Hell Can't Hold a Candle to Heaven

TJ
satan did not just sin for a millisecond he sinned for millions or possibly billions of years, in that time period of the Neanderthals etc etc (remember: let us recreate man in our own image & go forth and replenish the earth-GENESIS)which was why he was able to drag 1/3 of the angels down with him.Please do not trivialize him.

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Jesus said, "I have overcome the world", ever thought about believing Him. Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

Martin Marty is another person who is essentially going up to Jesus and saying to him, "Let me tell you how it is."

Give yourself to ODIN the One True God.
All others are False Gods and are to be avoided
if you wish to spend eternity in Valhalla.
There is no God but ODIN the warrior God.
Surrender now and enjoy His Love and protection
for ever and ever and ever and ever and ever.Amen.

TJ, AC,

Surrender unto Lord Krishna with love and devotion. He will grant you moksha (salvation) without fail.

T.J. I'm happy to see you can speak as an authority on the meaning of words. Did God actually say "good and evil?" Which God was that?

Have you read the first commandment? It can be summed as "no strange Gods" can't it?

http://www.hoax-buster.org/sellyoursoul says the God you're serving is a rather "strange" one, a ball of fire and is most likely Lucifer, only a pretend God. Of course the first commandment forbids giving definition to God doesn't it? Did God actually say what the Bible says or is someone putting words in God's mouth? Do balls of fire have mouthes?

I'm sure you have the best of intentions, a career as a priest. Are you familiar with the expression, "the road to hell is paved with good intentions" Of course that HB fellow says the big money goes to those who lead the multitudes to hell. Hard to argue with that, Billy, Jerry, Robert, Orel... That's not what your good intentions are about to do?

One last question. Do those who fail to do what priest tell them to do, morals only of course going to hell? And, can't we say that's a lot worse than a gun to the head? After all, getting shot dead only deprives one of the rest of this earth while hell is forever.

I'd be interested in your views but I think they will restart the subject tomorrow. Maybe later on another thread. I have to go to bed now, too late for me today.

BGONE

Good and evil are opposites. Its logic. Being a seminarian, studying for the Roman Catholic Priesthood, I have had the opportunity to study about good and evil, and also Gods will for each of us. We cannot question Gods authority over us. When it comes to words, that were spoken by God himself, I learned, as well as others, not to question the meaning of it. We must learn to have faith, and trust in God, even when at times it seems impossible or difficult. He knows the reason behind why He used those words, and why those words are being used today. We dont know why, and probably will not ever know why because God may not feel that we are ready to know.

RaeMae, God shouldnt have to disipline his own angels. Lucifer was an arch angel like I said before. They are supreme beings. Well, compared to humans. We can not understand why God would do something like that, but just to trust in his judgement.

T.J.

Are "good" and "evil" opposites,, like up and down, true and false? Oops! Theres shades of truth.

Are good spirits and evil spirits opposites or the same thing in different forms? Why do liquor stores advertise "spirits"[for sale]? What kind of spirits do liquor stores sell, good or evil?

Hint: evil things have bodies, are made out of matter while holy things don't have bodies, no matter at all. Things without bodies are not spirits per say. They are holes, things without bodies. The opposite of evil is holy.

Ignorant people have twisted the meanings of many words but hardly none more than the word evil. They also didn't understand that holes, the ones they were talking about as in "Holy God" contained air and therefore actually were evil, contained matter. They didn't know there was invisible matter, gases like air. God might be a gas you know and that would make God evil. That's not good for God must be holy.

Thought you might like to know. The opposite of good is bad.

To Bgone: I am not giving any arguments, I am just trying to do the job that God chose me for, satan is real, I don't care what anybody calls him, the accuser he is and he is not a good angel and I have met him. Jesus: God Incarnate, Love Incarnate said that satan is a liar and a thief and that is true. When I was battling satan for 24 plus hours off and on, what he said about me had some truth to it, but what he said about my earthly dad was such a lie that later when I was able to recoup sure upset me to say the least. God created satan and he created him for a reason, for one thing we have a choice with our free will and another as part of God's Plan for the salvation for the entire human race. Like it says even the forces of evil are inadvertantly working toward the filfulment of the Will of God. It is God's Will that ALL be saved. TO TJ: Sin is sin and about the only difference between hell and purgatory is that those in purgatory know they are getting out, those in hell do not know they are getting out BUT THEY WILL. Jesus won the keys to both hell and death, spiritual death and He will use them in due time. TO AC: You said that God cannot be in the presence of sin, I have no idea what that is suppose to even mean, it seems that that would mean God could not have anything to do with this earth at all. Jesus Himself became SIN, he took on all of the sins of the entire human race, past,present and future, and the Love of God culminated in Total Victory, a tie is unacceptable. Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

The gibberish level is sky-high on this thread,
much higher than the I.Q.level which is in single digits

TJ,

Why is God such a dictator? Why wouldn't he have understood the impulse to share in power and through love and mercy or whatever, shown Lucifer the error of his ways?

Sin is what separates us from God. God cannot be in the presence of sin, period. There is no purgatory, and the only intercession for our sin is Jesus Christ, not the virgin Mary, not Priests, not anyone other than Jesus. John 14:6: (Jesus says) I am the way, the truth, and the life. No man comes unto the father (God) except by me." Any other teaching is heresy. We have to confess that Jesus is our saviour, that he died on the cross, rose from the dead and is coming again for those who believe and accept him. We have to repent (turn away from) of our sins and sinful ways and "die daily" or ask forgiveness everyday. Only one can forgive and that is God. If we refuse to repent of our sins then hell is a very real place that The Bible says we have to take up our cross and follow Jesus. If we do this then we don't have to worry if there is a heaven or a hell. We know where we will be when judgement comes.

How do Christians reconcile the fact that it's been 2000 years and 100 generations of people waiting for their savior to come back and invite them to the Kingdom of Heaven leaving the rest behind? At what point do you say as a collective group, "Maybe we got it wrong..."

Hell, theres a place that we dont want to be in. As a Roman Catholic, and as a Catholic in general, we believe in hell. The result in us going there is completely up to us. We know the difference between good and evil, and thus know that if you do something bad, and are not sorry or repentant for it, we will go to hell. We also believe in Purgatory, and that is if you have made venial sins, or little white sins. There, we believe, that we are purged of our sins, which prevent us from being in total communion with God. Hell is a broad subject.

Now, on Lucifer, or Satan. He used to be an angel in communion with God. he was an Arch Angel, along with St. Micheal, and St. Garbriel. Lucifers job was to recieve the prayers that go to God and present them to Him. Where Lucifer went wrong, was that just for a milisecond, he liked haveing the power to "recieve" the prayers, and know what they contained. Thus resulting in God send Lucifer to hell, where Lucifer, now Satan, will spend all of eternity, to do anything to get us to not listen to God, and to literally go to hell.

A Hermit
The fact that you don't acknowledge G-d doesn't mean He isn't there for you. What you've separated yourself from is the community of believers -- which may indeed have been a wise choice.

(Just here to make trouble.)

THOMAS BAUM:

Your arguments will be greatly improved by accuracy. The one you call Satan is actually Lucifer. It is Lucifer that would be God, made himself like unto God. Satan is God's right hand man, the one that sorts out saints and sinners, the "accuser" the GOOD angel that gives dead folks a lie detector test on the nebol bridge and sends sinners on to hell.

See http://www.hoax-buster.org/sellyoursoul for a good look at Lucifer, picture authenticated by the Roman Catholic Church, the original Christianity according to the experts. You should know that Christianity dates Pharaoh but then you can't seem to separate good angels from bad ones...

Actually hell is not seperation from God, that is spiritual death, hell is experiencing your wrongdoing, judgementalism and unforgiveness in the Light of Pure Love, thank God that Jesus won the keys to both hell and spiritual death and will use them in due time. Yes, we have free will and we will all be judged but don't underestimate God's Mercy. It is important what you do and why you do it and it is also important what you know. God is a Trinity and He is a Trinity of the Oneness of Pure Love. satan is not only a liar and a thief but also a loser and his time is short. God's Plan is for all of His children to be with Him in the Kingdom of God, and if you are human you are one of God's children. If God was anything like what a lot of people that call themselves christians say, who in their right mind would be thankful to such a hate-filled, revengeful being like that. Some so-called christians sure give christianity a bad name. God is a searcher of hearts and minds, not of religious affiliations or lack thereof. A lot of people that call themselves atheists or agnostics will be pleasantly surprised at their physical death while a lot of people that call themselves christians will be unpleasantly surprised at their physical death. It is in the bible. Thank God that God wins Total Victory, a tie is unacceptable, ultimately when God declares Victory in favor of the Holy Ones, the Kingdom with all of His children will be established. God always sends a messenger ahead of time, well that is me, the New Testament Moses, Be ready, the book of revelation is unfolding before our very eyes. Take care. Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

Could "heaven as a place has been out for a long time" have anything to do with proof the world is actually round and not flat?

See the picture of the universe at http://www.hoax-buster.org It has all three places, this "flat" earth, the next "flat" earth, the nebol bridge that connects the two and the whereabouts of hell which lies beneath the bridge.

"Heaven as a place has been out for a long time" but the three significant places, earth, next earth and hell have not gone away. The nebol bridge is ignored. "Next earth" has been changed to a spirit world. And the beat goes on and on and on and....

When we begin our analysis of "faith" at the nebol bridge something sinister jumps out. Hell is a gun held to the heads of the faithful by the ministry. It's do what they say or else.

That's the essence of the Lord's prayer: "Our father who art in heaven, hallowed by thy name, they kingdom come, thy will be done" OR ELSE. God is the universal dictator employed by the ministry to extort the wealth of earth from the faithful, for the loftiest of reasons, secure heaven for the faithful. That would be "saved" getting past the demon on the nebol bridge.

Jesus said, "sell all your earthly possessions and and give to the poor." Jesus has no followers, just those who continue a con that is at least 5,000 years old.

Heaven:
according to the theologians is a place and a state of being - when we die and are separated from our bodies - the light goes on and at that moment we have this unbridled desire for God - it is all encompassing - a thirst that only He can fulfill. This desire propels us toward God but our will - unless it is filled with charity is in relative or absolute opposition to the Divine love that we thirst for.
Hell:
Is is a place and a state of being - it is to have a will that is absolutely opposed to God but to thirst for the Divine and to know that one's choices have caused one to lose all that one will want for all eternity. It is to be at war with one's self and to be among a community of like minded individuals hating themselves and all around them and attempting to rip and tear each other apart if only to distract themselves from their own self-hatred momentarily.
Heaven realized:
To see the creator face to face - how that takes place is somewhat vague since most of those in heaven (save Christ and his Mother) have no physical body - but the blessed do see God - we know that from the Transfiguration of Christ.

If "Hell is separation from God" why is my life so much better since I stopped trying to believe in Him?

A Hermit

Hi Martin

A.A.Atanasio has an interesting take on Hell in his book "Hellbound" - part of "The Crow" franchise. He combines cosmology and demonology in a rather curious mixture of ideas. Firstly pretty much everyone ends up in Hell - it's the great recycling centre of the human world, where souls are stripped of their individuality and sin by vicious torments, then sent back to Earth to try again. Only the most pure and compassionate join the company of the Angels - everyone else ends up in the hands of the demons.

But what are the demons doing it all for? Being spirits they're blessed/cursed with never-ending consciousness - but they can extract moments of "extinction" from tormented human souls. They plan to "sleep" until the very distant end of Time.

Both the Angels and the demons have lost contact with God, and both want to get back in touch - but the Angels are "keeping their first estate" while the demons think God has "lost the plot". Trust/faith versus doubt/disbelief, turning even angels into demons. An everlasting temporal existence without God would be hard to endure, even for beings like Angels and demons.

We know very little about the OtherWorld and the nature of God and spirits. I don't think it is helpful or Christ-like to draw up battle-lines over such doctrinal black-holes as the next existence and its inhabitants. And as Atanasio warns us, we might all be wrong.

So hell is just a separation from god,is it?
How profound.
Einstein you aint.

It is not mathematically tenable to believe that this enormously complex universe and the even more
complex things that are in it got here all by themselves. It could not happen.

The Missing Found and New Discoveries

Have you heard in your soul that something is wrong, that something just isn't right? Perhaps that you are not at home even though you are at home, or that there is the feeling of something drastic about to happen. I tell you that you have an instinct, not like that of an animal or a bear, but by the spirit that is inside. I tell you come to the courts of God and discuss these matters with him. For when the heart aches and the soul is in sorrow the tears flowing down the faces of those wrongly accused the Lord God says, "It is time to die to your feelings of importance to the world, it is time to die from the influences of this world, from the cares of this world and place your trust fully in Me. I am your light, I am your lamp, I am your treasure and your life, follow My voice and there you will find your a supply of abundant life, even for others."

For God says, "I am about to bring the unjust to justice, they will come forth! I am going to make them come forth and confess! For there are many that have lived under the yoke of not knowing where there sons and daughters are. And the Lord God is going to bring these mysteries to rest so that closure can be brought forth. In the woods a body, in the walls a baby, in the caves burned bones, in the fields the buried, in the lake a bag of limbs.

Nature is crying out, for God says, don't you know that the blood of innocent ones cry out! But in the hand of God are the innocent and those who have been subjected to a death of criminal. God has heard their cries in the midst of their torture, and in the midst of there last breath they spoke to God and said, "God, save me and keep me close to you. I'm ready to be with you." And I tell you that God will bring vengeance for their deaths. For he has seen the pain and said, "I saw what Cain did to Able and I branded him, and I tell you that the man who murdered is branded, and many will come forth from their own will."

I tell you that there will be the discovery of many that are missing, for the lost ones will finally have there rest when their murderers confess of the killings and where they hid the bodies, bringing peace to the victim. They will willingly surrender and many will be captured in the next few days! "I tell you that someone will be taken and one will be gone and the other left behind," says the Spirit. Remember I am the only just judge and many murder mysteries from the 90's and 80's are about to be solved, says the Spirit of God.