Center an attempt to prevent the next 9/11

“The influence of Islam paralyzes the social development of those who follow it. No stronger retrograde force exists in the world.” – Winston Churchill

We should not be ashamed to worry about ideologies that openly and vociferously seek to destroy our civilization. It is not only a right, but also the duty of free people to speak against every ideology that threatens freedom.

We need to ask ourselves whether Islam (not just fringe radicals) sanction the violence we are seeing perpetrated in the name of Allah around the world. And if we are to be honest then we must answer yes. The Koran, Haddiths, Sharia and Islamic history all show that Islam has a developed doctrine of theology and law that mandates violence against non-believers. Except for Mulsims fighting non-Muslims around the world the world is at peace. Every major conflict today (Somalia, Chechnya, etc.) are Muslims beheading and amputating and torturing Christians in search of a global hegemony of Sharia.

I am not surprised by the beheadings of Jews and Christians by Muslims. Muhammad, who is considered the perfect representation of human behavior in Islam, personally beheaded between 600-900 members of the Coriza tribe in Arabia. If the prophet did it then it is the proper way for Muslims to behave, and Muslims today are simply following the example of the prophet.

As to whether Islam is a religion of peace… the peaceful revelations of the Koran are limited to the time when the prophet was relatively powerless in his native city of Mecca. These revelations were abrogated and made null in later verses once Muhammad had become a powerful and wealthy warlord in Medina. In the last revealed (the un-abrogated verses) the message is clear: Sura 9:5 “Kill the unbelievers wherever you find them… and capture them and besiege them, and prepare for them each and every ambush.” Sura 5:33 “Those that wage war against Allah and his messenger… shall be killed or crucified or their hands and their feet be cut off on opposite sides.” Sahih Al-Bukhari Vol 8, Book 82, Hadith 795 “The prophet cut off the hands and feet of the men belonging to the tribe of Uraina.”

Islam is a supremacist hate group that seeks, in the name of religious freedom, to destroy all remnants of freedom from Western civilization. How ironic that in the name of multi-culturalism and freedom of religion we are bending over backwards in support of their mission to destroy freedom.

YasserYouSufi,

This is the last I will say on this matter.

Israel can take out whatever nuclear material Iran has in twenty minutes. If they thought it represented a threat to their security Iran would have said bye bye to whatever it has months ago. Don't be a fool. They've done it before and they'd do it again in a heartbeat. Jews have no intention of dying to make Islamists feel good. Get that through your benighted head.

I read Haaretz, along with Tehran Times and other newspapers. Saudi has been repeatedly attacking Iran for this, that, and the other thing. Before spewing, read.
They again attacked them about the islands, claiming Iran "occupied" them, when that is not the case at all, and I hear nothing from you on that.

They have stated in writing that without Iraq (!) the bulwark between them and Iran has vanished and that they have been subject to attacks by Al Quaeda. They went to China as was widely reported and asked that China participate in the sanctions. China did.

They bought millions of dollars of weapons from us, and we are running missions with them. Next to the UK, they are the heaviest investors in British Petroleum, worldwide; BP is the largest oil company in the world, and it needs oil now.

SAUDI is a prime mover in the sanctions. WAKE UP. Nejad himself has repeatedly stated that their are British agents in IRan (there are). The IRG, the Supreme Leader, who is dying, the Council, and Nejad are at odds with one another. Come the EU sanctions, Iran will fall. The BAZAR CLOSED. GET IT? And it won't reopen.
People are demonstrating from want of decent gas, in addition to not having work.

There is nothing else to say. If you think that the Saudis are pushing this due to their Zionism, then good luck to you with your meds.

Nejad is having difficulty unfreezing the assets the Brits froze. All I can say is that whatever happens, America, Britain, and the Saudis must leave IRan alone. It would have been better if they left it alone now. I detest the regime, but there will not be another Mossadegh, unfortunately. It is the West that brought us to where Iran is now. I can only hope that they do not make it worse. But I don't believe they will. They want the oil.

To "prevent the next 9/11", one has to find out who was responsible for the first 9/11 — to this day, bin Laden is NOT WANTED by the FBI for 9/11.

Read "9/11 Unveiled" — a free download at our website, examine the evidence on our 9/11 pages, and you'll see that the official account isn't worth the paper it's written on.

Enver Masud
Founder, The Wisdom Fund
http://www.twf.org

Dear Iman Rauf, as a person who was there and nearly killed myself because of the deaths of two of my friends on 9/11, I have a question for you. It turns out I'm half-Turkish and half-Ukrainian, so I'm half-Muslim if there is such a thing. So you're building your Cordoba House for people like myself to help us explore our ancestry.Right? Of course right. I can almost talk myself into accepting a mosque at Ground Zero, but a COMMUNITY CENTER? Do you really think two blocks away from Ground Zero is a proper place for people to swim and enjoy themselves? And what is this half-Turkish poet and filmmaker supposed to do- forget I've got friends killed there and read my poems or show my films at your new 500 seat auditorium? I'm sorry, but that would be quite impossible. I don't sell out my friends- not for a 500 seat auditorium, not for something MUCH larger, like a stadium. I'm asking you not to trample on our pain and our feelings- if you can't understand that what you're doing is causing UNNECESSARY pain, I feel truly sorry for you. Nobody ever could build anything on human blood- the Nazis and the Communists tried, as you well know. And where are they now?

JUSTACOMMENT,

Thats all baloney blown out of proportion by the pro-zionist media of US and UK. Ahmedinejad never said Iran will wipe Israel off the map of the world. Refer to my post below to Farnaz Mansouri, an Irani-Jewish-American who can understand farsi very well. And besides Al-Jazeera is an Arab news channel and doesn't have much credibility when it comes to Iran. Wikipedia is something of a neutral on this topic and you can see their explanation on what Nejad actually said:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mahmoud_Ahmadinejad_and_Israel

Also I dont think many people whose only source of information is the western media, who have sold there souls to the zionists, would know that Israel's Nobel Peace Prize winning President has also thretened to wipe Iran off the Map of the world. http://www.dominicantoday.com/dr/world/2006/5/8/13207/Peres-says-that-Iran-can-also-be-wiped-off-the-map

Now dont tell me you were aware of that. No one is. You wont find that news item in the mainstream media. Thats how this Animal Farm works.

I have no intentions of distracting you. It was you who brought up Israel not me. Your question regarding my stance on the attacks on innocent civilians in NY, London, Madrid, Bali, Mumbai, Tel Aviv etc is a no brainer. Ofcourse they are reprehensible. I have condemned them many times. They are against the very teachings of Islam and the perpetrators will burn in hell according to my and mainstream Islamic interpretation of the punishment for their crimes.

Why not make it an center specifically devoted to developing counter-arguments to Islamic terrorists (who freely and accurately quote from the Quran and Hadith to justify their violence) and specifically and honestly analyze the Islamic texts and expunge those portions that encourage and incite violent acts against non-Muslims. All of the interfaith dialogue in the world will do nothing to stop terror attacks by jihadists. Rauf can convince as many Catholics and Jews and Lutherans and Buddhists and Atheists he wants that Islam is a peaceful religion but those aren't the people that need convincing. What is needed is intrafaith dialogue in Islam and use some introspection and self-criticism instead of blaming others for their ills. The fact is the Quran and Hadith and the Sira contain some pretty troubling messages and examples and they need to be expunged. This community center/mosque does not appear capable of or interested in any such thing so it is of no value in promoting "moderate" Islam while it is still insulting to those who suffered at the hands of people acting on their understanding of Islam and the example of their so-called prophet.

If your Middle East 101 tells you that Iranian are longing for the americans to set them free, then count me out. You are looking from the perspective of a Jewish American. I see the situation a whole lot differently. The Saudis do not hate Iran enough to attack it. They cannot afford it. They are cunning buisnessmen above everything else. They know another war is not good for the region. Iran could seriously hurt Saudi Interests in the persian gulf. Oil is their life blood. Plus there's the question of their leadership status in the Islamic world. None of it will remain when they are exposed as conniving with US and Israel in attacking another muslim country. This is elementary Middle East geo-politics.

PS: Mossadegh-CIA-MI6-BP yea I've read that story. As I said its an Orwellian world we live in. The story is being repeated 50 years on with one more player, Israel!

Ok Farnaz,

This is my response to your last 2 posts:

I find Haaretz gives a unique perspective by being the voice of Israel's fast diminishing left. The Journalists whose names I cited above get a lot of hateful messages from their fellow Israelis but they are not afraid of saying what they see as wrong.

{Nejad has been shown on television literally threatening to "wipe Israel off the map"}

You fell for that too? I thought you could understand Persian. Who was going to wipe Israel off the map of the world? Did he say Iran or did he say he himself? Hasn't aparthied South Africa been wiped off the map of the world? USSR? Yugoslavia? Czechoslovakia? can you see any of these countries on the map of the world? Israel was an unsuccessful experiment. It has lived out its shelf life. Well almost. Iran doesn't need to attack Israel. Its fast becoming a pariah state. Its also becoming a hardline jewish haredi state. They are just as bad as the talibans or al-qaida. Most of them armed and ready to take on the state of Israel if they dare get in their way. Just wait till Israel faces sanctions for its criminal actions. These people will take over Israel.

So how do you know about something Saudi themselves deny? They cant even say they'll give air corridor to some other country to attack Iran and you think they'll send their army to Iran? By the way Israel WOULD have attacked Iran if it could. Firstly there's the question of which regime in ME signs its own death sentence by giving the Israelis air corridor. Secondly do you realize how many jets it will take to take out all of Iran's Nuclear and missile launching sites at once. Within no time there will be missiles in downtown Tel Aviv. Israel has no missile defense shield. Its vulnerable to even home made rockets by Hamas. Those Iranian rockets pack a punch and the Israeli's know that all too well. Thirdly, Israel ugly face has been bared to the whole world after its wholesale murder of women, children and innocent civilians in Lebanon, Gaza and Mavi Marmara. Its reputation has already hit rock bottom. You might just as well guess which side the world opinion will be in case of yet another unprovoked violent attack. And finally there's Obama. Do you think American army would be delighted with Israel providing a renewed vigour and hatred for the people fighting against the americans in Iraq and Afghanistan? So there you go, Israel has so much going against it. Iran is no Lebanon or Gaza.Plus there's a fat chance Syria, Lebanon, Pakistan, Turkey, Iraq and eventually Saudi and Egyptians and Jordanians will be dragged into this war. What of the Oil prices? This region will not see peace for decades and US can forget about its recovery from depression.

(Part II follows)

JUSTACOMMENT wrote to YASSERYOUSUFI:

“... don't underestimate the Muslim terrorism, a president of a Muslim country is thinking to wipe out Israel.”

**************************

YASS: You really think so?

Me: Yes.

YASS: Can you get me a credible proof?

Me: Hope you believe Aljazeera.net (LINK: http://english.aljazeera.net/archive/2005/10/200849132648612154.html)

Ahmadinejad: Wipe Israel off map - Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad has openly called for Israel to be wiped off the map.

“The establishment of the Zionist regime was a move by the world oppressor against the Islamic world," the president told a conference in Tehran on Wednesday, entitled The World without Zionism.

"The skirmishes in the occupied land are part of a war of destiny. The outcome of hundreds of years of war will be defined in Palestinian land," he said.

"As the Imam said, Israel must be wiped off the map," said Ahmadinejad, referring to Iran's revolutionary leader Ayat Allah Khomeini.

For a video go to http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5hLDjGdJC0Q&feature=fvw

YASS: “All I know is everytime I open a Newspaper their are reports about various Israeli plans of attacking Iran and speculations how actively US will support yet another blatantly uncalled for bloodshed in the Middle-East.”

Me: Apparently you want to distract me. You tried to make me condemn atrocities committed by a non-Muslim country, which I did. Then tried to corner me as a Christian wich I'm not. Now you want me to take on Israel. I prefer not to branch again. Instead I believe that this moment is a good opportunity for you to demostrate how a peaceful Muslim you are and condemn terrorists acts committed by muslim extremists in NY, London, Spain, etc. The ball is on your court.

Dear Mr. Feisal Abdul Rauf & CO. & al Ummah; WHAT IF "Kaaba' get's a similar fate as WTC 1 & @ et al? Would Ye "Welcome" the buildingg of Kafir Church(s), after the fact? Maybe Now YE & Islami Ummah might might understand.

.......... .( . P E A C E?
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.......... |.\/ . .. _) (_ . . . . . . .. |:|"|/|||::|/|::|\|||/||:|
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............ `\; . ; . . . .. . ; /.\ . . . ~~~~ ~~~ ~~ ~~
............. .`\; . . . . .; . ;| . .\ . "Give U.S. Liberty
............... ; . . '' ' ; . . . . . ./ . O'Give US Death"
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.......... :---------------------- '# # # |. . . .O' YaHaBeBe"
.......... | # # # # # # # # # | # # # |
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. . . . . . Credits To "jj" http://onwapo.com

Today's 2nd Big Question that the al Ishlami ummah or al Esauami ummah or Islami ummah must ASK & Answer is:

W H Y -- D O E S -- T H E -- K A F i R -- W O R L D -- H A T E -- U S -- I S L A M i's Now? Instead of YAHUDDI/JEWS?

Hint: For Starters; to help Islam with bringing Closure & Reconcilliation, That The Kafir Ummah (none Islami People) Must help the Islami's folks 'Abolish' or Wipe-Off The Face-of This Earth (a Space Ship, by whatever names, NOt gods) the War Mongering & Obviously jealous "ARAB-LEAGUE"! Please see:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arab_League

So, Having an ALL Green Islami enforced African Continent, or Middle Asia or South America via Islami creep (scare; which is Real))... Ain't Gonna Happen!

iMPORTANT Note: Like Less Government or less Reduncy' That The Arab Leage (for Starters) Shall be Replaced by the Islami U.nited N.ations called the "OIC". Please See:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OIC

Soo; Less [Pre-Apocalyptic) Religion (or Spread) need Containment. Less Government To; Less Over-lapping if ye Don't Mind.

___

The "WORLD TRADE CENTER" is Gonna RISE Again! NO Mosque(s) or CULTture or SECTtions Centers Pleazza! Take it To Holland or France or England but NOt Here!

There is NO Room or Place For Jealous "SATANIC VERSUS" Lovers to Hide, even Run anymore. Includes their ELDERS OF "AL TAQIYAH" via WAHHABi & AYATOLLAHi & Wannabe's!

Note: The ISLAMi "Sunni-A-Bomb" scare (soon there will be a Irani SHia-b-Bomb) is Real (Don't tell Us Other(un)Wise Mr. & Ms. Islami Satanites) so "iSLAMi-Phobia is also Real; and as real as "Religious-Police" (agents/Spy's)infiltrating Americans Neigborhoods, Kids, & Industry's!

This is NOt a Joke; Nor is This a Cartoon; but More that That! Soo, Please Satanic-VersUS lovers, STOP in the Name Of "E-K-L-A-H" or ELSE!?

Oppss. Down With 'THEOCRACY" & "MONRACHY" on This [Bless'th, Never Sin'th/Curs'th] S.pace-S.hip Earth forever. So "... Destroy Them Wherever Ye Find Them..." (none Eklah-t-iON's)!

I don't know if you read my second post, Yasser, but you should.

I can't search for links now, but will try to provide them tomorrow. Saudi has been agitating in a big way. They have again accused Iran of "stealing" the three islands, which Iran has not done. They have accused Iran of sponsoring terrorist attacks, complaining that Iraq (!) had been a bulwark for them against "Iranian aggression."

As for your hilarity, I doubt it equals mine, since as I said, the thought of fat Saudis taking on the Iranian army is a hoot. Nevertheless, per every major newspaper, they purchased millions of dollars of weapons from us and we have been flying missions with them. Surprised you are unaware of all of the foregoing.

The Saudis in addition to hating nonArab Iran for not being Arab, in addition to wanting Iran Oil via BP, also want an end to IRanian influence in Syria.

This, really, is Middle East 101. Who does not know this? As for Israeli nuclear weapons, we do know what they have.

Pakistan and India, however, remain mysterious. Along with North Korea, of course, and IRan.

I would suggest you read about a fellow named Mossadegh with special attention to the year 1953. Then, work forward.

Farnaz,

Honestly I find this American Israeli fetish of Saudi taking on Iran and they killing two birds with one shot Hilarious too. It aint gonna happen. The Saudi's have already taken enough flak for sitting in the lap of americans. If they even think about fighting Israel's war, that will be the end of the House of Saud. But that aint gonna happen. The Shiekh's are smarter than that, besides they have no immidiate danger from Iran that calls for such extreme measures.

With regards to the embargoes on Iran, ofcourse they are shamefull yet the sanctioners are shameless. Only the poor innocent Iranian will be hurt like poor innocent Iraqis with these unjustified sanctions while no one will dare ask a question about Israel's arsenal of nuclear weapons. Thats the sad reality of the orwelian world we live in.

Yasser, Haaretz has been very critical of Netanyahu for not being more reactive to what it perceives as the Iranian threat. If you have been reading it, you should know that.

Nejad has been shown on television literally threatening to "wipe Israel off the map."

Saudi Arabia has opened a corridor. It did so some time ago, but has denied it. I know for a fact that they did this. You can go ahead and use Israel as a bogey man all you want, but Saudi Arabia is not an Israel supporter and they are after Iran Oil. As are the Brits.

I would have thought you smarter than this, YasserYousufi. Israel does not need the Brits, or us, or the Saudis (LOL). If it wanted to get rid of Iran's nuclear materials it would have done so. If you read Haaretz, you know that Netanyahu publicly stated that IRan is "not an existential threat to Israel." That is a precise quotation. And of course it isn't. How could it be. So you have Nejad pounding his chest, Tarzan style, and Netanyahu pounding back. All this is obvious.

BP wants Iran oil. Read Tehran Times. There you will find how the British "Zionists" and the Saudi "Zionists" are after Iran.

Iran will fall from the sanctions. It is a horrible situation. The sanctioners need to stay out of Iran.

Ok i wrote my response without reading the second part. I'll get back at you with a response to that later.

Farnaz,

On issues pertaining to Middle-East and Israel-Iran conflict in particular I find the wonderful Israeli News Website Haaretz.com more credible than any other news source in US. I would recommend Gideon Levy, Amos Harel and Uri Avnery to anyone who is interested in getting a true picture of the situaution there. Any Western journalist who dares take a dispassionate view of the situation would meet the same fate that two award winning respectable female journalist met just during last couple of months. Both Helen Thomas and Octavia Nasr were thrown out of their jobs.

Make no mistake......Israel is itching for an attack on Iran. The headline on Haaretz today is of Mossad Chief going back and forth to Riyadh begging for an air corridor to attack Iran. Just type Iran in the search box and you'll get all the details of the plan to attack Iran.

PS: There is no credible evidence that Nejad said Iran will wipe Israel off the map of the world. I thought you as Persian woman would know better than the reactionary Iran haters of the west.

Yasser Yousufi,

Here is Part II:

It was the Saudis who went to China and got the Chinese to go along with the sanctions, btw. The Saudis also purchased millions of dollars of weapons from the US, and the US has been running missions with them. I confess I found it hilarious to imagine the Saudis taking on the Iranian army. Fat chance.

At all events, to my surprise, the sanctions are having a serious effect on Iran. The oil they are importing is way below par, which is irritating everyone. Evidently, the sanctioners have finally found ways to freeze some of Iran's assets in ways Nejad cannot unfreeze them. The Council of Guardians, Nejad, and the Supreme Leader, corrupt as hell, are in conflict. The SL has only a few months to live, evidently, since he has cancer.

The Bazaar closed and refuses to reopen. This is of great significance, as you know. Meanwhile, the EU is meeting to discuss further sanctions. This, too, is very important, since Germany has not cut back very much on its dealings with Iran.

I am at a loss. I did not want this to happen although I do not like Nejad. However, I do not like British agitators being in Iran, and I do not like BP either. My Iranian friends, Muslim and Jewish, want the US to go into Iran. I think that would be a horrible mistake, but people just cannot seem to learn. They cannot.

If Iran falls, it will be the poor who continue to suffer, but much, much more until Iran reconstitutes itself. Iran is a great nation. BP and its allies must stay out of Iran. IT is they who brought Iran to where it is today.

You really think so? Can you get me a credible proof? All I know is everytime I open a Newspaper their are reports about various Israeli plans of attacking Iran and speculations how actively US will support yet another blatantly uncalled for bloodshed in the Middle-East.

Posted by: yasseryousufi
-----------------------------
I don't know what newspapers you're reading , Yasser, but nothing like that has appeared in WaPo, the Times, or the WSJ. Ditto, the British newspapers. Let us remember that it is Nejad who has repeatedly threatened to "wipe Israel off the map."

If you are looking for credible threats to IRan look to Great Britain, BP (aka Great Britain), Saudi Arabia, and, of course, us.
REad Terhan Times, preferably in Farsi, if you can get someone to translate. The Saudis are agitating big time, and they have dragged the Emirates into this. Saudi Arabia is, as you know, heavily invested in BP. HOwever, they should take note: this is not 1953.

More to follow....

JUSTACOMMENT wrote,

Me: don't underestimate the Muslim terrorism, a president of a Muslim country is thinking to wipe out Israel.

**************************

You really think so? Can you get me a credible proof? All I know is everytime I open a Newspaper their are reports about various Israeli plans of attacking Iran and speculations how actively US will support yet another blatantly uncalled for bloodshed in the Middle-East.

@Arif2:

I really don't believe that YasserYousufi is a taliban. He is an educated moderate muslim who really doesn't like Islam being criticized, and he is a partriotic Pakistani as well. However, he does suffer from psychological dissonance that nearly all muslims suffer from. He reads the Quran, and the life of Muhammad, and the Islamic history and his brain is utterly incapable of using the very elementary logic to put together that all of it adds up to a horribly fascist ideology. On any other topic, he is likely as capable as anyone else. I am sure you know that as well, and you know how frustrating it is to deal with the closed minds of the followers of Muhammad. I do have hope that eventually we will be able to penetrate enough of these closed minds to see a genuine change.
I hope and wish there were a lot more guys like him who would actually participate in a dialog. As long as he is willing to talk and put his views across, he and we stand a chance. It is when the conversation stops that the real problems begin.

Folks this man YASSERYOUSUFI is a Taliban, the only difference is he is somewhat educated in something other than the filthy Qur'an (note I spelled it correct this time). He is a taliban with a keyborad. Oh how he would like to explode in a room full if kafirs.

YASSERYOUSUFI asked me:

“How are you going to ensure that your war mongering country led by your violent army and politicians are not going to cause another Hiroshima or Nagasaki or Mai Lai or Iraq or Afghanistan or Lebanon........??”

My answer: denouncing the perpetrators and trying that people don't forget these horrendous events when they vote, so we avoid loonies as leaders. That's how it works in democracies, not perfect but better than in a despotic nation.

You: “Try to look at the mote in your own eye like a good Christian before lecturing others.”

Me: you are wrong, this is not my mote. I'm a good atheist.

You: “When is your country going to renounce violence and its killing fields responsible for the murder of millions of innocents...”

Me: I don't know, wish I have more power to stop it. As long as religious people get involved, violence is the common solution.

You: “... far far worse than any Muslim terrorist can even think of causing.”

Me: don't underestimate the Muslim terrorism, a president of a Muslim country is thinking to wipe out Israel. So there you go,you might end up winning the contest.

Baloney! A mosque at the sight of the World Trade Center ruins in a monument to an Islamic 911 victory in their long standing war against the West and particularly against the United States. Those who have chosen to permit it to be constructed will forever live in shame. What's next; a Japanese Buddhist temple at Pearl Harbor? I had not had bad feeling toward Muslims prior to 911 and the cheering Islamic crowds in the Middle East. I do have animosity today. I'd be very happy if they would just pick up their Korans and go home to their Islamic nations. Is this politically correct? No, but it is the way I feel. I can't get the memory of those bodies hurling themselves from the World Trade Center out of my mind. The folks who approved the construction of the mosque need to relook at the tapes of the events of that day...a day that will live in infamy.

More from Feisal:

In a 60 Minutes interview shortly after the September 11 attacks Imam Rauf said, "Fanaticism and terrorism have no place in Islam" and went on to say, "I wouldn't say that the United States deserved what happened, but the United States policies were an accessory to the crime that happened."[3] When the interviewer asked Rauf how he considered the U.S. an accessory, the Imam replied, "Because we have been accessory to a lot of innocent lives dying in the world. In fact, in the most direct sense, Osama bin Laden is made in the USA."[4]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Feisal_Abdul_Rauf
--------------------------------
Feisal,

You need to clarify. This and my other post come to me from a Muslim friend who, I'm afraid, does not trust you for reasons I can't quite understand. He is an Ahmadi Muslim. He says there is more. I am all too much aware of American involvement with Osama. That isn't the point. These comments of yours go too far as friend says.

Wikipedia is widely read. You need to clarify your comments.

The Bengali Genocide, I mentioned in my previous post was in 1971!!

http://www.genocidebangladesh.org/

“…… we were told to kill the hindus and Kafirs (non-believer in God). One day in June, we cordoned a village and were ordered to kill the Kafirs in that area. We found all the village women reciting from the Holy Quran, and the men holding special congregational prayers seeking God’s mercy. But they were unlucky. Our commanding officer ordered us not to waste any time.”

Americans really should learn about the ideology underwhich Hamas, Hezbollah in the middle east, terror groups in Philipines, Indonesia, in Southern Russia, and the terror groups in Pakistan
http://www.satp.org/satporgtp/countries/pakistan/terroristoutfits/group_list.htm
have been operating for the past 40 years at least.

AKAFIR,

Are you an idiot or something! how many time do I have to prove your lies to make you understand? You are a concealor of truth by the very definition of your name. Im done with with crackpots like you. Go find your fellow hindus to share your half cooked lies with.

YasserYousufi:

Pakistanis killed three million Bangladeshis because they were half hindus. In the name of Islam your nation wiped out the minorities all over the country. Americans need to be aware of your and your Islam's history, and the blood that the supremacist ideology of Islam has shed.
*************************
Will Durant, the famous historian summed it up like this:
"The Islamic conquest of India is probably the bloodiest story in history. It is a discouraging tale, for its evident moral is that civilization is a precious good, whose delicate complex of order and freedom, culture and peace, can at any moment be overthrown by barbarians invading from without or multiplying within."

....

The Muslim conquests, down to the 16th century, were for the Hindus a pure struggle of life and death. Entire cities were burnt down and the populations massacred, with hundreds of thousands killed in every campaign, and similar numbers deported as slaves. Every new invader made (often literally) his hills of Hindus skulls. Thus, the conquest of Afghanistan in the year 1000 was followed by the annihilation of the Hindu population; the region is still called the Hindu Kush, i.e. Hindu slaughter. The Bahmani sultans (1347-1480) in central India made it a rule to kill 100,000 captives in a single day, and many more on other occasions. The conquest of the Vijayanagar empire in 1564 left the capital plus large areas of Karnataka depopulated. And so on.
*********************
Americans will be fools to allow Islamists to play on guilt and let their guards down.

JUSTACOMMENT,

Those are hollow, meaningless words you just spoke. How are you going to ensure that your war mongering country led by your violent army and politicians are not going to cause another Hiroshima or Nagasaki or Mai Lai or Iraq or Afghanistan or Lebanon........?? Try to look at the mote in your own eye like a good Christian before lecturing others. When is your country going to renounce violence and its killing fields responsible for the murder of millions of innocents far far worse than any muslim terrorist can even think of causing.

Some clarification from Faisal would be helpful on this:

And in a "60 Minutes" interview a few weeks after the 9/11 attacks, Imam Feisal said, "The United States' policies were an accessory to the crime that happened."

http://wcbstv.com/topstories/ground.zero.mosque.2.1799977.html

CADAM72 Don't be foolish, ALL muslims are the same, building a mosque at GZ is every muslims dream. A mosque in the most prominent place overlooking the biggest terror event perpetrated by muslims on US soil. The 20 terrorists are backed by entire muslim countries. This yasseryousufi guy is exactly like one of those 500 crazies you talk about. There are millions like him; blind to muslim aggression; its always the other guys fault. Islam is all about aggression, only a fool will think otherwise. The GZ mosque is a bad idea and appeasers will be the ones who will make it happen.

culture paranoia.

america spent and wasted trillion of $$$$$$$$$$$ in the islamic world in the form of culture invasion and wars.

america spent and wasted billions of $$$$$$$$$$$ in the none islamic world in the form of culture invasion and wars.

america spent and wasted billions of $$$$$$$$$$$$ in the form of cultur cold war with russia and allies.

why is a 12 story culture center near G Z or away from G Z stiring all this paranoia .

culture travel exactly like money and technology ,

good culture always beat bad culture
good money always beat bad money

and in order to protect your culture borders,
make sure that your culture is not leaky make sure that your culture is not hole/y.

YASSERYOUSUFI,

"Hey Gringo! shouldn't you feel ashamed that your God fearing, devout born again Christian, twice elected President said that God came in his dream and ordered him to attack Iraq?"

I should and in fact I'm deeply ashamed because this Christian president had ordered to attack Iraq and caused unnecessary deaths of innocent people.

Do you have any other question?

If not, it's time for you to start working to ensure that references to violence are taken out of your books, unequivocally condemn terrorist acts committed by groups that use the Islam/Muslim brand and dissociate all political ideas of dominance and sharia law from your peaceful religious message.

Then you and your religion will not be treated any more as a violent group.

JUSTACOMMENT writes,

Muslims should be ashamed that their faith and the conduct of their religion is no peaceful. Once they recognize that they will stop the terrorists in the same way that today we stop those who slave people.
------------------------------------
Hey Gringo! shouldn't you feel ashamed that your God fearing, devout born again Christian, twice elected President said that God came in his dream and ordered him to attack Iraq? 1 million Iraqis who'd be alive at this moment lost their lives as a result. Do you even understand the meaning of Shame?

This debate is endlessly framed as one of freedom of religion when it is not. Islam is a religion AND a totalitarian ideology whose teaching are quite clear: kill the infidels (that's us) wherever you find them, spread Islam until it rules the world, and install Sharia law as the law of the land; do so through violence or deceit.

If we only see this as freedom of religion then we are shamed into feeling that we are racist if we are concerned about the "destroy the infidels" ideology at work in Islam today (and for the past 14 centuries).

We should not be ashamed to worry about ideologies that openly and vociferously seek to destroy our civilization. It is not only a right, but also the duty of free people to speak against every ideology that threatens freedom.

LOVE2MUCH SE,

“The Muslim Faith nor the Muslim people did not attack us on September 11, a bunch of radicals who happen to be Muslim did. There are radicals in every religion that we care not own but we can't penalize everyone of that Faith for what some folk did.”

****************************************************

The Muslim Faith did attack us on 9/11. This faith is based on a book that says: Qur'an:8:12 "I shall terrorize the infidels. So wound their bodies and incapacitate them because they oppose Allah and His Apostle." 9:29: "Fight those who do not believe until they all surrender, paying the protective tax in submission."

Hey, supposedly this is the Muslim God who is talking and notice that he/she/it said “until they all surrender”, which has not happened because still there are a bunch of infidels, 5.5 billions as for the last count.

The Muslim people did attack us on 9/11. They did it in a passive way and in a symbolic way. Passively because Muslims in general do not denounce terrorists. In a symbolic way because those who cheered the terrorist act on 9/11 way exceed those who condemned it.

When Muslims give donations and do not find out where and how that money is used, they indirectly are contributing to the radicals that commit atrocities. Imams can and do order to kill those who abandon Islam, why they never order to kill terrorists?

Muslims should be ashamed that their faith and the conduct of their religion is no peaceful. Once they recognize that they will stop the terrorists in the same way that today we stop those who slave people.

What we should not condemn is people that since early age was instructed in that faith. But if as an adult a person converts to follow a religion that believe in "I shall terrorize the infidels” and in fact commit acts that terrorize infidels, do not expect respect for your religion.

@cadam72:

The issue is not condemning the muslims here or elsewhere for 9/11. However, it is also true that the attack on 9/11 was done in the name of Islam, which is inherently a supremacist ideology and strongly advocates dominating and ruthlessly ruling those who do not submit to it.
The issue is why this mosque at Ground Zero? Why not somewhere else? Why build it in the face of opposition of the majority of the people in USA? The reason and answer is simple if you see how Islam expanded and came to dominate in non-muslim societies like early Iran, or India, or Indonesia etc. It is the thin wedge of a psychological win over the Kafirs. It is part and parcel of the silent and stealth jihad. Islam will dominate is the message and it will be delivered one way or another.
Why not build the mosque in the suburbs of New York? Why at Ground Zero? Why when a majority do not want it there? Why not care for the feelings and sentiments of that majority, even if that majority is wrong in your eyes? Why not?

As a New Yorker who was there on 9/11, I welcome the idea of peaceful Muslims expressing their religion; that is the American way. 20 terroritsts flew planes into the centers with the backing of maybe 500 crazy, militant, supporters who hid behind their idea of religion. I will not condemn the 600,000 muslims in NYC, the 7 million in America or the 1.5 billion across the world.

As another new yorker who was their when the towers came down i can only say to you to go to hell.

You are insulting us with your sham religion of peace which kills or brutalizes everything it come into contact with.

No you can not build your house of death on sacred ground. Go build it somewhere else but you can not build it there.And as usual our politicians are on the wrong side of this issue to.

I agree that an "Ecumenical Center for Muslims, Christians, Jews, and Free-Thinkers" might be better, though it sounds similar to what they're proposing.

There's a lot of ignorance in the comments here, though. The people who "denounced the US as Satin" are not Americans. He's with a Muslim-American group, which has nothing to do with al-Qaeda. Very few Muslims are al-Qaeda - that's just ignorant.

"As a retired Christian pastor I witnessed a combination group of Muslim and Christians unloading new chairs into a church several weekends ago. God was smiling on that day. We are all Americans."

I hope that does not mean that as an American, I am not entitled to ask why are Kafirs killed so often and so regularly across the muslim world? I hope in the name of getting along, it does not mean that I can no longer question the absolute horrific evil towards non-muslims in the Laws of Islam? I hope you are not suggesting that in the name of peace that I should ignore that Kaafirs are being brutally killed and their daughters being kidnapped and forcibly converted to Islam in many Islamic countries and all in the name of Islam. Instead of the governments coming to the aid of the suppressed and abused Kaafirs, they choose to look away and censor the news as much as they can.

love2much SE | July 22, 2010 2:55 PM :"The Muslim Faith nor the Muslim people did not attack us on September 11, a bunch of radicals who happen to be Muslim did."

Obviously you know next to nothing of Islam. How knowledgeable of Islam are you really to claim that those who attacked in the name of Islam were "radicals"? If that is the case then tell me how many radicals are there in the 1.5+billion followers of Islam around the world? How many are actively killing and shooting Kafirs around the globe? Why is it "State" policy of Iran, Saudi Arabia, Egypt, Sudan, Yemen, Malaysia, Pakistan, etc. etc. to actively and materially discriminate and mistreat their non-muslim minorities? It is all done in the name of Islam. Are they all radicals? Kafirs are regularly killed, beheaded, displaced, across the Islamic world and it all done in the name of Islam by governments of those countries.
How much do you really know about Islam, Islamic history of imperialism, and the laws of the various islamic countries to label those who attacked in the name of Islam as radicals?

Why don't you talk to some christians from Iraq, or copts from Egypt, or hindus from Pakistan, or other kaafirs from other Islamic lands to find out how who you call non-radicals behave in the name of Islam?

Ok, build your mosque. It's your First Amendment right.

But when the next Faisal Shahzad testifies that he's a Muslim solider or a self-proclaimed Solider of Allah shoots up an army base, a bunch of us are going to desecrate Qurans on the sidewalk in front of your door, because that's our First Amendment right.

I wish some people could understand that the danger to America comes not from the Muslim faith, but from those who forget that we are a tolerant people willing to hold all faith, even those we don't agree with, in respect. The Muslim faith is not responsible for 9/11. People filled with hate and intolerance who worshiped a distortion of the Muslim faith are responsible. If we allow ourselves to be like them, how does that help?

As a retired Christian pastor I witnessed a combination group of Muslim and Christians unloading new chairs into a church several weekends ago. God was smiling on that day. We are all Americans.

Monty Keeling
www.gochurch.info

What good will this serve ? Better to spend the money on educating their " kind " that Christians, Hindus, Buddhists, Ahmadias and other religions should also preach and practice instead of killing them because they are " infidels ".

Who is this author kidding: "American Muslims want to be both good Americans and good Muslims. They can be the best assets the US has in combating extremism. They know that many American values -- freedom of religion, human dignity and opportunity for prosperity -- are Muslim values too." When has this been demonstrated? The leading muslim sects have denounced the US as Satin.

Only a fool would trust muslims and their crazy religion. The US would be better off and safer by deporting them to their native countries. Intolerant? You bet when madpeople want to destroy the US.

DanielintheLionsDen

I think you should read my post, it addresses some of your concerns.My question for you is that why isn't that an excuse for Islam? I mean since when Islam is on trail here? As a non religious, god loving person I can openly tell you that religious as a whole is one of the biggest necessary evils. In one hand it keeps people controlled, but in the other it creates so much division. In this country, not only do you have to believe in god, but also believe in the most popular god (by the way, Allah is just the Arabic word for god, not a different god).
But you see it in the media, when a white man kills someone, it was a an that killed another person, when a Latino or black person does, then is a Latino or black that killed someone.
And to address your other issue, have you ever tried smacking a child around everyday and telling him he is bad and not having him turn out to be bad?
You have to understand that as long as we pointing fingers and accusing people as a whole, then as a whole they will retaliate.

Love2much SE

I do not think that this Islamic Center should be built so close to Ground Zero.

How would not building it penalize people?

Repeating over and over that the people who did this were radicals and that every religion has radicals is not helpful. To me, that is a good argument against religion, in general, not an excuse for Islam.

In Islam, this is not an isolated incident. It happens a lot. Muslims do not want to face the awful truth, but the truth is that nihilistic terrorism is now a feature of modern Islam, and it is up to them to face it, deal with it, and do something to stop it.

This should be a priority at every mosque in the United States, even in the world, to face, analyze, and study this problem, and then to see what can be done about it, rather than to blame the victims for being afraid.

The Muslim Faith nor the Muslim people did not attack us on September 11, a bunch of radicals who happen to be Muslim did. There are radicals in every religion that we care not own but we can't penalize everyone of that Faith for what some folk did.

Are we that ignorant and immature? Come on ADULTS. I agree with who said - this is the country that is free for all, freedom to practice religion, build the Mosque, please. Promote change, tolerance, peace etc. That's the only we heal as One.

All of us suffered and lost loved ones in the 9/11 attacks but we can't take that out on the MUSLIM FAITH!!!

If building a Mosque at Ground Zero bothers you - seek some mental help please. You have hatred for people of a different faith who didn’t do anything to you and that’s not right

That’s like me as a black woman blaming all white people for Slavery – that would not be right now would it.

"What could be a better monument to the victims of 9/11 than a community center whose very presence is an affront to extremists everywhere?"

Exactly, so build a mosque that includes a statue of Jesus, one that includes a statue of Ganesha, one of Krishna, one of Shiva, one of the Buddha, etc. Extremists would hate the juxtaposition within a functioning mosque, and even promote Hindus and christian and buddhists and pagans, et al to worship there. Thusly will you community center be devoted to tolerance. Put action to your words, or, as my skepticism tells me is the real case but my optimism says I am wrong in this, your words are empty.

hariaum

You could save a lot of money by simply renting space IN the new trade center.

Seriously, though, I wish you much success and I hope you do construct it and it fulfills its purpose.

Mr. Rauf, You are not addressing the difficult questions of Islam as a Supremacist racist ideology. Our ears hear Al-Taqiyah in your politically correct soft sell. Where were you when we were waiting for American Muslims' voices against Daniel Pearl's horrific beheading? Where were you when we were waiting for American Muslims' voices against Theo Van Gogh's murder? Now you employ slick PR to establish your victory mosque at the site of our vanquished. It is not you that needs to fear for your life. It is those of us who have come out publicly against your mosque that now need to fear for our lives. I agree that your Cordoba Mosque of moderation is more needed in Saudi Arabia, Iran and Pakistan. We will never forget.

Mr. Rauf

This is your pet project, and I can see that you think it is a good idea, but it is also insenstive and in bad taste.

As a previous commenter suggested, Manhattan doesn't really need lessons in multi-cultrual tolerance; that should be saved for Pakistan, Saudi Arabia, or Iran.

From the looks of some of these posts, I'd say the Cordoba House's staff will have a huge undertaking. I think their mission is spot on. Godspeed and don't let the reactionists nor the fear and hate mongers deter you.

Mr. Feisal Abdul Rauf, who is funding this cirdoba center? The Wahabies of Saudi Arabia? The same place where the 9/11 terrorists came from? Have you released this information truthfully, or what the politicians want to hear? And you want us to believe this mosque will not be another jihadi recruitment and training center. If so, I have a nice bridge in Brooklin that I would donate to your center.

crashinghero, schnauzer2, areyousaying, areyousaying, Dainin, Garak, wpc09 each one of you took words out of my mouth. Each one of you expressed truth and simple logic, something a lot of people are lacking in here.

Is ironic how we claim to be such a free society, yet we hide behind catastrophes to isolate a whole group of people.
SO are we to say that there shouldn't be a christian church next to where a terrorist act was perpetrated by a christian or a Jew?
Does the few racist whites represent all white people as resist?
I think situations like this are suppose to encourages us to dig more into why people do what they do? to learn more about others culture, religion and struggles. Weather we may agree or disagree with something, it does not take away other people's rights.
Let's look at some more logic.
if it was true that all Muslims are evil and most kill, why aren't we being attached by the 1.5 BILLION Muslims in the world? Let me guess, they are bad Muslims!
-Fact check, how many countries have "Muslims" attacked in the last 100 years?
We, the Great loving U.S.A have attacked, invaded, encouraged, supported and manipulated at least 50 wars. But is us, so is ok, because we are "Good people" and we only do "GOOD things for the right reasons"
-Weather you agree or disagree with he invasions of Iraq and Afghanistan, please tell me who is fighting right along side our soldiers against fellow Muslims? Opps sorry, I gave you the answer, yes Muslims.
So what do we call them, "Domesticated Muslims"?
- Why aren't we mad at Netanyahu for saying the U.S is easy to manipulate? or is he just saying the truth? http://www.truthdig.com/eartotheground/item/netanyahu_us_is_easy_391007181/
-Why do we concentrate on the Q'uran, doesn't the bible also talk about killings and evil things?
- What ever happen to the Nice Christian Crusaders, weren't they responsible for the murder and slaughter of 100's of thousands in the name of religion? ooh that was then and this is now, right?
-What is terrorism? What made 911 a terrorist act? Was the murder or the fact that they created terror?
Let's be realistic, the killing was a crime, not a terrorist act, the fear that this act provoked is what made it a terrorist act. (and before anyone thinks of attacking me for this, I also lost loved ones there, so back off).
Now, don't you think that the people in the places we are bombing are not terrorized? Or that word only applies to us?
I can go on and on, but in conclusion, we need to stop trying to feel so offended about so many things, and if want real peace, lets try to learn from others, so we can teach about us. Let's stop putting labels as good or bad on people simply because the president said so, remember the only good people are those that are in our side at the moment. We can't go around slapping people around and not spec to get slapped back.
If we are such a loving and embracing country, lets act like it.

peace

Cordoba is just another version of Political Correctness misdirected. Reason has not prevailed!

Cordoba is just another version of Political Correctness misdirected. Reason has not prevailed!

@alex35332: "site of that terrorist attack by a Christian Militan"

Timothy McVeigh did not attact in the name of Jesus or Christianity. He never said anything about religious motivations in his defense or in his trail or in his last statement. This is unlike the attackers and supporters of the attack on 9/11. Al-Qaeda has always used the word of the Quran as justification for the attack. Atta and his fellow murderers all asserted the supremacy of Islam. The attack was specifically done in the name of Islam. The various beheadings that followed all were done by followers of Muhammad who held up the Quran while yelling Allah hu Akbar for the video camera.
You are a fool if you think that Timothy's act and the attack on USA by Islamic militants is similar in religious motivations. The latest "American" muslim to be put on the terrorist list is Anwar Awlaki, and all his lectures and writings calling for the murder of Americans is based on invoking Islam and its call for the murder of non-muslims. Please educate yourself for your ignorance is likely going to prove to be deadly for americans.

Many Muslims believe that their religion, Islam, is a religion of peace.

But, this Islamic system of belief has developed so inwardly upon itself, that it has strains that are stridently intolerant and at odds with modern, multi-cultural secularism which is overwhelminly dominant in the world today.

In its interactions and absorbtion into modern secular society, Islam has become dislocated, and out of sync with itself, and the world.

Terrorism, suicide bombing, and the nihilistic urge for random violence and destruction have become a sensational and flamboyant feature of modern Islam.

It is part of Islam. Failure to recognize this is just one more symptom of an Islam that is dislocated and broken. Until Muslims can begin to face the awful truth about themselves and about their religion, the problems can never be fixed.

The world exists as it is. Islam needs to adapt and accomadate to the world, or disappear.

I don't really have a problem wit hanything Imam Rauf wrote above. But putting an Islamic center in downtown Manhattan in the name of religious understanding is like building a sandlot in the middle of the Sahara. NYC is already one of the most diverse and tolerant places on earth.

How about spreading some of that tolerance to places like Pakistan or the Middle East? There seem to be a lot of angry Muslims out there harboring some very ill-conceived notions about the US, the West, the Jews, etc. That's where the understanding is lacking.

I just visited the site of the Oklahoma City Bombing memorial. There is both a statue of Jesus and a Church across the street from the site of that terrorist attack by a Christian Militant. All hell hasn't broke lose there. And New Yorkers are a lot thicker skinned and smarter than OKCers.

This mosque is offensive, this imam is a liar and all Americans should view this as a victory for islamic terror. I would like to remind everyone what islam does when it conquers a nation, look at the Temple mount, look at the Hagia Sophia in Turkey. This mosque is a mistake, these people could have put it anywhere. And how about the date they plan on celebrating their victory 9/11/2011. Our leaders are traitors!

Mr. Rauf, I started reading your What's Right with Islam book last night, and came up with an objection to its premise pretty quickly. The book describes, how Islam is compatible with American values because both ultimately derive from the patriarch Abraham's covenant with the monotheistic God. (Even the secularized West is derivative of the Judeo-Christian tradition, among other influences.)

Unfortunately, the central story about Abraham in the Judeo-Christian bible is the way he was willing to sacrifice his son Isaac on God's command because he had faith. God stopped him, of course.

But the central distinction between the religious and secular outlook is whether one puts faith above or below reason and knowledge when the two conflict. Most advanced societies now put faith in second place. Probably most Muslims do, too.

But the frequency with which Muslims do things like shoot up Army bases, beat girls back into burning buildings, and attempt to blow up Times square, show that too many of them have not put faith into its proper (second) place.

Ugh... All this religious high mindedness leaves a bad taste in my mouth. Christians, Jews, Muslims... who cares. They all murder, they all wage war. The Nazis were Christian - do you oppose the building of churches in Poland?

Frankly, all religions are about finding peace. Finding peace with yourself, with your fate, with your suffering. A Christian child who suffers can be just as easily brainwashed into believing that there is a purpose in killing just as easily as a Muslim child.

It doesn't make a damn bit of difference what religion you are, or the terrorists are. I take the Imam at his word that this community center will be a place for compassion and communal understanding, and, as such (even though it is affiliated with various religions), it seems like a good idea to me.

Posted by: DoTheRightThing "The center's promoters refuse to have a place for non-Muslims (Christians, Jews, etc.) to pray. That in itself is offensive."
-----------------------------------------
Does your church have an area for Muslims to pray? Does the Jewish community center? Besides all the promoters of this place have said it will be open to all people of all faiths to gather in peace? Where do you get this refusal you speak of? People of all faiths (including muslims) died on 9/11. You dishonor their memories by being bigotted. If all the places where christian purpetrated atrocities in the name of their religion suddenly decide to close all churches, you would probably have an issue with that, am I right?

All religions have been used for evil and violence, but you chose to see eveil only where it suits you.

Moses, Jesus and Mohammad,

Please protect us from your followers.

Amen

More proof Abraham never taught his over aggressive children to play well.

Christians and Jews want to bully their will over the First Amendment.

By this logic, Catholics should never be allowed to build their churches near middle schools.

We know that Muslims did not commit the crimes of 9/11. We know this because Muslims do not kill innocents, and therefore, by definition, do not commit acts of terrorism.

We also know that neither Jews nor Christians committed the crimes of 9/11. This is because the ten commandments includes "thou shalt not murder", and the Talmud says that lying is the worse form of theft, the theft of ideas.

What we can say today, with certainty, is that if we are to believe that al Qaeda orchestrated the events of 9/11 then we do not know much about al Qaeda.

There is, however, another system that continues to profit from the 9/11 attacks and that uses the fear and rage generated by al Qaeda-attributed terrorism to its own advantage. Understanding and destroying terrorism might simply be a matter of understanding and destroying the organizations that continue to profit from 9/11.

The center's promoters refuse to have a place for non-Muslims (Christians, Jews, etc.) to pray. That in itself is offensive.

@newyoirker74: why did Jews celebrate when Israel attacked the USS Liberty? Why did Jews celebrate when Israel bombed Gazauschwitz into the stone age? Why did Jews cheer when the Zionists used mass terror to ethnically cleanse Palestine? Why do Jews alway, alway, always, ALWAYS ask of anything, but is it good for the Jews?

How many synagogues condemned the attack on the USS Liberty? How many synagogues condemn Israeli theft of Palestinian land? How many synagogues condemn the bombing of Gazauschwitz? How many synagogues condemn the continued ethnic cleansing of Palestine? How many synagogues condemned the murder of Rachel Corrie? How many synagogues condemn Israel selling top-secret US military technology to Communist China? How many synagogues condemn Israel's traitor-spy Jonathan Pollard? How many synagogues condemn the massacres of 2000+ innocent civilians at the Sabra and Chatilla refugee camps? How many synagogues condemn the election of self-professed terrorists like Menachem Begin to the office of Prime Minister of Israel? How many synagogues condemn Israel's attempt to sell nuclear weapons technology to the apartheid South African regime? How many synagogues condemn the past and continuing ethnic cleansing of Palestine by Israel?

How many?

At the root of this opposition to mosques is the fear that Islam might just not be the religion of peace that our misguided political leaders say it is or that Islamic spokesmen from the Moslem advocacy organizations say it is. There is a fear that Islam is not just another religion like Christianity or Buddhism or whatever. These fears are well-founded, but because of general ignorance of the doctrines of Islam, people can't be sure. In fact, Islam is NOT a religion like other religions; and Islamic scholars are the first ones to say so. For example, Yusuf Qaradawi (the most influential Muslim cleric in the world today, the spiritual head of the Muslim Brotherhood) said: "Islam is not a religion in the common, distorted meaning of the word, confining its scope only to the private life of man. By saying that it is a complete way of life, we mean that it caters for all the fields of human existence. In fact, Islam provides guidance for all walks of life — individual and social, material and moral, economic and political, legal and cultural, national and international." This "complete way of life" is the Sharia sacred Islamic law which calls for the legal subordination of non-Moslems to Moslems and of women to men; it requires death for homosexuals, apostates and blasphemers. And, it calls for eternal war (jihad) against non-Moslems until Islamic law dominates throughout the world. These doctrines all come from the Koran and the sayings of Muhammad which are preached and taught in every mosque in the world, and will be taught in the proposed mosques. People questioning the new mosques need to understand why Islam is unique and not like other religions. Then they would know that mosques are not like churches because mosques are centers for the propagation of sharia law. If Islam is not like other religions, it should not be treated like other religions. If mosques are not like churches and other houses of prayer, then mosques should not be treated like other houses of prayer. Mosques are centers for the propagation of Islamic supremacist ideology, and they should be treated like other centers for the propagation of supremacist, violent and imperialist ideology, such as the Communist Party or the Nazi Party.

The Holocaust WAS NOT committed in the name of Christianity, but the world objected when a group of Catholic nuns, four decades after the end of the Holocaust, decided to place their convent near the gates of Auschwitz so as to pray in reparation for the evils committed at that place.

The events of 9/11 WERE committed in the name of Islam, so why should the placing of a mosque in a building that is part of the 9/11 site (it was damaged by the landing gear from one of the planes as it crashed through the roof and through to the ground floor) be seen as somehow less objectionable less than a decade after the attack on our nation?

Do you expect Faisal Shahzad would have acted differently if your ICC had been built?

Dear Feisal Rauf,

Good Morning,

You say *Center(Gladness Mosque) an attempt to prevent the next 9/11*
What kind of Word this is ?
-Does it mean *if you dont permit Gladness Mosque near Ground Zero,will next and new 9/11 occur*
-9/11 occured because there was not Mosque near World Trade Center
-If you build Gladness Mosque,will it be Guarantee to prevent next 9/11
-9/11 conducted by 20 Saudi Muslims,not American Muslims,How can Gladness Mosque stop World Muslim Terrorists
-(very important,pls,pay attention)Many Muslim Panelists and Apologist Posters,over and over again,wrote that 9/11 Terrorists are not Muslims.If their assertion is correct,if 9/11 terrorists are not muslims,Who Cares Gladness Mosque ?
-The name of your community is very interesting.Cordoba.It's the name of a city in Spain under Bedouin Invasion.What do you mean ? Do you want/wish Bedouin Invasion in New York/Manhattan.Right Name should be West Broadway Community.Cordoba is a city of Invasion and Omayyad Looting.
Do you intend to change Cordoba name ?

And another important point(many panelists and posters are writing over and over again):Freedom of Religion/Cult
It's a Round Concept.
Unlimited and Endless Freedom of Religion can not be thought and advocated.They will do eveything in the name of religion/cult and nobody will intervene,namely one will take Four Women and State will not do anything.This is not possible and right.
Nobody can torture to anybody,nobody can debase women.Hundred percent of Freedom of Religion(especially those are not yet reformed and deflawed) is Wrong Concept and not Contemporary Value.
Freedom of Religion,Faith-Based Order,Burqa is my choice,Sisters-Brothers Deal such as Yale Madrassa did,Special Law for Muslim Community,etc.are Trap Words and Applications.

"my fellow Americans who mistakenly believe that (1) all violence is committed by Muslims; (2) that all Muslims are the same; (3) and that the Qur'an preaches hatred and violence."

1) is false. Americans do not believe that ALL violence is committed by muslims.
2) is false. Americans do not believe that ALL Muslims are the same.
3) is True. Quran does preach hatred and violence.

You may want to educate yourself on the history of the Sufi Islam. There have been many Ghazis among the sufis and they have shed much blood of the Kafirs. You apparently do not know either the Quran or the history and the nature of Sufi Islam.

"It is an error to believe that "Let there be no compulsion in religion" has been abrogated anywhere in the Qur'an."

Then why do all the fiqh agree upon that an apostate should be put to death?

Maududi, a well known scholar of Islam says:
'"There is no compulsion in religion" (la ikraha fi'd din: Qur'an [Qur'an 2:256]) means that we do not compel anyone to come into our religion. And this is truly our practice. But we initially warn whoever would come and go back that this door is not open to come and go. Therefore anyone who comes should decide before coming that there is no going back.'

He also states:
" If Islam is truly a "religion" in the sense that religion is understood at present, surely it would be absurd to prescribe the penalty of execution for those people who wish to leave it because of their dissatisfaction with its principles. It is not only a "religion" in the modern technical sense of that term but a complete order of life. It relates not only to the metaphysical but also to nature and everything in nature. It discourses not only on the salvation of life after death but also on the questions of prosperity, improvement and the true ordering of life before death.
...
Whatever objections the critics pose regarding the punishment of the apostate, they make them bearing in mind only a single "religion" (madhhab). In contrast, when we present our arguments to demonstrate the validity of this punishment, we have in view no mere "religion" but a state which is constructed on a religion (din) and the authority of its principles rather than on the authority of a family, clan or people.
...
In any case the heart of the matter is that children born of Muslim lineage will be considered Muslims and according to Islamic law the door of apostasy will never be opened to them. If anyone of them renounces Islam, he will be as deserving of execution as the person who has renounced kufr to become a Muslim and again has chosen the way of kufr. All the jurists of Islam agree with this decision. On this topic absolutely no difference exists among the experts of shari'ah.
....
It is also wrong to interpret "the execution of the apostate" as our forcing a person, by threatening him with death, to adopt a hypocritical behaviour. In fact the matter is the opposite. We want to block entrance into our society of those people who are afflicted with the disease of capriciousness and keep on playing musical chairs with theories and ideas for their own amusement, and who lack totally the stability of belief and character which the building of an order of life requires. Constructing an order of life is a highly serious task. In the society which takes on this task, there can be no place for fickle and unstable people."

When will Feisal Abdul Rauf unequivocally distinguish himself from Mahathir Mohamad?
During the 6/06/10 interview with Aaron Klein, Feisal Abdul Rauf flared up, called his association with Perdana an “absolute lie“.

Feisal Abdul Rauf said his involvement with Perdana was limited to a one time lecture.

As anyone can see, that is not true. Feisal Abdul Rauf also signed a petition with Mahathir to “criminalize war”.
http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=1594

Why was it necessary to call a perfectly reasonable question an “absolute lie”?

Why was Feisal Abdul Rauf in a group with Francis Boyle, who is currently advising Native American Indians, and Hawaiians how to secede from the Union using the Palestinians as a role model.?

Why was Feisal Abdul Rauf featured on the Perdana website as a “role player”/”contributor” for nearly 5 years? Don’t we deserve some kind of an explanation for that?

Has Feisal Abdul Rauf told Perdana about the “absolute lie”? Because it is still there. Nothing has changed.
http://www.perdana4peace.org/agenda.aspx?x=3

Does Feisal Abdul Rauf still believe in the Perdana petition, or did something change? Or would that it be an “absolute lie” to ask such a question?

Mahathir doesn’t believe 911 was committed by Muslims, and neither does Feisal Abdul Rauf. He has said as much in his public statements, and in his writings.

Feisal Abdul Rauf what is your relationship with Mahathir Mohamad, with the other signatories of the KUALA LUMPUR INITIATIVE TO CRIMINALISE WAR, and why did you tell Aaron Klein your involvement with Perdana was “an absolute lie” ?

WPC who claims to be a Bahai asserts:
“It is an error to believe that "Let there be no compulsion in religion" has been abrogated anywhere in the Qur'an. What polemical politicizers inside or outside Islam may say doesn't make it true. Nowhere in the Qur'an is there a command to convert people of the Book by force.”

Qur'an:9:29 "Fight those who do not believe from among the people of the Book until
They all surrender, paying the protective tax in humiliation and submission.”
Qur'an:8:39 "Fight them until all opposition ends and all submit to Allah."
Qur'an:8:39 "So fight them until there is no more Fitnah (disbelief [non-Muslims]) and all submit to the religion of Allah alone (in the whole world)."

Qur'an:9:5 "Fight and kill the disbelievers wherever you find them, take them captive, harass them, lie in wait and ambush them using every stratagem of war."

There are plenty other similar jewels in the Quran.
http://prophetofdoom.net/Islamic_Quotes.Islam

"I agree we are not a christian nation, but currently the overwhelming number of terrorist attacks in this nation and around the world for the last 60 years have been and continue to be carried out by muslims. That is an undenyable fact. I only now hear about moderate muslims now that they want to build a mosque, that happens to be attached to a "community center". The Mosque will be the entire top two floors and overlook the mass grave that only exists due to islam. I suspect they wanted to build a mosque first and realized that alone would never fly so then they decided to attach a community center by default to cushion the blow. The majority of people who use this center will be muslim, of that I have no doubt."

Wake up and smell the coffee. Muslims did not evade the air defenses of the USA and totally demolish THREE skyscrapers. Muslims don't completely control the US media. Who in this world hates Muslims more than any group on the planet? Bingo.

Hey Feisal.

I'll make you a deal. You can build the Mosque on ground zero right after Saudi Arabia lets the Pope build a Cathedral next to Mecca in Saudi Arabia.

Or invite a Rabbi to address your Muslim followers in a mosque.

Until then, we can smell the hypocrisy a mile a way and it stinks to high heaven.

I must apologize for the rudeness, name-calling and ignorance expressed here by my fellow Americans who mistakenly believe that (1) all violence is committed by Muslims; (2) that all Muslims are the same; (3) and that the Qur'an preaches hatred and violence.

It is an error to believe that "Let there be no compulsion in religion" has been abrogated anywhere in the Qur'an. What polemical politicizers inside or outside Islam may say doesn't make it true. Nowhere in the Qur'an is there a command to convert people of the Book by force. Commands relating to battle are specifically directed against those who engaged in aggression against the Muslim community, and most specifically the pagan Meccans who were merciless in their outrages against Muslim believers. Yet even the Prophet Himself was generous to the pagans when He conquered Mecca.

While there have been distortions in the Islamic community as there have been distortions in other religions at various times, if you are ignorant of the cosmopolitan civilization of al Andalus, Baghdad and Cairo in the 9th-12th centuries, you only appear laughable and ill-informed when you say that Islam is barbaric and never had civilization. I would much rather have lived in Islamic Spain than in medieval Christian Europe.

Faisal Abdul Raouf represents Sufi Islam, which is essentially mystical and spiritually open by nature. His is not the fanaticism of radical fundamentalist Sunni or Wahhabi Islam with their puritanical and unbalanced literalism. The center proposed is a cultural center, which includes a space for worship, just as a Jewish or Christian community center may include a synagogue, chapel or prayer room.

Lest anyone think me a Muslim or a naif, note that I am a member of the Baha'i Faith, which is persecuted in some parts of the world, including some majority Muslim countries. But I also believe that Muhammad did come from God for a specific purpose and specific spiritual and social development of humankind.

I know that Jews, Christians, Muslims, Hindus and others were murdered on 9/11. A few people who claimed to be Muslims (but did not act like true Muslims and did not represent the Islamic community) performed an evil deed. Is this a reason for us to start acting in the manner we say we loathe? Let a thousand spiritual centers flourish near to and far from the site of the World Trade Center.

I pray that the one true God - Who revealed Himself in the burning bush to Moses, in the sign of the dove to Jesus, in the angel Gabriel to Muhammad, and in the Maid of Heaven to Baha'u'llah - will shed light into the hearts of all and banish the darksome night of ignorant prejudice.

Imam,
Why not listen to your neighbors? A majority of your neighbors do not want your mosque there. You can build it a few miles away? Despite Raza's dissimulation about is five more blocks enough, you are putting the emphasis on it being part of ground zero. Why not care for the feelings of those neighbors? All you want to achieve will still be attainable with your mosque in a suburb of New York. Why insist it has to be there
Now did you receive a $1 million dollars from the Government of Netherlands as claimed by Geert Wilders? How much have you received from the Saudis? Why not be transparent about your source of funds? Why don't you put the list of your donors on the web? What is the total amount of funds have you received from the middle east over the last decade since you have been the Imam in the same location? Why not tell your neighbors those sources and that may go a long way in allaying some of their fears?

If you really want to address the extremists then build your centers in Riyadh, or Tehran, or Islamabad or Cairo and have in that center a church, a temple, a mandir, a gurudawara, so you can show that moderate muslims like yourself really and truely believe in interfaith peace, respect and dialog.

Kaba in Mecca was a hindu temple. Mohammed defiled it and then usurped it.

Mr. Rouf, you are threating another Sep 11, if mosque is not built and prevent Sep 11, if mosque built. You Muslim thugs took our Hindu temple, broke the idols with axe and converted the temple to mosque. Your Islam is a parasite virus. Reconvert to your forefathers religion if you want to avoid burning in hell.

Islam is about victory, what more glory for Islam than to have stinking mosque at ground zero? First you draw attention to yourselves by a spectacular terrorist activity, then you pull the sympathy card, then you build a mosque. Mosques are a zits, visit any muslim country and you'll be reminded of Islam, every corner has a mosque and 5 times a day you hear the mullah doing the filthy Azana. The allah hu akbar noise is defining. Building a mosque in a city is like inviting the worst pest/parasite to your neighbourhood. No mosque, stop the spread of this ugly structure and the baggage it brings with it.

" This center is an attempt to prevent the next 9/11. Friends like Rabbi Burton L. Visotzky see the opposition for what it is: opportunistic rabble-rousing by a few politicians and some sensationalist media who in fact deny the basic decency of the American people. "
CHAIRMAN OF THE CORDOBA INITIATIVE Feisal Abdul Rauf is Chairman of the Cordoba Initiative and author of " What's Right With Islam Is What's Right With America."

With the greatest sorrow which rends my heart, I feel with great shame, I must inform you Imam Feisal Abdul Rauf, with the greatest everlasting respect to yourself and Rabbi Burton L. Visotzky, that being turned in to soap to facilitate Isalamonazis and Islamofascists, is something which has limited attractiveness for many Jewish people. Please accept my humble, profound and sincere apologies to your goodself and Rabbi Burton L. Visotzky for this wholly unconscionable, unreasonable and frankly disgracefully selfish attitude on the part of some though obviously not all Jewish people, of not wishing to be turned in to soap.

please check out http://www.islamicsolutions.com/do-they-even-know-what-islam-is/

So, where's the money coming from, Imam Rauf? If you're as open to dialogue as you claim, and if you have nothing to hide, then disclosing the source of your mosque's funding would seem to be the least you could do to reassure New Yorkers that your motives are pure. I'm curious why you haven't done this yet.

And I also have another question. What did you mean when you said the the US Constitution is "sharia compliant"? Do you consider that set of cruel and barbaric religious laws as higher or more holy than this nation's constitution? I think you should answer these questions, because your continued silence on them itself speaks volumes.

Mr. Rauf, I am not going to say you should not erect your center. But you must have expected the reaction and would have been prudent to have chosen another site. The work that you claim, can still be done from another location. In fact the work you propose to do that is educate the about true Islam. But sir, the people who are creating the mayhem in name of Islam are the ones who need to be educated first. They are not here in Manhattan. They are in the streets of Pakistan, Saudi Arabia and all the other islamic paradises/ Wouldn't job be better done if you built the center in those countries?

What befuddles us is you are lot more bent on educating us about the so called true islam than you are in educating your ilk. I know why you don't do it there, you would have your heads handed to you on a platter if you did that there. Go build your center, but don't give us the non-sense.

"Religion did not distinguish the victims."
Perhaps not, but one religion certainly distinguished the perpetrators and one religion inspired and motivated them: Islam. While Mr. Rauf should have just as much of a right to purchase property and use it for any lawful purpose, it doesn't mean that it shows good judgment or sensitivity to do as one wills, regardless of consequences, just because the law allows it.

"What could be a better monument to the victims of 9/11 than a community center whose very presence is an affront to extremists everywhere?" A better monument would be one that honestly depicted what happened and who did it. This would entail a serious and critical look at the Muslims who committed this act, as well as a critical look at the texts that inspired them and, in their minds, both justified and encouraged them to commit acts of terrorism: the Quran, the hadith, and the biography of Islam's prophet.

I think Rauf and his organization should be allowed to put up their monument to whatever it is they want to memorialize, just as I think everyone, no matter how much I oppose their beliefs, should be allowed to have their meetings or buildings so long as they obey the law. It is interesting to note that the initiative is named after Cordoba, a city in Spain conquered and ruled by Muslims where, despite what today's Muslim apologists and historical revisionists want to claim, non-Muslims were subjugated and relegated to inferior status. Cordoba harkens back to a time of Muslim political dominance and power over the West. I find the reference both revealing and, as a non-Muslim, disturbing.

I am not a New Yorker and, as such, have no standing on this, however I can say that proposing to put a monument that legitimizes the religion whose texts were responsible for 9/11 near the spot where the planes struck shows extremely poor taste and a lack of sensitivity to the feelings of so many people. If you really want to set up a community center to combat "misinterpretation of Islam" and "extremism", you should put it where the misinterpreters and extremists are (Mecca, Tehran, Cairo, Damascus, Amman, Gaza, Algiers, Darfur, Mumbai, Jakarta, Kuala Lumpur, Baghdad, Kabul, Chechnya, etc). You don't need to convince non-Muslims that Islam forbids terrorism; you need to convince millions of your fellow Muslims, and they aren't in New York.

“They know that many American values -- freedom of religion, human dignity and opportunity for prosperity -- are Muslim values too.”

When has freedom of religion become a Muslim value? The often quoted verse “No compulsion in religion” was written during the early part of the Muslim prophet’s ministry but was later abrogated (cancelled) by many later verses that incite for the outright killings of the infidels. As for the “People of the Book”; Christians and Jews, they were to be humiliated and discriminated against in their own lands and further coerced to abandon their religions and embrace Islam by imposing on them Jizya; exorbitant personal and property taxes.
Consult Quran 9:29 and Omar Pact linked below
http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/source/pact-umar.html

52% of people in Manhattan are against this and liberals outnumber conservatives 4 to 1 in NYC so don't pint the opposition as only a far right wing fringe group of people. The people of NYC are against this and find it insulting. plain and simple. When we can build churches and synagogs in Mecca then I think it fair to allow you to build your Ground Zero mosque.

A New Yorker who was here on 9/11!

1) The whole area to some degree is a landmark as even at 45 park place the landing gear from one of the jets that hit the tower crashed through the roof of the building they want to tear down.

2) It's hard to forgive a religion while the war is still going on and terrorist acts are still being commited and attempted. We didn't forgive Germany while the war was still going on....

3) I know I'm gonna catch hell for this....as far as I'm concerned the muslims that died on 9/11 were victims of their own religion and guilty of allowing extremism to flourish so greatly within it. It infuriates me when muslims are painted as the victims of 9/11. They were the perpetraitors of the crime far more than the victims. Most who died that day were non muslim Americans which was the goal of the attack.

4) I agree we are not a christian nation, but currently the overwhelming number of terrorist attacks in this nation and around the world for the last 60 years have been and continue to be carried out by muslims. That is an undenyable fact. I only now hear about moderate muslims now that they want to build a mosque, that happens to be attached to a "community center". The Mosque will be the entire top two floors and overlook the mass grave that only exists due to islam. I suspect they wanted to build a mosque first and realized that alone would never fly so then they decided to attach a community center by default to cushion the blow. The majority of people who use this center will be muslim, of that I have no doubt.

Also not one week and sometime not one day passes without a terrorist act being carried out by muslims. I wish they would go to "their" countries of origin and preach "Moderate islam" there. It isn't a small minority as they claim. Why was there cheering on the streets in gaza on 9/11. Why did the recently released Lockerbie bomber receive a hero's welcome home in Libya. Ten were killed today by a bombing in Bagdad. Yesterday 14 were killed by a bombing in Pakistan. It wasn't christinians, jews, hindus, buddhists or pagans who did it. All muslims. They can receive equal treatment when they behave equally civilized.

That's all for now. Now call me a bigot and a racist or as I see it a street smart realist.

Why not make it an Ecumenical Center for Muslims, Christians, Jews, and Free-Thinkers? That kind of center would have a little more credibility.