Comments (20)

Newark says:

"One of the many serious flaws in Secular Humanism is its failure to describe from where its values have arrived."

That comment just demonstrates your ignorance of the subject.

Here, educate yourself:

http://infidels.org/library/modern/nontheism/secularhumanism/

http://infidels.org/library/historical/non.shtml

The ultimate truth through belief? That is the most absurd statement I have ever heard. So the ultimate truth is that aliens exist because I believe it is so? Well, then what is the ultimate truth for someone who doesn't believe in aliens? There can't be two ultimate beliefs. Biblical intelligence is equal to Shakesperean intelligence - you know a lot about something an author wrote. "Biblical intelligence" didn't form the basis of our culture in America and many other parts of the world. You are re-writing history as usual. You can't even get Jesus' birthday straight, so how could you get the rest of history in order?

newark,
Thousands of christian sects and "seculars don't bother to agree even among themselves as to what is ultimate true through belief."????? Yeah right.

One of the many serious flaws in Secular Humanism is its failure to describe from where its values have arrived. They seem like an opposite reading of the learned truth of biblical intelligence which formed the beasis of our culture. Usually as the foregoing comments show, humanism is exactly what a person subjectively believes that is right and everone else is dead wrong. Seculars don't bother to agree even among themselves as to what is ultimate true through belief.

"By the way Frank and Mo, did you hear the latest? The earth revolves around the sun, and not the other way around?"

I don't know about their beliefs, but there actually are Biblical literalists who reject heliocentrism:

http://www.burntorangereport.com/showDiary.do?diaryId=2916

http://www.texscience.org/news/chisum-bridges.htm

"Rep. Chisum sunk to a new low of bigotry by distributing a memo--reproduced below--of State Representative Ben Bridges, Republican of Georgia, that advocates young-Earth creationism, geocentricity, a non-rotating and non-revolving Earth, and attributes evolutionary biology to a conspiracy of Jewish 'Kabbalists' documented in ancient 'Rabbinic writings.'"

Frank and MO,
You are both a real asset to your philosophies. I prefer to have correspondence with people that can articulate and write well, something you both need to work on. Secular humanism has been given a black eye by Christian conservatives because some Christian would have us believe that ALL/ONLY good comes from God, and ALL?ONLY evil comes from Satan. That idea worked well when the majority of mankind were ignorant, nomadic, barbarians. However, as a race, we are fairly well educated, no longer nomadic, and a little better than barbarians. Give mankind a little credit. We have come a long way. By the way Frank and Mo, did you hear the latest? The earth revolves around the sun, and not the other way around?

Godfrey,

I'm not sure there is a practical difference between atheism and secular humanism. Defining morality as existing independently of god and religion, and explaining natural events in materialist terms - these seem contrary to the doctrines of every theistic religion. Plus, almost every atheist I've ever encountered subscribes to those secular humanist ideas. Contrary to your assertion about "fuzzy-headed liberalism," many atheists are very libertarian in their politics. I'm an agnostic pantheist and my politics are liberal on social and personal issues and conservative or fiscal issues (eliminate welfare but make gay marriage legal).

Candide,

I disagree with your characterization of Christians, and I'm not even Christians. Many moderate Christians have told me that such bigoted demagogues as Pat Robertson do not speak for them, and in fact they find him to be an embarrassment.

Like liberalism, secular humanism has become a dirty word in the dirty hands of conservatives and redneck Christians. All it is is common sense.

Perhaps we should call Christians what they really are: bigoted fantasists.

Tonio:

Secular humanism is a real thing, but don't assume (not that I'm assuming you're assuming) that all agnostics and atheists are secular humanists. I don't subscribe to secular humanism because their politics tend to be fuzzy-headed liberalism.

Sure, Mo. Horses can't talk, and how do you know that horses believe in God? If I ask the horse who created God, I'm sure the horse won't be answering the question (do horses speak English like Mr. Ed?), but instead will be wondering if I have food. What is the difference between human and any other animal? There are genetic differences, we are different species, we are both mammals, need I go on? I don't believe in purpose. Purpose is a man-made thing and I think it leads to confusion. I think that individual purpose is much more important than what an imagined invisible man wants from me - and it's very liberating. The horse doesn't know what purpose is. Go ahead and ask it. It's instincts tell it to survive - to perpetuate it's existence and spread it's seed. Horses are bred and taught to be submissive to man - wild horses aren't going to let you ride unless you teach them to do so. I am not claiming that human beings are less intelligent than horses - I think that assumption speaks for itself. Just because you don't speak "horse language" doesn't mean you can assume that they think they were created by God. That's just senseless.

yes sir,horses have better sense this days ,at least they know that their creator god exist ,at least they do not associate no partner to their creator god ,if you ask the horse who created you the horse will tell you that god allmighty is my lord ,he created me ,no offend mr luke, who created you ?and what is the difference between human and horse ?and what is the puropse of human in this life ?and what is the puropse of horse ?who is submissive to the other the horse to the human or the human to the horse and why?what degrade the intellegence of human to the grade of horse ?how when and why ?i swear in the allmighty creator lord who created horses and humans i,m not being funny i,m serious like a horse ,answer the above questions please .

Mo, I have no idea what that meant, you are the one denying your humanity. I bet if you gave a mule the Bible they would read it and rejoice. Maybe you are more like a horse with your level of intelligence? I've met horses that write better.

horse towenship.
mr horsey from the sugar foot family of the big bang tripe and ms horsecess from the evolution family trip are announceing to mankind the happy marriage .the marrige already breeding some nuckle crap heads filling the planet earth with none but horse manour called secular humanism.
secular humanism is none but regression to animalism and liberalism ,from out side it looks humantic but the filling is no more no less than horseism and muleism.
the summation of secularism ,
work,eat,pass it to the environement and die,typical and identical horse and mule day.

human being born and created to worship their creator lord .
vote for humanity not animality, with all respect to animals they know that their creator exist .

Faith Facts is a great idea. Here are some future topics you might consider:

How do Sunnis and Shiites differ?

What are Salafism and Wahabbism, and what is the relationship between them?

What are the views of the 3 branches of Christianity--Orthodoxy, Catholicism, and Protestantism--on the Bible as the literal word of God?

Faith Facts is a great idea. Here are some future topics you might consider:

How do Sunnis and Shiites differ?

What are Salafism and Wahabbism, and what is the relationship between them?

What are the views of the 3 branches of Christianity--Orthodoxy, Catholicism, and Protestantism--on the Bible as the literal word of God?

Faith Facts is a great idea. Here are some future topics you might consider:

How do Sunnis and Shiites differ?

What are Salafism and Wahabbism, and what is the relationship between them?

What are the views of the 3 branches of Christianity--Orthodoxy, Catholicism, and Protestantism--on the Bible as the literal word of God?

Freaks? True Frank that secular humanists may "act like they come from something thousands of years old (what does that even mean?)", but ignorance and stupidity is pretty ancient, and you certainly pay testament to that. Your attacks on everything not Christian are tiring. Can't you go to Fred Phelps site or something?

For all practical purposes, and for contemporary discourse, "secular humanist" is a term employed ad nauseam by Bill O'Reilly to describe anyone who doesn't agree with him 100%.

Virtually every one of his programs devotes at least 20 minutes to denouncing the latest horrible deeds or proposals of "secular humanists".

If you disagree with O'Reilly you are deemed to be a secular humanist.

If so deemed, you are assumed to:

*Favor pedophiles and child molesters.
*Hate and attack Christmas.
*Want islamic terrorists to win worldwide success and for the U.S. to be totally defeated in Iraq.
*Teach middle schoolers how to perform homosexual acts.
*Oppose any criminal sentences tougher than probation without community service.
*Be a Democrat.
*Live in New England (particularly Vermont); in parts of the Northeast or Upper Midwest; or on the West Coast.
*Be highly educated, with a propensity to be a teacher, especially in higher education.

**And so on and on and on.

Blessed be The O'Reilly, for he is absurdly humorous.

P.S. How many people do you know personally who label themselves "secular humanists"?

Tonio, this site might interest you:

http://www.secularhumanism.org/

I didn't know secular humanism was a real thing. I had assumed that Robertson or Falwell had invented the term in the 1970s to bash people who disagreed with them. The concept above pretty well describes my attitudes. I don't rule out the possibility of the divine, but any claim for such should be subjected to the same standards as claims about the natural world.