Another bred (cloned?), born, and brainwashed Muslim and his Islamic thinking about jihad, apostacy and Muslim women and very little about how these "professors", muftis, imams and clerics are "dealing" from a false deck i.e. the flawed foundations of Islam.

Mohammed, an illiterate, hallucinating Arab who also had embellishing/hallucinating scribal biographers who not only added "angels" and flying chariots to the Koran but also a militaristic agenda to support the plundering and looting of the lands of non-believers.

This agenda continues as shown by the conduct of the seven Muslim doctors in the UK, the 9/11 terrorists, the 24/7 Sunni suicide/roadside/market/mosque bombers , the 24/7 Shiite suicide/roadside/market/mosque bombers , the Bali crazies, the Kenya crazies, the Pakistani koranics, the Palestine suicide bombers/rocketeers, the Lebanese nutcases and the Filipino koranics with most of this misery being funded by Iran or the "Wannabees" of Saudi Arabia.

Al-Tayer's closing statement sure sounds like a dead apology for Jihad - the armed kind. His disingenuous rationalization of current conflicts conveniently dismisses any culpability those "resisting occupation" may have for the state of things in their own countries. Blame of this magnitude rarely rests square on one's shouders. The guilt is more often carried by the masses.

Today Jihad is full of fearsome for the west, the same concept was acceptable to them and even supported to Jihadis in Afghanistan. Today table is overturn, now they are against it, because purpose is not serving. Bush, Pope, and West in fact provocating muslims to do more Jihad. You want to know the reason, a Big shadow of Cyclone of Islam is on the way cover US/EUROBIA.

We have hurricanes here, not cyclones.

"However, the mistakes that were made by the U.S.A. in Afghanistan in the 1980s have weakened any and all efforts by Muslim scholars and countries to prevent extremists from departing into battles in Iraq, Palestine, Chechnya and Somalia."

yeah..so its all the US's fault. why can't any of the muslims be self criticle.

"However, the mistakes that were made by the U.S.A. in Afghanistan in the 1980s have weakened any and all efforts by Muslim scholars and countries to prevent extremists from departing into battles in Iraq, Palestine, Chechnya and Somalia."

yeah..so its all the US's fault. why can't any of the muslims be self critical.

I am a 54 year old American male living in the South of the USA. I have studied the history of how the religon of Islam has been corrupted and made into the radical violent Islam we see destroying innocent lives. The policies of the United States has sickened me because our policies have been a big part of the root cause of such a movement. I tell my friends who do not understand because they do not know history and facts that it is us who has created this monster. It is our government who has fed the fire of violence. When I see the angry faces of from Iran, Iraq, and Palestine, I can only remotely imagine the cruel twist of dis pair and hopelessness. This is the dis pair they want us to feel. Our hope of finding a way out of this is complex but yet simple. We must listen, we must open our hearts with no hidden agenda, we must put aside our hatred and fear and hear the cries of lost loved ones and seek the ground that will save us. The place we find ourselves in is a dark place and to find our way we must find the lighted path that God has shone for us. This god is not a Muslim god, a Christian god, or any secular god but the god of all men without the strings of religon. To every Muslim, you are my brother in this world, I hope those who have chosen the path of radical Islam and violence could look me in the eye and tell me there pain, there fear, there rage so I can listen, hear and understand. Then perhaps the common ground be laid. And lastly, my governments polices for decades must be changed, we must except responsibility, apologize for our mistakes and begin the healing process. We have the power, it within us.

Rick:
Bravo! I strongly agree with your insight.

Muslim leader and intellectual has huge role to play in putting things in context and preventing radicalization.

Thanks for writing this comment.

Some verses from the Koran on terror(ism) and unbelievers:

[3.151] We will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve, because they set up with Allah that for which He has sent down no authority, and their abode is the fire, and evil is the abode of the unjust.

[5.51] O you who believe! do not take the Jews and the Christians for friends; they are friends of each other; and whoever amongst you takes them for a friend, then surely he is one of them; surely Allah does not guide the unjust people.

[8.59] And let not those who disbelieve think that they shall come in first; surely they will not escape. [8.60] And prepare against them what force you can and horses tied at the frontier, to frighten thereby the enemy of Allah and your enemy and others besides them, whom you do not know (but) Allah knows them; and whatever thing you will spend in Allah's way, it will be paid back to you fully and you shall not be dealt with unjustly.

[9.5] So when the sacred months have passed away, then slay the idolaters wherever you find them, and take them captives and besiege them and lie in wait for them in every ambush, then if they repent and keep up prayer and pay the poor-rate, leave their way free to them; surely Allah is Forgiving, Merciful.

[47.4] So when you meet in battle those who disbelieve, then smite the necks until when you have overcome them, then make (them) prisoners, and afterwards either set them free as a favor or let them ransom (themselves) until the war terminates. That (shall be so); and if Allah had pleased He would certainly have exacted what is due from them, but that He may try some of you by means of others; and (as for) those who are slain in the way of Allah, He will by no means allow their deeds to perish.

David:
Please read Koran with commentary. You have to read it in context. Verses within surah/chapter are connected with each other. Each surah, verse has a background, an event, a situation and a reason.

You're treating Quranic verses as if each of them is a formula to make a chemical-solution, complete and absolute, it is not. You should get Abullah Yusuf Ali's Quran commentary not just translation and read it. Also, you need to read Prophet's biography, a good book is Martin Lings' Muhammad.

Ignorance breed fear and fear breeds hatred. Joy and hatred could not be in same heart.

It is not the koran but who "wrote" the koran.

A short synopsis of the foundations of the OT, NT and the koranic book of death:

1. Abraham founder/father of three major religions was probably a mythical character. If he was real, he was at best a combination of at least three men. 1.5 million Conservative Jews and their rabbis have relegated Abraham to the myth pile along with most if not all the OT.

2. Jesus, the illiterate Jewish peasant/carpenter possibly suffering from hallucinations, has been characterized anywhere from the Messiah from Nazareth to a mythical character from mythical Nazareth. Analyses of his life by many contemporary NT scholars (e.g. Professors Crossan, Borg and Fredriksen, On Faith panelists)via the NT and related documents have concluded that only about 30% of Jesus' sayings and ways noted in the NT were authentic. The rest being embellishments (e.g. miracles)/hallucinations made/had by the NT authors to impress various Christian/Jewish/Pagan sects.

3. Mohammed, an illiterate, hallucinating Arab, also had embellishing/hallucinating scribal biographers who not only added "angels" and flying chariots to the Koran but also a militaristic agenda to support the plundering and looting of the lands of non-believers.
This agenda continues as shown by the conduct of the seven Muslim doctors in the UK, the 9/11 terrorists, the 24/7 Sunni suicide/roadside/market/mosque bombers , the 24/7 Shiite suicide/roadside/market/mosque bombers , the Bali crazies, the Kenya crazies, the Pakistani koranics, the Palestine suicide bombers/rocketeers, the Lebanese nutcases and the Filipino koranics with much of the misery being supported by blood/oil money from Iran.

4. Luther, Calvin, Smith, Henry VIII, Wesley et al, founders of Christian-based religions, also suffered from the belief in/hallucinations of "pretty wingy thingie" visits and "prophecies" for profits analogous to the myths of Catholicism (resurrections, apparitions, ascensions and immaculate conceptions).

Concerned the Christian Now Liberated wrote:

"Another bred (cloned?), born, and brainwashed Muslim and his Islamic thinking about jihad, apostacy and Muslim women and very little about how these "professors", muftis, imams and clerics are "dealing" from a false deck i.e. the flawed foundations of Islam."

Unfortunately, it seems you are not interested in dialogue or mutual exploration of ideas. Rather, your writings are little more than hermeneutic imperialism of the worst kind. Even more unfortunately, it is filled with dismissive anti-intellectualism as well, without any concrete evidence or argumentation for your assertions. If you are unwilling to accept even some measure of basis from which others write their contributions, then why should anyone respect yours?

Also, the boilerplate responses with bullet points just get old after a while.

Christopher,

Let us start with some observations:

There are 1 billion plus Muslims in the world because of "sword-forced" conversion and forced procreation. Considering the contemporary Islamic truth/death squads and "koranic" rules, things have not changed. Give freedom to the Muslim masses trapped under Islamic tyranny and watch what happens.

Any idea how many Muslims have access to this discussion??

And if I lived in Iran or other Islamic states and noted that Mohammed was an illiterate, hallucinating Arab who had contemporary or future scribal henchmen writing their own "koranic" militant agendas for plundering/looting the lands of non-believers, I would be beheaded. And you call that a "peaceful" religion??????

With respect to contemporary koranic violence, simply read the front page of your newspaper.

With respect to the mythical Abraham, see http://www.simpletoremember.com/ ...vativeTorah.htm

With respect to the historical Jesus, see http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/theories.htm
And repetition is a significant learning tool!!!

CHRIS:
why dont you ever answer the people who rightly point out what the koran says and what islamics actually do.
who cares if it is cut and paste - how eles do you get the facts out?
its always the messenger with you and never the message.

AS IF THEY DONT

I WOULD PERSONALLY APPEALED TO THE READER, PURCHASE THE QURAN AND CHECKED IT UP, YOU COME TO KNOW HOW ANTI ISLAMIC PERSONALITIES ARE CHEATING. IN FACT BY GIVING WRONG QUOTATION, THEY ARE PROVOKING THE READERS TO CHECK, ULTIMATELY TRUTH EXPOSED AND FALSHOOD PERISHED, IT IS BOUND TO PERISHED BY ITS NATURE.

PLEASE ALSO VISIT WEBSITE: WWW.IRF.NET

David,

Isolated quotations out of context establish nothing. And if you are a Christian or a Jew, you are throwing stones from within the proverbial glass house. The frequency and cruelty of violent verses in Old Testamnet far outpaces those in the Qur'an. What does that mean? Do those verse define Christianity or Judaism? I would challenge you to first struggle to understand the verses in your own scripture, and then apply that same standard to others' holy texts.

***

The LORD slew all the firstborn in the land of Egypt, both the firstborn of man, and the firstborn of beast.--Exodus 13:15

For every one that curseth his father or his mother shall be surely put to death -- Leviticus 20:9

He that blasphemeth the name of the LORD, he shall surely be put to death, and all the congregation shall certainly stone him -- Leviticus 24:16

therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him. But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves -- Numbers 31:15-19

Thou shalt surely smite the inhabitants of that city with the edge of the sword, destroying it utterly, and all that is therein, and the cattle thereof, with the edge of the sword -- Deuteronomy 13:15

Happy shall he be, that taketh and dasheth thy little ones against the stones. -- Psalms 137:9

What Al Tayer said is not been accepted by either groups of Muslim or Western radicals. Radicals and extremists on both sides are minorities but their eivl sounds well.
Al Tayer and Rick Huffman are representing the slinet majority and the later was great stating:
"To every Muslim, you are my brother in this world, I hope those who have chosen the path of radical Islam and violence could look me in the eye and tell me there pain, there fear, there rage so I can listen, hear and understand. Then perhaps the common ground be laid. And lastly, my governments polices for decades must be changed, we must except responsibility, apologize for our mistakes and begin the healing process. We have the power, it within us."

What Al Tayer said is not been accepted by either groups of Muslim or Western radicals. Radicals and extremists on both sides are minorities but their eivl sounds well.
Al Tayer and Rick Huffman are representing the slinet majority and the later was great stating:
"To every Muslim, you are my brother in this world, I hope those who have chosen the path of radical Islam and violence could look me in the eye and tell me there pain, there fear, there rage so I can listen, hear and understand. Then perhaps the common ground be laid. And lastly, my governments polices for decades must be changed, we must except responsibility, apologize for our mistakes and begin the healing process. We have the power, it within us."

August 12, 07

I fully agree with Ibrahami: Al Tayer and Rick Huffman are representing the silent majority. Yes there are Muslim extremists, but this is not the whole story because there are extremists in all the other religions. There are also secular extremists. Moreover, Muslims, whether they are moderates or extremists, are not living in a vacuum. They are part of the human experience; they affect this experience and are affected by it.

As an American Muslim, I can see clearly that the United States made a historic mistake when it dropped Afghanistan like a hot potato after the defeat of the former Soviet Union. If we stayed in Afghanistan and gave to the Afghani people in financial aid, a fraction of what are spending in Iraq today, 9/11 would not have happened. We gathered the Mujahdeen from all over the world to fight the Soviets, we armed and trained them. After the Soviet defeat we left the county. America helped and defended Muslims in Bosnia and in Afghanistan. However it made a historic mistake by leaving Afghanistan to become a failed state. It is those extremists that we gathered from around the world who committed the crime of 9/11, they planned the attack from Afghanistan!

The problem is not Islam and the United State. We can just remind ourselves that the overwhelming majority of the Muslim World was America’s allies during the Cold War. So when we get to discuss the atrocities committed in Iraq by Muslims extremists we can not do that is a vacuum. We can not ignore that 5 American, Congressional and Presidential, investigations concluded that all the reasons used to justify the invasion of Iraq were falls. The mistake of the invasion of Iraq is not America’s mistake; it is the mistake of the neo-conservatives, the secular extremists. Just visit the site of the “the Project of New American Century” http://www.newamericancentury.org and you will find that the design of the neo-conservatives to topple Saddam Hussein by force preceded 9/11. The project of the New American Century was established in 1997 and was closed by 2005. One of the founders of the project told the Washington Post, as the reason for the closure: “mission accomplished”.

That is why I agree with Ibrahami. However, Muslims and Americans alike must speak against extremists, violence and war.

Aziz Fahmy

I fully agree with Ibrahami: Al Tayer and Rick Huffman are representing the silent majority. Yes there are Muslim extremists, but this is not the whole story because there are extremists in all the other religions. There are also secular extremists. Moreover, Muslims, whether they are moderates or extremists, are not living in a vacuum. They are part of the human experience; they affect this experience and are affected by it.

As an American Muslim, I can see clearly that the United States made a historic mistake when it dropped Afghanistan like a hot potato after the defeat of the former Soviet Union. If we stayed in Afghanistan and gave to the Afghani people in financial aid, a fraction of what are spending in Iraq today, 9/11 would not have happened. We gathered the Mujahdeen from all over the world to fight the Soviets, we armed and trained them. After the Soviet defeat we left the county. America helped and defended Muslims in Bosnia and in Afghanistan. However it made a historic mistake by leaving Afghanistan to become a failed state. It is those extremists that we gathered from around the world who committed the crime of 9/11, they planned the attack from Afghanistan!

The problem is not Islam and the United State. We can just remind ourselves that the overwhelming majority of the Muslim World was America’s allies during the Cold War. So when we get to discuss the atrocities committed in Iraq by Muslims extremists we can not do that is a vacuum. We can not ignore that 5 American, Congressional and Presidential, investigations concluded that all the reasons used to justify the invasion of Iraq were falls. The mistake of the invasion of Iraq is not America’s mistake; it is the mistake of the neo-conservatives, the secular extremists. Just visit the site of the “the Project of New American Century” http://www.newamericancentury.org and you will find that the design of the neo-conservatives to topple Saddam Hussein by force preceded 9/11. The project of the New American Century was established in 1997 and was closed by 2005. One of the founders of the project told the Washington Post, as the reason for the closure: “mission accomplished”.

That is why I agree with Ibrahami. However, Muslims and Americans alike must speak against extremists, violence and war.

I was recently told by an American gentlemen that the only way to achieve peace in the ME is to enforce it.Unfortunately this is how a lot of American politicians feel and it is the basis of this administrations policies. No wonder why nothing is working out and the conflicts are getting from bad to worse.
Dr Al-Tayer analyzes the situation very accurately but the politicians and the decision makers are not listening

I was recently told by an American gentlemen that the only way to achieve peace in the ME is to enforce it.Unfortunately this is how a lot of American politicians feel and it is the basis of this administrations policies. No wonder why nothing is working out and the conflicts are getting from bad to worse.
Dr Al-Tayer analyzes the situation very accurately but the politicians and the decision makers are not listening

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