The Bishops' Dispirited Agenda

Today's News provides additional support for my observation (6/16/09 10:47 PM) that most major protestant sects, even the SBC, are losing a lot more people, net-net, than Christ's Holy Catholic Church is. Here is a fair use extract from today's AP feed:
"Jun 23, 4:40 PM EDT

Southern Baptist Convention opens in Kentucky

By DYLAN T. LOVAN
Associated Press Writer

LOUISVILLE, Ky. (AP) -- Southern Baptists are facing a membership decline that could shrink the nation's largest Protestant denomination by nearly half in 40 years, its convention president said Tuesday.

The Rev. Johnny Hunt, a megachurch pastor from Woodstock, Ga., told convention members gathered in Louisville that Southern Baptists need give more to worldwide missions and attract minorities.

"I really do believe we need a revival," Hunt said in a 45-minute address to kick off the two-day convention.

The denomination is declining at a rate that could shrink its membership from 16.2 million to 8.7 million by 2050, Hunt said.

Hunt, himself a Native American from the Lumbee tribe of North Carolina, urged members to recruit minorities, whom he called "our brothers in ethnicity."

The Rev. Richard Land, head of the denomination's public policy arm, has said the convention's minority membership, including blacks, Asians and Latinos, had grown to about 18 percent by 2007.

According to U.S. Census figures, minorities make up 34 percent of the nation's total population....."

"Pagan,
You are calling me a coward and threatening me with some Wiccan spell?"

Err, no. I think that'd have been something CCNL imagined, if you didn't do it on your own.

" This is getting too silly for me. I have no further comment."

That's one way to reduce the silliness. :)

Pagan,
You are calling me a coward and threatening me with some Wiccan spell? This is getting too silly for me. I have no further comment.

See, here's me laughing, politely, again.

Patrick,

Be very, very careful, Wiccans not only have the Horned God on their side but also the Triple Goddess shows up when things get rough!!!

Hmmm, maybe a new TV reality show is in the making?? Abraham's God and Jesus vs. Wiccan's Horned God and the Triple Goddess. Hmmm, would also make a great tag team match!!! Bring it on!!!

Yeah, Patrick. I'm calling you a coward.

Kind of appropriate, actually.

Ask Oisin. :)

And it's not to say Jesuits won't 'fight dirty' when they can get away with it, Fr, Reese is in fact bucking a trend here.

Doesn't mean what's under discussion *is* the 'dirty fight' some insist it must be.

If you think I'll play by those rules, you don't understand Pagans.

"People will have to judge my observation for themselves. This exchange though provides material for a new observation about Fr. Reese. He is the type of Jesuit that a person named Paganplace would feel very comfortable defending. That is interesting indeed."

Isn't it, though.

Being a Pagan, a 'blow' struck unfairly is a 'blow' struck unfairly, whatever you think of Jesuits. Or whatever 'guilt by association' you'd like to direct at them for me pointing that out.

You obviously haven't seen me lay into 'Father' Reese here on this very board on some of his *own* presumptions.

I don't accept their authority, but being an idiot about video editing doesn't help anything. Whoever does it.

Paganplace writes:
"Err, no. That's not a *nervous tic,* that's reacting to laughable assertions made by some which were spoken by Mr. Berlinerblau. "

People will have to judge my observation for themselves. This exchange though provides material for a new observation about Fr. Reese. He is the type of Jesuit that a person named Paganplace would feel very comfortable defending. That is interesting indeed.

See, I even laughed under my breath *saying* that about you neot seeing that. Oops. Did it again. Must be nervous.

Oh, btw, it's also not a "nervous tic" if a few instances of such a restrained laugh appears a few times *because the same footage repeats two or three times in the edit.*

*watching video*

"His nervous tic of inappropriate laughter when he discusses those issues suggests he may be aware of his disconnection from the Catholic Cuurch's long-standing moral teachings on those questions."

Err, no. That's not a *nervous tic,* that's reacting to laughable assertions made by some which were spoken by Mr. Berlinerblau.

Because I was surprised at how inappropriate Fr. Reese's comments were, I decided to listen to his video interview by Jacques Berlinerblau that is available in a box to the right of this column. From the interview, Reese seems to be little more than a political operative for the Left who disregards the moral issues of Stem Cell Research and Abortion because they are inconvenient truths that he'd rather not confront (i.e., if Catholic voters' views are the same as the public at large, then the bishops' statements don't need to be addressed).

His nervous tic of inappropriate laughter when he discusses those issues suggests he may be aware of his disconnection from the Catholic Cuurch's long-standing moral teachings on those questions. All in all, this supposed Jesuit shows he is not even a serious Catholic moral commentator but just an academic studying "the Catholic electorate" from a biased point of view.

The translation problem will be solved long before crazed Catholic antisemites gun down the Johanna Justin-Jinich's of this world.

May her memory be a blessing to those who knew her.
__________________________________________________

The translation problem will be solved long before crazed Christian antisemites decide that it is time "to kill the Jews" and go hunting them with a rifle.

May the memory of Stephen Tyrone Johns be a blessing to those who knew him.

In the Catholic church the laity has no say in what happens. I don't think all those that posted are thinking about the fact that the Catholic church doesn't allow women to be clergy nuns aren't clergy. The Catholic church is the definition of backwards. I was surprised that the Catholic church reaction to the sex scandal.

Another giant step for humankind will be taken when the Jewish atheist, Farnaz, admits she is really a member of orthodox Judaism.

Obama "spoke in accord with the spirit of Vatican II.
Give us a break! Poor John 23 must be laughing in heaven if a man whose speech implied there is no Truth as such but that all issues must be open to compromise and require "fair minded words" so that solutions can be reached.
It does not take Jesuit level education to know that there is still such a thing as right and wrong and no amount of fair minded words can change something that is wrong into something that is right.
Father Reese need not fret about diminishing numbers People have always been free to walk away from Jesus what matters is that those within the Church bear true witness to Christ's teachings which are taught by the Church.Those who no longer believe that the Church is teaching Christ's Truth have always been free to leave the Church at any time. There are no locked doors or chains or punishments doled out for leaving our Faith.

The translation problem will be solved long before crazed Catholic antisemites gun down the Johanna Justin-Jinich's of this world.

May her memory be a blessing to those who knew her.
__________________________________________________

The translation problem will be solved long before crazed Christian antisemites decide that it is time "to kill the Jews" and go hunting them with a rifle.

May the memory of Stephen Tyrone Johns be a blessing to those who knew him.

A giant step for humankind would be taken ---

IF:

Orthodox Jews would, like their Conservative brothers and sisters, deny the atrocities of the OT ever happened and that most if not all the OT is also myth.

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/abstract.html?res=F20E1EFE35540C7A8CDDAA0894DA404482

But since orthodox Judaism continues to believe that their OT god sanctioned/observed all of their actions, the atrocities committed by Joshua et al especially against the Jewish "mythical" enemies were approved by said god.

http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/warstatv.htm#Biblical

Then there are all those Jewish "prophets" aka fortune tellers who Christians relied on to predict the coming of their messiah.

Being fortune tellers is bad enough but being mythical fortune tellers adds another huge blow to the foundations of Christianity!!!!

The translation problem will be solved long before crazed Catholic antisemites gun down the Johanna Justin-Jinich's of this world.

May her memory be a blessing to those who knew her.
__________________________________________________

The translation problem will be solved long before crazed Christian antisemites decide that it is time "to kill the Jews" and go hunting them with a rifle.

May the memory of Stephen Tyrone Johns be a blessing to those who knew him.

Father Reese--in a surly way for a Jesuit who should be particularly loyal to the Pope's Church--tries to bolster his liturgy and church governance arguments by making the "factual" claim that: "The bishops need to return to the spirit of the council, otherwise they will be leaders of a church that continues to lose members. "

The problem with this argument is that all significant Christian churches (plus Judaism) are losing some members each year in absolute terms. Although Catholicism loses many people every year it also gains many adherents every year, so that net-net Catholicism fortunately is one of very few large churches that increases in size just about every year. Net-net, the Baptists have been losing members and the Episcopalians, Presbyterians, Lutherans, UCC and Methodists are practically hemorrhaging members. Judaism, as a religion, is losing adherents so badly that pollster Barry Kosmin carefully asterisks his figures on Judaism with the caution that Judaism as an ethnicity has many more adherents. Net-net, most other major American religions are in decline or at best in stasis and none of them is growing by the same percentage that the Catholic Church has been growing except for the much smaller Mormons.

Fr. Reese needs to stop taking cheap shots and start addressing substance without demeaning rhetoric ("Vatican fetish" "stupid idea"). As to the substance of liturgical reform, I see no reason for us not to try some revised language in the Mass. While I am used to the language we have had for the past forty years, it is hardly sanctioned by "immemorial practice." Many of us recall when we all did say "I believe" at the start of the Credo. Going back to that "I" language will engage each of us individually in an Act of Faith that may have become simply a corporate act for many. I do believe in God the Father, Jesus Christ His Son, the Holy Spirit and His One Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church. That Church is the Church in communion with the Holy See of Rome and to the extent Tom Reese wants to stay in communion with the Holy See, I suppose it accidentally is in communion with him as well.

When Father Reese says "Over the last few year the Vatican fetish for word-for-word translations of Latin texts" I suspect this really means that the Vatican translations are more accurate than some of the "creative" translations which were ideologically driven.Also his claim "When this project is finally finished, it will be imposed on American parishes."seems like sour grapes he did not complain when the translations he liked were handed down and imposed.
"The inability of the U.S. bishops to fight off this stupid idea is tragic." What a neat bit of nonsense the implication being the bishops wanted to fight it off but were unable.The bishops are well able to speak out against error as they have shown in regard to Notre Dame Could it possibly be the bishops accept this development because they know it is an improvement for the good of the souls of their people?

ATTENTION "Jesus" DEMYTHOLOGIZERS:

"The works (1990s) by George Albert Wells drew on the Pauline Epistles and the lack of early non-Christian documents to argue that the Jesus figure of the Gospels was symbolic, not historical. Wells later went on to retract his position somewhat and admit that he believed the Q source was a reliable early testimony to the historical nature of Jesus, although he has been criticized on this point by Robert M. Price because, Price argues, the imagined “single voice” behind the Q sayings is simply their common distinctive Cynical tang, and as Burton L Mack demonstrates, the same is found among any and all Cynic maxims, which is the only way he can tell the Q sayings are Cynic in the first place. They need not come from a single sage. Earl Doherty (1991, 2001) proposed that Jewish mysticism influenced the development of a Christ myth. Timothy Freke and Peter Gandy (2001) have popularized the Jesus-myth concept in their book The Jesus Mysteries.[1] Frank Zindler’s 2003 book The Jesus the Jews Never Knew: Sepher Toldoth Yeshu and the Quest of the Historical Jesus examines the Tacitus and Josephus material quite extensively but is mostly devoted to showing that the ancient Jews never heard of “Jesus of Nazareth” — indeed, they never heard of Nazareth. Another recent book, The Myth of Nazareth: The Invented Town of Jesus, examines all archaeological data extant and argues that “Nazareth” was not inhabited at the turn of the era when Jesus’ family should have been living there."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jesus_Christ_in_comparative_mythology

A sampling of historic Jesus exegetes to include a listing of their books and brief conclusion as to who Jesus really was is presented below and at http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/theories.html

(again, note that four of these exegetes listed below are members of the On Faith panel)

:Jesus the Myth: Heavenly Christ
Earl Doherty
Timothy Freke and Peter Gandy

Jesus the Myth: Man of the Indefinite Past
Alvar Ellegård
G. A. Wells

Jesus the Hellenistic Hero
Gregory Riley

Jesus the Revolutionary
Robert Eisenman

Jesus the Wisdom Sage
John Dominic Crossan
Robert Funk
Burton Mack
Stephen J. Patterson

Jesus the Man of the Spirit
Marcus Borg
Stevan Davies
Geza Vermes

Jesus the Prophet of Social Change
Richard Horsley
Hyam Maccoby
Gerd Theissen

Jesus the Apocalyptic Prophet
Bart Ehrman
Paula Fredriksen
Gerd Lüdemann
John P. Meier
E. P. Sanders

Jesus the Savior
Luke Timothy Johnson
Robert H. Stein
N. T. Wright

BTW, "Jesus" Demythologizers:

Freke and Gandy take leaps, make errors, that others have disputed and corrected, e.g, that there was a "common language" throughout the Mediterranean. In fact, the majority of Jews in Philistia spoke Aramaic, continued to write in both Aramaic and Hebrew. See Judah HaNasi, Talmud, etc.
______________________
Still, Freke and Gandy is a good start for the brainwashed and hallucinating.
______________________
ATTENTION JEWS CULTURAL/SECULAR and OBSERVANT

Answer a fool according to his folly, lest he be wise in his own conceit. ...

Continued

At the time, both Pagans and Christians were well aware that the Jesus story was a myth. The early Christians, known as Gnostics, understood the Jesus story as allegory, not history, and even called Jesus by the names of the Pagan Godman. The Gnostics were brutally eradicated by the Roman Church in the 4th and 5th centuries, and since then we have believed the official propaganda that these Christians were dangerous heretics who had gone Pagan.

Actually the evidence suggests the opposite is closer to the truth. The Gnostics were the original Christians, just as they themselves claimed. They had synthesized Jewish and Pagan mythology to produce the Jesus story and many other extraordinary Christian myths largely unknown today. The Roman Church was a later deviation, which misunderstood the Jesus story as history. It was, as the Gnostics said at the time, an imitation Church teaching a superficial Christianity designed for the masses.

Roman Christianity, and all its subsequent offshoots, is based on the idea that if you believe in the existence of an historical Jesus you will go to heaven when you die. For the Gnostics, however, Jesus is an everyman figure in an initiation allegory. They taught that if you yourself go through the process of initiation symbolized by the Jesus myth, you would die to your old self and resurrect in a new way. The Greek word we translate as resurrect also means awaken.

Continued

For the Gnostics, Christianity was about dying -- the idea of giving up your mortal body and awakening to your immortal essence as the Christ within ­- the One Consciousness of the Universe. This mystical enlightenment was not something that happened after death, but could happen here and now.

The historical figure of Jesus has been so central to Western culture that it is hard to question his existence. As soon as we hear his name we can see him in our mind's eye, in his flowing white robes, with long hair and a beard. Yet this picture of Jesus was not created until the 8th century. Early portrayals of Jesus show him clean-shaven with short hair and wearing a Roman tunic. St Paul says that long hair disgraces a man, so presumably his image of Jesus was not the same as ours.

The fact is that everything we think we know about Jesus, like this romantic picture of the bearded saviour, is a creation of the human imagination. Actually there is barely a shred of evidence for the existence of an historical Jesus and this dissolves on closer inspection. Paul, the earliest Christian source, shows no knowledge of an historical man, only a mystical Christ. The gospels have been thoroughly discredited as eyewitness reports. Other bits of traditional evidence, such as references to Jesus by the Jewish historian Josephus, have been shown to be later forgeries. If solid evidence had existed, there would have been no need to have created such fabrications.

A little over a century ago most people believed the story of Adam and Eve to be history. To most thinking people today its is obviously a myth. We predict that within a generation a similar revolution will have taken place in our understanding of the gospels. People will look back at the beginning of the 21st century and be amazed that a culture with the technology to travel to the moon could see the fabulous story of Jesus as anything other than a myth. However, we do not want to dismiss the Jesus story as nonsense. For us it is truly the greatest story ever told, because it has been thousands of years in the making. It is a perennial tale that has fascinated the human soul since the dawn of time.

Whilst our ideas clearly rewrite history, we do not see ourselves as undermining Christianity. On the contrary we are suggesting that Christianity is in fact richer than we previously imagined. According to the original Gnostic Christians, the Jesus story is a perennial myth with the power to impart the mystical experience of Gnosis, which can transform each one of us into a Christ, not merely a history of events that happened to someone else two thousand years ago."

When are the bishops going to talk about pedophiles who are not in prison less alone not removed from the priesthood and excommunicated for their atrocities?

The royal Papacy loves the idea of its "ambassadors" speaking in a dead language none of its sheep understands. It fortifies the mystery of the clergy and the need of its followers to go through them for salvation. It's a perfect power play to further subjugate and control Catholics

The translation problem will be solved long before crazed Catholic antisemites gun down the Johanna Justin-Jinich's of this world.

May her memory be a blessing to those who knew her.
__________________________________________________

The translation problem will be solved long before crazed Christian antisemites decide that it is time "to kill the Jews" and go hunting them with a rifle.

May the memory of Stephen Tyrone Johns be a blessing to those who knew him.

It seems like the idiots are out in force today, from the Jesuit priests who no longer even try to imitate St. Ignatius' fidelity to the Pope and Church teaching, to the Bayside traditionalists spouting nonsense falsely attributed to Our Lord and His Mother, to the blog hijackers with their agendas, pro and con things other than the subject of this article.

As for Fr. Reese, what would be the point of the Catholic Church imitating the liberal orders and churches whose lack of standards have them going headlong to self-oblivion?

correction:

Walter,

You noted:

"ccnl1, those atrocities listed in the O.T. would be really bad - if they were real. modern archaeology has revealed that "joshua's cities" didn't exist when he supposedly destroyed them. there's no evidence that anything in the O.T. prior to omri and ahab (including david and solomon) really happened. those "great" stories of israel's military exploits are just wishful thinking/revisionism by first-millenium b.c. judean priests."

I agree completely but orthodox Jews unlike their Conservative brothers and sisters are not going to deny these atrocities since they then would have to agree with Conservative Jews that most if not all the OT is also myth.

And since orthodox Judaism continues to believe that the OT god sanctioned/observed all of their actions, the atrocities committed by Joshua et al especially against the Jewish "mythical" enemies were approved by said god.

Then there are all those Jewish "prophets" aka fortune tellers who Christians relied on to predict the coming of their messiah. Being fortune tellers is bad enough but being mythical fortune tellers adds another huge blow to the foundations of Christianity!!!!

Walter,

You noted:

"ccnl1, those atrocities listed in the O.T. would be really bad - if they were real. modern archaeology has revealed that "joshua's cities" didn't exist when he supposedly destroyed them. there's no evidence that anything in the O.T. prior to omri and ahab (including david and solomon) really happened. those "great" stories of israel's military exploits are just wishful thinking/revisionism by first-millenium b.c. judean priests."

I agree completely but orthodox Jews unlike their Conservative brothers and sisters are not going to deny these atrocities since they then would have to agree with Conservative Jews that most if not all the OT is myth.

And since orthodox Judaism continues to believe that the OT god sanctioned/observed all of their actions, the atrocities committed by Joshua et al especially against the Jewish "mythical" enemies was approved by said god.

Then there are all those Jewish "prophets" aka fortune tellers who Christians relied on to predict the coming of their messiah. Being fortune tellers is bad enough but being mythical fortune tellers adds another huge blow to the foundations of Christianity!!!!

These prophecies came from Jesus, Mary, and the saints to Veronica Lueken at Bayside, NY, from 1968 to 1995.

STARTED WITH GOOD INTENTIONS
"Bishops in My Son's House, Church, you have gone astray. You have scattered Our sheep. You have joined with all manner of heretics and false teachers. You started with good intentions in your Council, but you became deluded in your search for peace and brotherhood. You allowed all manner of error to creep slowly into My Son's House, Church. You must understand that you are setting in motion the formation of a World Council of Churches, but it will not be the Church of My Son. It will be a church of man, a church without the true foundation." - Our Lady, June 5, 1976

SATAN WAS PRESENT
"You will not destroy My Son's House, Church, by consorting with the enemies of My Son! You will not convert the enemy by lowering the standards. Your example must be one of a steadfast faith.
"Change! What need is change when the foundation has stood through the test of time? It is a dissatisfied man, a greedy and lustful man who seeks change. Does he change to bring man to God? No! He changes to take man from God and give him to Lucifer!
"Satan was present, he listened with careful ears at the great Council. He awaited every move, and he placed his agents among you! Recognize and reconstruct your path. You have been deluded. You are on the wrong road. Turn about now, or you will sow the seeds for your own destruction!
"How many warnings will you receive before the hand of your Father will descend upon you? No date do I give unto all mankind, but only to few. All those who accept the grace given freely for the asking will not be caught unawares. They will prepare themselves. All mankind upon earth should prepare for his death.
"We look upon a world where mankind goes about defaming himself and the Father, wallowing in all manners of lust and pleasure, abomination—even in the House of God! He lives as though he never will die. No human flesh will be eternal, but the soul is eternal and will live on forever." - Our Lady, August 14, 1974

The translation problem will be solved long before crazed Catholic antisemites gun down the Johanna Justin-Jinich's of this world.
________________________________________________
May her memory be a blessing to those who knew her.

The translation problem will be solved long before crazed Christian antisemites decide that it is time "to kill the Jews" and go hunting them with a rifle.

May the memory of Stephen Tyrone Johns be a blessing to those who knew him.

"Over the last few years, the bishops have gradually adopted new translations that are worse than the ones in current use because of the Vatican fetish for word-for-word translations of Latin texts."

If words don't mean anything, then they aren't important, in which case why would one translation be "worse" than another? If words do mean something, then they are important, and the Vatican's "fetish" is nothing more sinister than dedication to getting things right. So where's the problem?

From "Brad HIRSCHFEILD" Post today [a prejadice 'Jewish?" Man & CO. {i.e. Adin Steinsaltz & CO.]:

"Att: C C N L (1?):

Your Jealousy is showing Through & Through! "Your a Day Late & a Dollar Short!"

Please; No "MED's", No Psych Ward"! Your Very "SuperStupidStitious" indeed! YE TRUE (opposite MYTH) colors is been revealed herein-at!

Note: Ye Jealously (Pre-Apocalyptically) & CO., attempted to Eliminate (unjustly) a "Great [iNTELLECTUAL] Blogger" known as "F A R N A Z 1 M A N S O U R i 1 (& by other names).

You proved you "Limited I.Q." [Hence Ye are HUMAN & not a HU{e}MATE! Sooo Sooo "PRE-APOCALYPTIC" indeed!

ccnl1,
now, your point about joshua's jihad being sanctioned by god IS a truly disturbing point.

ccnl1, those atrocities listed in the O.T. would be really bad - if they were real. modern archaeology has revealed that "joshua's cities" didn't exist when he supposedly destroyed them. there's no evidence that anything in the O.T. prior to omri and ahab (including david and solomon) really happened. those "great" stories of israel's military exploits are just wishful thinking/revisionism by first-millenium b.c. judean priests.

*chuckle.* Interesting choice of words, HMCcard. :)

Oh, give it a rest Father. I didn't notice notice any "beta testing" when you and your cronies hijacked the liturgy "in the spirit of Vatican II" and gave us the flaccid pablum we get now for most of our litugical use. Whatever happened to words being translated according to what they, you know, actually MEAN, rather than what you and the rest of your Society friends want them to?

And, to characterize the President as speaking with more moral authority than your bishop indicates to me that you need to reevaluate your vocational decision.

It is time for Judaism to reject the atrocities listed in the OT. Said atrocities give a poor example not only to Jews but to all members of Abraham-founded religions. Such conduct also gives "god-approved" credence to such violence.

Many Jews have become atheists because of the violence OT Jews committed against religions, to include members of their own religion and also violence against many other ancient cultures.

Said atrocities:

http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/warstat0.htm

"Exodus 32: 3,000 Israelites killed by Moses for worshipping the golden calf.

Numbers 31: After killing all men, boys and married women among the Midianites, 32,000 virgins remain as booty for the Israelites. (If unmarried girls are a quarter of the population, then 96,000 people were killed.)

Joshua:

Joshua 8: 12,000 men and women, all the people of Ai, killed.

Joshua 10: Joshua completely destroys
Gibeon ("larger than Ai"), Makeddah, Libnah, Lachish, Eglon, Hebron, Debir. "He left no survivors."

Joshua 11: Hazor destroyed. [Paul Johnson, A History of the Jews (1987), estimates the population of Hazor at ?> 50,000]
TOTAL: if Ai is average, 12,000 x 9 = 108,000 killed.

Judges 1: 10,000 Canaanites k. at Battle of Bezek. Jerusalem and Zephath destroyed.
Judges 3: ca. 10,000 Moabites k. at Jordan River.

Judges 8: 120,000 Midianite soldiers k. by Gideon

Judges 20: Benjamin attacked by other tribes. 25,000 killed.

1 Samuel 4: 4,000 Isrealites killed at 1st Battle of Ebenezer/Aphek. 30,000 Isr. k. at 2nd battle.

David:

2 Samuel 8: 22,000 Arameans of Damascus and 18,000 Edomites killed in 2 battles.

2 Samuel 10: 40,000 Aramean footsoldiers and 7,000 charioteers killed at Helam.

2 Samuel 18: 20,000 Israelites under Absalom killed at Ephraim.

1 Kings 20: 100,000 Arameans killed by Israelites at Battle of Aphek. Another 27,000 killed by collapsing wall.

2 Chron 13: Judah beat Israel and inflicted 500,000 casualties.

2 Chron 25: Amaziah, king of Judah, k. 10,000 from Seir in battle and executed 10,000 POWs. Discharged Judean soldiers pillaged and killed 3,000.

2 Chron 28: Pekah, king of Israel, slew 120,000 Judeans

TOTAL: That comes to about 1,283,000 mass killings specifically enumerated in the Bible."

Correction to previous posting: Stephen Tyrone Johns

The translation problem will be solved long before crazed Catholic antisemites gun down the Johanna Justin-Jinich's of this world.
________________________________________________
May her memory be a blessing to those who knew her.

The translation problem will be solved long before crazed Christian antisemites decide that it is time "to kill the Jews" and go hunting them with a rifle.

May the memory of Stephen Tyrone James be a blessing to those who knew him.