Lisa Miller: Is It Good for the Jews? - On Faith at washingtonpost.com

Hi this message is for Lisa Miller. My wife and I love to read her "Belief Watch" articles. We would like to ask her to find out more about "reincarnation" by reading the work of Allan Kardec the french educator (1800's) who really can explain to anyone, from any faith, what it is all about in a very reasoning and logic way differing from the Hindus (India or other cultures). Allan Karde was a very famous French at his time about this subject and we are surprise that we dont find his books and comentary about him on any american magazines, even the "spiritual" ones.... Go ALLAN KARDEC on Google and learned about this man who has his books translated from french to most of the world's language now! Please, when you read one of them let us know with your feedback! TKS!!!

January 27, 2008 8:08 PM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on January 27, 2008 20:08

aloisio correia:

Hi this message is for Lisa Miller. My wife and I love to read her "Belief Watch" articles. We would like to ask her to find out more about "reincarnation" by reading the work of Allan Kardec the french educator (1800's) who really can explain to anyone, from any faith, what it is all about in a very reasoning and logic way differing from the Hindus (India or other cultures). Allan Karde was a very famous French at his time about this subject and we are surprise that we dont find his books and comentary about him on any american magazines, even the "spiritual" ones.... Go ALLAN KARDEC on Google and learned about this man who has his books translated from french to most of the world's language now! Please, when you read one of them let us know with your feedback! TKS!!!

January 27, 2008 8:08 PM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on January 27, 2008 20:08

maryann:

--You take the lies out of Victoria, and she'll shrink to the size of a hat; but you take the malice out of her, and she'll disappear.

January 12, 2008 9:35 AM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on January 12, 2008 09:35

Some omissions:

Whatever happened to Meyer Lansky, Ethel and Julius Rosenberg, Jonathan Pollard, Meir Kahane- among others? Why not have a good panoramic view of American Jewish life, warts and all instead of some self-congratulatory, navel-gazing extravaganza.

January 12, 2008 12:39 AM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on January 12, 2008 00:39

VICTORIA:

maryan- i watch pbs all the time-

this coming month, after the 15th, african american month starts on pbs- then in march theres a short stint of irish history-

theres the many many ken burns documentaires-
im a big fan of documentaries-

it just wasnt a very interesting documentary, thats all.

yitz- actually it was explained to me that the matrilineal descent was for the very practical reason that you ALWAYS know who your mother is.

January 11, 2008 12:52 PM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on January 11, 2008 12:52

ama:

It seems that people with an identifiable ethnic identity tend to value their ethnicity. In contrast, people with a mixed or unknown ethnic background tend to devalue or ignore ethnicity or express some hostility (e.g., calling it "xenophobia") toward ethnic identity. This "chat" is about a TV show describing the development of one ethnic group in this country. I'd also like to see shows about other American ethnic groups, including Germans, Scotch-Irish, English, Koreans, etc. Our country is a melting pot, as you know.

January 11, 2008 11:02 AM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on January 11, 2008 11:02

Dan:

Candide wrote: "The problem of Judaism is the problem of archaic religion in general. Judaism, for a variety of reasons, faces the crisis first. Is there any content to Judaism other than ethnic identity? Judaism began as ethnic identity and persists for the same reason. It is a religion in the Roman sense: the binding together of a group."

Yes, Jewish identity is important to us because as one poster noted, there are only 13 million Jews in a world of 6 billion people. We walk a line where we are assimilated but still want to preserve our identity.

Second, there is a large amount of content, as you put it. For example The Torah which describes the first days of humanity starting with the Garden of Eden, prayer books for the High Holy Days, Rosh Hashannah and Yom Kippur, and the Haggadah which we read for Passover and details the Jewish people's exodus from Egypt. We have a rich and interesting history and don't want to see it forgotten by future generations.

January 11, 2008 9:24 AM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on January 11, 2008 09:24

Asim MA, San Antonio:

Lisa,
Could u pls some info on your book "The Bible & the Quran;" is it on comparative religion? And also publishing info.//Thanks

January 11, 2008 5:03 AM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on January 11, 2008 05:03

Asim MA, San Antonio:

Victoria is a most open-minded, balanced and objective American Muslim that I have seen on this and other forms.

January 11, 2008 5:01 AM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on January 11, 2008 05:01

ridiculous rationales:

people will come up with the most abstruse and implausible pretexts imaginable in order to avoid
mixing with "others", "infidels", "goyim" or whatever the appelation du jour might be. why don't some of you just admit you only want to be with your own? this is usually called ethnocentrism or, in extreme cases, xenophobia.

January 11, 2008 12:09 AM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on January 11, 2008 00:09

yitz:

Ama,

Just to clarify about why the determination of Jewishness depends on who is the parent.

Centuries ago Judaism was determined according to patrilineal descent. The rabbis later changed that to matrilineal descent for one reason, as far as I am to understand. That is, children are more likely to be with a mother than a father. We see this today in our own legal code. Don't courts favor the mother? It was a realization of the strong bond between mother and child. Remember that Jews used to be tribal. The father was the head of the household. The father determined many things for his family/tribe. Religion was one of those things. I don't remember when the change happened, but it was centuries ago. Don't most people today use the last name of their father? It seems there are some holdovers even in our own culture.

Also, to those who don't understand the argument against intermarriage please consider the following. Several years ago, there was a study conducted that concluded that over half of the American Jewish population had intermarried, and that by the time those people had grandchildren the grandchildren didn't identify as Jews. After this study many people in the community took issue with the statistics of the study and how it was conducted. However, if even a fraction of these numbers were true it is still alarming to the Jewish community. The problem is that to maintain one's Jewishness in a secular society requires a strong Jewish identity and unwavering commitment to one's faith. For many reasons, the current and possibly future generations of Jews lack such commitment due to a lack of proper Jewish education. I know too many people in my community who have intermarried and more that lack such a commitment. It's a sad situation that the Jewish community is intimately aware of and currently dealing with. Furthermore, when two adults (Jewish and non-Jewish) come together and form a family they impose their morals, values and beliefs on their children. That would seem normal to most people. Children, however, do not have the ability to distinguish between one set of religious beliefs and another. Statistics have shown that when parents try to be even-handed and try to raise the children using both religions the children do not feel grounded in either. This can be exemplified by those who celebrate Christmas and Channukah. That may seem innocuous to some, but what about taking them to Church and Synagogue. The religions are fundamentally opposed to each other at their core. Children look to us for guidance as to how to distinguish one thing from another; right from wrong, etc. They see everything in black and white until their teen years. So, intermarried couples may make an adult decision, but it is the rare intermarried family that is able to raise children with a strong Jewish identity.

Lastly, the Reform movement's decision to use patrilineal descent has really screwed things up for the rest of us. Imagine that I'm in synagogue and am speaking with an individual and I want to invite him to participate in my service. Suddenly I find out about his lineage. He believes he is Jewish even though only his father is Jewish. By my beliefs he is not. How embarrassing is that situation. It has just complicated matters on many fronts.

January 10, 2008 11:51 PM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on January 10, 2008 23:51

Will Jones:

During the Roman Empire a "baron," also called "palast," was tasked as an official of Rome. His jurisdiction was the "Palace District," also called the Palastine. The form we are most familiar with is Palatine. According to Hobbes and, America's Founder, Thomas Jefferson, the same families of the Roman Empire became the rulers of the Roman Church. The Maronite Roman Catholics know driving the "Palastinian problem" share the Vatican/papal priesthood and hierarchy. During the Holocaust Rome failed in its latest attempt to exterminate the Jews (Viz. Goldhagen "A Moral Reckoning"), now Rome's agents are attempting to cultivate the same exterminationist philosophy among the Muslim Arabs.

There is no more Roman Empire. Rome lost. They no longer enslave the Jews. There is no Palastine. Get over it. Get along with the State of Israel or humbly accept the curse due you.

January 10, 2008 11:39 PM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on January 10, 2008 23:39

HOW ABOUT A WIDER VIEW?:

I would like to see PBS do a documentary on the Jewish experience in Russia - particularly the role of assimilated Jews before, during, and after the Bolshevik takeover in 1917 but I'm afraid it would be too much of a hot-button issue. Detailed accounts backed up by original sources may be found in Yuri Slezkine's eye-opening "The Jewish Century" and/or Alexander Solzhenitsyn's yet to be translated "Two Hundred Years Together".

January 10, 2008 11:00 PM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on January 10, 2008 23:00

ama:

Seems to me that the term "intermarriage" refers to marriage between people of different ethnic groups, but I see that it's also applicable to marriage between people with different religious backgrounds. Seems also that intermarriage would be more significant with regard to genetically transmitted characteristics (such as physical appearance) than it would for characteristics that are not transmitted genetically. Wouldn't religious preference be transmitted to children through education and environment, rather than through genetic material? If so, then intermarriage should not be a significant factor in transmitting religious preferences to the next generation . . . unless, of course, the parents disagree on what should be taught.

January 10, 2008 10:45 PM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on January 10, 2008 22:45

On intermarriage:

In response to the comment: "Do you not see how complaints about intermarriage show a disdain for the gentiles, which then leads to their disdain of Jews?"

Two points:
1) I think you have this backwards. There was anti-Semitism long before the rates of intermarriage skyrocketed and it was ever discussed as a potential issue. I don't think a lack of support for intermarriage prompted the Nuremburg laws. Or the argument for keeping Jews in ghettos. Or more informal practices in teh 1950s and 60s of not selling homes in certain towns to Jews, blacks, etc. Or not letting them into certain universities or professions.
2) Every other group wants their kids to be like them--why is it so wrong of the Jews? Everyone in my rather diverse group of friends has had to deal with this to some extent. And there is a vast difference between complaints and genuine concern for preserving an ancient culture. When you bring home to mom and dad the love of your life--as I have--who happens to have been born into a religion that prays for you to leave the religion of your parents and grandparents, can you expect everyone to be thrilled? I feel blessed that I have parents who fully support and respect my choices--and realize that they don't mean I have any lack of respect for my upbringing or intention to turn my back on it whatsoever--and a wonderful person whose family is just happy that we are happy, with no apparent intention of asking/praying/expecting/demanding that I change.

January 10, 2008 8:07 PM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on January 10, 2008 20:07

ama:

Regarding intermarriage, does anyone know whether Italian-American or Irish-American families prefer that their offspring marry within their ethnic groups? How about other ethnic groups?

January 10, 2008 5:25 PM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on January 10, 2008 17:25

David:

It seems true that the relative lack of adversity is having a harmful effect on the cohesiveness of the Jewish community. Like the nuclear family the support system of multiple relatives living nearby, of having the vetting process family and friends formerly served when looking for a mate, the dispersion and full integration into American life has robbed the current generations of something that was extremely important in the first 3/4 of the 20th century.

I do feel that loss (I'm 70 so I can remember the E. LA shtetl of my childhood) but along with the loss I can also say that life is very, very good for me and the generations which have followed me.

January 10, 2008 4:40 PM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on January 10, 2008 16:40

Elizabeth Renant:

I see the usual nut-jobs are out on each side - there's Mr. Ellis insisting from the heights of his musical knowledge pinnacle that George Gershwin's music doesn't belong on the same planet with Fats Wallers' (oh give me a break - take a look at the score to Porgy & Bess someday, the Rhapsody in Blue, the songs he wrote that everyone is still singing, etc. etc.) and that all the jazz produced by black ghetto densizens is more important to humanity than, say Albert Einstein's discoveries, on which most of western science now rests. Hey, I'm sorry you're so outraged at Jews feeling good about their achievements under, shall we say, for the most part really difficult circumstances, but get real. There's room for Fats Waller and George Gershwin on the planet, and the racist superiority you're trying to support here only points up your rage and envy.

As for those piously pointing out the dismay over Jewish intermarriage - if you look for it, you'll find it all over the place: among Christians, American Indians and their arguments about full vs. mixed blood Indians, among Muslims who ALSO don't want their kids marrying out, etc., etc., etc., ad nauseam ad infinitum. How heinous of the Jews with their very particular heritage to want to preserve it through their families!!! Why, they should be charmed to see it all disappear into some White Bread culture!!!! Again, get real.

The same people wringing their heads over Jewish self-separation should take a look at Wahhabist Islam, and how Christians and other minorities are treated in Muslim countries, such as, for example, those great examplars of ecumenical outreach, the Saudis. They make the Jews look like amateurs.

And lastly, I see the usual club of anti-Semites disguised as anti-Israel types are out in force, as if every Jew on the planet were responsible (hey, collective guilt - ever hear of that?) for every action taken by the Israeli government. I wonder what they'd say if we all held every Muslim on the planet responsible for 9/11, not to mention the genocide against black Muslims being perpetrated by the Arab Muslims of the government of Khartoum in the Sudan. 300,000 people dead in concentration camps in three years. Hey, they make Saddam Hussein AND Israel look like amateurs! But funny, the people who come out of the woodwork hysterical about Israel and the Jews are NEVER interested in what's going on Darfur. Funny about that.

The Jews are a remarkable people with a remarkable history. They aren't perfect, but then neither is any other ethnic group on this planet. But only the Jews are expected to be.

January 10, 2008 2:40 PM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on January 10, 2008 14:40

MHughes976:

It seems very strange to suggest that there is some sort of moral obligation on those of Jewish blood to support Israel. What would people say if it were suggested that those with no Jewish ancestry to show racial solidarity with non-Jews everywhere and show strong opposition to Israel?

January 10, 2008 2:40 PM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on January 10, 2008 14:40

Anonymous:

A fun game:

1) Start an online discussion about Jewish culture & identity
2) Count the number of posts it takes before things tangent off to "zionistracistnaziapartheid" diatribes
3) If that number is less than 10, you lose!

... I haven't won in over seven years :(

January 10, 2008 2:21 PM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on January 10, 2008 14:21

Steve G:

Yup, the program was diluted PBS eyewash. But if you didn't know anything about the subject, it was mildly helpful and better than repeats of crime shows in the same time period.

Pertaining to this comments column. I don't see why the WaPo moderators allow it to be turned over to someone who is obviously having mental problems and the usual range of fervid Israel bashers.

It was a program about the history Jews in America, most of which happened before Israel was established.

January 10, 2008 2:06 PM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on January 10, 2008 14:06

Anon:

Why in the world would the editors post JJ's spamming hissyfit and not his original post? Was it really *that* bad??

January 10, 2008 1:35 PM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on January 10, 2008 13:35

JBE:

ANY Jew who DOES NOT speak out at the actions of Israel against the Palestinian people CANNOT BE a good Jew, nor a "good christian".

PERIOD.

No person supporting the occupation, or celibrating the misery of the Palestinians since the creation of the Israeli nation can claim to be "Jewish".

Those "Guns and Moses" shirts are DISGUSTINGLY UN JEWISH.

People who say "Israel is just defending herself" are wrong. Israel is the power giant in the region, controlls the land, the water, the roads, the seas, and all of the thousands of military/police checkpoints. Israel controls the flow of food, medicine, diapers, and virtually all commerce to Palestinians, and should be treating women and children refugees with compassion... NOT bulldozing homes.

As for the Palestinians - Palestinians need to rise up, throw out, and DESTROY islamic jihaad, Hamas, and all of the other terrorist organizations, of which there are many little splinter groups. Israel will NEVER agree to a free Palestine while terrorists have safe haven in Palestine.

It takes two to tango - but we Jews are no longer the victims of the world. The Palestinians ARE victims of Israeli millitary occupation, suffering tyhe same fate Jews across time have suffered at the hands of their "host countries".

As for the radical fundamentalist fringe evangelicals who move to Israel waiting for the second coming to inherit the holy land?

GET THE HELL OUT AND STOP STOKING HATE AND DEATH IN THE NAME OF JESUS. HE FINDS YOU, AND YOUR ACTIONS DISGUSTING, I ASSURE YOU.

January 10, 2008 1:31 PM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on January 10, 2008 13:31

Anonymous:

'I' posted , as always, NO ugly curses.

No racial or religious Overtones.

i did not even attach a Web Link (knowing you only allow 2 links) yet you delete some after postings!????, especially you competition's links!

It was Pure Academic!

WAPO, Is it the Writer Strike & you's are desperate for "ORGIGINAL" Content????

Then Pay us oldest active bloggers!

What's wrong??????

What could have i possibly said wrong??

LUBAVITCH jewry? SATMAR jewry [the ones who root with IRAN?? BOBOV jewry? HASSIDIC jewry? ULTRA-ORTHRODOX? or Sect/cult's?

EDITOR, Please, Please review, answer or Post All of It! Yes in Entirty, zero ommissions.!!

Where is me original Post????

EDITOR! EDITOR! EDiTOR! Ms. SALLY? Mr. WATERS? Ms. LISA? et al?

What am "i" doing wrong????

Using" "ZION" "Penis" "Screw" "Russia" "Aske-Nazi"...???????

January 10, 2008 1:30 PM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on January 10, 2008 13:30

JBE:

ANY Jew who DOES NOT speak out at the actions of Israel against the Palestinian people CANNOT BE a good Jew, nor a "good christian".

PERIOD.

No person supporting the occupation, or celibrating the misery of the Palestinians since the creation of the Israeli nation can claim to be "Jewish".

Those "Guns and Moses" shirts are DISGUSTINGLY UN JEWISH.

People who say "Israel is just defending herself" are wrong. Israel is the power giant in the region, controlls the land, the water, the roads, the seas, and all of the thousands of military/police checkpoints. Israel controls the flow of food, medicine, diapers, and virtually all commerce to Palestinians, and should be treating women and children refugees with compassion... NOT bulldozing homes.

As for the Palestinians - Palestinians need to rise up, throw out, and DESTROY islamic jihaad, Hamas, and all of the other terrorist organizations, of which there are many little splinter groups. Israel will NEVER agree to a free Palestine while terrorists have safe haven in Palestine.

It takes two to tango - but we Jews are no longer the victims of the world. The Palestinians ARE victims of Israeli millitary occupation, suffering tyhe same fate Jews across time have suffered at the hands of their "host countries".

As for the radical fundamentalist fringe evangelicals who move to Israel waiting for the second coming to inherit the holy land?

GET THE HELL OUT.

January 10, 2008 1:30 PM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on January 10, 2008 13:30

Anonymous:

'I' posted , as always, NO ugly curses.

No racial or religious Overtones.

i did not even attach a Web Link (knowing you only allow 2 links) yet you delete some after postings!????, especially you competition's links!

It was Pure Academic!

WAPO, Is it the Writer Strike & you's are desperate for "ORGIGINAL" Content????

Then Pay us oldest active bloggers!

What's wrong??????

What could have i possibly said wrong??

LUBAVITCH jewry? SATMAR jewry [the ones who root with IRAN?? BOBOV jewry? HASSIDIC jewry? ULTRA-ORTHRODOX? or Sect/cult's?

EDITOR, Please, Please review, answer or Post All of It! Yes in Entirty, zero ommissions.!!

Where is me original Post????

EDITOR! EDITOR! EDiTOR! Ms. SALLY? Mr. WATERS? Ms. LISA? et al?

What am "i" doing wrong????

Using" "ZION" "Penis" "Screw" "Russia" "Aske-Nazi"...???????

Please 'POST' my intellectaul property (not Your for the stealing) or courteously answer/reply to me A.S.A.P., Thank you!??????

Thank you for commenting.