Anonymous, So Islam attacked us on 9-11? Are you really comfortable painting an entire religion with a brush that broad? Don't forget that the terrorists use a similar brush to justify killing innocent civilians for the actions of their leaders. Do you find that acceptable? Christianity has it's fair share of skeletons in it's closet too, you know. Should I equate you with the Inquisition? Is that in anyway fair? How about that Phelps character that's been in the news lately? Should I equate the two of you under the umbrella of Christianity? Is that reasonable?

Fred,

Here are some arguments against the SCHIP bill that was originally offered by Senora Pelosi:

1) Recent studies indicate that people with private insurance will likely drop eligible dependents in favor of welfare-style health coverage under SCHIP. The CBO estimates that the bill would move nearly 1.9 million people off private insurance and onto taxpayer-supported health care.

2) in addition to regular SCHIP payments, the bill would offer "bonus payments" to states for SCHIP and Medicaid enrollment over specified "baseline" levels. As enrollment above designated levels increases, the bonuses get exponentially larger. The inclusion of such conditions, of course, would encourage state officials to actively seek and enroll persons in the government-health programs, regardless of current insurance status.

3) Under the bill, eligibility for government coverage would be extended to families with incomes up to 400% above the federal poverty level (FPL) — $82,600 for a family of four —hardly considered low-income by any reasonable standard. The House policy is transparently absurd: 89% of all children between 300% and 400%of the FPL are enrolled in private health insurance; 77% of all children between 200% and 300% of the FPL are enrolled in private health insurance; and 50% of all children between 100% and 200% of the FPL are enrolled in private health insurance.

4) The House bill requires no future reauthorization, thereby transforming it into a permanent government program. Moreover, the bill would change SCHIP from its current block grant status to the equivalent of a full-blown entitlement.

Mad Love,

No, I meant Islam. The flaws/violence in this warmongering religion are noted below:

Mohammed, an illiterate, womanizing, warmongering, hallucinating Arab, also had embellishing/hallucinating/plagiarizing scribal biographers who not only added "angels" and flying chariots to the koran but also a militaristic agenda to support the plundering and looting of the lands of non-believers.

This agenda continues as shown by the conduct of the seven Muslim doctors in the UK, the 9/11 terrorists, the 24/7 Sunni suicide/roadside/market/mosque bombers, the 24/7 Shiite suicide/roadside/market/mosque bombers, the Islamic train bombers in the UK and Spain, the Bali crazies, the Kenya crazies, the Pakistani koranics, the Palestine suicide bombers/rocketeers, the Lebanese nutcases, the Taliban nut jobs, and the Filipino koranics.

And who funds these acts of terror? The Islamic Shiite terror theocracy of Iran aka the Third Axis of Evil and also the Sunni "Wannabees" of Saudi Arabia.

If by 'Islam' you meant 'the G.O.P.' then yes, I agree completely.

Look at today's front page news!!! What warmongering religion has top billing 24/7? And what warmongering religion is costing us most of the 2007 $726 billion dollar defense budget??

ISLAM!!!!!!

Well, I do agree with George on one thing; I do not support paying for childrens health care by an additional "sin" tax, in this case on the cigerette smokers who have pending health issues of their own coming up!

It is positively criminal and immoral that society can not or will not take care of its elderly or its children for the common good! It is disgusting and shameful that the wealthy use their power to hoard their wealth and deny repaying society for their good fortune with a generous and open hand!

It is equally disgusting that the current Fascist regime will squander hugh sums on wars, instruments of wars, corporate welfare, and tax avoidence by the wealthy while cutting care and concern for our warriors, our children, our elderly, and the neediest among us! It is one of the greatest cons of our times that corporatism has "sold" the ideal of rugged individualism to get the ignorant support of their elitism rip-off of these ignorant economic slaves!

lavrat2000 - Usually when people advise others to read the legislation a little closer, I expect better arguments.

The Dems almost lost the latino vote, because LEGAL immigrants are denied coverage too, how are you proposing the ILLEGALS will get supported? Seriously, how? This is a specious argument at best, an attempt to be outright deceptive is even more likely.

Compared to the bills of years past, and with the conclusion that this bill is only $7 billion a year (still a fair amount of money) there simply isn't enough space for 'outrageous earmarks' within it. Care to specify a few of them? There are probably a couple, but it is nowhere near loaded down like bills have been for the past 6 years under Bush/Republicans, and a few earmarks to help children live healthy, is almost a no-brainer. It's certainly an easier decision than 200 BILLION this year alone (and that's the EXTRA money, not the actual cost of a standing army - 30 TIMES the cost of this health care) for the 'GWOT'.

The definition of a CHILD is as the states require it to be. The states require private insurance to cover children up to 25, because they are often in college, or have a cruddy little job that offers terrible benefits, if they're offered at all. Plus, the children's income is factored in, so it serves to further disqualify people when you include them. First jobs, especially for the children of the poor, tend to be extremely limited in benefits, so they go without health insurance, which dooms the few who come down with an expensive disease to bankruptcy, or worse.

Possum - If you are truly paying 45% of your money to the government, you are in a ridiculous tax bracket, or are very bad with your money. My wife and I clear six figures, and we are at about 35%. If you are truly paying 45%, you're in a tax bracket that tells me you can EASILY spare a few extra bucks. Especially when you have contributed to the country's level of illness with your secondhand smoke. Tobacco and smokers have not figured out a way to repay society for their dangerous habit. This is a good start.

Not to mention, a few pennies for prevention, saves dollars when people don't get sick. Letting kids in for wellness will help head off, or prevent very serious illnesses, that we will end up paying for ANYWAY, because the hospitals cannot turn down a dying patient, no matter how poor they are. who pays for them? We all do. Might as well make it a legitimate and positive action for all, instead of leaving the hospitals out to dry on the payment, which they pass on to the insurance companies, not to mention you and me.

Yes! Universal healthcare! Let's pay for it by taxing the churches!

If the best way to expand health care coverage to children is to expand health care coverage to adults, then why does the government offer programs exclusively for children at all?

Why not advocate for universal health care?

Only legislation has put in place the moral pillars necessary to make a moral society.

The religions have been a complete failure since the invention of "faith".

Witness that the "good christians" in Southern States stopped lynching blacks as laws were enacted to exact a price IN THIS LIFE for immoral behaviour.

Note that even the "good christian" mormons toed the line when the Great Society legislation was enacted. Now black males can "hold the priesthood". (well as long as they pay their money).

Nooses?

They have never been out of style among the hypocritical, southern and midwestern, "good christian", rednecks; but, Blacks are now protected from these "good christians".

The point.
Legistation is responsible for raising the bar of morality, i.e. conservatives are forced to be moral via threat of prosecution.

Health Care?
"good christians" have done nothing to provide for children's healthcare except as it has provided a tax deduction for the wealthy.

The "inconvienent truth"?

The churches use donations to further their existence, not for charity as Jesus encouraged.

Sadly, an immoral society tends to vote for immoral candidates, e.g. George Bush and the majority of republicans.

Nevertheless, little by little, we achieve a more moral society via legislation (FDR, JFK, LBJ) - not faith (we also lose morality via legislation Hitler, Lenin, Reagan, Bushes 1 & 2).

Lavrat: I have been in health care for 25 years. what you don't know (but every member of the uninsured poor does) is that anyone who is sick can walk in to any ER in this country and they must be treated without regard to their inability to pay. it's the law. you are paying for it now, it's built in to your health insurance premiums, because hospitals have to at least break even. so care for kids is essentially "covered" now, only the kid has to wait until he's sick, instead of getting "well" visits and immunizations (which you don't seem to have a problem with anyway) and the care in the ER costs many times what it would cost in a doctor's office.

lavarat2000@yahoo.com

So you believe in the survival of the fittest (those who have the money and therefore will not need to use tax-payer assistance). While I may have discontinued attending Catholic church and changed my Catholic beliefs for agnostic ones, I certainly agree with Father Reese on this point. Tax-payer money (for that is what it is) should be used to pay for health insurance, especially for the children--and the disabled whose care would be more expensive should not be left out, either. Anything less would be repugnant!

Well first of all - you obviously didn't read the SCHIP bill very carefully.

1. The check for citizenship eligibility is not as rigorous as it should be.
2.There are outrageous earmarks for congressmen's pet hospitals.
3.The definition of a "child" is too geneous and the cut-off should be at 16.

Also- more important how expensive a medical care are these children entitled too? I can see check-ups and immunizations and minor illnesses. But illness which will end up costing the taxpayer's millions of dollars for a single child - I am sorry I don't feel that should be covered. We have overpopulation now. In the old days these children would have died due to general level of medical knowledge in that age. Today at the cost of millions of dollars for a single individual we can prolong life. Should SCHIP cover that sort of expense, I don't think so. Let us face at today's cost we have to ration health care and an illness which costs millons for a single individual SHOULD NOT BE COVERED.

Possum: I would like to see your health insurance premiums go down by providing coverage to kids so they don't go to our expensive ER's sooner or later (when they are sicker for lack of preventive care) where hospitals have to see them for free, the cost of which gets passed on to Blue Cross, etc. The SCHIP subsidy further reduces your cost, because the unsubsidized portion comes from the parent according to their income, and the profit goes to the insurer, further reducing your premium

Henry James:
"if you don't like the way Hillary or George does it, argue for another way"

We're way too busy trashing Hillary's plan to come up with one of our own. Before Hillary presented her plan we were too busy preparing to and already trashing her plan to come up with a plan of our own.

Our plan: America has the best health care on earth. We'll know there's something wrong with it when Karl Rove complains.

It's not perfect of course because only God is perfect so we might improve it but we're way to busy preparing to trash and trashing anyone with a plan to improve it to come up with a plan to improve it ourselves.

Anyone with a plan to improve the health care system is a LIBERAL and anyone who is interested in seeing a plan to improve the health care system is LIBERAL too. We don't know what the word LIBERAL means except that it's several steps below being a LEPER, because we've been told it was that way by the authorities.

We don't know what a LEPER is but the authorities have assured us it's a real bad disease that costs way to much to treat and is not covered by health insurance policies, along with anything else that costs anything to treat.

The only campaign issues we listen to is, "I wanna be your president" as long as it's not a LIBERAL LEPER that's not and should not be covered saying it.

In case you haven't heard, "this is a republic and not a democracy and we're for keeping it that way." Now get some ambition and inherit yourself a nice department store. Did I mention that we're against employer paid health insurance and double so at department stores, Wal-Mart in particular?

"Go to your churches, temples, synagogues and mosques and pray" for there will be no government paid health insurance for poor children. Faith will see you through or you won't make it.

Possum

sorry for the beating. i do love you.

my amended thoughts

i hate the governments spending SO much on a deceptively authorized war also.

i think it is obscene that Bush gives tax breaks of hundreds of thousands per single 500millionaire,

and things get crunched for you and me.

that said:

I think it is our Moral Duty to find a way within our democratic system to have health coverage at the base level for ALL of our children.

if you don't like the way Hillary or George does it, argue for another way.

But just as it is the obligation of adults in a 100-member tribe to make sure the children of their tribe are ALL cared for,

so is it the obligation of us adults in a 300 million member nation to make caring for the children the FIRST priority.

that doesn't negate the need for
Fair Taxes
Honest Presidents and VicePresidents
Only using War as a Last Resort.

Get a good night's sleep, Possum

Love
Henry

Possum-beaters: Betty and Henry James

What inhumanity? What solipsism?
Did I not point out that I already give thousands of dollars per year toward common social improvement programs, including healthcare for the uninsured? Was it I that accused everyone else of “punishing children?” Was it I that made the insane claim that the American people are “refusing food and health care”?

“all of the money you have earned is entirely due to your personal, individual initiate
and is in no part due to being a beneficiary of the richest society on earth“

Uh, what? I didn’t choose my place of birth… And the ‘richest society on earth’ means very little in the dusty backwoods of rural Kentucky sir… I am not complaining about my lot in life, I am not complaining about giving some back, but yes, I did work my arse off to rise above my birthlot. I am not sure what your point is. Am I not allowed to complain about anything unless I am as miserable as the most miserable among us? Is what I have earned, whether $1 or $100,000 at least partially mine to use as I see fit? Must I give it all away? If not, exactly how much is enough? I have kids too, I have bills, I have responsibilities, I’m trying to raise a family without plugging in to the public dole, that takes nearly every dime I earn… but somehow I’m not generous enough? I’m punishing babies? I’m starving kids?

So I’m supposed to just bend over and hand even more of my money to a government that coldly, heartlessly sends my sons to die or be maimed in the desert for no good reason other than they are too ashamed to admit a galactic mistake? I can not trust my government to use the money wisely now. At what point is it finally okay to just say ‘enough is enough’!

I am also, and especially tired of being told by some tax-exempt organization that I don’t pay enough taxes.

Possum's Inhumanity, Starhawk's Soaring Vision

Contrast the inhumanity of Possum's relation to his fellows (Possum MUST BE a man)

with Starhawk's soaring and inspirational vision of our interconnectedness as human beings.

But what do we expect from a Sloth? (some of my best friends are sloths).
Do you think POssum had a mother?

Love you possum, you animal you.

Possum (what an apt name)

I suppose that all of the money you have earned is entirely due to your personal, individual initiate

and is in no part due to being a beneficiary of the richest society on earth, that probably helped you be born to parents with resources and live in a community with schools and libraries and police and firement.

Or did you do all that yourself too?

Your nearsighted solipsism is remarkable.

Fr Reese, Bless You

Eloquently and humanely put.

I wish Dr Elliot would read your column.

He would see the best of Christian Charity and Values.

Rev. Reese. With almost every other of your posts I disagree...they were like nails on a black board to me, but on this one we agree.

Healthy children make healthy adults and a more productive nation. With more polution in our environment, there is more health risks for our kids. The policies of our government causes a good bit of those risks, why not get goverment to pony up and take care of the future? The wealthy benefits from these policies as does all of soceity, we need to care about our children.

This nation is becomeing more of a fudal nation, the poor works for the rich and the rich throw up their hands and say...yes we prosper on the backs of others...but gee we deserve it and I am not responcible for those kids...as another poster on another Panalist's page said.."if they can't afford to take care of children don't have them."

As a non Christian, this is how I see the majority of Christians..worry about abortion and gays but don't touch my pocket book.

terra

Possum, you said, "I have been paying into private health insurance for twenty or more years, and have never made insurance claims that exceeded my annual premium payments… that money goes.. where?"

Surely you're not against the "for profit" motive? The California fires gave us an opportunity to look at where insurance premiums go. During the past three years CA fire insurers posted 15 billion in "earned" profits. The tally for the recent devastating fires is exactly 10% or 1.5 billion and they are asking for government, federal, help, crying like stuck pigs.

Yes Fr Reese, there is an attempt to limit births to those for whom there are resources. Look for $8 a loaf bread in the next 12 months to go along with $5, (we hope it's that low) gasoline. Those who keep a finger on the pulse at least attempt to notice when it becomes so weak the patient will die if something isn't done and promptly.

Do we really need millions of unwanted and un-adoptable babies when we can't find the courage to take care of the ones already here?

You need a new source of truth. The Bible is a proved hoax. Those who follow it's teachings are leading us to the desert where only God can save us. Methinks that's a plan to make God's representatives just that much richer. God's representatives?

IT wasn't God in the burning bush. http://www.hoax-buster.org/sellyoursoul Defeat that finding before creating more social turmoil. Social turmoil makes Devil happy but will He, can He even come to the rescue when we are lost on the desert?

“Their right to food and health care is so fundamental and so self-evident that it is incomprehensible to me that we ignore their needs.”
“Are we so hard hearted that we can refuse food and health care to children just because their parents are poor?”

Mr. Reese. Who is being refused food sir? Who is being refused medical care?

“Are we trying to punish poor parents by punishing their children?”
How dare you sir! I am not punishing anyone! I pay taxes and government mandated fees that exceed 45% of my income now. On top of all that I have been paying into private health insurance for twenty or more years, and have never made insurance claims that exceeded my annual premium payments… that money goes.. where?
The company I work for pays various Fed, state, and local taxes in the tens, if not hundreds, of millions of dollars per year… Who are they punishing sir?
I have smoked for many years, will die young, and not be sucking on the Social Security and Medicare teat into my nineties like you healthier whippersnappers… AND about half the money I pay for my coffin nails goes… where?

I am offended that you, someone who works in a tax-exempt organization, and has colleagues that maintain a ‘vow of poverty’ would dare put the blame on ME!