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Barbara,

Thanks. I feel happy and appreciative of many things. When I have those feelings, I feel, really, really good. I do have a general appreciation of things then.

Maybe some people equate appreciation with gratitude. I don't. I think of it as just being a good feeling. I don't feel that I have to thank anyone or anything for it. It's a part of nature.

But I thank you for our correspodence. It's made me feel good.

Norrie,

You have in turn given me food for thought. My initial response to the question of to whom are we to express our gratitude was to God (Creator, Recreator, Sustainer of all, and on and on). However, as I have thought about it for a little while now I feel as though that answer is inadequate. That the gratitude I express is beyond a reflection of my present condition or situation but rather a state of being in this time, and yes, failing world. I am grateful for all that has been, all that is and all that is to come - no judgement of "good" or "bad" - as my understanding of all that is of a spiritual nature is limited to what I can take in. I think my expression of gratitude in some way directly shapes what is going on, not only around my person but also beyond where I can physically reach. Perfect example is our discussion today on these lines - we both have no way of knowing what is rippling out from what you and I are sharing. Now, conversely, say I do not express gratitude - that I see no value of it in this realm we now experience - how does that change not only what I experience but also what you experience?

As to whom do I express my gratitude, I still go back in my mind to God, Abba, Keeper of my soul and I do so knowing that any spoken words I can come up with here today fall short of naming who it is I address.

Many thanks for the food, may we both feel it a good meal shared. Shalom, Barbara

Barbara,

Thank you for your post. What you say is wise and valuable in many ways.

Still, I fail to see the relevance of "gratitude" to our situation in this dukka world. It may be that the basic situation of sentient beings in this world can or will be transformed into something better, at least for some of the beings.
[Buddhists also believe that reincrnations can become successively worse.]

Buddhists believe in realization or "enlightment", a state in which suffering is ended. It is said that the Buddha had to endure millions of unsatisfactory lifetimes before becoming enlightened.

I can't see where "gratitude" has application to that situation, and, if it does, to whom or what should we express our gratitude? And why?

I really appreciate what you said and will continue to reflect upon it.

Mandy,

It seems to me that you are principally grateful that things in your life could be a lot worse but aren't.

I prefer the Buddha's analysis: this world is dukka ("suffering," or, more accurately, "always unsatisfactory").

Why a being should be grateful at finding himself in an unsatisfactory universe escapes me, though I am grateful to the Buddha for showing us the way out.

BTW,

"Samsara cannot be satisfying and so we seek liberation. But then we are only concerned about our own liberation. This is not negative by itself but if we want full enlighten­ment -it obstructs the path. In life, gratitude cannot contain self centeredness. Please consider."
******************

Where did you get the idea that I'm only concerned with my liberation? This morning while showering I saw a large spider struggling with water in the tub.

I carefully extracted him on a sheet of paper,
put him outdoors, recited the mantra of the Buddha of Compassion, and prayed for his liberation and enlightenment as soon as it might be possible.

Thanks for asking how things are here in Vermont, and for sending the link to the nudie story in the Brattleboro Reformer. The trees are blooming and the legislature has adjourned (now there's
something to be grateful for!).

For you folks "from away", Vermont has no law against public nudity. You can walk anywhere you want in your birthday suit. Also, you can carry a concealed weapon anywhere without a license (a bit hard to do if you're bare).

The link BTW provided is to the Brattleboro Reformer, which reports that, along with the spring blossoms, the high school nudies are back in a parking lot in downtown Brattleboro, hanging out and jamming away. With all of Vermont's natural beauty I can't think of less pleasant place to be nude than a dusty, noisy lot in the center of town.

Come to think of it, I am grateful for Vermont and all of its simple ways.

Greetings Norrie,

While I am not Buddhist, your mention of samsara leads me to think you are presently following that path - thus my comment.

If you think this present time to be samsara that would imply an understanding that there are other worlds awaiting our movement into them, so our gratitude in that case would be directed toward that time when we could experience a better existence. Gratitude is not necessarily a response to what is happening now, but can also be given and held for what is to come. It requires us to think beyond our present circumstance and put the perspective of endless time into our understanding - whatever our faith path may be.

Peace be with you, Barbara

Nothing to be grateful for:
1.) I am breathing at this very moment

2.) I have the ability to use my fingers as I type this message.

3.) I have a car (not the best) that gets me to the metro station every day to get to.....

4.) My good paying job that has nice HEALTH INSURANCE, DENTAL INSURANCE, LIFE INSURANCE, PAID TIME OFF, 13 HOLIDAYS, STD, LTD, 403B, THE LIST GOES ON AN ON....

5.) A wonderful husband and 3 kids

6.) A roof over my head

7.) Clothes on my back

8.) Shoes on my feet

9.) The fact that I could have been dead years ago and yet I am still here.

10.) The fact that out of all the dumb decisions I have made in my life (Sexual, illegal, immoral, etc.) not once did I contract a disease, have been arrested, have had someone try to kill me, have never tried to commit suicide, etc, etc. ,etc,

11.) The fact that I have eyesight and am able to read these messages.

12.) The fact that although I am not Rich or where I need and should be financially, somehow my kids are always fed, they always have clothes on their backs, they will never and should never know at this time in their lives that we don't have all the money in the world yet their clothes are always clean, shoes don't have holes in them, their bellies are always full, they have friends and family that love them and support them.

I MEAN I COULD KEEP ON WRITING, BUT I THINK YOU GOT THE POINT, I HAVE MORE THAN ENOUGH TO BE GRATEFUL FOR. HOW ON EARTH COULD YOU NOT.

I don't care what's going on in the world, I am still here and am Covered by the Blood of Jesus so until my day comes I will be grateful for every good thing that's in my life. I will WORSHIP HIM Through the bad times (Don't thank him for the bad because nothing bad comes from God he is a Good and merciful God.) I will praise through the Good and the Bad. That is my REASONABLE SERVICE.

Samsara cannot be satisfying and so we seek liberation. But then we are only concerned about our own liberation. This is not negative by itself but if we want full enlighten­ment -it obstructs the path. In life, gratitude cannot contain self centeredness. Please consider.

Norrie, how ARE things in Vermont?

http://www.reformer.com/localnews/ci_5906267

Gratitiude to whom for what? Those who even think of such a thing are simply the beneficiaries of cosmic blind luck. This world of samsara is nothing to be grateful for.

At least Lear recognizes the gratitude that is necessary to fully enjoy contentment. We may never feel sufficient gratitude, but that we do have helps to shield us from being overly smug and self-righteous. It also helps spur us to "pass it forward."