Not Standing By His Man

The Question: How should Barack Obama have responded to inflammatory remarks made by his former pastor, Dr. Jeremiah Wright? Are you responsible for what your spiritual leader says from the pulpit?

Certainly Barack Obama, or anyone else, is not “responsible” for what one’s spiritual leader says from the pulpit. However, as the forthcoming book by Gregory Smith, "Politics in the Parish: The Political Influence of Catholic Priests" (April 15, 2008 Georgetown University Press) indicates, people in the pews are influenced in their political thinking by what is said from the pulpit. In Senator Obama’s case, it is hard to believe that he did not know what was being preached, even if he did not agree with the views expressed. How could he not know when the pastor has been preaching for thirty-six years in the church Obama has attended for twenty years? As a public servant Obama should have distanced himself long ago from views of his pastor that he clearly does not share, but likely never anticipated the current uproar.

Pastors must also take responsibility for influencing their congregations. Politics and religion make a volatile, but sometimes unavoidable mix. The gospel calls people to account spiritually, morally, and politically. Jesus didn’t mince words and no doubt angered many with his positions that sided with the poor and the marginalized. So politics should not be kept out of the pulpit entirely. However, divisive rhetoric of separation and inflammatory views that condemn the positions and actions of white Americans by proffering erroneous arguments contradicts the gospel of reconciliation.

The privilege of the pulpit provides power to pastors since the Sunday morning congregation is, in many ways, a captive audience. Encouraging congregants to think carefully about an issue is one thing; telling them what to think is another. Church bodies hold moral positions on a range of issues from abortion to same-sex marriage—each of which the church considers a moral concern. However, the press usually describes these as “social” issues since they affect society. They are, of course, both. The church has a right, indeed an obligation, to weigh in on moral issues. It cannot, however, insist that society as a whole follow its position and often must work even to convince its own constituents. Christian churches and congregations disagree with one another on many of these issues, with some supporting and others opposing gay rights for example. What is problematic about Reverend Wright’s (segments of) sermons, (granting that they are taken out of context) is that he is not being prophetic but inflammatory, making claims that are not the case. He either knows that they are false and he doesn’t care, or he doesn’t know they are false and he is terribly misinformed, if not deluded. Either way, Obama cannot stand behind him on these and, prudently, he has not.

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Dear Professor Gillis

Wishing you a wonderful Easter 2008!

Soja John Thaikattil
Sydney, Australia

Posted by: Soja John Thaikattil, Sydney, Australia | March 22, 2008 5:13 AM
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Show and tell,

You noted: "Concerned, you need to remove the word "fictional" from, "pretty wingy talking flying fictional thingie" or prove it's so."

Was Moses a liar?" No, he was a myth, at least according to 1.5 million Conservative Jews, their rabbis and the lack of archeological evidence that there were ever thousands of Jews in Egypt and that they wandered around the desert for 40 years without leaving a trace of evidence.

"Was Muhammad a liar?" Yes, and also a warmongering, illiterate, hallucinating, greed and lust driven, womanizing Arab.

Was Joseph Smith a liar? Yes of course and a con man extraordinaire!!!!

A little history about "pretty/ugly wingie, flying, talking, fictional thingies":

It is all about the founders of the major religions and their favorite "tinkerbell(s)" aka angel.

Joe Smith had his Moroni.

Jehovah Witnesses have their Jesus /Michael the archangel, the first angelic being created by God;

Mohammed had his Gabriel (this "tinkerbell" got around).

Jesus and his family had Michael, Gabriel, and Satan, the latter being a modern day demon of the demented.

The Abraham-Moses myths had their Angel of Death and other "no-namers" to do their dirty work or other assorted duties.

Contemporary biblical and religious scholars (e.g. Professors Crossan, Borg, and Fredriksen, all on the On Faith panel) have relegated these "pretty/ugly wingie thingies" to the myth pile. We should do the same to include deleting all references to them in our religious operating manuals. Doing this will eliminate the prophet/profit/prophecy status of these founders and put them where they belong as simple humans just like the rest of us.

Some added references to "tinker bells".

"Latter-day Saints also believe that Michael the Archangel was Adam (the first man) when he was mortal, and Gabriel lived on the earth as Noah."

Apparently hallucinations did not stop with Joe Smith.

http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/07049c.htm
"This belief in guardian angels can be traced throughout all antiquity; pagans, like Menander and Plutarch (cf. Euseb., "Praep. Evang.", xii), and Neo-Platonists, like Plotinus, held it. It was also the belief of the Babylonians and Assyrians, as their monuments testify, for a figure of a guardian angel now in the British Museum once decorated an Assyrian palace, and might well serve for a modern representation; while Nabopolassar, father of Nebuchadnezzar the Great, says: "He (Marduk) sent a tutelary deity (cherub) of grace to go at my side; in everything that I did, he made my work to succeed."

Catholic monks and Dark Age theologians also did their share of hallucinating:

"TUBUAS-A member of the group of angels who were removed from the ranks of officially recognized celestial hierarchy in 745 by a council in Rome under Pope Zachary. He was joined by Uriel, Adimus, Sabaoth, Simiel, and Raguel."

And tinker bells go way, way back:

"In Zoroastrianism there are different angel like creatures. For example each person has a guardian angel caled Fravashi. They patronize human being and other creatures and also manifest god’s energy. Also, the Amesha Spentas have often been regarded as angels, but they don't convey messages, but are rather emanations of Ahura Mazda ("Wise Lord", God); they appear in an abstract fashion in the religious thought of Zarathustra and then later (during the Achaemenid period of Zoroastrianism) became personalized, associated with an aspect of the divine creation (fire, plants, water...)."

"The beginnings of the biblical belief in angels must be sought in very early folklore. The gods of the Hittites and Canaanites had their supernatural messengers, and parallels to the Old Testament stories of angels are found in Near Eastern literature. "

"The 'Magic Papyri' contain many spells to secure just such help and protection of angels. From magic traditions arose the concept of the guardian angel. "

For added information see the review at:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Angel

Posted by: Concerned The Christian Now Liberated | March 19, 2008 5:38 PM
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Blacks as awhole who are church goers have been in the same church's all their life. In the black community it is discouraged for members to change church's.

In my church organization their have been many people who have disagreed with their pastors and these same people started their own church's under my church organization which is the Church of God in Christ, INC.

Pastors are there to lead people who are willing to be lead. People who think so goes the pastor so goes the members, people who think this way or ignorant.

I can say that everybody in the USA who supported Bush and now they disagree with him, these should just leave this country. In the eyes of the world any american thats abroad are automatically thought of in the same rhederic that they think of the President.

Have forgot how many americans were targeted and killed because they were americans and Bush lated ordered all americans abroad should return home. It did not matter what these innocent people's political beliefs were but, it was because they were a citizen of the USA.

Posted by: Curtis | March 19, 2008 4:22 PM
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Concerned, you need to remove the word "fictional" from, "pretty wingy talking flying fictional thingie" or prove it's so.

Was Moses a liar?
Was Muhammad a liar?
Was Joseph Smith a liar?

Which one was telling the truth?

Posted by: show and tell | March 19, 2008 3:06 PM
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Leave Ratzinger Alone!,

I wish we could leave him alone but the man and his former colleages have been promulgating many a myth, embellishment and lie for the last 2000 years. The first myth is that the male-controlled Catholic Church has some kind of control over how a husband and wife want to plan their family.

Some of the other flaws and errors in Christianity that B16 needs to address asap:

1. Abraham founder/father of three major religions was either the embellishment of the lives of three different men or a mythical character as was Moses, the "Tablet-Man" who talked to burning bushes and made much magic in Egypt.

1.5 million Conservative Jews and their rabbis have relegated Abraham to the myth pile along with most if not all the OT. http://www.simpletoremember.com/vitals/ConservativeTorah.htm

2. Jesus, the illiterate Jewish peasant/carpenter suffering from hallucinations if you believe the "pretty/ugly wingie thingie" stories written by his biographers. He has also been characterized anywhere from the Messiah from Nazareth to a mythical character from mythical Nazareth to a mamzer from Nazareth (Professor Bruce Chilton, in his book Rabbi Jesus). Analyses of Jesus’ life by many contemporary NT scholars (e.g. Professors Crossan, Borg and Fredriksen, On Faith panelists) via the NT and related documents have concluded that only about 30% of Jesus' sayings and ways noted in the NT were authentic. The rest being embellishments (e.g. miracles)/hallucinations made/had by the NT authors to impress various Christian, Jewish and Pagan sects.

The 30% of the NT that is "authentic Jesus" like everything in life was borrowed/plagiarized and/or improved from those who came before. In Jesus' case, it was the ways and sayings of the Babylonians, Greeks, Persians, Egyptians, Hittites, Canaanites, OT, John the Baptizer and possibly the ways and sayings of traveling Greek Cynics. http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/theories.html

For added "pizzazz", Catholic/Christian theologians divided god the singularity into three persons and invented atonement as an added guilt trip for the "pew people" to go along with this trinity of overseers. By doing so, they made god the padre into god the "filicider".

3. Luther, Calvin, Joe Smith, Henry VIII, Wesley et al, founders of Christian-based religions, also suffered from the belief in/hallucinations of "pretty wingy talking flying fictional thingie" visits and "prophecies" for profits analogous to the myths of Catholicism (resurrections, apparitions, ascensions and immaculate conceptions).

Posted by: Concerned The Christian Now Liberated | March 19, 2008 2:26 PM
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I truly believe that this Wright issue is intended to disqualify Sen. Obama. Bush and most Republicans have embraced obnoxious white church ministers themselves and nothing resulted from the bigoted pronouncements of those white ministers. I am an immigrant and I am truly appalled at how Americans are reacting to Rev. Wright's comments some of which are true. Sen. Obama is being punished for associating with Wright who by the way served America fighting as a Marine whereas Bush and Cheney did not. Why pillory Wright. He has the right to criticize the bigotry and oppression, the hypocrisy. Bush was never ever pilloried for his lack of care and concern for the American people, for his lies and deception.

Posted by: M. Stratas | March 19, 2008 2:12 PM
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You said it all in your first paragraph. I'm left to wonder if you understand what you said. Obama has no choice but to listen and remain silent only to speak when it's him personally or run away form it. That's due to the "religion test" for candidates for all public offices.

It's a power struggle between church and state that's as old as witch doctors taking charge of the village. Maybe the Reverend feels like he's not getting all the respect he deserves?

http://www.hoax-buster.org/sellyoursoul sums up all the respect anyone of faith deserves. Obama is a victim in too many ways to be explained but at least we can get a better than average idea about who's fault it is. The one behind it all is a Devil named Lucifer that has been around since the first witch doctor told the first lie, preached the first sermon to prehistoric peanut brained dummies.

God is the highest office there is held by the high priest who has the keys to heaven. The question is not who's right but who shall run the kingdom of God, earth. Will that be God or will that be one subservient to God?

But of course, Roman Catholics know the pope has the keys to heaven's gate for they're on his flag. Jack-legged preachers are horning in on the pope's business which leads to the most significant question of all time. Was ecumenical really a good idea?

Ask Obama. Before ecumenical that preacher may well have been ignored? Faith is faith alright but in what? Is that God or those who claim to represent God? I do believe faith in this representative of God has led a candidate for the second highest office, (God is the highest office) on earth to hell.

Posted by: BGone | March 19, 2008 1:10 PM
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JJ, your fingers are typing, but nothing coherent's coming out again. May want to see about that.

Anyway, I think Senator Obama has certainly shown in words and actions that he isn't aligned with any extremist talk from his preacher. I haven't caught his speech on the matter yet, but my understanding is he dealt exhaustively with the subject matter in question.

Posted by: Paganplace | March 19, 2008 12:02 PM
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Posted by: Anonymous | March 18, 2008 11:22 PM
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Jovez you got booted for just that sort of thing. All you're doing now is guaranteeing that no one will ever let you come back.

Posted by: garyd | March 18, 2008 8:20 PM
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As a Catholic, I stand by Ratzinger's view that using contraception is worse than people dying of AIDS.

For women, especially African women, its better to die of HIV related diseases than use contraception.

I stand by the views of my church!

Posted by: Leave Ratzinger Alone! | March 18, 2008 8:05 PM
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Chester Gillis

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