On Faith: Guest Voices: Hopes and Fears of All the Years

Rock On:

What nut cases!

December 22, 2007 10:07 PM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on December 22, 2007 22:07

Concerned The Christian Now Liberated:

As per many NT exegetes to include Professors Crossan, Borg and Fredriksen, On Faith panelists, there is "No Historic Reason for the Season".

There was no Virgin birth. http://wiki.faithfutures.org/index.php/026_Jesus_Virginally_Conceived

And there was no Star of Bethlem. http://wiki.faithfutures.org/index.php/369_Star_of_Revelation

excerpts:

"Gerd Lüdemann

Commenting on the infancy narratives overall, Luedemann [Jesus, 124-29] concludes that Luke and Matthew represent "two equally unhistorical narratives." He cites the occurrence of a miraculous heavenly sign at key points in the life of Mithridates VI in a history written by Justinus (active in the reign of Augustus, 2 BCE to 14 CE). "

"John P. Meier

Meier [Marginal Jew I,211ff and 376] considers these traditions to be "largely products of early Christian reflection on the salvific meaning of Jesus in the light of OT prophecies" and concludes that their historicity is "highly questionable."

So nativity scenes on government property in the UK or the USA or wherever are basic representations of fiction and are equivalent to having representations of Santa Claus and his reindeer and/or Yule trees. No harm, no foul!!

And Merry Reality to All!!!

December 19, 2007 4:01 PM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on December 19, 2007 16:01

4th watch:

Messrs. Borg , Crossan
Enjoyed reading this commentary, it was brief, brisk, and the closing question kicked hard like Dads Irish whiskey did those many years ago.

Your question “If you are a Christian and the Old Roman Empire crucified your Jesus, how do you plan to live in the New Roman Empire?”

Life in the Old Empire was under the law, Christ brought them freedom from law and for this reason the Old Empire murdered Him. In the New Empire life is free from that former law and I savor that freedom one day at a time.

Out of the Old Roman Empire a Centurion’s report in Matthew Ch. 8 condenses the Christian life to its natural state, to simply go, come, and do as the Lord directs.
Here in the New Roman Empire that is my plan too.

December 19, 2007 11:36 AM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on December 19, 2007 11:36

Concerned The Christian Now Liberated:

If we consider nativity scenes as just more fictional accounts about good people (e.g. Santa Clause and his elves, Gabriel, Moroni et al), "do no harm to such scenes" or to the associated commentary. Even pagans have their fictional accounts to celebrate on their hallowed day of Halloween.

from: http://members.tripod.com/~TaraMiller/halloween.html

"Halloween: The Pagan Festival of Samhain

Paganism, and Druidry especially, recognise eight feasts durring the yearly cycle or the Eight Fold Year. These celebrations are based upon a deep and mysterious connection between our individual lives and the source of this planet’s life. Like any other religious ocassion, these Pagan holidays are marked by special observances.

The most popular festival, in ancient times as well as modern Pagan society, is Samhain or Samhuinn, (pronounced Sou’in) the Celtic new year.

Halloween Myths

1) The pumpkin God, Samhain ( pronounced Sam’hane) DOES NOT exist.

2) Pagans DO NOT sacrifice babies or animals on Halloween. The Wiccan Rede states "Do what thou wilst, but harm none."

3) Pagans DO NOT worship the Devil or Satan on Halloween.

4) PAGANS ARE NOT SATANISTS.

These myths have been perpetuated by people who have seen too many horror movies and the Christian idea of horrific and mythical forms of Satanism. "

And contemporary Wiccan witches (commentators?) note:

And contemporary Wiccans note:

"Also, some Wiccans feel that the tradition is offensive to "real witches" for promoting stereotypical caricatures of "wicked witches".[45] However, other Neopagans, perhaps most of them, see it as a harmless holiday in which some of the old traditions are celebrated by the mainstream culture, albeit in a different manner.”

December 18, 2007 3:25 PM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on December 18, 2007 15:25

Concerned The Christian Now Liberated:

John S,

Hmmm, another "red necked", born-again Christian are you??

Let the group know about your next encounter with Jesus. We would like to join in the chorus with some questions. Invite CNN also.

December 18, 2007 10:48 AM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on December 18, 2007 10:48

E Favorite:

John Stephens: “Your information is nothing new. It’s just warmed over hash of the same tired trash”

Have you been to the Religion section of a book store lately? There’s Christian inspiration, Christian fiction (my favorite), and numerous editions of the bible along with tomes helping people to understand it – as if the word from God himself is unintelligible to his flock.

Maybe you’re just trying to silence people who don’t have your point of view. Perhaps you’re concerned that some people will see some value in it?

I also question equating the existence of your mother and father with that of God. I’m sure they weren’t invisible and that you weren’t limited to telepathic communication.

December 18, 2007 9:25 AM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on December 18, 2007 09:25

John Stephens:

Hey, CONCERNED THE CHRISTIAN NOW LIBERATED,
You've posted the same lame nonsense ad infinitum ad nauseum. No doubt, you think yourself remarkably clever, like a baby discovering its feet. The simple fact is that there are volumes, nay tomes, written to disprove the Bible. Your information is nothing new. It's just warmed over hash of the same tired trash.

Some of us have had the sublime pleasure of experiential reality in our faith. That is to say, we have experienced God and Christ up close and personal. You may just as well argue that my father and mother never really existed.

You're just a dog baying at the moon. Nice croon, but a looney tune.

December 17, 2007 11:58 PM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on December 17, 2007 23:58

John Stephens:

On the lam.

December 17, 2007 11:44 PM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on December 17, 2007 23:44

Anonymous:

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Main Page | About On Faith | By Religion | All On Faith Panelists | RSS Feed Cal Thomas
Syndicated political columnist
Syndicated political columnist and “On Faith” panelist Cal Thomas has a twice-weekly column that appears in over 500 newspapers around the world. A graduate of American University, Thomas is a veteran of broadcast and print journalism. He has worked for NBC, CNBC, PBS television, and the Fox News Channel where he currently appears on the weekly media critique show, “Fox News Watch.” Thomas has authored ten books, including Blinded by Might: Can the Religious Right Save America?, A Freedom Dream, Public Persons and Private Lives, Book Burning, Liberals for Lunch, Occupied Territory, The Death of Ethics in America, Uncommon Sense and Things That Matter Most. His latest was The Wit and Wisdom of Cal Thomas. In 1995, Thomas was honored with a Cable Ace Award nomination for Best Interview Program. Other awards include a George Foster Peabody team reporting award, and awards from both the Associated Press and United Press International. Common Ground, which Thomas writes for USA Today, offers insightful discussion of contentious social issues with his friend and political counterpart, Bob Beckel. The two are working together on a book to be published in 2007. Close. Cal Thomas
Syndicated political columnist
Syndicated political columnist and “On Faith” panelist Cal Thomas has a twice-weekly column that appears in over 500 newspapers around the world. A graduate of American University, Thomas is a veteran of broadcast and print journalism. more »
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God Not Subject to Government Approval
Let those who still "keep Christmas" in their hearts observe it well and not look to governments to ratify what they have abandoned.

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All Comments (12)
Roy:
I agree that God is not subject to government approval but the problem with Cal and his ilk is that they think government is subject to the approval of their own private definition of God.

December 17, 2007 8:37 AM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on December 17, 2007 08:37

Norrie Hoyt:
"God Not Subject to Government Approval"

Neither is non-belief in "God", though Romney and the GOP would have it otherwise.

December 17, 2007 11:11 AM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on December 17, 2007 11:11

Russell D.:
Blah Blah Blah.

Fun fact all Christians should know:

Jesus wasn't born on December 25th.

Thought I'd put that out there.

December 17, 2007 11:20 AM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on December 17, 2007 11:20

Mr Mark:
Cal writes:

"...exploited Jesus to make money rather than to obey His teachings."

Ironic, coming from Cal Thomas, isn't it?

December 17, 2007 11:31 AM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on December 17, 2007 11:31

Andrea:
"Requiring governments to adhere to this unique expression of who God is would require a "conversion" by the consumer-driven culture."

No, Cal. It would require a complete overhaul of our Constitution.

December 17, 2007 11:45 AM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on December 17, 2007 11:45

Robert:
How incredibly hubristic to expect the world to "properly observe" the alleged birth of your particular deity.

Mr. Thomas, how many births of other deities have you properly observed this year?

December 17, 2007 1:23 PM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on December 17, 2007 13:23

TSK:
He summed up the temptest-in-a-teapot nature of the 'war on Christmas' pretty well. He hit the nail on the head about a consumer-driven culture exploiting all-things-Jesus to sell goods. But he missed the part about how the culture just before the consumer-driven one exploited all-things-Jesus to wage war on heathens, own slaves, make women second-class-citizens, etc.

Institutional Christianity has a lot of explaining and apologizing to do, but it has this bad case of amnesia....

December 17, 2007 2:25 PM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on December 17, 2007 14:25

Paganplace:
The Christian Right like to claim their consumer capitalism is divinely-ordained, and that they're the sole ones to credit for the civilization, ...then when the civilization conflates their Jesus and money and material things, just like Christian Right politicians do, ...they blame the secularists and non-Christians for their own behavior.

Yah.

December 17, 2007 4:42 PM | Report Offensive Comments

Posted on December 17, 2007 16:42

Jozevz et al:
Where is my Essay [comment]????????

Please post me 'Comment' or let me know you kept it forever!???

Where is my Comment??

Please 'POST" me comment! And The Others whom you suckered sally, ET AL!

rEMOVE YOUR "bot' FROM ME COMPUTER(S) & oTHER(S) IN 24 HOURS, OR ELSE THIS WILL HAPPEN EVERY DAY 365 DAYS PER YEAR!

Notice: You have not met US (me) half way, now you will be suid in FEDERAL COURT a.s.a.p.! bye parasites!

"Your comment has been received and held for approval by the blog owner"

"Your comment has been received and held for approval by the blog owner".