Mr. T.P.M. the BAUM; PSolUS:

Interesting. The METHODIST(s) [i.e. Folk like the BUSH's n da CLINTON's] should join/Merge w/the the M-O-R-M-O-N(s) Church instead!

i [WE] long ago, Exclusively ONWAPO, had suggested this too. WHEREFORE:

Since The "HOLY SEE" hath been watching our Writings & Learning from, then it was only Logical to be First to 'Invite-1st" the Other [ex-Rivals?].

Important: It is The UNITY" of America's LUTHERN + the METHODIST + MORMON , a real "TRINITY" of Historic Proportions that will be what "IT", not gods, Intended; as if genuine a Neo-MANIFEST DESTINY.! A Prophecy whio's time is come? WHAT A SYNERGETICAL, yet prophetic Moment!

Note: Matybe Then Islam will follow Suit, aye?

Eeeee Haaaa! HALLALUYA! Praise The HOLYi-NO-MAN/WOMB! O' Lord EKLAH; make IT happen!

Dear Mr. T.P.M. the BAUM:

"... Quite a Shock"

Sir; It's not like an ASTEROID hit US!

Yet again, LIFE is SO SOOOOO Beautiful, while it lasts, aye Lad-a? Poor, Middle or Rich..

BIG-note: Mankind is gonna live Longer and Longer... Gene-by-gene, step-by-step, MEME by MEMEticals... until.. Sweet Sweet AMERICA and Friends or Family see 'THIS' Space-Ship Earth for what it is or not, of manymanymany like or beyond US [HUMANS or by what ever names] too...

Note: The CHURCH(s) can never Hide the Fact that they Persecuted, one of many, such as Galileo Gallae [pbuh et al] nor the Pedophelia acts committed via either Catholics and Anglican, Presbyterians , Jews, Hindu's, Buddhists et al.

PSolus

You wrote, "He never said that to me; did he say it to you?"

Are your "ears" the only thing that you "listen" with?

See you and the rest of humanity in the Kingdom.

Take care, be ready.

Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

onthejourney

You asked, "When does the invitation open up to Methodists, etc?"

There already are married priests in the Roman Catholic Church that have come from denominations other than the Anglican.

Take care, be ready.

Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

ArchBISHOP Desmond TUTU, where art thou and congregation? How about his loving buddy, the H.H. Dali Lama and Congregation converting like going over to the other side? Note: In Logic, as well as in Beliefs, especialy Reality or in awareness of TIME, that There is such a state as "THESIS, ANTITHESIS and SYNTHESIS."

Imagine the Judeo-Abrahamic BIBLE/Chumash/Korans merging with the Judeo-Vedic Geeta/Kangyurs/Tangyurs etc.. as truly 1-ONE? Imagine, The "RELIGION OF EVERYTHING" (before the Science of Everything) becoming what they was supposed to have Been, long long ago?

Competitiion or hassling over a Name For god will End. Hence No More Unecessary Wars. And Then the 1,Ek,Uno... "BIBLE OF THE FUTURE", built via the U.N.'s newly Established/Created International "FAITH EXCHANGE" for this Purpose.

Yes, IT is TIME to "UNITE/FUSE" (un-Seperate) all the 5/6-Major Faiths/Beliefs/Religions Systems on S.pace-S.hip Earth, of Many, into 1-ONE BOOK!

Please keep in mind that, 'cult', to Us SECULARians now means "CULTure" and that, 'sect' now means "SECTion". And

Remember: WE are ALL (Equally) but "NATURALLY SELECTioned" no longer as if "gods biblical Chosen People" via someone elses ancient Tribal Pride Apathetic godly Jealous Minds.

Note: The Fact is that To Us AMERICAN SECULAR Nationals that All Abrahamics and Vedics (Torah's, Gospels, Hadith's and Synergeticals..) are, in Fact/Reality, ALL "IMPORTED RELIGIONS" (not Made in AMERICA) from the Abroad. So

WE, the International and Local "SECULAR" Nationals Movants, See what many Theologians failed to See. And

Prosthylisising or Promoting SECULAR thinking, especialy as We Humans Phase into the AQUARIUS-AGE from the War Mongering PISCES-AGEs/Epochs, not only in the Public Class Rooms, but Locally and around the World, is now in Direct Competion with THEO thinking. So

Today, an "EDUCATED" (the KEYs to unlocking Ignorance), or non-educated (common Sensor), as Ex-Believers turned SECULARists, Agnostic or Atheist.. will also fight, to the Death if need be, in What I, WE believe or FEEL and Think the "TRUTH" is! Being in DENIAL is ones worse Enemy. So IT begins with You/Us and IT ends with Us/YOU.

test~!

"Seems as if it is going to be quite a shock, to who knows how many, when people find out that God is a searcher of hearts and minds, not of religious affiliation."

I'm shocked!

"Seems as if we can also get so caught up in dogma, doctrine, denomination, whatever that we lose sight of the fact that God-Incarnate, Jesus, asked us to "Proclaim the Good News"."

OK: Good News, people!

"It is also important what one does and why one does it and what one knows."

OK, got it.

"By the way it is "GOOD NEWS" not the 'good enought news'."

How about the "Good Enough News"?
Or the "GoOd EnOuGh NeWs"?
Or the "GOOD ENOUGH NEWS"?
No? Oh, well.

"Also, we should not put so many "hoops" for people to jump thru to become Catholic, Jesus simply said, "Come follow Me", did He not?"

He never said that to me; did he say it to you?

Our RCC parish priests say one Mass a day, hold confessions once a week for the few who still believe in this mythical ritual, have a full time cook and also a housekeeper. Baptisms, another mythical ritual, is done by the permanent deacons. And in general, our parish priests turn over hospital visits to the hospital chaplin. And they get two to four weeks of vacation every year.

And btw, an accountant/business manager handles the church finances and there are a number of laity councils who do much of the other administrative work. Sunday is somewhat busy in saying Mass and distributing communion to the 33% of the parish who go to Mass. During the week there is always time for a round of golf.

Ironic isn’t it that the Holy Father’s reaching out to apostates and heretics "will allow former Anglicans to enter full communion with the Catholic Church while preserving elements of the distinctive Anglican spiritual and liturgical patrimony" while he continues to deny this to traditional Roman Catholics.

Dear Mr. T.P.M. the BAUM:

"... Quite a Shock"

Sir; It's not like an ASTOROID hit US! Yet

again, LIFE is SO SOOOOO Beautiful, while it lasts, aye Lad-a? Poor, Middle or Rich..

BIG-note: Mankind is gonna live Longer and Longer... Gene-by-gene, step-by-step... until.. Sweet Sweet AMERICA and Friends or Family see 'THIS' Space-Ship Earth for what it is or not, of manymanymany like or beyond US [HUMANS or by what ever names] too...

I don't know if that's progress or not, but at least we're not killing each other.
---------------------------
You forgot the stand on abortion. And as for not killing each other over beliefs........you may want to talk to Dr. Tiller. Oh, right, you can't.

So according to the RCC it is not okay to be openly gay, but the RCC will protect the gay pedophiles they ordain, who hide their sin.

Wonderful church that!

fr bmariner:

>It's a blessing that the current Pope is such a great Theologian. He is the best prepared to drive safely the "Universal" (that's the meaning of "Catholic") Church towards the unity Jesus Christ prayed for. ...

No, benny is NOT "the best prepared...towards the unity..." He is trying his darndest to undo the work of his immediate predecessor, and it's extremely obvious.

Actually, doctors and firefighters, etc. tend to work 24/3 schedules. They work long hours, but are paid very well and given plenty of time to spend with family. Priests serve their parish family from 6am mass to a 2am hospital visit with meetings, teaching, prayer and additional responsibilities throughout the day.

Many professions have "24/7" responsibilities, e.g. police, firemen, doctors, nurses. And most are happily married and have families.

Seems like the Vatican is seeking a way to fill their pews, but only with those who disavow women clergy and gay bishops...and what about those Catholic priests who can't marry sharing the pulpit with those who already are...doesn't seem very Christian to me...When does the invitation open up to Methodists, etc?

Seems as if it is going to be quite a shock, to who knows how many, when people find out that God is a searcher of hearts and minds, not of religious affiliation.

Seems as if we can also get so caught up in dogma, doctrine, denomination, whatever that we lose sight of the fact that God-Incarnate, Jesus, asked us to "Proclaim the Good News".

It is also important what one does and why one does it and what one knows.

By the way it is "GOOD NEWS" not the 'good enought news'.

Also, we should not put so many "hoops" for people to jump thru to become Catholic, Jesus simply said, "Come follow Me", did He not?

Take care, be ready.

Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

"Explain to us, please, the difference between an Anglican priest and those who enter the priesthood from the Catholic side."

Should one that makes his profession as an Anglican priest seek other employment because he finds his way back to the Catholic faith?
Should the Catholic faith provide for its priests and bishops to give less than their full selves to the Church and their wives and families by allowing priests to marry?
The job of a Catholic priest is a 24/7 responsibility. So, too, a husband and father in a family. A few talented people may be able to perform adequately at both, but there is a very practical reason why the Church, and any Catholic in communion with, does not allow priests to marry.

Henry VIII cannot be happy!!!! LOL

In fact; Besides being Rich Theologian's The Pope and Archbishop , as institutions know that England will inevitably succumb to the United-Euro (the side where the Roman Vatican Empire is located) or let's say, the otherside of the Thames/Euphrates river so to speak. And

Soon Archbiship Desmond TuTu, of South Africa and other near places will also 'merge' to their delight for the better; unless the Islamic Neighbors don't get Jealous. And

This is a 'Shot' not only across the Human-Bowe but but across Continents and Oceans , at the speed of Light (internet), for ALL the world to Stop a moment , such that the Islamic World, not only Catholic/Anglican/Anglican/Vatican CONSTITuates , must "merge" and combine into a sort of Judeo 'Christian-Transparency' such that,

that the Judeo ISLAMIC Shiat/Sunni/Sunni/Shiat will also merge their wealth and Rituals too. How long? Not too long when they awaken to Reality. Their own EVOLUTION.

Another thing: Soon, 6-SIX Gulf Arabic Nations will also merge and have their [Historic] own (50% Gold backed) Currency called the "KHALEEGi" (means GULF).

This too is Good for the GREAT [HUMAN] PEACE-TIME-EPOCH. And "... The-Truth keeps Marching On ..." And

From PISCES-AGE (FISH) we are moving (never backwards) Towards the AQUARIUS-AGE, into a NEW-MILLENIUM which seems like a Prophecy to me. In them days the Christians will be 3,000 years young and the islam will be where we were before the new-Millenium. And

the Vedic Hindu's will 'Un-Caste' and the Buddhists and Shinto's and the Atheist post de facto Communists and non realigionists will live in Harmony (Tolerence) and they too will 'merge' their mixed currency's into One; and even UNITE their Nations under One [Secular] "CONSTITUTION" in the not too distant future. So

"Spreading the Peace [giving the 'Chuech's the chance, is more important, right now, than spreading the Money".

Note: This godly 'Calling' or gesture/act is not only about running away from Woman theolgians or the Gays thing, but like an Olive Branch to HEAL the-Unjust-Seperations of 1534, being a just blessing of sorts. This is also good for US SECULARIst Citizens/Nationals.

Everybody WINS. Straights and non-Straights. The Drunks and not the Drunks...

Great news. Instead of increasing divisiveness as many organizations do, the Catholic Church is healing old wounds.

Well done.

Let us pray. Dear Lord, save us from our Anglican women and gay priests who preach the gospels openly from the pulpit and give us instead pedophile priests and bishops who prey on our children from the darkness of sunday school closets. Amen

So let me see if I'm getting this right. Unhappy Anglicans are trading in their gay Anglican bishops for pedophile Catholic priests? Lord save us, people are such wacky creatures.

So there are no Gay bishops in the Roman Catholic Church??? Gimme a break! To nicely mix a metaphor, these people are just jumping from the frying pan into the fire, but bigots of a feather should be allowed to flock together.

Got change for a twenty?

Whenever I need a good laugh, I just read canon law and papal encyclicals. There is nothing more ridiculous.

As a semi-retired [evangelical, charismatic] Episcopal priest, I see nothing but good in the Vatican's decision, at least in the long run.
We Christians, whatever our liturgical spin, must increasingly accept that the Church belongs to God; and, I believe, God is about to do a new, wonderful thing in our midst.

The importance of this story has always been less about what happens to a handful of disaffected Anglicans than it is about what happens to millions of disaffected American Catholics. If the door is opened to allow Catholics to take part in Episcopal masses and communion without suffering some formal break with their mother church then the floodgates of conversion may consist of modern, progressive young Catholics leaving their church for the Episcopal church, which to them will look very much like a sensible and reformed version of the Church they grew up with. Losing a large chunk of Catholic America would be defining event for the next century of institutional Christianity...

This should be an interesting experiment depending on which regions of the west the Anglicans come from. Hard to imagine that the migration of the old Congregationalists to Episcopalians by way of Unitarianism is going to lead their descendants to become Papists! What a shock that will be to the heavens!

Will they every accept Papal infallibility or immaculate conception or praying to saints?

Is there no end to the hypocrisy of the Catholic Church hierarchy? Explain to us, please, the difference between an Anglican priest and those who enter the priesthood from the Catholic side. And while you're at it, prove unequivocally that Jesus was against married priests. Let's see, now, married priests are a no-no, but pedophiles are OK.

Why neither of these Christian religions will survive:

Jesus was an illiterate Jewish peasant/carpenter/simple preacher man who suffered from hallucinations and who has been characterized anywhere from the Messiah from Nazareth to a mythical character from mythical Nazareth to a mamzer from Nazareth (Professor Bruce Chilton, in his book Rabbi Jesus). Analyses of Jesus’ life by many contemporary NT scholars (e.g. Professors Crossan, Borg and Fredriksen, On Faith panelists) via the NT and related documents have concluded that only about 30% of Jesus' sayings and ways noted in the NT were authentic. The rest being embellishments (e.g. miracles)/hallucinations made/had by the NT authors to impress various Christian, Jewish and Pagan sects.

The 30% of the NT that is "authentic Jesus" like everything in life was borrowed/plagiarized and/or improved from those who came before. In Jesus' case, it was the ways and sayings of the Babylonians, Greeks, Persians, Egyptians, Hittites, Canaanites, OT, John the Baptizer and possibly the ways and sayings of traveling Greek Cynics.
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/theories.html

For added "pizzazz", Catholic/Christian theologians divided god the singularity into three persons and invented atonement as an added guilt trip for the "pew people" to go along with this trinity of overseers. By doing so, they made god the padre into god the "filicider".

Current crises:

Pedophiliac priests, atonement theology and original sin!!!!

Luther, Calvin, Joe Smith, Henry VIII, Wesley, Roger Williams, the Great “Babs” et al, founders of Christian-based religions or combination religions also suffered from the belief in/hallucinations of "pretty wingie thingie" visits and "prophecies" for profits analogous to the myths of Catholicism (resurrections, apparitions, ascensions and immaculate conceptions).

Current crises:

Adulterous preachers, "propheteering/ profiteering" evangelicals and atonement theology, all male hierarchies and strange banking and funding.

Just a few thoughts - one, I guess this means that if I'm a Roman Catholic who wants to be a married priest I can just become an Anglican priest first and then bugger off to Rome? There already are plenty of cradle Roman Catholics who are not at all pleased with the dispensations given to married former Anglican clergy, and I think this is going to make that situation worse.

Second - those "disaffected Anglicans" come with a bit of baggage - they are all for Catholic order when everyone agrees with them, but as soon as there's a disagreement they tell their bishops and other duly appointed authorities to take a hike. That tendency will not play very well in the Roman Catholic Church, even with this new scheme.

Well--and I write as an Irishwoman who has lived in London all these years-- there is so very much to admire in English Catholicism. There are the saints as courageous as any general in battle—no, far more courageous because they fought armed only with the truth—there are the logicians and the writers. ( One could say that England has a true tradition of Catholic literature, not Ireland.) There are the humble immigrants and the rich grandees. Why wouldn’t the Anglicans want to be allied to this tradition?

We will soon receive a new saint: John Henry Cardinal Newman. And I have heard as well as sainthood he will be named a Father of the Church for his lucid and luminous prose.

So there is much to celebrate.

It's a blessing that the current Pope is such a great Theologian. He is the best prepared to drive safely the "Universal" (that's the meaning of "Catholic") Church towards the unity Jesus Christ prayed for.

It's not so evident nor easy to clarify what is essential to our faith and what is cultural. I pray he is able to carry out the sentence attributed to St Augustine regarding the unity of the Church founded by Jesus Christ: "In essentials unity, in non-essentials liberty, in all things charity."

I never thought bold steps like the one of today were so close...

"The process of reception of married Anglican priests would be unlikely to differ much from the current system, he said. Nor would he expect transfers of church property as part of the process of corporate reception."

Might those larger bodies of moving Anglicans take over some of the Church's unused churches? There are SO many available!!

Assuming there is any significant movement of Anglicans into this Ordinate, it will constitute essentialy the first new Rite in the Western Church since Trent. If the Rite gets any particular size, it will provide a home for the many Roman Catholics who desire married clergy to migrate to, adding to the size of the Anglican Uniate Rite. There are lots of such ramifications that the reporters ought to have asked about when they got the announcement.

For instance, the Salvation Army, based on its more Catholic than the Pope ministries to the outcasts of society they serve, would make a great Religious Order, the only such order with married members. Even the "Ordination" on women in the Army is no particular impediment, because their "Ordination" is not essentially to the Priesthood, but rather a Consecration within the Religious Order.

I just might (mentally) dance with Joy when the Red Jacket becomes a habit along with the Brown Robes and White Woolen Belts, and the White Cassocks and Black long Scapulars.

Catholic does mean universal, and our universe just got a little bigger.

"After reading Mr. Donohue's diatribe in today's Post against "secular sabateurs" in Amerca I can understand why many left the Catholic church for the Anglicans and why the pope is now working to allow them back in without calling themselves Catholic. Just another example of how the Catholics, with their shift to the political right over the last few decades, is getting desperate. Posted by: Fate1"

Got your terms a little mixed, sir. The pronouncement allows Anglicans who return to call themselves Catholic, without calling themselves Roman.

Return movements to the Church from the various Anglican Churches are a bit old hat, really. The Oxford Movement, for instance, which started as an attempt to return the Anglicans to their roots, which the leaders, being intellectually more honest than they might have realized, discovered were really in the Roman Church. From THAT movement we got Chesterton and Neuman.

By the way, if you don't want to be disillusioned by your perception of the Church moving politically to the right, best you don't read very much of Benedict's writings. No Goldwater republican would feel happy with his dicta.

Assuming there is any significant movement of Anglicans into this Ordinate, it will constitute essentialy the first new Rite in the Western Church since Trent. If the Rite gets any particular size, it will provide a home for the many Roman Catholics who desire married clergy to migrate to, adding to the size of the Anglican Uniate Rite. There are lots of such ramifications that the reporters ought to have asked about when they got the announcement.

For instance, the Salvation Army, based on its more Catholic than the Pope ministries to the outcasts of society they serve, would make a great Religious Order, the only such order with married members. Even the "Ordination" on women in the Army is no particular impediment, because their "Ordination" is not essentially to the Priesthood, but rather a Consecration within the Religious Order.

I just might (mentally) dance with Joy when the Red Jacket becomes a habit along with the Brown Robes and White Woolen Belts, and the White Cassocks and Black long Scapulars.

Catholic does mean universal, and our universe just got a little bigger.

After reading Mr. Donohue's diatribe in today's Post against "secular sabateurs" in Amerca I can understand why many left the Catholic church for the Anglicans and why the pope is now working to allow them back in without calling themselves Catholic. Just another example of how the Catholics, with their shift to the political right over the last few decades, is getting desperate.

The Catholic Church will not compromise on any doctrinal questions: the truth is the truth. Where it will bend is on Church practice (how those truths are presented to the faithful). For instance, it will allow married priests, which is a church practice already allowed in the eastern churches in communion with Rome. But it will not allow women priests or Married Bishops. It will not allow divorce. It will not recognize Gay marriage. It will not sanction abortion.

Reunification of Christians is a very good thing.

I guess it's good to have the door swing the other way; lots of former Catholics in the Episcopal Church. If this helps people find a church to their liking on Sunday morning, then I think God is pleased.

With the state of creation, I can't believe it makes a big difference to God whether people are Catholic or Episcopalian.

I agree that moves towards unification and avenues for dialouge between the Christian churches is definitely progress and definitely a good thing.

With reference to transubstantiation - I am fairly certain that the Vatican's move to provide a process for acceptance of disaffected Anglicans DOES NOT include a "compromise" on the issue of transubstantiation. Transubstantion is an article of the faith and - one would think - Anglicans seeking full communion with the church would likewise be also believe in the Church position on transubstantion. Furthermore, it would seem that Anglicans and Catholics, in principal, have similar positions on transubstantiation (http://www.catholicapologetics.org/ap060500.htm)

If this helps disaffected people find a church home where they can worship, then I think it's a good thing. I was happy the Episcopals took me in when I could no longer stand the Roman Catholic church's positions. This is a way of returning the favor.

I also find it interesting that the churches now find it acceptable to compromise on things that used to cause bloodshed--such as transubstantiation and the number of sacraments--and now we split over things like inclusion of women and gays. I don't know if that's progress or not, but at least we're not killing each other.