All Comments (15)

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i agree with mary- it is and has been political.

one of the most annoying misquotes actually is relevant in this aspect.

marx said 'religion is the opiate of the masses'

it wasnt an anti-religion remark- if you read his whole statement he was asserting that religion WHEN USED AS A TOOL BY THE POWERS THAT BE is very effective at controlling the behavior of large groups of people.

there is no spiritual aspect to this conflict whatsoever-

the only people who really believe this at any level are those allowing themselves to be distracted into ways to voice their own prejudices against those who believe differently-

its political- almost all of the terrorist actions have been motivated by political atmospheres- and are acts (horrific) of desparation.

o by the way- the inventor of terrorism wasnt the tamil tigers,

IT WAS THE IRISHMAN AND CATHOLIC MICHAEL COLLINS.

another person peripherally involved in his religion, but who didnt hesitate to use it to galvanize fighters for his side.

and again for the record-

arabs worldwide comprise less than 18% of the total population of muslims.

one of the biggest democracies in the world is a muslim country called indonesia.

Tim:

""A lot of what is happening makes no sense. But from a spiritual vantage things become clearer. The war on terror, like many significant wars, is about ideology, concepts and your god vs. my god. We are participants in spiritual battle and the war on terror is just the manifestation of this spiritual battle on the physical plane."

Or you could 'follow the money and power' in your inquiries: and see that the 'sides' in the war on terror may not be as simple as you think: the fact is, casting this as 'spiritual war,' tends to affiliate people with one side 'winning,' and this only serves certain interests, including Bush's friends the House of Saud, as Ahmed mentions, who've long been diverting attention from injustices in their own country by encouraging popular sentiment against the West.

In a way, yes, there's what I'd call a spiritual conflict, but it's not the one some would lead us to think.

"As long as they know this and we do not it puts us at a disadvantage."

At what, being the question.

Interesting piece, Mr Dickey...but it's important to be clear headed about this.

Suicide-bombing is a weapon, only recently invoked by Islamists.('Invented'-- if we might use that word--initially and thereafter frequently used by the fearsomely secular Tamil Tigers.) Islamists have been politically active in the 1990s and 80s without resorting to suicide-bombing. During this period religion was not invoked at all: they were fighting against the occupation of the West Bank, repressive gov'ts in Egypt, Saudi, Algeria &tc. It looked then as if these militants had purely political aims. They were defeated in Algeria, for example, because in order to bring about a 'perfect' state they were murdering Muslim civilians in ever increasing numbers!

What is happening today is happening primarily for a political goal--the remaking/'purification' of the ME. These goals are set in opposition to liberal democracy of the West, are ultimately Utopian and, as such, have much in common with secular Western movements of the 20th century.

Tony, what you have said is measured and well though out. I agree with your conclusion that political will and unprecedented vision will be needed to ensure a world where all peoples and cultures can live together. Communism lasted for a very brief period on the scale of history and Nazism was really just a blip on the map of history. Islamo ideology and culture has existed 1400 years. This is a whole 'nother animal with a past that includes the near conquest of Europe. Unless contained it will strive to and will find a way to dominate.

The question poised was about things that we can not see, i.e. heaven and hell. These are not physical quantities that can be observed and measured. If one can not imagine, envision, or even consider the possibility of hell, something beyond this physical life, then it is fair to say that the expression of surprise captured on the faces of those who died is only about the missing bits of body having been blown into pieces.

Also, viewed through a secular, materialistic lens we are all genuinely baffled, perplexed as to why a person with such diametrically opposed views to those of the host nation would want to live in that particular country.

A lot of what is happening makes no sense. But from a spiritual vantage things become clearer. The war on terror, like many significant wars, is about ideology, concepts and your god vs. my god. We are participants in spiritual battle and the war on terror is just the manifestation of this spiritual battle on the physical plane. As long as they know this and we do not it puts us at a disadvantage. Yet, more Americans are beginning to see the real nature of this current challenge to our freedom. When you do, then you can also see that there is perhaps another dimension to the expressions on those faces and Dickey saw this. It could an overstatement on the whole thing, but Dickey is the one who chose to use the words "feel firmly" and he concluded his piece with this wording. It just may be that he is communicating something to us that is pretty rare these days and is truly a picture that represents what the heart of this war is all about. It is about a choice between heaven or hell.

Suicide is considered a sin in Islam. Period.

Sadly in such places as none Arab Muslim countries many follow whatever their imams dish them out. So, in many ways it is the blind leading the blind. As for those who are Arabs and still commit such suicidal acts, they seem to be driven more by revenge than any proclaimed Islamic faith. Again revenge is forbiden in Islam where God implores patience in adversity.

The only war that is allowed in Quran is based on self defence and it has its limitation such as if the offender stops then we must also stop even if the peace term is against us for God prefers people to live in peace and find their way to HIM than be at war for HIS sake when HE clearly tells us, again, in the Quran, that HE is beyond need but it aslo clearly informs us that: "Whoever kills a person it is as if he has killed all human beings and whoever saves a person it is as if he has saved all human beings."

The sad part of this is that it is the USA who supports the House of Saud that supports the teaching of such fanatics as Wahabis who do not tolerate any other Islamic interpretations let alone non-Islamic faiths. In short they are a disgrace to most Muslims but many fear voicing their abhorance for whatever reason.

Sir,
I read with interest your article and would like to comment on just a couple of your points. Firstly i think its fair to say that the expression of surprise captured on the faces of those who died would probably have very little to do with religion and a whole lot more to do with the missing bits of body having been blown into pieces.

The second more fundamental point looks at the relationship between Muslims and terrorism. Its fair to say that not all Muslims are terrorists, its also fair to say that those who are or purport to be terrorists have a perverted sense of what their religion stands for and represents. My own personal experience of Muslims tells me they are an insular, secular, type of people who by nature find it hard to integrate into western lifestyles and values. There are fundamental differences between between the western way of life and the Muslim way of life, they prefer their own culture to the exclusion of all others, they demand their "rights" in a foreign country, but rarely respect the wishes of the indigenous population which in turn creates fear and suspicion. I am genuinely baffled, perplexed as to why a person with such diametrically opposed views to those of the host nation would want to live in that particular country ? Economic benefit maybe, or perhaps to destroy the hand that feeds them. I once listened to the words of a local Imam who proclaimed that one day every country would be a Muslim one, regardless of the wishes of its people, because the Muslim faith transcends all national boundaries and all other beliefs......so much for democracy!
The interpretation and perversion of Islam by some Muslim fundamentalist groups is both dangerous and frightening, i personally believe that how we deal with it is going to be right up there with climate change as the big issue that this planet has to deal with in the century ahead. Political will and unprecedented vision will be needed to ensure a world where all peoples and cultures can live together peacefully. Achievable, well, thats doubtful, impossible, no not impossible. Lets just hope and pray!

Christopher, an old clinical psychologist after having a few drinks said, "people do whatever in hell they want to" speaking from 30 years experience with those who need, must have, can't do without his council. You don't suppose we can explain what we see about us as simply people doing what they want to do?

One with a gun in his face will most likely "want to do" what the fellow holding the gun tells him to do. Reasonable?

Hell is a gun in the face. The fellow holding the gun is called a minister. What's the difference in a minister and a bank robber? Honesty about what one is doing?

Jesus Christ is the first jew and only jew I have known. So we will have to trust him in deciding what is heaven and hell.

"But as I look at the faces of the murderers, I feel certain that the death their souls tasted was the nightmare that became their eternity."

Dickey, what is interesting is that you "feel certain" of this nightmare for the suicide bombers. Your certainty of belief is because you have seen. You, Mr. Dickey, have been honored by God to be given sight to see a glimpse of the spiritual world that exists around us but can not be seen except though spiritual eyes. Many who see those same pictures only see the gruesome disfigured faces and might, if barbaric, even make fun or laugh. You see with spiritual eyes and are "certain" of things that others might laugh at. You see and thus you have been privileged to be given a momentary glimpse of the spiritual world around us. Take care, Mr. Dickey, and cherish this vision (albeit a dark vision) Thank you for sharing this with the rest of us. Wow, this nightmare of a vision from someone like yourself is very thought provoking.

Bertrand Russell....
We want to stand up on our own feet and look fair and square at the world-its good facts,its bad facts,its beauties.and its ugliness:see the world as it is and be not afraid of it.
Conquer the world by intelligence and not merely by being slavishly subdued by the terror that comes from it.
The whole conception of God is a conception derived from the ancient Oriental despotisms. It is a conception quite unworthy of free men. When you hear people in church debasing themselves and saying that they are miserable sinners,and all the rest of it,it seems contemptible and not worthy of self respecting human beings.

Mr Dickey
i couldn't even make it past the first incredibly stupid paragraph.
The fact that surprise was on the faces of the men who blew themselves,that you interpret as meaning that they were looking at heaven or hell,shows what religion has done to your brain.That is really,really outrageous.No wonder millions are losing respect for religious thinking.
What expression would expect them to have?????
Serenity? Tranquility? A smile maybe?
Get real.Bombs had just exploded in their guts.!

An interesting take on the subject, Mr. Dickey. I like it...

Emily Dickenson wrote this poem about Heaven:

What is — “Paradise”—
Who live there—
Are they “Farmers”—
Do they “hoe”—
Do they know that this is “Amherst”—
And that I—am coming—too—

Do they wear “new shoes”—in “Eden”—
Is it always pleasant—there—
Won’t they scold us—when we’re hungry—
Or tell God—how cross we are—

You are sure there’s such a person
As “a Father”—in the sky—
So if I get lost—there—ever—
Or do what the Nurse calls “die”—

I shant walk the “Jasper”—barefoot—
Ransomed folks—won’t laugh at me—
Maybe—“Eden” a’nt so lonesome
As New England used to be!

Mr. Christopher Dickey

Thank you for your interesting essay here on heaven and hell and terrorists. I had given it a pass until today and saw you refered to terrorists in my country of origin and country of adoption. As you know, they are members of Jemaah Islamiyah who had hope to force into being, a pan-Muslim state in mainly insular Southeast Asia covering Southern Thailand, Southern Philippines, Brunei, Indonesia and Malaysia. As if.

Terrorists who call themselves Muslims, and think they will automatically go to heaven for a single act of terrorism like 9/11, or Bali bombings are deluded in their beliefs, and warped in their actions.

If they really do know their Muslim belief (and not the special, particular and specific interpretations of Suras and Hadiths, or to create and accept fatwas by self-appointed clerical free-lancers), they should know that killing civilians is wrong and sinful; that no one go to heaven or hell based on a single, or a few specific acts in their life.

By Muslim belief, as you well know, the judgement is for the cummalative summation of acts and deeds in one's life. No credible Muslim cleric and members of the bona fide ulema would ever say who will go to heaven or hell, even for the most pious of believers, as the final judgement is by God and God alone.

It should not be surprising if some Muslims say the terrorists are not Muslims, as by their beliefs and acts, they are contrary to the traditional beliefs of Muslims on heaven and hell, war and peace. As you know, Muslim terrorists kill more Muslims than anyone of other faiths. What they could not persuade in a peaceful way and by democratic means in Indonesia and Malaysia, they try by acts of terrorism. They are certainly very, very deluded in believing what they believe in, and in the methods to attain their objective. It only revulsed Muslims who wants to live by their faith as it should be -for individual dignity, justice, peace and equity.

I would like to say that Indonesians and Malaysians are fearful of the terrorists in their midst. But rightly or wrongly, the terrorists are almost regarded as irritating mosquitos or ankle-biters. The history of both countries are replete with armed conflicts and acts of terrorism - from battles for independence to communist insurgencies to regional strifes to terrorists.

In the fight against terrorists, the governments of both countries also has not instituted any colour coded system of public warnings and/or alerts. Not to do so may be imprudent, but to do so would let the terrorists know they can intimidate governments and peoples into varying states of fear.