I'm amazed at how a simple celebration of an event that happened centuries ago has been twisted into something religious. Thanksgiving is a celebration on the coming together of different cultures with a harvest meal. The pilgrims came to America to escape religious oppression and was starving when Native Americans helped them by providing needed food. So where did all this religious debate come from. I'm sure the pilgrims viewed this occurrence as a God sent event.
Who to give thanks to? God, or whomever you see or don't see as a Higher Being, your mother, etc for going to the store and preparing it, the farmer for working long hours to grow the food, nature, earth, life in general for being here to enjoy it.
Sorry, Moral Majority, but everything is not about you. Set your egos aside and just enjoy a day with your family and give thanks to whomever or whatever pleases you and leave everyone else to do the same.
The U.S. Congress defiles the Constitution every time it opens with a prayer.
Yet, the idea that this is a Christian nation, or a Judeo-Christian nation, is itself obscene, so by all means let the Congress add to the defilement by allowing every other religious faith to open sessions with their prayers, if only to demonstrate the lie in the claim that this is an inherently Christian or JudeoChristian or biblical or theist nation state.
I oppose this establishment of religion (a sanctioned prayer by anyone), but if we must have it, let the dominant fundamentalist Christian religionists feel a small part of the pain that the rest of us feel any time ANY prayer is offered with government sanction.
Here's to Hindu and every other kind of prayer... may it help us all understand soon the obscenity and absurdity of any government established or sanctioned religion.
I am a Christian. Either all religions should be allowed to offer prayers or blessings in the House, Senate and other Government settings, or there should be no prayer at all. Anything else violates everything this country stands for. If prayer continues, the question becomes "What is a religion?" I sure don't have the answer to that one!
Bitner :
"Ah, but Gabby, who are you giving thanks to? If you express gratitude, there is a recipient of that thanks, which is why I said that Thanksgiving is a religious holiday."
Our table grace for every meal consists in thanking the earth and sun for giving life to the plants and animals we eat, thanking the plants and animals for the continuance of our lives that their deaths will ensure, thanking the people who raised and prepared the food, and thanking others at the table for their company in sharing the meal with us. Obviously, not all of these entities can be addressed individually, but nonetheless, being thankful for them does not necessarily mandate a divine source for them. My theist AND atheist friends and family find that they are able to participate in our grace without feeling hypocritical.
I am used to Pope John Paul's approach which (at least in his later years) was more unifying across religions. Anyone who thinks there is only one path to God - 'X' Religion - has got it all wrong - its not about Religion.
I am used to Pope John Paul's approach which (at least in his later years) was more unifying across religions. Anyone who thinks there is only one path to God - 'X' Religion - has got it all wrong - its not about Religion.
I think if people knew more about the history of this country, they would have a much clearer view of "Thanksgving." Like Neil said about the 4th of July, Thanksgiving as we think we know it is a myth. And early settlers of this country were fighting about faith back then, too. We have romanticized this period of our country to fit our insecure needs and justify all the things we may have done wrong.
I don't see why you have to belong to a church, a faith of any kind or even believe in God to be thankful. That sure would be arrogant (and gasp, Un-Christian!). Oh wait, that is kind of how most Americans are so maybe that works...(sarcasm, people, sarcasm).
Thanksgiving may have a religious origin, and many do celebrate it in a religious way today. However there's nothing wrong for the non-religious to take this idea and use it to the fullest for their own purpose. Thankfulness is not an exclusive trait of religion or Christianity. Does anyone honestly believe God is the only one you could, or should, thank? Give some credits to the fellow humans that made your and our lives easier.
Why should the Catholic Church use the state's language in its rituals when the state rejects prayer and God in its rituals?
I though we learned from Poland that the church is the only institution the people have when government wrongly imposes its will upon the governed. Of course, we are now in month number of nine of a majority of Americans favoring immediate withdrawal from Iraq, but that's different, according to all the politicians.
Ah, but Gabby, who are you giving thanks to? If you express gratitude, there is a recipient of that thanks, which is why I said that Thanksgiving is a religious holiday. However, it's not a Christian holiday.
Is Thanksgiving a religious holiday? Sure. Is it strictly a Christian holiday? No. Do you really suppose that the Native Americans present at the first Thanksgiving were giving thanks to Yahweh? I doubt it. And anyone, from any faith or none, may show gratitude for what they have.
Yes, non believe can celebrate thanksgiving. Why not? For instance, this past thankgiving we had several friends over. I bought the turkey and the ham. I bought the sweet potatoes, the white potatoes, the green beans, and the rest of the fixings. I made the pumpkin pie. I roasted the turkey. In short, from beginning to end, I prepared a feast that everyone enjoyed. When it was over they all gave their thanks to me. We didn't need an invisible man in the sky, nor some hokey myths about pilgrims and indians. We just enjoyed each others company and a good meal.
So next thanksgiving, honor your mythical god, if you will, and have your sweet little re-written historical scenarios of pilgrims in funny hats. But give thanks to the person or persons who made the meal before you possible.
As for the pagan/christian discussion, I know a lot of pagans, although I myself am not one. They are all, without exception, fine people who can share my table any time they wish. I also know a lot of people who claim to be christians. Many of them are also fine decent people. But many of them are lying, backstabbing, greedy people. The botton line is that religion doesn't make a person what he is. A person is either good or bad to begin with. Add religion to their lives and they are merely good or bad people who subscribe to a a religion. Nothing more. The christians Jesus is alledged to have said that we will know people by their fruits. Judging from the "fruit" is see from many christians I have little choice but to presume that the tree has some serious problems.
Just my two cents worth. Take it for what you will. Save your flames as I don't make it a habit to check back and see what responses may have been generated by my words.
And yes, I would vote for a pagan were one running for office. But I hesitate anymore to vote for anyone who plays the Jesus card in his attempt to get elected. After 6+ years of Bush & Co I've learned something.
I think thanksgiving is a time for coming together and being thankful for everything that we have, regardless of what faith we are. Be thankful that you can practice that faith, even you christians!
Non christians have family, friends, and lives to be thankful for too. Its not your holiday.
For John 2:16. I was a Catholic. I am a Catholic. I am a mature Catholic. I believe. I believe in Christ. I believe in the Jesus of the Bible. I believe the Holy Spirit works through God's Church. So ... I guess my vote cancels out your's.
For John 2:16. I was a Catholic. I am a Catholic. I am a mature Catholic. I believe. I believe in Christ. I believe in the Jesus of the Bible. I believe the Holy Spirit works through God's Church. So ... I guess my vote cancels out your's.
For John 2:16. I was a Catholic. I am a Catholic. I am a mature Catholic. I believe. I believe in Christ. I believe in the Jesus of the Bible. I believe the Holy Spirit works through God's Church. So ... I guess my vote cancels out your's.
July 4th isn't a religious holiday- it celebrates the birth myth of the United States. Rather than giving thanks to an alleged supernatural being, we should give thanks to the native Americans who made one of the greatest strategic blunders of all time.
If they had not helped the pilgrims they could have staved off the ensuing european invasion for some time to come. It would have been just a reprieve, but who knows how it might have worked out.
I guess Christians can argue that their supernatural being was tougher and more ruthless than the native american supernatural being(s).
Funnily enough, these gods seem to follow Darwinian principles!
The only reason why people believe in God is that they have a need to immortalize themselves. The foundation for all religions is faith. The problem is, is that if something is true, you do not need to have faith in it. Religion is the problem, not the answer. It is the cause of all wars. It is why we live in such peril today. To believe in such "non-sense", you have to overlook every single obvious facet of reality. THe Bible is written in a way that cannot be understood. It is vague and can be iterpreted in many different ways. That is why there is so many religions. It makes no sense at all. If there was a book that was supposed to have a set of rules for a society, it would not have to be interpreted.It would have to be exact. There is such a book. but the bible is not it.
Like most american traditions tainted by religion, the original meaning has long since been lost. Still plenty of good comes from celebrating though; families get together, people spend tons of cash, good football games, etc. etc. Even without religion, it's a great holiday for all. Turkey ROCKS!!!!
God's love is so much more complex than most people think. But to back up some, it's simple in that God does love everyone - but that doesn't mean God can be with them. Because man is born into sin, they are separated from God. God's holiness restricts him from even being in the presence of sin. For those who do not accept his grace through the sacrifice of Jesus, they are still separated from him. Hell is not punishment in the form of intentionally hurting people, but rather the absence of being with God. God is forced to separate them from him and in such a place, there can be no good. Evil takes control and that might be the point where a punishment of more than just separation begins.
God's love is so much more complex than most people think. But to back up some, it's simple in that God does love everyone - but that doesn't mean God can be with them. Because man is born into sin, they are separated from God. God's holiness restricts him from even being in the presence of sin. For those who do not accept his grace through the sacrifice of Jesus, they are still separated from him. Hell is not punishment in the form of intentionally hurting people, but rather the absence of being with God. God is forced to separate them from him and in such a place, there can be no good. Evil takes control and that might be the point where a punishment of more than just separation begins.
Well, when a "believer" tells me I will be in hell, I take it as a compliment...because if said person is in heaven, for me to join them there would be for me, by definition, hell.
I associate with a Christain faith but I do not believe in heaven or hell. Nor do I believe that a truly all-loving God would "doom" someone to a hell or "reward" others with a heaven.
I don't feel that someone has to be of the Christian faith to receive the love of God.
Jesus was God's best representative on earth and his message was love, respecting all people, harming no one, just love. I believe that is God's message.
No heaven, no hell, no god, no devil. If there were a god, does it have an ego? Does it need to be worshipped? Will it send one to hell for doing something it knew one would do? Can there really be something with horns, hooves, & a tail waiting for bad boys & girls? Religion was created to control the mindless masses & for politicians to have something they claim to have in common with the same. Claptrap extorting tithes from the gullible & fearful.
Christian, Catholic, Mormon, etc... It's not the religion, it's what you choose to believe. I'm personally a Christian, but I believe God knows everybody's heart! I also believe that the Bible teaches wonderful lessons, but I do not go to church, I do not force my beliefs and I am content with that. People who think Christians are "Arrogant" should take a look at them selves before making such a statement that stereotypes us.
Is there a Heaven or Hell? I believe that there is something after life and that it's good. It's not up to anybody to decide who should experience it and who shouldn't. Me personally; I'd rather go through life having something more to believe in that is based on good character and morals. That doesn't make me arrogant, that makes me hopeful and happy!
I'd much rather believe and be right than not believe and be wrong!
Christian, Catholic, Mormon, etc... It's not the religion, it's what you choose to believe. I'm personally a Christian, but I believe God knows everybody's heart! I also believe that the Bible teaches wonderful lessons, but I do not go to church, I do not force my beliefs and I am content with that. People who think Christians are "Arrogant" should take a look at them selves before making such a statement that stereotypes us.
Is there a Heaven or Hell? I believe that there is something after life and that it's good. It's not up to anybody to decide who should experience it and who shouldn't. Me personally; I'd rather go through life having something more to believe in that is based on good character and morals. That doesn't make me arrogant, that makes me hopeful and happy!
I'd much rather believe and be right than not believe and be wrong!
As an anti-religious person who believes in God (yes, there are such people), I think that Heaven and Hell are right here on Earth. It is up to us to choose (by our deeds) where we choose to be.
As an anti-religious person who believes in God (yes, there are such people), I think that Heaven and Hell are right here on Earth. It is up to us to choose (by our deeds) where we choose to be.
As an anti-religious person who believes in God (yes, there are such people), I think that Heaven and Hell are right here on Earth. It is up to us to choose (by our deeds) where we choose to be.
Only those infected with religion would be so arrogant as to assume they can control a secular holiday. Your feeble attempts at mind control will get you nowhere.
Only those infected with religion would be so arrogant as to assume they can control a secular holiday. Your feeble attempts at mind control will get you nowhere.
I assume that the tern "non-believer" in the question refers to non-Christians.
One need not be Christian to be grateful for the good things in life. In fact, it is possible to experience gratitude without the necessity for a belief in any sort of deity.
My parents are Christian, I am an eclectic pagan, my husband practices an Eastern faith known as Mahikari, some aspects of which I have integrated into my own path, and my daughter is agnostic. When we share a meal, we use the following table graced, which all of us find we can agree on:
We partake of this food with gratitude for all the blessings of heaven and earth,
for the efforts of those who have prepared it,
and for those with whom we share it.
For each of us, the term "blessings of heaven and earth" means something different. For my parents, it's the Judeo-Christian God who provided manna in the wilderness, for me, it's the living euniverse from which all life comes, for my husband it's the Creator god as well as the lesser god who specifically governs the material aspects of the world, and for my daughter, it's the sunshine, the rain, and the dirt which contributied to the growth of the plants and animals which make up our meals. We don't all have to have the same beliefs to be grateful for what we have.
Yes, we should thank the Founding Fathers, who understood so well the self-serving mischief done in the name of God, for creating a system that, so far at least, has kept the Christians safely contained.
Of course it is a "religious" holiday. The original reason of celebrating Thanskgiving was to Give thanks to God (The Creator God) for the many blessings that were given to those who sacrificed for the freedom to worship as they pleased. So even if you are an atheist, you should be thankful that you have a choice in this country to be that and not be persecuted by the government.
Yes! Of course atheists and agnostics should give thanks and celebrate thanksgiving. The problem isn't that they give thanks, it's that they don't know Who to thank! If they stop giving thanks they will hardly come to know Him better. You don't solve one problem by causing another.
DWB - Though I am not all-knowing when it comes to religion, I don't remember Jesus asking the blind man if he believed in God prior to granting him sight.
You see, I got the impression that Jesus just loved, and he loved with out strings.
With regard to our Nation's leaders- rightly so we should elect those who can be moral and just in their leadership. But faith alone does not determine that. Many wars start because of religions including the Christian faith, and I've known religious persons who committed crimes and sin, just as non-religious, or non Christians have.
I think your stereotype is very small minded. Wasn't it Jesus that reminded those who were about to stone the prostitute to think twice, and evaluate themselves before they judge another?
"DWB :
It always amazes me that the citizens of our Great Nation - The United States of America - rely on what candidates say. If they would just do a little research they would find the true character of each candidate. Their personal views on most political topics would be mirrored by their voting history. Their Christian beliefs would be self-evident. Or their lack there of. AND NO POLITICAL CANDIDATE SHOULD BE ELECTED UNLESS THEY ARE OF CHRISTIAN FAITH!
The United States was founded on Christian beliefs. How could anyone uphold our great Constitution if they do not understand the foundation in which it was built upon. Just look at our legal system that is full of Liberals, Atheists and Opportunists. If we had Christian leaders when most of these judges were appointed (to Lifetime postitions) we would not be in this situation. A moral and ethical demise.
God Bless The United States of America!"
Gosh, DWB, guess that little item in the First Amendment about not establishing a state religion was just a brain fart from our Founding Fathers? Does this mean the pogroms and burnings should start again? Should I stock up on aloe?
Excuse me. Faith is only one factor. You are free to vote on whether a candidate agrees with your religious views or not. Thank God most people don't use that as the one and only criteria. I'll say it one more time: 30% will vote right if Alan Ginsberg was to run Republican. 30% would vote Democrat if they ran Adolf Hitler. It's us folks in the middle the make the difference. We don't presume to use the religious litmus test as our defining factor. I think this is what really pisses off the religious right. Keep working on it though. You are free to do that in America, even if it's a pretty limited way to pick leadership. Has it worked for you so far? Your boy Bush ....
It always amazes me that the citizens of our Great Nation - The United States of America - rely on what candidates say. If they would just do a little research they would find the true character of each candidate. Their personal views on most political topics would be mirrored by their voting history. Their Christian beliefs would be self-evident. Or their lack there of. AND NO POLITICAL CANDIDATE SHOULD BE ELECTED UNLESS THEY ARE OF CHRISTIAN FAITH!
The United States was founded on Christian beliefs. How could anyone uphold our great Constitution if they do not understand the foundation in which it was built upon. Just look at our legal system that is full of Liberals, Atheists and Opportunists. If we had Christian leaders when most of these judges were appointed (to Lifetime postitions) we would not be in this situation. A moral and ethical demise.
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A true Christian or Jew cannot practice yoga or meditation and still claim he or she serves the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob or the triun God(God the father, Jesus the son, and the Holy Ghost). The only meditation Christians and Jews are allowed to do is on the laws of God in the Bible. Yoga and meditations open up spiritual access for entry of contrary spirits or demons. With true knowledge that Moslems use witch doctors to make voodoo, I see no prohibition for Moslems to engage in yoga and meditations.
==THE SALVATION OF THE WORLD DEPENDS ON OUR REVERSAL OF THOUGHT*
HERE IS A NEW TOOL TO HELP EVERYONE FOR A LIFETIME
WE’RE NOT WHO WE THINK WE ARE...WE’RE BETTER!
A SPIRITUAL BOOK SO PROVOCATIVE AND PROFOUND IN ITS IDEAS THAT IT WILL CHANGE THE WAY WE THINK ABOUT OURSELVES AND OUR WORLD..
THE ONLY THING TRULY REAL IS UNIVERSAL LOVE.......EVERYTHING ELSE IS JUST ANOTHER ONE OF OUR MANY ILLUSIONS OF THE EGO
THE MORE WE THINK AND FOCUS ON SOMETHING, THE MORE WE WILL CONTINUE TO CREATE AND SEE THAT SOMETHING, OVER AND OVER AGAIN......UNTIL WE REVERSE OUR THOUGHTS ON WHAT IS REAL VS WHAT IS ILLUSION
THESE IDEAS WILL EMPOWER US ALL NO MATTER WHO WE THINK WE ARE...........
==THE SALVATION OF THE WORLD DEPENDS ON OUR REVERSAL OF THOUGHT*
HERE IS A NEW TOOL TO HELP EVERYONE FOR A LIFETIME
WE’RE NOT WHO WE THINK WE ARE...WE’RE BETTER!
A SPIRITUAL BOOK SO PROVOCATIVE AND PROFOUND IN ITS IDEAS THAT IT WILL CHANGE THE WAY WE THINK ABOUT OURSELVES AND OUR WORLD..
THE ONLY THING TRULY REAL IS UNIVERSAL LOVE.......EVERYTHING ELSE IS JUST ANOTHER ONE OF OUR MANY ILLUSIONS OF THE EGO
THE MORE WE THINK AND FOCUS ON SOMETHING, THE MORE WE WILL CONTINUE TO CREATE AND SEE THAT SOMETHING, OVER AND OVER AGAIN......UNTIL WE REVERSE OUR THOUGHTS ON WHAT IS REAL VS WHAT IS ILLUSION
THESE IDEAS WILL EMPOWER US ALL NO MATTER WHO WE THINK WE ARE...........
Hello world! I'm from Latvia, I now have a computer and Internet! It's so interesting here! But on some forums I see strange posts, they offer to buy some pills or something and they look very stupid. It is robots posting? I thought moderators should delete such posts. Maybe somebody will explain me what's going on? But at all it is very interesting to speak to all you people!
Kisses! :)
Since religious faith is based on no evidence whatsoever, I truly wish that it were not a basis for public policy. Faith is belief without evidence. To set government policy based on texts that are thousands of years old and have no basis in reality and require you to believe in essentially what is an imaginary friend is folly.
My Brother and I were very close. When he was killed in Viet Nam, I experienced the most profound grief. I cried for 9 months. I lived far from my family at the time. I quit my job and just basically cried day and night. I did not realize, nor did anyone suggest, that I needed help. At the end of that period, I found I was completely empty. Never during the experience, was I suicidal, nor have I ever been since. I just simply had no attachments to anything or anyone. I had no fears, no grief, no needs, no joy, and I also had no curiosity about this state. I have since read that this is the state of non-attachment that Monks and other spiritual seekers strive to attain.
One hot, clear August day, we visited a cemetary and I thought of all those who had died in the war. But then I thought of all the love from other people, that was associated with each gravestone. I suddenly realized that there was far, far more love, than grief and tragedy, in the world, that those headstones symbolized. Just at that moment, a feeling swept up my spine and over me life a giant ocean wave. I found myself enveloped in pure white light, and in that light was my Brother. He was perfect, whole, and at peace. We talked for what seemed like a long time. I don't remember what was said but it seemed as if an entire lifetime of our relationship had been resolved - both the past and what would have been in the future had he lived. During this time, another part of my mind was skeptical and trying to analyze what was happening. I looked down at my feet and saw that the light had a round opening at the bottom and I could see my feet still standing on the sidewalk. That image struck me very funny for some reason.
Then, it seemed as if there was nothing more to communicate between the two of us; that our relationship, our lives, had suddenly somehow been completed in the most perfect way, that defied my understanding. I felt complete peace. It was then that I chose to disengaged from our communion. I wasn't afraid to do this - it felt just right for both of us.
Then, I was out of the light and saw once again, the normal scene of my worldly surroundings before me. Immediately, my conscious mind began to rationalize away this experience, because it defied all my previous assumptions and understanding about the nature of reality. But, as I turned to leave, it was as if someone put my eyes on a headstone some distance from where I was standing, that ordinarily I would not have noticed. And on it, was the name that was my maiden name (although I doubt the person who was buried there was a relative). It felt like my Brother was still with me, reconfirming the reality of this encounter, and that he wanted to get it across to me that this experience was not the result of my imagination, or that my mind was distorted from a long period of grief, but that it was real.
After that, I determined to find out how such a thing could have happened to me, and why it did not happen to any other member of my family. I began a study of spirituality and consciousness, that persists to this day. Ever since I emerged from the light and my communion with my Brother, I was utterly healed of all grief, filled with a peace and joy which has stood the test of time. While I have missed my Brother all these years, I have had no further grief about his passing, and I know beyond any doubt, that his wounds were healed completely and that he lives on a higher plane which I will go to when I pass over, and we will be together again. This experience anchored my belief in God in a very personal way, and in the fact of everlasting life, which Christ spoke to us about.
I hope my experience will inspire others to faith, as it did to me.
I celebrate Thanksgiving because it is a time to remember the things we enjoy and all the freedom and options we have in life. The historic reasons are too corrupt to use them. Immigrants starving to death and natives who felt the need to help them....a good human attitude.
dont feel bad PLHEART
ive had over 8 solid posts just disappear- i dont know what buzzwords im using, but they were all very logical biblical scripture with reasoning attached- often questions asked that could be construed as challenging, but certainly never rude in any way.
but its never happened in these open forums- only responses to panelists-
id lke to mention in defense of accusations-
exactly what news channel do you imagine is going to
broadcast moderate muslims that have anything ompelling to say about the issues of violence and the position of most muslims on it?
there are some muslim panelists on this site- go see how theyre attacked-
prejudice is an ugly thing no matter whose mouth it comes from and we should be free to express ourselves here without censure-
Here is the deal. I am Muslim, my husband is Christian. We have a preschool aged child. His family all but ignores my faith. Never once have they wished my a happy holiday or bought my daughter a gift for a Muslim holiday. My parents have gifted my husband a gold cross, bought our child gifts on Christmas and made her an Easter basket. My mom's point: She has to know we love and accept her. PERIOD. I think when she grows up my in-laws will have a rude awakening. Children know who accepts and loves them. I just hope she does not experience too much pain from their ignorance. I just try to ignore their behavior. The challenge for me is that my holidays are never recognized in the US. I do not get days off work, there are never any displays in the mall, etc... So I try to keep with my traditions getting together with friends and making new ones as a I go along. My grandfather once said ( in response to my question about God and faith). Child God is at the top of a great mountain. All the pathways on the side of that mountain lead to Him. Everyone takes a different path to the top. I guess that explains why my mom is the way she is.....my recommendation is accept these children for who they are and do not make them choose loyalties. Extended family you must do the same or risk hurting a child....in my faith the greatest sin there is.
One of the greatest tenets of democracy is that a superior argument will win the day. Right now, this doctrine is being turned on its head by the Islamic Fundamentalists.
These crazed murderers are not only cleaning our intellectual clocks. They are wiping the floors with our morbid brains.
These Fundamentalists have taken Islam and turned its teachings into a murderous medieval ideology – that the killing of infidels in the name of Allah will be rewarded in heaven - allowing the Islamists to sexually molest for all eternality 72 virgins, in 72 mansions, and 72 beds – that the murder of millions of non - believers is a religious duty, women are inferior to men - their virtual slaves to be denied education, beaten, killed for adultery or other sexual transgressions (real or imaged), covered from head to toe, people can be mutilated and tortured, barbers giving hair cuts can be killed, music and movies banned, women practicing folk dancing murdered, schools teaching young girls blown up, anyone who believes in a different interpretation of Islam to be killed and on and on. Muslims have paid a terrible price at the hands of these Fundamentalists. Children mutilated. Grand parents brains blown all over the street. Women, children, old and young. Over one hundred and fifty thousand Muslims have been slaughtered in the most horrid, unimaginable ways since 9/11.
Against these ridiculous crazy teachings, the Western World is intellectually collapsing – freedom of speech is collapsing. Anyone who writes or puts on a play exposing these teachings can be killed. In the face of this onslaught, moderate Muslims are being pushed to the background and running for cover. Western Governments are running for cover. Mosques are being taken over by radical Islamists from the Saudi Arabian Wahhabbi sect.
We need to form an immediate alliance with moderate Muslims to turn the intellectual tide. There can be no polite political correctness here. Tolerating - intolerance is no longer an option.
The Pope in his recent speech on God and Reason has shown the way forward. A very important event occurred recently when 36 Islamic Scholars sent the Pope a communication in which they agreed – that in Islam, Allah is – “A GOD OF REASON.” This important declaration - perhaps one of the most important by a group of such eminent Islamic scholars must be seized upon. The Pope should call for a world religious conference on the scale of Vatican 2 bringing together all the top religious le
Readers’ Responses to Our Question (271)
Thanksgiving is DEFINITELY a religious holiday.
Regards,
Tim (Pastor of the Church of turkey-loving football fans who love a day off of work)
August 29, 2007 7:49 PM | Report Offensive Comments
How could we take seriously anyone who never doubted?
August 29, 2007 11:26 AM | Report Offensive Comments
I'm amazed at how a simple celebration of an event that happened centuries ago has been twisted into something religious. Thanksgiving is a celebration on the coming together of different cultures with a harvest meal. The pilgrims came to America to escape religious oppression and was starving when Native Americans helped them by providing needed food. So where did all this religious debate come from. I'm sure the pilgrims viewed this occurrence as a God sent event.
Who to give thanks to? God, or whomever you see or don't see as a Higher Being, your mother, etc for going to the store and preparing it, the farmer for working long hours to grow the food, nature, earth, life in general for being here to enjoy it.
Sorry, Moral Majority, but everything is not about you. Set your egos aside and just enjoy a day with your family and give thanks to whomever or whatever pleases you and leave everyone else to do the same.
August 18, 2007 8:07 AM | Report Offensive Comments
"Skeptical scrutiny is the means, in both science and religion, by which deep insights can be winnowed from deep nonsense." Carl Sagan
August 16, 2007 3:18 PM | Report Offensive Comments
The U.S. Congress defiles the Constitution every time it opens with a prayer.
Yet, the idea that this is a Christian nation, or a Judeo-Christian nation, is itself obscene, so by all means let the Congress add to the defilement by allowing every other religious faith to open sessions with their prayers, if only to demonstrate the lie in the claim that this is an inherently Christian or JudeoChristian or biblical or theist nation state.
I oppose this establishment of religion (a sanctioned prayer by anyone), but if we must have it, let the dominant fundamentalist Christian religionists feel a small part of the pain that the rest of us feel any time ANY prayer is offered with government sanction.
Here's to Hindu and every other kind of prayer... may it help us all understand soon the obscenity and absurdity of any government established or sanctioned religion.
August 3, 2007 3:00 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Meery meet indeed!
I hope your Lughnasadh was filled with a rich harvest of family and other loved ones!
August 2, 2007 4:38 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Happy Lammas!
This is a day of thanks for the Harvest...our first Harvest...we have three.
Lepi, PP, Wiccan...all...Many Blessings on this day.
terra
August 1, 2007 10:10 PM | Report Offensive Comments
I am a Christian. Either all religions should be allowed to offer prayers or blessings in the House, Senate and other Government settings, or there should be no prayer at all. Anything else violates everything this country stands for. If prayer continues, the question becomes "What is a religion?" I sure don't have the answer to that one!
August 1, 2007 6:16 PM | Report Offensive Comments
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July 27, 2007 1:47 AM | Report Offensive Comments
Bitner :
"Ah, but Gabby, who are you giving thanks to? If you express gratitude, there is a recipient of that thanks, which is why I said that Thanksgiving is a religious holiday."
Our table grace for every meal consists in thanking the earth and sun for giving life to the plants and animals we eat, thanking the plants and animals for the continuance of our lives that their deaths will ensure, thanking the people who raised and prepared the food, and thanking others at the table for their company in sharing the meal with us. Obviously, not all of these entities can be addressed individually, but nonetheless, being thankful for them does not necessarily mandate a divine source for them. My theist AND atheist friends and family find that they are able to participate in our grace without feeling hypocritical.
July 23, 2007 12:50 PM | Report Offensive Comments
I am used to Pope John Paul's approach which (at least in his later years) was more unifying across religions. Anyone who thinks there is only one path to God - 'X' Religion - has got it all wrong - its not about Religion.
July 20, 2007 3:12 PM | Report Offensive Comments
I am used to Pope John Paul's approach which (at least in his later years) was more unifying across religions. Anyone who thinks there is only one path to God - 'X' Religion - has got it all wrong - its not about Religion.
July 20, 2007 3:12 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Bittner:
You give thank to nature!
July 18, 2007 6:02 PM | Report Offensive Comments
I think if people knew more about the history of this country, they would have a much clearer view of "Thanksgving." Like Neil said about the 4th of July, Thanksgiving as we think we know it is a myth. And early settlers of this country were fighting about faith back then, too. We have romanticized this period of our country to fit our insecure needs and justify all the things we may have done wrong.
I don't see why you have to belong to a church, a faith of any kind or even believe in God to be thankful. That sure would be arrogant (and gasp, Un-Christian!). Oh wait, that is kind of how most Americans are so maybe that works...(sarcasm, people, sarcasm).
July 18, 2007 5:37 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Thanksgiving may have a religious origin, and many do celebrate it in a religious way today. However there's nothing wrong for the non-religious to take this idea and use it to the fullest for their own purpose. Thankfulness is not an exclusive trait of religion or Christianity. Does anyone honestly believe God is the only one you could, or should, thank? Give some credits to the fellow humans that made your and our lives easier.
July 17, 2007 5:34 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Why not? Religion has nothing to do with it.
July 17, 2007 4:07 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Why should the Catholic Church use the state's language in its rituals when the state rejects prayer and God in its rituals?
I though we learned from Poland that the church is the only institution the people have when government wrongly imposes its will upon the governed. Of course, we are now in month number of nine of a majority of Americans favoring immediate withdrawal from Iraq, but that's different, according to all the politicians.
July 12, 2007 6:20 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Ah, but Gabby, who are you giving thanks to? If you express gratitude, there is a recipient of that thanks, which is why I said that Thanksgiving is a religious holiday. However, it's not a Christian holiday.
July 12, 2007 2:38 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Thanksgiving is not a religious holiday. Someone just infused religion into it.
Actually it's a holiday where you give thanks for the years harvest. Anyone can do that!
July 10, 2007 12:40 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Is Thanksgiving a religious holiday? Sure. Is it strictly a Christian holiday? No. Do you really suppose that the Native Americans present at the first Thanksgiving were giving thanks to Yahweh? I doubt it. And anyone, from any faith or none, may show gratitude for what they have.
July 10, 2007 11:56 AM | Report Offensive Comments
Yes, non believe can celebrate thanksgiving. Why not? For instance, this past thankgiving we had several friends over. I bought the turkey and the ham. I bought the sweet potatoes, the white potatoes, the green beans, and the rest of the fixings. I made the pumpkin pie. I roasted the turkey. In short, from beginning to end, I prepared a feast that everyone enjoyed. When it was over they all gave their thanks to me. We didn't need an invisible man in the sky, nor some hokey myths about pilgrims and indians. We just enjoyed each others company and a good meal.
So next thanksgiving, honor your mythical god, if you will, and have your sweet little re-written historical scenarios of pilgrims in funny hats. But give thanks to the person or persons who made the meal before you possible.
As for the pagan/christian discussion, I know a lot of pagans, although I myself am not one. They are all, without exception, fine people who can share my table any time they wish. I also know a lot of people who claim to be christians. Many of them are also fine decent people. But many of them are lying, backstabbing, greedy people. The botton line is that religion doesn't make a person what he is. A person is either good or bad to begin with. Add religion to their lives and they are merely good or bad people who subscribe to a a religion. Nothing more. The christians Jesus is alledged to have said that we will know people by their fruits. Judging from the "fruit" is see from many christians I have little choice but to presume that the tree has some serious problems.
Just my two cents worth. Take it for what you will. Save your flames as I don't make it a habit to check back and see what responses may have been generated by my words.
And yes, I would vote for a pagan were one running for office. But I hesitate anymore to vote for anyone who plays the Jesus card in his attempt to get elected. After 6+ years of Bush & Co I've learned something.
July 7, 2007 1:46 PM | Report Offensive Comments
You know what?
I think thanksgiving is a time for coming together and being thankful for everything that we have, regardless of what faith we are. Be thankful that you can practice that faith, even you christians!
Non christians have family, friends, and lives to be thankful for too. Its not your holiday.
July 5, 2007 6:28 PM | Report Offensive Comments
For John 2:16. I was a Catholic. I am a Catholic. I am a mature Catholic. I believe. I believe in Christ. I believe in the Jesus of the Bible. I believe the Holy Spirit works through God's Church. So ... I guess my vote cancels out your's.
July 5, 2007 2:33 PM | Report Offensive Comments
For John 2:16. I was a Catholic. I am a Catholic. I am a mature Catholic. I believe. I believe in Christ. I believe in the Jesus of the Bible. I believe the Holy Spirit works through God's Church. So ... I guess my vote cancels out your's.
July 5, 2007 2:33 PM | Report Offensive Comments
For John 2:16. I was a Catholic. I am a Catholic. I am a mature Catholic. I believe. I believe in Christ. I believe in the Jesus of the Bible. I believe the Holy Spirit works through God's Church. So ... I guess my vote cancels out your's.
July 5, 2007 2:33 PM | Report Offensive Comments
I am a Pagan. I was a Catholic. That was enuff to make anyone not believe.
July 5, 2007 2:30 PM | Report Offensive Comments
July 4th isn't a religious holiday- it celebrates the birth myth of the United States. Rather than giving thanks to an alleged supernatural being, we should give thanks to the native Americans who made one of the greatest strategic blunders of all time.
If they had not helped the pilgrims they could have staved off the ensuing european invasion for some time to come. It would have been just a reprieve, but who knows how it might have worked out.
I guess Christians can argue that their supernatural being was tougher and more ruthless than the native american supernatural being(s).
Funnily enough, these gods seem to follow Darwinian principles!
July 4, 2007 12:50 PM | Report Offensive Comments
The only reason why people believe in God is that they have a need to immortalize themselves. The foundation for all religions is faith. The problem is, is that if something is true, you do not need to have faith in it. Religion is the problem, not the answer. It is the cause of all wars. It is why we live in such peril today. To believe in such "non-sense", you have to overlook every single obvious facet of reality. THe Bible is written in a way that cannot be understood. It is vague and can be iterpreted in many different ways. That is why there is so many religions. It makes no sense at all. If there was a book that was supposed to have a set of rules for a society, it would not have to be interpreted.It would have to be exact. There is such a book. but the bible is not it.
July 3, 2007 12:10 AM | Report Offensive Comments
I belive in the virtue of FAITH.
Beliving in something without proof.
Yes I belive.
July 2, 2007 11:33 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Like most american traditions tainted by religion, the original meaning has long since been lost. Still plenty of good comes from celebrating though; families get together, people spend tons of cash, good football games, etc. etc. Even without religion, it's a great holiday for all. Turkey ROCKS!!!!
July 2, 2007 10:43 PM | Report Offensive Comments
In response to Finster:
God's love is so much more complex than most people think. But to back up some, it's simple in that God does love everyone - but that doesn't mean God can be with them. Because man is born into sin, they are separated from God. God's holiness restricts him from even being in the presence of sin. For those who do not accept his grace through the sacrifice of Jesus, they are still separated from him. Hell is not punishment in the form of intentionally hurting people, but rather the absence of being with God. God is forced to separate them from him and in such a place, there can be no good. Evil takes control and that might be the point where a punishment of more than just separation begins.
July 2, 2007 9:05 PM | Report Offensive Comments
In response to Finster:
God's love is so much more complex than most people think. But to back up some, it's simple in that God does love everyone - but that doesn't mean God can be with them. Because man is born into sin, they are separated from God. God's holiness restricts him from even being in the presence of sin. For those who do not accept his grace through the sacrifice of Jesus, they are still separated from him. Hell is not punishment in the form of intentionally hurting people, but rather the absence of being with God. God is forced to separate them from him and in such a place, there can be no good. Evil takes control and that might be the point where a punishment of more than just separation begins.
July 2, 2007 9:03 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Well, when a "believer" tells me I will be in hell, I take it as a compliment...because if said person is in heaven, for me to join them there would be for me, by definition, hell.
July 2, 2007 7:58 PM | Report Offensive Comments
I associate with a Christain faith but I do not believe in heaven or hell. Nor do I believe that a truly all-loving God would "doom" someone to a hell or "reward" others with a heaven.
I don't feel that someone has to be of the Christian faith to receive the love of God.
Jesus was God's best representative on earth and his message was love, respecting all people, harming no one, just love. I believe that is God's message.
July 2, 2007 6:41 PM | Report Offensive Comments
No heaven, no hell, no god, no devil. If there were a god, does it have an ego? Does it need to be worshipped? Will it send one to hell for doing something it knew one would do? Can there really be something with horns, hooves, & a tail waiting for bad boys & girls? Religion was created to control the mindless masses & for politicians to have something they claim to have in common with the same. Claptrap extorting tithes from the gullible & fearful.
July 2, 2007 6:06 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Christian, Catholic, Mormon, etc... It's not the religion, it's what you choose to believe. I'm personally a Christian, but I believe God knows everybody's heart! I also believe that the Bible teaches wonderful lessons, but I do not go to church, I do not force my beliefs and I am content with that. People who think Christians are "Arrogant" should take a look at them selves before making such a statement that stereotypes us.
Is there a Heaven or Hell? I believe that there is something after life and that it's good. It's not up to anybody to decide who should experience it and who shouldn't. Me personally; I'd rather go through life having something more to believe in that is based on good character and morals. That doesn't make me arrogant, that makes me hopeful and happy!
I'd much rather believe and be right than not believe and be wrong!
July 2, 2007 5:55 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Christian, Catholic, Mormon, etc... It's not the religion, it's what you choose to believe. I'm personally a Christian, but I believe God knows everybody's heart! I also believe that the Bible teaches wonderful lessons, but I do not go to church, I do not force my beliefs and I am content with that. People who think Christians are "Arrogant" should take a look at them selves before making such a statement that stereotypes us.
Is there a Heaven or Hell? I believe that there is something after life and that it's good. It's not up to anybody to decide who should experience it and who shouldn't. Me personally; I'd rather go through life having something more to believe in that is based on good character and morals. That doesn't make me arrogant, that makes me hopeful and happy!
I'd much rather believe and be right than not believe and be wrong!
July 2, 2007 5:53 PM | Report Offensive Comments
As an anti-religious person who believes in God (yes, there are such people), I think that Heaven and Hell are right here on Earth. It is up to us to choose (by our deeds) where we choose to be.
July 2, 2007 5:35 PM | Report Offensive Comments
As an anti-religious person who believes in God (yes, there are such people), I think that Heaven and Hell are right here on Earth. It is up to us to choose (by our deeds) where we choose to be.
July 2, 2007 5:34 PM | Report Offensive Comments
As an anti-religious person who believes in God (yes, there are such people), I think that Heaven and Hell are right here on Earth. It is up to us to choose (by our deeds) where we choose to be.
July 2, 2007 5:34 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Only those infected with religion would be so arrogant as to assume they can control a secular holiday. Your feeble attempts at mind control will get you nowhere.
July 2, 2007 5:09 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Only those infected with religion would be so arrogant as to assume they can control a secular holiday. Your feeble attempts at mind control will get you nowhere.
July 2, 2007 5:07 PM | Report Offensive Comments
I assume that the tern "non-believer" in the question refers to non-Christians.
One need not be Christian to be grateful for the good things in life. In fact, it is possible to experience gratitude without the necessity for a belief in any sort of deity.
My parents are Christian, I am an eclectic pagan, my husband practices an Eastern faith known as Mahikari, some aspects of which I have integrated into my own path, and my daughter is agnostic. When we share a meal, we use the following table graced, which all of us find we can agree on:
We partake of this food with gratitude for all the blessings of heaven and earth,
for the efforts of those who have prepared it,
and for those with whom we share it.
For each of us, the term "blessings of heaven and earth" means something different. For my parents, it's the Judeo-Christian God who provided manna in the wilderness, for me, it's the living euniverse from which all life comes, for my husband it's the Creator god as well as the lesser god who specifically governs the material aspects of the world, and for my daughter, it's the sunshine, the rain, and the dirt which contributied to the growth of the plants and animals which make up our meals. We don't all have to have the same beliefs to be grateful for what we have.
July 2, 2007 12:55 PM | Report Offensive Comments
m689k
July 2, 2007 5:09 AM | Report Offensive Comments
Yes, we should thank the Founding Fathers, who understood so well the self-serving mischief done in the name of God, for creating a system that, so far at least, has kept the Christians safely contained.
June 18, 2007 2:51 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Of course it is a "religious" holiday. The original reason of celebrating Thanskgiving was to Give thanks to God (The Creator God) for the many blessings that were given to those who sacrificed for the freedom to worship as they pleased. So even if you are an atheist, you should be thankful that you have a choice in this country to be that and not be persecuted by the government.
June 18, 2007 12:07 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Yes! Of course atheists and agnostics should give thanks and celebrate thanksgiving. The problem isn't that they give thanks, it's that they don't know Who to thank! If they stop giving thanks they will hardly come to know Him better. You don't solve one problem by causing another.
June 15, 2007 1:08 PM | Report Offensive Comments
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June 13, 2007 6:29 PM | Report Offensive Comments
DWB - Though I am not all-knowing when it comes to religion, I don't remember Jesus asking the blind man if he believed in God prior to granting him sight.
You see, I got the impression that Jesus just loved, and he loved with out strings.
With regard to our Nation's leaders- rightly so we should elect those who can be moral and just in their leadership. But faith alone does not determine that. Many wars start because of religions including the Christian faith, and I've known religious persons who committed crimes and sin, just as non-religious, or non Christians have.
I think your stereotype is very small minded. Wasn't it Jesus that reminded those who were about to stone the prostitute to think twice, and evaluate themselves before they judge another?
June 10, 2007 8:36 AM | Report Offensive Comments
"DWB :
It always amazes me that the citizens of our Great Nation - The United States of America - rely on what candidates say. If they would just do a little research they would find the true character of each candidate. Their personal views on most political topics would be mirrored by their voting history. Their Christian beliefs would be self-evident. Or their lack there of. AND NO POLITICAL CANDIDATE SHOULD BE ELECTED UNLESS THEY ARE OF CHRISTIAN FAITH!
The United States was founded on Christian beliefs. How could anyone uphold our great Constitution if they do not understand the foundation in which it was built upon. Just look at our legal system that is full of Liberals, Atheists and Opportunists. If we had Christian leaders when most of these judges were appointed (to Lifetime postitions) we would not be in this situation. A moral and ethical demise.
God Bless The United States of America!"
Gosh, DWB, guess that little item in the First Amendment about not establishing a state religion was just a brain fart from our Founding Fathers? Does this mean the pogroms and burnings should start again? Should I stock up on aloe?
June 7, 2007 3:40 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Excuse me. Faith is only one factor. You are free to vote on whether a candidate agrees with your religious views or not. Thank God most people don't use that as the one and only criteria. I'll say it one more time: 30% will vote right if Alan Ginsberg was to run Republican. 30% would vote Democrat if they ran Adolf Hitler. It's us folks in the middle the make the difference. We don't presume to use the religious litmus test as our defining factor. I think this is what really pisses off the religious right. Keep working on it though. You are free to do that in America, even if it's a pretty limited way to pick leadership. Has it worked for you so far? Your boy Bush ....
June 7, 2007 2:51 PM | Report Offensive Comments
It always amazes me that the citizens of our Great Nation - The United States of America - rely on what candidates say. If they would just do a little research they would find the true character of each candidate. Their personal views on most political topics would be mirrored by their voting history. Their Christian beliefs would be self-evident. Or their lack there of. AND NO POLITICAL CANDIDATE SHOULD BE ELECTED UNLESS THEY ARE OF CHRISTIAN FAITH!
The United States was founded on Christian beliefs. How could anyone uphold our great Constitution if they do not understand the foundation in which it was built upon. Just look at our legal system that is full of Liberals, Atheists and Opportunists. If we had Christian leaders when most of these judges were appointed (to Lifetime postitions) we would not be in this situation. A moral and ethical demise.
God Bless The United States of America!
June 7, 2007 9:43 AM | Report Offensive Comments
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A true Christian or Jew cannot practice yoga or meditation and still claim he or she serves the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob or the triun God(God the father, Jesus the son, and the Holy Ghost). The only meditation Christians and Jews are allowed to do is on the laws of God in the Bible. Yoga and meditations open up spiritual access for entry of contrary spirits or demons. With true knowledge that Moslems use witch doctors to make voodoo, I see no prohibition for Moslems to engage in yoga and meditations.
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April 6, 2007 12:18 PM | Report Offensive Comments
WWW.AREVERSALOFTHOUGHT.COM
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THE MORE WE THINK AND FOCUS ON SOMETHING, THE MORE WE WILL CONTINUE TO CREATE AND SEE THAT SOMETHING, OVER AND OVER AGAIN......UNTIL WE REVERSE OUR THOUGHTS ON WHAT IS REAL VS WHAT IS ILLUSION
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March 6, 2007 5:18 PM | Report Offensive Comments
WWW.AREVERSALOFTHOUGHT.COM
==THE SALVATION OF THE WORLD DEPENDS ON OUR REVERSAL OF THOUGHT*
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March 6, 2007 5:16 PM | Report Offensive Comments
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January 30, 2007 3:19 AM | Report Offensive Comments
Since religious faith is based on no evidence whatsoever, I truly wish that it were not a basis for public policy. Faith is belief without evidence. To set government policy based on texts that are thousands of years old and have no basis in reality and require you to believe in essentially what is an imaginary friend is folly.
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My Brother and I were very close. When he was killed in Viet Nam, I experienced the most profound grief. I cried for 9 months. I lived far from my family at the time. I quit my job and just basically cried day and night. I did not realize, nor did anyone suggest, that I needed help. At the end of that period, I found I was completely empty. Never during the experience, was I suicidal, nor have I ever been since. I just simply had no attachments to anything or anyone. I had no fears, no grief, no needs, no joy, and I also had no curiosity about this state. I have since read that this is the state of non-attachment that Monks and other spiritual seekers strive to attain.
One hot, clear August day, we visited a cemetary and I thought of all those who had died in the war. But then I thought of all the love from other people, that was associated with each gravestone. I suddenly realized that there was far, far more love, than grief and tragedy, in the world, that those headstones symbolized. Just at that moment, a feeling swept up my spine and over me life a giant ocean wave. I found myself enveloped in pure white light, and in that light was my Brother. He was perfect, whole, and at peace. We talked for what seemed like a long time. I don't remember what was said but it seemed as if an entire lifetime of our relationship had been resolved - both the past and what would have been in the future had he lived. During this time, another part of my mind was skeptical and trying to analyze what was happening. I looked down at my feet and saw that the light had a round opening at the bottom and I could see my feet still standing on the sidewalk. That image struck me very funny for some reason.
Then, it seemed as if there was nothing more to communicate between the two of us; that our relationship, our lives, had suddenly somehow been completed in the most perfect way, that defied my understanding. I felt complete peace. It was then that I chose to disengaged from our communion. I wasn't afraid to do this - it felt just right for both of us.
Then, I was out of the light and saw once again, the normal scene of my worldly surroundings before me. Immediately, my conscious mind began to rationalize away this experience, because it defied all my previous assumptions and understanding about the nature of reality. But, as I turned to leave, it was as if someone put my eyes on a headstone some distance from where I was standing, that ordinarily I would not have noticed. And on it, was the name that was my maiden name (although I doubt the person who was buried there was a relative). It felt like my Brother was still with me, reconfirming the reality of this encounter, and that he wanted to get it across to me that this experience was not the result of my imagination, or that my mind was distorted from a long period of grief, but that it was real.
After that, I determined to find out how such a thing could have happened to me, and why it did not happen to any other member of my family. I began a study of spirituality and consciousness, that persists to this day. Ever since I emerged from the light and my communion with my Brother, I was utterly healed of all grief, filled with a peace and joy which has stood the test of time. While I have missed my Brother all these years, I have had no further grief about his passing, and I know beyond any doubt, that his wounds were healed completely and that he lives on a higher plane which I will go to when I pass over, and we will be together again. This experience anchored my belief in God in a very personal way, and in the fact of everlasting life, which Christ spoke to us about.
I hope my experience will inspire others to faith, as it did to me.
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Family,
I celebrate Thanksgiving because it is a time to remember the things we enjoy and all the freedom and options we have in life. The historic reasons are too corrupt to use them. Immigrants starving to death and natives who felt the need to help them....a good human attitude.
Mauro
December 22, 2006 12:41 PM | Report Offensive Comments
dont feel bad PLHEART
ive had over 8 solid posts just disappear- i dont know what buzzwords im using, but they were all very logical biblical scripture with reasoning attached- often questions asked that could be construed as challenging, but certainly never rude in any way.
but its never happened in these open forums- only responses to panelists-
id lke to mention in defense of accusations-
exactly what news channel do you imagine is going to
broadcast moderate muslims that have anything ompelling to say about the issues of violence and the position of most muslims on it?
there are some muslim panelists on this site- go see how theyre attacked-
prejudice is an ugly thing no matter whose mouth it comes from and we should be free to express ourselves here without censure-
just kill them with kindness is what i say
peace
December 21, 2006 11:23 PM | Report Offensive Comments
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December 21, 2006 4:25 PM | Report Offensive Comments
mr houle, without being aware of it- you have described the philosophy of islam- truly an egalitarian religion
ps as for the 72 virgins- this is a complete invention and is found nowhere in islamic doctrine
peace
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December 12, 2006 10:14 PM | Report Offensive Comments
Here is the deal. I am Muslim, my husband is Christian. We have a preschool aged child. His family all but ignores my faith. Never once have they wished my a happy holiday or bought my daughter a gift for a Muslim holiday. My parents have gifted my husband a gold cross, bought our child gifts on Christmas and made her an Easter basket. My mom's point: She has to know we love and accept her. PERIOD. I think when she grows up my in-laws will have a rude awakening. Children know who accepts and loves them. I just hope she does not experience too much pain from their ignorance. I just try to ignore their behavior. The challenge for me is that my holidays are never recognized in the US. I do not get days off work, there are never any displays in the mall, etc... So I try to keep with my traditions getting together with friends and making new ones as a I go along. My grandfather once said ( in response to my question about God and faith). Child God is at the top of a great mountain. All the pathways on the side of that mountain lead to Him. Everyone takes a different path to the top. I guess that explains why my mom is the way she is.....my recommendation is accept these children for who they are and do not make them choose loyalties. Extended family you must do the same or risk hurting a child....in my faith the greatest sin there is.
December 7, 2006 3:05 PM | Report Offensive Comments
TOUGH LOVE AND ISLAMIC FUNDAMENTALISM
One of the greatest tenets of democracy is that a superior argument will win the day. Right now, this doctrine is being turned on its head by the Islamic Fundamentalists.
These crazed murderers are not only cleaning our intellectual clocks. They are wiping the floors with our morbid brains.
These Fundamentalists have taken Islam and turned its teachings into a murderous medieval ideology – that the killing of infidels in the name of Allah will be rewarded in heaven - allowing the Islamists to sexually molest for all eternality 72 virgins, in 72 mansions, and 72 beds – that the murder of millions of non - believers is a religious duty, women are inferior to men - their virtual slaves to be denied education, beaten, killed for adultery or other sexual transgressions (real or imaged), covered from head to toe, people can be mutilated and tortured, barbers giving hair cuts can be killed, music and movies banned, women practicing folk dancing murdered, schools teaching young girls blown up, anyone who believes in a different interpretation of Islam to be killed and on and on. Muslims have paid a terrible price at the hands of these Fundamentalists. Children mutilated. Grand parents brains blown all over the street. Women, children, old and young. Over one hundred and fifty thousand Muslims have been slaughtered in the most horrid, unimaginable ways since 9/11.
Against these ridiculous crazy teachings, the Western World is intellectually collapsing – freedom of speech is collapsing. Anyone who writes or puts on a play exposing these teachings can be killed. In the face of this onslaught, moderate Muslims are being pushed to the background and running for cover. Western Governments are running for cover. Mosques are being taken over by radical Islamists from the Saudi Arabian Wahhabbi sect.
We need to form an immediate alliance with moderate Muslims to turn the intellectual tide. There can be no polite political correctness here. Tolerating - intolerance is no longer an option.
The Pope in his recent speech on God and Reason has shown the way forward. A very important event occurred recently when 36 Islamic Scholars sent the Pope a communication in which they agreed – that in Islam, Allah is – “A GOD OF REASON.” This important declaration - perhaps one of the most important by a group of such eminent Islamic scholars must be seized upon. The Pope should call for a world religious conference on the scale of Vatican 2 bringing together all the top religious le