Readers’ Responses to Our Question (346)

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apubk knrmtjby ktrepgv nmuwrlk wfdpo kiosce qazeirj

apubk knrmtjby ktrepgv nmuwrlk wfdpo kiosce qazeirj

apubk knrmtjby ktrepgv nmuwrlk wfdpo kiosce qazeirj

At Ease Sargent! And those of you. I have never had a problem with my Christian, Jewish or Muslim
Soldiers beliefs. None of them had a problem with
their Pagan Sargent. I was respected for my military
abilities by by my Superiors and Subordinates alike.
Pity we can't forgo ignorance and learn from each other. But then, as Ron White said, "You can't fix stupid."

Oops! Sorry CTCL, I have dislexia. I confused you with CONCERNED AMERICAN.

Hi Victoria,

How goes the Ramadan observance?

We love you Baby.

Hi Victoria,

How goes the Ramadan observance?

We love you Baby.

CTCL,

I should have added this to the previous post:

How do you reconcile the following with your constant attacks on my friend Victoria?

All religions need to learn to respect each other. (like that will ever happen). Just like people on this message board need to respect each other. Knowledge is power and it seems a lot of people are powerless because they are spouting slander without knowing a thing.

CTCL,

I find your thoughts on religious tolerance and separation of church and state most refreshing. I disagree with your politics, but so what?

Live long and prosper.

Yes, I would vote for a Pagan for public office, if he or she had a platform/programme that I felt I could support.

It really is that simple. I vote for a candidate who shares my political views, not my religion.

Yes, I would vote for a Pagan for public office, if he or she had a platform/programme that I felt I could support.

It really is that simple. I vote for a candidate who shares my political views, not my religion.

Yes, I would vote for a Pagan for public office, if he or she had a platform/programme that I felt I could support.

It really is that simple. I vote for a candidate who shares my political views, not my religion.

Religon: "Devoting to a religious faith." Religous: "Relating or devoted to an acknoledged ultimate reality or deity."
Point being Paganism is a religion because most Pagans believe in a deity(ies) of some sort or in the sacredness of nature as a source of spiritual energy (Gaia).
Next point when will we finally seperate church and state. It doesn't look sperated to me! Bikering over what religon the chaplain is! All religions need to learn to respect each other. (like that will ever happen). Just like people on this messege board need to respect each other. Knowledge is power and it seems alot of people are powerless because they are spouting slander without knowing a thing. Look it up. Paganism is a religon. Actually the WaPo should be calling it NeoPaganism because it is the old Pagan ways revived with certin staples holding it together. We did out with the eating babies and such if people cared to look insted of slander.
Most of all I just want to say I'm a Pagan and I believe Jesus existed and he seems like a nice guy and had some good stuff to say, love each other and stuff. I have nothing agaist todays Christans, I'm friends with some. So slanderers think WWJD? He probably would look at some of these comments and think not cool.

We must allow for all faiths to have representation. I also appreciate the focus of some on the board on the rights of Christians. Our rights are coming under attack. We Christians must also support the rights of those of other religions the freedoms that we have so that we don't risk losing our own.

Since this question is about Pagans and their place in U.S. military and political life, there really isn't a point in bringing up Christianity at all. It will be a good thing when we can discuss issues in contemporary Paganism (Wicca, Druidic, Asatru, Feri, Thelemite or otherwise) without having to bring in other religions into the discussion. This topic can stand alone.

I WOULD LOVE TO HAVE ALL OF OUR FUTURE PRESIDENTS TO HAVE "CHRISTIANITY" ON THEIR SIDE WHILE IN THE OVAL HOUSE. HOWEVER, THIS WILL "NEVER" BE THE CASE! LOOK WHERE WE ARE NOW WITH SOMEONE IN OFFICE HALF-STEPPIN' CHRISTIAN BELIEFS, AND I HONESTLY DO BELIEVE THAT AT THIS POINT IN TIME, "BOZO the CLOWN" COULD BETTER CONTRIBUTE TO OUR COUNTRY. BECAUSE I AM A BELIEVER OF RELIGION AND HOW WE ALL GOT HERE, NOTHING WOULD PLEASE ME MORE THAN TO KEEPING THE "TRADITION" OF HAVING RELIGIOUS BELIEVERS AS LEADERS. WHAT I WOULD LIKE TO SEE DONE IS HAVING A LEADER DO HIS OR HER JOB FOR "ALL' THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, AND SEEING TO IT THAT NO CHILD GOES TO BED HUNGRY, ALL CHILDREN ARE TO BE EDUCATED "FULLY", ALL PEOPLE TO HAVING BETTER HOUSING INSTEAD OF PROJECT LIVING, AND FOR THOSE WHO CAN WORK, GET THEM OUT THERE, AND MORE RESONABLE HEALTHCARE COVERAGE FOR THE WORKING WORLD AND SENIOR CITIZENS. HAD THE FIRST PRESIDENT OF THE US of A BEGAN THIS TREND OF IMPORTANCE AND NOT BE SELFISH BY ENSLAVING PEOPLE FOR THEIR OWN SELFISH GRATIFICATIONS, WE THE PEOPLE WOULD PROBABLY BE GETTING ALONG FAR BETTER THAN NOW. NOT TO MENTION, THE PROBLEMS WOULD BE FEWER. WE WILL NEVER KNOW THIS FOR CERTAIN NOW, WILL WE! BECAUSE I HAVE BELIEFS OF THE RELIGIOUS KIND, IT WOULD BE HARD FOR ME TO VOTE FOR ANYONE OTHER THAN WHAT I BELIEVE. IF I WASN'T MADE AWARE OF THIS FACT, AND THE PERSON WAS IMPRESSING ME WITH THEIR POLITICS, AND THE VIBE I FELT FOR THAT PERSON WAS ON POINT, YES, I WOULD VOTE FOR A NON-BELIEVER. GOD HAS BEEN SO VERY GOOD TO US, AND MANY OF US CANNOT SEE THIS BECAUSE OF MANY UNFORTUNATE INCIDENTS, SITUATIONS, AND DISAPPOINTMENTS HAVE CLOUDED OUR VIEW. I WAS THERE TOO! ANGRY AND DEPRESSED BECAUSE OF THE LOSS OF MY MOTHER AND FATHER, AND MY SISTER. THEN ILLNESS INVITED ITSELF INTO MY WORLD AS WELL. I KNOW THAT THIS IS THE WAY OF THE WORLD, AND I HAVE FOUND A BETTER WAY OF COPING WITH THESE ORDEALS. THERE'S TOO MUCH OF OUR NOT HELPING ONE ANOTHER IN THE WORLD, AND WE NEED TO BETTER HELP OUR FELLOW MAN AND WOMAN, AND NOT JUST IN OUR "PROFESSIONAL LIVES, BUT AS NEIGHBORS. FOR THOSE OF YOU WHO PRACTICE WHAT WAS TAUGHT TO YOU OR WHAT YOU'D TAUGHT YOURSELF TO DOING, I AM THANKING YOU KINDLY, AND PLEASE CONTINUE THE CONTRIBUTION YOU'VE MADE TOWARDS YOUR FELLOW MAN, WOMAN, OR A FAMILY. IF YOU ARE ONE WHO TAKES ADVANTAGE OF THE SYSTEM, YOUR FAMILY MEMBERS, AND OTHERS, WELL, HAVE I SOME NEWS FOR YOU!! K H A R M A IS GOING TO COME BACK AND PUT A FROWN ON YOUR FACE YOU'LL NEVER BE ABLE TO REMOVE!! I'M OUT!! GOD BLESS US ALL!! ROZKJ*

As far as I can see, the only reason to deny Pagan chaplains is to deny others their freedom of religion.

Why not have pagan chaplains?

I'm following with interest the discussion here from teh other side of teh atlantic.
I served in teh British Army and now I am a Corrections officer. This has given me 2 perspectives on religion in instituations.
a) In teh army we were free to go to services if we wanted to. Major events like remembereance Day (veterens day) normally included a christian prayer because we are predominatly a Christian country in the UK. However in my unit there was jews Muslims , Hindus and a Pagan. None of them really had a problem with this as it was part of a military parade and did not involve evangilising.
b) In prisons in teh UK we have many different denominations chaplains. All take care of eth welfare and emmotional health of prisoners. Ther eis no requirment that only a Catholic Chaplian listerns to teh problems of a Catholic prisoner. Normally a duty Chaplain will attend a prisoner and then put him in touch with a chaplian of his own faith.
It appears that in the USA where secularism is enshrined in the constituation and religious freedom is teh law, this is more of a hot patatoe than in the UK where we have no such guarantees. Despite this there is very little religious friction here and religion rarely enters teh public domain.
I must thank Sergeant and Alice for one thing, there comments have inspired me to find out more about paganism as I jhave felt myself attracted to it for some time now. any fiath tha tcould inspire such bigoted outbursts from people must have something going for it.

Lady Victoria!

Doing catch-up here, and just read your post about Solon's 10 commandments. What a revelation! Really good, I have saved a copy. My compliments!

The responses have amazed and saddened me. I am a practicing Christian, but am dismayed at how many so-called Christians howl about the Mosaic 10 Commandments, but do not read the Gospels. The ten were replaced by Jesus - the Two Great Commandments, the heart and soul of Christianity:

"You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your mind. 38 This is the great and first commandment. 39 And a second is like it, You shall love your neighbor as yourself. 40 On these two commandments depend all the law and the prophets." - Matthew 22

Thank you Mary, yes I was being facetious. Surely no one thought I was being serious about the cannabalism???

I was simply trying to point out that what someone outside a religion might say about that religion's practices should be taken with a grain of salt.

JDS

NARROW Minded idiot. I know that this will be a but of brow beating, but how can you say that Pagans worship a dead god, If you talking about jesus, the only one that I have heard of alive are hispanics, and as far as a dead god. Pagans are a comglomorit of multiple religions being classified together, But in the past back in dark ages, most of Europe were pagan and their rituals of halloween, thanksgiving, and other ones were based on seasonal changes, harvests and the preparing for winter. Oh yea centuries before the roman catholic legion, uh church.

yes this is probably the few violant posts from a non-beliver

Rose this is a few days late but I just found this blog. If you have never served or been to a military function or meet a chaplin then you have no right to talk about the military system. A. I'm an Atheist, but the military chaplins are not pagan, out of the total military service there are only 2 Jewish, about 3 Muslim/Islamic, and now I guess 1 Pagan. But there are over 50 different recognized religions by the Dep. of Army and Vet Affairs. So before you go off half cocked about the military is Pagan, we are more a relistic cros section of society than some would belive. And for those screaming about evangelizing, the chaplins in the military are not here to do that, how ever there are many in command positions that do attempt to force thier "proper" religions on thier unit, sorry religious right that is not allowed in the Army.

I want to sincerely thank everyone who made a post recognizing a Christian's right (and need) to evangelize. I am really encouraged that we might be able to have serious dialog on these issues.
Thanks!

John M:
Yes, you have the right to evengelize, but only when the evangelee has the option of walking away.
In the case of chaplains evangelizing non-Christians at military schools, the target doesn't really have the option of turning his back on an authority figure and walking away. And if a chaplain who is also a superior officer is evangelizing lower-ranked soldiers, they don't have the option of turning their backs and walking away either.

In addition, you do not have the right to trespass on private property in order to evangelize. That means that when JW's or Mormons come knocking on MY door wanting to tell me how I'm worshipping wrong, they are violating MY right to privacy, and MY right to freedom of religion. And when I tell them I'm not interested in their literature, and they eave it in my mailbox, they should know that putting anything other than US mail in a mailbox is a federal offense, and that I will report it as such. If I say I don't want it, don't stick it in my mailbox.

I have had aggressive evangelists grab me when I refused the literature thrust at me - legally, that's both assault and battery.
I have had door-to-door evangelists stick a foot in the doorway when I tried to close the door after telling them I didn't want their literature. Legally, that's home invasion.

I've even tried pointing to my altar and telling them that I will listen to them tell me about their religion if they will, in turn let me tell them about mine. Thus far, I have had no takers.

Now, when I see through the peephole that it's them, I just answer the door skyclad.

Christians and Muslims in historic meeting at the Egyptian Embassy in Washington DC.

knock knock -anybody home?

Well, no word yet from Alice and Sergeant. Still, I'm hopeful that they are searching through their bibles and will soon post a list of verses that support their treatment of Pagans here in this discussion.

Any other Christian reading here who supports Alice and Sergeant could post such a list. Of course Christians who don't support their views of Pagans could speak up too.

I am sure John M. would not be intimated. As no one with conviction would be. I am not bothered with true Christian loving faith as
I am with people who say:" just pretend you believe."

Please, if Jesus was anything i'm sure he could read your heart.

Most people can, especially those with limited education who have plently of time to think. Alice, i would like to,again, address your concern about kindergarten. It is true there are many people who lack higher education.

Are they less than you? Do you think all your knowledge amounts to anything you carry with you when you die? All your knowlege is in regards to this world. When you die all you carry with you is who you really are. no memory of this world. Do you know who you are? or has education clouded your vision.

John M:
I see your point- especially when it comes to chaplains evangelizing to the willing. However, I don't think my argument breaks down with atheism. I may be wrong- hasn't been the first time- but I think it's a valid point. As far as atheism not being a belief system that tells adherents to spread the truth- I think that's hardly the point. If I think that you are wrong, then it doesn't matter to me that you think your deity wants you to spread whatever knowledge you deem truthful. And that goes both ways- I'm fairly confident that you really don't care about the Hindu talking points of does and don'ts, for instance. My intent was to pose a question ( I don't necessarily think that I have a wholesale monopoly on what is 'correct')- how would you as a Christian feel if, say at work, someone approached you and started professing a 'truth' that you thought was threatening? Or irrelevant? I'm not trying to be malicious, I'm just trying to flip your perspective. Would you merely laugh, shake your head and say "those guys..." or would you start to get irritated after a while, and feel imposed upon?

John M - how about having a a government-sponsored scientist [maybe Dawkins himself] who lovingly and respectfully shares the God Delusion with those willing to listen?

Scott:
Your argument breaks down with respect to Atheism/Agnosticism because they are not organized groups. Neither is a belief system. Neither has a teaching that tells adherants to spread the truth. Of course, you are free to tell me why you don't believe. I think that's part of your freedom.

I liked Viejita's response. It was very compassionate.

I guess the questionable part involves the government PAYING these chaplains. But, religious freedoms ought to apply anywhere, even at work, even if your employer is Uncle Sam. I think we get a little crazy with the whole Separation of Church and State thing. Having a government-sponsored chaplain who lovingly and respectfully shares the gospel with those willing to listen is not the same as the U.S. Military making recruits watch the "Jesus movie" or attend mandatory Bible classes.

John M wrote:
**So, what does it mean to have religious freedom in this country? If that freedom is limited to believing what I believe in private and expressing my faith only at church, that is really not freedom at all. Freedom to practice my Christian faith must allow me the freedom to evangelize.**

Is this like religious spam? I'm not trying to be mean here, but claiming that you have the right to evangelize- in any setting- because that's part of the calling, and that Christian military chaplains should have every opportunity to approach a non-christian for such purposes seems a little carte blanche to me.

Would I then get as much traction out of the argument if I hung out at a church and passed out free copies of "The God Delusion"? Or, more to the point- would an officer in the Marine Corps be able to approach a company full of marines and offer a study group on what it means to be agnostic or atheist, just like military chaplains get to advertise bible studies to a company full of marines? Maybe, the military can often be more progressive than the rest of the nation- but what would happen if that information got out to the civilian world? Would there be an outcry that religion was being persecuted? I remember reading that several years ago Ft. Hood let a group of Wicca's use a chapel on base for their services. The Souther Baptists found out about it and all hell broke loose. I'm not trying to be snide, I'm merely posing a question- how are your Christian sensibilities provoked if, in the market place of opposing beliefs, everyone gets to 'evangelize'.

John M.
You have articulated very well the problem chaplains may encounter when trying to counsel individuals of faiths other than their own. To use Christianity as an example:
I totally sympathize with the honest Christian feeling -- no, it is stronger than a feeling, it is a conviction -- that Jesus could so easily solve people's problems if they would only let Him. But our government does not pay anyone to "correct" the religious views of others. It is a dilemma, but the most effective chaplains have learned to deal with it without breaking the law.

It is human nature that people are willing to believe anything. And it doesn't make a whisker's difference what one believes. Beliefs are not facts, and beliefs change no facts.
It is also human nature for people to enjoy disagreeing about their beliefs. So humorous.

Lepidopteryx :

I wrote:
"Is anyone aware that activists are lobbying hard right now to prevent Christian chaplains from mentioning 'Jesus'? What do those of you who think you are tolerant have to say about that?"

You responded:
"Are you referring to prohibiting the mention of Jesus in sermons during formal worship services, or are you referring to prohibiting evangelism directed at non-Christians outside of services?
It would be ridiculous to prohibit the mention of Jesus during an actual worship service, but I have also heard stories of chaplains attempting to convert others outside of services, and that should not be allowed."

I think what you wrote is a very common non-Christian thought. But, I would like to ask what exactly we mean by religious tolerance and religious freedom. I don't think tolerating someone's beliefs is limited to respecting their right to believe what they believe. True tolerance requires taking the time to learn what the other believes.

If non-Christians were to do that, they would learn that Christians believe Jesus left them with the directive to spread the Gospel all over the world. Following Jesus means telling people about Him. There's no way around that.

So, what does it mean to have religious freedom in this country? If that freedom is limited to believing what I believe in private and expressing my faith only at church, that is really not freedom at all. Freedom to practice my Christian faith must allow me the freedom to evangelize.

I know this is not popular, but a Christian will never be truly free unless they are allowed to openly share Jesus with those around them.

You can walk away, but it is not right to tell me to stop.

I'd like to clarify that a Christian is misguided if they are forceful, obnoxious, judgmental, or any other adjective that would not describe Jesus. To speak my faith in love includes knowing when to let the other walk away.

Recent Anonymous:

Being atheist myself, I couldn't care less what the Pope says. My point is that a few Christians on is forum have tried pigeon hole the various Pagan beliefs into their own narrow understanding- meanwhile it would look to an outsider that Christians can't even get their own story straight. Now, having once been Christian, I understand all of the subtitles, games, and rationalizations for the various denominations and the myriad interpretations of the eucharist- that doesn't mean that it makes any more sense, or that the eucharist in general wouldn't seem a rather silly concept to any other religion.

wdyx vfzwjleau gojvxdr cjqiym wjivnkrz wlrgupys twxfc

wdyx vfzwjleau gojvxdr cjqiym wjivnkrz wlrgupys twxfc

Oh Bitner was being facetious.

Bitner,

The Trinity is not polytheistic. You obviously do not have an understanding of what the doctrine of the Trinity is. I am not catholic, but yet the Trinity doctrine is biblically correct.

Scott,

I'm not sure why any true Christian would care what the pope says about who is Christian or not. He's not the head of the church. Jesus is. He's not God, so who is he to judge? If God is never changing (Malachi 6) then why does the pope keep changing what the so called (only true church) does concerning doctrine and worship? Hence, most recently, latin mass and limbo?? C'mon now pope get it together!!

As a word of advice for any Christian. Read the Bible to see if what the pope says is biblical. Go from there.

Scott - don't worry about what the Pope says -- They've been saying that kind of stuff for centuries. Nobody pays much attention anymore

While some of the Christians are ganging up on the Pagans, lets throw this into the mix: The Pope just said that if you're a Protestant then you're not really a part of the church- not really a Christian. He wants the sandbox to himself.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/6289014.stm

I wonder which dictionary he was using?

Alice,
You have no idea what you are talking about. And apparently, you are content to remain in ignorance. I wonder how you would like it if the shoe was on the other foot?

Christians are Polytheists, because they believe in the Trinity. They are also Cannabalists, because they eat their God. Their Priests are all pedophiles, and they themselves are idol worshipers (the idols in question being the Bible the Saints, the Virgin Mary and the Pope). I've also heard that they drink the blood of babies (hmmm...maybe that's why they are against contraceptives and abortion?).

People have said all these things and more, but that doesn't make it true. You repeating what you have heard without bothering to find out from a Pagan if it is indeed true is akin to the detractors of Christianity who do the same thing.

Ask yourself, WWJD?

Alice,

Don't feel bad. The point of discussion is to help us grow. We either change our thoughts or our thoughts are strengthened. Come on, which is it?

Alice and Sergeant - I see you've been here a lot since I last posted, but haven't addressed my question yet.

Please do. Here it is again:

"Are you Christian? If so, which of Jesus' teachings are you applying the comments you've made here about Pagans?"

Thanks

Alice: **The end result of your reasoning is the same as saying: a Pagan should be allowed to say Mass to Catholics.
The Last Rites and The Mass are both Sacraments.**

That's not what I meant. I was simply pointing out to ALice that her idea of a Pagan chaplain having everyone run to the nearest tree and bow to it as a way of responding to a death in the ranks was ridiculous. I wuld hope that there would be a spiritual counsellor for the fallen soldier, whatever his faith who could handle such affairs in the manner the soldier would have preferred. It has been my experience that a Pagan would be more likely to participate in a Christian ritual for the sake of another than the other way around.

However, if there was not a Catholic chaplain available, and a soldier wished to take Communion or needed Last Rites, then I would say that a Pagan priest or priestess would be better than nothing at all. Surely your deity would understand.

Jim & Alice & Sargent: I cannot figure out what you are saying or asking. Perhaps you should try a milder approach.

Alice,

If you remove the parts Christianity, you are not a Christian. I have heard priests say, If you don't believe this stuff you don't belong.

Sergeant,

What ever happened to "the world will not end"

I have news for eveyone: The physical is not what what you think it is. It is merely a reflection of all the problems in this world. If we can fix all the problems, through science and compassion. The world will take care of itself.

The levels of existance all include this world. And at the top level everything is perfect, Always a sunny day.

Alice,

You REALLY don't want me to go that route. Do you? Trust me on this. I've got *far* more books on Paganism that includes but are not limited to rituals, ethics, rites of passage, mythologies, cultural differences, interfaith ideas, raising kids, stages of life, etc. than ANY that you can name that are written based on your so called 'definition'.

Please stop. You're only embarrassing yourself. I can provide you with titles if you wish, but I'm pretty sure you don't want me to do that. Besides, you're the one who seems to think that you need a 'book' to have a religion in the first place.

I read for ideas, take what works for me and leave the rest. It's all about experience. And love.

Mary;
What you were writing is still Buddhism even if you subtracted the elements you mentioned.

Mary;
Another saying comes to mind "We must all agree or the world will tumble to the sea."

Seargant:

LoL- That's pretty funny. I like that. :) Never said I'm not worried about the way we're so good at trashing the planet- but he just doesn't do it for me.

Alice: Also, and far more importantly to this thread, Paganism is legally recognized in the United States, and Wiccan Soldiers only recently completed a 10 year quest for a pentacle on their VA issued gravestones. As do many other branches of Paganism. Pagans are only requesting from the government what is taken for granted by others.

Priver, every single book that has been written about Paganism is based on that definition. You can check them out.

Priver, every single book that has been written about Paganism is based on that definition.

Sergeant,

Even if we do love the earth, we do not all agree on how to save it.

Priver; What you wrote down brings to my mind another saying, "He who loveth not Al Gore, loveth not the earth."

Um.. no, actually, it's not.

Would you let someone else tell you what you believe? I doubt it. Dictionaries, even if you got it from one, can be wrong. Written by.. people. Definitions can change over time, as do words.

Priver, like it or not, the definition I gave is the definition of your "religion".

Alice,

No I am not talking about Budism. Buda's believe in bopping someone in the head if they get something wrong. They also believe in no attachments. And they believe that meditation should be your life's pursuit. They also believe that an enlightened women will go to a planet full of babies. And they believe that magic can break the cycle that you are in.

I don't believe any of that.

As I think was mentioned in an much earlier blog, all religions have a bit of truth in them.

Mary, your criticizing the basic definition of Paganism.
But what you've been writing about all this time isn't about Paganism.
What you keep talking about is really Buddhism.

Alice,

The 'definition' you gave has nothing to do with Paganism as a religion. And yes, it is a religion. With ceremonies, rituals for all occasions, rites of passage, very strong ethics and everything.

Check your etymology.
The root of 'paganus' (Latin) refers to 'country dweller'. That's it. You have added something about hedonism (which makes me laugh, given the fact that some people call me a fuddy duddy for the way I am- at a young age, too!) and Heathen, which is supposed to be used in some sort of derogatory fashion, but is actually one of many differing branches that Paganism falls under.

There is much we can learn from each other, if only you'd take the time to actually ask and stop criticizing people not like yourself.

Seargant: Al Gore has nothing to do with me. Sorry to disappoint you. I celebrate the seasons changing. The beauty and diversity of all life on this planet. I wanted to take care of the Earth long before he showed up.

E Favorite: I was wondering the same thing myself.

Priver, I don't have to ask around.
I already know what the "beautiful" minds will say!

Alice,

Your ideas about forgiveness come from your religion, not ours. And the deffinition you gave for Paganism comes from the dictionary, a very generic source.

John M. : "Here's a related question...
Is anyone aware that activists are lobbying hard right now to prevent Christian chaplains from mentioning 'Jesus'? What do those of you who think you are tolerant have to say about that?"

Are you referring to prohibiting the mention of Jesus in sermons during formal worship services, or are you referring to prohibiting evangelism directed at non-Christians outside of services.

It would be ridiculous to prohibit the mention of Jesus during an actual worship service, but I have also heard stories of chaplains attempting to convert others outside of services, and that should not be allowed.

I think the teaching that comes to my mind is "Do not love a tree, it might fall."

Sergeant and Alice --

Are you Christian? If so, which of Jesus' teachings are you applying the comments you've made here about Pagans?

Priver, respect for nature is your religion? Is your high priests name Al Gore?
Surprise!

I merely sited the basic definition of Paganism.

Basically, the only thing you added was Polytheism.

The Pagan worship of many gods without the characteristics of Judaism, Christianity and Islam is
the same as the basic definition I typed down earlier.

Wow. Such vitriol from people who seem to enjoy denigrating others. So much fear, so little curiosity. Sad, really.

Alice: What are you so angry for? Why not actually ASK a Pagan what he/she believes? What are you afraid of? We aren't the ones proselytizing about what we are/do, and are happy to share our feelings about what our religion is and does for us. Ask questions. You may be surprised.

Sargent: It's less about 'faith in nature' and more about respect for Nature, the Earth we live on, and respect for everything and everyone on it. 'Stupidity'? Hardly. If we don't start respecting our home and taking care of it and each other we are all in trouble.

More than likely, a Pagan chaplain would see death as part of an ongoing natural cycle, and would mourn with others who are close to those who passed away.

Gaby, you mean you attend prayer meetings at 6 different Churches of The Farting Dog . . .
No wonder, you sound so moronic.

Alice
All you've proven is that you can pick out only those definitions that you like, while ignoring the rest. Shall we see what other definitions for Pagan exist?

Dictionary.com Unabridged (v 1.1) - Cite This Source
pa·gan /ˈpeɪgən/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[pey-guhn] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
–noun 1. one of a people or community observing a polytheistic religion, as the ancient Romans and Greeks.
2. a person who is not a Christian, Jew, or Muslim.
3. pertaining to the worship or worshipers of any religion that is neither Christian, Jewish, nor Muslim.
5. of, pertaining to, or characteristic of pagans.

Lepidopteryx,
The end result of your reasoning is the same as saying: a Pagan should be allowed to say Mass to Catholics.
The Last Rites and The Mass are both Sacraments.

No, Alice, I am not claiming to be nice. People like you and Sergeant make my skin crawl. And when my skin crawls, I get NASTY!

Sergeant, "Church of the Farting Dog"? Not bad, how did you know I have six of them?

By the way, Sergeant, I doubt very much that you know anything about the military way of life. I, on the other hand, know plenty having been connected with them for over 20 years of my life.

You great philosophers, scholars and "researchers" have got Buddhism and Paganism mixed up!

ALICE:**Hey Mr. Pagan! What's the Pagan chaplain gonna teach the soldiers when somebody dies?

Pagan Chaplain: "Get up! Let's worship a tree!"**

Not quite. Although we did hold a memorial service for a dear friend of mine under an oak tree that was over a century old.
When a loved one dies, we mourn the loss, just like anyone else does. We just have different ideas about what happens to that person after they die.
I would hope that any memorial activities carried out by a chaplain would be in accordance with the deceased soldier's religion, not a default to that of the chaplain. And to be honest, I can see a Pagan chaplain reading a Christian prayer for a fallen Methodist soldier much easier than I can a Baptist preacher invoking the Elements for a fallen Pagan soldier.

Gaby sounds so stupid. He probably attends Prayer Meetings at "The Church of The Farting Dog".

Alice:

"Stop giving us that I'm from the University crap! "

I think it's your turn to go back to kindergarten. Better yet, preschool where they teach you if you don't have something nice to say keep your trap shut!

Gaby, are you claiming that your "NICE"?

Alice:

"Stop giving us that I'm from the University crap! "

I think it's your turn to go back to kindergarten. Better yet, preschool where they teach you if you don't have something nice to say keep your trap shut!

Gaby, why are you getting mad? Are you a Pagan? Don't you believe in "love"?
I'm advising you to get out of your house right now and ask forgiveness from a tree!
Who's the moron now?!?

Lori, you must go back to kindergarten.