THOMAS BAUM:

From reading what you write, I get the impression that you seem to believe that all of the world's problems are the fault of the United States and Israel, is that true?
Not at all.
My personal belief are that it starts with one self. Notwithstanding this, the US sets limits and keeps most countries in check as for the advancements they are allowed.

However, I do take issue with most of contents in third paragraph. The people of countries that are run by, either installed Autocrats or supported ones, have very limited abilities to exercise their freedoms and choices needed to promote and expand democracies. The US undermines human rights and democracy significantly by the support and protections it lends to Autocrats around the world in order to preserve their national interests.

Be well and return soon.

Faramarz Fathi

VICTORIA

I suppose that I should say, Hi Astoria, I am guessing that this is your name.

Thank you for answers to my questions and a Happy Eid Mubarak to you, kind of a Eid Mubarak doubled.

As to your question: "What is the phrase one would wish to Jewish people for the new year?", I don't know, I am not Jewish, I am Catholic but I hope someone that reads this post or yours will respond.

We are all members of God's Family no matter what beliefs we may have, no matter what religious affiliation or lack thereof we have, we may not always act like we are, but as a race, human, we are all brothers and sisters whether we like it or not or live that way or not, one day, in God's Time we shall, but until then, I believe that we are called to at least try to live that way now.

I hope that you had a good month of Ramadan and I wish you a happy and peaceful Eid Mubarak and may God plant a big smile in your heart.

Take care, be ready.

Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

VICTORIA
Hi Thomas-
Today is Eid-ul-Fitr- and occurs on the new moon-
It is the small Eid- Eid means festival.
Well, after our 30 days of fasting, we have 3 days of relaxing and celebrating- We are NOT allowed to fast these 3 days- and you know, when I woke up today- I have gotten into the habit of refraining from drinking water- that I had to stop myself from stopping myself- In other words- I had to remind myself TO drink some water!
I didn't even remember that I wasn't fasting until I took wudu(the ablutions)- we rinse our mouths out with water 3 times, and when fasting are very carefulnot to swallow it, my response is to spit out extra water after I've rinsed- And THEN I remembered I'm not fasting!
After a month- it replaces old habits (fasting) and becomes the new habit-
and the instinct by now is to say- o I'm used to this- it is easy now- I'm going to get "extra brownie points in heaven" and fast more!

That is why we are forbidden to fast- (ONLY on these days) to keep us from being extreme in our practice-

Ramadan is not what the fasting is named- it is the name of the month when the Qur'an was revealed to Muhammed(pbuh) and Eid celebration starts on the first day of the next month, Shawwal

Eid al-Adha is the big Eid, and occurs at the end of Hajj(pilgrimage to Mecca)the largest congregation of humans on the planet-

Eid Mubarak means literally, Happy Festival-

This year, OUR (meaning yours and mine) celebrations have dovetailed nicely-

So, Eid Mubarak is a nice thing to say.
What is the phrase one would wish to Jewish people for the new year?

VICTORIA

You mentioned, "tomorrow we start our 3 day holy celebration of Eid."

What is the 3 day holy celebration of Eid? I have heard of Ramadan but I have never heard of Eid. You also mentioned that this year they dovetailed nicely, can you explain how they are closer and farther apart in time?

I would like to wish you something on this celebration but I don't know what is appropriate, so this is my inadequate wish to you.

By the way, if I can ask, what does the expression "EID MUBARAK" mean?

Take care, be ready.

Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

Ahh- and-
EID MUBARAK FARAMAZ!!!

Thomas-
Well, all we can do is try to walk in each others shoes with compassion, listen earnestly- and really be vigilant in giving each other respect-

We will always find reasons and excuses to vilify an "other". That takes only a small heart and selfish worldview coupled with an underlying fear.

May your own holdiay give you the introspection and blessings you desire.

We Muslims ended Ramadan(30 days of fasting) on Monday (today- I haven't been asleep yet) and tomorrow we start our 3 day holy celebration of Eid.
This year, our celebrations have dovetailed nicely-
Maybe the god is trying to tell us something:)

VICTORIA

You wrote, "This question Thomas- the one you asked-
"I was wondering about what is reported in the news, that there seems to be many in that part of the world that wishes to see the State of Israel exterminated, is any of that true or is that all made up?"

The quote is attributed to Ahmadinjad, and, as you saw- it is traslated pretty questionably.
Most people assume that the 'wipe israel off the map' is true because it is repeated so much."

It is not just Ahmadinjad, right, wrong or indifferent, the history of the Middle East since 1948 seems to speak for itself.

Maybe people think that it is true because of the reality of the situation. As they say actions speak louder than words.

That was the question and even tho I do not follow the news all that closely, it seems to me that even if some of it is staged for the newscasts that some of the governments are helping to stage them.

You wrote, "All the while understanding that leaders and governments are not the people-"

Not only that but "the people" are really not "the people" but a lot of individual people that think and want what they, individually, think and want.

Like I have said before, I can not live anyone else's life and no one can live anyone else's life but there sure do seem to be some that try.

But doesn't, at least sometimes, "leaders and governments" do things contrary to what the people think or want.

The "us vs them" mentality, which seems to be alive and well, will always try to demonize "them", it isn't something new, is it?

The "us vs them" mentality is all over the world, people use all kinds of "justifications" to do many things to their fellow human beings and to place the "blame" for all of the troubles of the world on Israel and the United States is ludicrous.

Whether it is an individual or a country to always place blame on the "other" is just a cop out, we have free will and whether or not we take responsibility for what we do is our choice.

Take care, be ready.

Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

Hello Farmanz-

I assumed Ahmadinejad was a holocaust denier because of the conference he sponsored-
Questioning something is not denying it-
(Actually- questioning anything presupposes it's existence- but that is flimsy reasoning for this purpose.)

I admit I do not know, and should be ever more vigilant in making declarative statements without full knowledge.
(I still don't know, not having investigated)
:)

This question Thomas- the one you asked-
"I was wondering about what is reported in the news, that there seems to be many in that part of the world that wishes to see the State of Israel exterminated, is any of that true or is that all made up?"

The quote is attributed to Ahmadinjad, and, as you saw- it is traslated pretty questionably.
Most people assume that the 'wipe israel off the map' is true because it is repeated so much.

McCain said it last night at the debate.
I assumed yours was a search for truth- and was suprised that you would question whether it was even true or not-

"There are many (Othodox)religious Jewish groups against Zionism itself- they believe that Jewish people cannot return to Israel from the diaspora, which was the will of G-d-, until G-d sends Mossiach (the Messiah).
Since the original zionists are all atheists- THEY(RELIGIOUS JEWS) believe that THEY (ZIONISTS) were trying to force G-d's hand- so to speak- and expedite events for their return before G-d willed it."

Maybe I should have used a proper noun instead of a pronoun there-

I had suspicion that you had the highest motives and were asking an honest question, so responded with equally high motives.

But, I wonder that you could not figure out what question it was from the answer given.

Faramarz Fathi:

From reading what you write, I get the impression that you seem to believe that all of the world's problems are the fault of the United States and Israel, is that true?

Seems to me it is a lot easier to put to blame on others rather than for some countries to clean up their own act, so to speak, don't you think so?

I know that the United States is not perfect, far from it, as a matter of fact, there is no country perfect in this world but to blame others for one's shortcomings, whether an individual or a country, is just plain scapegoating and when this happens with a country, it can sometimes surely take people minds off of the immediate people in charge and place the blame elsewhere.

Take care, be ready.

Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

VICTORIA

You replied, "What made you ask that question?"

Which question are you referring to?

Then you wrote, "Since the original zionists are all atheists- they believe that they were trying to force G-d's hand- so to speak- and expedite events for their return before G-d willed it."

I don't quite understand this, if they were atheists then how could they believe that they were trying to force God's Hand, so to speak, if they didn't even believe that there is a God?

As I have said previously, God works in mysterious ways and sometimes what people think will be the way that God is going to do something is not so, no matter how right they may think that they are.

In one of the articles that you referred to, it was written in effect, "There you will discover the actual IRNA quote, "As the Soviet Union disappeared, the Zionist regime will also vanish and humanity will be liberated." ", this seems pretty well straight to the point and it says that this is exactly what he said.

This places the blame of everything wrong in the world on the, as some people refer to it as, the "Jewish Problem", this definitely sounds familiar except now it is all of humanity rather than just Germany that will be "liberated", is that not what it says? Seems pretty up front to me.

By the way, is the "liberation of humanity" the imposition of sharia-law worldwide?

Israel is the canary in the mine, when Israel goes down the tubes, so to speak, the world is also going to go down the tubes, so to speak.

The whole refustation of the "rumor of the century" is nothing but laying the blame of everything that has ever gone wrong in the Middle East at the feet of the Jewish State.

I am not saying one way or the another about anything that Israel has done, is doing or will do to try and survive but to blame all of the troubles of the Middle East on them is ludicrist, do you really think that maybe some of the other governments over there just might being using Israel as a convenient scapegoat for their inadequacies?

Another thing to think about, have you or anyone else who happens to read this ever thought, why does one country so small and one people that is such a small percentage of the world population bring out such utter hatred and contempt from some?

Do you or does anyone else think that the FACT that the Jews are the Chosen People have anything to do with it?

As I have said before, night is coming, be ready, the True, Living, Triune, Triumphant God is a searcher of hearts and minds, not of religious affiliations or lack thereof.

Take care, be ready.

Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

Thomas Baum:

President Ahmadinejad has consistently asked many many questions as to why the Holocaust happened.The questions that have been interpreted as a Holocaust denier. The questions I have never seen in prints before.
I am not a Holocaust denier and neither is President Ahmadinejad. However, I sincerely believe we all owe it to ourselves to find answers to any valid questions surrounding this terrible tragedy in human history. My heart goes to each and all of those who fell victims to a fanatic during the world wars two, Jews as well as the other 14 million people who needlessly lost their lives too, at that time and any other time and place.

The United States is the only current Imperialist who aggressively tries to impose its vicious policies on other countries to the extent it can and has leverage too. But imperialism is a Twenties century and before governing. The challenges the nations face in the 21st century are quite different and people are forced to find common interests to better utilize the limited resources available to us.
The people occupied Palestine have created nothing short of an Apartheid state.
The history has proven to us the oppressors, no matter in what corner of the world they exist, will eventually meet their fates. Often, much less than what they would hope for it.

I referenced the Jews who own and control the Media in the west when I said people like yourself.

I can not lend any credence to your characterizations or identifications of the Jews. The next bizarre thing you will come up, I am surprised you have not already, is that the God gave the Jews the occupied territories. I love Jews. They are on average more principled people than the rest. My only idol is a Jewish woman. Having said that, I do have everything against anyone whose interests and intentions contradicts just and justice for all,.

Be well and let us learn more from you.

Faramarz Fathi

For more information and understanding on this topic, Thomas- this site is Torah Jews against Zionism.

http://www.jewsagainstzionism.com/

There are many (Othodox)religious Jewish groups against Zionism itself- they believe that Jewish people cannot return to Israel from the diaspora, which was the will of G-d-, until G-d sends Mossiach (the Messiah).
Since the original zionists are all atheists- they believe that they were trying to force G-d's hand- so to speak- and expedite events for their return before G-d willed it.

They also believe that the Torah, and tanakh(body of Jewish scripture) prohibit their return until it is clearly sent from G-d- (by the appearance of Mossiach) and that it is against G-d's Law, to abuse a people to fulfill their own destiny.

One could never call such people anti-semites- they are people trying to obey G-d as they understand G-d's will.

Faramz-
Apaarently Janet hasa great deal of energy and great reservoir of anger to defame you on another thread-

the topic? Islamophobes!
____________________________________
Alas, I saw very few address this blogger's post. Only yours truly by her lonesome. He's asking one Victoria for her support. Here's the post, MR. PATEL. Your comments, sir?
*******************************
"I have repeatedly stated without any hesitations, here and else where, that the Zionists and Jews have hijacked the foreign policies of this country to solely advance and promote their own causes and agendas all at the expense of the American people and their values.
How does that make one to be a racist when stating uncontested and established facts ?
And, what are the required qualifications to label one as such? Certainly, not arrogance, ignorance, hate and the least but not the last, not being a fake,."

FaramarzFathi@aol.com
_____________________________

As you can see, she included your email address.
http://newsweek.washingtonpost.com/onfaith/eboo_patel/2008/09/how_islamophobia_works/all_comments.html

I don't intend to feed the troll, myself.

Here you go Thomas-

This is the quote in question. It occurred on October 26,2005, in Tehran- at a conference called "The World without Zionism"

"The Imam said this regime occupying Jerusalem must vanish from the page of time."

With translation-

The Imam said that this regime occupying Jerusalem (een rezhim-e eshghalgar-e qods) must [vanish from] the page of time (bayad az safheh-ye ruzgar mahv shavad).[13]

Norouzi's translation is identical.[11] According to Cole, "Ahmadinejad did not say he was going to 'wipe Israel off the map' because no such idiom exists in Persian". Instead, "He did say he hoped its regime, i.e., a Jewish-Zionist state occupying Jerusalem, would collapse."[14]

This source is Wikipedia-

http://www.mohammadmossadegh.com/news/rumor-of-the-century/

Above is a site that elaborates on it-
just google ahmadinejad-wipe out or any part of the oft repeated but inaccurate quote.

Ahmadinehad is a holocaust denier.
-------------------------------------

It is an important distinction to make that anti-zionism is not anti-semitism or anti-jewish

Zionism is a political regime in Israel- with specific tenets and philosophies.

There could be an Israel without Zionism, just as there could(and has been) an Iran without a theocratic ruling party.

The United Nations declared in 1974 that Zionism equals Racism.
It's quite true, and easy to verify.

Not all Jewish people are Zionists either. I know many many Jewish people here who are vocally anti-zionist.
Just as one can be a republican christian and be against democratic christians, it doesn't mean one is against christians-
but a political ideology.

For instance, you would not be welcome to live in zionist Israel- because you are not Jewish.
But, a free and open Israel- with polcies more simlar to America- would allow you to live there.

That is why the UN found it equal to racism- becasue the philosophy advocates only one religious and cultural group.
It's true, and very easy to find.

Personal accusations of racism, or bigotry- are so ugly- one wonders what motivates the heart of the accuser to promote hatred when it is so much more postive and constructive to advocate for love and peace.

One has to be super careful when one makes even the slightest critique of Israel- because Israelis are very afraid- and hyper sensitive and perceive even the mildest critique as an assault on their security.

There is a vast difference between criticizing the policies of a government, and vilifying an entire people.

We have freedom of speech- and that is the difference between a dictatorship- like Iran- where one cannot criticize the policies without consequences- and freedom to criticize any policies of any government-

All the while understanding that leaders and governments are not the people-

What made you ask that question?

" Faramarz Fathi:

It is profoundly sad to see some to go on offense under false pretense when they are void of the preliminary qualities it takes one to be qualified to promote such.

I have repeatedly stated without any hesitations, here and else where, that the Zionists and Jews have hijacked the foreign policies of this country to solely advance and promote their own causes and agendas all at the expense of the American people and their values.
How does that make one to be a racist when stating uncontested and established facts ?
And, what are the required qualifications to label one as such? Certainly, not arrogance, ignorance, hate and the least but not the last, not being a fake,."

This is a remarkable and terrifying question. Worth asking of all the United States. How gravely evil and sick you are. I will pray for you.

VICTORIA:

Click on your nickname or e-mail and your page should show up.

Faramarz Fathi

It is profoundly sad to see some to go on offense under false pretense when they are void of the preliminary qualities it takes one to be qualified to promote such.

I have repeatedly stated without any hesitations, here and else where, that the Zionists and Jews have hijacked the foreign policies of this country to solely advance and promote their own causes and agendas all at the expense of the American people and their values.
How does that make one to be a racist when stating uncontested and established facts ?
And, what are the required qualifications to label one as such? Certainly, not arrogance, ignorance, hate and the least but not the last, not being a fake,.

Faramarz Fathi

Faramarz Fathi:

I was wondering about what is reported in the news, that there seems to be many in that part of the world that wishes to see the State of Israel exterminated, is any of that true or is that all made up?

Did Ahnadinejad say that the Holocaust didn't happen or not?

I was wondering considering the fact that there still are people alive with tatoos from the concentration camps.

You wrote, "President Ahmadinejad has more than few occasions stated that the Imperialist and agggressors are doomed."

Are these "Imperialist and aggressors" both the United States and Israel and only the United States and Israel or are there others, in his opinion, that fit into those categories?

You also wrote, "You have to thank many like yourself in media who never lose any opportunities to misinterpret and project the wrong image of one who makes sobering statements but not align with your ideas of oppression rules."

First off, I am not in the media, I am just a messenger chosen by God to tell the whole world that: God wins, satan loses, a tie is unacceptable, the captives shall be released and the dead shall rise.

Oppression is oppression no matter who does it, forcing oneself on another in any way, shape or form is oppression, no matter what kind of justification someone tries to come up with.

I have met God the Father and I have met the Holy Spirit and the Holy Spirit has revealed to me that the Catholic Eucharist is Jesus, just like Jesus said.

I have also met satan, who is a liar, also just like Jesus said.

Do you know why the Jews are the "Chosen People"?

If not then I will tell you, for the simple reason that God chose them. God not only chose them but He also formed them.

God is a searcher of hearts and minds, not of religious affiliations or lack thereof, in other words, God looks at the person, just because someone believes something does not mean that they follow their beliefs and just because someone believes something, does not mean that it is true.

Take care, be ready.

Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

Hello again,
My absence was not avoiding anything- I think bad manners and behavior need to be addressed- but often they are cries for attention- so one has to be judicious in how much response is given-
or one can feed into the dark need of the unmannerly and actually accelerate their behavior.

I was busy-
but here is what I posted pre-Janet's comments- on the link she provided-

"I doubt Farnaz appreciates you using her as an excuse to foment your deeply disturbing hate-speech.
I sincerely doubt she is any more of a fan of Ahmadinejad's extremist dictatoriship than I am."

Farnaz, who is never at a loss for intelligent response- was likely repulsed by the posts- and for reasons similar to my own, refrained from feeding the troll-

Faramaz- Let me know how to acess our profiles.
Keep spreading the love.
Peace and Ramadan Mubarak to my brothers and sisters in Islam in here. :)

Faramaz-
Thank you for your kind observations.
I didn't knw we could look at our profiles. How do we do that?

"And President Ahmadinejad has never said that either. It is you stupid, no offense intended, who have been influenced by the deliberate propagandas the Zionists and the Jews who own and control the Media in the West are trying to project. Solely to advance their own cause and agendas all at the American people's expense.

FaramarzFathi@aol.com"

Janet,

Thanks for posting this. I had been reacting to other racist posts, but this one takes the cake. If only this poor person knew how much harm he does to the credibility of his religion, already in doubt due to mass murders, persecutions, the Quoran itself....

Faramarz Fathi-

So regrettable that an arrogant racist thinks I'm uncivil. Perhaps, your co-religionists can explain to you that we in this country consider racism not merely uncivil, but unacceptable.

You need not look forward to corresponding with me, not until you overcome your racism.

When you are ready to post a sincere apology to all those engaged in the war against racism, when you honestly repent for the filthy things you've written, then I will correspond with you.

You are not going to drive Christians and Jews from their country. This isn't Iran and you won't be persecutin the Bahai here.

Faramarz Fathi-

"And President Ahmadinejad has never said that either. It is you stupid, no offense intended, who have been influenced by the deliberate propagandas the Zionists and the Jews who own and control the Media in the West are trying to project. Solely to advance their own cause and agendas all at the American people's expense."

FaramarzFathi@aol.com

********************************
I don't know if anyone told your racist arrogant self that you're not in Iran. This is the US. We don't like racism here. You're not going to drive out and persecute US Christians. You're not going to exile a million Jews and steal their property. You're not going to endanger the lives of the Bahai.

You made a claim about "the Zionists and Jews." Do you really think you can just arrogantly spread racist garbabe here? Arrogant racist Muslim, think again.

As for nonracist Muslims, when can we expect to hear from you?

Janet:

At no place in my earlier post I referenced Victoria's faith. Her Faith was irrelevant in my observations.
I briefly went at looked at my profile here in WP and the total number of my posts reached 20 pages.
I initially introduced myself as Fred followed by Fred, Bos and it is a long time I have disclosed my real name here often followed by my E-mail,.

Be well and I look forward to seeing you here as soon as you have adopted a more civil tone.

Faramarz Fathi

Joe-

"Curious minds want to know.

Does any one know what Mahmood AhmadDinnerJacket Wore in in dinner the antisemites threw for him"

Can you tell us?

"And her absent response here is the very indication that she feels compromised should she acknowledge one who is so consumed in her arrogance and ignorance and accordingly blind to all the facts.
Keep well and God bless you."

Victoria's status as a Muslim has been questioned repeatedly, although perhaps not by your bigoted arrogant self. That is, unless you are Victoria. I haven't seen your name before. If your bigoted arrogant self read my posts to Victoria and hers to me then you would know that Farnaz is the issue. Tell us what you think of Farnaz oh arrogant one.

God bless and keep you.

Curious minds want to know.

Does any one know what Mahmood AhmadDinnerJacket Wore in in dinner the antisemites threw for him

Janet:
"Victoria whom no one takes seriously is a middle aged woman who alas has been visited by premature senility. Sadly, although one prefers to ignore the demented her xenophobia and anti-Jewish racism along with her defamation of another blogger who is widely respected here have forced me to respond to her. See her posts and mine.

By the way, a lot of Muslims don't believe Victoria is a Muslim. Aside from cut and paste from the Quoran, she's said nothing to convice anyone. She knows something about Catholicism though. My guess is she's really a Catholic who is bigoted against Muslims and is trying to give them a bad name here. Why else would she support Ahmedinejad and spew racist garbage about Jews?

Everyone knows doing that only makes you look like a bigoted moron.

http://newsweek.washingtonpost.com/onfaith/georgetown/2008/09/the_christian_right_and_the_ir/allcomments.html" End of quote.

Janet:

Victoria’s posts here have always been unbiased and reflected her knowledge, intelligence and class. Her posts have been very seldom challenged intellectually.
She has never resorted to vulgarities and name-callings for all the reasons there are. She is substantive, real and considerate and feels no adequacies to resort to such. And her absent response here is the very indication that she feels compromised should she acknowledge one who is so consumed in her arrogance and ignorance and accordingly blind to all the facts.
Keep well and God bless you.

Faramarz Fathi

Angela writes:

"Not one false God has ever made the statement: I and the Father are one. And no other person ever stated they could forgive sin so who worships false Gods. What you're doing is calling Jesus a liar. People need to stop saying we worship the same God; we don't. Imagery in the mind"

ANGELA: You misread my post. What I posted was chaprer and verse from the Quoran. I'm not a Muslim obviously.

If you think the Quoran lies, then say so. I am not the Quoran. I posted from it since I believe Christians and Jews who defend Muslims need to know one of the reasons Muslims hate them

Muslim hatred for Christians and Jews stems from the Quoran.

Dan,

False prophets will go to hell. Anyone that preaches that lying is good is a false prophet. In addition, any god-fearing man would not think that assaulting 9-year olds is a good thing in addition to thinking good works will get you into "paradise with a horde of virgins.

Blashemous rhetoric to say the least.

Not one false God has ever made the statement: I and the Father are one. And no other person ever stated they could forgive sin so who worships false Gods. What you're doing is calling Jesus a liar. People need to stop saying we worship the same God; we don't. Imagery in the mind...

This is the beauty of America- that, even though we may disagree with what another says, we cannot coerce or oppress that speech.

Even the verbal violence of hate speech.

please don't misunderstand or try to twist my words, i do not support or condone any civil and human rights violations and definitely free speech rights which have been subverted until recently maybe tto hide the incompetance of people caught with thier pants dowen when they were prenedig to be in charge of things. i encourage all peoplle everywhere to work to change injustice perpetuated by individuals, countrys or.. religions including my own which, i as an artist have personally experienced. shame on you neocon men.. and my christan freinds who let liars cheats and theives try 2 hijack our democracy, even paid for it to happen in some cases in my opinion which in america iam entitled to have and voice,,... but if you look at the leader who has actually taken the time to go to the other country , to talk and engage in a dialoge with people of all kinds ..not some pretend amen gallery for the tv cameras we all to often see with our representatives of both parties. perhaps its time for a we the people party to actually represent the people of the united states of america. irans president is far from a perfect human being but actually trying maybe it is better to come with all your imperfections not trying to hide them or to pretend you are something you are not and try to find the things in common and agreement instead of the differences . our leaders appear to do nothing or cause conflict unnessisarily and hope something magically is going to happern to make it all right in the end and justify means which would seem to have no justification or purpose except, greed the wish for more power watch the hands of the con men when they speek whether they are polititians preachers or used car salesmen when they are con men you will see the same hand motions to distract your attention from what they are actually saying. keeping peoples attention occupied with one hand while they are stripping them of thier rights and wallets with the other...there is an old saying.. if you spot it ... you got it.. and then the correct thing for each to do would be to work on improving ones own demostration... talk and promises and intentions without actual good, acts are nothing but fantasy.. the administration we have had for the last 8 years could outdo fansay isleland amybe someday we will have a president who will be willing to be honest and moral. albeit imperfectly.. but please check 4 truth Iam the dyslexic artist son of a son of a southwestern virginia blueridge mountain hillbilly... florida state university said i was not very .. brite i call them fake-it state university as an homage to thier theatre and film programs..

ARASH AFSHAR wrote - "It would be wise for the authors of this article to repost their misguided and misleading opinion to the opinion section of the Washington post, and for Washington post to better monitor the personal attacks that are in readers’ comments. It is sad to see some readers disguised as true believers use such vile language to dismiss other beliefs and opinions."

Sorry Arash, I hate to say it but your complaint isn't the first. I'm not sure anyone at WaPo even reads the violent, bigoted garbage that gets vomitted up on these pages.

Craig

Great article. Let's hope more people see the truth and stop pretending that everything is OK.

For those people who wish to claim that the Iranian president was popularly elected, please bear this in mind. Most of the reformist and moderate candidates for the Iranian presidency were prevented from running by the Muslim clerics actually running Iran because they weren't "Muslim enough". That left the extremist candidates such as Mahmoud Ahamdinejad as the only candidates allowed to run for president. A significant number of Iranians chose to boycott the election because the candidates that they actually supported had been forbiddent to run. The same thing happened to reformist and moderate candidates running for the Iranian legislature. The deck is stacked against opponents of the radical clerics running Iran, leaving the Iranian people unable to truly have a democratic, representative government. The clerics stole the Iranian revolution nearly 30 years ago and will do anything to ensure that they never have to give back their ill-gotten power and wealth.

I actually made an Iranian mad by ranting. GOOD. Now he knows how we feel when Mr. Ahmadineajd and his thugs rant nonsense about us every day.

Just look at www.Irna.com every day. Half the articles is bout Jews. This is Iranian official news agency.

NOTE TO CHRISTIANS AND CATHOLICS. THIS IS STRAIGHT OUT OF THE QUORAN. THIS IS JUST A SMALL PART ABOUT WHAT THE QUORAN SAYS ABOUT JESUS CHRIST AND CHRISTIANS.

NO WONDER THEY WANT TO KILL US ALL. MORE TO COME ON CHRISTIANS, JEWS, HINDUS FROM THE QUORAN, THE MUSLIM HOLY TEXT.

5:72-73: They do blaspheme who say: "God is Christ the son of Mary." But said Christ: "O Children of Israel! worship God, my Lord and your Lord." Whoever joins other gods with God, - God will forbid him the garden, and the Fire will be his abode. There will for the wrongdoers be no one to help. They do blaspheme who say: God is one of three in a Trinity: for there is no god except One God. If they desist not from their word (of blasphemy), verily a grievous penalty will befall the blasphemers among them

Jonathan writes:
I think you meant to address your post on toilet paper to pigface "Furious," not pigface "Curious."
I think Furious would make very good toilet paper myself.

Furious-

Mea Culpa. Screaming savage racists like you sometimes make good toilet paper after a big dump No. 2. Now that you've destroyed the economy with your oil and AIG greed and bailouts, it's generous of you to offer yourself up for us to wipe our A holes with. That's what you were made for anyway.

Of course you're not as good as regular toilet paper but we have to make do.

Hi Dan,

I think you meant to address your post on toilet paper to pigface "Furious," not pigface "Curious."
I think Furious would make very good toilet paper myself.

Curious:

The only savage is your pigface self. You're not fit for an Israeli, Jewish or Christian, to use as toilet paper.

Note to Christians and Catholics. Here's a nice juicy bit from the Quoran. More to come.

5:72-73: They do blaspheme who say: "God is Christ the son of Mary." But said Christ: "O Children of Israel! worship God, my Lord and your Lord." Whoever joins other gods with God, - God will forbid him the garden, and the Fire will be his abode. There will for the wrongdoers be no one to help. They do blaspheme who say: God is one of three in a Trinity: for there is no god except One God. If they desist not from their word (of blasphemy), verily a grievous penalty will befall the blasphemers among them.

It's foolish for anyone to ignore that fact that Mahmoud Ahmadinejad is the leader of a country- and a country that plays an important role in the world. We can stick our heads in the sand and spout all the morality we like, but we still have to deal with the reality. Whether or not he is being "honored", denying him a forum serves no purpose other than lessening the chances he will become part of the global community because all lines of communication will be gone.

Instead of walking out before he spoke, why doesn't this country have the foresight and leadership skills to know how to turn our relationship with his country around, to our benefit if no one else's? Political posturing, such as the Bush administration has engaged in for the last 8 years has hurt us, not Iran.

That said, I can't say I think the Quakers and Mennonites have very questionable intentions for holding this dinner, but perhaps they are simply trying to engage him in a dialogue that that will allow him to understand that our religions have much to share. Ahmadinejad is a conservative, in a country that had been well on it's way into the 21st. century until the Islamists took over. Iran today is engaged in a cultural/religious battle of its own and like many other countries in the Middle east, may well work its way out of extremism into a more moderate government. extremism is not a long term sustainable policiy. History shows that.

I have no doubt that Ahmadinejad is an anti-Zionist, and as for his reasons to deny the Holocaust, I just can't say. He seems a simple farmer in over his head but after reading the anti-semitic comments on these blogs, he is certainly not alone. everyone uses the Palestinians for political purposes- Arabs and anti-Semites alike. the idea that the United States is run by Zionists is so ludicrous that every Jew I know (and that includes myself) is rolling on the floor laughing hysterically. The U.S. has used Israel and Jews for the last 60+ years for its own political purposes. Israel has been the staunchest ally of the US in the Middle east since the day it was born and some of you would do well to read a few more books besides those of Benny Morris for the full story of the creation of the state of Israel.

As for feeding the guy and opening a dialogue with him? Would you rather ignore him and one day wake up to find the wolves at our gates and us with a broken lock?

Some screaming savage Israeli with another rant against Iran DOESN'T GET IT.

IN the past we've had to listen to rationale that when people are angry they take it out on jews as a convenient scapegoat. I, for one long bought that old canard.

But now, note,
This country is furious. And many think such "taking ot" will be demonstrably right. No
ranting will change the subject.

The neocon wars, the lying, the wall street greed. It might be smarter for the ranters to shut up for once. The most hated people in the world are not the Muslims. And certianly not Iran.

Note to Christians and Catholics. Here's a nice juicy bit from the Quoran. More to come.

5:72-73: They do blaspheme who say: "God is Christ the son of Mary." But said Christ: "O Children of Israel! worship God, my Lord and your Lord." Whoever joins other gods with God, - God will forbid him the garden, and the Fire will be his abode. There will for the wrongdoers be no one to help. They do blaspheme who say: God is one of three in a Trinity: for there is no god except One God. If they desist not from their word (of blasphemy), verily a grievous penalty will befall the blasphemers among them.

mehran:

Dear Mehran:

I would be delighted to withdraw the corrections I have attempted to make here if proven wrong.

Faramarz Fathi

Note to Christians and Catholics. Here's a nice juicy bit from the Quoran. More to come.

5:72-73: They do blaspheme who say: "God is Christ the son of Mary." But said Christ: "O Children of Israel! worship God, my Lord and your Lord." Whoever joins other gods with God, - God will forbid him the garden, and the Fire will be his abode. There will for the wrongdoers be no one to help. They do blaspheme who say: God is one of three in a Trinity: for there is no god except One God. If they desist not from their word (of blasphemy), verily a grievous penalty will befall the blasphemers among them.

"One would think viewing a section “on faith” would contain humility, serenity and guidance. However Washington Post has managed to turn it into a cyber battleground for clash of civilizations and cultures."

Arash Afshar:

What is religion -- what has it ever been -- if not a "battleground for clash of civilizations and cultures"?

At least in cyberspace, you can't be lynched, drawn and quartered, beheaded, run through with a sword, or stoned to death.

Note to Christians and Catholics. Here's a nice juicy bit from the Quoran. More to come.

5:72-73: They do blaspheme who say: "God is Christ the son of Mary." But said Christ: "O Children of Israel! worship God, my Lord and your Lord." Whoever joins other gods with God, - God will forbid him the garden, and the Fire will be his abode. There will for the wrongdoers be no one to help. They do blaspheme who say: God is one of three in a Trinity: for there is no god except One God. If they desist not from their word (of blasphemy), verily a grievous penalty will befall the blasphemers among them.

"Worse, the invitation offers President Ahmadinejad a new, prestigious podium for espousing his ideology of intolerance."

Chairperson Gaer:

If what he says is anathema to reasonable people, then what have you to fear from his giving a speech? He will be seen through quite easily, and his words won't have the desired effect.

Alternatively, if he has something to say that might have some kernel of truth or an interesting perspective, listeners might walk away with a better understanding of their human neighbors in the Middle East.

The question is: What are you afraid of? You wouldn't want to suppress his speech unless you're fearful that he might say something you don't want Americans to hear.

Victoria whom no one takes seriously is a middle aged woman who alas has been visited by premature senility. Sadly, although one prefers to ignore the demented her xenophobia and anti-Jewish racism along with her defamation of another blogger who is widely respected here have forced me to respond to her. See her posts and mine.

By the way, a lot of Muslims don't believe Victoria is a Muslim. Aside from cut and paste from the Quoran, she's said nothing to convice anyone. She knows something about Catholicism though. My guess is she's really a Catholic who is bigoted against Muslims and is trying to give them a bad name here. Why else would she support Ahmedinejad and spew racist garbage about Jews?

Everyone knows doing that only makes you look like a bigoted moron.

http://newsweek.washingtonpost.com/onfaith/georgetown/2008/09/the_christian_right_and_the_ir/allcomments.html

Yonkers, New York
25 September 2008

Why should Iranian president Mahmoud Ahmadinejad not be invited to what is billed as a "dialogue" in New York City?

Have the authors of this essay, Felice D.Gaer and Michael Cromartie, anything to fear about what Mr. Ahmadinejad has to say?

Rather than keep him from revealing what's on his mind, Mr. Ahmadinejad should be made to feel completely free to say what he needs to say.

He will be speaking in New York City, which is part of the United States of America, a nation which prides itself on a Bill of Rights which guarantees anybody and everybody the right to speak freely.

Who knows? The individual's right to speak freely in America might just rub off on Mr. Ahmadinejad--a remote possibility, yes--and one day, out of the blue, get him to suggest to Iran's ayatollahs that it might be a good idea to give Iranians the same right to speak freely.

Mariano Patalinjug
MarPatalinjug@aol.com

I am a Jew, Zionist and Israeli.

There are Israelis who truly believe Mr. Ahmadinejad is an Israeli agent set up to destroy Iran within.

This is country with
1) 27% inflation
2) 50% youth unemployment
3) These are depression type statistics. Mr. Ahmadinejad proclaims Iran does not have poor people. This is how connected they are.
3) Mr. Ahmadinajad wasted all the national capital reserve on wasteful expenditure
4) Everyone in the world thinks Iranians are terrorists and not welcome any more.

It is true we should be scared of the nuclear stuff. This can be easily resolved by a
1) The Busher nuclear plant is already 30 years old even when it has not been opened yet
2)The technology is Chernobyl type class
3) I imagine technologically would not be so difficult to create a Chernobyl type accident. No one will take responsibility. Israel did it to Syria.

Do Iranians truly think we will march like lambs to slaughter house again. Iran can be much wiped off the map much easier than Israel.

aghaye : " Faramarz Fathi "

you defend ahmadinejad very BADLY . have some patiance .

Abandon all hope, ye Zionists, the world is running over you in high gear.

Don't worry about the xenophobia hidden as concern-
Here is Janet's hysterical accusations of racism posted on Berlinerblau's-
http://newsweek.washingtonpost.com/onfaith/georgetown/2008/09/the_christian_right_and_the_ir/allcomments.html

The reason? Because she knows I am a muslim.
Apparently, muslim=bigoted racist hater to Janet.

One would think viewing a section “on faith” would contain humility, serenity and guidance. However Washington Post has managed to turn it into a cyber battleground for clash of civilizations and cultures. People of faith along with editors of Washington Post (who advocate separation of church and state) should know better that mixing politics and religion is a dangerous game they are playing.

The authors of the article have disguised their political ideology and activism under the veil of faith. It is misguided and deceiving, it does nothing but to damage faith and religion and bring about a clash among believers.

It is not unprecedented that such chatters on blogs and social sites have turned into real violence and caused lose of life, as it happened few months ago to a young girl who took her own life due to cyber bulling.

It would be wise for the authors of this article to repost their misguided and misleading opinion to the opinion section of the Washington post, and for Washington post to better monitor the personal attacks that are in readers’ comments. It is sad to see some readers disguised as true believers use such vile language to dismiss other beliefs and opinions.

The more you pressure these governments (regimes) the more they crackdown on freedoms. This is how it works. The moment these type of governments feel threatened, they start to panic and take rigid measures to curb freedoms. This is exactly why some thoughtful yet progressive Iranians advocate that change should come from within. Any outside interference is an excuse tightening public freedoms. The best thing is to engage these type of governments, expand the the middle class base and let the temperature to slowly come to a boil from within and witness the kind of change that is evolutionary not revolutionary as Iran has experienced with the overthrow to the Mosadegh government in 1950s and installation/support of Shah and then the coming of Mullahs. If change doesn't come from within and naturally, then you never know Iran might have next, dictator like Saddam Hussain or Shah's party jockeying for power or secularists and nationalists outlawing religion and headscarf and Mullahs regain strength and you are in for a regionally devastating civil war.

Faramarz Fathi:

Raju:

I also listened to the President's speech and did not detect any demonization of Judaism by him.

Perhaps, you would better come up with a quote or shut up.

Shutting up would be a very good thing for you to do. The pig president of Iran is a Holocaust denying racist who belongs in a pigpen with ill mannered cretins such as your dictatorial self.

"Faramarz Fathi:

Janet:

"That anti-semitic pig isn't my brother. He isn't the brother of any Bahai either since he's busy killing and torturing them. His only "brothers" are other pigs like him."

You have brought new difinitions to hatred and hateful here tonight.
You are the first to accuse President Ahmadinejad to killing Bahais. That is news and it just makes me to wonder since I do have Bahai Persian friends who are clueless about this.

Your frustration about a man whose core of his culture is based on just and justice, which contrdicts yours in its entirety, is quite understandable.
Finally but not lastly, you may call me a pig too. I 'll be honored."

This is not the first time I've seen a racist find honor in being so designated so consider yourself Ahmadinejad's brother. If you would like to tell us what in his address to the UN was not anti-semitic racist garbage, I'd like to know.
For you anti-Jewish racism equals "justice." Yes, I agree with your self-assessment. You are a racist pig.

"Mamie:

That Janet below

"I am not a jew" "He is an anti-semitic pig"

Is such a charmer, isn't she? The very kind of thing that is so valuable on "ON FAITH" and
pretty much the kind of thing of which this glorious little ole blog consists.

And why do the nastiest posters against Arabs, and everybody else always deny that they are Jews? Even when their earlier posts here and elsewere prove that they, indeedy, are.

THe latest BBC surveys suggest that the flinging of hate toward everyone else is not going over well in the world History, history history"

NO, it isn't, which is something the anti-semitic pig president of Iran ought to check out. Jews is spelled with a captial letter, namie, and you can bet your nasty, bigoted ass that if I were a Jew I would say so. We Christians don't have much to be proud of these days.

Janet:

"That anti-semitic pig isn't my brother. He isn't the brother of any Bahai either since he's busy killing and torturing them. His only "brothers" are other pigs like him."

You have brought new difinitions to hatred and hateful here tonight.
You are the first to accuse President Ahmadinejad to killing Bahais. That is news and it just makes me to wonder since I do have Bahai Persian friends who are clueless about this.

Your frustration about a man whose core of his culture is based on just and justice, which contrdicts yours in its entirety, is quite understandable.
Finally but not lastly, you may call me a pig too. I 'll be honored.

Faramarz Fathi

What is all this business about not talking to our purported enemies? Isn't that what diplomacy exists for in the first place? Iran is a peaceful nation that has not attacked another nation in its entire modern existence. Such hyperbole, comparing Ahmadinejad to Hitler and all kinds of other nonsense, is ultimately delusional and self-defeating. We should be talking to Iran just as we should be talking to all nations. Enough of this school-girl behavior.

Acebojangles:

"I don't like Bush either, but I don't believe that he ever said that any other nations should be wiped off the map."

And President Ahmadinejad has never said that either. It is you stupid, no offense intended, who have been influenced by the deliberate propagandas the Zionists and the Jews who own and control the Media in the West are trying to project. Solely to advance their own cause and agendas all at the American people's expense.

Anyone with the least amount of intelligence and common sense would tell you that President Ahmadinejad is not responsible for the loss of more than one million Iraqi lives, more than four million displaced and neither did he void the sovereignty of a nation with seven thousands years of civilization.

Faramarz Fathi

How stupid and downright FALSE of these two horrendous authors who lie to our faces.

Ahmedinejad IS NOT a despot. A mere ceremonial and ELECTED government "Presidential figure" of the Iranian Islamic Republic.

I doubt the authors share any basic understanding of Iranian politics, its history, or even if they have a favorable opinion of Islam...because if they did, they realize their entire piece from start to finish is pure inflammatory "Ahmedinejad is a hate figure so lets not dialogue with him" gas.

Its nice to believe that the authors like us to believe they are the watchdogs for religious freedom and expression then they can start right here by criticizing the religious right-Southern Baptist evangelicas for cheering and giving political cover for the invasion and deaths of half a million of innocent Iraqis!!!!

Raju:

I also listened to the President's speech and did not detect any demonization of Judaism by him.

Perhaps, you would better come up with a quote or shut up.

Faramarz Fathi

Thomas Baum:
"I think that you make a good point here, I do not think that he is lying either when he says he wants to destroy the United States and Israel."

Mr.Baum:
I am sorry to disappoint you here. President Ahmadinejad has never made those statements. I am a Persian and have personally listened to all his speechs on tapes that have turned up controvertial in the west.
President Ahmadinejad has more than few occasions stated that the Imperialist and agggressors are doomed. They are on path to self annihilation. but never threatened to destroy anyone.

You have to thank many like yourself in media who never lose any opportunities to misinterpret and project the wrong image of one who makes sobering statements but not align with your ideas of oppression rules.

Faramarz Fathi
faramarzfathi@aol.com

That Janet below

"I am not a jew" "He is an anti-semitic pig"

Is such a charmer, isn't she? The very kind of thing that is so valuable on "ON FAITH" and
pretty much the kind of thing of which this glorious little ole blog consists.

And why do the nastiest posters against Arabs, and everybody else always deny that they are Jews? Even when their earlier posts here and elsewere prove that they, indeedy, are.

THe latest BBC surveys suggest that the flinging of hate toward everyone else is not going over well in the world History, history history.

"Free american media" is controlled by zionists. It is all propaganda. The zionists have commited ethnic cleansing of palestinians, they built an apartheid state where palestinains live in concentration camps and open jails of gaza. When the victims fight back the zionis nights of the KKK accuse them of terrorism and anti semitism.

Iran is the only country in the middle east where Jews are still accepted in the society and by the state. and the religious restrictions in Iran are the least in the region. and when compared to saudi arabia iran is Las vegas

Hark Democrat Party, Do not Make Haste; else waist!

Do Not Go For That 'REPUBliCAN" ROBBER-BARON & CAPTAINS of INDUSTRY" Con Job, word NOW! NOW NOW!NOW!

No No No It Could Wait!!!!!!!!!! DO-NOT RUSH!

IT's Not an E-M=E=R=G=E-N-C-Y!!!!

IT's Not an E-M=E=R=G=E-N-C-Y!!!!

IT's Not an E-M=E=R=G=E-N-C-Y!!!!

VOTE: NO NO NO Bail-Out NOW! It Could Wait January 2009, not 2008!

VOTE: NO NO NO Bail-Out NOW! It Could Wait January 2009, not 2008!

VOTE: NO NO NO Bail-Out NOW! It Could Waite January 2009, not 2008!

ASIM, SAN ANTONIO

You wrote, "Ahamdinajad is not the most charismatic of leaders nor is he the most tactful propagandist-he has not lied to".

I think that you make a good point here, I do not think that he is lying either when he says he wants to destroy the United States and Israel.

Thanks for bringing it to our attention.

Take care, be ready.

Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

To the authors of this medicore piece:

Ahamdinajad's legitmacy is not a grant from u-He eraned it in free and fair elections by his people at the ballot box. He certainly has more legtimacy than GWB and Chenny-who lied to the whole world and invaded,destroyed and occupied Iraq on false pretnese;as a result they incited a civil war amongets Iraqis with one million dead and four million as refugees.

Ahamdinajad is not the most charismatic of leaders nor is he the most tactful propagandist-he has not lied to or occupied any other country as the US or your "israel."

Why is "israel" and anti-semitism are injected into each and every debate-and nothing is said about "israel" the racist, apartheid,miltaristic occupying jewish theocracy?? why don't u say any thing about its formidable nuclear arsenal??
And about its collective nazi style punishment of a whole people which it has been occupying all their land-historic PAlestine for over sixty years??

Nothing against the jews per se provided they pack up from occupied Palestine and go back to where they come from so the seven million ethnically cleanesed Palestinian refugees can come to their Palestine which has been occupied by the jews since 1947.

U two should show some decency and objectivity when u write and not recycle propaganda.

That is true Jennifer- even Richard Holbrooke has spoken extensively of the help received by Iran to counter terrorism in Afghanistan.
Also, tens of thosands of Iranians poured into the streets and held vigils in support for the Americans who lost their lives after Sept 11.

Janet: "That anti-semitic pig isn't my brother."

Where is the spirit of do unto others as they would do to you? You give your enemies the right to treat you likewise. Don't we want to change Iranian behavior here or again, do you just want to destroy them. If that is what you want you give them permission to try to destroy you first.

That is true Jennifer- even Richard Holbrooke has spoken extensively of the help received by Iran to counter terrorism in Afghanistan.
Also, tens of thosands of Iranians poured into the streets and held vigils in support for the Americans who lost their lives after Sept 11.

Ann Ingram: "air his hate-speech -- and give him a free dinner besides!"

Ann, I'm sure some of us are interested in your opinion, but putting it in this kind of language speaks against your ability to be fair in your opinion.

what about fidel and raul castro? what do you all think about a dialogue with him? lifting the embargo? why not? opening hotels like the canadians and spaniards? vacationing in cuba surrounded by his slaves?

or would some other peaceful communicative action be more effective?

or is this forum just about some people's human rights, not everyone's?

I don't believe Iran has ever attacked another soverain nation.
The US, however, has attacked several, and just recently, led by Bush the lesser, has attacked, invaded and now occupies, Iran's closest neighber Iraq.

Now, a lot of you may not realize that Iran stepped in when the US invaded Afghanistan and offered its help. It is Widely accepted that without Iran's help, the US could not have overthrown the taliban as quickly as it did. (We'll pass on how the US left Afghanistan in a muddle while it went on to attack Iraq).

At any rate, Iran is not a dangerous nation, has never been, and god, allah, whoever - willing, never shall be. But a lot of people think it's right to bleat about hate-mongering and nasty speeches. Don't they realize that words don't hurt - but US bombs dropped on innocent civilians do?
There is a special hell for hypocrites, according to the bible. That ought to be important for any Jew or Christian to remember.

Irgun, Stern, and Haganah were terrorist organizations, not self defense forces. Israeli historians such as Benny Morris and Illan Pappe have made this abundantly clear. They were "defending" Jews the same way the SS "defended" Germans. No amount of Zio-fascist revisionism and disinformation can change this historical reality.

The only real Hitler in the Middle East was mass murderer Ariel Sharon. Execute POWs in cold blood just like the SS at Malmedy. Goad and incite the Lebanese Christian Phalangits (i.e., Fascists) to murder over 2000 innocent Palestinian refugees at Sabra and Chatilla--mostly women, children, and old men--and then order the IDF troops to stand back and not interfere. Sharon has more blood on his hands than Arafat could have dreamed of.

Jabotinsky was a fascist. His Betar youth movement performed the same sort of exercises as the Hitler Youth and wore military uniforms with BROWN SHIRTS! Jabotinsky hated all Arabs and thought he had the absolute right to kill as many of them as necessary to achieve his end of a Greater Israel. Terror was his weapon of choice is ethnically cleansing Palestine of those he deemed unworthy of living with Jews.

Untermenschen. Lebensraum. Sound familiar?

Hello WO{rld:

Un-justly, because Islami PAKi-Man [ex Pagan Idol Worshipers] and or Islami PARSi-Man [ex Pagan Idol Worshipers] hath a Nuclear Bomb's (a Non Islamic invention) does not tell Us , that they are smart! Or ORiGiNAl! To the Contrary!

iMportant: In Both Madrassas [Yeshivas, Perochial schools] in Iran/Persia & Pakistan/Baluchstan that they (includes Saudi, Afghanistan) Tell [Orally] & Teach [Books] their Young-in's (not Ours) , that the "Non-Islamic Nationals" ("Kafeers", aka Jews, Christs & Hindus & Buddhists..] Stole All the Nuclear Technologys, Math knowlege , Astronomy awareness etc.. from Allah or Al Islam of them ISLAMi's!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Note: They [Islami's] also Jealously teach their Youngin's that the Non-Islamics Stole EUROPE from Them, as far away as Portugal & Spain in 1400's;. And That Judeo-Islam Founded America 1st, not Judeo-Christ or Judeo-Ju's!?????????????????

Vote: BOMB all Three Satanic Nations: Iran, Afghanistan & Pakistan back to the STONE AGES, Today, not Tomorrow! Then & Only Then will a Genuine-Peace-Love & Happy Earth will become a Reality, else will remain Dillusional/Illusional to selves & Loverd Ones, Unjustly!

While I generally approve of letting everyone speak freely, Ahmadinejad is "beyond the pale". It would be one thing to speak to him privately, but to give this religious despot a forum in which to air his hate-speech -- and give him a free dinner besides! -- seems, at best, ill-advised.

Yes, invite him but also invite some American Muslim legal experts to explain to him that he is basically an idiot when it comes to Islam.

"Ahmadinejad is your brother. Treat him like a brother, and respect the problems Iran has as a nation."

That anti-semitic pig isn't my brother. He isn't the brother of any Bahai either since he's busy killing and torturing them. His only "brothers" are other pigs like him.

If Ahmadinejad is ever to envision a new direction in which to lead his country, is that to be assisted by isolating him, threatening him, and refusing to talk to him? Are you among those whose only solution is to bomb him into oblivion? Don't you think he may imagine, from that perspective, ways he might bomb the bombers first, in a preemptive strike? Come on, join us in the real world. Ahmadinejad is your brother. Treat him like a brother, and respect the problems Iran has as a nation.

"I heard Akhmetjihad's speech last evening at the UN. I was shocked to see how a Muslim gets away with demonizing the whole religion of Judaism at the international conference?

What if someone attacked the whole religion of Islam for daily terror attacks on civilians (which would be not far from the truth)?"

THat was interesting, wasn't it? I'm not Jewish, but I was embarrassed for every Christian on the face of the earth. Whatever the Christians there may have thought isn't good enough. They should have had the guts to SAY SOMETHING. I guess for them oil speaks louder than Jesus.

I agree with this article. The Iranian president has shown he will exploit any opportunity to foment hatred, and he has many such opportunities: at the United Nations; at tolerant religious groups that are not tolerated in Iran; and at some members of the media. It is important, though, to ask further: what should decent people do when faced with an articulate, forceful personality like Ahmanadinajad? Boycotting him, as George W Bush has done, doesn't seem to have weakened him at all. Thank you for this important viewpoint.

Note" "i" do-not understand; why could'nt IRAN/Persia Leaderships be 'civilized' , at the Get-Go so to spaketh, about their (not Our) Nuclear Ambitions or Intensions?

Meaning: Gee, If some Nation wanted to go Nuclear, then WHY BE SNAEKY about it, or so Testy about such intent or ambition????

Important Reality: From when they 1st started; Iran, because they did not come forward and behave in a 'Civilized' manner & flouting the U.N. [World National Governments of Earth, not Heaven or Hell governments] instead of Cooperation , is FREUDiAN Slip that's TELLUSng something.

If Iran/Persia , from the begining of their plans, was nice about their Ambitions like intending to go Nuclear Power because of 'Green' House Excuses, then Iran/Persia should've taken the ANGEL way, yet chose the SATAN's Way!

Vote: Like We need Less Competing Religion Systems, then Vote: Less Nuclear Arms! Soo, To STOP Iran now!!! Or Iran (shiiat) + PAKi {Sunni) [Both Dellusional Vanguards ISLAM] will stop the West!

Vote: DOWN with Theocracy & Monarchy on All Earth Now! Not Tomorrow! NO IRAN/Persia/Parsi Bomb!

Paid for by the JO'KTAN-Nationalis; aka KAHTAN Movement, U.S.A. 2013, for World Peace, Healing of Nations & more Good Tidings..

RANDALL

You wrote, "Could it be that you know deep down inside that the fairy tale that makes you feel so good and superior is false."

I have met God and I definitely do not feel superior but does the fact that you call it a "fairy tale" betray that someone might feel superior?

God is a Trinity and God is a Being of Pure Love and Jesus is God-Incarnate and it seems that there are going to be some people in for quite a surprize when they find out that the True, Living, Triune, Triumphant God is a searcher of hearts and minds, not of religious affiliations or lack thereof.

Take care, be ready.

Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

HANK

You wrote, "As someone that has studied Iran, and have known several people that have lived there, I can tell you that Amadinijad does not speak for the majority of Iranians, any more than Bush speaks for the majority of americans".

How many people that are in charge of a country, any country, or have been in charge of a country actually speak or have spoken for the majority of the people of that country?

Did Hitler speak for the majority of Germans?

Did Stalin speak for the majority of the people of the Soviet Union?

Has anyone in power ever spoken for the majority of the people under them?

What really does the "fact" that Amadinijad does not speak for the majority of Iranians have to do with what he may or may not do?

The reason that the word, fact, is in "" is because I do not know it to be a fact but it probably is true but really what difference does that make?

Take care, be ready.

Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

One of the things that I find interesting where people compare Ahmadinejad to Hitler is that when Hitler was telling the world just what he intended to try to do, at least from what I can gather since I was not alive at the time, not many people took him quite as seriously as Hitler took himself.

It seems that Admadinejad has stated flat out that he intends to, at least try, wipe Israel and America off of the map, so to speak.

Does anyone think that he is overstating what he intends to do or that he is telling us point-blank what his intentions are?

Not letting him speak does not change his intentions, it just means that less people get to hear it.

By the way, America is not the great satan for two reasons: satan is not a country and satan is not great.

Take care, be ready.

Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

To quote the Queen from Alice in Wonderland:

"`Off with his head!' she said, without even looking round.

`I'll fetch the executioner myself,' said the King eagerly, and he hurried off."

Better the Iranians than Israel.

You yammer on about Iran being our enemy?
Why, How?

Israel has bankrupted us
morally and financially. And now there's AIPAC flooding congress to be sure we bialout their sourceof income.

THEN there latest trick was trying to get us in a fight with Russia in Georgia

(the administration says that israel had a 'relationship below the radar with Georgia.)
And Saakashvili has declared Georgia the Israel of the Caucauses)

Israel provided advisors, arms, and the war provocation to get us in. "WE have not taken onthe mighty Russia," one of the Israelis said.
And US blood and treasure was to follow.

Why don't you shut up about iran being the enemy. Their leader has a big mouth. Israel's corrupt leaders are ticks on the American body.

I cannot understand those who know nothing about the history of the United States as concerns Iran, and spout the line of the "Bomb, Bomb Iran" crowd. Iran may indeed pose a someday threat to the U.S., but, before we condemn them completely, we should remember historical facts. Iran was our friend and ally who elected a president who decided to nationalize their oil resources. (Just like the Saudis, our dear friends.) In response, we, with our CIA, caused the ouster of their president and engineered the installation of the Shah, who was a terrible dictator and abused his people with his secret police. Then, when Iraq invaded Iran and caused the death of millions of their people, we became friends with Iraq and helped Iraq with arms, including chemical weapons. Iran later retaliated by holding many of our embassy folks hostage, until they were later released, due to our selling the Iranians arms, etc. (remember "Arms For Hostages" scandal?) So the Iranians have not had a very nice relationship with the U.S. and cannot be blamed for a very careful attitude toward us, especially considering our one-sided attitude as relates to the Arab-Israeli matter.

AFSC, a Quaker organization, and one of the hosts of the dinner is also a Nobel Peace Prize recipient -- awarded the late 40's based in large part on the war relief work the AFSC provided "enemy civilians" (i.e, Germans, Italians Japanese) at the end of WWI and WWII. Countries that too were once vilified and our enemies -- and yes who were acting in ways that brought on war and horrible suffering to the world.

But at the heart of our sense of Jesus's ministry is the belief that their is that of God in every person -- even the most troubled and violent person. And we believe as we see Jesus acting, that engaging with even that person opens up the opportunity for dialouge, for understanding, and yes, possibly redemption for all. Sitting down for dinner with Ahmadinejad, the elected President of the proud country of Iran, is not about 'honoring' him but about honoring the people of Iran and honoring the possibility that engagement, at least before war begins, has the chance of bringing significant movement towards peace.

It may not work. We are a faithful but not at all naive people. It maybe that that of God within Ahmadinejad will not be engaged. But isn't it always better to attempt diplomacy and engagement before dropping the bombs and killing so many thousands of innocents? You can always resort to war, but it is impossible to undo the destruction of war after the fact.

As an early Quaker, William Penn, one of our founding fathers was fond of saying: "Lets us then try what Love may do." Yes, to a neo-con that might sound silly and naive. But I dare say I doubt that it would to Jesus.

acebojangles-- I judge by what I see in action, not propaganda. What I see is Bush lying to the american people to justify an illegal invasion of a soverign nation, and in the process causing the deaths of tens of thousands, including over 4 thousand of our own sons and daughters for oil. Amadinajad on the other hand may run his mouth, but the Iranians have invaded no one, and even when they took our embassy personell hostage, instigated by a justified outrage at our meddeling in their internal affairs, they never killed any of them. We got them all back.

As someone that has studied Iran, and have known several people that have lived there, I can tell you that Amadinijad does not speak for the majority of Iranians, any more than Bush speaks for the majority of americans. I do not want to be judged by the ignorance that comes out of Bush's mouth, and I don't think that Iranians should be judged by what comes out of their presidents mouth. By their deeds shall they be judged.

Hank:

America isn't perfect and we make a lot of mistakes in our foreign policy. If, however, you think this constitutes the plank to Iran's proverbial splinter, maybe you should move to Iran and try to make similar comments about their government and leadership. I don't like Bush either, but I don't believe that he ever said that any other nations should be wiped off the map.

So you fear a dialogue with the Iranian leader
will enable his despotism.

Then he must be the only one left that isn't a despot.

Jews, Christians, and Muslims all think they have the one true religion that must be preserved at all costs.

No matter how many get killed or marginalized it is always the other guy that is the terrorist.

If your god up in heaven loves you so much why are you scared of everything?

Could it be that you know deep down inside that the fairy tale that makes you feel so good and superior is false.

It is so nice to know that Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad is the new satan. I guess that we return the favor.

However, it is a small America that is conspicuously absent from the UN when the Iranian president speaks, as if we may be polluted.

I listened to the interpretation of Ahmadinejad's speech in the UN yesterday. He used very interesting religious language. He was obviously not afraid to push his faith.

When one listens to Ahmadinejad without the political spin and propaganda from our own liars, there are numerous openings for dialogue with Iran. We forget that there is a large moderate population in Iran. Did you know that there is even a relatively significant Christian population there?

We shut out our "enemies" at our own peril.

I heard Akhmetjihad's speech last evening at the UN. I was shocked to see how a Muslim gets away with demonizing the whole religion of Judaism at the international conference?

What if someone attacked the whole religion of Islam for daily terror attacks on civilians (which would be not far from the truth)?

I'm sorry, you cannot have a president like George Bush and decry other leaders despotism. Until we get rid of the criminals in the white house, we have NO moral ground to stand on to critisize anyone else. Also, as long as we are umbilicled to israel, calling others purveyors of hate is an empty argument as well. To put it in terms you might understand, we need to get the beam out of our own eye, befor we try and get the splinter out of anyone elses.

B’SD

JDO Applauds Bombing of Ahmadinejad Headquaters in London
the Iranian Embassy

Today JDO states we had no hand in the bombing that just happened but are quite
happy in fact we have a JDO chapter in London, but JDO is not a Jewish Underground.
JDO is instead an armed public Jewish self-defense group that patrols synagogues and
Jews homes from violent anti-semitic or terror attack. As for the Iranian Embassy
it is Ahmadinejad who actually planned attacks on Jews in Israel and around the world. In fact it
was Ahamdinejad who sent Iranian trained terroroists to blow up several hundred Jews at the
Jewish Center in Bueno Aires Argentina a few short yeas ago. So now apparently some angry
Jews in London formed their own Jewish Underground to strike back just like the Irgun used to
do,and give the Hitler of Iran a taste of “Jewish Justice” should we shed a tear ? Their were 3
Jewish Undergruonds in pre-stae Israel, the Irgun, Stern Group and Hagana. The Irgun was
mainly Jewish youth and adults who originally had been part of Jabotinky group the Jewish
Self-Defense Organization which was a public armed self-defense group. The Irgun was
completly underground and did use bombs and bullets on actual members of Arab terrorist
groups starting in the mid 1930’s. One day Jabotinsky read in the newspapers that after some
Arab terrorists had blown up scores of innocent Jews living all over pre-state Israel the Irgun did
a series of retaliatroy and preventative bombings at the secret headquaters of the PLO Hamas
types of those times. They even bombed these Arab terror groups and they really hit hard with
bombs and bullets. The Irgun boys on those missions ot save Jews lives did not ask Jabotinsky’s
for permission which when they had been in the public armed self-defense group
Jewish Self-Defense Organization they would have.In fact at first Jabotinsky would say anytime
someone would want to speak to him about who did these attacks he would say “father (himself)
does not want to know anything.” On the other hand after a series of suuccesful bombing and
shootings against the PLO and Hamas Arab Nazi groups of those times he wrote praising thier
actions these important words. “ My children write more clearly and more succintly than I do. “
amd he praised and morally supported Irgun attacks against known enemies of the Jews be it
Nazis in Germany or Arab terrorists in Israel or anywhere else .Prior to that Jabotinsky had been
invoved with taking up guns against pogromists anti-semites in Russia,or Arab rioters in Israel as
part of a self-defense for Jews as well as holding demonstrations.

Now, JDO has been asked what it thinks of these recent attacks on Ahamdinejad HQ in London.
Simple we will say “we don’t know who did it and we don’t want to know, but Jews can breathe
alot better now that some Jews who we don’t even know, decided to resssurect an Irgun way of
doing things, even if JDO itself cannot travel that long poweful undergound road, at least others
understand. They write far more clearer than we do, their message will be clearly understood by
Ahmadinejad the Iranian Hitler.”

Meanwhile the Quakers and others are having a dinner to honor the “ Hitler of Iran” this
Thursday night at the Gand Hyatt and there will be a huge rally to protest . The same QQuakers
whose leaders went to meet Hitler in Germenyt during the Holocaust agaisnt Jews and praised
him as “a man of peace”Now these fakers are lying in a news story where their head liar
(Fleming) denied that Ahmadinjad ever denied the Holocaust. They admit they are doiing this
dinner to save Islamic Relublicof Iran and their heor Ahamdinejad from sanctions and to actually
get the world of his back !! Never forget that the Quacker radicla political arm the Americans
Friends Service Committee worked with the Arab Nazis of the PLO and had “Death to Israel”
demonstrations with known Arab terrorists groups. JDO is going to make the names nd home
addresses of the American cheering section holding this dinner public so angry Jews can march
on these colloborators with the “Hitler of Iran’s” homes right here !! JDO soon will put that on
the website as prt of “ Operation Crush Terror ! ”

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EMERGENCY PROTEST at the AHAMDINEJAD DINNER

THURSDAY SEP 25

GRAND HYATT HOTEL