPONSE--Well, you have cogently expressed the Obama agenda for Christians.

Wow, this is the same guy who believes Teletubies kid's show is promoting homosexuality.. the guy is a total far right-wing whack-o.. he's a claims to be Christian and so did Adolf Hitler.

If I didn't know any better I would believe God God Damned America the day Bush won.

It's been hell in this country ever since.

These Fake Christians almost lead to the destruction of us all.

These people believed Bush was a Christian.

How stupid are they. It's no surprise they still believe in a 2000 year old book.

For Christ sake they believed the world was flat.

Soon, very soon, God's will will be revealed. Or not. Run for Alaska, Dobson, run and join the secessionist movement. Palin for President of the Republic of Alaska! Take the Redneck Remnant with you. All the Fundamentalists can pray for global warming and turn Alaska into a blessed garden. The Christian Sparta will be flesh.

Oh Dobson, you hypocite. And Palin, you fool...

Tell me good Pastor sir, and Sweet Sister Sarah what WOULD Jesus say to someone who actually took $150,000 in new clothes???

That money would have fed the hungry and clothed the poor. How much medicine could have been bought for that much money???

How do either of you sleep at night? I know you are both ever so pious...but perhaps one more reading of The Sermon on the Mount might be in order.

Charles Carroll - signer of the Declaration of Independence stated :

" Without morals a republic cannot subsist any length of time; they therefore who are decrying the Christian religion, whose morality is so sublime and pure...are undermining the solid foundation of morals, the best security for the duration of free governments." [Source: To James McHenry on November 4, 1800.]

America is losing its morals. Part of America will cease to exist soon. As the above statement says, IT WONT SUBSIST ANY LENGTH OF TIME. The republicans are here to stay folks. The Democrats, well, Im not so sure about that. Ask Charles Caroll.

Obama’s partisan support for Odinga was considered so transparent, that the Kenyan Government spokesman, Alfred Matua, complained of political posturing to aid Odinga’s election chances: “It is very clear that the senator has been used as a puppet to perpetuate opposition politics,”(“Walking The World Stage” Newsweek 9/11/06) And, “…we earlier thought he was mature in his assessment of Kenyan and African politics,” Mutua told AFP.”We forgive him because it is his first time in the Senate and he is yet to mature into understanding issues of foreign policy,” he said.”(“Obama’s Kenya Honeymoon Ends Abruptly After Graft Rebuke” 8/29/06) Subsequently, Ambassador Ogingo Ogego made a public complaint to the US.(“Kenyan Envoy Kicks Off Diplomatic Row” My Africa 9/27/2006)

Raila Odinga subsequently lost the controversial (probably rigged) presidential election. In what appeared to many—including Human Rights Watch– as a coordinated strategy from the top, (“Violence We Fled was Planned, Say Kenyan Refugees” Reuters 1/26/2008 and “Kenya: Violence Planned Before Poll, Says Report” The Nation 3/18/2008) his Luo supporters (a core of whom call themselves The Taliban”(“Ethnic Gangs Rile Kenyan Slums” Newsweek 1/10/08)) engaged in what US Envoy Jendayi Frazer called “clear ethnic cleansing” (“US Envoy Calls Violence in Kenya ‘Ethnic Cleansing’” USA Today 1/30/2008) of the Kikuyu opposition.

Odinga’s supporters went on a rampage—burning Kikuyu homes and businesses, (“Ethnic Cleansing in Luoland” The Economist 2/7/2008) raping Kikuyu women, and murdering everyone in their path—including at least 50 Christian Kikuyu woman & children who had sought refuge in a church. They burned them alive. (“Mob Burns Kenyans Seeking Refuge In Church” CNN 1/10/2008)

YOU SAY ODINGA, I SAY OBAMA

AND JUST HOW WOULD OBAMA ADDRESS AN EMP MISSILE ATTACK FROM AN IRANIAN FREIGHTER THAT WAS SCUTTLED AT SEA AFTER THE LAUNCH?

A NUCLEAR ARMED SHAHAB-3 MISSLE, EXPLODING 300 MILES OVER ANY MAJOR US CITY WOULD CREATE ELECTROMAGNETIC PULSES.

GAMMA RAYS SCATTER IN WHAT IS CALLED THE COMPTON EFFECT AND 3 SEPARATE PULSES DISABLE CONSUMER ELECTRONICS, SOME AUTOMOBILES, AND, MOST IMPORTANTLY,

THE HUNDREDS OF LARGE TRANSFORMERS THAT DISTRIBUTE POWER THRUOUT THE USA.

ALL OF OUR LIGHTS, REFRIGERATORS, TVs AND RADIOS STOP RUNNING [EXCEPT VACUUM TUBE MODELS WITH INDEPENDENT POWER GENERATORS.]

FOR ALL INTENTS AND PURPOSES, MOST COMMUNICATIONS EQUIPMENT ARE RENDERED USELESS.

SUCH AN EMP [ELECTROMAGNETIC PULSE] ATTACK WOULD EFFECTIVELY THROW AMERICA BACK INTO THE EARLY 19TH CENTURY.

PERHAPS HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS OF US WOULD DIE FROM LACK OF FOOD AND WATER AND AS A RESULT OF SOCIAL BREAKDOWN.
------------------------------------
NOT LIKELY UNDER A MCCAIN PRESIDENCY ----

SO DO YOU FEEL LUCKY ????????

[REMEMBER MAGNUM FORCE WITH CLINT EASTWOOD,

'I KNOW WHAT YOU'RE THINKING -- DID HE FIRE 5 SHOTS, OR WAS IT 6 ? WELL, I DON'T RIGHTLY REMEMBER, BUT SEEING AS THIS IS THE MOST POWERFUL HANDGUN IN THE WHOLE WORLD -- WHY IT COULD BLOW YOUR HEAD CLEAN OFF --- DO YOU FEEL LUCKY -- WELL DO YA SCUM ???' ---- WHERE ONLY THE INSANE 'FELT LUCKY' MUCH TO CLINT'S 44 MAGNUM'S APPRECIATION.

SO DO WE FEEL LUCKY TOO ?????????

Dobson is what suffices for a modern monster, a retrograde and hopeless mind that makes me sick to my stomach. These idiots who claim knowledge of god are the real enemy of good people on this Earth. A dense pageant queen with $500 in makeup on her face pandering to a medieval old man who'd murder every Palestinian just so his Biblical fantasies seem more real. That is one sick group on the Right. Real old school conservatives take the votes, but they laugh behind their backs at the likes of Dobson and Palin.

Dobson is one to talk about hate - he knows it well and spews it all the time in the name of poor old Jesus.

May the God of the whole universe negate the evil of intolerant white evangelical god of power and money Dobson serves for self-glory and riches.

Like he and his lemmings prayed to their god for rain at Obama's nomination in Denver, let them pray for Palin, too. It's a right in America that they would take away from others.

For years after being mayor and governor, Palin never bought pretty clothes I guess. The party thinks she needs pretty clothes to be "presentable". Sarah was just a loyal foot soldier. I think she was even clueless how much those clothes cost. They gave it to her and she just wore it. It's that simple.

If she was corrupt and vain, those clothes won't be needed in the first place coz she will have lots of them even before this vice pres. race. THE NEED FOR CLOTHES JUST SHOWS HER BEING A SIMPLE WOMAN FOR YEARS.

I'm sorry, but since there is no god (yep, don't exist) this is all totally irrelevant.

Spidermean,

I couldn't tell if you had tongue-in-cheek or not. Surely you don't believe that the GOP has a monopoly on "morals". Although the "Christian Coalition" has been trying to make that claim ever since they worked to bounce perhaps the most moral, born-again Christian man ever to hold the office out of the White House in favor of a divorced and remarried (and, thus, adulterous, according to both Testaments) former actor who hadn't darkened the doors of a church in decades because he was somehow "God's candidate"....

spatula, do you think your nose will form that way if there was no God? Will your lungs strive to breathe just by itself? THINK, THINK THINK. That's the use of your brain.

James Dobson doesn't have a loving heart. He has read the bible and sees a meaning that aligns with his beliefs. I have read the bible and see it differently.
I think Jesus would like me better.

The "offense of the cross" to which Dobson refers is not what he thinks it is. The offense of the cross is that it was a form of capital punishment. Imagine Jesus in the 2sst century being executed in an electric chair. Christians would be wearing electric chairs around their necks and making the sign of the electric chair, putting electric chairs on our graves. Now that would gross out the checker at Safeway. That would be offensive. What if, like Jesus on the cross, we put him in an electric chair and sang songs about it. That would be very very strange. THAT's the offense of the cross.

Dobson and his ilk have lost the sense of being really offensive. Dobson, like the Pharisees and Sadducees, has completely bought into "respectability and the 'moral life'". By doing that he and all like him have dissociated themselves with the very offenseive, very eccentric, friend of prostitutes and sinners. Dobson defends the culture. He doesn't offend it. Dobson a collaborator in the destruction of the human spirit which Jesus loved. Jesus loved people MORE than he loved his beliefs. DObson wants to sacrifice your humanity on the altar of his nincompoopery.

Palin? Just one of his winged monkeys.

James Dobson -- High thing raised up against the knowledge of God.

it's interesting the qualities of Dobson's imaginary friend. that he needs business agents (like Dobson, Wright, et al) at all shows his lack of power: he can't collect money or build his own churches. Obviously he isn't able to pick good candidates either.

"EliPeyton :
Obama’s partisan support for Odinga was considered so transparent, that the Kenyan Government spokesman, Alfred Matua, complained of political posturing to aid Odinga’s election chances: “It is very clear that the senator has been used as a puppet to perpetuate opposition politics,”(“Walking The World Stage” Newsweek 9/11/06)"

In context:

"The delirium evoked memories of Bill Clinton's 12-day African visit in 1998. But while Clinton came offering apologies--for slavery, for genocide in Rwanda, for America's support of a motley crew of despots--Obama came armed with tough love. "I want to be a truth teller," he told me during a lengthy conversation in Nairobi. And he played that role to the hilt. In South Africa, he scoffed at Health Minister Manto Tshabalala-Msimang's home remedies for AIDS. He blasted Zimbabwe's Robert Mugabe, whose schemes have made a violent mess of his country. And he hit the government in Khartoum for the genocide in Sudan. But his most unrelenting critique was of Kenya. He took the government to task for violating freedom of the press, lectured its citizens on the folly of tribalism and slammed government corruption in a nationally televised speech: "While corruption is a problem we all share, here in Kenya it is a crisis."

Prominent visitors have criticized Kenyan corruption before. But hearing the message from Obama was different. For he was seen not only as a fellow Kenyan standing up to power, but also as a Luo standing up to a Kikuyo--the dominant ethnic group to which President Mwai Kibaki belongs and against which Luo resentment runs deep. And worse, in the government's eyes, at least, he was seen as siding with the opposition--in particular with Raila Odinga, a powerful kingmaker and Luo whose Orange Democratic Movement has been a painful thorn in Kibaki's side. "It is very clear that the senator has been used as a puppet to perpetuate opposition politics," sniffed Kibaki spokesperson Alfred Mutua."

From the same Newsweek article.

Wow, what a dastardly man...

I would like to ask people who post comments to go to www.google.com (or any other search engine) and type in the search window the words “Snopes Owner History Wikipedia”. Then type in the search window “Factcheck Owner History Wikipedia”. In your mind, take note of who owns each of these websites and how they check the input that comes to them. I believe you will see that Snopes is often based on rumors instead of facts. It is sometimes used by people whose intent is to mislead people who rely on information from postings, blogs, and forwarded emails. Sometimes the forwarded emails say "This was check out on Snopes." It often is the case that the information was indeed checked out on Snopes and was found to be false but the information that is passed on does not mention that it was found to be false. Therefore readers who do not check for themselves are reading and forwarding false information. www.snopes.com is privately owned. www.factcheck.org is not privately owned. When you look up information on www.factcheck.org, remember to type org instead of com in the web address.

It's very easy which party is immoral. Massachusetts, California, and just lately Connecticut are all hardline Democratic states. They all allow abortion and gay marriage which the Bible oppose. More are coming and without a doubt, all will be Democratic states. We have new Sodoms in the making.

Surely we'll have a "new" cities burning as well just like what happened with Sodom.

It's very easy to distinguish which party is immoral. Massachusetts, California, and just lately Connecticut are all hardline Democratic states. They all allow abortion and gay marriage which the Bible opposes. More are coming and without a doubt, all will be Democratic states. We have new Sodoms in the making.

Surely we'll have a "new" cities burning as well just like what happened with Sodom.

Dobson is a traitor and coward. His followers are America's version of the Taliban, taking refuge behind a crucifix. Their 15 minutes of fame is over. For the rest of us, the vast, vast majority who are not, ultra-facists who bathe themselves in psuedo-christianity, Dobson's demise is a good thing. If there is a heaven, he's certainly not going there. God doesn't forgive those that carry hate to their grave and urge others to behave the same. Those of you fools who believe that all that is necessary to get to heaven is to accept Jesus as you lord & savior and send money to televangelist hate-spewers like Dobson are delusional. You might as well worship Apollo, or a rock, or practice Santoria. You're responsible for your acts. Get out of my schools, my libraries, my bedroom, and my government. Get out or be thrown out on your asses!

Dobson is a disgrace to the message of Jesus,yet he cries out for His help and that is what he needs. His heart is so filled with hate and malice that only his coming to terms with his God and will can free him from his sickness.

Pookiecat wrote "You might as well worship Apollo, or a rock"

Would you believe that those who do worship those things are voting of Obama? You belong to that crowd, dude.

Pookiecat wrote "You might as well worship Apollo, or a rock"

Would you believe that those who do worship those things are voting for Obama? You belong to that crowd, dude.

Dobson has a very good reason to hope the GOP wins: one of his major contributors is the head of the private army Blackwater (who gets 90-plus percent of his money from the US government), and if that firm is finally held accountable for failing to prevent - and blocking the investigations of - the rapes and murders of numerous American and Iraqi civilians, there goes his cash cow.

If Dobson were really a man of God, he would reject blood-money. Instead he revels in it. The fact that Palin would even sit down to an interview with such a person is another black mark on her soul. He's just as bad as Pat Robertson with his African blood diamond investments. "By their fruits ye shall know them."

spidermean2 Author Profile Page:

It's very easy which party is immoral. Massachusetts, California, and just lately Connecticut are all hardline Democratic states. They all allow abortion and gay marriage which the Bible oppose. More are coming and without a doubt, all will be Democratic states. We have new Sodoms in the making.

Surely we'll have a "new" cities burning as well just like what happened with Sodom.
_____________________________
Dr. Dobson? Glad you could join us. Perhaps you could explain to why G*d is keeping Obama ahead in the polls? Can't he just strike down the enemies of the Republican party? Or maybe you could pray for G*d to lead the Republicans out of this land of Sodom perhaps to a new land - like Alaska. That way, the Democrats could just stay behind and develop the US into a fully formed, progressive nation focused on equality, innovation and economic prosperity and you guys can live in Alaska with Presidents Dobson and Palin (I don't think McCain is pro-life enough).

Let me know what you think.

Sarah Palin is the ultimate stealth Dominionist candidate and that makes her absolute objectionable. Dominionists would stand the Constitution on its ear let alone world history and the urgent need to correct global warming..

That Dominionists have insinuated themselves in political life suggests their intent to foist their narrow view of existence on the majority..

Time to stop fooling around with this .. Sarah is the most rabid right wing Dominionist to get this close to the White House since..since..since..George W. Bush..but the difference is that George W. Bush used it for political power..Sarah actually believes it...

SPIDERMEAN2 :
It's very easy to distinguish which party is immoral. Massachusetts, California, and just lately Connecticut are all hardline Democratic states. They all allow abortion and gay marriage which the Bible opposes. More are coming and without a doubt, all will be Democratic states. We have new Sodoms in the making.

Surely we'll have a "new" cities burning as well just like what happened with Sodom.
_______________________________________________

And yet Massachusetts also has the lowest divorce rate, low crime rates, low rates of drug addiction and teenage pregnancy... And the Bible-thumpin' parts generally have the highest. Take Alaska, for example, which has the highest rates of sexual assault in the country.

If that's your New Jerusalem, I'll take my chances with Sodom and Gomorra any day.

Please make your opinion count: VOTE.
No opinion counts unless you VOTE.

Increase your voting power by getting others to VOTE.
Please use the next 2 weeks encouraging others to VOTE!

Focus on CHANGE WE NEED: Obama '08

Democrats had placed us into this mortgage mess which then put us into economic tailspin : http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081020/ap_on_bi_ge/the_influence_game_housing

Democrats are very soft on pouncing on future TROUBLE SPOTS like it did with the Taliban in Afghanistan and pre-911 terrorist attacks until they were successful in 911. That attack pushed us into this war.

Democrats enriched communist China by having unfettered trade with them despite the fact that they are still COMMUNISTS and dangerous and oppressive to religion. China is much more dangerous today than it ever was. Thanks to Democrats' FORESIGHT. This too will be a problem of the next president. Im glad the Dems are winning coz they would handle this coming problem. They started it, let them solve it.

Democrats placed us into an OIL CRISIS because of their "green" laws. That contributed much to our economic downturn.

Democrats are very tough on trade to the extreme. The world would truly miss the gentleness of the Republicans on this area. Oftentimes you won't give idiots what they wish coz it would spell more trouble. The world want a Democrat so give them the Democrats. When these people start complaining, I want you to remember that they CHOSE this. Stupidity, BIG TIME.

Democrats will fast tract abortion, gay marriage rights and everything liberal. God will not help us when these coming troubles pour at us.

If Bush was "hellish", see what real hell is once the Dems take over. Remember Sodom?

Dobson is a fool and a false prophet (to the extent there are any dolts who coonsider him to be a phrophet). If he were alive 2,007 years ago and heard the Sermon on the Mount he would have decried it as godless socialist propaganda and been the first to drive a stake into Chrit's hands.

"And I will kill her children with death;" .

Does it sound like coming from an Islamic extremist? Nope. Those are the words of God and it's directed to the liberal Democratic parts of America.

"And I will kill her children with death; and all the churches shall know that I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts:"

This is what is in store for liberal America. It's already written in the prophecy. Obamaland is doomed.

Don't you get it, David? Unless you believe in God the way that Dobson and the American Taliban do, you don't believe in God, so far as they're concerned.

If Christ were to come back tomorrow, he would slap Dobson’s arrogant face.

What is the first Commandment give to Moses.

"I am The Lord your G_d, Who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage. You shall have no other gods before Me."

I think that Dobson has a golden calf as a G_D.

The god of Palin and Dobson is a tribal god. The howler here is that Dobson's view of women would not allow Palin to be a pastor in his church. She, of course, hasn't a clue. It will be a great day when the President-elect takes his oath on telephone book and tells the ayatollahs and religious nut jobs to take a flying leap.

Dobson: praying for republicans and rewarded with cash flow! He's a Lobbyist!

[Vomiting]

Dearest Spidermean2,

Did god really say all that claptrap? Sounds like he's a really immature guy with repressed sexual problems. Coincidently, he sounds an awful lot like one of those terrorists threatening the same thing: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2006/10/22/INGA9LS0721.DTL

Thanks but no thanks on that bridge to nowhere.

I wonder if Dobson has ever studied the New Testament? His inane prattling would suggest that he isn't very familiar with it. He would surely be shocked at its socialist overtones; its admonitions that we should care for the poor, the sick and the oppressed, by working with them and sharing our resources with them. Yes - I am pretty sure Dobson would have Jesus nailed right back on that cross for daring to preach that socialist agenda!

surely, by now the huge majority of christians have figured out what dobson, robertson, and falwell were all about. it was never about salvation, it was about power. christianity was just a way of getting what they really sought.

i figured this crew out in the early 80s, took their idol's advise and voted with my feet. i quit the baptists and have not darkened a door of that denomination in over two decades.

the quickest way to get me to the polling booth is to have a candidate's opponent claim to be the 'christian candidate.'

dobson preaches a god i neither know nor respect.

To spidermean2:

Luke 18:9-14

[9] To some who were confident of their own righteousness and looked down on everybody else, Jesus told this parable: [10] "Two men went up to the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the other a tax collector. [11] The Pharisee stood up and prayed about himself: 'God, I thank you that I am not like other men -- robbers, evildoers, adulterers -- or even like this tax collector. [12] I fast twice a week and give a tenth of all I get.'

[13] "But the tax collector stood at a distance. He would not even look up to heaven, but beat his breast and said, 'God, have mercy on me, a sinner.'

[14] "I tell you that this man, rather than the other, went home justified before God. For everyone who exalts himself will be humbled, and he who humbles himself will be exalted."

SHAME on you. Humble yourself.

outlawtorn103 wrote "he (God) sounds an awful lot like one of those terrorists threatening the same thing: "

The people of Sodom thought likewise and it didn't stop them from burning.

The President Who Stole Christmas! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=doChINcDTJU

The Antichrist Has Come! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d7vh5LJjJhc

"That created hatred for him (Bush, not Jesus) for months and months and it's one of the reasons they despise him so much today because he had the courage to speak the name of Christ," Dobson said.

I read somewhere that even the Devil can quote scripture.

"unabashed christians?"
hardly.
last time I checked, Gov. Palin is still the only candidate consistently mentioning God in her speeches and announcements.
The nearest Obama came was his so-called religious speech "Call to Renewal", which was hailed by the Washingotn Post as the most important address since JFK's. I read the entire thing, and he didn't mention a single one of his religious views. The one thing he said was that he personally opposed abortion, but wouldn't vote against it (nothing shows your values are for sale better than "I'm personally opposed, but...")
Yes, all four have mentioned God, or Christ, but none speak about their beliefs as Gov. Palin does. Obama has yet to reject Rev. Wright.

Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity and co. are certainly not mainstream media; if they were, we would be in a lot better shape.

For an 'unabashed Christian', Obama has yet to show any Christian values, let alone the logic and reason behind them.

To all you CHristian folk out there,

just remember

Dobson's "GOD" is better than your "God"

Just the same as saying his followers are more "patriotic" than your followers - SAME DIFFERENCE

I used to greatly respect Dobson's efforts to help the family. That started to diminish over the past few years because of his alliance with a political party. Now it's just gone.

Dobson has forgotten that the reason David wanted the prophet Nathan around, wasn't to have a cheerleader. It was to have a voice unafraid to speak to power. And thus, to ensure accountability of leadership. When religious leaders become so allied to a political party, they surrender their prophetic voice, and the faith and security of all is diminished. Eventually, they just become Christian "Taliban."

A topsiturvy world.

The people who oppose killing of babies insdie the womb and perverted sex are now called the Taliban Christians.

The brains of these people had gone haywire. What have you been eating all these years folks?

God is not a maker of trash. He will burn this topsiturvy trash soon.

Last time I checked, David Waters, none of the dozens of reporters I know -- at the Post, the Times, Newsweek, Time, Salon, Slate, etc. -- remotely entertained the idea that Obama's "Christian faith" was anything other than a cynical political maneuver. A transparent, opportunistic sham.

And they admire him all the more for the way he's faking his way though all this distasteful business of "religious vetting."

Perhaps all four of the people on the ticket are deserving of "Christian prayers," as you so contemptuously suggest.

But "admiration"?

Only from the faithless and the deluded.

with malice toward none, with charity for all, with firmness in the right as God gives us to see the right. (Do obasmics even know who said that?)

The obasmic translation reads: with malice toward those that disagree with the donkey version of reality, with love for infanticide, with weakness in the sight of our enemies.

If you guys had been in charge during the Civil War--first of all Africans would still be enslaved. If you guys had been in charge on April 19, 1775, you would have handed Samuel Adams and John Hancock over to the British and suggested we pay more tax on our tea.

"Resolved, That the enactments of the State Legislatures to defeat the faithful execution of the Fugitive Slave Law, are hostile in character, subversive of the Constitution, and revolutionary in their effect."

--Platform of the Democratic Party, 1860

"Instead of restoring the Union, it [the Republican Party] has, so far as in its power, dissolved it, and subjected ten states, in time of profound peace, to military despotism and Negro supremacy."

--Platform of the Democratic Party, 1868

"These Negroes, they're getting pretty uppity these days and that's a problem for us since they've got something now they never had before, the political pull to back up their uppityness. Now we've got to do something about this, we've got to give them a little something, just enough to quiet them down, not enough to make a difference. For if we don't move at all, then their allies will line up against us and there'll be no way of stopping them, we'll lose the filibuster and there'll be no way of putting a brake on all sorts of wild legislation. It'll be Reconstruction all over again."

--Sen. Lyndon B. Johnson (D., Texas), 1957

"I do not think it is an exaggeration at all to say to my friend from West Virginia [Sen. Robert C. Byrd, a former Ku Klux Klan recruiter] that he would have been a great senator at any moment. . . . He would have been right during the great conflict of civil war in this nation."

--Sen. Christopher Dodd (D., Conn.), 2004
Chairman, Committee on Banking, Housing and Urban Affairs
Candidate for the Democratic presidential nomination, 2008

Who is James Dobson that he can judge others spiritually? Sin is sin and from what I've heard on the campaign trail everybody needs to repent. Again, most people believe men like these rather than believe God thats why there isn't any great improvement in our lives. The Bible talks about many being on milk rather than meat. If MR. Dobson was to truly preach and teach the Word of God, this article would not have been written the way that it was written. Thats all I'm going to say on this subject because men like these are a dime a dozen. Yet the harvest is plentious but the laborers are few. True laborers are few.

Dear Mr. Dobson- Millions of people are also praying for Barack Obama and Joe Biden. By no means are all Christians and "God-fearing" people all voting Republican.

In fact, if you analyze many issues from a perspective of love and concern for one's fellow human, the Democratic ticket comes out on top. For example, Obama advoctes comprehensive health care for all and giving a priority to saving our Earth's environment. Jesus would be proud of both positions!

This Christian is voting Democratic this year!

gerard2003 , if America would follow the verses you mentioned, there will be no second Sodom. It's that simple. Sodom was burned to serve as an example as to what happens if people won't believe. It's that simple. America has become a nation of unbelievers so those parts of America would burn. It's that simple.

tarheeler :
I used to greatly respect Dobson's efforts to help the family. That started to diminish over the past few years because of his alliance with a political party. Now it's just gone.

Dobson has forgotten that the reason David wanted the prophet Nathan around, wasn't to have a cheerleader. It was to have a voice unafraid to speak to power. And thus, to ensure accountability of leadership. When religious leaders become so allied to a political party, they surrender their prophetic voice, and the faith and security of all is diminished. Eventually, they just become Christian "Taliban."
==============================================
How is infanticide practiced in North Carolina? Do you prefer to let the baby lie there in a trash can, gasping for its last breath, or do you slice the baby into bits? I honestly don't know how Darth Obama stands on the issue today. Last week, his Brown Shirt field operations manual stated on page 47 that the "hope and change crap" is supposed to continue through the 4th of November, and that on November 5, 2008, the infanticide killings can pick back up without fear of negative press. What's the scene like there in Mount Pilot?

Sigh.

I am a follower of Jesus. I rarely call myself a Christian anymore, because of what Dobson and those of his ilk have done to that moniker. And no, my conservative brothers and sisters, this is the not the same as being ashamed of the gospel. I'm ashamed of my brother, James Dobson. Hebrews says that Jesus is not ashamed to call us brother, but I'm sure ashamed to be associated with him.

To start with, Dobson says, [speaking out for Christ] "created hatred for him (Bush, not Jesus) for months and months and it's one of the reasons they despise him so much today because he had the courage to speak the name of Christ."

People like me don't have a problem with Bush because he "spoke the name of Christ." We have a problem with him because his is, curiously, incompetent *and* arrogant. A strange combination. He gains support through fear. He says if you don't agree with him, you're unpatriotic.

He goes on:

"It's the offense of the cross and it's one of the reasons there's such hostility tor Sarah Palin, because she is an unabashed Christian."

Again, wrong. I always find it amusing when Christians point to the words of Paul in Corinthians about "the offense of the cross." Jesus never seemed to have this problem. Jesus was constantly surrounded by people who wanted to hear his message. The overwhelming majority of people who came to hear Jesus were people with lots of problems. The people who were *offended* by Jesus were the highly religious. If the current crop of right-wing evangelicals formed the religious power structure of the time, they would have been the ones who couldn't hear His message, and ultimately worked the system to get Him crucified.

I'm offended by Sarah Palin because (and this is really in no particular order) she took a job for which she is completely unqualified, she used her authority as governor inappropriately, under her watch, Wasilla started -- hello -- charging rape victims for rape kits in emergency rooms, she is incapable of forming an intelligent thought without days of coaching by handlers, she cannot accurately state the job responsibilities of the vice-president...I could go on, but it's really too depressing.

--Another (and there are lots and lots of us) Follower of Jesus who can't wait to vote for Obama.

Dobson and Bush believe that anyone not with them is aganist them, a terrible hatred for a so called spiritual leader. Palin is right at home with Dobson and his group, or maybe not. She is a liar and the devil dressed in $150,000 worth of clothes. Wonder how many poor people could eat on $150,000. Just thin $150,000 worth of clothes, what a beautiful way to hide the Anti-Christ.

Could she pass a polygraph test on drug use, adultery or other vices of the true sinners?

America does not need McCain or Palin, and yes Palin I will be praying to my God that you loose the election.

Palin and Crew are real nut cases. America has been trashed by the Republican Party. The Republican Far Right also wants to totally divide the people... What is their goal???

One good indicator that Dobson is on the right track is that the Compost is against him.

I'm guessing Palin is wishing her pastor hadn't "cast out ALL forms of witchcraft" when he visited her Pentacostal church, because she and McCain could use a little magic spell right about now.

I do agree with her and Dobson about one thing: GOD will "do the right thing" on November 4th. She will stuff the ballot box for the Democratic candidate (and devout Christian), Barack Obama, the 44th President of the United States.

dogsrule1 wrote "I'm offended by Sarah Palin because... "

You can state all the reasons except 85 percent of Alaska were very satisfied with her performance. A topsiturvy mind would vote for her if she gets 15 percent satisfaction rate, Im sure.

The people of Sodom all think they were DOING THE RIGHT THING. Yeah right, until they met their Doom.

Another good indicator that Dobson is on the right track is that the majority of the communists that post on the Compost site are against him.

Do you obasmic "hope and changers" realize how your juvenile posts discredit the alleged message of hussein's "mein kampf"?

Dear hope and changers:
And now a message from the founder of your donkey party:
Blacks "are inferior to the whites in the endowments of both of body and mind."

--Thomas Jefferson, 1787
Founder of the Democratic Party
President, 1801-09

Evangelist should preach peace instead of hatred.
"GOD" IS ON EVERYONE'S SIDE.

These evil cult leaders use "GOD" as a tool to dominate human beings' mind because human beings fear "GOD" ,who is unseen, unknown, and almighty.
These cult leaders curse those who oppose their opinions and wishes, and evoke "GOD" punish them. They support those who bow to them, joint them and pray to "GOD" for their victory no matter what they do.

GOD IS RIGHTEOUSNESS. I think, GOD will bless Obama/Biden team. He knows Obama/Biden team is higher standard team, is good for the United State of America.

GOD BLESS AMERICA!

I am an independent voter. I was incline to McCain before he selected Sarah Palin. After two months' Palin personality, especially watching her on Saturday Night Live (10/18/08). Now, I decide to vote Obama/Biden team.

"You cannot go into a Dunkin' Donuts or a 7-Eleven unless you have a slight Indian accent."

"My state was a slave state. My state is a border state. My state has the eighth largest black population in the country. My state is anything [but] a Northeastern liberal state."

"I mean, you got the first mainstream African American [Barack Obama] who is articulate and bright and clean and a nice looking guy."

"There's less than 1% of the population of Iowa that is African American. There is probably less than 4% or 5% that is, are minorities. What is it in Washington? So look, it goes back to what you start off with, what you're dealing with."

Sen. Joseph Biden Jr., (D., Del.), 2006-07
Chairman, Committee on the Judiciary, 1987-95
Chairman, Committee on Foreign Relations
Candidate for the Democratic presidential nomination, 2008

Dear obasmics:
As part of your weekly mailing, you will receive 100 voter registration cards from Acorn. Be creative.

You will also receive a box wrapped in brown paper from Bill Ayers. It might be ticking, but don't worry, it's a Jeremiah Wright bobblehead. Bill says to leave it a the police station at exactly 7:53 a.m. on November 5, 2008. He will solve any problems once the Senate confirms him as Community Organizer Attorney General.

I can understand why non-Christians selectively read the scriptures but its heartbreaking when those who claim to be Christ's do it.

Jesus repeatedly warned his followers that the world will not love them because it does not love Him.

He also told us He did not come to bring peace but a sword between brothers etc.

This is a hard message, but He spoke these things so His followers would understand that there is a Heavenly war between the Father of Truth and the father of Lies that is also being fought on earth.

This war will not end until the Father of Truth brings it to a close. And this war will intensify until the end of days occurs.

Christ's own will be despised by the world because we are a reproach to them. As demonstrated by the hate speech in many of these postings and in demonstrations throughout the country on various issues the persecution of Christians has intensified in this country.

Christians who seek to be loved by the world, who compromise their beliefs to earn honor among the pagans imperil their salvation.

you christians are CUCKOOOO! Ever heard of separation of church and state? Maybe Obama isn't quoting scripture because he doesn't want to offend the jews, muslims, atheists, agnostics, sikhs, buddhists, taoists, druids, and god/God knows who else. Why are christians so self-righteous and all-knowing? If anything, Jesus was awfully morally ambivalent at times. But there's one thing you can depend on with the Christian right....the lack of any consistent ethic. They hate abortion but support the death penalty, the cry for the sanctity of life but want to wage war worldwide in defense of something they really can't define even in their own culture. Its repulsive and amazing all at the same time!

jlr1Judy :
Evangelist should preach peace instead of hatred.
"GOD" IS ON EVERYONE'S SIDE.

These evil cult leaders use "GOD" as a tool to dominate human beings' mind because human beings fear "GOD" ,who is unseen, unknown, and almighty.
These cult leaders curse those who oppose their opinions and wishes, and evoke "GOD" punish them. They support those who bow to them, joint them and pray to "GOD" for their victory no matter what they do.

GOD IS RIGHTEOUSNESS. I think, GOD will bless Obama/Biden team. He knows Obama/Biden team is higher standard team, is good for the United State of America.
==============================================
Which of these things might cause God to bless them even more:
a) infanticide
b) abortion
c) "my muslim faith" 9/5/08, talking to georgie porgie stepalloverus
d) jeremiah wright's condemnation of America
e) Bill Ayers' bombing of America
f) Obama's mockery of the Bible (youtube)

Sen. Barack Obama said, “I have consistently advocated for reproductive choice and will make preserving women’s rights under Roe vs. Wade a priority as president.” He told the Planned Parenthood Action Fund, “The first thing I’d do as president is sign the Freedom of Choice Act [FOCA]. That’s the first thing that I’d do.”

Sen. John McCain said, “Roe vs. Wade is a flawed decision that must be overturned, and as president I will nominate judges who understand that courts should not legislate from the bench.”

Philadelphia Cardinal Justin Rigali, who is chairman of the Committee on Pro-Life Activities of the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops, wrote about FOCA: This “federal bill, … if enacted, would obliterate virtually all the gains of the past 35 years and cause the abortion rate to skyrocket.” Sen. Obama’s proposed national health care plan mandates abortion coverage, and could reimburse abortionists $3,000 per abortion. (An abortion now is about $300).

Scranton, Pa., Bishop Joseph Martino stated, “(P)ro-choice candidates have come to support homicide – the gravest injustice a society can tolerate – in the name of ‘social justice.’”

For Catholics, bishops have cited abortion as the top voting criteria. If Sen. Obama is elected president, every person who has not called out abortion as the number-one voting criteria can take some responsibility for the innocent lives that will be lost as a result of an Obama administration’s pro-abortion actions.

Approximately 50 million U.S. children – about 3,900 babies a day – have been killed from abortion since 1973. Sen. Obama will continue the holocaust – Sen. McCain and Gov. Palin will seek to end it.

Religious wackos do not serve America. They are an impediment to rationale thought and progressive ideas.....

leftcoastblue wrote "GOD will "do the right thing" on November 4th. She will stuff the ballot box for the Democratic candidate (and devout Christian), Barack Obama, the 44th President of the United States. "

Im sure of that, that is why atheists, pagans, homosexuals, liberals and anybody who the Bible says is a disgrace to God is voting for him. What a mind. What a topsiturvy mind. And the sad fact it, this mind is replicated among millions in America.

And since you mentioned that God is a "she", do you mean the godess Diana?

Elipidope,

I like how most of your quotes are from when the Democratic party was the CONSERVATIVE party. Might want to read a little history every now and then, chief... there was a polar shift in the political parties. The Dems were conservatives back then and the Repubs were the liberals. That's why the Great Emancipator, Abe Lincoln, was a liberal for his time... the GOP was then the liberal party! Doh. Funny... if Lincoln was around today, I'm sure you right wingers would be calling him a lib and a race traitor, etc., cause we all know how much you Republicans value the Black vote.

Oh, and Obama the Muslim. Ok... he's a member of a radical Christian church but somehow also a radical muslim. That's kinda like when you right wingers were saying the Hillary Clinton was a lesbian but she still was having an affair with Vince Foster, before having him killed. Moronic in both cases.

I won't give you a hard time though. The next eight years with President Obama will be hard enough on you. I hear the GOP will be passing out tissues at the pollling sites. I'd feel bad for you.. if you all werent' so arrogant after the 04 election. HOW SWEET IT IS. Loser.

These Negroes, they're getting pretty uppity these days and that's a problem for us since they've got something now they never had before, the political pull to back up their uppityness. Now we've got to do something about this, we've got to give them a little something, just enough to quiet them down, not enough to make a difference. For if we don't move at all, then their allies will line up against us and there'll be no way of stopping them, we'll lose the filibuster and there'll be no way of putting a brake on all sorts of wild legislation. It'll be Reconstruction all over again."

--Sen. Lyndon B. Johnson (D., Texas), 1957

-------------------

Ah, here we go again with another con who has re-discovered his high school history book. Why don't you, like that guy on the radio says, tell us the rest of the story? Yes, LBJ said those words in his Sen. Maj leader days but then repudiated them in 1965 by signing the most ambitious and beneficial civil rights legislation ever. This was a courageous move on LBJ's part who realized it could have negative repercussions on a 68' re-election bid and who accurately predicted that it would hurt the Democrats now in the South for a generation (he underestimated). And why don't also mention how Nixon picked up on that when he created his "Southern History" of pulling those Dixiecrat states into the Republican fold?

Try reading the whole story instead of cherry picking your history facts!

"They hate abortion but support the death penalty"

Babies are not mass murderers. Do you know that?

I could care less what Dobson thinks or says! The religious wingnuts are about to be cast into the darkness where there will be much wailing and gnashing of teeth.

Good night!

swiftsmail :
you christians are CUCKOOOO! Ever heard of separation of church and state? Maybe Obama isn't quoting scripture because he doesn't want to offend the jews, muslims, atheists, agnostics, sikhs, buddhists, taoists, druids, and god/God knows who else. Why are christians so self-righteous and all-knowing? If anything, Jesus was awfully morally ambivalent at times. But there's one thing you can depend on with the Christian right....the lack of any consistent ethic. They hate abortion but support the death penalty, the cry for the sanctity of life but want to wage war worldwide in defense of something they really can't define even in their own culture. Its repulsive and amazing all at the same time!

October 23, 2008 9:31 PM
================================================
Abortion--the taking of an innocent life
Death penalty--Thomas Jefferson, founder of the donkey party said it should apply in the case of murder and treason. Do you disagree with your founder?
Infanticide--you didn't mention that one because you have no clue how to defend it.
War--we have fought a war almost every 20 years so kooks like you could spout your drivel without fear of going to jail or getting shot. For you to mock the sacrifice of brave men and women since April 19, 1775 through today who have died on your behalf is really weird. A relative of mine fought during the Revolutionary War so that we could be free and independent. A Constitution was then established which in its first amendment restricts Congress from establishing a religion of prohibiting the free excercise thereof. It doesn't restrict the President, a justice in Alabama or a pastor of a church. Your theory of separation of church and state made its way into the discourse indirectly by way of Marbury v. Madison, whereby the Supreme Court took upon itself super-legislative powers. Now, a pastor has to be careful what is said from the pulpit. Watch "John Adams" to realize what an important part churches were in our Revolution.

I suggest you take a stroll to the Lincoln Memorial. Upon entering, turn to your right, look at the right-hand column, all the way at the bottom, in the last paragraph. That Kentucky farm boy who guided us through our darkest hour suggested, among other things, that we proceed with firmness in the right as God (not Allah, etc.) gives us to see the right.

To All, Concerning Spidermean,

He's known better as Spidey here. He is not a Christian. A Christian is a follower of Jesus, the Christ. Spidey never mentions him, Spidey does not know who the Prince of Peace is, he has apparently never read the Gospels, certainly not the Sermon on the Mount. Spidey never thinks about 'What would Jesus do?', but thinks in terms of 'Who would Jesus bomb?'. Many of us here seriously, and I mean seriously, think he in a lot of psychological trouble. Pity him, and pray for him. I do.

The "religious wingnuts" are those who think they are Godly and feel good when they abort babies or have sex with their kind.

Elipidope,

I like how most of your quotes are from when the Democratic party was the CONSERVATIVE party. Might want to read a little history every now and then, chief... there was a polar shift in the political parties. The Dems were conservatives back then and the Repubs were the liberals. That's why the Great Emancipator, Abe Lincoln, was a liberal for his time... the GOP was then the liberal party! Doh. Funny... if Lincoln was around today, I'm sure you right wingers would be calling him a lib and a race traitor, etc., cause we all know how much you Republicans value the Black vote.

Oh, and Obama the Muslim. Ok... he's a member of a radical Christian church but somehow also a radical muslim. That's kinda like when you right wingers were saying the Hillary Clinton was a lesbian but she still was having an affair with Vince Foster, before having him killed. Moronic in both cases.

I won't give you a hard time though. The next eight years with President Obama will be hard enough on you. I hear the GOP will be passing out tissues at the pollling sites. I'd feel bad for you.. if you all werent' so arrogant after the 04 election. HOW SWEET IT IS. Loser.

October 23, 2008 9:35 PM | Report Offensive
===============================================
Instead of shooting all the fish in the barrel at once, let's start from the beginning.
Do you recognize Jefferson as your founder, yes or now?

Get a good look at Dobson. He is the closest thing in America to a full-blooded Fascist in the mold of Franco or the Latin American dictators. It is chilling to consider that this despicable man, who would burn the Constitution and bankrupt the nation for a tablespoon's measure of power, once had the ear of a President of the United States.

Someday, we can hope Dobson will read his New Testament and realize how completely contrary his "Christianity" is to the Gospels. But in the meantime, he will continue to strangle the great party of Lincoln and render it increasingly irrelevant.

Someone needs to create a viable alternative to the Democrats, because the Republicans seem bound to follow Dobson and Palin into the path of the Whigs.

"Spidey never thinks about 'What would Jesus do?'"

This is what Jesus will do :

"And I will kill her children with death; and all the churches shall know that I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts:"

That statement is addressed to the libreal Democrats. Wait for it coz it's coming soon.

CynthiaD1 :
Ah, here we go again with another con who has re-discovered his high school history book. Why don't you, like that guy on the radio says, tell us the rest of the story? Yes, LBJ said those words in his Sen. Maj leader days but then repudiated them in 1965 by signing the most ambitious and beneficial civil rights legislation ever. This was a courageous move on LBJ's part who realized it could have negative repercussions on a 68' re-election bid and who accurately predicted that it would hurt the Democrats now in the South for a generation (he underestimated). And why don't also mention how Nixon picked up on that when he created his "Southern History" of pulling those Dixiecrat states into the Republican fold?

Try reading the whole story instead of cherry picking your history facts!
========================================
Do you recognize Jefferson as the founder of the donkey party? Yes or never?

tboyer33 :
Get a good look at Dobson. He is the closest thing in America to a full-blooded Fascist in the mold of Franco or the Latin American dictators. It is chilling to consider that this despicable man, who would burn the Constitution and bankrupt the nation for a tablespoon's measure of power, once had the ear of a President of the United States.

Someday, we can hope Dobson will read his New Testament and realize how completely contrary his "Christianity" is to the Gospels. But in the meantime, he will continue to strangle the great party of Lincoln and render it increasingly irrelevant.
==============================================
Name one position he takes that is contrary to the Gospels.

EliPeyton :
Elipidope,

I like how most of your quotes are from when the Democratic party was the CONSERVATIVE party.
================================================
I'm glad you used the word "most". It shows a brief attempt at being honest, which tells me I'm making progress tonight. Tell me about the quotes not included in "most". By the way, I called Michelle. She said "Elipidope" was contrary to the spirit of hope and change, and that therefore you will have to spend two weeks on a missions trip with Pastor Emeritus of We Hate the US church on the Sox side of Chicago. Apparently you and Jerry Wright will be visiting Kenya to burn the last birth certificate.

Calling all donkeys: Today's blue light special is an infanticide kit. It comes with scissors, acid and a special potion from Bill Ayers. It will be mailed to you along with 80 Acorn voter registration cards already filled out using your local phone book information.

A diffidence, perhaps too just, in my own qualifications will teach me to look with reverence to the examples of public virtue left by my illustrious predecessors, and with veneration to the lights that flow from the mind that founded and the mind that reformed our system. The same diffidence induces me to hope for instruction and aid from the coordinate branches of the Government, and for the indulgence and support of my fellow-citizens generally. And a firm reliance on the goodness of that Power whose providence mercifully protected our national infancy, and has since upheld our liberties in various vicissitudes, encourages me to offer up my ardent supplications that He will continue to make our beloved country the object of His divine care and gracious benediction.
Andrew Jackson

In this dedication of a Nation we humbly ask the blessing of God. May He protect each and every one of us. May He guide me in the days to come.
F. Roosevelt

EliPeyton you should dust off your bible and start "practicing" christianity. I won't pretend to know the mind of God or Jesus Christ, but I feel in my soul he would not approve of the hatefulness you spew. Don't bother responding - I am leaving this mean-spirited site.

In this outward and physical ceremony we attest once again to the inner and spiritual strength of our Nation. As my high school teacher, Miss Julia Coleman, used to say: "We must adjust to changing times and still hold to unchanging principles." 2
Here before me is the Bible used in the inauguration of our first President, in 1789, and I have just taken the oath of office on the Bible my mother gave me a few years ago, opened to a timeless admonition from the ancient prophet Micah: 3
"He hath showed thee, O man, what is good; and what doth the Lord require of thee, but to do justly, and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with thy God." (Micah 6:8)
Jimmy Carter

republicrat :
EliPeyton you should dust off your bible and start "practicing" christianity. I won't pretend to know the mind of God or Jesus Christ, but I feel in my soul he would not approve of the hatefulness you spew. Don't bother responding - I am leaving this mean-spirited site.

October 23, 2008 10:05 PM
===============================================
Oh, please don't leave the Compost pile. We were just becoming friends. Am I quoting too many Democrats? Do you want me to switch to Republicans?

Steadfast in our faith in the Almighty, we will advance toward a world where man's freedom is secure. 70
To that end we will devote our strength, our resources, and our firmness of resolve. With God's help, the future of mankind will be assured in a world of justice, harmony, and peace.
Harry Truman

Any student of American history know that Thomas Jefferson, the author of the Declaration of Independence was a racist and wrote racist things that were in contradiction to his beliefs about the Rights of men. Was Jefferson alone among the Founding Fathers in this vein? Washington freed his slaves on his death but Jefferson didn't. However what else is different in their attitude towards blacks? Is Washington off the hook because he was a Federalist? Who cares!

What I never thought I would read is someone on the Right throwing Jefferson under the bus to try to make a political point against the Democrats of 2008. The Democratic-Republican party of 1800 has about as much in common with the Democratic Party today as the Republican Party Of Lincoln has with George W. Bush and John McCain.

You can also find some very disparaging things that Lincoln said about blacks. Does that reflect poorly on the Republican party today?

Obama wants to hammer McCain about the economy. As if they (the Dems) were not the source of this economic downturn.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081020/ap_on_bi_ge/the_influence_game_housing

The people in Wall Street like the hedgefund managers are mostly democrats. It is ALL THEIR UNDOING.

CynthiaD1 :
I could care less what Dobson thinks or says! The religious wingnuts are about to be cast into the darkness where there will be much wailing and gnashing of teeth.

Good night!
================================================
Have a "hope and change" good night. We'll be back here in the morning and so forth and so on. We shall go on to the end, we shall fight in France, we shall fight on the seas and oceans, we shall fight with growing confidence and growing strength in the air, we shall defend our Island, whatever the cost may be, we shall fight on the beaches, we shall fight on the landing grounds, we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall fight in the hills; we shall never surrender, and even if, which I do not for a moment believe, this Island or a large part of it were subjugated and starving, then our Empire beyond the seas, armed and guarded by the British Fleet, would carry on the struggle, until, in God's good time, the New World, with all its power and might, steps forth to the rescue and the liberation of the old. W. Churchill

Sorry Cynthia, not a lot of wailing and gnashing from our side, just fighting.

Someone wrote: "Dobson has a very good reason to hope the GOP wins: one of his major contributors is the head of the private army Blackwater (who gets 90-plus percent of his money from the US government)..."

I'd like to hear more about that.

CynthiaD1 :
Any student of American history know that Thomas Jefferson, the author of the Declaration of Independence was a racist and wrote racist things that were in contradiction to his beliefs about the Rights of men. Was Jefferson alone among the Founding Fathers in this vein? Washington freed his slaves on his death but Jefferson didn't. However what else is different in their attitude towards blacks? Is Washington off the hook because he was a Federalist? Who cares!

What I never thought I would read is someone on the Right throwing Jefferson under the bus to try to make a political point against the Democrats of 2008. The Democratic-Republican party of 1800 has about as much in common with the Democratic Party today as the Republican Party Of Lincoln has with George W. Bush and John McCain.

You can also find some very disparaging things that Lincoln said about blacks. Does that reflect poorly on the Republican party today?

October 23, 2008 10:10 PM
==================================================
My question was simple. You didn't answer. I didn't ask stuff like, "Paula, which way was it pointing?" or "Monica, tell us about the stain." Those were tough questions. My question was very straightforward. So I went looking for answers: a) democrats.org b) click on "Our Party" tab c) click on "Party History" and lo and behold, "Thomas Jefferson founded the Democratic Party in 1792 as a congressional caucus to fight for the Bill of Rights and against the elitist Federalist Party.

Now, fast forward to Uncle Joe Biden or Aunt Chris Dodd. You read their quotes below. Do you see the connection? No? That's OK. The effects of the Kool-Aid will wear off within 6 months according to Uncle Joe.

David Waters, I've got news for you. Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity, James Dobson are NOT MAIN STREAM MEDIA and don't proclaim to be. I have to discount everything you say if you are so dumb as not to know this. They deliver there commentary openly as CONSERVATIVES. How long have you been in this business?

dobson is a dangerous,narrowminded, hypocritical, non-christian, meglomanical, fearmongering, sociopath interested in money, power,and controlling others by preying on their fears and ignorance and using religious bigotry as his means. In the same boat with the late Jerry Falwell, Pat Robertson, Oral Roberts

Spidey wrote,

This is what Jesus will do :

"And I will kill her children with death; and all the churches shall know that I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts:"

Spidey just proved my point - all he cares about is Who would Jesus Bomb/Kill.

The Republican nominee demonizes the Democrat by saying he wants to "redistribute wealth." Well, let's look at the bible.

Jesus Christ said to the rich young ruler: "sell whatever you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; and come, take up the cross, and follow Me" (Mark 10:21).

When the people asked John the Baptist "what shall we do," he said: "He who has two tunics, let him give to him who has none; and he who has food, let him do likewise" (Luke 3:11).

James, the brother of the Lord, said: "Listen, my beloved brethren: Has God not chosen the poor of this world to be rich in faith and heirs of the kingdom which He promised to those who love Him? But you have dishonored the poor man" (James 2:4-5).

An honest reading of scripture clearly contradicts the Republican nominee's premise that there is something wrong with redistributing wealth. On the contrary, it is the godly thing to do.

David Waters, Christians don't approve of the barbaric procedure of partial birth abortion. That's the barbaric procedure of pushing a baby back in the birth canal and sucking out his or her brains. Obama does. Christians don't approve of innocent babies that are born alive in a botched abortion to just....die. Obama does. Christians don't believe in stealing from one group, taking a percentage and giving the rest to someone else. Obama does. Obama's personal giving judging by his tax returns is pathetic. Is Obama really a Christian?

Spidermean apparently does worship Apollo and rocks. It's obvious that anyone with the time to post here about 35 times must have rocks in his head.

All together now ....

Dobson = Gutless traitor

Dobson = racist coward

The christian right is niether.

Well done.

You now have 11 days left to pray that the rapture gets here on November 3rd. After that, your out of luck .... for another 100 or so years when the next group of religious koo-koos crawl out from under a rock.

November 5th ends the myth that ...

GOP = GOD

Go to a McCain rally and you know exactly what GOP means now: Goofy Over Palin

She's your future hero. And like so many of you so-called "God fearin' folks", her future looks like indictment, prosecution, conviction and jail time for FRAUD.

Lovin' every second of this. I am surely blessed.

"Spidey just proved my point - all he cares about is Who would Jesus Bomb/Kill."

It's good to know what Jesus plans to do. And what's more important is WHY He he will "kill her children with death".

If you want to plug your ears as to why He's doing it, it's because something is wrong with your mind.

Why can't everyone realize that all four of the candidates are good, decent citizens? Is it necessary to personally tear down a human being because of his or her positions on policy? Are any of us in a position to judge another's faith or relationship with God….regardless of which political party they belong? What a judgmental, cruel election this has become!!! Is this what it takes to get voters attention when we are in a war and a recession?

Glad Hannity, Dobson, Rush don't belong to the mainstream media but to the loony fringe. It would be horrible if all the mainstream people around me sprout such rubbish.

The wingnuts should all be sent to Pakistan - out there it is not only acceptable to yell "kill him" about someone running in the opposing party, but to actually blow up the person running against you. They would be so ecstatic!

Or maybe these Commies should be sent to Siberia - go spy on your neighbor there, remove books from libraries, eavesdrop on telephone conversations...

Please leave my decent country alone!!! I love America too much to allow you hateful people to take it over.

EliPeyton scribbled - Name one position he takes that is contrary to the Gospels. (Regarding Dobson)
---------------------------------
Matt 22:39 - You shall love your neighbor as yourself. - Dobson spews his hatred of homosexuals at every opportunity.

Although Dobson and his ilk use Lev. 18:22 as justification to hate gays (You shall not lie with a male as with a woman; it is an abomination. ) They conveniently forget the other abominations, or maybe they haven't actually READ the Bible:

Lev 11:12 - Everything in the waters that has not fins and scales is an abomination to you.

Lev 19:7 - If it is eaten at all on the third day, it is an abomination; it will not be accepted.

Deut 22:5 - A woman shall not wear anything that pertains to a man, nor shall a man put on a woman's garment; for whoever does these things is an abomination

So, If you wing-nuts want to follow one part of the Bible, why not the whole thing? No left-overs, seafood, and women can't wear pants.

It's sickening to normal people the way hypocrites like you cherry-pick and twist the Bible to suit your own warped purposes. If you ever did legitimate Bible study, which doesn't include TV or radio preacher-shouters, you would be ashamed at yourselves. However, there is no chance of that because REAL Bible study is hard work and takes hours and days of study to actually understand a passage. So-call Christians like you only want to spew the hatred you hear on the radio from these flat-earthers like Dobson.

Go take your medications and quit making a fool out of yourself.

tarheeler :
Someone wrote: "Dobson has a very good reason to hope the GOP wins: one of his major contributors is the head of the private army Blackwater (who gets 90-plus percent of his money from the US government)..."

I'd like to hear more about that.

October 23, 2008 10:22 PM
================================================
Oh, it's much worse than you might think. The Blackwater guy is originally from North Carolina. He used to be a prosecutor in Durham. When he was only 12 years old he joined Halliburton. They sent him on secret missions to destabilize Middle Eastern countries. In fact, there is a picture of him playing soccer with Uday and Qsay. If you look closely at the picture of the United plane just before it hit the South Tower, you can see his name (actually codename---Biff) written in lipstick next to the missle bulge. Well after making a mint on those secret missions, he joned Blackwater and moved to Wyoming to work with a power company as a lineman. That's where he met Dick Cheney. Now you're putting it together.
One day, while playing chess with his buddies during lunch, he got a call from Richard Armitage who said he was at a spa with Bob Woodward, and could Biff reveal the identity of the lady that cleaned the bathrooms in Langley. In a fit of despration brought on by the loss of his bishop, Biff stated, "It was Mallory, plain, and simple". Anyways, meanwhile, while Biff finished his lunch, James Dobson took a break from his daily radio program in Colorado, and sent a text message to a listener who lived in Avon, Montana. You guessed it. The high tension wires caused Biff's super secret Bond phone to partially intercept the message, which then read, Deposit your f___th in ___, and things will work out. Instantly Biff realized he was receiving a message from headquarters and hit reply with instructions to the sender on where a fourth of his secret stash was stored which he thought was needed for an important mission. It turns out it was at a storage locker at the Greyhound bus terminal in Colorado Springs, just a few miles from Dobson's office. Stay tuned, there is more to come, including that fateful night when Frank and Pelosi went to the spa with Woodward.

Charles Carroll - signer of the Declaration of Independence stated :

" Without morals a republic cannot subsist any length of time; they therefore who are decrying the Christian religion, whose morality is so sublime and pure...are undermining the solid foundation of morals, the best security for the duration of free governments." [Source: To James McHenry on November 4, 1800.]

America is losing its morals. Part of America will cease to exist soon. As the above statement says, IT WONT SUBSIST ANY LENGTH OF TIME. The republicans are here to stay folks. The Democrats, well, Im not so sure about that. Ask Charles Caroll.

Pookiecat, you're dreaming. The thing is Obama's term could be the Democrat's last.

I have a question for a majority of the posters here. Why do you feel it necessary to denegrate those who disagree with you? I was under the impression that these forums were an opportunity to have a civilized discussion about the issues of the day, but unfortunately they are nothing more than opportunities for folks who will never meet to slander one another.

What a waste.

I worship Satan and if you have read this Satan is now in your living room

Love thy neighbor does not mean cheer and encourage them them as they wallow in the mud.

What a topsiturvy world.

Posted on October 23, 2008 22:43

xconservative :
EliPeyton scribbled - Name one position he takes that is contrary to the Gospels. (Regarding Dobson)
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Matt 22:39 - You shall love your neighbor as yourself. - Dobson spews his hatred of homosexuals at every opportunity.

Although Dobson and his ilk use Lev. 18:22 as justification to hate gays (You shall not lie with a male as with a woman; it is an abomination. ) They conveniently forget the other abominations, or maybe they haven't actually READ the Bible:

Lev 11:12 - Everything in the waters that has not fins and scales is an abomination to you.

Lev 19:7 - If it is eaten at all on the third day, it is an abomination; it will not be accepted.

Deut 22:5 - A woman shall not wear anything that pertains to a man, nor shall a man put on a woman's garment; for whoever does these things is an abomination

So, If you wing-nuts want to follow one part of the Bible, why not the whole thing? No left-overs, seafood, and women can't wear pants.

It's sickening to normal people the way hypocrites like you cherry-pick and twist the Bible to suit your own warped purposes. If you ever did legitimate Bible study, which doesn't include TV or radio preacher-shouters, you would be ashamed at yourselves. However, there is no chance of that because REAL Bible study is hard work and takes hours and days of study to actually understand a passage. So-call Christians like you only want to spew the hatred you hear on the radio from these flat-earthers like Dobson.
Go take your medications and quit making a fool out of yourself.
October 23, 2008 10:42 PM | Report Offensive Comment
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I'm currently taking Peptoobasimol.

As for the Scripture references, just remember take into account all 1,189 chapters.

Romans 1:27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.
I agree with you about other abominations. The passage in Romans seems to equate disobedience to parents and homosexuality. But still, two wrongs don't make a right, and God, not I, is the one warning us.

I. Corinthians 6:13
Meats for the belly, and the belly for meats

Clothes
The New Testament refers to modesty. Is that bad thing if you have a teenage daughter?

It has been literally years since I have listened to Dobson, but what hatred have I spewed? Just because I quote a democrat doesn't mean I have spewed hatred.

kinoworks :
I worship Satan and if you have read this Satan is now in your living room

October 23, 2008 10:50 PM
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Nope, sorry. I haven't watched Keith Olberman is a while. Satan is not omnipresent. On the other hand, his demons do his business. Nevertheless, Satan was defeated about 1968 years ago. The proof is in an empty tomb, as well as a curtain torn from top to bottom inside the temple. His defeat was foretold in Genesis 3:15, about 6,000 years ago. He end is sure. Revelation chapter 20 describes his fiery future. If I were you I would change teams before the playoffs, which could start any second.

EKIM53 wrote Christians don't approve of the barbaric procedure of partial birth abortion.
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Another so-called Christian that doesn’t actually read the Bible. If you actually have one, go read the book of Joshua. Joshua 6:21 - Then they utterly destroyed all in the city, both men and women, young and old, oxen, sheep, and asses, with the edge of the sword.

There is more killing in the Bible than all of the Rambo movies combined. You apparently don’t know what real Christians approve of.

Elipeyton – you should be taking medicine because your posts make no sense. Posting a bunch of random quotes does not add to the discussion.

xconservative :
EKIM53 wrote Christians don't approve of the barbaric procedure of partial birth abortion.
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Another so-called Christian that doesn’t actually read the Bible. If you actually have one, go read the book of Joshua. Joshua 6:21 - Then they utterly destroyed all in the city, both men and women, young and old, oxen, sheep, and asses, with the edge of the sword.
There is more killing in the Bible than all of the Rambo movies combined. You apparently don’t know what real Christians approve of.
October 23, 2008 11:03 PM
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You've given a timid example. How about the Flood in Genesis chapters 6-9? How about the book of Revelation? Why is that all those people lost their lives/will lose their lives. It goes back to what God told Adam in chapter 2 of Genesis. Enjoy the garden. One thing. Don't eat from that tree over there. What did they do? They ate from that tree. What happened? (Gen.3) They were instantly separated from God--spriritual death. They hid when God came calling. Those chose to sin, just like all of us. The penalty of sin is death--not based on my rules, but on God's. Rom. 3:23 Is there a solution to the problem. Yes, John 3:16, Rom. 6:23, but hey, who wants to mess with separation of truth and the Compost pile.

Let's all take a moment to chill. Fellow Christians, I know how you feel. I was worried about Obama, his Muslim dad and stepdad, his pro-choice views, his Christian minister who doesn't seem to be preaching Christ's teachings and his uncanny popularity. But the American side of me, what our founding fathers defined in the constitution and bill of rights, the separation of church and state, the fragile economy, the war; all these make the argument for Obama as president. We need Obama now because he is a very intelligent man with a very intelligent team. He is very measured in his response to crisis. We need a calm and thoughtful and smart president during this times.

Since I wasn't sure what I should do, I prayed to God for guidance because I want to do what God wants me to do. GOD provided me with guidance and direction. During this troubled times, you don't know who is the wolf in sheep's clothing. SO SEEK GOD's GUIDANCE. Just quietly pray and let HIM guide you. Dobson, O'Reily, etc. do not speak for GOD. CHRIST, our Lord and Savior is love, mercy, wisdom, forgiveness and humility. So you need to do your homework and quietly seek GOD and HE will show you what to do. Ask and you shall receive. If you love Christ, PRAY for guidance instead of spewing hatred and anger.

What these end-timers fail to realize is that God will not come back just because some nut jobs decided that they would help to usher in the apocalypse. God will come back when God is ready, which could be a thousand years.

Would anyone be willing to bet that the end-timers will be predicting 2012 as the year of the Rapture. It just so happens that the Mayan and Chinese calendars stop on 2012. If this is the case, then the end-timers would be paying heed to the Gods of heathens.

As for me, I don't trust any person. God will come back when God is ready, not because a man or woman says it's going to happen SOON! Hopefully God brings some marijuana because I think we all need to smoke a joint or two.

"racist hatemongerers" I find that this such and interesting tactic deployed by the liberal illuminati socialist. I've never heard McCain say anything remotely close to racist. I've asked several Obama supporters, but none have produced anything remote close to concrete. If anything, McCain has always been quick to distance himself from anyone using those tactics. "Just the Facts!"

It is abundantly clear that the extremist republicans are going destroy whatever chance the US has to affect change in the future by further dividing the masses. Since they can't win honorably, they always resorted to preying on the fears of less informed citizens, and differences to divide. But this is the truth the US face: United we stand-Divided we fall. I see no Christian principles in what they have done, inciting coded Racism, inciting phobias of Anti-American, Pro-American, Socialism, Nationalism, Communism, Real American, Terrorist pals, Muslim bashing and the list goes on. Why do extremist Republicans boast about believing in God? Satan believes in God but he will not be going to heaven. If extremist Republicans lived the word of God, US would not have experienced the facilitation of enormous amounts of greed on Wall Street and corruption, abuse of power, and incompetence in every major agency in the government of this administration. Extremist Republicans remind me of the two women who asked King Solomon to decide who the live baby belong to. …the extremist Republicans are requesting that the baby be cut in half therefore killing the baby… Read the story 1King3:15. What was done in the dark (the first 6 years of President Bush administration) is now coming to light (the last two years of President Bush administration).

Dobson's heyday was years ago, when his radio program gave parents specific instructions on how to maintain control of their kids so they wouldn't turn into Godless druggies. Back then, listening to Dobson was less boring than not listening to anything at all on the AM radio in my work truck in a corner of Wyoming.

I wondered, though, what the kids subjected to the Dobson method thought of him. I suspect most did OK--at least their parents were engaged.

As an Evangelical Christian, like others posting here,I can vote for Obama without fear. No one is pro-abortion, and Obama has pointed that out with each opening. What is more Christian--to try to establish a support system to reduce abortions, or simply concentrate on overturning Roe v. Wade? What happens after Roe is overturned? How is one life saved during the years of those efforts? We know that abortions decline dramatically when there is a support system such as Obama is promoting (education to help avoid unwanted pregnancy, health care availability during pregnancy and child care or adoption)---so why does McCain's website say that the first step is to overturn Roe v. Wade and AFTER that, other support systems will be instituted. Until then, the abortions continue Which plan actually addresses the problem now? Do you really care to reduce abortions, or is your whole plan just to overturn Roe?

Such attitudes by religious leaders blasphemes God. I'm sure she won't be pleased.

janw20165 :
As an Evangelical Christian, like others posting here,I can vote for Obama without fear. No one is pro-abortion, and Obama has pointed that out with each opening. What is more Christian--to try to establish a support system to reduce abortions, or simply concentrate on overturning Roe v. Wade? What happens after Roe is overturned? How is one life saved during the years of those efforts? We know that abortions decline dramatically when there is a support system such as Obama is promoting (education to help avoid unwanted pregnancy, health care availability during pregnancy and child care or adoption)---so why does McCain's website say that the first step is to overturn Roe v. Wade and AFTER that, other support systems will be instituted. Until then, the abortions continue Which plan actually addresses the problem now? Do you really care to reduce abortions, or is your whole plan just to overturn Roe?

October 23, 2008 11:40 PM
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The whole plan is life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. Ms. evangelical Christian, what is your perspective on Jeremiah 1:5 as it relates to abortion and infanticide?
As for Roe v. Wade, what part of Article III allows the Supreme Court to say that a Texas statute is unconstituional? If you don't know the answer, that's fine, that's expected.

"And I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not. 22 Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds. 23 AND I WILL KILL HER CHILDREN with death; and all the churches shall know that I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts:"

Why are the fornicators and unbelievers attracted to Obama? Why is Hollywood, gays, liberals, atheists, pagans, Wall Street big wigs who placed us into this economic mess attracted to Obama?

WHY, AMERICA? WHY? To fulfill the prophecy of Doom. It's coming folks. Very soon.

janw20165 :
As an Evangelical Christian, like others posting here,I can vote for Obama without fear. No one is pro-abortion, and Obama has pointed that out with each opening.
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Jan, call the turkeys at the DNC and ask them to edit the party platform so that it conforms to your representation of what Hussein says about abortion. The platform is as follows: "The Democratic Party strongly and unequivocally supports Roe v. Wade and a woman's right to choose a safe and legal abortion, regardless of ability to pay, and we oppose any and all efforts to weaken or undermine that right."

Sorr, my angry liberal posters, I had to watch the end of Game 2. A team from a state that has voted Republican beat a team from a blue state. I don't even remember the names of the teams. But it felt like an omen.

cjackson1 :
Such attitudes by religious leaders blasphemes God. I'm sure she won't be pleased.

October 23, 2008 11:45 PM
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Genesis 1:27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.

What female deity were you referring to? Has the female deity issued any books?

The Ayatollah Dobson is in for a very RUDE awakening!

Mo. sixth-graders face discipline for 'Hit a Jew Day'

Several sixth-graders from suburban St. Louis are being disciplined for creating "Hit a Jew Day" and then hitting Jewish classmates.

It began with an unofficial "Spirit Week" among sixth-graders that started harmlessly enough with a "Hug a Friend Day." Then there was "High Five Day."

Soon, though, the days moved from friendly to silly. Next there was "Hit a Tall Person Day" and, "Hit a Jew Day." Next month the plan is for a "Stomp a Mexican" and "Spit on an Oriental."

The school offers no apologies for their agenda stating that "real Americans" like Sarah Palin defined are not going to stand by and let "foreigners" take over.

http://blogs.usatoday.com/ondeadline/2008/10/mo-sixth-grader.html

Let me recommend to the angry donkey supporters the new medicine: peptobasimol. Test results have shown it not only calms the hatred so often detected in donkey circles, but it also functions as an antidote to the Kool-Aid that is distributed by the Communist Nuisance Network and Mindless Senseless Nothing But Communists in conjunction with the New York Mimes and the Compost. The peptobasimol is available at your local drugstore right after the Cold Remedies and just before Athlete's Foot on aisle 7.

You may remember that Jesus said "...many will come in my name." He made it quite clear they weren't speaking for him. Dobson, despite his colossal ego, is just another one of the many who come in His name who do NOT speak for Him.

Posted on October 24, 2008 00:14

kkrimmer :
Mo. sixth-graders face discipline for 'Hit a Jew Day'

Several sixth-graders from suburban St. Louis are being disciplined for creating "Hit a Jew Day" and then hitting Jewish classmates.

It began with an unofficial "Spirit Week" among sixth-graders that started harmlessly enough with a "Hug a Friend Day." Then there was "High Five Day."

Soon, though, the days moved from friendly to silly. Next there was "Hit a Tall Person Day" and, "Hit a Jew Day." Next month the plan is for a "Stomp a Mexican" and "Spit on an Oriental."

The school offers no apologies for their agenda stating that "real Americans" like Sarah Palin defined are not going to stand by and let "foreigners" take over.

http://blogs.usatoday.com/ondeadline/2008/10/mo-sixth-grader.html

October 24, 2008 12:11 AM | Report Offensive Comment
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Helps explain why Obama is ahead in Missouri.

tc125231 :
You may remember that Jesus said "...many will come in my name." He made it quite clear they weren't speaking for him. Dobson, despite his colossal ego, is just another one of the many who come in His name who do NOT speak for Him.

October 24, 2008 12:15 AM |
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If he's right and you're wrong, do you expect to see Voltaire? (the flames already?)

braultrl :
The Ayatollah Dobson is in for a very RUDE awakening!
October 24, 2008 12:08 AM
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He's been atacked enough over the last few decades to recognize who is awake and who is rude. Bottom line in America: if you disagree with a donkey you are a racist extremist. Solution: have a larger animal sit on the donkey.

Mr. Dobson has earned the right to be properly identified as an extremist christian ideologue.

American must stop referring to this radical christian zealot as a religious leader that has any real credibility. His extremist cult's current war on American society is one of the biggest threats to the American democracy and our national security that exist within our borders.

The extremist christian ideology is the evil of our times, beware of the cloak of goodness.

Real americans are those who care for the welfare of American soldiers in Iraq. The fake ones are those who cry foul when American soldiers commit honest mistakes due to over-stress and the viciousness of the enemy.

They are often more comfortable calling American soldiers as murderers than its ememies.

What a topsiturvy world.

WildWest1 :
Mr. Dobson has earned the right to be properly identified as an extremist christian ideologue.

American must stop referring to this radical christian zealot as a religious leader that has any real credibility. His extremist cult's current war on American society is one of the biggest threats to the American democracy and our national security that exist within our borders.

The extremist christian ideology is the evil of our times, beware of the cloak of goodness.

October 24, 2008 12:24 AM
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"the evil of our times"
Get back in your VW van and get on I-80 heading west. When you see a golden gate, ask for Alcatraz.

The evangelical "Christian" movement became big after the 1964 Civil Rights bill was enacted. In order to avoid integration, "Christian" schools were needed and big churches were required to support these large expenditures. Anyone traveling through the South in the late 60s remembers seeing the hastily built private schools popping up all over the place and it was no coincidence that the evangelicals movement grew at that time. It was, and is, about race. Now, some of these schools will point out that they have a few black students. While this is true, the numbers are small and they are truly tokens (and usually atheletes). The bottom line is that, no matter how it's framed, the evangelical movement is built on racism, not true Christianity, and Dobson is a perfect example thereof.

My dislike of Bush has nothing to do with his faith, it's because of his policies that have been disastrous for our country.

As for praying for a McCain victory, really? An adulterer (on many occasions) who carried on an affair before divorcing his disabled wife and abandoning her and their three children to marry his mistress six weeks later? Indeed, he does need prayers, but not to be elected.

carmineappice :
The evangelical "Christian" movement became big after the 1964 Civil Rights bill was enacted. In order to avoid integration, "Christian" schools were needed and big churches were required to support these large expenditures. Anyone traveling through the South in the late 60s remembers seeing the hastily built private schools popping up all over the place and it was no coincidence that the evangelicals movement grew at that time. It was, and is, about race. Now, some of these schools will point out that they have a few black students. While this is true, the numbers are small and they are truly tokens (and usually atheletes). The bottom line is that, no matter how it's framed, the evangelical movement is built on racism, not true Christianity, and Dobson is a perfect example thereof.
October 24, 2008 12:53 AM
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I went to an evangelical boarding school in the 70's way in the deep South. My welding teacher was African-American. My Portuguese teacher was African-American. Our church leader was African-American. Our maintenance foreman was African-American. Would you describe that as token? Oh yeah, my 6th grade social studies teacher was African-American. We were taught that race was not an issue. We didn't learn that through verbal instruction. It was simply gained through observing whites (teachers and students) interact with African-Americans (teachers and students).

Meanwhile, just 250 miles south of where I live now in Ohio, down in Knoxville, Tennessee, four black guys raped, burned, mutilated and murdered a white couple last January. Did you hear about it. Don't talk to me about tokens. Talk to me about Rodney King double standards, as applied by the Compost, NY Mimes, etc.

As an Evangelical Christian I am always apalled at some of my fellow brothers and sisters in America. For me and most of my friends at church, they simply read another Bible, they do not read it at all or simply turn their backs to the teachings of the Christ.
Christianism is a religion of love (love thy neighbour as...), forgiveness (Our Father who art in heaven ... forgive us our trespasses AS WE FORGIVE THO WHO TRESPASS AGAINST US...) and giving. SPalin (who claims to be a Christian, but has only been spitting hatred since she was nominated) and McCain have been spitting on the Bible (especially the New Testament) all through the campaign.
As for Dobson, he is the mist hypocritical powermonger I have seen or listed to. Maybe the best time was on Larry King, when he was caught outright lying. He lies at will contradicting the Bible, but I guess his "bible" is not the one inspired by God, but Macchavelli's "Prince": the end justifies the means.
As to James Dobson's reading the Bible, I guess he has never got as far as the New Testament. When he reached the Song of Songs, he found that it's sexual content was unacceptable. Resotting to his Nazi tactics he burned his Bible (remember the Nazis burning books in bonfires in pre-WW2 Germany or SPalin trying to get books banned from Alaskan libraries); so he has never read the New Testament and, thus, about the New Covenant.
As to educating the people not to have abortions (Obama's position) v. simply opposing Roe v. Wade and bombing clinics or killing doctors who perform abortions (SPalin and Dobson's approach), the rreason for the Dobson position is simple. The more educated the people are, the least they heed to his hatemongering views. Ergo, the more power he loses.
James Dobson is all about controling, monopolising power, money (for him, but not to his fellow Christians ---taxes are "communistic") and ego. Christ came to liberate the people, to share (He went as far as sharing His life for our sake) and sharing.
So Republican Talibans: stop hiding behind a Christ you betray every day with your hatred, your racism, your selfichness. Be brave and erect altars to your real heroes: Hitler, Stalin (any relation to SPalin is not merely a coincidence), Lenin, Franco, Pinochet, Nixon (the Republican president who started the trend of dividing America and who has to resing among the gravest accusations of corruption), Ayatollah Khomeini, Kim Il Sung and his son Kim Yong Il and, last but foremost, Satan himself, who dwells in hatred and bigotry.

Liberal communists,

Have you read this story? Where's Rodney King when you need him?

http://www.wbir.com/news/local/story.aspx?storyid=41276

BE BRAVE ENOUGH TO COMMENT AFTER YOU'RE THROUGH READING.

Dr. Dobson would be well advised to seek counsel in the Scriptures before lavishing praise upon Gov. Palin, and the party he endorses and obviously follows. The eighth commandment, which exhorts not to bear false witness against your neighbor, seems to have gone missing from his homilies, otherwise he surely would be appalled at the viciousness with which they attack their opponents. And President Bush was not criticised for confessing Jesus, but for the disastrous performance of his administration and contempt
for the law.
Dr. Dobson, your prayers are needed, for your country and the world; and for better conduct of those who aspire to serve in high offices. Your divise exclamations are not compatible with the responsibility expected of you as a Christian leader.

Conservative Christian Republicans will rule the world. Why and how? It is in the prophecy. This may be the last time (or second to the last) Democrats will win the presidency. God does not see them fit to rule. Here is His prophecy.

"And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations: 27 And he shall rule them with a rod of iron; as the vessels of a potter shall they be broken to shivers: even as I received of my Father. "

That is the prophecy and nobody can disannul it. For the liberal Democrats who think their day has come. Sorry folks coz it's not gonna last that long.

The Democratic Party's platform are way too liberal for the taste of God.

"And I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not. 22 Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds. 23 And I will kill her children with death; and all the churches shall know that I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts: "

That is the liberal Democrats' future. There is no place for them under the sun.

As the song says "This is my Father's world". What is not part of my Father's world like abortion, gay marriage, liberal values will be disposed of.

Preachers like Dobson and conservative Christians like Palin have no power. The power comes from God. The power is a gift to anybody who believes. The good part is these two people believe and so are the majority of Republicans.

"I have to have that faith that God's going to help us get that message out there," Palin said.
**************************************************
So what if you lose? Do you then blame God? Or do you then think that maybe, just maybe your mind has nothing whatsoever to do with God?

Its like Bush who said he was guided by God and invoked a Higher Father about the illegal invasion Of Iraq, resulting in millions of deaths. He is now despised and has the lowest approval rating of any President in history.

Is this God's fault? Or is George imagining things? I think his slow witted brain is making up this stuff. He does not exhibit the slighest indication he is a man of God, just like betcha doesn't either.

I lost all respect for Dr. Dobson years ago. I was listening to a "Focus on the Family" radio spot, and he used the parable "There Are Two Seas" by Bruce Barton, but he did not attribute it at all, and it was presented as if it was Dobson's own work. I wrote Focus on the Family and got a bull-**** letter back about time constraints and how busy Dobson was. Well plagiarism is plagiarism. Dobson is a self righteous phony.

In the years since, I my opinion of Dobson has continued to deteriorate. His "god" is a very mean, very unforgiving spirit.

I know it is important to be aware of the full spectrum of political thinking in the country, but haven't we devoted enough time and thought to fundamentalist phonies like Dobson?

When does the IRS revoke his 501(c)(3)?

Contrary to what Dobson claims, the hatred for Bush is due to the mess he has made of the country (and the world) in the last 8 years. Jesus is ashamed the likes of Bush, Palin (and Dobson) claim to be his followers.

Can a fundamentalist Christian here answer a philosophical question?

It is presumed by me that evangelical Christians fundamentally believe that it is _God_ that should determine whether a person lives or dies - not other men. At heart, this is why abortion is so abhorrent: if the baby died of a miscarriage it is God who chose to take the life of this baby way, but during an abortion we take the decision out of God's hands. Correct?

Philosophically, this makes sense to me. What does not make sense to me is then how most evangelical Christians are also in favor death penalty... which also takes the decisions of life and death out of God's hands.

So my question is: who should determine whether a person lives or dies, God or man? And if you believe it is God that should decide, then how can you reconcile being against abortion yet for the death-penalty?

I hope there prayers work out better than they worked for BUSH§
They may call is a prayer. But that last time they prayed for a presidential candidate, it turned out to be a HEX on the Country!

Thank you crazy sick folks!
Keep doing what your doing so Al Qaeda can WIN!

"And I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not. 22 Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds. 23 AND I WILL KILL HER CHILDREN with death; and all the churches shall know that I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts:"

Does this quote refer to Bristol Palin?

The only reason all four candidates have so called shown themselves to be "unabashed christians" is because they're too chicken-s___ to do otherwise. In the US's unrelenting need to please everyone, it would be political suicide to do otherwise. But clearly the Christian movement has a lot to learn about running this country or anything else for that matter. What Palin has shown us is what an idiot she is.

So sick of the "Kool Aid" references, but add some Kookies and it does start to seem like kindergarten nap time for those who just say what mommy and daddy say...

To me, a "Christian" is a person who has a personal relationship with God that is based on his/her acceptance of Jesus Christ as his/her "personal Savior." There are lots of "what-does-that-mean" questions that arise from that definition, but that's beyond the point of this post. According to my understanding of the term, an "Evangelical" Christian is merely one who believes that the directive in Matthew 28:19-20 means what it says -- that we should (paraphrasing) "go into all the world and teach all nations . . ." BUT, IMHO we're not supposed to "teach" about behavior modification or political philosophy. We're supposed to "teach" about the personal benefits to be enjoyed from "receiving Jesus Christ as Savior" and about how to do that -- how to "receive Jesus Christ as Savior."

I'm a liberal Democrat, and I'm an Evangelical Christian. I'm a Christian because of what I believe about spiritual things. But I'm a Democrat because I believe that the U. S. Constitution constrains me NOT to try to impose my own concepts of spirituality upon my fellow citizens.

The U. S. Constitution controls how all citizens of America -- believers and non-believers -- have agreed to govern themselves, socio-politically, in peaceful co-existence in this great country. My Christian faith controls how I conduct myself in my private and interpersonal (non-governmental) relationships.

It's generally referred to as "separation of church and state" -- the life-blood of "right" Christian existence in America, IMHO.

McCain Calls 911 to Complain About Traffic: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K7WtiseFjbI

quoting mustafacenter1 :
"Jesus is ashamed the likes of Bush, Palin (and Dobson) claim to be his followers."

It's a good thing Jesus has a spokesperson down here.

For a nation that has such a large Christian population, the things that "unabashed" and "fundamentalist" congregations and their leaders say is quite disturbing.

I have been born into and raised in a working class community where Christian values have been an integral way of doing things. We shared things with other families not because it was Christian but because it was the right thing to do. We all helped the less fortunate in our own communities and families even though some were of different faiths. We took a more pragmatic view that since we all believed in a living God it did not matter that our cultures and customs were different.

From the numerous postings it appears to me that there is serious level of intolerance in Christian Americans for things that are different to them. It seems that there is a driving need to be better than "them" whoever might be perceived as being different.

Maybe my American brothers and sisters in Christ need to become a little more humble by engaging in dialogue with those they seek to convert in a way that exemplifies the power of love. Hate speech and intolerance only hardens the views of the non-fundamentalist Christians as well as the non- believers.

How many more millions of people have been killed in the name of our loving God and in the name of misdirected feelings of patriotism, before we the human race will learn?

Have you ever wondered about how so-called democratic countries profit from other nations fighting one another? Maybe families in these countries that support wars should be forced to adopt an orphaned child from a war torn country to let them be reminded daily by the consequences of their patriotic fervor.

If two seventy-six year old spinsters who will fight tooth and nail to prevent a fifteen year old from having an abortion they they should be forced to adopt the child and to care for it. Surely we should only force others to something if we ourselves are willing to do the same thing.

If we as Christians believe that love trumps evil then maybe we want to live our lives in a way that proves this to be the case.

brianschroeter :
Can a fundamentalist Christian here answer a philosophical question?

Brian, that's a really good question. I admit to having the same question and here's the answer that the Lord gave to me as I was reading 2 Kings recently. You see, all through history people have chosen to worship other gods instead of the true Creator God, the God of the Bible. In 1 & 2 Kings we learn about people worshing created gods - literally statues. Some of these people literally sacrificed their children on the hands of these gods. In the case of one, a fire would be stoked inside the statue until its hands were scalding hot, then the parents would lay their child in the idol's hands. I've even read that the hands could lift to the mouth of the statue and the child was dropped into the statue for sacrifice. I'm sure you would agree that this is horrible. Why would they do this? They were hoping that that the god would make their life better if they gave it this baby. Perhaps they wanted prosperity, perhaps they wanted a better crop that year, perhaps they wanted an easier life. In 2 Kings we are told that God hated that these people shed that innocent blood. When I read that, I knew that God values the innocent and hated that the people killed these babies. Who is innocent? For sure the little children who were sacrificed were innocent. And, I recognized then that abortion today is the sacrifice of innocent blood. Why do people do it? In the hopes that their life will be more prosperous, or simpler, or less inconvenienced. Perhaps only to keep from being embarrassed.

The one true God is good. The Creator God is all about justice - taking care of those who cannot care for themselves. And children are at the top of that list. Our culture tells us differently, our culture says "care for yourself first."

Recently I've begun to ponder the difference between abortion and capital punishment, myself. Because, I tend to agree with you that if all life is valuable, then how can we condone any killing (war, self-defense, capital punishment). I'm still working this out with God, but the one phrase above that keeps jumping out at me is "innocent" blood. God is not in favor of us sacrificing the innocent to further our own comfort. So, you'll get Christians who believe both sides of the capital punishment debate. I can understand why you would be confused by that.

If I can just finish up with the first command that God gave to the Isrealites "I am the Lord your God, you will have no other gods before me" and that Jesus spoke when he walked the earth "Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: Love your neighbor as yourself." As a Christian, I ask myself constantly, am I loving Jesus in what I'm doing or how I'm thinking? Am I worshipping Him or something else. Am I loving this other person by my action? These are the questions Christians should ask constantly, and I realize that if I take a life, I can't be loving that baby like myself. For someone who has an abortion, they can know that Jesus died for all sins and Jesus LOVES them and wants them reconciled to God. At any time they can turn to Jesus and if they confess with their mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in their heart that God raised Him from the dead, they will receive God's gracious gift of eternal life. Not only eternal life, but freedom here and now. Freedom from living for my own self-pleasure. Jesus said that eternal life is knowing the only true God and Jesus Christ whom He sent. That's one of the most exciting things about being a Christian - is that God will reveal himself to us in a way we've never known Him before. And He continues to teach us about Him as long as our hearts are open to learning and loving Him.

See this piece about Sarah Palin's adherance to a Biblical command http://www.huffingtonpost.com/daoud-kuttab/evangelical-palin-violati_b_132410.html

These right-winged fundamentalists Christians have nearly succeeded in the destruction of the US. Now on 11-4-08 Gods gonna clean the house of these folks.

Why is this putz worthy of attention? He and his sick organization will wither and die and no one will notice he's gone.

Was Dobson walkin' funny as he approach the microphone for the interview about Palin?

Please tell me that Dobson and his organization do not receive any tax benefits or write-offs. It's obviously a wing of a political party and works actively on behalf of that party.

TO PBODANZA, who wrote:
"Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: Love your neighbor as yourself."

Does this mean that you and all Christians like you are going to support a single-payer, universal health insurance system backed by the full faith and credit of the federal government, in order to insure that all God's children have adequate health care?

We can always count on whiners like Dave to complain about conservatives invoking God during an election. It's almost cliche.

Now when the shoe is on the other foot . . .

Demonic Dobson is just another Moron Con Econ Terrorist Fraud exploiting the Ignorant for personal gain.

The $1 Billion Connection: McCain And His Lobbyists' Clients
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Campaign Money Watch, a nonpartisan campaign finance watchdog group, announced today the result of a new analysis of the fees Sen. John McCain's (R-AZ) lobbyist bundlers, advisors and staff members have collected from domestic clients over the past decade.
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The total? A staggering $930,949,819.
.
"The McCain campaign relies on big money lobbyists, and they'll rely on him," said David Donnelly, director of Campaign Money Watch. "In the 'you-scratch-my-back, I'll-scratch-yours' world of Washington, $931 million gets the special interests the best government money can buy. But just think of the payday these lobbyists might expect in a McCain Administration."
.
Google "McCain Bush Lobbyists"

Over 2 Million jobs lost in the past year.
.
Old Adulterer War Criminal McBush's Call Girl spends over $150,000 on clothes in less than 2 months.

Retirement account losses of over $2 trillion
.
Over $10 Trillions lost in Stocks, thanks Moron Con Econ WMD Terrorists
.
The 2009 budget deficit is expected to be close to $2 trillion, or 12.5 percent of gross domestic product, more than twice the record of 6 percent set in 1983
.
Trillions lost in Home Values
.
When the Econ WMD took office the S&P was 1343, now it is 882, an annual compounded lost of over 5.8% each year,
.
Stupid Worthless Moron Con Econ Terrorist Policies of No Regulations, No Antitrust, No Oversight have destroyed America. Russia, India, Iran, China, etc are all laughing at the Moron Con Econ Terrorists Idiots America has in the White House.
.
Moron Cons who enable War Criminals are equally guilty of Murder, Rape & War Crimes.
.
Moron Cons are Cowards with Guns & Bombs
Comment by Moron Con Communist Econ WMD Terrorists, Old Adulterer Songbird Treasonous Traitor War Criminal Corrupt McLobbyist & The Born Again Pro Life Killer Retard & their Hundreds of Big Corporate Lobbyists will Destroy America!!

We were attacked after Mission Accomplished Axis of Evil Moron Con Econ Terrorist Nazi was informed, so what, Moron Cons?
.
Cons are Morons
.
Moron Cons are Cowards with Guns and Bombs
.
Birth Control Pills can cause Abortions, so stop taking them, Moron Cons, practice Astenence in your Moron Con Brains
.
Drill a Palin, get a Retard later.
.
Moron Con Econ Terrorists will destroy America.
.
Moron Cons love Socialist Communist Trillions in Tax Hike Bailouts of their Rich Wall Street Reckless Gambling Criminal Business Incompetents.
.
Over 2 Million jobs lost in the past year.
.
Old Adulterer War Criminal McBush's Call Girl spends over $150,000 on clothes in less than 2 months.

Cons are Morons
.
Moron Cons are Cowards with Guns and Bombs
.
Birth Control Pills can cause Abortions, so stop taking them, Moron Cons, practice Abstinence in your Moron Con Brains
.
Drill a Palin, get a Retard later.
.
Moron Con Econ Terrorists & the Moron Con WMD Axis of Evil Born Again Pro Life War Criminal Mass Murderering Terrorists will destroy America.
.
Moron Cons love Socialist Communist Trillions in Tax Hike Bailouts of their Rich Wall Street Reckless Gambling Criminal Business Incompetents.
.
Over 2 Million jobs lost in the past year.
.
Old Adulterer War Criminal McBush's Call Girl Trailer Trash Hore spends over $150,000 on clothes in less than 2 months.

"After the interview, Dobson continued talking to his audience about the 'hatred' Palin has encountered, especially 'in the newspapers up there.' He didn't specify what he meant by 'up there...' "

Because it really doesn't matter: wherever they're from, we can take comfort that Ms. Palin doesn't read them.

This man holds views dangerous to American society. Folks who claim to know the intentions of God almost certainly do not. Those who follow such false prophets do so at their own peril. They may find themselves worshiping the modern anti-christ of greed & hate.

Demonic Dobson is just another Moron Con Born Again Fraud exploiting the Ignorant Extremist Moron Cons for personal gain. This Fraud and all the Extremist Phonies only want to enrich themselves and religion is an easy way to exploit the Ignorant Trailer Trash Moron Cons.

Over 2 Million jobs lost in the past year.
.
Old Adulterer War Criminal McBush's Call Girl spends over $150,000 on clothes in less than 2 months.

Retirement account losses of over $2 trillion
.
Over $10 Trillions lost in Stocks, thanks Moron Con Econ WMD Terrorists
.
The 2009 budget deficit is expected to be close to $2 trillion, or 12.5 percent of gross domestic product, more than twice the record of 6 percent set in 1983
.
Trillions lost in Home Values
.
When the Econ WMD took office the S&P was 1343, now it is 882, an annual compounded lost of over 5.8% each year,
.
Stupid Worthless Moron Con Econ Terrorist Policies of No Regulations, No Antitrust, No Oversight have destroyed America. Russia, India, Iran, China, etc are all laughing at the Moron Con Econ Terrorists Idiots America has in the White House.
.
Moron Cons who enable War Criminals are equally guilty of Murder, Rape & War Crimes.
.
Moron Cons are Cowards with Guns & Bombs
Comment by Moron Con Communist Econ WMD Terrorists, Old Adulterer Songbird Treasonous Traitor War Criminal Corrupt McLobbyist & The Born Again Pro Life Killer Retard & their Hundreds of Big Corporate Lobbyists will Destroy America!!

We were attacked after Mission Accomplished Axis of Evil Moron Con Econ Terrorist Nazi was informed, so what, Moron Cons?
.
Cons are Morons
.
Moron Cons are Cowards with Guns and Bombs
.
Birth Control Pills can cause Abortions, so stop taking them, Moron Cons, practice Astenence in your Moron Con Brains
.
Drill a Palin, get a Retard later.
.
Moron Con Econ Terrorists will destroy America.
.
Moron Cons love Socialist Communist Trillions in Tax Hike Bailouts of their Rich Wall Street Reckless Gambling Criminal Business Incompetents.
.
Over 2 Million jobs lost in the past year.
.
Old Adulterer War Criminal McBush's Call Girl spends over $150,000 on clothes in less than 2 months.

Cons are Morons
.
Moron Cons are Cowards with Guns and Bombs
.
Birth Control Pills can cause Abortions, so stop taking them, Moron Cons, practice Abstinence in your Moron Con Brains
.
Drill a Palin, get a Retard later.
.
Moron Con Econ Terrorists & the Moron Con WMD Axis of Evil Born Again Pro Life War Criminal Mass Murderering Terrorists will destroy America.
.
Moron Cons love Socialist Communist Trillions in Tax Hike Bailouts of their Rich Wall Street Reckless Gambling Criminal Business Incompetents.
.
Over 2 Million jobs lost in the past year.
.
Old Adulterer War Criminal McBush's Call Girl Trailer Trash Hore spends over $150,000 on clothes in less than 2 months.

Using the Dow Jones Industrial average as the benchmark, Stock Analysis shows a $10,000 investment compounded during Democratic presidencies since 1901 would be worth $279,705 after 48 years. The same $10,000 investment during 56 Republican years would have been worth just $36,699.

Those of you bothered by Dr. Dobson and Sarah Palin have to ask yourselves what is the real underlying problem you have with them if, as your postings indicate, you truly believe all four candidates are Christians.

Could it be that you recognize a real Christian when you see/hear one and due to the conviction in your own heart you become angry and bitter? I mean, why doesn't Obama's Christianity bother you? Could it be becuause you really don't believe he is a Christian? Could it be that, like Obama, you believe in picking and choosing which parts of the Bible you want to believe? Obama doesn't believe in the inerrancy of the Bible and he doesn't believe Jesus when he said, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No man comes to the Father but through me."

Well, just as in this election you get to choose the candidate you want for President, in life, God gives you the freedom to choose whether to believe in Him and trust Him for eternal life. One decision affects the next 4-8 years; the other eternity.

brianschroeter asks:

Can a fundamentalist Christian here answer a philosophical question?

It is presumed by me that evangelical Christians fundamentally believe that it is _God_ that should determine whether a person lives or dies - not other men. At heart, this is why abortion is so abhorrent: if the baby died of a miscarriage it is God who chose to take the life of this baby way, but during an abortion we take the decision out of God's hands. Correct?

Philosophically, this makes sense to me. What does not make sense to me is then how most evangelical Christians are also in favor death penalty... which also takes the decisions of life and death out of God's hands.

So my question is: who should determine whether a person lives or dies, God or man? And if you believe it is God that should decide, then how can you reconcile being against abortion yet for the death-penalty?
______________________________________

A good question that I can understand your confusion. However, the answer is simple and has already been pointed out by another, but so that there's no confusion, I will clarify with no hesitation.

The difference between an abortion and the death penalty is that with an abortion you are killing an innocent person while someone given and killed because of the death penalty has gone through a trial and has been found to be guilty beyond a reasonable doubt for the crime he/she was convicted of. While it is very possible to convict and put to death an innocent person (no doubt it has happened, there is evidence of that), the legal system is not perfect, for the most part the legal system gets it right more than it gets it wrong and I have very high confidence that someone put to death under the death penalty deserves it. However, EVERY person aborted has been INNOCENT (NOT something the death penalty opponents can say). Granted, I do believe that there are some instances where an abortion can be justified (I have always lived by the "Let he who is blameless cast the first stone." doctrine) or understandable, rape, incest, life of the mother in danger. But the baby is STILL INNOCENT, the baby did not rape the mother, the baby did not have incestual sex with the mother and the baby did not deliberately choose to make a mother pregnant so that the mom would die in child birth. Of the three cases where I can see some justification for abortion, only one is there a real legal justification, that is when the mother's life is endangered, everyone has a right to self-defense and while the baby did not ask to be conceived in the womb of a mother who cannot handle the risk of pregnancy, the mother does have a the right and justification to defend herself and have the abortion (she could also choose to have the baby and die, THAT'S REAL "Freedom of Choice").

One point I would argue against in your question is that I do not feel that it is only God who should decide who lives and who dies. I have always believed that the duty of the government is to protect its citizens and if that means that you have to kill some citizens who continue to hurt and kill other citizens, then that is what the government has to do. This also applies to wars, the gov't has a duty, obligation and a right to defend it citizens by killing citizens of another government. Now, as long as you live within the laws of the government and no other government is trying to impose itself on another, then I do feel that it is God who should decide who lives and who dies. However, that would mean a perfect world where noone murdered others.

Hey Seektruth:

"Real Christian?" Is that like Real American? The ability to distinguish like that must be a real gift.

How truly fortunate you must feel.

We had a guy like Dobson (and a lot like Hagee and Falwell and the other Masters of Pontifical Intolerance) who ran the Christian Education program at the church I grew up in. Tight shiny shoes, tight high collar, nondescript but expensive suit, some well-paid day job, and an undiscovered-until-later but not un-exercised preference for putting his hands down the pants of the little boys and up the skirts of the little girls he so sanctimoniously professed to be "teaching Christ to." Out of the King James Bible. WAY out. And obviously a lot of others are attracted to the same opportunities for the laying on of hands.

He was a "Fun-damentalist," like a lot of others you'll find in any "religious" group, who conflate the divine spirit and lovingkindness with whatever happens to tickle their pleasure centers.

Far as I can tell, there's nothing to choose between the mullahs in the madrasa and the Megapreachers with their multimedia "proofs" of how you the parishioner can get your "rapture" and/or your "72 virgins" by just making a seed offering of only four seeds of $19.95 plus shipping and handling for this boxed set of CDs proving that Jefferson had sex with slaves and that Armageddon is just a few more shipments of arms to the Mideast so get your Congressman to push for them, "the Bible says, it's God's Holy Word right here in Jeremiah, and if it doesn't say exactly that, it's been laid on my heart by the Almight that it SHOULD have," or a quick trip to the nearest checkpoint or open market or police station with your suicide belt snugged up tight around whatever might be left of your conscience. BOOM.

As a agnostic, guys like dobson remind me why I would sooner hear out a Muslem, a Jew a Wickia or a person of any other religious denomination before I would ever a Christian on most all matter religious or political.

Somebody here wrote:
"The one true God is good. The Creator God is all about justice - taking care of those who cannot care for themselves. And children are at the top of that list."

Let's not forget that our Intelligent Designer must have put together a genetics program that doesn't always function properly- or does the Devil step in and cause two parents to each carry a deadly recessive mutation such as Tay-Sachs disease that they pass on to their innocent child who dies in the first year of life after intense suffering?

The Designer must also have made disease causing microorganisms (or does the Devil have that power to create too??). While diseases can kill anyone, it is the children that are particularly vulnerable.

I just do not understand any idea of a "just" and "merciful" God. Santa Claus would be another great being to believe in if he was just true!

Jesus spoke volumes about the death penalty when he shielded the adulterous woman. He never spoke about infanticide or homosexuality but he was quite clear about the death penalty.

If Christians were even remotely "Christ-like"...What a world there would be!

I have spent the good part of my life as a Christian admiring James Dobson. Specifically for the things he has said about families and raising children that have benefited me and my family.

BUT I am uterrly amazed at the quickness people like Dobson and all of these other people who attempt to cloth their right-wing conservative agenda (Which if you know the Scriptures is more like the Pharisees than Jesus Christ)in the garment of the Christian faith.

As an African American Evangelical (Some might call that an oxymoron :-) I find it an affront to my Faith when people like Dobson, Palin or Bush attempt to correlate themselves to the struggles of the Early Church Fathers of the Faith. Statements like Bush is hated because he pronounced the name of Christ. As if he martyred himself for the Faith, puhhleeez!

I don't hate Bush, but let me be clear and I think I speak for a lot of Christians. My problems with President Bush is not because he said the name of Jesus. My problem with Bush is because he said the name of Jesus, but has run the country as if he does not know Him.

To A TRUECHRISTIAN:

So as has been so thoroughly documented, when a person is judicially killed (the "death penalty") at the end of a trial where the police and prosecution and possibly perceptions of career enhancement and public opinion have suborned your ridiculous notion that there is something like a"fair trial" with "proof beyond a reasonable doubt," it very often happens that an innocent person is actually given the needle or the juice. Are you such a Christian, with such powers of rationalization, that you deem that unjust murder of a person, I guess as an eye for an eye, that you know in your heart that God, especially in the person of Jesus Christ, does not weep and would not if he were still on earth lash out at the tribunal as He did to the money-changers in the Temple?

Abortion is not always a good idea. It doesn't do much to discourage rape, incest, or Newt Gingrich having sex with a woman not his wife. The death penalty satisfies a Good Old Testament kind of love of retribution and death -- remember how the Old God helped the Israelites during their "good" periods to slew the Canaanites and the Jebusites and all the other 'ites in the area, putting them to the sword to the last infant and carrying the women away to be tent slaves? Is that your God? He looks a little different than the one I read about in the books chosen long after Christ's sacrifice to make up the New Testament.

The tongue you are speaking in does not sound like one that was born of Heaven, but of the human brain's tribalism and love of violence and ability to justify whatever one chooses to believe.

ELIPEYTON:

Okay, you have piqued my interest.

How does the horrific murder that was reported in the link that you provided have something to do with liberals, communists, liberal communists, Rodney King and lastly, Sarah Palin and the current election?

SEPARATION OF CHURCH AND STATE

Do religious Americans understand this concept? The mention of Christ, Mohammed, Buddah, or any other religious figure has no place in American politics.

Our founding fathers were EXPLICIT in this separation for the sheer fact that corruption and faith go hand-in-hand. In the name of God you can justify anything (see 'pre-emptive' strikes) and it seems that there is a movement in this country led by Dobson to send us back to the Middle Ages.

OH JEZUS MOTHER MARIA WHAT A HOKUS/POKUS SCAM THIS DOBSON IS!! HE SHOWS US THAT RELIGION POISONS EVERYONE IT TOUCHES!!!

Well, JDoyle, You need to do a little more reading on church and state and the attitude of our founding fathers. The constitution does not deny the right of churches to speak or for religion to play a role in politics. While I disagree with Dobson on most things, you are simply wrong. While I think that religious affiliation has nothing to do with one's capacity to be president and our founding fathers considered and discarded the idea of a religious qualification, the constitution does not deny the right of others to think differently.

the offense of the cross is not being ridiculed for being a christian. according to st. paul, the offense is that it was a political torture device that killed the messiah. the messiah was made into a common criminal. the cross was not something to be proud of. it showed a god that was vulnerable. this is the offense of the cross. it is a stumbling block for all. this is what the Bible says.

James Dodson uses his beliefs to spew hate. GOD is not a republican or a democrat... Did Jesus spew hate> I don't think so.. Quit trying to divide this great country of ours James Dodson!!!

What's truly egregious is your point of view that anyone who seems to contend moral supremacy (on any point) is inherently morally destitute. As if the tenets of morality and Christianity are simply a subjective exercise. The heart of Evangelical Christianity and Catholicism for that matter is that the locus of moral authority is objective and "outside" in the person of the creator and the Bible (and in the case of Catholicism, in church tradition as well). There are plenty of examples in the New Testament of condemnation of so called believers, because of issues of immorality, doctrinal error, rebellion, etc.

But that is beside the point. Dr. Dobson is speaking from a primary conviction that the Bible places supreme value on human life and should be protected, that the Bible upholds the institution of marriage as between a man and a woman and is sacred, that the Bible upholds the value of the family and implicit authority of parents in the lives of their children. An honest intellectual argument would center on whether the Bible provides legitimate and authoritative moral guidance on these issues or not. That it does uphold these values is indisputable.

When a public figure such as Obama or Biden claim the name of Christian, but hold and expouse positions antithetical to the Bible, it's fair game to call them on it and criticize those positions. Simply saying you are a Christian doesn't give you carte blanche to interpret the Christian faith anyway you choose. For instance, Catholic leaders rebuked both Joe Biden and Nancy Pelosi recently, when they distorted the realities of the church position regarding abortion through the ages.

With respect to this discussion, what I object to is the villification of man who is assuming a moral position. Yes, he disagrees with Obama and Biden. Yes, he believes that some of their positions are antithetical to the Bible and should be renounced. Yes, there is an argument here. But simply expousing traditional Christian morality doesn't make one a hater or intolerant.

It is you who are wearing the emperor's clothes for you cry "intolerance and bigotry" when your positions and posture are nakedly intolerant and bigoted. You exhibit prejudice and superficial judgments of a man simply because he is taking a moral position that is antithetical to your own. Why not be honest and debate the points instead of villifying the messenger. Your judgments of him are wrong. He is not intolerant or a hater. He is simply a man of conviction who has lived out his convictions his entire life. Many of the readers here ascribe "hatred" to a man who has literally stood and loved millions through his works, books, and broadcasts.

I'm always baffled by evangelical conservative christians who embrace the idea that they are hated by people who disagree with them. The old "attack from a defensive position" ploy is such a hackneyed, threadbare ruse that I'm surprised that everyone isn't bored by it.

As one of those people "up there" I can assure Mr. Dobson that we don't hate him - I for one look at him as somebody with a particular point of view based on a particular world view that I don't share. Then I turn the page or change the channel and I don't bother with him any more. To hate Mr. Dobson, I'd have to care about what he says, and I don't.

But if hate is the currency of Mr. Dobson's realm, I have to wonder if he hates me. And I have to wonder if Sarah Palin (rhymes with Stalin, another maverick who came from an outlying region - Georgia) thinks I don't respect her, does that mean she returns the emotion, before she's even met me?

What is it about the world view of some fundamentalist christians that looks for a fight?

fr seektruth:

>Those of you bothered by Dr. Dobson and Sarah Palin have to ask yourselves what is the real underlying problem you have with them if, as your postings indicate, you truly believe all four candidates are Christians....

The main problem I have with "dr" dobDUMB is that he continues to make up and spout tired old LIES about how awful GLBTQI's are, and how we have an "agenda" and how we're going to "teach 5 year olds sex education", etc. Believe me, NOTHING could be further from the truth, and dobdumb wouldn't know the truth if it stood up, bit him on the nose, and walked away. He also founded the so-called "frc", which is nothing more than a shell game. He's also butted his big nose in where it doesn't belong into the fight against Prop 8, a virulently anti-gay measure that he wants to have passed.

Anyone that advocates BEATING small children and dogs with implements is NOT a Christian. Don't believe dobdumb's lies. See the fantastic documentary "For the Bible Tells Me So" and how he treated a family with a gay son who simply wanted to deliver a letter to him.

If you listen to this man, then you know that the Democrats started this whole financial mess years ago under Jimmy Carter? And it burned while Bill Clinton was in office even though John McCain and others wrote a letter warning of the mess to come? Did you know some networks like"..you know, Fox News.." are OK while the other mainstream media outlets are biased? I defend Dr. Dobson's right to his opinions but why must he be able to do it in a non-profit designation? All over America, the pulpit rings GOP because Republicans are going to end abortion since 1973. They have been in control, (and that includes the Supreme Court), many sessions/terms since RvW and have sidestepped every opportunity to stop abortion on demand. Dr. Dobson,local churches, 700 Clubbers, etc. should all be able to promote their opinions but let's stop pretending they are toeing the line between politics and religion! Let's revoke their non-profit status'since the gov't. will not regulate, nor should they, their partisan content. As for you folks that believe that RvW will be overturned by the GOP just remember " the street musician doesn't give up the fiddle that puts the gold coins in his cup..."

carmineappice wrote:

The evangelical "Christian" movement became big after the 1964 Civil Rights bill was enacted. In order to avoid integration, "Christian" schools were needed and big churches were required to support these large expenditures. Anyone traveling through the South in the late 60s remembers seeing the hastily built private schools popping up all over the place and it was no coincidence that the evangelicals movement grew at that time. It was, and is, about race. Now, some of these schools will point out that they have a few black students. While this is true, the numbers are small and they are truly tokens (and usually atheletes). The bottom line is that, no matter how it's framed, the evangelical movement is built on racism, not true Christianity, and Dobson is a perfect example thereof.

No truer word has been written about these ripoffs of religiosity!! As we listen to Greenspan try to weasel his way out of his complicity in the current meltdown. As we see Bush and his handlers hide and cower after lying and leading us into what will be a failed occupation of Iraq. Let us consider that disingenuity is rampant in many other areas of our lives. Look at the Healthcare Industry, Department of Justice, FDA, FAA and many others who allow lead into our children's toys, deadly pharmaceuticals parading as life saving discoveries, uninspected and poorly monitored aircraft and an Attorney General being investigated for lying. We can safely include the so called church in that congregation that does one thing and says another. As advised by the leading biblical figure, we should "think on these things".

Regarding the Palin-Dobson interview:

Republicans don't want to stop abortion. The executive, the legislative and the judicial branches were a Republican majority before the 2004 Congressional elections, yet the only thing that got changed was a 2003 ban on the most visibly horrific and yet infinitely RARE act of abortion, the partial birth abortion.

Republicans use kind-hearted people's disgust for abortion to get themselves into office, then they sit on their thumbs and do very little about it. And that is because if abortion actually were made illegal, no Republican would ever get into office again because their ONE AND ONLY ISSUE would be moot.

I voted for Reagan his first term on the abortion issue, sure that he would end at least the later trimester abortions. I waited and waited and waited and slowly realized that abortion is a campaign tool, and nothing else,for the majority of the GOP. Do you really think those guys want a bunch of unwanted babies on the street sucking up welfare tax money? Not on your life.

With a Democratic Congress, which we will absolutely have for the next few years, no Republican President will be able to move on this issue, even if he wanted to, and the Republicans know it. If they couldn't control abortions when they were in a complete majority, they sure won't do it now.

IF there is any indication that God is listening...He ain't listening to the hypochristians.
This campaign has shown that "fundamental hypocrites" are going down...for good, and they are taking the nazi Republicans with them.
Praise the Lord!

Roe v. Wade has cost the african-american community its position as the largest minority, so I agree with the evangelical christians that abortion needs to be overturned. Because of abortion, african-americans have remained at 10% of the population. If it weren't for abortion we would have a much larger percentage of the population. Thanks to abortion, african-american women average the same number of children as white women.

Having said that, although I am a Republican, I'm not voting the Republican ticket over a single issue. Not after 8 years of bad decisions, unnecessary war, and tax breaks for corporations that shift their labor force overseas.

Conservative Christian Republicans will rule the world. Why and how? It is in the prophecy. This may be the last time (or second to the last) Democrats will win the presidency. God does not see them fit to rule. Here is His prophecy.

"And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations: 27 And he shall rule them with a rod of iron; as the vessels of a potter shall they be broken to shivers: even as I received of my Father. "

That is the prophecy and nobody can disannul it. For the liberal Democrats who think their day has come. Sorry folks coz it's not gonna last that long.

The Democratic Party's platform is way too liberal for the taste of God.

"And I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not. 22 Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds. 23 And I will kill her children with death; and all the churches shall know that I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts: "

That is the liberal Democrats' future. There is no place for them under the sun.

As the song says "This is my Father's world". What is not part of my Father's world like abortion, gay marriage, liberal values will be disposed of.

Preachers like Dobson and conservative Christians like Palin have no power. The power comes from God. The power is a gift to anybody who believes. The good part is these two people believe and so are the majority of Republicans.

"Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, SEVERITY; but toward thee, GOODNESS, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be CUT OFF. (Romans 11:22)

I am baffled by the notion that James Dobson strongly aligns himself with a political party that clearly favors the wealthier among us. Doesn't he realize that the New Testament mentions the disparity between the rich and the poor far more than any other subject in the Bible including today's favorite wedge issues of the day . . . abortion and gay marriage? I wonder if Dobson feels the same about the innocent Iraqi men, women, and children that were killed in our war of choice, as he does for the unborn fetus. I don't think I have ever heard him speak out about against these injustices. Why?? I don't doubt Dobson's faith in God for a moment, but I have serious doubts about the way he cherry-picks political issues to suit his personal religious and political agendas. I, and many others, would have more respect for the man if he would follow Jesus' simple and very clear advice by "...giving to Caesar that which belongs to Caesar, and giving to God that which belongs to God..."

Jesus was quite apolitical, so then why do so many of his followers seek to politicize him?? Better yet...why do so many church "leaders" do this? They should know better.

From my understanding of the life and purpose of Christ, God isn't interested in our elections. They are irrelevant to Him. What is important is how we live our lives and that we serve Him while we are on earth. Dobson has done a lot to create the hate-filled atmosphere of this election. Jesus was the Prince of Peace. Dobson doesn't trust God, but wants to impose his own will on us. God allows us to make our own decisions. Dobson has control issues. If anyone is in doubt about that, read Dobson's own writing about beating his little Dachshund because the pup wanted to sleep in a warm spot, rather than the cold cage Dobson wanted to put him into.

fr spidermean2:

>...What is not part of my Father's world like abortion, gay marriage, liberal values will be disposed of....

My marriage to my partner-now-WIFE was truly blessed by God, and we firmly believe that He brought us together. Our UMC minister also believes that.

Remember the news conference where Bush pounded angrily on the podium and practically screamed "Let me make this clear WE DON'T TORTURE" So that was, as was many other things we were told a BOLD FACED LIE to the American people.
What I want to know is why isn't he being held accountable for his lies? Why isn't the sanctimonious Religious Right up in arms over TORTURE, gee I guess abortion is bad but TORTURE is OK for christians. Why isn't it widely recognized now that the the US is guilty of the very same things we accuse rogue regimes of: loss of habeas corpus, detention without trial, falsely accused defendants denied council then denied access the "secret" evidence, mock trials where the defendant is guilty before they ever enter the room. Somehow we hear not one word about this from the Christian right. And for those MORONS who say that terrorists don't deserve any better or that it's fine with them to torture and abuse prisoners at Guantanimo, how do you know they are terrorists? because Bush (the proven liar) says so? because an Afghani Warlord who turned them in for cash says so? with no trial, no evidence and no defense council you'll never know..you'll only know that the Army of the US HAS to prove them guilty in order to validate having tortured them in the first place. I expected CHRISTIANS to come down hard on TORTURE because it's clearly against their values but nnnnooooo. They'll make a stink about a congressman's sexual proclivities but not about the ultimate violation of human rights....go christians! (I would have capitalized the word christian but they've proved they don't deserve it, all the "hallelujah's, "praise Gods" and Amen's are just words to the fundamentalists).
Bringing the facts that WE DO TORTURE while our "president" and his closest advisers not only new about it but initiated the policy, drafted the specific tortures and signed off on it and then let the grunts that carried it out for them take the fall proves beyond a shadow of a doubt that our country is not about bringing down regimes that commit horrible acts on it's citizens (otherwise we would have intervened in Darfur and Rawanda or would do so even now as 100's of thousands are being raped and murdered) but is now more than likely doing the very same thing.
How far we have fallen. Who would have thought that christian's would allow it, condone it and approve it without even a word, how disgusting. Guess Christ wasn't Crucified he was "extraordinarily interrogated" now that makes it OK ...

Alex511, it is called perversion. No amount of juggling by any law can change that.

I am a disciple of Christ. I am born of His Sprit and His Grace sustains me. He is my Rock and my Salvation. Jesus died for the sins of "this world", not for the sins of the Republican Party. His Grace is sufficient to sustain all of us, not just those who are a part of the GOP.

I don't hate Sarah Palin, nor do I believe that most Democrats hate her. I do however hate the rhetoric that she spew, and the hatred that she encourages at her rallies. I don't believe that God is on Sarah Palin's side for that reason alone. There is a scripture that states "All of those who cry out Lord Lord will not enter the Kingdom. Sarah Palin and her kind need to do some serious soul searching, because based upon her message, she and I do not serve the same Lord.

Dr. Dobson is the main reason so many people view Christianity as hypocritical. Jesus is not concerned with politics, His main concern is the condition of man's soul. Christians have to spread the Word of Jesus Christ. I am a Christian and it hurts to know that someone like Dobson who has such a large public platform abuses it by endorsing candidates who do not represent Christ. He shouldn't endorse anyone. I greatly admire Dr. Charles Stanley, who is an outstanding minister of God's word with a large following. He has never endorsed anyone, because He understands that the platform God has given him is for the teaching of God. When Dobson and his friends say stuff like people hate/dislike their candidate because they are Christians it makes my blood boil, because some of their faithful, non reading the Bible for themselves followers believe them. Then they in turn start spewing forth all sorts of intolerant rhetoric while invoking the name of our Holy Savior. It sickens me. They can't read the New Testament and believe some of the rhetoric that they dispense. Here is good reading for Dobson and those who think like him to meditate on: Luke 6:21-49
20Looking at his disciples, he said:
"Blessed are you who are poor,
for yours is the kingdom of God.
21Blessed are you who hunger now,
for you will be satisfied.
Blessed are you who weep now,
for you will laugh.
22Blessed are you when men hate you,
when they exclude you and insult you
and reject your name as evil, because of the Son of Man.

23"Rejoice in that day and leap for joy, because great is your reward in heaven. For that is how their fathers treated the prophets.
24"But woe to you who are rich,
for you have already received your comfort.
25Woe to you who are well fed now,
for you will go hungry.
Woe to you who laugh now,
for you will mourn and weep.
26Woe to you when all men speak well of you,
for that is how their fathers treated the false prophets.

Love for Enemies
27"But I tell you who hear me: Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you, 28bless those who curse you, pray for those who mistreat you. 29If someone strikes you on one cheek, turn to him the other also. If someone takes your cloak, do not stop him from taking your tunic. 30Give to everyone who asks you, and if anyone takes what belongs to you, do not demand it back. 31Do to others as you would have them do to you.
32"If you love those who love you, what credit is that to you? Even 'sinners' love those who love them. 33And if you do good to those who are good to you, what credit is that to you? Even 'sinners' do that. 34And if you lend to those from whom you expect repayment, what credit is that to you? Even 'sinners' lend to 'sinners,' expecting to be repaid in full. 35But love your enemies, do good to them, and lend to them without expecting to get anything back. Then your reward will be great, and you will be sons of the Most High, because he is kind to the ungrateful and wicked. 36Be merciful, just as your Father is merciful.

Judging Others
37"Do not judge, and you will not be judged. Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven. 38Give, and it will be given to you. A good measure, pressed down, shaken together and running over, will be poured into your lap. For with the measure you use, it will be measured to you."
39He also told them this parable: "Can a blind man lead a blind man? Will they not both fall into a pit? 40A student is not above his teacher, but everyone who is fully trained will be like his teacher.

41"Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother's eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? 42How can you say to your brother, 'Brother, let me take the speck out of your eye,' when you yourself fail to see the plank in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother's eye.

A Tree and Its Fruit
43"No good tree bears bad fruit, nor does a bad tree bear good fruit. 44Each tree is recognized by its own fruit. People do not pick figs from thornbushes, or grapes from briers. 45The good man brings good things out of the good stored up in his heart, and the evil man brings evil things out of the evil stored up in his heart. For out of the overflow of his heart his mouth speaks.
The Wise and Foolish Builders
46"Why do you call me, 'Lord, Lord,' and do not do what I say? 47I will show you what he is like who comes to me and hears my words and puts them into practice. 48He is like a man building a house, who dug down deep and laid the foundation on rock. When a flood came, the torrent struck that house but could not shake it, because it was well built. 49But the one who hears my words and does not put them into practice is like a man who built a house on the ground without a foundation. The moment the torrent struck that house, it collapsed and its destruction was complete."

spidermean2 wrote:
Conservative Christian Republicans will rule the world. Why and how? It is in the prophecy. This may be the last time (or second to the last) Democrats will win the presidency. God does not see them fit to rule.

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Please show us where God mentions that "Conservative Christian Republicans will rule the world" in the Bible. What verse it that??

Do you honestly believe that God looks with favor upon your blatant and idiotic politicalization of his word? Is it any wonder that virtually everyone here sees you as being morally bankrupt in your views, and totally lacking in simple basic common sense?

No one should think Dobson speaks for all evangelicals. He speaks only for those who have replaced God with government (ironically, in the name of God). God is not in control in Dobson's world. You have to scare, cajole and make divisive comments for his "God" to reign in government. My Lord reigns despite who Dobson says should be leading this country. And, apparently, he isn't going to be doing it through professing Christians who don't believe in spreading the wealth; it's going to be through those who do.

Conservative Christians can't understand why people claim to be Christians and yet embrace the liberal ways of the Democrats.

How do these people read the Bible? What is their understanding of the lake of fire? Do they see it as a body of cold water?

Dobson's spew is yet another great reason the Founding Fathers were so much for separation of church and state. Remember that they generally considered themselves "Deists" after all. And given that the King/Queen of England was not only the head of state, but also the head of the church....well you can guess why they wanted to have that separation.

Personally methinks that if Dobson, or any other religious figure, wants to talk politics, that's fine, but the second you do that then you automatically and perpetually lose your tax exemption on every level of government. I can think of a lot of tax departments that would love to get all that cash and balance the books.

It is true that many religious people who were persecuted all over the world re-settled here and are still doing so. That's the good news. The bad news is that starting with Rhode Island's attempt at religious "tolerance" which was precisely the reverse...they've continued the tradition of trying to save us from ourselves by trying to force their weird and sick notions on those who have no need or use for them. Dobson and those who follow him are going to "tolerate" us into their orbit unless we stop them. The GOP is their medium and their modus operandi is to spew hate and galvanize the so-called base. Others have a business interest in supporting these wingnuts. For years, GOP and right wing causes have been extravigantly funded by the Richard Mellon Scaifes of the world and corporate interests. (See: KBR, Blackwater, Fluor, Big Oil...you get the idea)

Their worldview is to keep the masses ignornant, poor and beholden for crumbs. Socialism (using the richness of a community to raise the standards of all in it) and spreading wealth are anathema. Sounding familiar? Elitism in education, position and favorable tax policy maintains the financiers. It is stacked against us unless we're extremely talented or lucky. (Examples: legacy appointments to select schools, removal of inheritance taxes, "the old boy network", being white, Christian and from a 'good family', limitation of student loan potential.. the reader will add to this list)

Raging in this thread are a series of comments on so-called "life" issues. What about the right's love of war? What about the cheerleaders who want to kill doctors and advocates of a woman's right to choose? Take lives to preserve lives? Isn't that a little like "I had to kill them in order to save them."? Twisted logic gets people killed. We lost over 3000 on 9/11. Since then, we've doubled down to our detriment and the locals in Iraq and Afghanistan account for well over 100,000 more.

How about us? We are the majority of this country: we don't have a fervent religious affiliation, we don't like war, we don't like taxes but understand the need for them, we don't like hate speech and certainly don't need to have our patriotism questioned by those who advocate emptying our treasury, speaking ill of our political leaders and sending our men and women over to slaughter and be slaughtered in the name of some gauzy cause or other gussied up as patriotism.

Oh, and Jesus does not care who wins football games. Pass it on.

I am an evangelical born-again Christian. I do not hate Dr Dobson and I don't think he is a hate-filled person as some have posited. I have attended some of his Focus on the Family outreach programs and I believe he is doing an awesome work in the life of many families.

However, I will not be voting for the McCain- Palin ticket. Not because Sarah is an unabashed Christian and definitetly not because I am anti-christian. I am a christian.

I will not vote for the ticket because Sarah Palin is simply not qualified to be Vice President or President of this country. She appeals to to the base, but that's about it. Since joining the ticket, she has spewed out outright lies and half-truths to the dismay of this Christian. Is that a christian thing to do just because you want to win an election for which you are not qualified?

Being a christian is not sufficient to earn my vote. Being a competent Christian like Mike Huckabee will earn you my vote. Irrespective of what Dr. Dobson says, and as much as I admire him, there are many evangelicals like me who are not two-issue voters. There is so much more at stake.

Unfortunately, the McCain-Palin ticket is not up to the task.

The Christian resolution to find the world ugly and bad, has made the world ugly and bad - Nietzsche.

Thanks a lot Dobson!

If liberal Democrats want Dobson and Palin to quit their "hate speeches", they should try to make a law that would ban reading the Bible.

You guys are crazy. Hate speech your liberal views. All the hate I see are coming from the left. Do you guys want some mirrors?

Of course, Palin and Dobson yakked about abortion, but then Palin made the verbal slip and mentioned Obama's truly big sin in the eyes of the GOP, "sharing the wealth." Dobson kept his more seasoned mouth shut about that issue because he knows how to control the message.

I believe Karl Marx said that "Religion is opium for the masses" and I would add that Dobson is a drug peddler of the Christian Religion in this country.

If Jesus was among us physically, I am sure he would have beat the crap out of Dobson for misleading people under the guise of his name, profiting himself by living in luxury mansions and a life style that would make Jesus hang his head in shame

This country was founded on separation of Church and State and in the past 8 years Bush willingly disregarded that moral principle to promote his version of god. The city I live in has mushroomed so many Mega Churches in the past 8 years funded mostly by our tax dollars. Imagine if that tax funding would have gone a Mosque or a temple , the Republicons would have been up in arms over it.

This is not the direction the Constitution wants the country to go in

It's interesting that even Dobson admits being a homosexual is a natural biological process yet still holds his views.

Dobson was against McCain before he was for him, until he realized he wasn't going to have a say in Washington politics. This is all about Dobson and his lust for power and influence. Which is the trait in religious leaders Jesus fought while he was on earth.

Here's an idea: if McCain & Palin had anything worthwhile to say, the electorate would respond. But they don't and we're not.

Palin's whining about the "mainstream media" is like blaming a loss on the referees.

All this bluster over who's a Christian and who's not ... it's truly off-the-hook crazy.

David Waters, your work was a bit sloppy. So, I need to correct you. You wrote that Dr. Dobson "didn't specify what he meant by 'up there,' " in reference to the hatred Sarah Palin has encountered. From the audio link(http://www.citizenlink.org/clspecialalert/A000008476.cfm) Dr. Dobson said: "I talked to H.B. London who was in Alaska just a week ago and he said "They are just killing her in the press up there.' " So, for what it's worth, he was talking about ALASKA. I don't know why you felt THAT point was worthy of discussion, but if you're going to write about it, be accurate in your quote, please.

Despite what I have read here, it was a wonderful interview that Dr. Dobson had with Governor Palin. It was nice to have someone ask her about being faced with putting her words into action with the knowledge that her baby had Down Syndrome.

So sad for me to see so much hate at this "On Faith" website, both from the author, David Waters, and the commenters. Oh well. Such is the state of our world today. As I write this, there have been 275 comments and it's probably a "hostility ratio" of 9 to 1 against Governor Palin and Dr. Dobson. You folks may be able to quiet our voices in your presence, but we still can vote in privacy and we will be very loud once again and you will be surprised on Election Day.

you can see it here, the conservatives mix their religion and their politics just like it's done in the muslim world, a conservative republican Sharia is what they want and they won't accept anything less.

It's you freaks who are the most dangerous, and who are driving people out of your republican party. You're too blinded by faith to see it.

I hope Dobson joins Falwell soon in hell.

Democrats had placed us into this mortgage mess which then put us into economic tailspin : http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081020/ap_on_bi_ge/the_influence_game_housing

Democrats are very soft on pouncing on future TROUBLE SPOTS like it did with the Taliban in Afghanistan and pre-911 terrorist attacks until they were successful in 911. That attack pushed us into this war.

Democrats enriched communist China by having unfettered trade with them despite the fact that they are still COMMUNISTS and dangerous and oppressive to religion. China is much more dangerous today than it ever was. Thanks to Democrats' FORESIGHT. This too will be a problem of the next president. Im glad the Dems are winning coz they would handle this coming problem. They started it, let them solve it.

Democrats placed us into an OIL CRISIS because of their "green" laws. That contributed much to our economic downturn.

Democrats are very tough on trade to the extreme. The world would truly miss the gentleness of the Republicans on this area. Oftentimes you won't give idiots what they wish coz it would spell more trouble. The world want a Democrat so give them the Democrats. When these people start complaining, I want you to remember that they CHOSE this. Stupidity, BIG TIME.

Democrats will fast tract abortion, gay marriage rights and everything liberal. God will not help us when these coming troubles pour at us.

If Bush was "hellish", see what real hell is once the Dems take over.

I doubt that I would ever embrace the Christian faith because in America it would require that I embrace the hateful Republican philosophy. Too bad. Melding a religion with a political party is just a good idea for half the population. There are religions that separate themselves from secular politics. I'll stick with one of them, and I suspect end up a lot closer to heaven than evangelical Christians. They seem to think heaven is in Washington and God sits in the White House.

When Christians talk about being the target of "hate", it is a strategy. It's the same strategy the Republicans use when they call people "elitist". By projecting your own weaknesses on your opponents, you hope that people will not notice them in you.

JKJ88 Author Profile Page:

spidermean2 wrote:
Conservative Christian Republicans will rule the world. Why and how? It is in the prophecy. This may be the last time (or second to the last) Democrats will win the presidency. God does not see them fit to rule.

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Please show us where God mentions that "Conservative Christian Republicans will rule the world" in the Bible. What verse it that??

Do you honestly believe that God looks with favor upon your blatant and idiotic politicalization of his word? Is it any wonder that virtually everyone here sees you as being morally bankrupt in your views, and totally lacking in simple basic common sense?

Give up. You can't argue with someone who does not accept reality. You can't argue with crazy people. I learned this at work. They're not starting with the same basic assumptions as the rest of us.

I am a Christian, Conservative, Educated, and Black. I fellowship in one of the more conservative Pentecostal organizations, and I am amazed at how this election is viewed. The problem is Christians want to have it BOTH WAYS: they want our Judeo Christian values to be at the forefront of policy and issues, yet at the same time they refuse to acknowledge that George Bush suckered the right, and really stands for very little of the things they or Christ stand for. You cannot stand up for abortion, faith based sex education, the family vs gay marriage, and at the same time pretend that whats happened in the last 6-7 years did not exist. BOTH WAYS: Does God care more about Abortion than Bombs? Do people really think that he (God) cares more about America, our politics, even DEMOCRACY, than he does about each and every individual soul? Did he not leave the 99 to reach out to the one? We have POLITICIZED GOD to fit our worldview and thus we justify everything (including Israel) we do or believe against that. To read and hear some of the stuff written and said about Obama, his past (I mean, I lived a few years in Arkansas and was aware of the Clinton baggage, true and false) what will happen if he's elected, you would think that he is the ANTICHRIST.I mean down right mean, nasty, and slanderous: this from "Christians". One conservative Christian website, which has very conservative views on womans dress, make-up, etc., actually gave praise to Sarah Palin, her views on abortion, family etc (which I agree with)while at the same time you can click on his website and see other similarly dressed and attired woman called a harlot and JEZABEL. YOU CANT HAVE IT BOTH WAYS, I dont and never believed the hype. Forget about Iraq, the "un"Patriot Act, Judgegate, Haliburton, and the financial collapse, which is more important prophetically than the war. My sleeping brothers on the right fail to realize that WE ARE NOT TO BECOME OVERLY INVOLVED WITH CEASAR, and that God puts up leaders, and takes them down at his will and time, for he is the head of all governmental authority, however good or bad. So if he is in charge, and all things work for the good, then it really makes no difference who's in charge. Let Ceasar(s)(politicians and governments) do what they do, and let us pray for our country and leaders. In closing, the election of Barak Obama is exactly what every Christian Right Republican deserves for their hypocricy. Whats next? I predict that those raging gun toting Christians that you see and hear at the MCCain/Palin rallies will one day lay ahold of their extreme right Religion and Guns, only to find out that the Patriot Act, curtesy of your friendly Bush Administration (emergency powers)takes away their right to bear arms, even in an emergency. Dont believe me, ask some of the people (mostly white and conservative)who wanted to defend their homes after Katrina. Oh, did I mention Katrina..

Spidermean2,

You really should stop 'contributing' to this forum for your own good. The utterly false and completely irrational thoughts swimming inside of your head come out as complete unintelligible gibberish in this, and other, forums. It really sounds like you are suffering from some form of paranoid psychosis. In one rambling remark you rail against hate speech, then in the very next remark the most hateful things come out of you. I feel quite sad for you, as your ramblings are completely irrational, erratic, uninformed, hateful, and you sound very very far away from the God that loves us all. Please get some help for yourself, you really do need it.

spidermean2:

"If liberal Democrats want Dobson and Palin to quit their "hate speeches", they should try to make a law that would ban reading the Bible.

You guys are crazy. Hate speech your liberal views. All the hate I see are coming from the left. Do you guys want some mirrors? "

---

LOL, that's pretty funny right there, considering that the far-right members of this country seem to always be the ones to want to ban books from schools, reading lists, libraries, etc. because they're "bad influences". Did I get that wrong? I hope not because I haven't heard about us liberals wanting to blanketly ban free speech and all that, even when that speech is blatently stupid.

I find it interesting also that you would seemingly not classify Palin's "there are some parts of this country pro-America and others anti-America" as some type of hate speech. Why is that? Don't keep everyone to the same standard of morals or ethics or something?

I heard part of the interview with Dr. Dobson and Gov. Palin. I continue to be astounded and saddened by how the right wing has hijacked the God of my understanding and the sweetness of Jesus. It's hard to even identify as "Christian" anymore because of it. These people have created a situation where there is no room for my ideas, questions or beliefs in their churches, and certainly not the Republican party.
My dad had a saying from down south, "there is no sense in trying to talk sense into a pig. Just frustrates you and annoys the pig."
I've gotten to that point with the Focus on the Family crowd-- It just frustrates me and annoys them when we try to present a more gentle theology or world view. They killed Jesus for it, and now they've killed the Republican party.
I'll be voting for Obama and the life he can hopefully bring back into our country.
Thanks.

The millions of people praying for Sarah and John McCain, as Dobson claims, are obviously praying to the "Christian God" and not the Hindu God or the Buddha God or the Muslim God.
Pastor Conrad Arnold from Davenport, Iowa expressed it so well at the invocation of a McCain/Palin rally.

I am so tired of the quoting of scripture by people who have only ever memorized verses and never actually read the entire text for themselves.

Go to your Bible and read Isaiah , Jeremiah, and/or Ezekiel all the way through. Then talk about why the Lord was so angry.

It was for oppressing the poor, for not dealing true justice, for using their positions to enrich themselves at the expense of widows and orphans. He was angry at the religious leaders for saying that their own words were the words of the Lord.

"Christian Leader" has become the new name for the Saducees, and "Evangelical Christian" is the new name for the Pharisees. There truly is nothing new under the sun.

Remember, it was Jesus who said to go into your closet to pray (not to make a show in public), and to give alms in secret. Matt 6:1-7

(BTW, also notice how often adultery is mentioned as a major evil; this seems to have been missed by many Christians who seem to be able to forgive adultery in their leaders without a thought, but will vilify many other things that are never mentioned in the Ten Commandments.)

As a Christian who is a member of a religious order, I am disgusted by these "Christians" who have less to do with Jesus Christ and his teachings and more to do with their own political agendas.

As for Palin, she has already shown her true colors -- found to violated ethics standards as governor, using $150,000 of donated money for her to shop at Neiman Marcus, for her husband to shop; being paid over $17,000 of Alaskan taxpayer money to live in her own home; spending thousands of dollars of taxpayer and donated money for her family to travel with her during this campaign -- spending over $700 a night in hotels -- while claiming to be an average American. She uses Christianity as a tool to claim moral superiority to her political opponents and lies, distorts, and smears honest people to obtain political power.

As for McCain -- he committed adultery with Cindy while married to wife #1, a woman who had stayed faithful to him while he was a pow, a woman he dumped after she became injured by a bad accident in which she ended up with a limp. McCain dumped his loyal wife for a rodeo beauty queen who was an heiress to a beer empire. McCain's explosive temper and notorious foul language is well known in Washington, DC.

I am quite fearful of these extremists like Palin, Dobson, etc. Pharisees one and all.

I think whats happening this year is the return of rationality to the argument. Lets use "Spidermean 2" as an example. He infers that liberal democrats are the ones full of hate speech....but yet can't refer to any particular examples to back it up. Worse, he fails to look at the situations that occur all over this country in terms of who it is that tries to ban books from the libraries, that want to censor information so that others may not have access, etc.etc. He seems to have confused choosing to vote for the other guy with something a little higher up the totem pole, racism....violence, etc.
I know who Dobson is. I don't hate him. I just don't agree with him and furthermore, will not support "his" cause. My government is my government and my religion should be mostly kept separated....and last time I checked, that was actually written down somewhere on some inconsequential document relating to the history of this country.

Billy8:

Very good comments.

I have 2 thoughts to add: (1) your comment about people talking past each other because they are not starting from the same place is dead on. This is essentially the inevitable, but intentional, impact of FoxNews and the Republican Party's multi-decade efforts to vilanize and discredit traditional media sources. The result is that different sides of the political spectrum do not even agree on the basic facts. Without bedrock agreed-upon facts, there can be no discussion. What you hear instead is "well that is not what I read" or "where did you hear that, from Rush Limbaugh?"

An super-simplified example is basically if one had a conversation about the Redskins and one person said they are having a great season, are 5-2 and doing well, while the other said not, they are 2-5 and lost the last 4 games in a row and are horrible. Each has a source for their contention, and does not agree that the other's source is valid. There can be no discussion.

(2) projecting your own tendencies and weaknesses on your opponent. Great strategy because then, when your faults are discussed or made public, the response among those already in your camp is "well, so what? THEY (the other side) do that too." How often has a discussion about the present administration morphed into what happened during the Clinton administration?

fr spidermean2:

>Alex511, it is called perversion. No amount of juggling by any law can change that.

No, it's called MARRIAGE EQUALITY! No amount of hate-spewing by "dr" dobdork can change that.

Vote NO on Prop. 8, all California voters. Send a message to dobson and his ilk that Hate is NOT a family value.

I do not agree with everything Dobson says. But he was right about the witch hunt that Sarah Palin is enduring in this election. Now they want the lab results from the woman's pap smears. Utterly ridiculous.

Poor, poor, disadvantaged, persecuted Christians! How ever do they manage to survive in a country where only 90+% of the citizens and 99+% of the elected officials share their religious faith? Where they are irrationally prevented from hoisting their flag over statehouses and courthouses? Where members of other religions, AND EVEN THOSE WITH NO RELIGION AT ALL, are allowed to live? Poor, poor persecuted Christians...

Spidermean2:

"Democrats had placed us into this mortgage mess which then put us into economic tailspin : http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081020/ap_on_bi_ge/the_influence_game_housing"

Interesting that the article you reference points out that the consulting firm used by Fannie Mae is a REPUBLICAN consulting firm.

Actually in part I agree with your opinion, I just think though that the blame can be far more widely pushed around than you think it can. I mean, who was in control of Congress when all these regs were changed, huh?

"Democrats are very soft on pouncing on future TROUBLE SPOTS like it did with the Taliban in Afghanistan and pre-911 terrorist attacks until they were successful in 911. That attack pushed us into this war."

Well the US has been in the past of a relatively isolationist bent in foreign policy so I wou;dn't necessary call this solely a Dem problem; I mean Woodrow Wilson was a Republican, right? And the war argument really only plays into Iraq. There was no true need for it, Iraq was effectively isolated since 1991 anyway. If a war WAS needed it was solely Afghanistan anyway, all the arguments for invading Iraq have, over time, been shown as bunk.

"Democrats enriched communist China by having unfettered trade with them despite the fact that they are still COMMUNISTS and dangerous and oppressive to religion. China is much more dangerous today than it ever was. Thanks to Democrats' FORESIGHT. This too will be a problem of the next president. Im glad the Dems are winning coz they would handle this coming problem. They started it, let them solve it."

HUH? Since when did every CEO that has outsourced production to China been a Democrat? I mean, good ol' Richard Nixon "opened" China, right? Please cite references how this can be pinned on the Democratic party.

"Democrats placed us into an OIL CRISIS because of their "green" laws. That contributed much to our economic downturn."

HUH? As above, please cite references. Are you saying that recycling or otherwise having some environmentally-responsible regulation caused all of our oil price problems? That sounds wierd to me but I'm willing to further consider the point if you can better elaborate.

"Democrats are very tough on trade to the extreme. The world would truly miss the gentleness of the Republicans on this area. Oftentimes you won't give idiots what they wish coz it would spell more trouble. The world want a Democrat so give them the Democrats. When these people start complaining, I want you to remember that they CHOSE this. Stupidity, BIG TIME."

I can only laugh because this sounds incredibly ridiculous.

"Democrats will fast tract abortion, gay marriage rights and everything liberal. God will not help us when these coming troubles pour at us."

You know, this is the free will argument all over again. Besides why should you care how I treat my body, and how you treat yours? That's none of your, or my, business anyway, which I am pretty sure is the common-sense philosophy anyway.

"If Bush was "hellish", see what real hell is once the Dems take over."

Talk to the CIVILIAN Iraqis and ask them that same question, I think you'll get a good answer

MRRAMSEY:

"So sad for me to see so much hate at this "On Faith" website, both from the author, David Waters, and the commenters. Oh well. Such is the state of our world today. As I write this, there have been 275 comments and it's probably a "hostility ratio" of 9 to 1 against Governor Palin and Dr. Dobson. You folks may be able to quiet our voices in your presence, but we still can vote in privacy and we will be very loud once again and you will be surprised on Election Day."

---

yeah I agree. I think we need to strive to argue out of civility and rationality, not just passion. The latter just creates more problems for all of us.

There is a comment attributed to Voltaire: “If God created us in His image we have certainly returned the compliment.” I never stop being amazed at the lengths of how the religious right creates God in its own image.

Maybe someone from that group can answer my questions: Do you guys REALLY own God? If God is on your side, don't you think God is the one to make that decision? Are the rest of us supposed to believe in a God small enough to fit in the mind of a fundamentalist?

I find myself feeling in the middle here. I am a Christian, but I am not a Dobson Christian. When Jesus came, he brought two new great commandments: to love God and to love one's neighbor as one's self. Over and over, Jesus repudiated the temptation to punish people who were viewed to be sinners. Unfortunately, the most Christian parts of the U.S. today are the ones who most gleefully call for the death penalty, who put all former felons beyond the pale by denying the rights to participate in our democracy, who condemn even minor wrongdoers to long terms in jail, and more. Where did the "forgive" part of the message get lost?

One needs only to look at history to see that when the Church controls the political arm of state as well that the results are not good--try the Salem Witch Trial and the Inquisition. It is tempting when one believes something to be true to feel that it should be a law as well, but, if we are really successful at standing up for what we believe in, we can influence through moral, not legal persuasion. That is what the U.S. should be, a place where Churches see to souls, not laws.

"My kingdom is no part of this world." (John 18:36)

Sincerely,
J.C.

The double standard that is protecting Sarah Palin is absurd. The truth is she is unqualified... Not because of her religion nor her gender nor her outsider status, but because she is not up to the task. The US is due for an Iron Lady, and Sarah Palin is not her.

I know it's normally bad form to crib from other internet sources, but this "open letter" (origninally posted in response to that other great theologian, "Dr." Laura Schlesinger) is so appropriate...

Dear Dr. Dodson:

Thank you for doing so much to educate people regarding God's Law. I have learned a great deal from your show, and try to share that knowledge with as many people as I can. When someone tries to defend the homosexual lifestyle, for example, I simply remind them that Leviticus 18:22 clearly states it to be an abomination. End of debate. I do need some advice from you, however, regarding some of the other specific laws and how to follow them:

When I burn a bull on the altar as a sacrifice, I know it creates a pleasing odor for the Lord - Lev.1:9. The problem is my neighbors. They claim the odor is not pleasing to them. Should I smite them?

I would like to sell my daughter into slavery, as sanctioned in Exodus 21:7. In this day and age, what do you think would be a fair price for her?

I know that I am allowed no contact with a woman while she is in her period of menstrual uncleanliness - Lev.15:19- 24. The problem is, how do I tell? I have tried asking, but most women take offense.

Lev. 25:44 states that I may indeed possess slaves, both male and female, provided they are purchased from neighboring nations. A friend of mine claims that this applies to Mexicans, but not Canadians. Can you clarify? Why can't I own Canadians?

I have a neighbor who insists on working on the Sabbath. Exodus 35:2 clearly states he should be put to death. Am I morally obligated to kill him myself?

A friend of mine feels that even though eating shellfish is an abomination - Lev. 11:10, it is a lesser abomination than homosexuality. I don't agree. Can you settle this?

Lev. 21:20 states that I may not approach the altar of God if I have a defect in my sight. I have to admit that I wear reading glasses. Does my vision have to be 20/20, or is there some wiggle room here?

Most of my male friends get their hair trimmed, including the hair around their temples, even though this is expressly forbidden by Lev. 19:27. How should they die?

I know from Lev. 11:6-8 that touching the skin of a dead pig makes me unclean, but may I still play football if I wear gloves?

My uncle has a farm. He violates Lev. 19:19 by planting two different crops in the same field, as does his wife by wearing garments made of two different kinds of thread (cotton/polyester blend). He also tends to curse and blaspheme a lot. Is it really necessary that we go to all the trouble of getting the whole town together to stone them? - Lev.24:10-16. Couldn't we just burn them to death at a private family affair like we do with people who sleep with their in-laws? (Lev. 20:14)

I know you have studied these things extensively, so I am confident you can help. Thank you again for reminding us that God's word is eternal and unchanging.

Please keep your religion in the church and your prayers in your house. I don't care if your decisions and actions are influenced by your religion, but it is certainly wrong to claim that God talks to you and you're doing his will. It is an insult to anyone on this planet who's not religious or has a different religion than the Great Leader of the United States to whom God (the Christian Evangelical one) chats every day. It is scary to hear grown men in charge with the destiny of a country with so much influence in the world tell us they are hearing voices, God's or others, those people belong to an institution. I don't have a big problem with the decent Christians or other religious people who believe, but I have a problem who claim they hear God's voice. What if the voice tells them to kill the unfaithful? That's so 14th century.

Palin is a shame for Christianity. 150K spent on clothes.. Didn't Jesus say something about that behavior? Hypocrites and bigots!

Mr. Dobson; get a decent job, fix a road or a bridge, be useful to the society and stop spreading hatred. Yes hatred; your claim that Palin is somehow victimized because of her religion makes her fans hate her opponents. One day one of those fans will do something horrible and you will be part of it.

God gave us freewill. Make up yer own cotton pickin' mind, for Christ's sake!

Last time I checked, Dr. Dobson, all four candidates on the major party presidential tickets are unabashed Christians. All four have had the "courage" to speak the name of Christ.
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And this is part of the problem. They shouldn't have to, and we shouldn't expect to hear only one name, or any name, should they want to.

Hmmm, Harry Truman, farmer, hat salesman, Jackson County Judge, One term Senator, VP, President-

"Truman, whose demeanor was very different from that of the patrician Roosevelt, was a folksy, unassuming president. He popularized such phrases as "The buck stops here" and "If you can't stand the heat, you better get out of the kitchen."[1] He overcame the low expectations of many political observers who compared him unfavorably with his highly regarded predecessor. At different points in his presidency, Truman earned both the highest and the lowest public approval ratings that had ever been recorded (George W. Bush eventually earned more extreme numbers in both directions).[2][3][4] Despite negative public opinion during his term in office, popular and scholarly assessments of his presidency became more positive after his retirement from politics and the publication of Truman's memoirs. U.S. scholars today rank him among the top ten best presidents. Truman's legendary upset victory in 1948 over Thomas E. Dewey is routinely invoked by underdog presidential candidates."

Dobson and his band of Evangelicals are Christians in the true sense of what Christ meant. they are a bunch of religious fanatics that want to turn the US into a theocracy.
There is a reason why Evagelicals ony make up 10% of the US population.

Ah, here we go again with another con who has re-discovered his high school history book. Why don't you, like that guy on the radio says, tell us the rest of the story? Yes, LBJ said those words in his Sen. Maj leader days but then repudiated them in 1965 by signing the most ambitious and beneficial civil rights legislation ever. This was a courageous move on LBJ's part who realized it could have negative repercussions on a 68' re-election bid and who accurately predicted that it would hurt the Democrats now in the South for a generation (he underestimated). And why don't also mention how Nixon picked up on that when he created his "Southern History" of pulling those Dixiecrat states into the Republican fold?

Try reading the whole story instead of cherry picking your history facts!

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She won't. Some people never absorb the message about repentance, or redemption.

Instead of just speaking for Christ, it would have been nice if Bush had acted for him too.

I'm a Christian.

That's why I'm voting the opposite of whatever James Dobson says.

I am an evangelical Christian.

I fully and faithfully follow Christ as much as I can.

That is why I am voting Democrat. Yes, I am pro-life, and no I don't agree with the Dems on this point, but I certainly am not naive enough to think the Republicans actually care about it.

Their rhetoric is hollow.

I am a true Christian.

And I already voted for Barack Hussein Obama.

Deal with it.

As I watch the nation, I live in today it's as if we live in 2 parallel worlds. I am an educated professional with a master's degree in accounting. With that, I am an evangelical Christian who believes that the bible is as applicable today as it was 2000 years ago. I don't recognize 1/2 of the USA. I love my God and my guns and the freedom and prosperity this country offer. Today, all across the world there are hundreds of thousands who line up at the embassies of the countries they were born in and ask for a visa to come to the USA. I believe that John McCain is the person to be the next president of the USA and I'm so proud he chose Sarah Palin to be his VP. I'd be glad to debate on any level you decide; economic, values, character, experience, associations, or spiritual. You underestimate those across this nation like me...

MichaelFairbanks wrote: "I fully and faithfully follow Christ as much as I can.

That is why I am voting Democrat. Yes, I am pro-life, and no I don't agree with the Dems on this point, but I certainly am not naive enough to think the Republicans actually care about it."

Thank you for saying that. Keep seeking the truth!

That is always the problem with Dr. Dobson. His view is that Christ is always under attack, and if you don't subscribe to his particular ideology then you aren't even a Christian.

I am a born again Christian and believe soley and completely in God's word. Yes, i also do not support pro-choice and gay marriage. HOWEVER, this is not cause to vote for John McCain and Sarah Palin. In 2004, I almost voted for Bush because of the gay marriage issue and his belief in Jesus. Sarah Palin says she's a christian but her actions are far from being christ-like. I don't think God is happy with her lying and accusatory statements on the campaign trail. i see no signs of love for all and humility in her. Do you honestly think God supports her behavior in this election?? Frankly, McCain-Palin scare me. I am voting Obama-Biden. honestly, i think christianity has no place in politics. We just all need to pray for our leaders and let God decide who to appoint to lead his great nation!

Dobson recalled the moment in 2000 when presidential candidate George W. Bush named Jesus Christ as his favorite political philosopher. "That created hatred for him (Bush, not Jesus) for months and months and it's one of the reasons they despise him so much today because he had the courage to speak the name of Christ," Dobson said. DR DOBSON, THIS IS SO FAR FROM THE TRUTH. BUSH APPROVAL RATING HAS NOTHING AT ALL TO DO WITH HIM SPEAKING THE NAME OF CHRIST. IT DOES NOT TAKE A ROCKET SCIENTIST TO FIGURE OUT THAT WE ARE NOT HAPPY WITH BUSH BECAUSE OF HOW HE DESTROYED THIS GREAT COUNTRY. WHEN I READ YOUR COMMENTS, I LOSE RESPECT FOR YOU BECAUSE YOU ARE INSULTING CHRISTIANS INTELLIGENCE. I AM SO OFFENDED!

At the heyday of corruption in the Catholic Church (then the Western Christian Church), Calixtus III ---the first Borgia to accede to the "Throne of Saint Peter"--- wrote upon his election as Pope: "I was elected to annihilate the enemies of the faith". The enemies of the faith were those who diagreed with them, those who wanted corruption banned from the pulpit, those who wanted to return to the original values of Christianity.
Thus, reformes of the Church were persecuted and massacred (Luther, Calvin, the Huguenots), scientists were executed (Giordano Bruno) or threatened with death (Galileo). Today, the extreme right of the Evangelical churches ---mainly in the US, but spilling a bit in other countries---, the new Borgias (James Dobson, Pat Robertson, Oral Roberts) threaten with annihilation (moral, through their twisted and relativist interpretation ---citing, out of context--- only those few paragraphs that suit their interest, but suppressing the rest of the Bible--- of the Word). They have found their condottieri in a corrupt GOP, in wgich clinging to powerhas become more important than the well-being of the American people. It is no coincidence that this trend was started by no other than Richard Nixon and is ending with W. and Cheney.
The American people are the new Luthers. They must rise in this elections against the neo-Borgias (neo-cons). Joe the Plumber is not one of the plumbers that the GOP is plagued with (remember the Watergate plumbers). Joe should rise against the SPalins and the Dobsons, so that the Christian faith in America returns to its Biblical principles.

The Reality of Christianity for Those Eyes That Have Not Seen--

Jesus was an illiterate Jewish peasant/carpenter/simple preacher man who suffered from hallucinations and who has been characterized anywhere from the Messiah from Nazareth to a mythical character from mythical Nazareth to a mamzer from Nazareth (Professor Bruce Chilton, in his book Rabbi Jesus). Analyses of Jesus’ life by many contemporary NT scholars (e.g. Professors Crossan, Borg and Fredriksen, On Faith panelists) via the NT and related documents have concluded that only about 30% of Jesus' sayings and ways noted in the NT were authentic. The rest being embellishments (e.g. miracles)/hallucinations made/had by the NT authors to impress various Christian, Jewish and Pagan sects.

The 30% of the NT that is "authentic Jesus" like everything in life was borrowed/plagiarized and/or improved from those who came before. In Jesus' case, it was the ways and sayings of the Babylonians, Greeks, Persians, Egyptians, Hittites, Canaanites, OT, John the Baptizer and possibly the ways and sayings of traveling Greek Cynics. www. earlychristianwritings.com/theories.html

For added "pizzazz", Catholic/Christian theologians divided god the singularity into three persons and invented atonement as an added guilt trip for the "pew people" to go along with this trinity of overseers. By doing so, they made god the padre into god the "filicider".

Current crises:

Pedophiliac priests, atonement theology and original sin!!!!

3. Luther, Calvin, Smith, Henry VIII, Wesley et al, founders of Christian-based religions, also suffered from the belief in/hallucinations of "pretty wingie thingie" visits and "prophecies" for profits analogous to the myths of Catholicism (resurrections, apparitions, ascensions and immaculate conceptions).

Current crises:

Adulterous preachers, "propheteering/ profiteering" evangelicals (e.g. Dobson, the Osteens, the Grahams) and atonement theology.

CCNL posted (yet again): "The Reality of Christianity for Those Eyes That Have Not Seen--"

We have all seen you post this particular rant many times on this board. I find myself hoping that your "pretty wingie thingies" will eat Spidey's "chocolate cake", and both phrases will be replaced by new and original posts.

The bible has been reiterated for ~2000 years. Reality is just catching up.

I take issue with David Waters comment about all 4 candidates being unabashed Christians. David you and the media fail to take a stand on Sen. Obama's membership in Jeramiah Wright's church. As a church member who attends worship service to "worship" I would never sit in a pew where anti-American and anti-race sermons are preached from the pulpit. Sen. Obama participated in that church, hearing those sermons because that is what he believes or for political gain. He only stopped attending because those sermons were exposed. I would never vote for someone who participated in that type of church atmosphere and was not strong enough in their faith to leave until it wasn't politically beneficial. Come on David do you really believe that Sen. Obama never heard those sermons and he didn't know how Jeramiah Wright feels about America. Be careful America a vote for Sen. Obama is an uniformed vote.

DROBINSON1 says he would never sit in a pew where anti-American sermons are preached. Does that mean that no Chrisian preacher can call America to account? Rev Wright's "no, no, no, not God bless America, but God damn America" may have been way over the line in terms of manner of expression, but he comes from a long line of prophetic preaching. Does not this comment bear some relationship to the laments against Israel articulated by the prophets? "Thus says the Lord, woe to Israel if" (they don't repent, etc.) Perhaps we have gotten so used to "Bible language" that we don't fully appreciate how strong that must have been in its time. May I suggest that people re-read Jeremiah ("Jeremiads" comes from this...) and I Isaiah, for some idea how strong this language is.

I don't condone Rev Wright's language, but I understand the preaching tradition fron which it comes. No matter how "exceptional" we believe America to be, we still stand under the judgment of God.

fr forgetthis:

>...I do not agree with everything Dobson says. But he was right about the witch hunt that Sarah Palin is enduring in this election....

The ice queen is NOT "enduring" a witch hunt. dobdork is talking out of his hat again.

DRobinson1 wrote: "Come on David do you really believe that Sen. Obama never heard those sermons and he didn't know how Jeramiah Wright feels about America."

I know my kids aren't perfect, and sometimes I yell at them in language that others would find offensive. When all is said and done - I still love them with all my heart.

Can't my relationship with my country be just the same without a bunch of right wing yahoos questioning my patriotism?

I am furious at the Dobson's of this world that are so arrogant to think that they decide who God would endorse, and rule on whether or not Obama's Christianity is acceptable. Apparently, Obama (according to Dobson) has insulted the Lord with his interpretation of the Sermon on the Mount... among many other things. But moreso, I think the Republican 'base' has displayed a total lack of Christian values, likely moreso hiding the coincidence that they are mostly white... and ironically gun-owners as well... and also, many of them are mighty bitter and have bibles.