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Anon

Your post to Arif is amazing especially when one considers your other posts. I can't make sense of you man.

I was born into a strict Muslim family but love was everywhere even when my older brother brought in some US seamen for lunch, my mum would cook them food. That was mid-sixties. My brother worked on US oil tankers taking oil to Vietnam. I just say this so that many here know that even though I was born into a strict Shiite Muslim family we were not crazy as some would like to paint all of us. Indeed almost everyone I know to this day is far from being crazy! May be it is the fact that I do not sit with the ignorant, no matter from what camp.

Yet today, at the age of 57, I have come to a firm belief that we are indeed ONE soul and God is pure and unconditional love. How do I reconcile my heart with those Quranic verses that Concerned and others keep posting here? Well, I do and with logic. This is part of my belief and no matter how hard I try to reason with folk, it seems a loosing battle, for I know that faith and belief is a personal issue. Thus, I try to resist replying to stuff which comes from a mind that is set in concrete.

Ali, Prophet Mohammad's cousin said: A tree that does not bend is the first to fall in a storm.

No one can reach the absolute truth whilst they are stuck in a worldly belief system. Boxed in firmly whilst we witness this whole expanding universe. Truth and religion is set apart. But it does not mean we disrespect others because of their beliefs. Indeed if we are to gain their hearts we must treat them with kindness. If certain Muslims transgress human laws and commit murder, we should treat them as criminals. We should not go waging wars on whole countries and drop bombs on towns and villages just because we suspect there are criminals there.

We do not bomb the whole school yard in order to deal with a bully. Are such basic lessons taught to us in kinder gardens lost to us?

Anon: I offer you peace from my heart as I had done here before. The same offer is for all humanity from me till Eternity.

My heart tells me: My body is that of a Jew, my heart is that of a Christian, my soul is that of a Muslim (truly submitted to God) and my life is that of a Buddhist and my way is Pure Love and it is expanding and changing with every moment yet it remains perfect and at peace with every change.

Arif,
U never were a Muslim-clearly u are a racist fascist zionist jew-and a coward who hides behind a Muslim name.

Your views on Mecca are stupid and ingnorant:as a jew and porbably an israeli,you are promoting another war on another muslim state as the case was/is with Iraq-and where American blood and treasure is wasted while AIPAC/israel/jews sit on the side and enjoy the show.

Go ahead and destroy Mecca-it is no more tha a piece of real estate that can be rebuilt;Islam however is INDUSTRUCTABLE,it firmly in the hearts of 1.6 billion human beings.

Your desperate attacks on the Prophet ring a bell:the same ones that the jews of banu quraizah threw at him in vain 1400 years ago when he was alive-and his message of ultimate truth stood the test of times and Islam today is the fastest growing faith on earth-u can go ahead and eat your heart!!
I would not normally respond to some one like u-but meant to show your unique package of racism and ignorance.

Ms. Gallagher,

“Today we commemorate the day the atom bomb was dropped on Hiroshima.”

You will have to speak for yourself here. I don’t commemorate this day; indeed, I personally don’t know a single individual, beyond you, who does.

“And yet, it is a beautiful scandal, isn’t it? That God would care about one singular, particular life. Where would we be, how would we understand our human story, without it?”

What it also speaks to is our utter devotion to self-absorption. Of what possible use can a God be who is NOT particularly concerned with my invaluable life?

The story that moves me is the one told by Shin Bok-Su. There is no right or wrong here, just one terribly awful; among many others, I’m sure.

I had an occasion to meet and speak with Mr. Oppenheimer back in 1958-9. He came to speak at our high school and our smallish advanced physics class was treated to a couple of hours of conversation with him following dinner. We were particularly interested in his insights into quantum physics and expectations of thermonuclear devices. He was uncomfortable discussing nuclear weapons, immediately shrouded with a sad and tortured look, focusing his observations on the difficulties of their use (as opposed to the morality of their use). He was, at the time, under a cloud of suspicion with respect to security. He spoke very thoughtfully, gently, slowly and clearly. I’ve not the slightest doubt that Shin’s story would have been sheer torture for him to hear or read.

But Oppenheimer tortured himself. The decision to use the bomb actually belonged to Harry Truman and as far as I know, he lost no sleep over it. We have heard both negative and affirmative cases here in prior messages. Unfortunately, both depend on virtual facts which didn’t happen so a definitive answer is indeterminate.

“What has happened to the soul of the destroying nation?”

I suppose the use of the word “soul” in this construction is intended to extend the hand of God into nations, to establish a particular relationship between God and the nation (He created). Sheer nonsense. All it does is muddy the waters.

What we are asking is, “What has happened to the beliefs and principles of this destroying nation?” That is a fair question.

I don’t believe our use of nuclear devices at Hiroshima and Nagasaki has caused any erosion of our principles or beliefs. On the contrary, the first experience of them made their further use unfathomable, until more recently. Haven’t you noticed? We have a lady no less, running for President, who insists on keeping the option of a first nuclear strike on the table, and berating anyone who says otherwise. Yup, it is in our national interest to have every other nation in the world consider the possibility that we might just do them in. Really smart, aren’t we?

Abu Ghraib, Guantanamo, Iraq, Afghanistan, etc. are OUR generation’s problem. They have nothing to do with World War II. The erosion of our morality is found in US, now, not in the fellows who developed and used the bomb in 1945. All you have to do is look at the evening news and see the list of our best and brightest who backdated their options to collect more millions on top of millions. Right? And we just had to invade Iraq to clean out that nest of Al Qaida terrorists, right?

Some people with their altruism worry about the destruction of nations far away from home while they neglect the destruction of the nation that they call home. Very typical....and it bugs my mind..(sic)

Nations do not have souls, just as corporations do not have souls. Only individuals have souls. However, a group of people gathered together to form a nation, or a corporation,agree to subjugate their souls to the greater good of the institution. These institutions provide them with safety, earnings, power, influence. A soul seems like a fair price for all that. The nation or corporation must survive in order to provide this to it's members, so it does whatever is expedient in order for it to prevail. How did the bombings of Japan, the near extermination of Native Americans, the unjust war in Iraq effect the American soul? Not at all. It doesn't have one. The machine grinds on as it always has. But it has effected many thoughtful individual souls, who work tirelessly to end the insanity of war.

Wake up folk. War is an outmoded form of settling disputes. It robs you from being creative. Violence begets violence. Have you not seen the results throughout our history? How much more mayhem you must support before you wake up to this very fact that violence begets violence and that the energy of Love neutralises all other energies.

How many times must the cannon balls fly
Before they are forever banned?

How many ears must one man have
Before he can hear people cry?

How many deaths will it take till he knows
That too many people have died?

Well, the answer my friend is in your heart and you keep on using your worldly logic to deny this simple truth.

Just face up to it. Do not deny yourself. Be brave. We are ALL ONE. So, wish for others what you wish for yourself. Do unto others, etc. You know the drill but you keep denying The Christ that is within you. Before the cock crows you will deny the little Jiminy Cricket a thousand times.

You my friends have all the knowledge/logic but no humanity. It resides in your heart. Look for it. It was always there. Seek and you shall find.

BGone states:
"Odd how we can't seem to get away from assumptions. Does God really care? How do you know God really cares? I hope you aren't relying on sacred scriptures. The Bible and all sacred scriptures in turn are proved hoaxes."

Your comment is like asking someone to go for a drink of water while keeping them locked in a waterless room.

This is so typical of a post-enlightenment worlview...making the "assumption" that the universe is a closed system.

If you would be so kind as to unlock my room, I just might visit the church down the street and find out the answer to your question...you know, that "non-profit" organization which delivers meals to the hungry and backpacks for needy children at the local school.

BGone

I generally agree with all you've said. Those who would "fight to the last man" will not give up unless a dramatic intervention occurs, and that appeared in the form of Fat Boy and Little Man in WWII. The Japanese would have fought to the last.

I am just countering the OP regarding the premise that a "line in the sand" was crossed by our nation by dropping the bomb. I do not consider that Hiroshima "eroded our sense of morality" any more than fire bombing Tokyo did. Not at all different.

You forget that we had already destroyed two cities: Tyoto and Dresden; Neither of these were military targets. Clearly, if we had ever had one, we had already lost our soul.

Perhaps as important as what Hiroshima did to our national soul is the effect on the national souls of all the other countries in the world who still fear what we might do with our extensive quiver of nuclear weaponry.

Check out this link to see what a nuclear weapon can do to your town.
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/amex/bomb/sfeature/blastmap.html
The Cold War is over, but the threat of annihilation certainly persists.

Islamist,
I think the "Naval Officer" knows more than you give him credit for.
Islam is a very different religion; I however refer to it as a cult. A good friend a recent convert to Islam, now supports Palestine, Chechnya, Kashmir and other "suppressed" nations, the worst part is his new found hatred for the Jews (you and I know perfectly well why). Before his conversion he never knew where these countries were or even existed, today he is almost willing to do Jihad to liberate these "oppressed" peoples. Islam is dogmatic, if one insults, dishonors or defames Islam he does so at his own life’s risk. People loose their lives for criticizing or simply questioning the Koran. Your dead prophet gets insulted too easily.
Destroying the Kaaba is a what if question, one that people dare ask, and why not? Vaporize the Kaaba and what then? What do the militants have to fight for? They will be demoralized and finished with the head of the dragon eliminated. Muslims will not be able to point in that direction and pray anymore. Is Mecca still only for Muslims, will it always be that way, why?

Christians on the other hand will mourn the loss of the Vatican if destroyed, but I'm quite sure there will not be any exploding Christians in crowded Muslim gatherings. Thanks for the questions, I read your comments often.

Asim:
I am no longer a Muslim but unfortunately that is still my name, I used to believe in gods who write books and send "messengers", I don't subscribe to that anymore. You on the other hand need to evaluate why your god sent a very dishonest looting, vandalizing, raping, pedophile, misogynist as his "last messenger".

Nora: Your writing style is beautiful and your question is provocative. I am writing a novel series about a physicist who becomes a pacifist as a result of his involvement in WW1. Then he gets drafted into helping out at Los Alamos. I'm doing research on the place and plan a trip soon, so, naturally, I will be very interested in your book. I too am exploring the same question, but really do not have a clear answer.

Anonymous,
Do u work for AIPAC? The debate is about the morality/immorality of the American nukes on Japan-and not about your fabrications on any thing Muslim;u seem to think that a very lengthy cut/paste job will give your lies and warmongring credibility-it just does not and like many otehrs I would not waste my time reading such BS.

I challenge the idea that Hiroshima eroded our sense of morality as to me it was never honestly developed, or at least it was never developed to the stature that we like to believe. We are a nation founded on slavery and genocide. Hiroshima is in many ways a consequence of that formative truth.

July 5 news roundup of UK terror plot investigation activities and related news:

-- 45 Muslim doctors planned US terror raids. Daily Telegraph reports that "45 Muslim doctors threatened to use car bombs and rocket grenades in terrorist attacks in the United States during discussions on an extremist internet chat site". Police found details of discussion on the British Jihadist web site run by Younis Tsouli ("Terrorist 007"). Jihadists stated "We are 45 doctors and we are determined to undertake jihad and take the battle inside America.The first target which will be penetrated by nine brothers is the naval base which gives shelter to the ship Kennedy." Telegraph believes that is refers to the USS John F Kennedy, which is often at Mayport Naval Base in Jacksonville, Florida. Daily Telegraph states that the Jihadists also referred to using six Chevrolet GT vehicles and three fishing boats and blowing up petrol tanks with rocket propelled grenades. This would support Sky News report on July 4 of British Anglican cleric Canon Andrew White who has said of an April discussion with Al-Qaeda representative where "[h]e told me that they were going to start killing in the UK then the USA".

16 July 2007: The Northeast Intelligence Network was first to confirm during the June 30, 2007 edition of the Homeland Security Report that last month’s failed London car bomb plot had its tentacles reaching far into the United States. Now, NBC24, a television station in Toledo, Ohio is reporting that the FBI has questioned a Muslim doctor who recently moved to Toledo from the UK. Toledo also happens to be the corporate home of KindHearts for Charitable Humanitarian Development, an Islamic charity chaired by Hatem El-HADY, a Toledo physician, and a charity that has been the subject of an investigation for its reported ties to terror organizations.

The Toledo doctor was questioned by the FBI on July 4, 2007, less than a week after the failed bomb plot in London. According to information obtained through additional investigation conducted by the Northeast Intelligence Network, authorities are focused on a number of subjects in the U.S., including Muslim doctors, and others in the Toledo area who are also associated with a specific Toledo, Ohio mosque. When contacted by this agency, a spokesperson for the mosque declined to speak with this Northeast Intelligence Network investigator.

The July 4th visit to the unnamed Toledo doctor has prompted Toledo area Muslims to circulate an e-mail warning to Muslim doctors “to be ready for a knock at the door by the FBI,” and urged them to “have an attorney present” when answering questions asked by law enforcement officials. Following up on the investigation in Toledo, this Northeast Intelligence Network investigator spoke to a federal law enforcement official from Cleveland, Ohio who is familiar with the various overlapping investigations in Toledo. [MORE: Click on "read more" above or on article title to continue reading].

Responding to the e-mail being circulated, this law enforcement official stated that this type of “feigned cooperation” by the majority of Muslims, whether they are imams, Muslim community leaders or simply members of the Muslim community “is the norm.” “It has been my experience that it’s not unusual for Muslims to publicly portray a sense of cooperation, yet privately stonewall our investigations by refusing to answer questions, or limit their dialogue with law enforcement to communicating only though an attorney, even for the most basic of questions.”

This federal official, speaking to this investigator on the strict condition of anonymity, expressed his frustration at the misconception of a working dialogue between federal agents and “certain Muslim leaders and their representatives.” If you listen to them, they are actively trying to help us [law enforcement] weed out the bad guys,” stated this source. “That’s not quite the reality of it. There is a lot of stonewalling, unwillingness to share information about possible actions of other Muslims that could have criminal implications, or even ties to terrorism,” he added. “We’re talking about everything from possible terrorist funding to direct or peripheral ties to terrorism. When it comes down to them helping us by providing even some answers to the most basic of questions, there is a tremendous amount of resistance and unnecessary roadblocks. I can say from experience that instead of answering questions openly when asked, we have been put off, told to direct our inquiries to their legal representatives, or simply turned away. To make matters worse, we have been frequently told to ‘lay off’ by higher ups, to avoid causing a PR problem, I guess,” stated this source. “It’s definitely frustrating and the supposed cooperation, at least from my experience, is not being honestly portrayed.”

When asked about the media reports that Muslims are urged by Islamic advocacy groups to fully and truthfully cooperate with law enforcement whenever questioned, this source stated “I wish it was that easy, but it’s not like that at all. There is a tremendous unwillingness for Muslims to talk other Muslims, and it’s getting worse.”

This is not the first time a doctor in Toledo has been questioned or at the center of investigation. In an unrelated case, Dr. Mohammad ANVARI-HAMEDANI, 72, a licensed physician, pleaded guilty last April to 36 counts of money laundering, making illegal money transfers to Iran and tax evasion for sending at least $4 million to his native Iran over a four year period. ANVARI-HAMEDANI was sentenced to 60 days in a community jail and ordered to pay $1.15 million in fines and forfeitures. U.S. District Judge James Carr permitted ANVARI-HAMEDANI to serve his jail time on weekends so that he can continue practicing medicine.

Here is another site that keeps up-to-date on the Brotherhood's activities and mentions the suspect organizations involved in illegal activity.

http://www.douglasfarah.com/article/233/more-gleaned-from-the-holy-land-foundation-exhibits.com

This is the document, I think related to the CURRENT TRIAL.

http://www.nefafoundation.org/miscellaneous/HLF/US_v_HLF_Unindicted_Coconspirators.pdf

It lists some organizations and people as unindicted coconspirators such as:

VII. The following are individuals/entities who are and/or were members of the US
Muslim Brotherhood:

1. Abdel Rahman Alamoudi
2. Gaddor Ibrahim Saidi
3. Islamic Society of North America, aka ISNA
4. Muslim Arab Youth Association, aka MAYA
5. Nizar Minshar
6. North American Islamic Trust, aka NAIT
7. Raed Awad
8. Tareq Suwaidan

The Muslim Brotherhood's WAR ON THE WEST: 3 of 4

In Britain in 1997, the Muslim Brotherhood founded the Muslim Association of Britain (MAB). This group claims to be moderate, and promotes missionary (dawah) work among the young.
Friday, June 15, 2007By Adrian Morgan

In Britain in 1997, the Muslim Brotherhood founded the Muslim Association of Britain (MAB). This group claims to be moderate, and promotes missionary (dawah) work among the young. Its founder, Kamal Tawfik Helbawy, was at that time the Brotherhood's European spokesman. Born in Egypt in 1939, he had been a member of the Brotherhood since the age of 12. He co-founded the World Assembly of Muslim Youth (WAMY) in Saudi Arabia in 1972 with Abdullah bin Laden, Osama's nephew. WAMY is an organization which has been accused of funding terrorist organizations, including Hamas. Kamal Helbawy was WAMY's first president.
In November 1997, in the same year that he had founded MAB, Helbawy helped to found the Muslim Council for Britain (MCB), which was officially inaugurated on March 1, 1998. As Helbawy stated in a 2005 interview: "I played a role in the establishment of the MCB. Our objective was that the MCB should remain independent and its primary function should be to represent and protect the interests of Muslims."

The MCB, whose senior members have supported extremism, enjoyed an unprecedented position with Blair's government, acting as advisers on all things Islamic. In June 2005 its then-secretary general Iqbal Sacranie was given a knighthood by Blair, even though he is an anti-Semite who wishes to see Holocaust Memorial day scrapped. In 1996, Sacranie supported plans to invite Osama bin Laden to the UK to lecture to Muslims, claiming the terrorist was an "Islamic Scholar". Despite boycotting memorials for the Shoah, Sacranie nonetheless attended a memorial service for Sheikh Yassin, the founder of terror group Hamas. This service was held at London's Central Mosque in 2004.

In 2005, the MCB persuaded Blair to introduce a bill which would have outlawed any criticism of Islam, which was neutered by the Lords, parliament's Upper House. In June 2006, the unelected MCB succeeded in persuading the elected Blair government to abandon its 18-month campaign to outlaw forced marriage, which annually affects at least 250 young Muslim girls.

The government has been so manipulated by the claims of the "moderate" Muslims in Britain, that MI6 and the Foreign and Commonwealth Office have actively courted the Muslim Brotherhood. The overtures to the Brotherhood have been made through a unit called the Engaging With the Islamic World Group" (EWIG) which was founded in 2003. EWIG is led by a 27-year old former Muslim radical called Mockbul Ali. In July 2006, this group used taxpayers' money to pay Yusuf al-Qaradawi, spiritual leader of the Brotherhood, to attend a conference in Turkey. On July 14, 2005, one week after the London bombings, Mockbul Ali argued that a visa should again be given to Qaradawi. That document and others can be found here.

After the London suicide bombings of July 7, 2005, the Blair government invited Tariq Ramadan, son of Said Ramadan and grandson of Hassan al-Banna, to sit on a working committee. This committee was set up to find ways of preventing radicalism amongst Britain's youth. Ramadan is not even a UK citizen, and according to Jean Charles Brissard, he has had meetings with known terrorists in his native Switzerland. The UK government sponsors a website promoting "the radical middle way" of Islam, where Ramadan has his own page. Tariq Ramadan is still barred from entering to the US, though he insists he is not a Muslim Brotherhood member.

US Politicians Duped By The Brotherhood

In the United States, one individual maintained a pretense of "moderation" which would later embarrass the left and the right. According to the testimony of Dr Michael Waller to the US Senate Committee on the Judiciary, Abdurahman Alamoudi was a member of the Muslim Brotherhood. A man born in Eritrea in 1951, he arrived in the US in 1979 and became a naturalized US citizen on May 23, 1996. From 1985 onwards he became involved in many Muslim groups. In 1990 he founded the Washington DC-based American Muslim Council (AMC), which Waller states "has been described as a de facto front of the Muslim Brotherhood." The AMC was an affiliate of the American Muslim Foundation, which was also headed by Alamoudi. Despite this, in June 2002 the FBI called the AMC "the most mainstream Muslim group in the United States."

What is of concern is the manner in which Alamoudi persuaded US authorities under two administrations of his reliability. Around 1993, he was an adviser for the Pentagon on which Muslim chaplains should serve in the US military. He continued this role until 1998. From 1997 he acted for the State Department as a "goodwill ambassador" to Muslim countries. He was regularly at the Clinton White House and had advised Hillary Rodham Clinton on managing iftar dinners since 1996. Alamoudi had made donations to the Democrat party but was open to wooing the opposition.

In 1998, as Frank Gafney recounted, right-wing Republican Grover Norquist formed the Islamic Institute, which aimed to recruit Muslim and Arab Americans to support the GOP. Alamoudi made contributions both to the Islamic Institute and later, in 2000 and 2001, he made payments to a lobbying firm connected with Norquist.

Alamoudi's Brotherhood connections were not touted openly, but in August 1997 he was publicly proclaiming on Fox TV that Hamas was a "freedom fighting organization". Hamas had started its first bombings of Israeli civilians in February 1996, a year earlier. On October 28, 2000, Alamoudi attended an anti-Israel protest at Lafayette part outside the White House, where he was caught on video proclaiming "I have been labeled … as being a supporter of Hamas. Anybody supporters of Hamas here? Hear that, Bill Clinton. We are all supporters of Hamas. I wish they added that I am also a supporter of Hezbollah. Anybody who supports Hezbollah here?"

Shortly afterward the White House outburst, Hillary Clinton returned a donation of $1,000 to her election war chest, which Alamoudi had presented on May 25 of that year. Alamoudi embarked upon at least 10 clandestine trips to Libya. On September 28, 2003 after returning from a multi-stage excursion he was arrested at Dulles International Airport. He was handed an 19-count indictment on October 23, on charges including money laundering, dealing with a prohibited nation.

Alamoudi had been stopped at Heathrow on August 16, 2003 before boarding a flight to Syria, and had $340,000 of Libyan money seized. On July 30, 2004 he pleaded guilty to three charges - violating conditions barring transport to and commerce with prohibited nations (Libya), failure to disclose to IRS his income, and lying to ICE federal investigators. On October 15, 2004, Alamoudi was given a jail sentence of 23 years. He had told officials that he provided Libyan money to London-based Saudi dissidents to finance a plot to assassinate Saudi Crown Prince Abdullah.

Politicians may have been fooled by Alamoudi, who headed sixteen US-based Islamist organizations, but despite what is known of the Muslim Brotherhood's support of terrorism and extremism, US politicians are now openly courting the Brotherhood. On April 5 this year in Egypt. House Majority Leader Steny Hoyer met with Mohammed Saad el-Katatni, the leader of the Brotherhood's 55 members within the Egyptian parliament. Hamdi Hassan, the Brotherhood's spokesman, said Hoyer met with el-Katani once at the parliament building and later at the home of the US ambassador to Egypt.

On May 27, a delegation by four members of the House of Congress again met with Mohammed Saad el-Katatni in Egypt. The delegation was led by David Price, a Democrat who represents North Carolina.

The Enemy Within

While Said Ramadan was establishing European bases for the Muslim Brotherhood in Geneva and Munich, similar actions were being taken in the United States. In 1962, an organization called the "Cultural Society" was set up, the first Muslim Brotherhood body to be formed on American soil. Muslim Brotherhood members are sworn to secrecy when they join up ("kitman" or concealment) so exact details of this group are murky. The Cultural Society mainly drew its recruits from foreign Muslim students at midwestern universities, such as Illinois, Indiana and Michigan. The name "Cultural Society" was employed to draw attention away from its Brotherhood identity. The following year, the Muslim Students Association (MSA) was formed by the US Brotherhood, and up until the 1970s, new bodies proliferated.

The website of a newer Brotherhood-founded group, the Muslim American Society (MAS) describes its founders as "pioneers" - "The call and the spirit of the movement reached the shores of North America with arrival of Muslim students and immigrants in the late 1950s and early 1960s. These early pioneers and Islamic movement followers established in 1963 the Muslim Student Association (MSA) of the U.S and Canada as a rallying point in their endeavor to serve Islam and Muslims in North America. Other services and outreach organizations soon followed, such as the North American Islamic Trust (NAIT), the Islamic Medical Association (IMA), the Muslim Arab Youth Association (MAYA) and the Muslim Youth of North America (MYNA), to name a few."

All of the groups listed above were formed by the Muslim Brotherhood. MYNA was founded by Ahmed Elkadi, who was the US Brotherhood's treasurer from the 1970s until 1984, when he became its president. He held this position until 1995, but has since left the Brotherhood. He did not resign from his position as president of the US Ikhwan - he was pushed.

Other groups were founded by the US Brotherhood later - the Islamic Society of North America (ISNA) was formed in the 1980s as an outgrowth of the Muslim Students Association (MSA).

The Muslim American Society, under Brotherhood leadership, was incorporated in 1993 in Illinois. The decision to incorporate the MAS was made at a meeting of 40 Ikhwan (MB) members at a hotel near the Alabama-Tennessee state line. Shaker Elsayed, an leader within MAS, has admitted the Brotherhood had founded the Muslim American Society, saying: "Ikhwan members founded MAS, but MAS went way beyond that point of conception."

MAS is based in Falls Church, Virginia, the same town where Abdurahman Alamoudi lived. Five miles away in Alexandria lay the US headquarters of the World Assembly of Muslim Youth or WAMY, which was co-founded by a Brotherhood member, Kamal Helbawy. On Friday May 28, 2004 the WAMY offices were raided by agents of the FBI, ICE and the Joint Terrorism Task Force. An affidavit from a customs agent claimed that one WAMY publication included a section entitled "Animosity Toward the Jews", and stated: "The Jews are humanity's enemies: they foment immorality in this world." The affidavit mentioned links with WAMY and the terrorist group Hamas.

The director of MAS' "Freedom Foundation", Mahdi Bray, pushed for the release of a Falls Church Citizen, Ahmed Omar Abu Ali, who had been accused of plotting to assassinate George W. Bush in al al-Qaeda plot. Ali, who had been educated at the Saudi-funded Islamic Saudi Academy in Alexandria, was convicted on November 22, 2005 and sentenced to 30 years' jail on March 29, 2005.

MAS, which has 10,000 members in 53 chapters across the US, is also involved in the disputes at Minneapolis-St Pauls airport, where Somali taxi drivers have refused to carry passengers with alcohol. Three quarters of the 900 drivers are Muslim, mostly from Somalia. Last year, 5,400 potential rides were turned down because passengers had alcohol. The Metropolitan Airport Commission sought guidance from Muslims, and a fatwa was made by the MAS. Khalid Elmasary declared: "It is expressly stated. Transportation of alcohol for Muslims is against the Islamic faith, and therefore forbidden." The issue still has not been resolved.

It is sometimes hard to work out if such Muslim "representatives" are really following the ways of the prophet, or are following the plans laid out in Muslim Brotherhood's "Project" manifesto for gaining national and global power.

Mahdi Bray, who is based in Washington DC where he has a radio talk-show, is accused of taking part in protests were calls for the death of Jews. Steve Emerson in his book American Jihad stated that at the October 28 2000 rally for Hezbollah and Hamas at Lafayette Park, "Mahdi Bray, stood directly behind Alamoudi and was seen jubilantly exclaiming his support for these two deadly terrorist organizations." Three weeks earlier, Bray had "coordinated and led a rally where approximately 2,000 people congregated in front of the Israeli Embassy in Washington, D.C.... at one point during the rally, Mahdi Bray played the tambourine as one of the speakers sang, while the crowd repeated: 'Al-Aqsa is calling us, let's all go into jihad, and throw stones at the face of the Jews."

Bray, who was awarded a Congressional Black Caucus award in September last year, has issued a press release claiming "victory" in the settlement of vindictive lawsuit launched by the Islamic Society of Boston, which attacked 16 organizations and individuals, including Steve Emerson.

There was no settlement agreed between the parties - the Islamic Society of Boston mysteriously dropped its lawsuit, which claimed "defamation", on May 29, 2007. With MAS coming to its defense, and with Muslim Brotherhood member Abdurahman Alamoudi listed as one its founders and trustees, with the Muslim Brotherhood's spiritual leader Yusuf al-Qaradawi as another early trustee, it is not unreasonable to assume that the Islamic Society of Boston began its life in 1982 as another outreach of the Muslim Brotherhood. In 2002, Qaradawi appeared by videolink at an ISB fund-raising event.

The ISB, which is building the largest mosque in Eastern United States at Roxborough, Boston, was in January 2006 defended by Arsalan Iftikhar, the legal director of the Council of American Relations (CAIR), who said: "Unfortunately, I see the Boston case as indicative of a growing trend in anti-Muslim rhetoric that has grown after 9/11." It should be noted that the two co-founders of CAIR, Omar Ahmad and Nihad Awad, were officials of the Islamic Association for Palestine, which was established by Hamas member Mousa Abu Marzook, and has been called a "Hamas Front". Nihad Awad and Ahmed Bedier, head of CAIR's Florida chapter, have both openly pledged their support for Hamas, which itself is derived from the Muslim Brotherhood.

With its previous links to Muslim Brotherhood members, ISB may be thankful that it was not listed as an "unindicted co-conspirator" in a plot to fund Hamas. This has been the recent fate of CAIR. In a trial in Dallas, Texas, Ghassan Elashi, the head of CAIR's Texas chapter, is accused with a staggering list of co-conspirators. Elashi was also head of Texas branch of the outlawed Holy Land Foundation. The indictment maintains that other officials from the Texas branch of the Holy Land Foundation, had conspired with numerous others to supply funds to Hamas. Ghassan Elashi and his brothers Bayan and Basman were convicted of "conspiracy to provide material support to terrorists" on April 13, 2005. Elashi was given a seven year sentence on October 13, 2006.

The named co-conspirators include eight Muslim Brotherhood individuals and organizations: Abdurahman Alamoudi, Gaddor Ibrahim Saidi, the Islamic Society of North America (ISNA), Muslim Arab Youth Association (MAYA), Nizar Minshar, North American Islamic Trust (NAIT), Raed Awad and Tareq Suwaidan. The trial will begin on July 16. The trial will hopefully clarify further the exact roles of CAIR, and also the mysterious American contingent of the Muslim Brotherhood.

The Muslim Brotherhood is not a body to be trusted. It claims peace and moderation, while simultaneously planning to conquer the globe by fair means or foul. It propagates anti-Semitism, and justifies and supports the murder of Israeli civilians. Its current motto is: "Allah is our objective. The Prophet is our leader. Koran is our law. Jihad is our way. Dying in the way of Allah is our highest hope." Those politicians who try to do deals with such a group are betraying not only the people who elected them and the nations they serve, but they jeopardize the security of the Western world at large.

This article was also published at FamilySecurityMatters.org

FREETHINKR:

The Civil War lingered on until civilians were targeted. There are no "innocents." WT Sherman made that determination and ended the war by attacking the civilians. Those innocents give aid to the not so innocent in uniform. When Tokyo was fire bombed every house supplied all available workers to the war effort and many houses had been turned into factories. That's not innocent.

The problem in Iraq is the failure to recognize the non uniformed fighters and attack them. Foreign terrorist fighters are not living in the open off thin air. Those who have the attitude of fight to the last man (woman and child like the Japanese) must be killed to the last man. Well, one can give up the notion of victory. Maybe not going there in the first place?

"...And yet, it is a beautiful scandal, isn’t it? That God would care about one singular, particular life."

Odd how we can't seem to get away from assumptions. Does God really care? How do you know God really cares? I hope you aren't relying on sacred scriptures. The Bible and all sacred scriptures in turn are proved hoaxes.

http://www.hoax-buster.org/sellyoursoul AKA interpretation 1,501 of sacred scriptures says that was Devil and not God that cares about "one singular, particular life." No one has been able to rebuff that finding and the evidence all seems to lean in it's direction.

Could it be that the ministry is leading the multitudes to hell. Why? But of course, Lucifer plans to attack heaven again and he needs all those, "one singular, particular lives" for His army. He almost won last time. Maybe if enough people join His cause? I wonder if Lucifer has any idea about how to obtain nuclear weapons? Probably not many "Godless scientists" in hell, just the very moral violators of the first commandment, "no strange Gods." Don't you agree?

Unfortunately, during times of war, the "personal particulars" are considered collateral damage. This is why war should be avoided unless ABSOLUTELY necessary, although I think Dick Cheney et al would disagree. I don't think the use of atomic weapons in WWII was any different than the destruction of Dresden, the fire bombing of Tokyo, or the V2 and V1 attacks on London as far as "human particulars" go. The same story you quote from the Japanese woman could just as easily have been told by any civilian victim in any war. If we had any "soul" change it was as soon as we started targeting civilians.

I've spoken with many US WWII vets who are eternally grateful that the bombs hastened the surrender of Japan. The slaughter that would have ensued, of both US and Japanese forces, as well as civilians, when the inevitable mainland invasion occurred would have dwarfed the death toll of Nagasaki and Hiroshima combined.

Your essay here seems self-serving and primarily written to promote your book. The quotes you used are moving, but your conclusion is "read my book to see what I really think".

Ms. Gallagher, your treatise is foolish.

It is patently ridiculous for fat and self satisfied Americans who in many cases literally owe their very existence to our WWII decisions to now second guess those decisions.

We can sit in comfy chairs in our air conditioned homes or offices and write or say whatever we want, with the benefit of 62 years of hindsight.

But as you freely express yourself, understand this: Winning World War II was a matter of nothing less than survival. Losing was not an option. Defeating a formidable enemy – whose barbaric treatment of those it conquered was well known – was all that mattered.

Guess what? Americans fighting WWII did not know how it would end. They had a good idea of what life would be like if they lost. You enjoy the freedom of speech and many other things because we didn’t lose.

To look back with the benefit of 62 years of hindsight, which of course those fighting the war did not have, and say what should and shouldn’t have been done is nonsense.

Quote Gandhi and ponder all you like. You wouldn’t have his quotes at all if his passive resistance campaign had been waged against Imperial Japan or Nazi Germany. Fortunately, those regimes were defeated, and that fact is a very, very good thing. In 1945 that is all that mattered, and if we were in the same situation, that is all that would matter to us.

Nora:

How would you address those who seek to overthrow our government?

Aug 1, 2007
FINALLY, THE SMOKING GUN

One of the most fascinating exhibits presented by the prosecution in the Holy Land Foundation case (provided by researchers for the NEFA Foundation) is a memorandum on the Muslim Brotherhood’s multifaceted plan to convert the United States to an Islamic nation. It is the smoking gun of the Ikhwan’s long-standing efforts to destroy the Western world as we know it.

The most interesting exhibit is a Muslim Brotherhood memorandum by Mohamed Akram, dated May 22, 1991, where he outlines the Ikhwan vision of the future. He leaves no ambiguity as to the nature of the Ikhwan calling. (The exhibits will be posted and written about more completely in the NEFA website in coming days).

Under the heading “Understanding the role of the Muslim Brother in North America,” he writes:

“The process of settlement is a ‘Civilization-Jihadist Process’ with all the word means. The Ikhwan must understand that their work in America is a kind of grand Jihad in eliminating and destroying the Western civilization from within and ‘sabotaging’ its miserable house by their hands and the hands of the believers so that it is eliminated ad God’s religion is made victorious over all other religions.”

But wait, there is more:

“Without this level of understanding, we are not up to this challenge and have not prepared ourselves for Jihad yet. It is a Muslim’s destiny to perform Jihad and work wherever he is and wherever he lands until the final hour comes, and there is no escape from that destiny except for those who chose to slack.”

Akram then spells out in some detail the role of the Brotherhood in moving the project forward: “As for the role of the Ikhwan, it is the initiative, pioneering, leadership, raising the banner and pushing people in that direction (the Jihadist process). They are then able to employ, direct, and unify Muslims’ efforts and powers for this process. In order to do that, we must possess a master of the art of ‘coalitions,’ the art of ‘absorption’ and the principles of ‘cooperation.’”

The document then gives rationale for setting up Ikhwan organizations across the country: “We must say that we are in a country which understands no language other than the language of the organizations, and one which does not respect or give weight to any group without effective, functional and strong organizations.”

The document also deals with the criticism among the Brothers that the focus on the United States will drain support for the establishment of the global caliphate. The response is two-fold:
1) “The success of the Movement in America in establishing an observant Islamic base with power and effectiveness will be the the best support and aid to the global Movement project.”
2) The global (Ikhwan) movement has not “succeeded yet in distributing roles to is branches, stating that what is needed from them as one of the participants or contributors to the project to establish the global Islamic state. The day this happens, the children of the American Ikhwani branch will have a far-reaching impact and positions that make the ancestors proud.”

The document ends with a list of Ikhwan groups trying to coordinate, including all the usual (ISNA, ICNA, IIIT etc.)

What is so interesting about the document is the breadth of ambition, the conviction of ultimate success and the care with which the campaign we see today was being thought about 16 years ago. So is the the clarity of the ultimate objective of ending our years as a functioning democracy, built on the rule of secular law, minority rights and freedom of religion, press etc.

The infiltration of the government by members and sympathizers, the coordinated role of the organizations in pursuing specific objectives, the recruitment of the best and the brightest into the movement, and other objectives are far advanced, perhaps further than the author could have imagined in so short a time.

The rationale, for those like Lieken et al who want play footsie with these groups bent on our destruction, is truly mindboggling. I don’t think the Brothers who have been on the cusp of the new PR campaign, from Ramadan to Akef, have bothered to spell this out like the Brothers do for themselves.

But here we have it, in their own words, written by their own hands. There is much more to say, and I will revisit the topic as more information comes in.

Will anyone pay attention?

www.counterterrorismblog.org

EM,

Amen!

Fred,

That last post was from Arminius.

Fred, you wrote:

"War sucks. The past is best explained without superimposing values on decisions which did not exist in the framework of the time.

At the end of the day the complex reasonings behind the start of this war are quite irrelevant in light of the fact that the end was predictable and could have been more ghastly save the intervention of technology.

I love my country, it ain't always easy to do but but God help me...I do.

No excuses, no apologies. The clock keeps ticking."

And you wrote it well, beautiful and moving. I am also a vet, but without your experience. 1968-1970. Did not go to Nam, but to West Berlin. The wall and a visit to East Berlin taught me to hate any and all repressive regimes. Not communism per se; communism isn't evil, just stupid, but it lends itself all too easily to evil men running the show.

Iraq is apparently personal to both of us, albeit more to you. My great-nephew went there as a gunner on a humvee. To our great relief, he came back in one piece. I trust your sons did too.

It's a strange country we live in. I love it too, in spite of our incredible recent blunders.

I seldom return to forums but this one presents a unique snapshot of the American soul sixty-plus years after the event in question. I have copied the entirety of this string of thought for further reading. Extremes exist in it but the main line of reasoning and a search for meaning is the dominant through-line.

Morality and war are mutually exclusive. I mentioned the thought that my dear old Dad most likely would have perished in any invasion (2nd Mar Div). That is personal enough for me and is a vindication of a complex decision made by an American President.

My dear old Dad didn't end wars. I ended up in 2nd Mar Div, then 1st Mar Div in Viet Nam. My own sons served in Iraq (3 tours) with 1st Mar Div and we are not particularly war-like. Serving comes easily to some of us.

The common theme for all our collective experience is that any one who has to be told that war sucks, war is immoral, war is unfair and nasty and stinks and feeds only the flies and politicians has missed something deeply human, deeply true.

For the guys who never had to load the boats to slam onto the Japanese shoreline (I've been there, JP, loved the people, loved the food, admired the ancient culture...ignored the immediate past) there was no decision. It was life and death.

I didn't want my sons to go to Iraq but I damn sure didn't want anything kept in the cupboard that could have kept them alive. WW II had been long and the death toll for the fleet and ground forces at Okinawa made for some immutable math in terms of looking ahead.

An invasion of some extent would have to happen. Japan, god bless them now, would have had the same Soviet/Western World line of demarcation across it as all the mutually conquered lands in Europe endured for sixty years after the fact.

War sucks. The past is best explained without superimposing values on decisions which did not exist in the framework of the time.

At the end of the day the complex reasonings behind the start of this war are quite irrelevant in light of the fact that the end was predictable and could have been more ghastly save the intervention of technology.

I love my country, it ain't always easy to do but but God help me...I do.

No excuses, no apologies. The clock keeps ticking.

In 1992 I wrote a thesis entitled "United States Strategic Bombing Policy in World War II" which compared the manner in which the United States executed the air campaigns in Europe and Japan. My conclusion at the time, which was somewhat controversial, was that the approach to Japan (night time fire bombings of civillian populations ultimately culminating in the use of the atomic bombs) was primarily motivated by racism. The reason I came to this conclusion was that the United States Army Air Corps.' approached the European theater in an entirely different manner (with some notable exceptions, i.e Dresden) through use of highly risky day light bombing of fortified industrial and military targets in an effort to destroy Germany's capacity to wage war. Because of the dramatic impact of atomic bombings, the previous history of "area bombings" in Japan has been largely forgotten or ignored. In any event, the history of strategic bombing in Asia did not end with WW II. Its revival, through operation "Rolling Thunder" in Vietnam is a notable example. The move towards "precision targeting" in operations such as the "Shock and Awe" campaign in Iraq, while in theory motivated by a desire to reduce civillian casualties, has done little to provent collateral damage. While the metrics are not in yet, I imagine that the death rate of Iraqi civillians (and its ratio to "combatant deaths") as a direct or indirect result of US actions in Iraq will equal or exceed the civillian death rate in WW II.

Nora, shame on you to write without any understanding of the history. The US does need to do some soul searching but for a different reason. Gen.Douglas MacArthur spared Emperor Hirohito from indictment. He also secretly granted immunity to the physicians of a covert biological warfare research and development that undertook lethal human experimentation using live humans during the war, in exchange for providing America with their research on biological weapons. Those physicians went on to work, after the war, in medicine, corporate posts, government and politics. Because of selfish reasons on the part of the US, liberal surrender conditions were authored at the expense of all the victims that fell under the evil hands of the Japanese. Some Japanese have refused to acknowledge the surrender treaty to this day.
The U.S. stole the justice deserved by the victims and the victims families who are still waiting for an official State apology from Japan while Japan continues to insult and inflict pain to the victims families as evidenced by the recent incident of the denial of the sex slaves by Shinzo Abe. By saying that the women volunteered is an insult and indirectly claims they were prostitutes. America continues to encourage Japan to see themselves as the war victims inflicting more pain to the real victims of the war's families. Yes, America and Japan need to get off their moral high horses and do some real soul searching.

Interesting to read the posts here that refer to what God or Jesus would do...or have done under simular circumstances. These religious comments/posts presume a premise of the capacity of man to posess the mind, wisdom, knowledge and perfection of the Creator's mind. This is illogical because at best, humans are imperfect....hence human choices. We can only try to make the right choices.

Nora poised valid questions. Lets break the questions down.

1. "How did Hiroshima erode our sense of morality, what we permit ourselves as a nation to do?"

ANSWER: Must qualify the question with a question here. Who, when and how proved that Hiroshima eroded OUR sense of morality ? Mabe we did in fact do the moral thing ?

2. "How did it affect our fragile sense of what is permissible to do to another?"

ANSWER: Again, must qualify this question with a question first. Who, when and how was it proved that it did in fact AFFECT our sense and why is our sense more fragile now than it was from the beginning of time ?

Take out the presumed premise of the questions Nora asked and you have a better idea of the reality of what is being asked.

Kind of like asking a person when he/she stopped kicking his pet ? :)

Regards,
Just Another Christian

A further note about what American casualties would have been in an invasion of the Japanese home islands; estimates vary all over the map, but this is probably the best indicator:

"Nearly 500,000 Purple Heart medals were manufactured in anticipation of the casualties resulting from the invasion of Japan. To the present date, all the American military casualties of the sixty years following the end of World War II — including the Korean and Vietnam Wars — have not exceeded that number. In 2003, there were still 120,000 of these Purple Heart medals in stock.[42] There are so many in surplus that combat units in Iraq and Afghanistan are able to keep Purple Hearts on-hand for immediate award to wounded soldiers on the field."
Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Downfall#Ground_threat

This of course does not include Japanese casualties, which would surely have well exceeded a million.

Odd that you question the morality of the Hiroshima event without examining all the facts and context.
Briefly:
Most estimates of the initial death toll is closer to
70,000 with 200,000 to of died in five years.
In one night of firebombing Tokyo, 70,000 died.
Yet we hear little of this event.
The next day the military leadership barely mentioned the deaths in a meeting.
Allied estimates were 700,000 causalities for a land invasion of the home islands.
There were 9 divisions waiting for the allied soldiers on the first island.
How many Japanese do you think would of died if this happened.
The total would of been well over a million for both sides.
The Japan leadership new the war was over before Okanawa.
Yet the followed a policy of "bleeding the enemy" by continuing to fight battles and allowing their and our soldiers to die.
They thought that this policy would allow them to negotiate a conditional surrender.
That the allies would "tire" of dying, while they wouldn't.

They were arming the population with sharpened bamboo sticks to use against our bullets.

Even after Hiroshima, is was only after the Russians entered the Pacific war did they finally surrender.

Odd that you question the morality of the Hiroshima event without examining all the facts and context.
Briefly:
Most estimates of the initial death toll is closer to
70,000 with 200,000 to of died in five years.
In one night of firebombing Tokyo, 70,000 died.
Yet we hear little of this event.
The next day the military leadership barely mentioned the deaths in a meeting.
Allied estimates were 700,000 causalities for a land invasion of the home islands.
There were 9 divisions waiting for the allied soldiers on the first island.
How many Japanese do you think would of died if this happened.
The total would of been well over a million for both sides.
The Japan leadership new the war was over before Okanawa.
Yet the followed a policy of "bleeding the enemy" by continuing to fight battles and allowing their and our soldiers to die.
They thought that this policy would allow them to negotiate a conditional surrender.
That the allies would "tire" of dying, while they wouldn't.

They were arming the population with sharpened bamboo sticks to use against our bullets.

Even after Hiroshima, is was only after the Russians entered the Pacific war did they finally surrender.

To Raymond Takashi:
Thank you for your post. It is the sanest, most balanced and logical (hence the best) post on the issue.
Better to have a balanced discussion than sentimental ramblings in either direction.

Eon Mullet. If your name doesn't say it all, your comments certainly fill the rest in. Every nation involved in war thinks they are the good guy. Attacking a military target does not justify annihilating a civilian one, or are you saying that 9/11 was justified?

Author writes:

"Several days after the bomb was dropped, reporters asked Gandhi what he thought. He said the atom bomb “resulted for the time being in destroying the soul of Japan. What has happened to the soul of the destroying nation is yet too early to see.” That question is what I have been turning over in my mind since completing this novel."

Gandhi understood that nations, like individuals, can not realize the consequences of their choices until fruition. However, the adage of "what goes around comes around" is not necessarily true nor applies in situations where the most difficult choices must be decided upon with prudent compassion to effect an outcome that is in the best interests of the majority...and that requires great wisdom, courage and strength from those leaders who are not predisposed to impluse nor indecision. Choosing (electing) a leader is the greatest responsibility of any citizen for it is ultimately the citizen who chooses the fate of its nation. The buck actually stops with the citizen.

Wisdom usually councils allowing the past its own integrity.

In any case, the gentleness of the current generation rests upon the exertions of the previous. If times were hard, we would revert to their decisions surprisingly quickly. Even if times are not hard: Bush II has reinstated torture and concentration camps. Dershowitz and the neos progress from advocating life sentences in lieu of execution to advocating torture in lieu of interogation.

1. Japan attacked us first. They picked the fight.
2. The Japanese military trained themselves not to ever surrender; surrender was weak and cowardly, an insult to the emporer.
3. The Japanese military was training the Japanese civilians (i.e. making them combatants) to defend against an invasion of the homeland.
4. The Japanese were not going to surrender while they still had a means to resist, making an invasion or other attack necessary to end their attempt to subjugate the world to their rule.
5. The soldiers, sailor, airmen, and Marines who had survived nearly 4 years of fighting the forces of evil around the world were moving to invade Japan. Chances of their survival were extremely low.

If you want to talk about senseless destruction of life, start with the Japanese treatment of:
a. The Chinese
b. Allied POWs
The Japanese practice of genocide against the Chinese ranks among the most horrific actions in human history.

To hold America as the bad guy in the tragedy that was World War II is a pathetic joke and an insult to all who gave their lives to end the threat of fascism. Dropping the atomic bomb on Japan was not a good or happy decision, but it was undeniably the only one the Japanese permitted. What were we going to do? Lose a million Americans and every single Japanese in their nation during an invasion? We were (and still are) the good guys. We ended the fighting and dying that otherwise would have continued and claimed more lives.

1. Japan attacked us first. They picked the fight.
2. The Japanese military trained themselves not to ever surrender; surrender was weak and cowardly, an insult to the emporer.
3. The Japanese military was training the Japanese civilians (i.e. making them combatants) to defend against an invasion of the homeland.
4. The Japanese were not going to surrender while they still had a means to resist, making an invasion or other attack necessary to end their attempt to subjugate the world to their rule.
5. The soldiers, sailor, airmen, and Marines who had survived nearly 4 years of fighting the forces of evil around the world were moving to invade Japan. Chances of their survival were extremely low.

If you want to talk about senseless destruction of life, start with the Japanese treatment of:
a. The Chinese
b. Allied POWs
The Japanese practice of genocide against the Chinese ranks among the most horrific actions in human history.

To hold America as the bad guy in the tragedy that was World War II is a pathetic joke and an insult to all who gave their lives to end the threat of fascism. Dropping the atomic bomb on Japan was not a good or happy decision, but it was undeniably the only one the Japanese permitted. What were we going to do? Lose a million Americans and every single Japanese in their nation during an invasion? We were (and still are) the good guys. We ended the fighting and dying that otherwise would have continued and claimed more lives.

1. Japan attacked us first. They picked the fight.
2. The Japanese military trained themselves not to ever surrender; surrender was weak and cowardly, an insult to the emporer.
3. The Japanese military was training the Japanese civilians (i.e. making them combatants) to defend against an invasion of the homeland.
4. The Japanese were not going to surrender while they still had a means to resist, making an invasion or other attack necessary to end their attempt to subjugate the world to their rule.
5. The soldiers, sailor, airmen, and Marines who had survived nearly 4 years of fighting the forces of evil around the world were moving to invade Japan. Chances of their survival were extremely low.

If you want to talk about senseless destruction of life, start with the Japanese treatment of:
a. The Chinese
b. Allied POWs
The Japanese practice of genocide against the Chinese ranks among the most horrific actions in human history.

To hold America as the bad guy in the tragedy that was World War II is a pathetic joke and an insult to all who gave their lives to end the threat of fascism. Droping the atomic bomb on Japan was not a good or happy decision, but it was undeniably the only one the Japanese permitted. What were we going to do? Lose a million Americans and every single Japanese in their nation during an invastion? We were (and still are) the good guys. We ended the fighting and dying that otherwise would have continued and claimed more lives.