All Comments (79)

SHE ISA GOOD GIRL

It's interesting that people seem to have rejected Mubarak's ideas simply because they don't like how she's dressed in her picture or her personal faith. How about actually considering the ideas she puts forward and thinking about them critically, instead of letting your personal prejudices get in the way?
A spade is a spade, no matter who calls it.

Sure, there are problems in the Muslim world especially in relation to women, but that's not the point of the article.

Also, who are you to say that because Ms. Mubarak wear the hijab she is objectified or oppressed, and therefore conclude that she has no right to contribute to this debate? Perhaps she wears it, like many Muslim women do, as a statement that she wishes to be judged by her character, intellect and personality and not by her physical appearance. If that is the case, she has every right to be critical of a trend in society that seems to focus on a woman's appearance as the measure of her value, as opposed to her principles or character. Any woman who chooses to reject that idea for herself has the right to be critical of it.

I also just have to say that whoever said that Ms. Mubarak 'doing this kind of thing in an Islamic nation could get her killed' is ignorant. She couldn't say so in Egypt? How about Malaysia? There are many different Muslim countries in the world and the freedoms they allow their citizens vary greatly. I would suggest that such a person learn about the world from say, actual books, or perhaps even actually talking to people from other parts of the world, and not Fox News or right wing talk-radio hosts.

peace

observer- you seem to be unanaware that the first university in the world was founded by muslims. as was the very concept of scientific method, without which science as we know it would not exist.

sans- just as you feel encroached upon by (what you believe) to be someone oher than yourself defining what is morality to you-

you feel comfortable imposing your opinion upon muslim women.

you are wrong.
speak for yourself only.

i am a muslim woman.
i am a feminist, as were my mother and grandmother (generations before the term even existed)
i wear hijab, and am not "enslaved" by my CHOICE
i am free

it is not your place, right, or business to judge what another person is or isn't.

MO:

You say "science and technology and common human morality and understanding is a gift and mercey from the creator god to mankind not the inspiaration nor the affect of jeudochristianity"

Well if you are right that science and technology are a gift handed down by the Creator as opposed to humans using their God given brains, then why Allah had denied your cult any of that gift? Have you ever asked yourself that? The reason your cult has contributed zilch to science and technology is because your so- called “Scholars” are involved in heated discussions on how many nymphs the Believers will have in Paradise and how many wings does the Archangel Gabriel has, as the rest of humanity passed you by. Their minds are unlike yours'; not trapped in a box. A liberated mind is innovative and creative, but that is something beyond you and your cult’ s comprehension.
You of all people talking about rationality. What is rational about kissing pebbles plastered on a cubical structure and revolving around that structure in the Hejaz desert? What is rational about facing a black stone five times a day? Are you surprised why such a mentality could not invent a mop or manufacture a needle? A mentality that does not know how to build but adept at destroying.

There is no such thing as a "Muslim feminist". So long as you wear that hijab, your enslaving yourself to cultural/religious ideas - you're not free and not a feminist.

Our society's not undergoing a "moral crisis" either. I agree, marketing in many societies can become tacky and tasteless and our society allows that, but just because the vast majority of this society doesn't follow *your* definition of morals doesn't mean that there's a crisis.

Shell Script, Shell Script, Shell Script

Repeating yourself with a computer is trivial.
Repeating yourself with a computer is trivial.
Repeating yourself with a computer is trivial.

Your posts are boring.
Your posts are boring.
Your posts are boring.

So cut the cut-and-paste.
So cut the cut-and-paste.
So cut the cut-and-paste.

It is a new day, so say a new thing.
It is a new day, so say a new thing.
It is a new day, so say a new thing.

Pseudo, Pseudo, Pseudo,

Unfortunately the facts demand repetition. Learn from them. Thumping the bible is out by the way. Thumping the facts is in!!!! Live with it.

Shell Script, Shell Script, Shell Script

Repeating yourself with a computer is trivial.
Repeating yourself with a computer is trivial.
Repeating yourself with a computer is trivial.

Your posts are boring.
Your posts are boring.
Your posts are boring.

So cut the cut-and-paste.
So cut the cut-and-paste.
So cut the cut-and-paste.

It is a new day, so say a new thing.
It is a new day, so say a new thing.
It is a new day, so say a new thing.

Genuine FREEDOM OF THOUGHT IS HERE!

The RELIGION OF EVERYTHING IS HERE!

Huggs n Kisses to ALL!

J
O
Z
E
V
Z
.
U
S

J
O
Z
E
V
Z
.
U
S

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=peFQWuk4nuo&feature=related

UNDERCOVER MOSQUE! THOUSANDS INVOLVED!

Aboloish islam in Sweet sweet U.S.A.! Remove Tax free Status & Building permitts etc..!

mind liberation and spirit elevation?

worship the creator not the creation.
common sense is a treasure .

the old spice proverb about the ass who carry a book is coined for mankind who is full of knowledge full of science full of technology full of philosophy full of books full of sophistication but all that doesnot lead him/her to know the creator god of this universe?????

jesus never created any thing in this universe,science and technology never created any thing in this universe,human brains ,human philosophy never created any thing in this universe.

the (affect )of jeudochristianity on humanity is the fact that they brought to mankind the myth and idol so called son of god who never existed and if you examine old jeudochristianity or the new jeudochrstianity they all the same all about idolism all about delusionism all about creation worshiping .

science and technology and common human morality and understanding is a gift and mercey from the creator god to mankind not the inspiaration nor the affect of jeudochristianity.

again and again and again,
the truth is one and delusions are many .for those who call themselfs rationalits and scientists and civilizests please let them scrutnizingly examine world delusionism !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!.

Pseudo, Pseudo, Pseudo,

Unfortunately the facts demand repetition. Learn from them. Thumping the bible is out by the way. Thumping the facts is in!!!! Live with it.

Concatenated Shell Script So Repetitive:

"Freedom to speak, repeat and preach!!!!"

Preaching at people is different from preaching to them...
Preaching at people is different from preaching to them...
Preaching at people is different from preaching to them...
Preaching at people is different from preaching to them...

"And I gained this right by protecting it in our War vs. the Terror and Aggression of the USSR. I trust you also served your country in some respect in your life."

For any meritorious service to the Nation I thank you. I do not suggest that you have no right to say what you do, over, and over, and over again. Just that it is repetitive and about as interesting as last week's news paper, which, like you, still says the same thing today as a week ago.

Copy-paste is not communication.
Copy-paste is not communication.
Copy-paste is not communication.
Copy-paste is not communication.
Copy-paste is not communication.
Copy-paste is not communication.
Copy-paste is not communication.
Copy-paste is not communication.

You can do better.
You can do better.
You can do better.
You can do better.
You can do better.
You can do better.
You can do better.
You can do better.

Some of us have been bothered by Duality displayed in Public domain back to the JFK days. There has always been this kind of double standard of private and public morals in my life.

Morality is established very early in age. I attended a strict Southern Baptist Church Bible School and worship services during JFK days. During those sermons the Preacher condemned immorality to include booze, gambling and smoking cigarettes for that matter. In the back of my mind during those sermons, I flashed back to the loud card party that had just occured on Saturday Night previous to that sermon. And I asked myself, "What is wrong with this picture ?" Were not my parents and neighbors good Christians ? I supposed I learned that I could act immorally if in fact, I did not get caught in the act.

I think Catholics of our neighborhood had an advantage in that they could whisper or confess their "sins" to a Priest in private. Therefore some demoninations could relieve conscious while others progressed towards self damnation or becoming "Born Again" for the third or fourth time take your pick.

The worst thing is to be exposed as a hypocrite I guess therefore resignation is expected by public ethics and morality. I have been exposed to private literature of numerous world leaders of the past through modern day discoveries in public domain. There is ample evidence to me that power creates sexual perversion.

On the other side of life, the dog finally cornered a possum that she had been stalking for weeks. She cornered the possum in a wood pile near the garbage. With a "hurry up come here" kind of bark, I broke up a viscious fight. The possum was eliminated by shotgun. The dog was rewarded for doing her job as a natural hunter.

Pseudo,

Again and again and again,

"Freedom to speak, repeat and preach!!!!"

"Freedom to speak, repeat and preach!!!!"

"Freedom to speak, repeat and preach!!!!"

And I gained this right by protecting it in our War vs. the Terror and Aggression of the USSR. I trust you also served your country in some respect in your life.

Concatenated Shell Script So Limited

"NO ONE IS SAFE UNTIL THE KORAN IS DEFLAWED!!!!!"

Your Jesus Seminar Gods need to be deflawed.

"Freedom to speak, repeat and preach!!!!"

No one wants to be preached to by a shell script or a moron that can only repeat itself.

It is trivial to repeat yourself using a computer.
It is trivial to repeat yourself using a computer.
It is trivial to repeat yourself using a computer.
It is trivial to repeat yourself using a computer.

Your tiny brain needs to be deflawed.
Your tiny brain needs to be deflawed.
Your tiny brain needs to be deflawed.
Your tiny brain needs to be deflawed.
Your tiny brain needs to be deflawed.

Get a life.
Get a life.
Get a life.

Spitzer Case Says NOTHING about our Society's Morality

Kate is right. There are prostitutes or equivalent in every society (except maybe the Amish).

A society WITHOUT them is probably more un-natural.

Though it is more complicated, someone who pays for sex is not all that different from someone who pays for a massage.

Unless you think Sex in and of itself is immoral, in which case you are destructive to healthy human society.

Spitzer's problem was both his Hypocrasy and the fact that he broke a couple of specific laws that may or may not be reasonable to have on the books.

If a man or a woman politician in Nevada, where prostitution is legal, goes next door and pays for services, there is no reason why it should disqualify her from public office.

What is Ms Mubarak trying to imply by the expression "our society is undergoing a moral crisis" A society, like the US society, that in three days musters enough moral outrage so as to force New York´s Governor to resign is not undergoing such moral crisis. On the contrary, it shows the World, again, the US is capable of doing the right thing quickly and no person, no matter how high his or her position, is spared punishment. While there are inmoral people in the US and I agree with Ms. Mubarak too many people in the US are on the wrong moral track, such as advertisers who use a kind of soft porn to sell, as well as a number of young girls linking their self worth to sex appeal, it is irrational to conclude "society is undergoing a moral crisis". Since she chooses to put forward her condition as Muslim as somehow enabling her to feel offended. If we consider the level of morality prevailing in most of the Islamic World it is hard to see how her condition as Muslim can give her any insight, let alone her condition as feminist. In terms of lack of freedom, lack justice, lack of laws and of equality under the law, subjugation of the poor and of women,deviant behaviours and son, Moslem countries are way behind the society Ms Mubarak considers to be "undergoing a moral crisis". Like many others, she is perturbed by the exceses of some under freedom. This leads her to conclude the whole society is in crisis but her conclusion is wrong. As a religious person and a feminist she could do worse than to reflect on why is it that she is able to proclaim herself a "Muslim feminist" precisely in a non Muslim society in safety and freedom far above anything she could find in any Muslim society. She does not dare saying it but she is obviously implying a Muslim society would not fall in the "moral crisis" she finds so perturbing. She should also wonder why is it that it is in the West that women have initiated their liberation and are starting to achieve it. ¿Would she prefer a Moslem society like the ones I as a mere human I am embarrassed to know?

Any religion that blames women for the lust of men has missed the point. If rape had anything to do with lust 90 year old women wouldn't be even occasional victims.

I am sure you will find no disagreement among those who comment to your message and those of various religious and political persuasions. However the bottom line which the ad agencies go by, is what does the pilot group say, will attract their attention.

I will go beyond just the objectification of women and say that it is a product of materialism. And that is caused by an imbalance between the technological and the spiritual progress in our societies. We can pursue the choices and dignity of women but at the same time we have to consider how it is connected with other parts of the society.

The issue is organizing. As individuals we are almost powerless. United, we can achieve something.

Al Taqiyah: Kill non Musloms!:
Please see islamaHolics "IMAMS" talking "SHiat & not Sunni"!

Al Taqiya ( Islamic Zionism). Al Taqiya (Islamic Zionism) Al Taqiyah=World Conquest, not Jewish Conquest!

Too bad there is no such thing as Islamic Zionism, as you put it, although I can't see how there would be, since Zionism is specific to Judaism.

On the other hand, what you do have is Islamism, plain and simple, regardless of what sect you belong to.

Islam and Islamism are the same. It means murdering women for the crime of having been raped, making brothers their murdererers, denying women fundamental human rights, and conquering and killing your own and other people wherever you can. Like Kurds, as a minor instance, or Jews, or Christians.

If you had the Islamic equivalent of Zionism, you would stay on your own land and do what you could to improve it, instead of cultivating racism, hatred, torture, exploitation, and murder.

And while we're at it, why not keep your Islamism to yourself?

Read Torah to begin with, and then move on. May the Lord give you guidance and help you to contribute to perfecting, instead of destroying the world.

Terrils,
I think if you read the rest of my post again, you will see that I agree with you. We all can and should be thought of in more than sexual terms.

Paganplace has it right, repression only increases the efficacy of sexual advertising. Scarcity, real or artificial, always increases demand.

Single, we're not all 'sexual pigs,' but it will be easy for you to see us that way if you hang on to your outrage.

Sometimes you need to think differently. Take it out, kick it around, just for the academic exerciseof it. Now we call it "thinking outside of the box."

Sweden criminally penalizes the John, not the prostitute:

http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/world/AP-Sweden-Prostitution.html

Apparently, it's working. It may be the world's oldest profession but it's not inevitable.

Dear fellow humans, start practicing a reckless and strict egotism by doing whatever you like without endangering the following morning. We are here, believing in which god ever, to use and enjoy life so that the world may say: "Thank You"
But if we risk 80 pieces of gold to win 100 pieces and have to pay 50 of such pieces just to enter the market, we are not very clever. You see: the moment I perform something bad in order to gain something I think to be good, any time I start showing the good I achieved I am reminded of the bad I paid for that so calles good. It is so stupid, in the first place for people who think they had commercial experience. Truly Yours, Andreas von der Decken, Mannheim Germany

A muslim woman, pictured wearing a headscarf, is complaining to me about the objectification of American women.

Hm.

Doing this kind of thing in an Islamic nation can get you killed. And apparently, despite being a "Muslim feminist", she doesn't realize the irony.

Thanks, but I'll pass on the whole Phelpsian claptrap, especially coming from a Muslim.

When natural sexuality isn't repressed and denied and shamed pushed to the subconscious, it's of limited utility in selling people endless consumer goods as a substitute: the human body is *not* degrading or degraded unless we make it so.

Likewise, the very act of trying to repress other people's sexuality is often a surrogate for the sexuality of the repressor, as we see time and again when moralists are caught engaging in the very things they seek to punish others for.

More repression isn't the answer: that only gives the sex-as-advertising *more* power.

The way past that is a mature, healthy, and unconflicted attitude toward sex, not, I'm afraid, throwing fabric over women and *still* sending the message that men are entitled to whatever they manage to see.

Haida,
I found your article most thought-provoking. While I agree with some aspects of your article such as women's bodies are used too much in advertising I strongly disagree with other points such as young women dressing for the sole purpose for the pleasure of males. I found this to be quite untrue in the Middle East where I was an instructor for a women's university. As a female instructor in the classroom, some female students would remove their 'hijab' or veil and sometimes their black robes in order to feel more comfortable in the classroom. Many students had beautiful makeup on and sometimes very form-fitting and scanty clothing. Clearly they were not dressing for the pleasure of men (as they covered up again when they exited the classroom) but perhaps for a very human drive to adorn the body and perhaps as a way to compete with other women. While undoubtedly some women in the West dress to perhaps attract male attention, other women do not have this objective in mind, as they put on makeup and clothes to please themselves as many women in the Middle East do.

Also another point is that women do not have to dress provoctively to attract male attention. In fact, I noticed that in the Middle East that the local males would be more turned on when they strained to see a glimpse of what was underneath the veil and through the black abaya (robes). When going to a mall with my female students, we would often we followed by local males attempting to have contact with the women by trying to drop off their phone numbers in the female students' shopping bags. So the point is that this is a part of a male initiative to seek contact with women. It's part of a very human response.

So while some of your argument may be true in some circumstance it is not necessarily true in all situations.
Best wishes,
Helen

Haida,
I found your article most thought-provoking. While I agree with some aspects of your article such as women's bodies are used too much in advertising I strongly disagree with other points such as young women dressing for the sole purpose for the pleasure of males. I found this to be quite untrue in the Middle East where I was an instructor for a women's university. As a female instructor in the classroom, some female students would remove their 'hijab' or veil and sometimes their black robes in order to feel more comfortable in the classroom. Many students had beautiful makeup on and sometimes very form-fitting and scanty clothing. Clearly they were not dressing for the pleasure of men (as they covered up again when they exited the classroom) but perhaps for a very human drive to adorn the body and perhaps as a way to compete with other women. While undoubtedly some women in the West dress to perhaps attract male attention, other women do not have this objective in mind, as they put on makeup and clothes to please themselves as many women in the Middle East do.

Also another point is that women do not have to dress provoctively to attract male attention. In fact, I noticed that in the Middle East that the local males would be more turned on when they strained to see a glimpse of what was underneath the veil and through the black abaya (robes). When going to a mall with my female students, we would often we followed by local males attempting to have contact with the women by trying to drop off their phone numbers in the female students' shopping bags. So the point is that this is a part of a male initiative to seek contact with women. It's part of a very human response.

So while some of your argument may be true in some circumstance it is not necessarily true in all situations.
Best wishes,
Helen

DZ:
It Can't Be All That Bad:

I will choose to express myself in such way as fits my belief and principles. It is none of your business. It seems that you aren't all that committed to freedom either. Anyone who advocates laws/rules to cover such issues as clothing is a fascist twit and will be called on it. Res ipsa loquitur
~~~~~~~~~~

Be my guest. I never said I supported anything in this article. I was tactfully referencing your "bad mood,." which is really rudeness.

But hey, there are plenty of others for me to talk too.

What else was in Mr. Spitzer's hotel room??? The stench and ghosts of JFK, Bill Clinton, Rudy Giuliani, Newt Gingrich, Gary Hart, Jesse Jackson, Kobe Bryant, Bill Cosby and every Muslim polygamist!!!!!!

It Can't Be All That Bad:

I will choose to express myself in such way as fits my belief and principles. It is none of your business. It seems that you aren't all that committed to freedom either. Anyone who advocates laws/rules to cover such issues as clothing is a fascist twit and will be called on it. Res ipsa loquitur.

Posted on March 15, 2008 01:03

Afshan Kahn:
Excellent Hadia.

"I totally agree that scantily dressed women are a constant source of excitement to men and it would be a good idea to have rules about what is permitted in a decent respectable society.

Long skirts or long pants should be required on all females over 13, and ideally only black clothes should be permitted. Very baggy ones.

Womens' faces and heads should be covered totally as in decent middle eastern countries. It is the only way to prevent men's bizarre preoccupation with seeing women always as sex objects. It is disgusting and quite puzzling.

Why western men are such disgusting beasts I can only understand as being caused or exacerbated by the immoral western permissive society where people go around half naked.

I am proud to say that my husband would never let me out of the house dressed like that."
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Sweetie, I hate to break the bad news to you but scantly dressed women are not the problem, it is that men are sexual pigs and will say and do anything to get you in the bedroom.

Once they have had sex with you they will leave so quickly and not even take the time to put on their sox back on but shove them in their pocket on the way out the door. Now that is what I call a sexually driven pig.

BTW, if I ever get married again, which is highly unlikely, no man is going to dictate how I dress, period.

DZ:
Afshan Kahn:

"What disgusting fascist garbage. We will not have rules about clothing in a free country. Do you not understand the concept of freedom? You do not get to decide for other people. We decide for ourselves and it's none of your business. If you don't want to live in a free country then please get out of this one."
~~~~~~~~~~~~

What is wrong? Did you wake in a bad mood?
Your are being just plain nasty.

Please, tone it down a bit.

Afshan Kahn:

What disgusting fascist garbage. We will not have rules about clothing in a free country. Do you not understand the concept of freedom? You do not get to decide for other people. We decide for ourselves and it's none of your business. If you don't want to live in a free country then please get out of this one.

MO, aka Moody

You say:
‘for those who call themselfs rationalsts and scientists and reasonsts let them examine the creed and the back ground of jeudochristianity and let them examine the effect and affliction of jeudochristianty on those who born and breast fed in jeudochristianty .’

I tell you the “ affect” that Christianity had on humanity. It elevated the spirits and liberated the mind of those who adopted it that now they are at the top of every human endeavor. Name it; science, technology, industry governance, liberties, human rights, academia, philosophy theology , exploration, etc. They added to their continent four more just in the past half millennium in addition to the moon. They are in the process of claiming the planets of our solar system and eventually the whole Universe. Can you claim any of this to your cult? While the rest of the world is moving forward those of the Black Stone cult are moving backward. Any wonder?

Muslim-Christian understanding: The attempt to persuade Christians of the "superiority" of one outdated brand of superstition over another outdated brand of superstition. Hadia has no choice but to parrot what her men told her - and she honestly believes them. Superstition goes very well together with honesty, with passion, with love, with hatred, with murder - but not with reason.

Sexuality is the basis for life. It is the religions' fault to have perverted it into sin. "Immaculate conception", a hilarious example of this perversion. And Mohamed having the permission of "Allah" to sleep with children and innumerable women - another hilarious attempt of legitimizing sexual incontinence - and millions worship him. Incredible. Thousands are killed and maimed in Iraq, but all people care about is Spitzer's sex - nobody was even injured. Hadia herself suffers from this. It is not the objectification of women, it is the religious perverted infatuation with the "sin" of sex that damages the minds, including her's.

The real dignity of the human race starts with the gradual abolition of religions.

Spitzer's "sin" is the fraud he committed, the hypocrisy, not the sex he had with whomsoever.

Pseudo,

Freedom to speak, repeat and preach!!!!
Freedom to speak, repeat and preach!!!!
Freedom to speak, repeat and preach!!!!

"NO ONE IS SAFE UNTIL THE KORAN IS DEFLAWED!!!!!

the culture affliction of jeudochristianity.

moses came to the sons of isreal carrying a great book full of light and guidance (tora)but yet among the sons of isreal who chose to worship the golden calf ??????????????.

jesus son of marry came to mankind carrying the ingeeel a divine book full of light and guidance ,but yet among people in his era who chose to worship jesus himself instead of the creator god who sent jesus and before he sent moses .

mankind in 21century worship his/her brain the allmighty brain became an idol bow and prostrate to around the clock,instead of worshiping the creator of all the brains .

the brain idol is no more no less than the golden calf no more no less than the son idol.

for those who call themselfs rationalsts and scientists and reasonsts let them examine the creed and the back ground of jeudochristianity and let them examine the effect and affliction of jeudochristianty on those who born and breast fed in jeudochristianty .

Excellent Hadia.

I totally agree that scantily dressed women are a constant source of excitement to men and it would be a good idea to have rules about what is permitted in a decent respectable society.

Long skirts or long pants should be required on all females over 13, and ideally only black clothes should be permitted. Very baggy ones.

Womens' faces and heads should be covered totally as in decent middle eastern countries. It is the only way to prevent men's bizarre preoccupation with seeing women always as sex objects. It is disgusting and quite puzzling.

Why western men are such disgusting beasts I can only understand as being caused or exacerbated by the immoral western permissive society where people go around half naked.

I am proud to say that my husband would never let me out of the house dressed like that.

Concerned Moron Totally Repetitive:

In case you missed this:

Nobody has missed your stupidity.
Nobody has missed your stupidity.
Nobody has missed your stupidity.
Nobody has missed your stupidity.
Nobody has missed your stupidity.
Nobody has missed your stupidity.
Nobody has missed your stupidity.
Nobody has missed your stupidity.

Hmmm, what was you biggest mistake?
Hmmm, what was you biggest mistake?
Hmmm, what was you biggest mistake?
Hmmm, what was you biggest mistake?

Self righteousness?
Self superiority?
Hate speech? Boorishness?
Mindless repetition?

Do the readers of On Faith a service. Quit the cut-and-paste. Are you a shell script or a moron?

Cross posting with repetitions from other blogs is an insult to the readers here.
Cross posting with repetitions from other blogs is an insult to the readers here.
Cross posting with repetitions from other blogs is an insult to the readers here.
Cross posting with repetitions from other blogs is an insult to the readers here.
Cross posting with repetitions from other blogs is an insult to the readers here.

Get a life.
Get a life.
Get a life.

Neira:
You fault me for “lowering the level” of your prophet. I did not make up that story, but copied it from the Muslim literature and the Quran, and did that because it fits in with our topic. If the story demeans the prophet he must have brought it out on himself. The number of wives was not the point of the post. The point is that his house was full of wives and yet he saw fit to sleep with a mistress on a night allotted to Hafsa, one of his younger wives and the daughter of his friend and successor Umar ibn el Khattab.
I do appreciate your friendly wishes. Ibrahim

In case you missed this:

Hmmm, what was Mr. Spitzer's biggest mistake??

He did not become a Muslim. Had he, he could have declared his call girls his other wives and been above the law at least in the Islamic world.

Yeah right wew have done such a wonderful job that we no have antibiotic strains of syphilis, gonorrhea, and several diseases for which there is no known cure all in an attempt to allow us to behave as selfishly and with as little remorse for those we have harmed as possible. And with as little concern for consequences.

But you go ahead and tell yourself that your pleasure is more important than anything else in life. But in the end you will merely grow old and jaded and find you have to go further and further to get the same level of pleasure that simple sex once did for you. Pleasure in the end is more addictive than cocaine and a far worse master.

Drcha writes, TOTALLY IRRELEVENTLY

"I applaud your article. In a society where parental guidance is limited and media impact abounds."

Eliot Spitzer had MANIACAL parental guidance, and probably was not allowed to watch tv. He went to the finest schools and got a great education with the highest values attached.

You totally misdiagnose the reasons for his behavior because it suits your own unexamined prejudices of how the world works.

You simplistic explanations may comfort you, but they have nothing to do with reality.

To Mr. ,

Ibrahim Mahfouz:

may Allah almighty, open your heart for the right path, may god shower you with mercy and barka,

please, do not lower prophet Mohamed (peace and blessing be upon him) to this level, he married 9 waifs and each one for different reason not for intimacy
may god open you basera ( inner vision) the only guide is from the almighty god, God have the power over you, your email is so offences , why your respond that bad because she maddest in her look?? if she has different name and different look
and said “let’s look at our society’s “ would you respond in the same way ???? i do not think so

may god shower you with mercy and show you the right path, and give you knowledge and wisdom
wish you the best

Dear sister,
I applaud your article. In a society where parental guidance is limited and media impact abounds. The values portrayed by the media seep into young hears and are hard to get rid of. One can make some hair splitting. However, in general your observation is correct. Most of the stone throwers deserve to be stoned ahead of Spitzer.

Mo:
It is mind boggling that somebody belonging to your cult; the “Black Stone” worship cult, would speak about reason and rationality. Every page of your religion book is a an assault on human reason and rationality. Explain to the “infidels” how does rotating around a rock would wipe out a lifelong worth of sins?

Hadia Mubarak,
it is so simple: we have FREEDOM OF SPEECH in here
and this includes freedon of printing certain photos or showing certain movies; this is more important that anything else.
Give me freedom or give me dead.

Hadia Mubarak,
it is so simple: we have FREEDOM OF SPEECH in here
and this is more important that anything else.
Give me freedom or give me dead.

Hadia:

You are the recipient of a unique honor: for the first time I agree with everything an "On Faith" panelist or contributor has written.

The Spitzer situation is definately a sign of the times. As a person of faith I don't believe in coincidences.

I remember seeing a PBS documentary called "The Merchants of Cool" several years ago that struck some of the same chords you wrote about.

In an ever smaller concentrated group, the corporate elite of certain industries, creators of entertainment and advertisers are dictating what our youth sees. It's manipulation, plain and simple, and it's more insidious than anything the world has seen. You could call it "anti-faith."

Our media is addicting and it promotes deviancy by design. I don't even own a television anymore because I refuse to buy into this shallowness.

You hit the nail on the head when you said that our society is in "moral crisis." I no longer have faith that our corrupt system of government has any intention of challenging this situation.

I put my faith in God alone.

Like you I have noticed certain things that indicate that this immorality is getting worse.

I went to the movies for the first time in several years and was shocked by the trailers. I watched three-quarters of "The Mist," even with its anti-Christian message, before walking out.

Even the lingerie ads in the newspaper are often incredibly more revealing than when I was a teenager. What can possibly be the point? The incredibly tight clothing that is in style now is designed to promote a society where hedonism and sexual gratification are worshipped. Even young girls wear shorts with writing on their rear ends as if they had something to look at.

I used to buy into the whole thing. Now, from a different perspective I question the superficiality of a lifestyle that unnaturally elevates the value of the sex act, something so basic and rudimentary that even animals can accomplish it. There's more to life than pleasure.

For more thoughts on Spitzer, see: http://www.carlrollinsblog.com/id31.html

"You wrote "let’s look at our own society’s encouragement of deviant practices through the ways in which women’s bodies are exploited, commodified and objectified." How about we look at our society's encouragement of deviant conservative practices though the ways in which women are pressured to hide their bodies and learn to be ashamed of their bodies. Lets look at how women are led to believe that if they are not hidden and ashamed, then they are automatically the subjects of exploitation, commodification, and objectification."

You're sadly mistaken to believe those are the only two choices. Should the day come when women in America are seen first as human beings, rather than as sexual toys for men, it won't matter whether women wear burqahs or bikinis. They'll cover, or expose, whatever they choose, knowing their worth does not rest on mens' judgment as to their physical charms. Little girls won't be sexualized before their time and women of all ages won't be brainwashed into thinking their value lies overwhelmingly in how many men want to have sex with them, but in areas like how smart, how capable, how hardworking they are. What a concept.

As long as you view depictions of sexuality as inherently objectifying and degrading of women, you will never realize the healthy and empowering aspects of human sexuality. Spitzer's use of an expensive prostitute had exactly nothing to do with sex and everything to do with power and the abuse of it. As long as the public is titillated by the "naughty" aspect of it, and indeed as long as we think of it as "naughty" at all, the true root cause can never be recognized, let alone addressed. Sexuality in marketing, while perhaps overused, is totally irrelevent to the topic at hand.

It is difficult to disagree with the general statement made in this piece. On the other hand, is the objection limited to depicting "women in a way that subconsciously leads to their degradation and objectification", or to depicting in any way or form anything that suggests sexuality? Will the cultural practice become more "acceptable" if commercials devote "equal time" to depicting sexuality of both men and women? Though Hadia Mubarak identifies herself as a "Muslim feminist", I cannot help but wonder if her views are influenced by the fundamentalist attitude on sexuality of her faith, i.e., more Muslim than feminist.

It is difficult to disagree with the general statement made in this piece. On the other hand, is the objection limited to depicting "women in a way that subconsciously leads to their degradation and objectification", or to depicting in any way or form anything that suggests sexuality? Will the cultural practice become more "acceptable" if commercials devote "equal time" to depicting sexuality of both men and women? Though Hadia Mubarak identifies herself as a "Muslim feminist", I cannot help but wonder if her views are influenced by the fundamentalist attitude on sexuality of her faith, i.e., more Muslim than feminist.

With due respect, Ms. Mubarak, your article seems to be more of a personal indignation towards western perception of freedom of sexuality and social behavior, rather than an objective view on Mr. Spitzer's behaviour from a political and social standpoint. In my view Mr. Spitzer is guilty on two counts. Firstly, if I understand correctly, it is against the law to accept solicitation for sex, or simply paying for sex. Secondly, being a political representative and campaigning for people's support against anti-social elements, primarily prostitution; he has let down his people. It was a bad judgement on his part and he is paying the price for it. Does it reflect on our eroding public and private morality? I guess that can be debated. It is purely relative. For nudists in Europe, it is an expression of liberation and sense of freedom. Their definition of morality is different and you can find some of the nicest, honest, and peace loving people among that cult. For some African and Amazonian tribes, it is simply the way they are. Are these the signs of a dithering western society? I don't think so. Yes the norms are changing, but they are more extrinsic than intrinsic, in my view.

judgeing against perfection.

all perfection goes to the creator of heavens and earth.

judgeing mankind against the perfection(the only begotten son who was nailed on the cross for the sin and saftey and perfectness of mankind????????????????????????????????????)is not