John F. Kennedy set an unfortunate example in 1960 when he said that his Catholicism would have virtually nothing to do with his presidential decision-making. How could that be?
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Posted on March 2, 2007 08:56
Bush following Blair?
I think most of us wish he had.
Too bad Blair is a poodle and Bush an 800lb. gorilla.
February 2, 2007 2:10 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on February 2, 2007 14:10
"I think John F. Kennedy set an unfortunate example when he told a group of Baptist preachers in Houston in 1960 that his Catholicism would have virtually nothing to do with his presidential decision-making. How could that be? I want to know how a political candidate makes decisions, weighs priorities, and gains strength in crisis." -- Mohler
Mr. Mohler, I think John F. Kennedy told those people that his Catholicism would not influence his decisions because there was an incredible amount of distrust of Catholics back then. I remember. The Pope doesn't have the influence today that the office used to have (or was still perceived to have). People were truly afraid then. Kennedy HAD to distance himself from the Pope's influence to get the job.
It makes me wonder now how much influence other groups have over our elected officials. I think Presidents have a huge amount of pressure & manipulation aimed at them. It's amazing that they can function. They have to be careful, thoughtful, not easily influenced, deliberative. And wise, oh so wise.
And how much influence do Bush's religious advisers have on him? I have always had a feeling that the Israeli's have had too much influence over Bush. And Tony Blair's influence over Bush at the beginning of this Iraq war? I don't like the way Bush was following Blair, instead of leading.
There are a lot more influences in the world than just religion.
I think religion's main influence over a person is in molding our system of ethics. But ethics come more from parents/adult role models than from religion. And they come early in life.
I, too, want to know as much as possible about a candidate, but if a candidate talks about religion, I'm inclined to think he's just pandering.
January 30, 2007 9:20 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2007 21:20
Mary Cunningham
I would bet almost anything that Mr. Mohler would not be able to vote for a Catholic, pretty much under any circumstances. Why? In April 2000, Mr. Mohler called the Roman Catholic Church "a false church" that "teaches a false gospel."
on CNN's "Larry King Live. He also said "As an evangelical, I believe the Roman church is a false church and it teaches a false gospel,". He also said "I believe the pope himself holds a false and unbiblical office" and he criticized the pope's efforts to create a dialog with Jews and Muslims.
January 30, 2007 8:57 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2007 20:57
Norrie Hoyt
What does it matter if MC is, or is not Mary Cunningham. She makes for interesting reading from a Catholic perspective. I like her postings. I only pick on Canyon (my favourite Christian believer) and BGone (my favourite non-believer and Hoaxbuster) if and when they seem a bit off from their usual postings. I love your postings too - very unpredictable and delicious.
January 30, 2007 5:42 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2007 17:42
On reflection I guess it's obvious that MC and MARY CUNNINGHAM are one and the same.
January 30, 2007 1:29 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2007 13:29
Anybody,
Is "MC" simply a shorthand for "MARY CUNNINGHAM" or are they two differnt people?
January 30, 2007 1:26 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2007 13:26
Mary Cunningham,
It's nice to see you back posting again. Your posts are always interesting and informative, and your being British and Catholic brings an underrepresented perspective, as do your historical analyses.
Your statistical analysis above is revealing and a novel approach to thinking about the panelists.
I'm sort of (but not terribly) sorry for our first encounter when you called me an atheist and I responded similarly.
Highest regards, Norrie
January 30, 2007 1:19 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2007 13:19
MC,
You must learn to pay no attention to bgone. He is like the grade school child who feels left out and wants attention. Sad, really.
Anonymous,
Just for clarification, you do realize that torture was not invented by President Bush? During WWII (long before President Bush, would you agree?), "torture" involved brutally killing someone. Japan used Chinese prisoners for live bayonnet practice for crying out loud. It is an insult to WWII Chinese prisoners to equate what they endured to that of today's "enemy combatants". Sorry we had to flush your Koran down the toilet. Boo-hoo. And don't think that the "greatest generation ever" in the US was immune either. There are scores of Filipino men, women, and children that were killed during WWII for absolutely no reason whatsoever.
January 30, 2007 12:33 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2007 12:33
Posting from Northern Ireland, eh BeGone? You sound just like the Rev Dr Ian Paisley.
I really do wish you would Be gone...some of the atheist posters are witty, some insightful. But you are crude at worst and just plain bad at best..
January 30, 2007 11:54 AM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2007 11:54
Religion/non-religion of panalists on "On Faith":
Unattributed (probably agnostic):2
Atheist: 1
Pagan:1
Jewish:2
Muslim: 1
Protestant: 12
Of which:
No branch mentioned:2
Baptist: 3
Episcopalian: 4
Evangelical: 3
Mormon: 1
Roman Catholic:1
Conclusion:this forum really does not represent the religious affiliations (or lack thereof) of the US! Overrepresented are Muslim, Jewish and Pagan (can't believe the last is even here!)and within the Protestant grouping Episcopalian (far, far too many). Severely underrepresented are Roman Catholic (should be at least 4), also under are atheist--should have another panalist.
Agnostic (at 2) are about right, as these usually masquerade as academics. I find them the most frustrating of all--these are the Crossans and Armstrongs of the world.
January 30, 2007 11:47 AM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2007 11:47
Mary Cunningham - you have great insight. What do you suppose the pope and Billy Graham discuss during their fact to face, heads of state meetings? Perhaps Rev Mohler could give us his opinion? Do southern Baptists really like to see presidents kneeling before the pope?
January 30, 2007 11:20 AM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2007 11:20
"I think John F. Kennedy set an unfortunate example when he told a group of Baptist preachers in Houston in 1960 that his Catholicism would have virtually nothing to do with his presidential decision-making. How could that be?"
I'd like to answer that, Dr Mohler.
Firstly: John Kennedy was raised a Catholic in the midst of Protestants. His family had moved from that most western province of Ireland--Boston!--to the heart of Yankeedom. No, not Boston but NYC, much moreso the capital of Yankeedom then than now. As a whole America was more Protestant than it is now (kind of like the South today).
Secondly: America in 1960--as Northern Ireland and to a lesser extent England today--distrusted Roman Catholics. They were charged with the semi-treasonous sin of double loyalty. It could not be elsewise as Catholicism has always claimed to be a universal faith. I would note that in 2007 the Pope is stilled burned in effigy every November, Guy Fawkes Day, when all of the UK gives thanks for their deliverance from Roman Catholicism. Today the heir to the throne could marry a Muslim but a Catholic is forbidden by law. Still....
Thirdly some religious suspicions--and I am talking here about Protestant suspicions--are very deeply ingrained. And America in 1960 was still very suspicious.
So Kennedy did what Catholics do in those circumstances. ?
He was smart. He kept his mouth shut about his Catholicism. He played it down. He said his faith did not affect him. His wife helped by quipping that it was unfair that he suffered so much for being a Catholic when he was such a bad one!
Even in today's America Roman Catholics tend not to broadcast their beliefs in the manner of Baptists. Or evangelicals. Or Muslims, frankly.
How many contributers here are RCs? There are about 60 million Catholics (and rising) in the US, that's one out of five. But you would never guess that here, would you? I'd say at a guess, the frequency is 1 out of 10--half--and one of them is Crossan and I would not call him Catholic!
So there is still some reticence on the part of the US Catholic community & we can see it on these pages.
January 30, 2007 11:05 AM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2007 11:05
Good point, Ba'al. Can I call you Al?
Here's what "religious" people do. http://www.tbo.com/news/nationworld/MGB8IXMVJXE.html?farksub=1
In this story from Florida, a woman is brutally raped. She goes to police, who find out she owes restitution, and they jail her. A guard refuses to let her have emergency contraception for "religious reasons." (Fortunately, she had already taken one dose.)
January 30, 2007 10:46 AM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2007 10:46
I wrote the last post about torture and Mr. Mohler
January 30, 2007 9:41 AM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on January 30, 2007 09:41
I am wondering what beliefs are behind the Bush administration's decision to torture prisoners and to continue to defend that practice? I notice that Dr. Mohler recently commented on what he called "President George W. Bush's brave and strategic support for religious liberty during his recent visit to Asia.". The people being tortured these days, as described in the article I cite below, are directly relevant to that struggle for religious freedom in China.