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For Obama, Nothing is the Matter with Kansas
In 2004, 78% percent of White Evangelicals voted for George W. Bush. The GOP, I surmise, would like to achieve similar numbers in 2008. The danger presented by Barack Obama is not so much that he will completely reverse this result. Neither he, nor any other Democrat will be able to do that. It will be decades, if not longer, before Evangelicals return to the Party they once so faithfully supported. Rather, what Obama may be able to do is siphon off scads of “Swing Evangelicals” in battleground states. If I were a Republican operative I would dread the following scenario:
It’s mid-October and the senator is addressing a room full of Kansans in a non-college town. The Kansans (who in my reverie are dressed like the cast of Rodgers and Hammerstein’s Oklahoma) are initially skeptical about this “liberal” affiliated with the socially progressive United Church of Christ denomination. But Obama opens his talk by reminding them that he too is from Kansas (being from Kansas: Kansans love that!). He then surprises his listeners by pointedly noting his disagreements with certain secular mantras of his party (Indeed, it suddenly dawns upon the lone, closeted village atheist in the room that when it comes to separation of church and state, Barack Obama is no Michael Dukakis).
Next, he fires up his audience with Jimmy Carter like gospel-based oratory, except that it’s interesting and fun to listen to. He speaks out-loud about an awesome God and his awesome God does not appear to be a card-carrying member of the ACLU. After the Q and A, as the Kansans head home in advance of their self-imposed, statewide 7:30 pm curfew, 25% of them remain completely unconvinced and unmoved. Another 50% depart intending to vote Republican, but they are generally impressed by what they heard and pleased to learn that Mr. Obama is a Good Christian Man (because Kansans are fair, big-hearted folks, after all). Twenty five percent of his listeners, however, will now consider casting their vote for a Democrat (because Kansans are open-minded folks, after all). The next evening the scene repeats itself in Columbus Ohio.
The scenario I have conjured up abounds in hypothetical assumptions, not least of which is that Obama will win his party’s nomination. It also ignores certain glaring negatives in his biography (and autobiography) that may make him a difficult sell to White Evangelicals (I will address this issue soon). Yet the point I wish to make is that if there is any present Democratic candidate who can manipulate faith-based rhetoric to trigger a political conversion among conservative religious voters it is the talented junior senator from Illinois.
By Jacques Berlinerblau |
August 30, 2007; 8:41 AM ET
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Posted by: Bymnsniff | June 12, 2008 3:19 PM
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The reasons we Evangelicals aren't bowled over by Obama is not his skin color. It's the fact that he isn't an Evangelical. (Personally, I'd love to see a Colin Powell/Condi Rice ticket.) Martin Luther King, Jr. was an evangelical. There was no question in anyone's eyes as to whom Dr. King served. Obama is a great orator that knows how to use religious language to give the impression of a deep-rooted faith, but take heart all you nervous Democrats, he is definitely not a fundamentalist Evangelical. The Bible is a moral starting point for him, but ultimately, it's more suggestion than hard, fast course of action. Evangelicals do not equivocate or compromise in the name of Political Correctness or Obama's notions of how fundamentalists and "progressives" should interact. Besides, this is all moot anyway. Hillary continues to lead in every poll. If Obama is lucky, he'll win the job of Chairman of the DNC. (I'm betting Hillary takes John Edwards as her running mate.)
Posted by: An Actual Evangelical | September 3, 2007 4:03 AM
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White fundamentalist Christians have been putting their racism aside, or trying to, in the political sphere at least, for some time now because they recognize black conservatism on culture war issues. It's hypocritical since they migrated to the Republican party largely because of the integration of the public schools and maintaining private (i.e. white) schools throughout the Bible belt remains extremely important to them. The divisions remain profound and they live in dread of getting too close to blacks lest the inevitable question from an African- American arise - So can my son date your daughter? (one cause of the Promise Keepers demise, by the way) And Obama seems to be loosing ground with the liberals he needs for his party's nomination as they begin to recognize his lack of forthrightness on controversial social issues. Nothing much will come of your speculations.
Posted by: JohnJ | September 3, 2007 1:54 AM
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Since there apparently are a number of Obama supporters on this thread, this Independent voter in Oregon has a question for y'all:
Given:
- the steadily worsening state of the Middle East, and increasingly of Iran, Afghanistan and Pakistan,
- the slow resurgence of Russian (and soon, Chinese) military ambitions,
- the growing threats that climate change and peak oil pose to the global economy,
- and any other number of incredibly complex economic/social/environmental problems looming on the world stage right now...
...why on earth would I want a one-term Senator with no real foreign policy experience sitting in the White House in 2009?
Clinton's campaign doesn't excite me, but I'm confident that, were she elected President, she'd walk into the Oval Office in January 2009 more knowledgable about --and better prepared to deal with-- the challenges we face in the next four years than any other candidate I've seen so far.
(It should go without saying that I do not see anyone on the Republican side who I would trust on this. Hopefully it will be different in 2012.)
I like a lot of what Obama and especially Edwards have to say. But the 2008 election will not be about health care, poverty, race, gays, social security or *anything*, ultimately, except the worsening hornets nest of the Middle East and the still-real threat of an Al-Qaeda attack on the homeland. And because of that I will vote for Clinton.
(Yes, even though she voted for the Iraq war over the objection of the millions of us who took to the streets in February 2003 warning that it would be --guess what?!-- a quagmire that would only make things worse.)
Posted by: Oregonian | September 3, 2007 12:48 AM
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JERUSALEM TEMPLE, FATHER OF DEMOCRACY
Let Caliph Omar and Caliph Abd el-Malik build Al-Aqsa (638) and Dome of the Rock (688) wherever they want (even on the spot of the ancient Jewish Citadel which overlooked and protected the Temple)
But, NOW, it is the Jews’ Duty to restore the Jerusalem Temple -Father of Planet Democracy- on its authentic Site, indicated (downstream) to David by YHWH :
See at www.jerusalem-4thtemple.org : the first and unique Scientific Study of the TEMPLE RELIGIOUS HYDRAULIC SYSTEM which has been miraculously preserved, to this very day, in the rocky underground of the Jewish Citadel (nowadays Haram) and which can be checked by any one in Jerusalem...
This grandiose, innovative, unique (and totally ignored ! ) antique religious HYDRAULIC SYSTEM, installed from King Solomon to King Herod, with meticulous underground cascades, had been, thus, designed to constitute the “Water Tower” which stored and provided, DOWNSTREAM, by sole gravitation, the Jerusalem Temple with the live Source Waters of Etam :
These purifying living Waters had to EVER FLOW, without the least interruption, according to the meticulous exacting Jewish Religious Prescriptions, in order to allow daily Purifications of ALL ISRAEL, as required in the Cult of the TEMPLE by YHWH.
But WHY -by God!- should the Jews rebuild -now!!- the TEMPLE of JERUSALEM ???
TWO ANSWERS :
1/-- FOR THOSE WHO BELIEVE IN *GOD* ?
2/-- FOR THOSE WHO DO NOT BELIEVE IN *GOD* ?
See Answers on next post at Washington Post , or at NATAN PAPER : http://jerusalem-4thtemple-natan.blogspot.com
Posted by: Natan | September 3, 2007 12:37 AM
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church and state are seprate,and should remain so. Obama is looking like a pastor. i will never vote a pastor into office. He needs to step down from the pulpit....
Posted by: greg | September 2, 2007 9:56 PM
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"Labeling and demonising is certainly easier than dialogue, it's true."
Well, we could be shooting you and blowing up your churches, as you do.
Posted by: Tom | September 2, 2007 9:53 PM
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I grew up in a "good Christian community" about 40 miles from the Kansas border. One of my fondly remembered childhood songs is "Jesus loves all the little children, all the little children of the world. 'CEPT NIGGERS!" The last atonally shouted. I've been working since then to counteract that song; but it's still out there, in the supposed "heartland."
Posted by: Tom | September 2, 2007 9:41 PM
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Why is he wasting everybody's time talking about God to Kansans?
Doesn't he realize that we are in a war without end? Can't he talk about mobilizing his comatose party?
Posted by: Saleden | September 2, 2007 6:37 PM
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Why is he wasting everybody's time talking about God to Kansans?
Doesn't he realize that we are in a war without end? Can't he talk about mobilizing his comatose party?
Posted by: Saleden | September 2, 2007 6:36 PM
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>>It also ignores certain glaring negatives in his biography (and autobiography) that may make him a difficult sell to White Evangelicals
The biggest "negative" to the White Evangelical bunch, of course, is that Barack Obama is black.
alan
Posted by: Alan Bluestone | September 2, 2007 5:24 PM
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There are two themes that one can follow thoughout American history. One is unregulated, buyer beware, winner take all, individualistic capitalism. The second is religious doctrinal rigidity. Both of those values produces a very toxic combination. Fundamentalism, by definition, believes in excluding and rejecting al those who are not like "us." This was true for the Puritins as it is for today's religious zealots.
I think the bigotry inherent in religious zealotry must be exposed and condemned. There is something wrong with the people of any state that will officially subsume science below religious doctrine.
I worry about a political system that produces candidates who will do anything, say anything to win. We don't need a Democratic version of George Bush. If we pay lip-service to religious doctrinal rigidity for political advantage, that is just what we will get.
Posted by: Hugh McGuire | September 2, 2007 3:57 PM
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Clarification: my comments above were directed to Berlinerblau.
Posted by: Tiffany | September 2, 2007 1:30 PM
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Clarification: my comments above were directed to Berlinerblau.
Posted by: Tiffany | September 2, 2007 1:28 PM
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Clarification: my comments above were directed to Berlinerblau.
Posted by: Tiffany | September 2, 2007 1:28 PM
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The condescending comments that you made about Kansans (and by implication, Ohioans, too) represent an attitude toward rural Americans that is attributed to the Democratic Party, and it is a large part of the reason that the people you (inaccurately) describe REALLY CAN'T STAND MY PARTY. Get over yourself and have some respect for who they are and (at least some) of what they believe. The substance of the issue you raise is interesting and important, but your manner of expression is offensive and, if you are a Democratic, ultimately self-defeating.
Posted by: Tiffany | September 2, 2007 1:16 PM
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"Kansas, preparing young minds for the high tech jobs of 1652." ~ Randi Rhodes
Posted by: Jack | September 2, 2007 11:46 AM
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"Perhaps the white evangelicals will continue to diminish in electoral importance, as demographic and culture factors work against them.
Perhaps they will return to terrorism, as they did in the nineties, bombing federal buildings and gay nighclubs and shooting doctors."
Ah, so this is the dialogue the Left wants? Obama is obviously wasting his time talking nice to the evangelicals, if his base just wants to call them terrorists and move on. Labeling and demonising is certainly easier than dialogue, it's true.
Posted by: Anonymous | September 2, 2007 10:48 AM
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What self-regard!
How nice of the Good Christians to consider thinking well of someone who bends the knee to them...
Perhaps the following will happen: Hillary wins the primary and general election, with marginal support from the evangelicals.
Perhaps the white evangelicals will continue to diminish in electoral importance, as demographic and culture factors work against them.
Perhaps they will return to terrorism, as they did in the nineties, bombing federal buildings and gay nighclubs and shooting doctors.
Perhaps then the moderate third of the country will realise what Good Christians these people are.
Posted by: Adam | September 2, 2007 2:44 AM
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John, Apparently you don't know many african americans. Many many are very spiritual and have deep ties to religion. would you tell people to stop the madness if it was Martin Luther King, a pastor? There is a religious tradition in the african american communities. and many go to church every sunday and read their bibles everyday.
there is a big difference between this and the fringie fundies who come out the Bush league.
Mr. Age.
it was Obama's grandparents because his grandfather had wanderlust.
to the rest.
I live in Illinois. Obama's state. when he ran in the democratic primary and won it was noted he did not just get the black vote or the progressive vote. he got large swaths of republicans and rural voters.
The thing with Obama is that many whites, republicans and even religious people are attracted to him and his message. They are willing to put aside party labels and ideology for him. They believe he has everyone's best interest at heart and not just a certain group like corporations, or cronies or just secular democrats. They like that he embraces everyone and respects them for who they are. And essentially that is what we all want.
It's been widely whispered that if Obama got the nomination he would not only win the general easily but, he would do so in a landslide.
The biggest problem he faces are in his own party who are determined to foist Hillary on us. Most do not even care what her positions are or that she has more in common with neocons than democrats.
Because her last name is Clinton she will be shoved down our throats and we will most likely lose.
How unfortunate that we have a brilliant candidate who appeals across the board to all ages, parties, beliefs, races, ect. and he will be thrown over for a corporate candidate who embraces war, unilateral invasions and outsourcing.
With that in mind, if the the dems refuse to look squarely at the choices and chose clinton because of name, then the democrats deserve to lose.
Posted by: vwcat | September 2, 2007 2:02 AM
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Born in Wichita, Kansas and living in same city, could be where Obama's mother fled from ( not surprising ) to Hawaii or foreign lands would have been a life improvement. I only chart "Barry" from his Hawaiian upbringing, that's what matters.
Some knot head bringing up hatred because of his Hussein middle name is foolish. He had no choice in it.
Doesn't hate his parents to change it. Has done very well in life with that unique name.
The world would like America better if he could achieve a majority vote for President.
We'll see who his running mate is to better define what White House policies will happen in the future.
Kansans voted for State owned gambling Casino's recently in certain counties!Evangelicals can lose some elections. In Wichita, largest city in state, where casino's were denied by voters, it took Corporate figure heads suggesting they would move their business from downtown Wichita, where a Casino could be located. The newspaper said it was a bad idea. Chamber of Commerce did as well.
Evangelicals supported Bingo but not a Casino!
The process means a Casino won't be in Wichita, but only 20 miles away in a neighboring County. What many Kansans fail to realize, gambling is already here.
There is a serious split between Republicans and Conservatives. Evangelicals are ruining their position on many topics. The Farm Bills dominate why so many vote Republican. What's the matter with Kansas, those farm Bills ruin family farms faster. Corporate farming benefits more.
Rumsfeld recently refused to come for a future speech, or someone told him not to show up.
Things can change here!
Bush saw Tornado damage in Greensburg, Kansas and visited a Boys and Girls club for moments in Wichita, then did a fundraiser event for Pat Roberts.
Because Senator Pat Roberts was an apologist for the Bush war that has hurt him. Don't know if anyone is strong politically enough to challenge his seat.
Senator Sam Brownback is running for Prez keeps missing Congress votes. Few in Kansas believe he has a chance.
Senator Todd Tiahart gets slammed for his rubber stamping Bush policies. He raced around trying to get Boeing tankers bought by the Air Force when the AF didn't want them. So much Boeing fraud occurred they replaced CEO and fired some management! Todd Tiahart has his agenda, no one else matters.
Obama and Hillary could come here to get many votes if they try. But what's the point, trying to change rural Kansas is tougher. Promise more Farm Bill money. The World Trade hates America's Farm Bills because their unfair.
Kansas Republicans like being unfair to the world and ruin faster family farming! That's why a split exists in Kansas today.
We have a Democrat Governor on her second term. Have had Democrat Governors in the past. Past Republican Governors not so highly thought of.
Many liked Bob Dole who never visited Kansas that often. Divorced his Kansas born wife too. So Bob Dole is disliked by many Kansans as well.
Does that clear state of Kansas up? It can be a mess. Remember the evolution debate. Kansas was ridiculed for wanting to challenge Darwin. Those Evangelicals were voted off the state School Board. They can go to far in Kansas.
Look up Fred Phelps.
Posted by: Mrage | September 2, 2007 12:51 AM
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I'm with anonymous in post 4. His stuff on "peleg" really struck me as the solution to the social security crunch, and I'm upset with the later commentators that they've so blithely ignored (do we do anything else blithely?) his insights.
I also liked how Espo (just above) quoted Galations, saying that "if you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham's offspring," and then says, in God's eyes, there's no [difference between] a Jew and a Greek.
As a logician, I'm upset. They're both kinda olive-complexioned with big noses, but the languages are nothing alike. And I figure an omniscient being would be aware of that.
As a Jew, I'm ashamed. Nothing against the Greeks, but I just can't deal with all the spinach. Plus, I have some problems with Plato's exchanging of sophia for episteme in the Meno.
I suppose what he must have meant is that the Christian vision of God is one who doesn't prefer people of one race to another.
More importantly, I really wonder whether all you people who profess to be open minded really believe I'm going to roast for all eternity.
Because if you seriously believe that, then I'm really uncomfortable with being on the same side of a debate as you -- even if the other side believes it, too.
And a president who is willing to use explicitly biblical imagery -- in a non-metaphorical way--is one whom I will never be wholly comfortable with, because I will always have the sneaking suspicion that he believes I'm going to hell.
Perhaps some Jews (Kissinger, I'm looking at you) might be comfortable. I'm not. It ain't just tactics: as soon as both sides agree on Christianity as the medium of debate, I'm shut out.
And I wonder what happens to my grandkids after I'm shut out of the debate, and how long it takes before it happens.
Posted by: Bill | September 1, 2007 11:59 PM
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sure,the Christian right will vote for a half black man who is a democrat.
and bush finsihed his service honorably in the TANG
Posted by: barb | August 31, 2007 4:49 PM
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I am amazed that so many peole who claim to be Christians are racist. I do believe these are the people who will hear the words "I never knew you" directly from the lord. Paul tells us , in Galations how we to look at race and gender.
"But before faith came, we were kept in custody under the law, being shut up to the faith which was later to be revealed. Therefore the Law has become our tutor to lead us to Christ, that we may be justified by faith. But now that faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor. For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus. For all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor freeman, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus. And if you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham's offspring, heirs according to the promise." (Galatians 3:23-29).
In God eyes there is no difference, there is no Jew, no Greek, no White, no Black. There is no gender, no women nor men. We are all the same, all loved as a father loves his son. Those who claim to be Christian and are racist cannot justify their views with the the teachings of Christ. They may be sincere, but they are sincerely deluded.
Posted by: eSPO | August 31, 2007 12:13 PM
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Stop the madness! Barack Obama is actually a Christian fundamentalist. We know this is true because we have a number of chronicles about him. We know that he carries his bible with him wherever he goes. We also know he consistently attends Sunday masses at his Chicago church. Last but not least, we know that he strictly lives by the 10 commandments of the Christian faith. In short, evangelicals may not want to vote for him for him because he is: a black man, a person of mix race, member of a very liberal church, socially moderate, economically fairly conservative, and probably too smart for his own good.
Posted by: John | August 30, 2007 10:35 PM
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To Ender:
Not all of us in the South are racist Neanderthals.
To If anyone is still reading this ...:
"faith-based" progressive politics is the most complex oxymoron I have ever seen.
To all:
Obama thinks, instead of knee-jerks. He actually talks to people, instead of parading around to music and spewing sound bites. And he listens. He could be a true uniter, unlike our present disaster in the oval office.
Posted by: Arminius | August 30, 2007 9:15 PM
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Thought I'd better clarify that by "corporate values" I meant the values of the nation or the melting pot body of faith. Much as those who belong to one faith or another may dislike admitting it, there is an American culture or body of faith that values doing compassionate works here in the U.S. But we digress. The point is that Obama is the only candidate out there who is moving people to be their own better selves.
Posted by: Jean | August 30, 2007 8:54 PM
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I think of it more as asking your government to reflect your corporate values. Most of us do not want people to rot and despite what the current administration apparently believes, the faith-based initiatives [private charities] cannot do all the basic good work that needs to be done. .
Posted by: Jean | August 30, 2007 8:45 PM
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Should Christians be compassionate, observe the golden rule, etc.?
Absolutely.
Does that translate into supporting the maintenance and expansion of the welfare state? That's an entirely different question.
After all, how compassionate is it to employ the force of government to get someone to do your bidding? That, after all, is what "faith-based" progressive politics is all about.
Posted by: If anyone is still reading this ... | August 30, 2007 7:36 PM
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Personally i have waited for years to find someone who will unite the United States of America and its people.
I am tired of division which keeps the masses in a fog and allows politicians to do things on the basis of beating up the other party.
Barack has worked with republican Senator Coburn from oklahoma to pass the transparency bill.
REPUBLICAN SENATOR COBURN SAID ON AUGUST 1ST 2007 ON C-SPAN THAT OBAMA IS A GREAT SUPPORTER OF CAMPAIGN REFORM.
http://obama.senate.gov/podcast/060914-091406_coburn-obama_transparency_bill/index.html
Transparency for Government Contracts
When we created Sunlight we made a point to note that the issue of greater transparency for government actions was a nonpartisan issue. We saw support for it across party lines in our initial polling and we see it again today in an editorial in the conservative newspaper -- the Examiner --which endorses transparency for government grants and contracts. The paper strongly supports Sen. Tom Coburn's Federal Funding Accountability and Transparency Act (S. 2590) that would make all information about federal contracts and grants available to the public free of charge in a searchable, downloadable online format on the Internet. (Coburn is the original sponsor of the proposal, and the measure is co-sponsored by the unlikely bedfellows of Sens. Barack Obama, Tom Carper and John McCain, R-Ariz.)
respectively
Danielle Clarke vietnam vet
Posted by: Danielle Clarke | August 30, 2007 6:32 PM
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The speech on the relationship between faith and politics someone referred to earlier was Obama's Call to Renewal Keynote Address. Here is the link: http://www.barackobama.com/2006/06/28/call_to_renewal_keynote_address.php
Posted by: sloan | August 30, 2007 5:23 PM
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Truely amazing insite. This man is a man of the people and this is his time.
Obama 08.......the peoples movement!
Posted by: JimmieFromDayton | August 30, 2007 5:14 PM
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Amen!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Posted by: Joseph Muchungu | August 30, 2007 4:37 PM
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"glaring negatives in his biography" What are you talking about?
Obama speaks thoughtfully and realistically. He does not use three word slogans like our current President. That is what will allow him to gain evangelical votes. Evangelicals also clearly believe in forgiving, or at least forgetting, the past. (see our current "former" alcoholic occupant of the White House)
Posted by: StevenAK | August 30, 2007 4:02 PM
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So Dead On.
Posted by: Parthi Kandavel | August 30, 2007 2:50 PM
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"THEY ARE A BUNCH OF RACIST TO THE BONE, AND OBAMA WOULDN'T GET THEIR VOTE IF HE WAS MORE RIGHT WING THAN PAT BUCHANAN."
Well that will certainly save us all time in the future.
Why don't you compile a list for us of all of those irredeemably incorrect in their thinking with whom we don't need to bother to talk?
Posted by: Anonymous | August 30, 2007 2:27 PM
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Obama's race has bee beyond the scope of what a lot of analysts have imagined. http://www.enewsreference.com
Posted by: eNews Reference | August 30, 2007 2:25 PM
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I know squat about Kansas, but having grown up as the Southern Baptist Fire and Brimstone Conservative Republican South, THEY ARE A BUNCH OF RACIST TO THE BONE, AND OBAMA WOULDN'T GET THEIR VOTE IF HE WAS MORE RIGHT WING THAN PAT BUCHANAN.
Posted by: ender | August 30, 2007 2:23 PM
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What I think Doug was saying (but I may be wrong)is that Obama is still too "foreign" for most Americans to consider as a presidential candidate. Are we ready for a president who is non-white? With a background that isn't pure American Christian? What about a female like Hillary?
I agree with Doug. I would vote for Obama, but I don't have much confidence in too many other Americans doing so ... certainly not enough to elect him. I live in a flyover state like Kansas, and I just don't see it. I'd like to be proven wrong.
Posted by: jay | August 30, 2007 2:19 PM
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This article does delve into an interesting subject matter that has not been discussed enough. In the minds of many people the racial divide in this country can only begin to be healed through frank and open discussions in the churches of this nation; Obama can begin this dialogue.
Posted by: paul | August 30, 2007 2:10 PM
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When a non-negotiable conflict arises between traditional Christian morality and the platform of the Democratic Party, Obama invariably sides with the party.
Every note Mr. Obama plucks in his article about the golden rule and benevolent liberalism is belied right off the bat when he spends the first two pages ruling unborn children out of that creed of benevolence and philanthropy.
Winning the party, as it currently exists, therefore goes a long way to guaranteeing that he will never be able to appeal to more than a fringe of evangelicals.
Simply instructing his staff not to refer to pro-lifers in general as terrorists is not going to make the sale.
Posted by: mulopwepaul | August 30, 2007 2:08 PM
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Most evangelicals I've met are nice, and often their words are honeyed. But the fruits...those are going to take a lot of answering for in the coming years. So, Swing Evangelicals yes, but I would hope Obama does not attempt to appeal to the hard core. In the future, they won't be a moral asset. In the future, no one's going to want to be associated with churches that were so pivotal in electing someone like Bush.
Posted by: Laura | August 30, 2007 2:02 PM
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What Doug is saying is that he has had a very poor upbringing. When one puts their personal predjudice above what is best for their country
its a sad day indeed. Barack is intelligent, articulate, a critical thinker and more than capable of bringing parties together for solutions. Fortunately for us there are more than enough voters who do not subscribe to racial prejudice. Obama will make history on election day.
Posted by: eSPO | August 30, 2007 1:59 PM
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You know very little about Kansas.
Posted by: joe Reid | August 30, 2007 1:39 PM
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Doug wrote:
"It'll be decades before America elects a president with a name like Barack Hussein Obama."
So, Doug, are you saying:
It'll be decades before Americans grow out of their willingness to put shallow labels and characteristics ahead of bold new ideas?
It'll be decades before America considers a presidential candidate based on his or her experience, vision and leadership qualities?
It'll be decades before hope and optimism will count for more than cronyism and cynicism?
It'll be decades before America can again lead the world by the example of its constitution and its values?
Doug, America -- and the world -- don't have decades left to address the serious problems we face. Voters understand that the 2008 election is extremely important and I hope and believe they will look deeply into the qualities and experience of each of the candidates from all parties before casting their ballots. So much is riding on the wisdom of the electorate.
Posted by: Rich Evans | August 30, 2007 1:33 PM
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Doug Said.
It'll be decades before America elects a president with a name like Barack Hussein Obama.
What he really was saying is, America would not vote a black man in as president even if he is most qualified.
Well to clarify that we all aren't bigotic minded like Doug, I would vote for who would take the country to the best place right now and unite us as one, even if he is a black person named Barack Obama.
Posted by: Darren | August 30, 2007 1:31 PM
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Dennis -
He did give a speech and it tracks with the fantastic article he wrote in TIME last October which you can begin (it's 11 pages) at:
http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1546579-1,00.html
The only problem with the premise of this scenario of Obama winning over the white evangelicals is getting the Democratic Party's nomination, which seems hellbent on putting up Hillary Clinton, who will only reinforce the current red-blue divisions in our country.
Posted by: Mark | August 30, 2007 1:14 PM
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He can excite all the Kansans he wants.
It'll be decades before America elects a president with a name like Barack Hussein Obama.
Posted by: Doug | August 30, 2007 12:34 PM
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"There are plenty of us out here who do not preach thinly-veiled hate, whose progressive churches are growing by adding young families who don't want their children to learn the narrow, dogma-fueled intolerance of the Right."
And yet the urge to demonise and sneer remains powerful.
Somebody once said something about planks and motes...
Posted by: mulopwepaul | August 30, 2007 12:31 PM
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I presume that Dennis above is referring to Obama's speech at the AIDS conference sponsored by Saddleback Church pastor Rick Warren back in December (paired with Republican candidate Sam Brownback):
http://usliberals.about.com/od/extraordinaryspeeches/a/ObamaAIDS.htm
I think the speech was fine as far as it went, but I don't think it fundamentally represents a watershed in the relations between advocates of the Sexual Revolution and those of traditional sexual morality. Respectful disagreement is a step up from sneering disagreement, but it is still disagreement.
Posted by: mulopwepaul | August 30, 2007 12:16 PM
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The best thing Obama can do, something he's already expressed an intention to do, is to get Christianity out from under the fundamentalist cloud that has made it a bad joke for the last few elections. There are plenty of us out here who do not preach thinly-veiled hate, whose progressive churches are growing by adding young families who don't want their children to learn the narrow, dogma-fueled intolerance of the Right.
Posted by: jazzyndn | August 30, 2007 12:13 PM
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And his people are trying to sell Obama as progressive.
The heights of pandering are breathtaking.
Posted by: Alain James | August 30, 2007 12:04 PM
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Hey Christopher,
I think you meant Obama's message embodies and *exudes classical Christian values, not eludes...
Posted by: Chris | August 30, 2007 12:04 PM
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I have been thinking about this for sometime. I couldn't agree with you more. There is a speech in particular that he gave in a religious gathering sometime early this year, or late last year, ( I just can't remember where) that was a masterpiece. Few noted it, but I gurantee you when it is all said and done, it will go down in the annals of history. I was very impressed by the ability of a liberal democrat to do that, whether it was genuine faith or political expedience.
Posted by: DENNIS | August 30, 2007 12:00 PM
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I have to say that Obama is in a very good position to gain support from certain parts of the white evangelicals - yes, on some social issues he is at odds with them - but more importantly, Obama's message embodies and eludes classical Christian values that also resound with heartland Christians...his message of hope, compassion, responsibility, family values, and sense of community will appeal to many in the heartland, even if some of his points are at odds with what has been, up to now, core issues for conservative Christians...I see a change in priorities for them and Obama stands very nearly with how they want to be represented politically - particularly after seeing how the old standard of simply voting Republican has worked out for them.
Posted by: Christopher | August 30, 2007 11:55 AM
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Every man acts in faith; at least in the faith that the sun will rise again tomorrow, or the faith that his memories of the past actually represent the course of events causing him to be where it is he currently stands.
Merely lauding "faith" is therefore selling an empty bottle. The inevitable question is going to be "faith in what?" Marketing and restraining the condescending sneers may in fact shave off a certain percentage, but, as Prof. Berlinerblau notes, most Evangelicals WERE Democrats, and were alienated from the party by positive action on the part of the party.
In a nutshell, the Democrats decided consciously to forego a share of the traditionalists and a share of feminists and other sexual non-traditionalists for almost all of the non-traditionalists and almost none of the traditionalists.
Demographically this has proven to be a short-sighted plan. Regardless, the fundamental policy positions won't be changed with different marketing approaches, and it is the policy positions to which the traditionalists are responding.
Marketing alone won't change the refrigerator-buying habits of eskimos over the long term, even if the salesmen learn to stop calling the eskimos "Nanook" and stop referring to them in print as "poor, ignorant, and easily led."
Posted by: mulopwepaul | August 30, 2007 11:53 AM
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WEll, Obama is smart enough to know that faith is not a virtue of one party only. WE can all be dedicated faith people but also a democrat who want to implement what our faith is telling us to do in real life. THat is what his appeal to everyone in America will be! adn He sill be surprise everyone come the voting day! I cannot wait for that date!
Go Obama!
Posted by: Daniel | August 30, 2007 11:39 AM
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WEll, Obama is smart enough to know that faith is not a virtue of one party only. WE can all be dedicated faith people but also a democrat who want to implement what our faith is telling us to do in real life. THat is what his appeal to everyone in America will be! adn He sill be surprise everyone come the voting day! I cannot wait for that date!
Go Obama!
Posted by: Daniel | August 30, 2007 11:37 AM
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WEll, Obama is smart enough to know that faith is not a virtue of one party only. WE can all be dedicated faith people but also a democrat who want to implement what our faith is telling us to do in real life. THat is what his appeal to everyone in America will be! adn He sill be surprise everyone come the voting day! I cannot wait for that date!
Go Obama!
Posted by: Daniel | August 30, 2007 11:31 AM
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Obama is politically smart enough not try to claim Kansas as part of his own history.
His mother fled Kansas; trying to tie himself back to it would force him to acknowledge his mother's rejection of it, and that doesn't do him any political good.
He is much better served approaching Kansas as an outsider without presumptions of familiarity, as, in fact, he has done to date.
Posted by: mulopwepaul | August 30, 2007 10:41 AM
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