All Comments (27)

Did Benedict XVI ever manifest he was against dialogue? All the contrary. he wants Catholics to dialogue with other christians, but from our identity, not as if our identity was partially or deficiently unfounded.

That there are elements of truth in other Christian denominations does not mean that the Catholic Church lacks the specific elements found in these others.

Anonymous:

Everything you say about faith applies equally well to carnival pitch men selling tickets to see the crazy lady in the snake pit. The ones that have already seen her encourage other to look describing the awe of it all.

Faith is the necessary ingredient of the confidence scam. Those who have doubts feel a lot better when many others join them, get conned too. Do you have any doubts about faith? Do you feel better when you look around and see the church filled to capacity? Would you be there if you were the only one to ever come?

That is just it is doctrine not the word of God. Jesus did not create any new doctrine man did so who is really changeing the Word, the Gospels are stories of what the Lord did said church canon or doctrine is what man wrote down what they think the Lord said. If you want to preach the Word we can dance all day if you want to preach dotrine then dance by youself. Thats the problem today people take doctrine and replace the Real Word.
Remember when you assume, You make an ass of u and me. God Bless and Peace.Matthew

I find it interesting that you talk about chenging doctrine through dialog.

This is how the doctrine of god has slowly became the doctrine of man.

God's doctrine should be left alone and we should pray to understand it, not change it.

People forget all the nations of the earth had a chance to be Gods chosen people just the hebrews kept a very detail history of there doings and the kept his word. God keeps his word with those who keep theirs, whether you believe they were spoken by just men or divinely inspired men, For us christians Jesus keeps us on the path with God he did not come to destroy Faith, He came to give Faith to those who have none, He came to correct the Fathers word that was not being spoken right, Also if He was just a man ask yourself, if God came to you and said " If you give your Life to ME I will spare all mankind". Excuse my language but ask yourself do you have the balls to except that challenge.

Also if you actually do research for youselves and not take the word of just one or two sources. From all the sources I have studied, The conclusion I come to is this: Jesus just came to spread the Word of God everything else is of man.
Why, He did not want anything from anyone, He came to spread Peace and Love, no matter what way you try to spin it. Budha,Confucious,etc they where men and only claimed to be men and only produced acts of man, men made them religions. Jesus did not care about what man thought he only cared about what God his Father and now the Father to all of us, thought.
If we are to talk bad then talk bad about the men who wrote what we read, he did not write anything as far as history can prove, He came to set an example for all those willing to follow the correct way of how to live life, and nothing was ever forced by Him or the Father. Also all those who truly believe will find out in our ressurection, He just said do not fear death if you lead a good life and repent and correct your ways if you didn't. As the saying goes "it's hard to be humble". But remember "All things are possible with God, not man". God Bless and Peace allways.Matthew

correct me if I am wrong but jews claim to be from the tribe of judah, judaism is a religion based on the tribes faith. Hebrews the chosen people of God are the correct people and not a religion.

Mary Cunningham, a few definitions posted in Comments are definitely helpful for those who don't bother to look them up for themselves, so thanks for that!
Though it is easy to find great fault with some of the regrettable actions of the Church, going back to its very foundation, its suppression of competing "heretical" sects, etc., the fact remains that the Church is the direct descendant of the Apostles, who were the people specifically chosen by Jesus Himself to learn and spread the Word. It is no accident or coincidence that a few short years of non-violent, non-military, non-coercive ministry in a tiny corner of the world by the Son of God, speaking in Aramaic, has resulted in a faith lasting thousands of years in billions of people. Branches may shoot off in different directions and for different lengths of time and influence, but the Church is the trunk of the tree that sprang from the seed that was planted by God in the form of Jesus of Nazareth.
There. I said it. Hope that settles the matter, as I'm sure it will!

Professor Gillis,

Thank you for your post, which IMO was not difficult to understand. But this is not primarily a Catholic audience and the additions of a few definitions might be helpful.

Ecclesiology: study of the history and theology of the Christian Church

Magisterium:the authority of the Catholic Church to teach religious doctrine

Protestants of the Reformation denied the Magisterium and this Catholic is not sure with what they replaced it. (I have doubts that *they* know,Scripture they would say, but who judges the Scripture?)

This is why dialogue is possible with the heirs of the Reformation (all those tens of thousands of different churches all saying different things!) but unity is not. If the Catholic Church is 'supreme' in anything, it is in its heroic struggle to maintain some semblance of integrity and unity during the long dissolution of Christianity.

That's of course, apart from what your non-religions had to say about some nefarious danger that kids might learn some 'real magic' from Harry Potter books, as some Satanic conspiracy to crack reality in half or something.

Just to put that in perspective, particularly in terms of world religions and armed conflict and all that, ... you realize, you're freaked out about kids learning how to break the laws of physics from childrens' books, and, you know, by and large,

Admittedly with some well-documented reservations, we still more or less trust you guys with *guns.*

And bombs, and... Well.

See what I mean, here?

(I mean, cause, I don't know if you remember, just a couple weeks ago, here, a lot of monotheist types were insisting that my people shouldn't have equal treatment under American law for not being 'real religions,' and all...

Now that we've sorted that out, I'm sure the bureaucracy on said treatment will sort right out.

Right?)

Great. I knew you'd get right on that. :)

So that's what all the shooting's about.

But if you guys aren't religions, after all,

Can I have my civil rights, now? :)

To Come now and the rest of humanity: Actually the Jews are not a race or a religion but a people, the chosen people, chosen by God and formed by God to make this place safe enough with enough people that were obedient out of love to take care of God Incarnate so that He would be able to grow up and do what He was created for, yes two natures, one created one not created, one person, since He is True God and True Man, but like it says He emptied Himself to become one of us and all that He kept of His Godnessity was the essence of God which is Love. God gave us all free will and He also came up with a Plan to save ALL OF HUMANITY whether we like it or not. Actually being a christian is carrying on the work begun by Jesus in whatever you have been called or chosen to do. Jesus was a Jew when He walked this earth and He was a Good Jew but He saw thru all of the man-made rules that were just more chains put on them by the religious people. It is not about religion, it is about God, Christianity is not a religion and Judaism is not a religion either. I really feel sorry for the people out there that have no idea what christianity is about but nevertheless call themselves christians. Jesus did His part, we are called to do our part whatever it is. There will not be a tie, satan's rule will be totally crushed as it says, "I will put enmity between you and the woman" and that woman is Mary and she not only gave her YES but she lived it. The message from this messenger is God wins, satan loses, a tie is unacceptable. I did not ask to be the New Testament Moses but I have said Yes. Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

Oh yeah, the pope spoke
and
his holy words need parsing.

Jews are both an ethnicity and members of a religion. There are plenty of ethnic and non-religious Jews out there.

Maybe we should have a contest. All of you guys, give us your nicest word for *anyone* outside your faith group.

Surely there's some out there big enough for a few compliments, ...brave keepers of your ancestors' ways, seekers after transcendent kindness, singers from high parapets.

One thing all this division about who has the 'true way' does to you guys is, while you're going after the vicarious crowns, ...You're so busy defending the "who" that you don't know *what* you've *got,* that you could be using for the good.

Look at the hurt that comes of this stuff.

This is not all you are.

Unless you let it be.

Jews can do better than "Goy" to slander gentiles.

Maybe we should have a contest. Give us a word, your best racial slur for non Jews. (Jews are a race and not a religion?)

Most of the breakup Christianity can be laid at the foot of the Church of Peter and was foretold at the Last Supper when Jesus said to Peter, Simon, Simon! Remember that Satan has asked for you, to sift you all like wheat. The Church bears a heavy responsibility to bring us all back together again, and not set us apart by some unnecessary pronouncement that has a tendency to divide.

I find it difficult to believe the Church could be so unaware of what the soundbytes about these edicts will say to the non-theologians among them.

The Bible is NOT a hoax.

http://www.hoax-buster.org/sellyoursoul is wrong. That was not the sun Moses spoke to. There really was a supernatural being in the ball of fire. And that being really is the Father of Jesus.

Do not believe the Bible is bogus. That was Lucifer in the fire. He was put there by bad angels who didn't want him to win the election for God in heaven. As soon as enough people are led to hell He will again attack heaven and this time He will win!!! Keep the faith whatever you do or you will be shut out.

When Lucifer defeats the forces of evil now in charge of heaven, the one known as God, then Lucifer will declare Himself to be God. Then we can say the Bible is God's word for real.

Keep the faith. Lucifer rewards those who do His will with the treasure of earth. Now take the millions raked in by TV ministers spreading His word for example. They have/had $660,000,000.00 to pay out in LA and that was just petty cash. Pray and work hard and Lucifer will reward you. That's God of course, the being in the ball of fire that Moses made the deal with that will reward you,, you'll get your reward in heaven just as soon as Lucifer attacks and wins. Onward Christian soldiers, you can defeat Michael and those bad angels this time. Got faith?

"We will establish ourselves in Palestine whether you like it or not...You can hasten our arrival or you can equally retard it. It is however better for you to help us so as to avoid our constructive powers being turned into a destructive power which will overthrow the world."
Chaim Weizmann
"Judische Rundschau" No. 4, 1920

“… we Jews, the destroyers, will remain the destroyer forever … nothing that the Gentiles will do will meet our needs and demands.” Mr. Maurice Samuel, Jewish writer.

Think stupid goy,..think!

The Rothschild family is definitely Jewish,
and madame Rothschild herself once said,...

"if my sons didn’t want wars, there would be no wars,"

You are all too stupid to see, I just know it.

"We shall drive the Christians into war by exploiting
their national vanity and stupidity. They will then massacre
each other, thus giving room for our own people."
(Rabbi Reichorn, July 1, 1880)

"By using the new atheist exile politics they [the Zionists] provoked and increased anti-Semitism in Europe which led to the Second world War. . . The worldwide boycott against Germany in 1933 and the later all-out declaration of war against Germany, initiated by the Zionist leaders and the World Jewish Congress. . . " -- Rabbi Schwartz, New York Times, Sept. 30, 1997

I'm sure the stupid goy among you will mark it all off as merely "anti-semitic", but of course the stupid always stereo type, refusing truth and blind to the facts.

Stupid goy.

"The Talmud is, then, the written form of that which in the time of Jesus, was called the Traditions of the Elders." — Rabbi Michael L. Rodkinson

"The Jewish religion as it is today traces its descent, without a break, through all the centuries, from the Pharisees." — Universal Jewish Encyclopedia

Thank you, Dr. Gillis. Though I cannot quite understand why you have taken the time to post your interpretation of Vatican comments at this site, given the typical array of non-productive discourse that has been entered in response, I just thought you should be aware that there are many who read this forum without commenting and who are perfectly able to follow your thought process to its logical conclusion, whether we agree or disagree. The perspective of a Catholic theologian at Georgetown is one that I am grateful to have!

This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come. For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good, Traitors, heady, high-minded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God; Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away. 2Timonthy 3:1-5

However, in recent months, that has begun to change. For a start, racism against Arabs in Israel is rising, according to at least one recent poll. In a survey for the Centre Against Racism, a poll of Jewish Israelis found that more than half believed it was treason for a Jewish woman to marry an Arab man; 40% said Arabs should no longer have the right to vote in parliamentary elections; and 75% opposed apartment blocks being shared by Jews and Arabs.

"The Hebrew form of the name Jesus--Yeshu--was interpreted as an acronym for the curse 'may his name and memory be wiped out,' which is used as an extreme form of abuse. In fact, anti-zionist Orthodox Jews (such as Neturei Karta) sometimes refer to Herzel as "Herzl Jesus' and I have found in religious zionist writings expressions such as 'Nasser Jesus' and more recently 'Arafat Jesus.'" (Israel Shahak, Jewish History Jewish Religion)

I don't know about the professor's theology, but I would say that he is quite a dialectician, or maybe a lawyer. I got lost along the way.

Sincerely

R M Kraus
Akron

That was a whole lot of discourse for so little being said!

You should consider running for the Senate!

I agree that the Church should seek out commonalities with the other Abrahamic Faiths! The fundementals of our Religion did originate with the Hebrews after all! They are tied to the Caballistic System that most Catholics are ignorant of!
However, I feel the Catholic Church has NOTHING to learn from Anglicans, or Mormons or any other re-created Religion!
How can you have an intelligent discussion with a full grown man who honestly believes in an actual Adam and Eve? Or that ridiculous hogwash about them living 6,000 years ago?
Having attended private Catholic High School, I was educated about the FACT that the Israelites were imprisoned, and had their Religion denied to them by the Egyptians! That much like the Bohemiens, the Israelis created the stories to teach issues of Morality under the ignorant watching eyes of their Egyptian Masters!
There is much Catholics can learn from Hindus, and even Mecca-if they would ever allow it! But, unfortunately, I have no time to waste trying to straighten out a Haggard type Evangelical about the fact that Noah never actually built a frigging Ark! That the Story is about family Relations!

Some people can't handle the Truth!

Google Yod-He-Vau-He, and begin at the beginning!

Professor, let me agree and ask a simple question.

You said, "In other words, theologians take note and correct your errant ways (perhaps before the CDF takes corrective action). This warning being noted, both Protestant and Catholic theologians call for dialogue as most theologians believe that history and the interconnectedness of today’s world makes dialogue not only desirable but necessary. However, the agreement that dialogue is necessary does not preclude dialogue partners from maintaining their own beliefs. In fact, religious convictions are a prerequisite for dialogue. One must come to the dialogue with specific convictions which, while they may be subject to revision via the dialogue process, are foundational. Differences must be acknowledged and taken seriously. The process by which one determines similarities and genuine differences must be a careful one so that simple misunderstandings are not labeled as differences and so that the temptation to overlook differences simply in order to claim harmony is avoided."

Does the "religious conviction" expressed at http://www.hoax-buster.org/wellyoursoul qualify as a "dialogue partner" or will the CDF need to take action?

Perhaps you can verify that those pictures at that scandalous web site are truly "authenticated by the Roman Catholic Church" or deny same? Are you still using Lucifer as the Lord of hell or has Satan taken over, "gradually" the way evolution works? On another page at that distressing site there is a picture of Satan giving the lie detector test and recording sins on the dead person's soul. Is that a legitimate version of a "religious conviction" that also qualifies for "dialogue partner"?

Let me agree whole heartedly with you and his holiness the pope that "errant ways" need to be corrected.

Thank you in advance for your enlighten guidance.

Professor Gillis,

I rarely double-post, but your essay's content is very much like that of Bishop Mark Sisk's, so I'm taking the liberty of posting my comment to his essay here:

Wow, Bishop Sisk!

Benedict XVI has really conned you!

There is nothing in his pronouncement that is moderate, inviting, or aimed to promote cordial and fruitful discussions with other Christian churches.

The successor to the Grand Inquisitor remains just that. Domingo de Guzmán Garcés would be proud of him.

It seems to me that the Pope's statement, and the various responses to it, are just disputations on how many angels can stand on the head of a pin.

Meanwhile, the world is as it is, largely a slaughterhouse and a perpetual Treblinka.