The Pope is Wrong

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The Pope is awesome. He speaks the Truth.

Protestantism is one big corrupt hoax, full of liars and heretics.

This just in: The Bible really was written by an ancient ancestor of JK Rowlings. It originaly was called "Harry Potter and the the Books of The Bible," but the publisher thought that was too much of a mouthful for readers back then. Hence, he shorten it to "The Bible," and is probably amazed as all get out that, 2000 years later, we are still taking his fictional stories so damn serious. No really. I wouldnt make this up. No more than I could make stories up about people turning into a pillar of salt, a virgin birth or a man building an ark with two of every kind of animal.

Well I nominate Gabriel Fackre to be the new pope!

Not only is the Pope wrong but he is setting a dangerous precedent in that he is preaching that Catholicism is the only true religion. That in itself sets the stage for conflict among various religions. The fanatical nature of Islamic extremism coupled with the rantings of a demagogic Pope can set the stage for worsening religious conflict. When will the people on earth learn that religion, all religion, is a curse on humanity? If there is a devil surely he initiated religion to serve and achieve his objectives.

Why continue to waste time and resources on all the theology stuff ginned up through the ages?

We can start with the position that humans want some structure to live and conduct their lives by.

Then we could start again with: "In the beginning ...." and derive a set of "values" for all humanity to conduct themselves by if they want to be recognized as human!!!!!!!!!!! No God chosen race, no 90 year old woman and 120 year old man having a baby [and then raising him!], no God given land to the chosen, no prophet, no nothing. Just a clean sheet of paper with a broad set of scientific and physical knowns. (There could even be some of Secretary Rumfield's known unknowns.)

Although the highest of the animal kingdom, humanity still just ain't that smart should be one of the starting points.

Maybe George Bush's legacy to the world is to be that he demonstrated to the world that the details of history is not real and a lot of it was just plain made up.

We know "the pope is wrong." Does that make you right? Atheists can't prove there is no God so there is a God. But which God is it?

http://www.hoax-buster.org/sellyoursoul is wrong. There really was a supernatural being in that ball of fire. That story is not a hoax but a very true one. It explains how the big money goes to those leading the multitudes to hell.

Could there be a little jealousy in that statement, "the pope is wrong" a matter of how small one's multitude is compared to the billion of suckers the pope is leading? Warning! The pope has the God[supernatural being in the ball of fire Moses made the deal with] given power to condemn all heretics to hell. Time to fall in line, you're under attack by the forces of truth, justice and the American way.

Steve,

I agree completely, we should read the Bible for what the Bible says, and it declares the same message from Genesis to Revelation.

What do you think that message is?

Oh yeah...that's in the Richard Mouw thread.

Steve W,

"One can choose lines from any book at random. But if you don't put them together and try to see what the author is trying to say overall, then I think you are missing something. You can't see the forest for the trees."

Take a look at what Canyon Shearer does in "quoting" Pope John Paul II. Editing is the only way CS is able to put random lines together.

The point to that seems to be; CS is asserting that the Pope is in hell because he is a pagan for worshipping the virgin Mary.

The libelous hack job to the original text seems to be the work of a pathalogical zealot.

Whether you are Catholic or not, it's just sad to see somone so deperate to convice themselves that they are better than everyone else.

'Less evil than the worst nightmare you can construe' hardly seems to me an argument for Great Compassion and Goodness.

Wacky idea, here, but instead of arguing about books and who's 'abstractly' evil, how about we all get together, look to the reality we know, and if there is tyranny, we'll deal with it together?

Someone being 'worse' doesn't mean the 'lesser evil' is *good.*

How bout we be people.

THE POPE CAN SAY WHAT HE WANTS ABOUT HIS RELIGION. WANT TO SEE SOMETHING TRULY EVIL - COMPLAIN ABOUT THIS

To Muslims the Koran is the very word of God, who spoke through the Angel Gabriel to Muhammad: "This book is not to be doubted," the Koran declares unequivocally at its beginning. Scholars and writers in Islamic countries who have ignored that warning have sometimes found themselves the target of death threats and violence, sending a chill through universities around the world.
The Hadith No. 284, The Muslim, volume one, says that any Jew or Christian, who heard of Muhammad but did not convert to Islam, and died in disbelief, would rot in hell! Thus Islam withdraws from all Jews and Christians the right to believe in their faiths, and practice them as such.
"The unbelievers of the People of the Book and the idolators shall be in the Fire of Hell therein dwelling for ever; those are the worst of creatures. But those who believe, and do righteous deeds, those are the best of creatures..." (XCVIII: The Clear Sign: 5)
Here those Jews and Christians, who spurn Islam, have been lumped together with the idolators such as the Hindus, and classified as 'the worst of creatures'. Therefore the Koran commands:
"O believers, take not as your friends those of them, who were given the Book before you, and the unbelievers, who take your religion in mockery and as a sport..." (V: The Table: 60)
"The true believers say: Has not God ordered a chapter that commands the holy war" (Sura 47:22); or elsewhere: "Kill the idolaters wherever you find them, imprison them, besiege them, ambush them" (Sura 9:5); and, "Make war on unbelievers" (Sura 9:29). "When you come upon unbelievers, massacre them, tighten the bands of the captives that you will have taken. Then you will set them free, or you will release them for a ransom" (Sura 8:57).
"To Allah, there are no animals viler than those who do not believe and remain unbelievers" (Sura 8:57). That is why it is necessary to Islamize them by force and by humiliation. And those who resist Islam and its founder must be chastised, according to the Koran: "Here is the fate of those who fight Allah and his messenger: you will put them to death or you will make them suffer the torture of the cross; you will cut their hands and their feet alternately. They will be driven from the country" (Sura 5:37).
"Do not display cowardice, and do not call the infidels to peace when you are superior to them" (Sura 47:22). THIS ALLOWS THEM TO MAKE PEACE SO THAT THEY CAN MAKE WAR AGAIN LATER.
4.89": They desire that you should disbelieve as they have disbelieved, so that you might be (all) alike; therefore take not from among them friends until they fly (their homes) in Allah's way; but if they turn back, then seize them and kill them wherever you find them, and take not from among them a friend or a helper.
"4.90": Except those who reach a people between whom and you there is an alliance, or who come to you, their hearts shrinking from fighting you or fighting their own people; and if Allah had pleased, He would have given them power over you, so that they should have certainly fought you; therefore if they withdraw from you and do not fight you and offer you peace, then Allah has not given you a way against them.
"4.91": You will find others who desire that they should be safe from you and secure from their own people; as often as they are sent back to the mischief they get thrown into it headlong; therefore if they do not withdraw from you, and (do not) offer you peace and restrain their hands, then seize them and kill them wherever you find them; and against these We have given you a clear authority."

Can't help but ask how exactly those 'glimpses of heaven on Earth' connected to exclusivist dogma, there, Steve.

Canyon,

I admire your zeal. But I simply cannot abide zealots. They do not grow in holiness because as far as they are concerned there is no room for improvement. They already have the "truth", the whole "truth" and nothing but the "truth". So what is left to improve upon.

I know all the scripture you do so you need not quote it to me. The difference between how you read it and I do, it seems, is what we choose to emphasize. I choose to emphasize the unimaginable goodness of God, which Christ declared so unambiguously.

One can choose lines from any book at random. But if you don't put them together and try to see what the author is trying to say overall, then I think you are missing something. You can't see the forest for the trees.

As for being saved and going to heaven, I would never put myself in God's place to say. But I have caught glimpses of heaven on earth and that's all I've needed to keep me going so far.

Still wondering, Bgone, ... is your fear of Hell here rhetorical, theological, psychological, what?

Canyon Shearer:

We must guard against the possibility of inadvertently violating the first commandment. As we do all those things to discover God's will having a little devil sneak into our definition of God is all too real. Purify but be careful about assigning attributes to God for that makes God an image. Be that image only in the mind it is still forbidden by the first commandment. Images of God and Devil, both supernatural beings that are usually invisible are easy to confuse. Is that not so Canyon?

Wouldn't it be a shame to end up in hell after going through the hell of pleasing God only to find out we have misidentified God and are actually doing Devil's desires, not God's?

"“That church” I said, not “the Church.” Reinforcing the encyclical Dominus Jesus, Benedict XVI has repeated the denial of the word “church” to all the other churches. But subtraction is sectarian, and this medieval move of pulling up the drawbridges around the Roman Church is a cancellation of ecumenicity."

Well, can't you see? They're just trying to preserve the 'sanctity of the word church.'

What right have you to expect equal treatment?

After all, you could call yourself something else, like, 'somewhat religiouslike community,' with all the same legal rights, if no one decides to interpret the laws favoring churches otherwise...

...there's no bigotry there, ..separate but equal. Fair, right?

Wouldn't want the dignity of *The* Church somehow diminished by other people having one, would you.

After all, if you just called *anything* a Church cause you wanted to, why, animals and sports hooligans could call what they do 'Churches,' and it's be chaos...

I'm sure you understand.

After all, this is consistent with certain Christian demonimations' opinions on other matters.

Steve,

I'm not sure what your post means...I usually feel compelled to read and understand someones post before I reply to it; I wish you'd do the same.

In which sense did you determine that I am not compelled towards growing in holiness?

"I appeal to you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, to present your bodies as a living sacrifice, holy and acceptable to God, which is your spiritual worship. Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect." - Romans 12:1-2

See also Romans 12:9-21

With which idolatrous lens should I take another look at the cross with? There are very few ways of looking at it. We were appointed our time on the cross; our sins had condemned us. Instead of us dying and going to Hell Christ took hell and died for us; in that while we were yet sinners, Christ loved us, and gave Himself for us. He lived a perfect life and faced a sinners judgment so we can live a sinners life and face a righteous judgment.

We could argue this all day, but the important question is; are you saved? If you died tonight would you go to Heaven?

.....Recalling its resolution 1904 (XVIII) of 20 November 1963, proclaiming the United Nations Declaration on the Elimination of All Forms of Racial Discrimination, and in particular its affirmation that "any doctrine of racial differentiation or superiority is scientifically false, morally condemnable, socially unjust and dangerous" and its expression of alarm at "the manifestations of racial discrimination still in evidence in some areas of the world, some of which are imposed by certain Governments by means of lesislative, administrative or other measures".

Recalling also that, in its resolution 3151G (XXVIII) of 14 December 1973, the General Assembly condemned, inter alia, the unholy alliance between South African racism and zionism,

Geee, and Israel wonders why anyone paying attention can see their apartheid treatment of palestinians!

Taking note of the Declaration of Mexico on the Equality of Women and Their Contribution to Development and Peace, 1975, proclaimed by the World Conference of the International Women's Year, held at Mexico City from 19 June to 2 July 1975, which promulgated the principle that "international co-operation and peace require the achievement of national liberation and independence, the elimination of colonialism and neo-colonialism, foreign occupation, zionism, apartheid
and racial discrimination in all its forms, as well as the recognition of the dignity of peoples and their right to self-determination",
Taking note also of resolution 77 (XII) adopted by the Assembly of Heads of State and Government of the Organization of African Unity at its twelfth ordinary session, held at Kampala from 28 July to 1 August 1975, which considered "that the racist regime in occupied Palestine and the racist regimes in Zimbabwe and South Africa have a common imperialist origin, forming a whole and having the same racist structure and being organically linked in their policy aimed at repression of the dignity and integrity of the human being",

Taking note also of the Political Declaration and Strategy to Strengthen International Peace and Security and to Intensify Solidarity and Mutual Assistance among Non-Aligned Countires, adopted at the Conference of Ministers for Foreign Affairs of Non-Aligned Countries held at Lima from 25 to 30 August 1975, which most severely condemned zionism as a threat to world peace and security and called upon all countries to oppose the racist and imperialist ideology,
Determines that zionism is a form of racism and racial discrimination.

2400th plenary meeting
10 November 1975

1975 UN Resolution 3379

"...upon this rock I will build my CHURCH."

Do you see an S after CHURCH? Now the pope has been "kinder and gentler" as advised by GHW Bush with you describing your gang as a "faith family" an appropriate designation corresponding to mafia organization, specifically families.

Lucky for you the Bible from which his holiness gets his license to steal is a proved hoax so the sentence, should it come and it's no doubt coming is not valid. Phew is in order. There is another problem however.

http://www.hoax-buster.org/sellyoursoul says with authority that, in the event you wish to "faith" the Bible, interpret it, the Bible is actually the word of Devil, inspired by the desire to sin and have sins forgiven. The Devil is very quick to say "your sins are forgiven." And He, Devil just loves to hear that you crucified the son of God, well, a beneficiary anyhow.

Good luck and God or the supernatural being of you choice bless and keep you.

"The Pope is Wrong" I knew. Now when are you going to get the story straight? I've verified to my satisfaction that Devil is behind both of you. That explains the chaos. Hell is a chaotic place or did somebody get that wring too.

Lookout!!!!

MATTHEW 16 -
15He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am?

16And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.

17And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.

18And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

19And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

-----------------

The above give his holiness the power to sentence you to hell. A word to the wise....

To Canyon,

So I gather your beliefs don't compel you to try to be a better person. In that you may be succeeding.

Take another look at the cross, my friend. You'll see someone in pain, suffering there. Don't add to the pain by being a pain.

Steve, like most Catholics, and lost persons, you make wide sweeping statements "assuming" that that is what God wants. That is breaking the 2nd Commandment and it is a very serious sin.

Lets take a look at the Bible, Paul says "For Jews demand signs and Greeks seek wisdom, but we preach Christ crucified, a stumbling block to Jews and folly to Gentiles." 1 Cor 1:22-23

Then later in his ministry he calls preaching, "The offense of the cross." (Gal 5:11)

The Cross is offensive, it attacks your self-righteousness, sets your conscience ablaze, and demands that you repent or perish.

In order to rescue your soul from the doom of Hell, your God had to subject Himself to the broken and diseased world of earth, a perfect example of faith, obedience, righteousness and love; but His pointing out of faults was so offensive to the Pharisees that they KILLED Him for it.

God takes sin very seriously, He counts lust as adultery (Matt 5:28), hatred as murder (1 John 3:15), lying lips are an abomination (Prov 12:22), and all of these will be thrown into the lake of fire. (Rev 21:8)

Your sin was placed upon Christ at the Cross, He bore your burden in love, He had no burden to carry Himself and did it solely so we could be rectified and God could be glorified. By me preaching to you that Christ carried your sin to the Cross, then that implies that you have sin, and not only so, but a great deal of it. Christ paid for your sin in His own life's blood.

Repent of your sins, cease your transgressions, apologize to God for wrongdoing, and turn towards righteousness, and then place your full trust in the atoning work of Christ on the Cross. If you do these things, God will forgive you, your sinful heart will be replaced with a new heart, and you will be reborn into the family of God. Not because you are a good person, but because you are a bad persons whose sins have already been to the Cross, and you have been forgiven by a good God.

A big Amen to Tom Powell's post from a Catholic.
How about we cut to the chase and say that if the goal of religion is to make people better in God's eyes, saying things in ways that offend other people must surely be a sin. Sure most of humanity is small minded that way, but I don't want to hear it from the Pope. He's supposed to be special. JP2 was.

The world is in for an all out religious war unless religious leaders can come together and agree to be less sectarian in their theologies and teachings, to be more tolerant of other religions, and to impress upon their followers to do the same. This country's strong suit is its freedoms: speech, press, and the freedom of religion. Let's be a model for the world, a real shining light.

Readers and conspiracy theorists:

Due to technical difficulties, a number of comments on this particular blog post were inadvertently deleted Friday. We apologize for the problem.

David Waters
Producer, "On Faith"

Throw a rock into a pack of dogs, the one that yelps is the one that got hit...

Even Frank Collins doesn't get cut-off around here.

Well...looks like WaPo will draw the line at fanatics calling kids "the wh*re of Babylon", "devil worshipper", and telling them that you are closer to God than them and that they are going to hell...eh, Canyon Shearer?

Apparently our On Faith moderators can't handle the Truth.

43 posts in summation:
http://www.wayofthemasterradio.com/podcast/2006/11/09/november-09-2006-hour-1/
http://www.wayofthemasterradio.com/podcast/2006/11/09/november-09-2006-hour-2/

The Bible verses Catholicism;
Pope/Priests - "And call no man your father on earth, for you have one Father, who is in heaven." - Matthew 29:3
Celibacy - "If they cannot exercise self-control, they should marry. For it is better to marry than to burn with passion." - 1 Corinthians 7:9
Purgatory - "For the gate is wide and the way is easy that leads to destruction, and those who enter by it are many. For the gate is narrow and the way is hard that leads to life, and those who find it are few." - Matthew 7:13-14
Catholic Church - "The woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet, and adorned with gold and jewels and pearls, holding in her hand a golden cup full of abominations and the impurities of her sexual immorality. And her name was the Wh*re of Babylon." - Revelation 17:4-5

Salvation is by Grace alone through Faith alone in Christ alone known by Scripture alone for the glory of God alone.

Gospel;
Jesus willingly died for our transgressions, be they lying, thievery, lust, hatred, covetousness, ungratefulness, or failing to oppose evil. We broke the Law and Jesus paid our fine, so that we can be saved from the wrath of God like a parachute would save us from gravity; not because we're good people, but because we're bad people forgiven by a good God.

I would also like to add the posting that I put on this site a little earlier and as far as I know has somehow vanished. Thank You. To Canyon Shearer and the rest of the world: First off I do not believe in reincarnation so not only did I not claim to be the Old Testament Moses, I can't be. The Old Testament Moses and Moses at the transfiguration are one and the same. Do you really think that God earned glory by His death on the cross or do you think He earned salvation for humanity, God does not need to earn glory, God does not need our approval, God is Pure Love, you know His name but I could not be thankful to your conception of God, as you put it, "my weak understanding of God" actually I have met God, the whole Trinity, I have also met satan. As I have said I stake my everlasting destiny on God and His Plan. As I said I am not the Old Testament Moses, I am the New Testament Moses and the OTM did make mention of me. Jesus is referred to as the Unblemished Lamb, well guess who the guilty goat sent out into the desert of sin might be? You talk a lot about enemies of God, Jesus said Love your enemies. Another thing in the bible that God said, "I will send the simple to confound the wise". A childlike faith God Smiles on, a childish self-rightious, self-pious, holier than thou attitude well you can decide what you think God thinks of this. As it says in the bible the wages of sin is death and it also says that Jesus took on the sins of the world and He who is sinless became sin for us, Jesus did not only go thru a physical death but He also suffered spiritual death and hell for us, all of us, do you have any idea what being a christian is, it is carrying on the work of Jesus of Nazareth, King of the Jews, as He said, "Come follow Me". See you in the Kingdom, remember God wins, satan loses, a tie is absolutely unacceptable. Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

Posted July 21, 2007 10:28 AM

I don't know a lot about computers and these posting sites but I would like to ask a question to whoever can answer it. What happened to all of the postings that were on here? Truth will win out erasure or not. Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.