A two-way street

It baffles me on how many atheists and non-christian believers continue to desecrate the name of our God in their statements; yet in the same sentence, state He does not exist. Why continue to say His name in vain if you do not believe in Him? If you chose to not believe in Him, why not do us all a favor and remove His sacred name from your vocabulary as well.

It baffles me on how many atheists and non-christian believers continue to desecrate the name of our God in their statements; yet in the same sentence, state He does not exist. Why continue to say His name in vain if you do not believe in Him? If you chose to not believe in Him, why not do us all a favor and remove His sacred name from your vocabulary as well.

Whizler,

Jesus restarted his church with Joseph Smith for the reasons you gave, but he also taught us that we are still spiritual brothers and sisters.

I dont see any irony here. Or are you not interested in the Whole Story?

Mark
Always seek the truth.

"The potential for trouble lies in whether a message like theirs is allowed to descend into ridicule or condemnation of those who do profess a belief in God."

Goodness, the irony...

"My object in going to inquire of the Lord was to know which of all the sects was right, that I might know which to join. No sooner, therefore, did I get possession of myself, so as to be able to speak, than I asked the personages who stood above me in the light, which of all the sects was right — and which I should join. I was answered that I must join none of them, for they were all wrong, and the personage who addressed me said that all their creeds were an abomination in His sight: that those professors were all corrupt . . ." (Mormon religion founder Joseph Smith, History of the Church, vol. 1, p. 5-6).

haraium

I truly doubt you have realy studied the bible because you are wrong about everything you have said about it.

mark
always seek the truth.

Besides. What if it's not a 'street' at all?

But rather a *hearth* some want to claim exclusive gatekeeper privileges to?

These customs didn't come from Christianity to begin with. They came from Europe.

Your Christ is welcome enough. Doesn't mean you own them.

""Unfortunately, there is a growing tide of anti-religious sentiment in America.""

Which you act as though it came out of nowhere, and which couldn't possibly have anything to do with how the likes of *you* have treated all others for *all our lives* ...but instead, well, when someone rebuffs your attacks and dehumanizations, you claim to be the ones being 'oppressed.'

"" And as John A. Howard of the Howard Center for Family, Religion, and Society has observed, these critics of religion "have developed great skills in demonizing those who disagree with them, turning their opponents into objects of fear, hatred and scorn.""

It's hard to blame some if they seem to have the impression that's all you understand.

As for your 'Peace on Earth, love your neighbor,'

Well, any time you want to try that. You never know what it might do. ;)

"Unfortunately, there is a growing tide of anti-religious sentiment in America."

Yes, thank God.

Thinking Americans are finally waking up to the hijacking of our society by the likes of "religious" politicans such as Tom Delay, Newt Gingrich, Mitt Romney, Bart Stupak, the crazy Bachmann woman, Sarah Palin, and all of the other right-wing nutjobs who try to proscribe our lives and restrict our rights -- always in the name of Jesus -- but do so through the medium of partisan politics.

Americans are starting to push back against the growing ignorance that has threatened to suffocate us.

Charles Pierce's new book, "Idiot America: How Stupidity Became a Virtue in the Land of the Free," opens with the opening of a Creation Museum in Kentucky. Among its offerings is a dinosaur wearing a saddle. The museum's founder and owner delights in crying out, "We are taking the dinosaurs back from the evolutionists!"

It is this kind of mass stupidity that brought down earlier civilizations and allowed the early success of Hitler's plan for world domination. People who can be led are people who can do damage -- on a grand scale.

So, when Mr. (or Brother or Elder or Grand Poobah) Otterson tells us that he and his kind (other self-obsessed religionists) are being discriminated against because of their beliefs, one can only hope that he's right.

Because their beliefs are that religion -- specifically theirs -- should run the great cosmic show. That their God is the one we should be praying to; that their religion is the one we should acknowledge as the truth; that their way of life is the one to which we should aspire.

Americans are beginning to see the real nature of what they've embraced along with their professions of belief, and they seem to be suffering from a national indigestion. Let us hope that they begin to realize that relief comes not from a swig of Maalox but from a reevaluation of the ways in which we've allowed our society to go astray.

ahm,

I have studied the bible and that is why I reject its doctrine. I have studied the book of mormon and find it lacking in depth. I have studied the koran and know what evil lies in it.

Have you even read the Dhampada, The Gita, the Tibeten Book of the Dead, the Egyptian Book of the Dead, the Diamond Sutra, the Aman Cara, the Mainstalk, the Book of the Hopi, Socrates, Pyhtagoras, Nagarjuna, Vivekananda, Ramakrishna, Thoreou, Emerson...

Have you ever studied formal logic? Have you ever tried to dissect your own belief v what the society you grew up in...

So easy to assume that I don't know, it makes your conclusions easier. By the Way God told me that the bible is mythology created by an evil force in the world but good men put it to good use and bad men just ramble about its sacredness. Maybe it was a devil speaking to you - did you ask him to prove he was god?

2) As noted elsewhere, the university system is not attacking christianity. It is just that christianity is stuck in the middle ages and learning has moved past it. Other than historical significance, it adds nothing to the modern world of ideas and knowledge. What christianity fears is that the rest of its economic base will figure out that it is a spiritual sham. And so it considers itself under attack - of course the attackers are those who seek Truth - Funny, they collect in Universities.

haraium

Maybe, it is just because I spent too much time in the realm of academia, but there is a very real prejudice against Christianity on college campuses. If you want to be a far-out radical that gets on the nerves of your professors - be a Christian. I could see this even when I was not a Christian.
As for those of you that worry about the overwhelming numbers of 85% being Christian, you shouldn't be. My country of residence is only 20% Muslim, (Please note that I am not saying anything bad about Muslims here or anywhere else) but the Muslims own the vast majority of the retail stores, used car lots and hotels. They have great capitalistic, economic power in the nation that far outweighs their meager 20%.
Likewise in the United States, secular humanism may not have many adherents to claim that title, but they have almost totalitarian control over the public education systems and universities as well as teachers' unions, etc. Not only do teachers learn what to teach, but how to teach with a secular humanist bent. Throw in the media, music, movies and television as the forces for enculturation away from Christian beliefs and add the ACLU and compliant courts that make their bread off of seeking out and destroying any vestige of Christian heritage, and the miracle of our day is that there are any Christian left. Even among those that still claim to be Christian, many of them have secular beliefs and practices that are contrary to Christianity. So don't worry too much, you power far outweghs your numbers.

hariaum

If you actualy studied the bible, you wouldn't say that.

Go ahead, study it.

I dare you, or you afraid the truth will enlighten you?

Mark
Always seek the truth.

PS:I know the bible is the word of God because he told me so.

What if you daughter, married to another man, said I am giving a virgin birth of a child of god named bugga bugga. Would you order myrrh?

It is all nonsense.

How do you know it is god's word in the bible. Do you think the devil would come out and say this book was written by the devil? No he would come out and say he was god. He would promise you salvation. He would tell you not to worry about your sins as he would take them upon himself. All you have to do is worship in his name = jesus=devil=bugga bugga

Or you could say, I take responsibility for my own choices, I love the god that is beyond name, beyond book, for I know that love transcends all my actions.

hariaum

Wjmdjm

You’re funny too (LOL)!

Yes, I have read the Bible and it makes a great deal of sense. But, it is obvious that you have not.

If I lived at that time and had learned that God had chosen my daughter to fulfill prophecy and bring into the world, the savior (Jesus) who would restore his church to this earth once again, I would rejoice just as those involved at that time rejoiced.

The Christmas season is once again upon us and we are rejoicing again for the 2009th time. It was a wonderful thing he did for us.

Mark
Always seek the truth.

Posted by: volkmare "You’re funny. If you truly understood the teachings of God, found in the bible, you wouldn't say that."

Hey Mark, Have you read the Bible? Does it make sense to you?
If your local priest or "Man of God" told you that God had impregnated your virgin daughter, would you rejoice or grab a shotgun ?

If you wouldn't believe it, why should anybody?

KHOTE14

You said: "And truly, I find what you believe to be ridiculous. If you can tell me I'm going to burn for eternity and be tortured by your loving gods for not believing in them, how does this differ from my seeing and saying that your faith is ridiculous?"

You’re funny. If you truly understood the teachings of God, found in the bible, you wouldn't say that.

It sounds more like you have been reading “the doctrines of man”, and not the doctrines of God (the bible).

Mark
Always seek the truth.

Observe the Hidden Distortions in Brother Otterson's Column

1. He begs for "respect" of Christians by atheists.
In a country that is 85% Christian.
That is de facto ruled by Christian Orthodoxy (try getting elected without sayin you believe in Jesus)
Where an atheist will automatically NOT be voted for by 50% of the population.
Where legislation is de facto subjected to Veto by Religious Groups that is more powerful than the President's Veto.

BIGGEST HYPOCRISY: Brother Otterson's Church believes that
MORMONISM IS THE ONLY TRUE CHURCH.
and
Only Mormons will achieve the highest level of heaven.
Gandhi won't get there. But Joe Schmoo from Idaho, because he is a Mormon, will.

All day long the christians tell us of the terrible consequences we face for not believing as they do. Most of the large-scale religions around today do this.

How is this respecting someone else's beliefs, or lack of them?

And truly, I find what you believe to be ridiculous. If you can tell me I'm going to burn for eternity and be tortured by your loving gods for not believing in them, how does this differ from my seeing and saying that your faith is ridiculous?

We are far outnumbered in this society by your kind, you believers. Even if we do think of you with scorn, so what? Except for when you pound your bibles in my front yard I could not care less what you believe.

I don't step into your church and tell you all what deluded fools you are. Where is the reciprocity? Every where I go in the pubic square I have to hear your noise.

As if the critics of anyone not in lock step with their religion didn't invent "demonizing those who disagree with them, turning their opponents into objects of fear, hatred and scorn."

I respect the theistic religious views of others as being sincere expressions of themselves.

But looking at the beliefs per se, I can't do other than regard them as not well-founded, and, in many cases, as being absurd and nonsensical.

You know, we atheists really don't care much if you "respect" atheism. We sure have become accustomed to being disrespected, but one of the differences between theism and atheism is that atheism can stand on its own two feet when intellectually challenged. For us, a worldview that you plan to apply to your life and ours needs to be intellectually workable to be respected.
I'll let the religious in on a little secret. Atheists don't give a hoot if you spend your time worshiping invisible things. We just grow really, really tired of the faithful coming out of their houses of worship and telling us (with no proof at all, by the way) that we can't be political leaders, or parents, or even good, without following their god. Maybe the religious can start the respect ball rolling by getting over that horribly disrespectful claim.