Bible Promises Life After Death; Condemns Channeling Spirits

IF WE ARE TRUE BELIEVER OF CHRIST JESUS WE SHOULD UNDERSTAND THAT PRAYING IS NOT TALKING WITH THE DEAD FOR IN ALL CHRISTIAN RELIGIOUS BELIEVES IS THE SAYING JESUS LIVES..... N IF HE RESURECTED THEN HE FOR SURE IS NOT DEAD....RESURECTION MEANING THE STATE OF COMEING BACK FROM DEATH....TO LIVE AGAIN... AS SO DID LAZARUS... IN OPINION TO TALKING TO THE DEAD I FEEL IS KINDA OF SICK AND DISTURBING TO EVEN TRY TO REACH THEM FOR THEY ARE GONE AND RESTING AWAITNG JUDGEMENT.... BUT LET US REMEMBER THEM AND ALLOW THEIR LIFE TO BE AN EXAMPLE TO OUR LIFE'S; BUT THEN WE MUST ALSO REMEMBER THAT ONLY WE CAN SEEEK SALVATION FOR ONE-SELF..... AND NOTTO WORY FOR THE TORMENTS OR REWARD'S OF THE HERE-AFTER FOR WE SHOULD FEEL REWARDED ENOUGH WITH THE RIGHTOUS PATH WE BELEIVE WE TAKE.... FOR NOR GOOD NOR BAD DEED WOULD BE TAKEN IN CONSIDERATION AT THE FINAL TRAIL.... FOR THE ONLY WAY TO HEAVEN IS THE FAITH WE HOLD KNOWINGLY BELEIVENG THAT WE ARE SINNERS AND THAT WE MUST REPENT OF OR SINS WITH A NOBLE PURE HEART CONCIOUSLY KNOWING THAT SOME1 CAME GAVE THEIR LIFE FOR US.....AND THAT THE TRUTH HAVE BEEN TOLD FOR THE PRAISED ONE HAS CMAE AND REVEAL THE TRUTH OF GOD ...... QUESTION ON PRAYER DID JESUS NOT SAY PRAY AS I PRAY HEAVENLY FATHER...... NEVER SAID PRAY TO ME FOR I'M GOD ALMIGHTY..... APOLOGIIES TO ANY I MIGHT HAD OFFENDED

IF WE ARE TRUE BELIEVER OF CHRIST JESUS WE SHOULD UNDERSTAND THAT PRAYING IS NOT TALKING WITH THE DEAD FOR IN ALL CHRISTIAN RELIGIOUS BELIEVES IS THE SAYING JESUS LIVES..... N IF HE RESURECTED THEN HE FOR SURE IS NOT DEAD....RESURECTION MEANING THE STATE OF COMEING BACK FROM DEATH....TO LIVE AGAIN... AS SO DID LAZARUS... IN OPINION TO TALKING TO THE DEAD I FEEL IS KINDA OF SICK AND DISTURBING TO EVEN TRY TO REACH THEM FOR THEY ARE GONE AND RESTING AWAITNG JUDGEMENT.... BUT LET US REMEMBER THEM AND ALLOW THEIR LIFE TO BE AN EXAMPLE TO OUR LIFE'S; BUT THEN WE MUST ALSO REMEMBER THAT ONLY WE CAN SEEEK SALVATION FOR ONE-SELF..... AND NOTTO WORY FOR THE TORMENTS OR REWARD'S OF THE HERE-AFTER FOR WE SHOULD FEEL REWARDED ENOUGH WITH THE RIGHTOUS PATH WE BELEIVE WE TAKE.... FOR NOR GOOD NOR BAD DEED WOULD BE TAKEN IN CONSIDERATION AT THE FINAL TRAIL.... FOR THE ONLY WAY TO HEAVEN IS THE FAITH WE HOLD KNOWINGLY BELEIVENG THAT WE ARE SINNERS AND THAT WE MUST REPENT OF OR SINS WITH A NOBLE PURE HEART CONCIOUSLY KNOWING THAT SOME1 CAME GAVE THEIR LIFE FOR US.....AND THAT THE TRUTH HAVE BEEN TOLD FOR THE PRAISED ONE HAS CMAE AND REVEAL THE TRUTH OF GOD ...... QUESTION ON PRAYER DID JESUS NOT SAY PRAY AS I PRAY HEAVENLY FATHER...... NEVER SAID PRAY TO ME FOR I'M GOD ALMIGHTY..... APOLOGIIES TO ANY I MIGHT HAD OFFENDED

IF WE ARE TRUE BELIEVER OF CHRIST JESUS WE SHOULD UNDERSTAND THAT PRAYING IS NOT TALKING WITH THE DEAD FOR IN ALL CHRISTIAN RELIGIOUS BELIEVES IS THE SAYING JESUS LIVES..... N IF HE RESURECTED THEN HE FOR SURE IS NOT DEAD....RESURECTION MEANING THE STATE OF COMEING BACK FROM DEATH....TO LIVE AGAIN... AS SO DID LAZARUS... IN OPINION TO TALKING TO THE DEAD I FEEL IS KINDA OF SICK AND DISTURBING TO EVEN TRY TO REACH THEM FOR THEY ARE GONE AND RESTING AWAITNG JUDGEMENT.... BUT LET US REMEMBER THEM AND ALLOW THEIR LIFE TO BE AN EXAMPLE TO OUR LIFE'S; BUT THEN WE MUST ALSO REMEMBER THAT ONLY WE CAN SEEEK SALVATION FOR ONE-SELF..... AND NOTTO WORY FOR THE TORMENTS OR REWARD'S OF THE HERE-AFTER FOR WE SHOULD FEEL REWARDED ENOUGH WITH THE RIGHTOUS PATH WE BELEIVE WE TAKE.... FOR NOR GOOD NOR BAD DEED WOULD BE TAKEN IN CONSIDERATION AT THE FINAL TRAIL.... FOR THE ONLY WAY TO HEAVEN IS THE FAITH WE HOLD KNOWINGLY BELEIVENG THAT WE ARE SINNERS AND THAT WE MUST REPENT OF OR SINS WITH A NOBLE PURE HEART CONCIOUSLY KNOWING THAT SOME1 CAME GAVE THEIR LIFE FOR US.....AND THAT THE TRUTH HAVE BEEN TOLD FOR THE PRAISED ONE HAS CMAE AND REVEAL THE TRUTH OF GOD ...... QUESTION ON PRAYER DID JESUS NOT SAY PRAY AS I PRAY HEAVENLY FATHER...... NEVER SAID PRAY TO ME FOR I'M GOD ALMIGHTY..... APOLOGIIES TO ANY I MIGHT HAD OFFENDED

JGiven;

I was about to say the same thing...talking to Jesus IS talking to the dead;that's assuming the guy ever actually lived.Which is not a given.
There's more evidence that Plato,and Socrates lived,and Aristotle too,than there is for Jesus.
According to some critics,there were many Jesus like mythological figures in religions that pre-dated Christianity.The good guy destroyed by the baddies.God intervening and scooping up the good guy,who had suffered so,and sending him on up to heaven.There are ,apparently variations on this theme elsewhere in Pagan past before Jesus' time.

If praying is not talking to the dead,then its talking to oneself,'cause there sure aint anybody
else that gets to hear it.

JOET,
I see what you were saying now. Sorry about the misunderstanding.

JOET:

I see what you were saying now. Sorry about the misunderstanding.

Lepidopteryx: ain't my book. I'm just making the point that those who invoke channellers are in conflict with the tenets of their faith. that's a problem for them to resolve, not me. and no, I don't recall anything literally saying god will only talk through his priests, but it's implicit in the role of the pope and the priesthood that they are god's representatives. they are the shepards to the flock, not the mediums, and are given multiple roles, including the delegated power to forgive sins. it pretty much follows, and supports the dogma that Colson cites, that no one else could have the role or the power that mediums claim.

JOET:

**and god gave us no hint that he would use the dead, rather than his priests to talk to us.**

Granted, it's been a few years since I undertook rigorous study of your book, but I don't recall anywhere in the Bible where God said that he would communicate with man only through his priests.

Moody, Moody, Moody,

Again it is very apparent that you suffer from the Three B's i.e. you were Bred, Born and Brainwashed in Islam. And your mind has never been outside that box!!!

Please address the flaws in the foundations and founder of Islam and then get back to us.

And there is a five point program you can take to escape the koranic curse. Just ask!!!

I am not one to consult mediums because it's virtually impossible to separate the wheat from the chaff in that "line of work".

However, it's a huge leap from saying "Don't ask a medium to try to contact the dead", to "Let's simply deny that those who have passed on can communicate to us in any manner whatsoever."

Having been a beneficiary (and I use this term most intentionally) of a couple of these communications, I have no further need of dogma to tell me what I am allowed, or not allowed, to believe.

And to those who would warn me that surely I was deceived by the devil, let me point again to that word "beneficiary" and remind the fundies that their devil is constitutionally incapable of doing good to anyone, even in an attempt to trick and beguile a poor deluded fool such as myself.

Now Terra, you're not incorrect about the etiquette involved, but let's not forget that time is irrelevant in that realm, there is never a shortage of it, and those who love us and care about us are never offended when we ask for their ear.

Many times we may not get a straightforward answer, but this is because they have the perspective to realize that part of our growth means we may have to deal with things ourselves. Sometimes, for our own good, they have to practice the principle of non-interference. We need to understand this as their higher form of love for us.

I find it surpassingly strange that Mr. Colson, so steadfast in his fundie faith, would confess himself terror-stricken at the thought of any contact with another eternal soul who just happens to be discarnate at the moment. My reaction was amazement (just like Peter, James and John on the mountaintop) -- certainly not horror.

Mr. Colson makes some very good points and is respectful of other Christian traditions and their views on communicating with saints. Kudos to him.

Henry J.

Quick therapy is require but, to the sick inclined to conflict approach, provocative and have no sense of respect for others/themselves.
I guess that is the only sense they have...to make!

In my posts, I'm quoting authentic references that any body can verify. ABOUT,

-Proof of God, (SCIENTIFIC EVIDENCE)

-Holy Bible,is a book of Paul/John/Mathew/Luke OR JESES(A.S.)?

-Trinity, is it mentioned anywhere in Bible?

-Jesus (A.S.) in Islam and his verses about comforter to come after him named as "Pargaleeta" in the Bible . This word was deleted by interpreters and translators and changed at times to "Spirit of Truth" and at other times, to "comforter" and sometimes "Holy Spirit." The original Greek and its meaning is "one whom people praise exceedingly".

Henry J.

Quick therapy is require but, to the sick who are provocative and inclined to conflict approach, have no respect for others/themselves.
I guess that is the only sense they have...to make!

In my posts, I'm quoting authentic references that any body can verify. ABOUT,

-Proof of God, (SCIENTIFIC EVIDENCE)

-Holy Bible,is a book of Paul/John/Mathew/Luke OR JESES(A.S.)?

-Trinity, is it mentioned anywhere in Bible?

-Jesus (A.S.) in Islam and his verses about comforter to come after him named as "Pargaleeta" in the Bible . This word was deleted by interpreters and translators and changed at times to "Spirit of Truth" and at other times, to "comforter" and sometimes "Holy Spirit." The original Greek and its meaning is "one whom people praise exceedingly".

MAVADDAT: I hope you didn't miss the fact that I am not subscribing to what I am explaining. I am just having fun with the fact that fundamentalists who do take their faith seriously don't get the point that they are heretics if they claim to believe in spirits. I just can't resist.

Yes, JGiven... you really must better learn the art of making up arbitrary standards of morality that Christianity has mastered. Without understanding how Christians just "make crap up," your objections will remain naive at best.

JGIVEN: the point of course, is that religions teach that only the man (dead or not) that is god can talk to the living, not dead people who aren't god. and no living person has the power to summon or channel the dead. the theological issue is that the finite world of man and the infinite world of god are only bridged by god.

Well,
As a Wiccan I was taught it was bad form to call on the dead...not because of any moral prohibition or scripture...but they are going about their journey and holding them up is not polite.

terra

Actually, if you literally believed what Jesus says about death (as Mr. Coleslaw claims), then you would believe that (if you were a believer) Jesus will literally resurrect you upon his return and that you will literally dwell on Earth in a youthful form forever.

And if you were bad, then you get sent to the valley of the son of Hinnom, which is outside the walls of ancient Jerusalem, to burn on the pile of dead carcases that probably aren't there anymore.

Mr. Colson says: ..."in no Christian tradition do we communicate with the dead." However this is patently wrong because all Christians communicate through prayer with Jesus Christ. Yes, He is God, but He is also a dead man.

Henry: sorry for the confusion, I mistook you for Anonymous in that post.

Thomas: I can't even tell from your post whether you agree with Colson or not.

Paganplace: the theological problem with mediums is that only God is supposed to have the power to summon folks from God's world - mortals have no infinite powers. and god gave us no hint that he would use the dead, rather than his priests to talk to us. so its idolatry to believe in a medium, and blasphemous to claim to be one.

TO CHARLES COLSON AND THE REST OF HUMANITY: You wrote, " but in no Christian tradition do we communicate with the dead.", do you remember the "Transfiguration"? You should also remember that Jesus said, "I am the God of the living" so just because people stop breathing don't mean they are dead, just that they are physically dead. You also wrote, "Consulting mediums or spiritists is clearly condemned", and do you know why? Do you think that it might be because satan is a deceiver? Sometimes God can use a deceased loved one to give us a message at just the right time and even though we might not know it till later, that is God's provacative. We should not try to put God in a box of our own making, God has a Plan and God's Plan will come to Fruition. Oh, and by the way; God wins, satan loses, a tie is unacceptable. Being a christian is more than knowing God's Name. Take care, see you in the Kingdom. Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

Moody
you multiple obscenely long posts
are Sociopathic.

Cut it out,
and get some therapy quick.

JESUS(A.S.) IN ISLAM:

Jesus (Isa) A.S. in Islam, and his Second Coming
by Mufti A.H. Elias
I. Jesus (A.S.) In Islam
Muslims do believe that Isa (A.S.) was sent down as a Prophet of Allah (God), but he (Jesus) is not God or Lord, nor the son of God. Muslims do not believe that Isa (A.S.), also known as Jesus by Christians and others, is dead or was ever crucified. We believe that he was raised to heaven and is there, and will descend at the appointed time, end all wars, and bring peace to the world. Like Jesus (A.S.), Muhammad (Peace be upon him) is also a Prophet and Messenger. Muhammed (P.B.U.H.) is the last Prophet, though, and there is none after him. Hence, Islam is the last religion, complete, with the Holy Qur'an as the unchanged and perfect word of God for over 1400 years, AS GOD PROMISED TO PRESERVE IT TILL THE LAST DAY FOR ALL OF HUMANKIND, UNLIKE SACRED TEXTS OF OTHER RELIGIONS WHICH HAVE MULITPLE VERSIONS AND ARE "REVISED" PERIODICALLY BY MAN. God, or Allah in Arabic, is Divine and Supreme Being and Creator.
What the Holy Qur'an says about Jesus:
They slew him not, nor did they crucify him but it was made dubious to them.
(Holy Qur'an, Surah Nisaa, Verse 157)
Hadhrat Isa (A.S.) himself told of the coming of Prophet Muhammad (Peace be upon him). In the Bible, Jesus (A.S.) says,
IF YOU LOVE ME, KEEP MY COMMANDMENTS. AND I WILL PRAY TO THE FATHER AND HE SHALL GIVE YOU ANOTHER COMFORTER THAT HE MAY ABIDE WITH YOU FOREVER.
(Bible, John 14-15/16)

BUT WHEN THE COMFORTER IS COME, WHOM I WILL SEND UNTO YOU FROM THE FATHER, EVEN THE SPIRIT OF TRUTH, WHICH PROCEEDETH FROM THE FATHER, HE SHALL TESTIFY OF ME, AND HE ALSO SHALL BEAR WITNESS, BECAUSE YE HAVE BEEN WITH ME FROM THE BEGINNING.
(Bible, John 15-26/27)

I have yet many things to say unto you, but you cannot bear them now. How be it when he, the spirit of Truth will come, he will guide you into all truth, FOR HE SHALL SPEAK NOT OF HIMSELF, BUT WHATSOEVER HE SHALL HEAR, that he shall speak, AND HE WILL SHOW YOU THINGS TO COME. He shall glorify me, for he shall receive of mine, and he shall show it unto you.
(Bible, John 16-12/14)
Ulema (learned scholars in Islam) have said that the person who is described by Hadhrat Isa (A.S.) to come after him - in the above verse - does not comply with any other person but Prophet Muhammad (Peace be upon him).
In this case, the "comforter" he mentions is none other than Prophet Muhammad (Peace be upon him) and his laws and way of life (Shariah) and Book (Holy Qur'an) are those that Hadhrat Isa (A.S.) asks his followers to abide by.
THE "PERSON" WHOM JESUS (A.S.) PROPHECISED WILL COME AFTER HIM, IS CALLED PARGALEETA IN THE BIBLE . THIS WORD WAS DELETED BY INTERPRETERS AND TRANSLATORS AND CHANGED AT TIMES TO "SPIRIT OF TRUTH" AND AT OTHER TIMES, TO "COMFORTER" AND SOMETIMES "HOLY SPIRIT." THE ORIGINAL GREEK AND ITS MEANING IS "ONE WHOM PEOPLE PRAISE EXCEEDINGLY." THE SENSE OF THE WORD, THEN, IS APPLICABLE TO THE WORD MUHAMMAD IN ARABIC, SINCE MUHAMMAD MEANS "THE PRAISED ONE."
Jesus (A.S.) also says in the Bible,
... AND A LITTLE WHILE AND YOU SHALL NOT SEE ME; AND AGAIN A LITTLE WHILE, YOU SHALL SEE ME BECAUSE I GO TO THE FATHER.
(Bible, John 16:16)
... and the Holy Qur'an says,
And surely they slew him not. But Allah (God) raised him unto Himself.
(Holy Qur'an, Surah Nisaa, Verse 157-158)
As such, Muslims believe that Hadhrat Isa (A.S.) was raised to heaven. According to Hadith, he is on the second heaven. Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wasallam=Peace be upon him) mentioned, "During the Meraj (Ascension), I met Hadhrat Isa (A.S.) on the second heaven. I found him of medium stature, reddish white. His body was so clean and clear, that it appeared as though he had just performed ghusal (ablution, cleansing of the entire body) and come." In another Hadith, Rasulullah (Sallallahu Alayhi Wasallam) mentioned to the Jews that, " Hadhrat Isa (A.S.) is not dead, he will most surely return to you before Qiyamat (the Day of Judgement)."
May Allah Guide all people to the Truth. Aameen.

PROOF OF GOD!

I liked your note Gerry its reason vs superstition and not Islam Vs Christianity or others. For you i advise to see below comments of mine.
Rick, you asked about Hell and Havens and told about population comparison. For you my dear, we are only responsible for our own actions. At the end good deeds and bad deeds were never rewarded equally and never will be(though in appearance you find injustice), logic tells! My believe tells i have the responsibility to seek KNOWLEDGE of world as well to reach the truth, other wise i will left ingorant and end up in hell. (If you are sincere enough you will find the answer of ALL the questions that hinders you and create doubts- ANSWERS ARE ALL OUT THERE!!)
Steve Holgate, dear you talk about lack of scientific proof, I suggest you to also read below comments carefully!!!

Opinions are made upon understanding and certain knowledge, which differ from person to person. For some God is a myth, for some they believe or want to believe according to their religion and for some He is as real as His creation. Below are few examples in the favor of their belief:

For Muslims Big Bang Theory is not something new, it is more than 1400 years old, revealed in their Holy Book along with more than 1000 other scientific facts which are happened to be established recently in couple of centuries. And the answers of so many confusing questions which keep us going astray throughout our lives. AND AS A FACT MUSLIMS KNOW THEY WERE REVEALED BEFORE DISCOVERED AND FURTHER ON TOP OF IT THAT NOT A SINGLE VERSE OF THEIR HOLY BOOK IS IN CONFLICT WITH ANY LOGICAL/SCIENTIFIC APPROACH (INFECT EVERY TIME SCIENTIFIC DISCOVERIES PROVIDING PROOF IN FAVOR OF THE LAST REVELATIONS), MAKE THEM MORE FOCUSED / PRACTICING /FUNDAMENTALIST OR WHAT EVER OTHERS THINK ABOUT THEM and made it very easy for them to reach to the conclusion...SIMPLY APPLY THE SCIENTIFIC RULE OF PROBABILITY....What if 80% of Qur’an is in conformation with 100% of Science and 20% of it is beyond humans comprehension then logic says it would be also correct, if not now then in future...IF YOU UNDERSTAND PORBABILITY RULE THEN ITS NOT A JOKE !!), very few examples out of All from the Holy book as proof,

I have created all the creatures from earth and all the living beings are made out of water (Chapter 21) (living being which are meant to die/perish)
Don’t you see the earth and sky was together and I separated them, still you don’t believe
(Chapter 21)
I have created sky upon earth for your protection and there is sign for you
(Chapter 21)
All the stars, moon and sun are floating in their skies
(Chapter 21)
All the skies are holding with out pillars and there is sign for you
(Chapter 21)
And the world is expanding. (it is also said in Qur’an I guess in Sura Nisa)

For Muslims God means (The One, Ultimate Creator, Who is Uncreated and above time always present before and after time and beyond our limited level of comprehension)

Below is the TOUCH STONE of God that He revealed in Holy Book, when the question about God was raised:
1- He is One and Only
2-the Eternal, Absolute;
, the eternally Besought of all! on Whom all depend.
3-He begets not, nor is He begotten.
4-And there is none comparable unto Him.
And none is like Him.

PLEASE COMMENTS ARE NOT NECESSARY WITHOUT VARIFICATION / RESEARCH OF THE ORIGINAL TEXT AND AUTHENTIC TRANSLATIONS BY ONLY MUSLIM SCHOLARS TO AVOID ANY TWISTING AND DECEPTIVE TECHNIQUES IN GENERAL PRACTICE!!

HOLY BIBLE:

David,
IN ANSWER TO PROOF OF GOD, muslims point of view!!
I haven’t read all the posts but David in reply of your post to me dated:10/02/07.
I understand your point of view David when you refer to spirit. I suggest you to further study the meaning and concept.
To all fella’s no offense and with all due respect, in Bible word trinity is not even mentioned. Even name BIBLE is not mentioned inside book. In Roman Latin language Bible means book. The closest explanation saying that Holly Ghost, Spirit and Father is one is taken out/removed from the Bible in its latest versions/new additions explained by more than 50 High Priests of Church that it was not mentioned in the most ancient scripts and was a concoction, addition, fabrication in the translations.
More than 50% of the Bible is written by Paul who hardly met once the to Jesus (A.S.) in his life time. Then written by Luke, Mathew and John. And very small part of it is said by Jesus (A.S.) him self. (You can refer to red Bible).
Where Qur’an is the word only that Mohammed (P.B.U.H.) heard and not every thing he said. (Refer to my previous mail Jesus in Islam)
-What Mohammed (PBUH) said other than what he HEARS is called HADITH and is not part of Quran (Muslim Bible). And we also found concoctions in hadith but thousands are preserved and original.
-And what disciples of Mohammad(PBUH) said is even not considered as religious scripture or part of it unlike Christian Bible. It is kept totally separate for other references. I’m not saying Muslims don’t believe in Juses(A.S), they do, and also believe in Original Bible, if there are any proofs of original scriptures of Bible which were in Nazarian language and not in Latin.
And to see the Proof of God, Please read my next post!

HOLY BIBLE:

David,
IN ANSWER TO PROOF OF GOD, muslims point of view!!
I haven’t read all the posts but David in reply of your post to me dated:10/02/07.
I understand your point of view David when you refer to spirit. I suggest you to further study the meaning and concept.
To all fella’s no offense and with all due respect, in Bible word trinity is not even mentioned. Even name BIBLE is not mentioned inside book. In Roman Latin language Bible means book. The closest explanation saying that Holly Ghost, Spirit and Father is one is taken out/removed from the Bible in its latest versions/new additions explained by more than 50 High Priests of Church that it was not mentioned in the most ancient scripts and was a concoction, addition, fabrication in the translations.
More than 50% of the Bible is written by Paul who hardly met once the to Jesus (A.S.) in his life time. Then written by Luke, Mathew and John. And very small part of it is said by Jesus (A.S.) him self. (You can refer to red Bible).
Where Qur’an is the word only that Mohammed (P.B.U.H.) heard and not every thing he said. (Refer to my previous mail Jesus in Islam)
-What Mohammed (PBUH) said other than what he HEARS is called HADITH and is not part of Quran (Muslim Bible). And we also found concoctions in hadith but thousands are preserved and original.
-And what disciples of Mohammad(PBUH) said is even not considered as religious scripture or part of it unlike Christian Bible. It is kept totally separate for other references. I’m not saying Muslims don’t believe in Juses(A.S), they do, and also believe in Original Bible, if there are any proofs of original scriptures of Bible which were in Nazarian language and not in Latin.
And to see the Proof of God, Please read my next post!

I mean, not to overstate the obvious or anything, but exactly why again is it so dreadfully forbidden to do what, according to the theology that forbids it, ....is supposed to be impossible?

Not that I advise it, ...just kind of wondering.

Well, I guess it'd be kind of inconvenient while trying to make everyone believe that all beings in the universe must go to one of two places based upon how well they obey a certain book....

To actually note that the spirits don't seem to cooperate with that view. :)

What can you do. :)

anonymous admonishes me:
"Become more familiar with the intircacies of the Bible before you take it out of context and splash it across a public forum."

same nonsense/meaninglessness that we are used to from the man with no name. No specific reference. meaningless accusation with no backup. really pathetic still, man with no name.

Joey: I DO agree with your basic point. I was trying to point out that it don't make a Heck of a lot of sense to permit contact with some Godlike or ex-human spirits and prohibit it with others.

Do these other world souls obey the orders of the Catholic or Methodist or Scientological Churches? I would doubt it. (Assuming they exist of course, which they don't).

So finally it is a meaningless spiritually masturbatory minuet.

I believe in death after life.
There's no avoiding it.

Religion has a big investment in death.
Without death,there would be no religion.
Without death,we wouldn't need God.
Death scares us.And religion promises us paradise,
if only we believe in magic,and the skygod.
But it's so darn childish I just can't do that.
I don't understand how ANYBODY can do that.
Maybe the only way a grown-up can believe this stuff,
is to be indoctrinated as a child,which,mercifully I wasn't.

Mr. James: Of course I was referring only to supernatural claims not involving Jesus. Mr. Colson's point is that most organized religions teach, whether based on biblical literalism or just plain developed theology, that mediums and contact with more mundane spirits are heresy. I'm agnostic myself, or worse, but that doesn't prevent me from asking fundamentalists how they can hold, let alone cite, belief in contact with spirits simultaneously with their fundamentalism.

John Stuart Mill;

"My father's rejection of all that is called religious belief was not,as
many might suppose,primarily a matter of logic and evidence: the grounds for
it were moral, more than intellectual. He found it impossible to believe
that a world so full of evil was the work of a God combining infinite
power with perfect goodness and righteousness.
His aversion to religion,in the sense usually attached to the term,was of
the same kind with that of Lucretius; he regarded it with the feelings due
not to mere mental delusion but to a great moral evil.
It would have been wholly inconsistent with my father's ideas of duty to
allow me to acquire impressions contrary to his convictions and feelings
respecting religion;and he impressed on me from the first that the manner in
which the world came into existence was a subject on which nothing was known".
John Stuart Mill,quoted in "Why I Am Not A Christian",by Bertrand Russell.

Let me add that since you are recruiting for Jesus I can't think of a better place to find candidates for hell than the penitentiary. I've yet to meet a conservative or an evangelical Christian that didn't say that.

How sure are you Jesus isn't the great anti Christ? The notion that Jesus is the Christ is just that, a notion.

The Bible, ref: http://www.hoax-buster.org/sellyoursoul says that the being in the ball of fire Moses made the deal with to get him off the wanted for murder hook was the biggest Devil of them all, Lucifer. That finding stands unchallenged.

Jesus was the son of the being in the fire. All Christians believe that so I'm sure you do too. We have some real good evidence, (you're familiar with evidence so I understand) that the whole tale of sacrificing the son of God and so on was just a scam. God needs no such thing as anyone with just a piece of a brain knows. But we can surely expect Lucifer would sacrifice His son to Himself in an effort to trap people and get them in hell. It's working real good I see.

Once upon a time, Lucifer attempted to take over heaven. The battle between good and evil has already taken place. So the notion another will take place tells us Lucifer intends to try again. And, the unwary will choose sides with His son, Jesus against God. Good luck. You'll need it.

Jesus is not "The Christ" but is the great anti Christ. Followers of Jesus need to get ready to fight with God's heavenly host led by Michael the arc angel. They're training hard in hell right now. When "pride of the Marines" Pat Robertson gets there he'll command a huge corps. On the last day when the big fight takes place the nonparticipants, atheists and so on will get to watch.

Fight hard Chucky. There's a fire extinguisher in heaven so you have every reason to fight as hard as you can. Your gang almost won last time. I hope God isn't watching you and creating more angels to stop you and your would-be God Lucifer from taking over heaven. But then you know God is watching you. Again, good luck.

Henry James

Become more familiar with the intircacies of the Bible before you take it out of context and splash it across a public forum.

Joet

I suppose the appearances of Jesus after his death, clearly supernatural, are the same as a seance? Classic Christianity clearly and plainly differentiates Jesus from any other person in that He was both man and God and had overcome death since He was and still is flesh and bones. Ask doubting Thomas. Seances deal with spirits, etc. I guess to you these are the same?

The point is not that biblical literalism is defensible, it's that those who invoke faith in the supernatural as if it were consistent with faith in the unerring nature of the inspired Bible have some 'splainin to do. I doubt both, but that doesn't preclude the use of a logical hypothesis that proves a contradiction whether the premise is correct or not. the believers can't have their cake and eat it too.

Mr Colson strikes me as the kind of fellow who follows strictly all the strictures of Leviticus.

I am sure, for instance, that he never engaged in homosexual acts while he was in prison.

I trust he never eats Shellfish.

If his child fails to obey, I am sure he has no compunction about stoning that child to death.

Slavery, and selling one's daughter into sexual slavery, are quite fine under the right conditions.

Having Visions of God the Father (which of the many names of God in the Torah does Mr Colson use to clear up WHICH God) is fine
but seances where the spirit and body of Muhammed would appropriately be blasphemous and forbidden.

So get thee behind me, Mohammed.

I have been making this point on other conversations - that it is at best awkward for believers to proclaim both their faith in the God of the Bible and their faith in mediums and contact from the dead, if not downright contradictory. The Catholic Church, if I recall correctly, thinks its blasphemous and idolatrous to partake of mediums.