Name a moral statement or action, uttered or performed by a religious person, that could not have been uttered or performed by an unbeliever.
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Mildred and loving
May 8, 2008 12:50 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on May 8, 2008 12:50
Mildred and loving
May 8, 2008 12:50 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on May 8, 2008 12:50
I would like to comment on just one thing from the above, because I have to go out in ten minutes,
'....Can they name a moral statement or action, uttered or performed by a religious person, that could not have been uttered or performed by an unbeliever?'
The answer from any self-respecting religious entity must be a resounding 'No!'. I'm surprised you're still waiting for an answer, you should have asked me! Funnily enough the answer can be found in the telling of 'The Good Samaritan.' Anyone who helps another intuitively does so due to the understanding of the necessity of the act. The quality of character of a helping person will be seen by the level of empathy and compassion they have for the one they help. The religion, or set of beliefs of the helper is neither relevant nor helpful in satisfying the necessity to act. Nor is it appropriate to evangelise as you dress the wounds of an injured traveller. I’m sure this is what Jesus meant to convey.
This is called ‘behaving yourself’ where I’m coming from and should be practiced by everyone, especially those confused within the belief that the words and forms of religion come before ‘religious acts’. My definition of a truly religious act is one exampled above with no mention of religion at all. Atheists, agnostics, non-conformists and cat worshippers can all perform ‘religious’ acts, although they’d prefer another term no doubt. The quality of the goodness given by an atheist to someone suffering is to great degree down to it’s necessity and appropriateness, the quality of the giver I have already described and these are in no way inferior to those adherents of my religion who behave in the same manner.
I have always admired and enjoyed your well written articles and essays . If I don't agree with everything you write, something you wouldn't expect or demand I expect, what you say makes one think, or better -makes one examine your own ideas for rust and dust . That's a compliment that is and there is no 'but' hanging around the corner in ambush.
However, (damn, that's another form of 'but' isn't it?) I would like to know what your opinion of Scientology is. I can't seem to find any reference to it in your writings anywhere though I shall continue looking. Maybe you have dismissed them as a religion and therefore naturally as bad as the rest of them. But it isn't you know -a religion I mean, although it's worse than any religion I can think of by a long shot. And there are very few people un-distracted by film star PR articulate enough to dissect the animal efficiently in order to expose it's entrails to public view.
Will you have a shot at it if you havn’t already?
May 7, 2008 1:39 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on May 7, 2008 13:39
god gave us free will.
Mr. hitches wave your hand in the air any direction you desire.
According to nobel prize winning phyicists science does not have an answer for free will.
Your are free Mr hitches to love man hate man love god hate god. it is your choice.
you sholuld thank god.
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February 21, 2008 7:19 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on February 21, 2008 19:19
The issue is not whether good or bad exists in believer or nonbeliever. The issue is if one follows the tenets of any religion does it make them a more moral and ethical person. Certainly one could argue that one does not need religion to act moral or ethical but my premise is if one does follow their religious tenets religiously if you will(not just lip service), the results will demonstrate a moral and ethical person. And the reason for that is because religion by its very nature offers morality and ethics as guidlines.
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February 18, 2008 9:05 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Posted on February 18, 2008 21:05
Hi,
I completely understand your position. Although raised in a Christian home, I saw no concrete evidence that God existed. I grew weary of accepting something on face value and no one could prove (or, at the least, successfully argue) their religious dogmas.
I felt this way until one night I was prayed for by a blind man and his wife. I was about to be married and my Mom insisted I have someone "bless it". As this man prayed over me, I was mentally preoccupied with the worry of "Happy Hour" soon expiring at my favorite bar. The couple finished their prayer and I insincerely thanked them and rushed to my car to make the last 30 minutes of half-priced alcohol.
Enroute to the bar and about 2 blocks from their home, I suddenly felt something odd happening. Even today, I still can't explain it. All I know is within a few seconds, I hollered out "Oh my gosh, there IS a God!". I couldn't believe my own ears as I involuntarily shouted that. From that moment on, the feeling I had grew stronger and stronger. By the time I made it to the bar, I was in a sort of daze (no alcohol ingested at all). I started playing billiards because I had no desire for alcohol or even cigarettes even though I smoked heavily.
As I was playing billiards alone, I began to observe other people in a totally different light. I heard a loud voice in my head that said "Chuck, that's not who they really are. THIS is who they really are!" And with that, I suddenly saw the purest, whitest light I'd ever seen in my life near the navel of everyone in the room. The next feeling I experienced really shocked me. I was suddenly drawn to that light and began to feel an avalanche of LOVE coming out of me and directed to each person I focused on. COnsidering my brawling past, that as quite unlike my normal personality. Expecially since this was a motorcycle bar with a Texas version of Hell's Angels (they were the Banditos).
This gush of love kept getting stronger until I felt totally overwhelmed. I threw my cue down and began to rush for the exit. As I looked into someone's eyes, they'd stare defiantly back (direct eye contact in that bar was usually interpreted as a challenge for a fight). But as they stared back into my eyes for more than 2 - 3 seconds, their hardened features suddenly softened as though they were feeling something they'd never felt before. I now know it was Unconditional Love they were feeling, but at the time I had no idea what was happening. So I continued to rush for the door and got to my car. I sat there for over an hour just blown away. I never said a word to anyone, not even my closest friends or fiance.
About 3 years later, a little sawed-off fireplug looking co-worker appeared in my life and constantly badgered me about "this Jesus guy". I threatened him with bodily harm and meant it. He kept at for a couple of weeks until I evening while preaching away, I finally decided to shut him up for good. So I said "Larry, I'm going to tell you a true story and when I'd done, I don't EVER want to hear another word about Jesus or anything else you're selling".
As I concluded telling the story I just shared with you (including more graphic detail), Larry suddenly slapped his knee and yelled "Brother! That's exactly what I've been telling you about all this time! You had an encounter with God".
Mr. Hitchens, I totally respect your view and wouldn't attempt to argue with you. There's nothing I can say that will probably ever convince you. I might be able to "sway you", but that's not the same as convincing you so there's really no point in trying. But I hope you one day have the same experience I was fortunate enough to have that fateful night.
Sincerely,
Chuck Frazier
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Not applicable, to, say, Buddhism or religious ideas bottomed on PanDeism, is it? If the hypothesized God is not creating an ingroup and an outgroup then religion causes no harm.
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